Chris Christie: I Would Not Permit Businesses to "Discriminate" Against Gay People, But Would Make Exemptions for Religious Organizations Only

If Politco's reporting is to be believed as accurate -- a dubious proposition -- that is what Christie supposedly said today.

Commenter tommylotto points out that I am trusting Politico's paraphrase of Christie's remarks for this post, which he claims is unwise and unfair, especially given the point I'm making about Politico (that they simply do not understand conservative beliefs or arguments).

That is a good point.

I am leaving this post up, but with this caveat: You can't trust a progressive to paraphrase a conservative's words.

If this report turns out to be ill-founded, I'll retract prominently, and ding Politico again.

For the moment, I'm just assuming -- provisionally, and a bit optimistically -- that someone at Politico understands the very basics of their job.

...

I personally would not permit businesses to discriminate against gay people for being gay -- but I sure would permit them to "discriminate," or just refuse, to be a part of ceremony they find contrary to their religion.

The distinction I make is between simply selling a stock in trade (donuts off a shelf) or being asked to personally use one's skill and experience to tailor-make something for a gay wedding. There is necessarily an intimacy and direct contact with the object-to rite in that instance which outweighs the would-be customer's purported right to buy anything from anyone he chooses.*

Chris Christie apparently disagrees.

He also says he's used birth control, but... sure, of course Politico finds that to be the big news here. Because they're trivial and childish. They're Buzzfeed for Over 40s.

Town hall meetings like the one in Manchester offer an opportunity for Christie to meet voters, show off his personality and crack jokes. On Tuesday morning, he made brief opening remarks before opening the floor to questions, deftly maneuvering across queries about whether he would allow business owners to discriminate against gay couples (no, but he would make exceptions for religious organizations) and Tom Brady (Christie cannot help him).

So the birth control thing is that he was talking about the separation of church and state and somehow got into the business of the Catholic Church's prohibition on artificial birth control; he says he's used it, and "not just the rhythm method." Then he said he doesn't think that makes him a bad Catholic.

Who gives a shit.

The important thing is that he does not support any kind of liberty of conscience in people's lives except for those working for expressly religious institutions. All other people must forfeit their liberty of conscience in order to achieve the allegedly-imperative social goal of no one disagreeing publicly with anyone else and no one ever feeling the discomfort of ideological conflict.

Except in church. Only churches get to "discriminate" like that.


* Some will object that my formulation is itself a compromise of perfect liberty of conscience and perfect freedom of association. It is that. I can't deny that.

On the other hand, I think actively agitating for a perfect and complete right to discriminate against whoever you like is a surefire loser position, which will result in the public opting for the progressive position (no freedom of conscience at all).

Posted by: Ace at 02:07 PM




Comments

(Jump to bottom of page)

1 Wow, NO!

Posted by: Lizzy at August 04, 2015 02:09 PM (NOIQH)

2 Only churches are allowed a religious conscience?
No.

Posted by: Lizzy at August 04, 2015 02:09 PM (NOIQH)

3 Politico is working it's very standard angle of trying to marginalize the Catholic Church from American "Catholics."

Setting up the whole "illegitimate" claim.

This of course is why Christie needs to shut the fuck up.

Posted by: tsrlbke PhD(c), rogue bioethicist at August 04, 2015 02:11 PM (tM4uk)

4 We really didn't need to know about His sex life...

Posted by: donna at August 04, 2015 02:11 PM (hUdMz)

5 The less said by or about this blowhard, the better.

Posted by: bystander at August 04, 2015 02:12 PM (hKyl0)

6 I still don't get how a party that requires an invitation falls under "public" accommodation.

But I think the general view today is that gays are mentally ill, fragile people whose every whim must be indulged, lest their Fabrege egos be cracked.

Posted by: AmishDude at August 04, 2015 02:12 PM (b65cm)

7 >>The important thing is that he does not support any kind of liberty of conscience in people's lives except for those working for expressly religious institutions. All other people must forfeit their liberty of conscience in order to achieve the allegedly-imperative social goal of no one disagreeing publicly with anyone else and no one ever feeling the discomfort of ideological conflict.>>

Is that a direct Christie quote or did you divine that from the brief paraphrase quoted above.

Don't believe everything you read. Politicians are nuanced. Reporters, not so.

Posted by: tommylotto at August 04, 2015 02:12 PM (A3a8d)

8 Congress shall make no law respecting an
establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or
abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the
people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a
redress of grievances.

Posted by: The Fucking Constitution Read It Asshole at August 04, 2015 02:12 PM (78TbK)

9 I must have misse where "free exercise thereof" means only for the hour you are sitting in a pew and gay people get to demand you violate your beliefs.

Posted by: Buzzion at August 04, 2015 02:13 PM (z/Ubi)

10 Fvck that guy in particular.

Posted by: That Cat at August 04, 2015 02:13 PM (fO0en)

11 Why is he talking about b.c. anyway?

Why do GOP candidates play into the Left's hand like this? They need to learn to deftly transform a question like that into something they want to talk about. Except their sex life - no one wants to talk about that.

Posted by: Lizzy at August 04, 2015 02:13 PM (NOIQH)

12 Except in church. Only churches get to "discriminate" like that.

For now. Tax exemptions were up for discussion before the ink on Obergefell was dry, and I've seen polls showing a not insignicant portion (~25%) of the public would be okay with forcing churches to perform gay weddings.

Posted by: Hal at August 04, 2015 02:14 PM (hmPdt)

13 Chris Christie is birth control.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 04, 2015 02:14 PM (LA7Cm)

14 Then he said he doesn't think that makes him a bad Catholic.

-----

But it does make him a sinner. Which I guess means he was a bad Catholic when he was doing the sinning part.

As a Catholic, I'm not sure why any of that would make me want to vote for him.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:14 PM (gmeXX)

15 8 Congress shall make no law respecting an
establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or
abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the
people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a
redress of grievances.

Who needs "Congress" when You have the Supreme Court making the laws?

Posted by: donna at August 04, 2015 02:14 PM (hUdMz)

16 >>I must have misse where "free exercise thereof" means only for the hour you are sitting in a pew and gay people get to demand you violate your beliefs.

That's been Obama's little verbal trick since Day 1 - freedom of religious practice, not conscience.

Posted by: Lizzy at August 04, 2015 02:15 PM (NOIQH)

17 Did somebody say bakeries? Now there's something I'm an expert on...

Posted by: Gov. Chris Christie at August 04, 2015 02:15 PM (YFFpo)

18 Did you know that in 1992 there was an episode of Seinfeld where Elaine was on her way to a lesbian or gay wedding. Apparently in 1992 gay people didn't need the government to acknowledge their love or threaten people's livelihood if they didn't agree with it.

Posted by: Buzzion at August 04, 2015 02:15 PM (z/Ubi)

19 What do you mean I should dye it? Why? What color is it now?

Posted by: Gov. Christie at August 04, 2015 02:16 PM (JO9+V)

20 >>Then he said he doesn't think that makes him a bad Catholic.


Nancy Pelosi also doesn't think she's a bad Catholic despite supporting PP and calling abortion "a sacrament."
Don't think either one of them has the final say IYKWIMAITYD.

Posted by: Lizzy at August 04, 2015 02:16 PM (NOIQH)

21 So, basically, we get so imagine Da Big Guy strapping on some birth control. Great.

Posted by: joncelli, Boned like You at August 04, 2015 02:17 PM (RD7QR)

22 Something I have never understood is Catholics who violate their church's proscriptions on birth control or abortions. If you want those things you need to find a new church.

Posted by: Vic at August 04, 2015 02:17 PM (GpgJl)

23 Gay Tuesday already?

Posted by: cajun caret at August 04, 2015 02:17 PM (UZQM8)

24 I'm a Catholic. I disagree with Catholic teaching and do not always follow it. Does that make me a bad Catholic. I don't think so. Vote for me.

Yea - no thanks. You have a wonderful guiding moral compass.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:17 PM (gmeXX)

25 Christies birth control is his fat hiding his penis.

Posted by: Buzzion at August 04, 2015 02:18 PM (z/Ubi)

26 Chris Christie is against people refusing to make him cakes.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 04, 2015 02:18 PM (FhT/k)

27 Yo!

Posted by: Yo! at August 04, 2015 02:18 PM (W6iIX)

28 >>>Is that a direct Christie quote or did you divine that from the brief paraphrase quoted above.

Don't believe everything you read. Politicians are nuanced. Reporters, not so.

...

good point, I will include your objection.

Posted by: ace at August 04, 2015 02:18 PM (dciA+)

29 I'm really glad Christie keeps gaping his maw and validating my reasons for disliking him.


He should advance no higher than Sec'y of Ed.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:18 PM (xSCb6)

30 So, will Christie force cakemakers to bake a cake for a Satanist celebration?

Posted by: DangerGirl at August 04, 2015 02:18 PM (L6lkG)

31 This is the worst possible of answers.

The problem is people are drawing this nonsensical, illusionary distinction between religious conscience and secular conscience. The founders saw no distinction because it does not exist.

All that matters is freedom of conscience, period. The same thing that allows conscientious objectors to avoid direct combat service also allows Jehovah's witnesses to not swear on the Bible on court, and also allows the bakery to not bake a cake for a homosexual "wedding." And yes, allows Muslims to not take dogs into their taxis.

The way the founders saw it - and the only way liberty can survive - is for freedom of conscience to hold for all. The only thing that can trump that is a direct and clear violation of a higher right.

Because folks, rights have a hierarchy. The absolute top tier right is life. No matter what right you feel is being violated, that does not trump someone else's right to life. The rights go down from there: property, free expression, etc. But the right to freedom of conscience is very, very high level.

And nobody has a right to a cake, or to not feel bad about themselves. Nobody.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 02:19 PM (39g3+)

32 My sure-fire RINO squish detector worked perfectly on Christie. From the get-go.

What's the secret sauce in the detector?

Support for gun control. If a Republican pol voices that to any degree, no matter how much other red-meat conservatism they may be pushing in other areas, you can be assured that their squishy pseudo-Democratic proclivities will eventually reassert themselves.

Posted by: torquewrench at August 04, 2015 02:19 PM (noWW6)

33 26 Chris Christie is against people refusing to make him cakes.
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 04, 2015 02:18 PM (FhT/k)

To be fair, no single baker can work that fast.

Posted by: joncelli, Boned like You at August 04, 2015 02:19 PM (RD7QR)

34 Apparently in 1992 gay people didn't need the government to acknowledge
their love or threaten people's livelihood if they didn't agree with
it.


I'm so old I remember being told by gay people that not requiring the government's stamp of approval on their relationships made them better than straight people.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 04, 2015 02:19 PM (/kI1Q)

35 I have a problem with Christie's statement re: birth control.

I don't want that mental image of him wearing nothing but his jimmy hat.

Posted by: Old Hob at August 04, 2015 02:19 PM (FFIoe)

36 Wow. Three posts in about an hour? Seems like Ace has found something to do w/the other (now free) hand...


Heh.

Posted by: anon a mouse at August 04, 2015 02:20 PM (C9pBZ)

37 You're fat too!

Posted by: Just the Punchline at August 04, 2015 02:20 PM (evdj2)

38 As a Catholic, I'm not sure why any of that would make me want to vote for him.
Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:14 PM (gmeXX)

Yeah, what a boneheaded comment. It gains him no support whatsoever.

And the doof is feeding into the stupid Dem meme that the GOP is anti-BC and wants to take it away from women. "See! I'm not like these other candidates! I like bc! I've even used it myself!"

Stop talking about damn birth control. That's not an issue.

Posted by: Donna V. (sans ampersands) at August 04, 2015 02:20 PM (u0lmX)

39 Spray "Goodyear" on his ass and hoist him over some goddamned stadium. Enough.

Posted by: Shallow HAL 9000 at August 04, 2015 02:20 PM (VcOqI)

40 I have a good friend that would vote for Republicans, but the stupid SoCons want to ban birth control.

Posted by: Mr. Doo Doo at August 04, 2015 02:20 PM (OD2ni)

41 "He should advance no higher than Sec'y of Ed."

You only need a Secretary of Education if you have a Department of Education. Just sayin'.

Posted by: torquewrench at August 04, 2015 02:20 PM (noWW6)

42 Who needs "Congress" when You have the Supreme Court making the laws?

I say we go full-bore on the novel legal theories. Here's my current favorite:

The Judiciary was made unconstitutional by the 14th amendment.

Do you see any non-lawyers on the courts? Rank discrimination.

Posted by: AmishDude at August 04, 2015 02:20 PM (b65cm)

43 See the problem here is that it's all water under the bridge and has been since businesses were forced to cater to blacks back during the Civil Rights Era.

That destroyed freedom of association.

Personally I think it's stupid as a business to not cater to a large segment of the population (many of those towns and cities in the South had a large population of blacks), but nonetheless it was an attack on freedom of association.

Once that happened this stuff today was bound to happen.

Trying to say wait a minute this isn't right now is like trying to stuff a genie back in a bottle.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 04, 2015 02:20 PM (oFCZn)

44 20 Nancy Pelosi also doesn't think she's a bad Catholic despite supporting PP and calling abortion "a sacrament." Don't think either one of them has the final say IYKWIMAITYD.
Posted by: Lizzy at August 04, 2015 02:16 PM (NOIQH)


Nanny Nan has been sanctioned by her church. I think she should have been excummunicated.

Posted by: Vic at August 04, 2015 02:21 PM (GpgJl)

45 How 'bout a return to the legal regime of State-guaranteed freedom of association and freedom of contract? Would you really take offense if some diner advertised that it only served left-handed Armenian customers? Or vegetarian Chinese Methodist customers? Why would it matter to you if some nightclub admitted only black lesbians?

Posted by: Malcolm Kirkpatrick at August 04, 2015 02:21 PM (IbUUZ)

46 I believe that Cristie meant that, as President, he would force bakers to bake cakes .. for him.

Posted by: Grump928(c) at August 04, 2015 02:21 PM (evdj2)

47 I think businesses should be able to discriminate against anybody for any reason whatsoever. Don't like white people? Fine, don't sell to them or bake them a cake and lose that business. Freedom. The government has no right to tell me who I need to serve. Feck off.

Posted by: jjod at August 04, 2015 02:21 PM (3UYA8)

48 "Who gives a shit."

You would if you were a Catholic.

In RC circles, Christie's remarks warrant a WTF. He says, "Like a good Catholic, I pick and choose what teachings I'll follow. I, not the Church, define what 'Catholic' is and means for me."

It's like his being RINO. "Small government? Small anything is not for me! *short, chuffle* But that doesn't make me a bad Republican!"

FFS.

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:22 PM (12atq)

49 "Some will object that my formulation is itself a compromise of perfect liberty of conscience and perfect freedom of association. It is that. I can't deny that.

On the other hand, I think actively agitating for a perfect and complete right to discriminate against whoever you like is a surefire loser position, which will result in the public opting for the progressive position (no freedom of conscience at all)."


Only a Sith thinks in absolutes!

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Back-to-School Sale on Lunchboxes, Accusations at the Outrage Outlet! at August 04, 2015 02:22 PM (hLRSq)

50 The political class are nuttier than chipmunk farts. Why would anyone running for president feel compelled to answer these questions? This is all nanny-state do-gooderism.

Posted by: Fritz at August 04, 2015 02:22 PM (UzPAd)

51 updated to include upfront tommylotto's objection to trusting a Politico paraphrase.

Posted by: ace at August 04, 2015 02:22 PM (dciA+)

52 Is the "trigger warning" thing about self inflicted self destructive psychic emotional wounds untreated in individuals taught that obstinate denial is their key to healing?

Posted by: DM at August 04, 2015 02:22 PM (j/tOh)

53 "Then he said he doesn't think that makes him a bad Catholic."

But of course. Because voluntary followers get to pick and choose that which is dogma. It's a Buffet!

I'm thinking he might not actually be Catholic.


"On the other hand, I think actively agitating for a perfect and complete right to discriminate against whoever you like is a surefire loser position..."

Maybe, but that's where I am when it comes to private citizens and business. Is Freedom of Association not a thing anymore? Did Nature abandon the concept of discrimination based on self-preservation?

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at August 04, 2015 02:22 PM (1CroS)

54 Christie lost me when he decided to make his RNC speech all about him and then topped it off with his groping of Obama days before the election. Now I'm just enjoying his rapid trip into irrelevancy.

Posted by: JackStraw at August 04, 2015 02:22 PM (OGm46)

55 Is there a non-corrupt government anywhere in the world?

Posted by: Man With Lantern at August 04, 2015 02:23 PM (VcOqI)

56 Posted by: Buzzion at August 04, 2015 02:15 PM (z/Ubi)


I love pointing out to them that gays have always been able to get married. Even my highly intelligent lesbian sister has problems with that one. I think I finally got her on board with the Get Gov't Out Of The Marriage Business position.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:23 PM (xSCb6)

57 Pelosi certainly appears to be excommunicate, she just hasn't been formally declared as such.

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:23 PM (12atq)

58 4 We really didn't need to know about His sex life...

Posted by: donna at August 04, 2015 02:11 PM (hUdMz)

5 The less said by or about this blowhard, the better.

Posted by: bystander at August 04, 2015 02:12 PM (hKyl0)



This is the most unfortunate placement of comments that I have seen on this blog.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Back-to-School Sale on Lunchboxes, Accusations at the Outrage Outlet! at August 04, 2015 02:23 PM (hLRSq)

59 Broccoli is the boner-killer

Posted by: Ancient Bene Christieit Saying at August 04, 2015 02:23 PM (87y4e)

60 Those damned socons ruin everything.

Posted by: Mr. Foo Foo at August 04, 2015 02:23 PM (Dwehj)

61 Christie lost the need for birth control when his gut exceeded the length of his dick, which happened over 20 years ago I expect.

Posted by: maddogg at August 04, 2015 02:24 PM (xWW96)

62 I would allow anyone or any organization to discriminate against anyone for any reason whatsoever. Remember when the left was lecturing us that you can't legislare morality?

Doesn't matter to me, though. I'm a priest in.the No Christy No Fvcking Way religion.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 04, 2015 02:24 PM (cQzyY)

63 Nobody ever died from someone else declining to bake a wedding cake.

Posted by: V the K at August 04, 2015 02:24 PM (O7MnT)

64 I personally would not permit businesses to discriminate against gay people for being gay -- but I sure would permit them to "discriminate," or just refuse, to be a part of ceremony they find contrary to their religion.


Define "religion."

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 04, 2015 02:24 PM (oKE6c)

65 Never forget that Jim Crow was Government Policy, enforce with State Power, not private discrimination. And Democratic Party Government Policy at that.

Posted by: Grump928(c) at August 04, 2015 02:24 PM (evdj2)

66 Ace, you know what your problem is?

You just don't buy this idea of a central government group-think being superior to a personal opinion (at least when we are talking about anything outside of the core minimal role of a central government in national defense, necessary interstate laws and the like).

You just don't like codifying social contracts with compliance demanding laws. You think there's room for personal belief in a big country like ours. That's your issue right there.

Posted by: MTF at August 04, 2015 02:24 PM (LISuA)

67 For five dozen unlicked donuts, I can be persuaded to change my stance.

Posted by: Christy Christie at August 04, 2015 02:25 PM (Dwehj)

68 Nancy Pelosi also doesn't think she's a bad Catholic despite supporting PP and calling abortion "a sacrament."

Considering there isn't a single priest, deacon, bishop or cardinal who has the stones to kick her out of whatever church she drags her scrawny, feculent, hell-borne ass into and lay down the smack that she is denied the Blessed Sacrament until she publicly and fully recants her PP position, I have no doubt she does believe she's a good Catholic.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at August 04, 2015 02:25 PM (zF6Iw)

69 I baked a cake for a gay couple. I then left it out in the rain.

Posted by: Richard Harris at August 04, 2015 02:25 PM (VcOqI)

70 Thought police. We are literally legislating a criminalizing people's thoughts . How far we've fallen...

Really, if I'm a racist, an anti-semite, a homophobe (hate that word), so what. It's not the government's business. If I hate blacks and refuse to sell them my wares, word will get out. Let the free market decide to patronize my business or not. Stay the hell out of my life, I'll stay out of yours.

Posted by: Chi at August 04, 2015 02:25 PM (oE+xB)

71 I love pointing out to them that gays have always been able to get married. Even my highly intelligent lesbian sister has problems with that one. I think I finally got her on board with the Get Gov't Out Of The Marriage Business position.
Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:23 PM (xSCb6)


Tell her being against gay marriage was Harvey Milk's position.

It's 100% true and he was very vocal about it.

Posted by: AmishDude at August 04, 2015 02:25 PM (b65cm)

72 Bakeries are one example...

An artist can put a painting on the wall of a gallery, but should not refuse to sell it to someone because of their sexual proclivities or any reason. The same artist should be able to refuse to paint a commissioned painting for any reason they feel like inventing. The first is a good, the other is a service.

I'm the last one to ever suggest we need another law, but the line between goods and services, and religious and other completely legitimate reasons for denying service apparently needs to be protected.

Posted by: se pa moron at August 04, 2015 02:25 PM (xQX/f)

73 "No shirt, no service."

Wut?

Posted by: SCOTUS at August 04, 2015 02:25 PM (12atq)

74 Well I don't think Pelosi should be kicked out of Church.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:26 PM (gmeXX)

75 ***"You only need a Secretary of Education if you have a Department of Education. Just sayin'."***


Agreed. And I think he'd be a great person to preside over winding it down.


And then he'd be out of a job. Win-win I say.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:27 PM (xSCb6)

76 Christie lost the need for birth control when his gut exceeded the length of his dick, which happened over 20 years ago I expect.

Posted by: maddogg at August 04, 2015 02:24 PM (xWW96)
========================

I think it had more to do with his wonderfully nice wife saying four kids is enough.

Posted by: MTF at August 04, 2015 02:27 PM (LISuA)

77
He says, "Like a good Catholic, I pick and choose what teachings I'll follow. I, not the Church, define what 'Catholic' is and means for me."
Posted by: Feh




Christie, you are the Rock upon which I will build my Church.

My -- big -- fat -- Rock.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at August 04, 2015 02:27 PM (kdS6q)

78 63 Nobody ever died from someone else declining to bake a wedding cake.

Posted by: V the K at August 04, 2015 02:24 PM (O7MnT)


Somebody might have died because they weren't allowed to use a phone in a white only store.

Might not happen today with all the cellphones, but back in the day? I'll bet it happened.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 04, 2015 02:27 PM (oFCZn)

79 The Judiciary was made unconstitutional by the 14th amendment.

Do you see any non-lawyers on the courts? Rank discrimination.


The thing is, you say this as a joke, but that's exactly how the 14th amendment not can but must be interpreted the way the courts have been ruling. You say kids can't vote? 14th amendment violation. You say I can't be in your race because I'm in a wheelchair? 14th amendment violation. There is almost nothing too absurd for this to be applied.

The 14th amendment is the worst thing that has ever, ever happened to the US Constitution. It was horribly worded and the later interpretations have been even worse.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 02:27 PM (39g3+)

80 I say we go full-bore on the novel legal theories. Here's my current favorite:
***
Or how about the unequal implementation of taxes is a violation of equal protection, and that any direct taxes are a violation of the 13th Amendment?

Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for
crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist
within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction

If the government taxes you at 25% of your wages, it is making you work for IT for 25% of the time, therefore unconstitutional...

Posted by: 18-1 at August 04, 2015 02:28 PM (78TbK)

81 No shirt, no service

Why, I oughta...

Posted by: Paul Anka at August 04, 2015 02:28 PM (Dwehj)

82 Hey all you Catholic voters - I think the Catholic Church is wrong and I know better. Now Vote for Me.

Posted by: Chris "I'm Catholic" Christie at August 04, 2015 02:28 PM (gmeXX)

83 In a Christie Administration, I hope to enshrine the right to

be glazed like a donut in sugar syrup then covered in chocolate sprinkles.

Posted by: Chris Christie at August 04, 2015 02:28 PM (0cMkb)

Posted by: Paul Anka at August 04, 2015 02:28 PM (Dwehj)

85 An artist can put a painting on the wall of a gallery, but should not refuse to sell it to someone because of their sexual proclivities or any reason.


Why not? It's his property. He should be able to do with it whatever he wants. What if he wants to sell it to a family member instead of someone else who bids more?

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 04, 2015 02:28 PM (oKE6c)

86 He would reintroduce prima nocta regarding wedding cakes.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 04, 2015 02:29 PM (cQzyY)

87 There's a fatman in the bathtub
with the blues.........

Posted by: Roland THTG at August 04, 2015 02:29 PM (QM5S2)

88 Can a Muslim (or Hindu , or any other faith) be forced to participate in a Christian ceremony?
Could an atheist baker be forced to participate in any type of religious ceremony?
Can I refuse to do business with customers I simply don't like? In other words could someone refuse to business with gays, not because they're gay but because they're obnoxious or because they want you to provide your service or product at below cost?

Posted by: Northernlurker at August 04, 2015 02:29 PM (4rzL1)

89 The barrel calls you 18-1.

Climb in, let go....

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Back-to-School Sale on Lunchboxes, Accusations at the Outrage Outlet! at August 04, 2015 02:29 PM (hLRSq)

90 I'll need to sing my way out of the barrel. Sigh.

Posted by: Paul Anka at August 04, 2015 02:29 PM (Dwehj)

91

Wow, that Christie guy's some kind of italican, huh?

Posted by: naturalfake at August 04, 2015 02:29 PM (0cMkb)

92 I'm the last one to ever suggest we need another law, but the line between goods and services, and religious and other completely legitimate reasons for denying service apparently needs to be protected.

In what way is it apparent? Is there some American somewhere unable to buy a cake?

You have no right to what I produce. That you can take it by force is no ethical argument.

Posted by: Grump928(c) at August 04, 2015 02:29 PM (evdj2)

93 Posted by: 18-1 at August 04, 2015 02:28 PM (78TbK)



How about "disparate impact?" White people pay a disproportionate amount of taxes. Illegal discrimination?

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 04, 2015 02:30 PM (oKE6c)

94 A 20 piece bucket of chicken in every pot!

(Preferably fried and spicy)

Posted by: Chris Christie at August 04, 2015 02:30 PM (oFCZn)

95 Freedom of association implies a freedom to not associate. Private businesses have the right to discriminate against anyone they want. Any court or legislature that disagrees should be ignored and disobeyed.

Posted by: Achilles at August 04, 2015 02:30 PM (TpeIH)

96 The thing is, you say this as a joke, but that's exactly how the 14th amendment not can but must be interpreted the way the courts have been ruling.

Even more strongly, my "rights" are being violated unless I take 3 years out of my life, take an extraordinarily easy graduate curriculum and pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for the privilege.

Posted by: AmishDude at August 04, 2015 02:30 PM (b65cm)

97
How about "disparate impact?" White people pay a disproportionate amount of taxes. Illegal discrimination?
Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 04, 2015 02:30 PM (oKE6c)

White people are in a position of power, and cannot be discriminated against. Unless they're women. Or teh ghey.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 04, 2015 02:30 PM (2Ojst)

98 You're havin' my bay-bee...

Posted by: Paul Anka at August 04, 2015 02:31 PM (Dwehj)

99 If it came down to Christie-Clinton, I would have to vote Clinton.

Actually, I wouldn't vote at all, given that choice. But, gun-to-head, I'd vote for Clinton over Christie.

Posted by: BlueStateRebel at August 04, 2015 02:31 PM (7ObY1)

100 Tell that fat shithead to STFU and go back to that socialist hell hole of a state called New Jersey. The only thing "new" about New Jersey is what new taxes they can come up with each year. Hey Fatso how is Newark doing huh?.....or Camden? Atlantic City?.....

Posted by: Hillary with a Wang! at August 04, 2015 02:32 PM (D0NZx)

101 >>Can a Muslim (or Hindu , or any other faith) be forced to participate in a Christian ceremony?

Stephen Crowder made a video of going into a Muslim bakery and asking for a wedding cake for his SSM. You would not believe what happened next!

Posted by: Lizzy at August 04, 2015 02:32 PM (NOIQH)

102 Dickie Do syndrome is real and debilitating. Won't you please help? Send what you can today!

Posted by: Gov. Christie at August 04, 2015 02:32 PM (JO9+V)

103 Whatever, CC's time was in 2012. He missed his window of opportunity. Say this about Obama, he took advantage of his window of opportunity.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:32 PM (gmeXX)

104 ***"Tell her being against gay marriage was Harvey Milk's position.


Posted by: AmishDude at August 04, 2015 02:25 PM (b65cm) "***


She wouldn't know who he was. Fortunately she's one of those rare lesbians whose entire identity doesn't revolve around who she prefers to diddle.


She mostly lets her emotions rule her thought processes on the subject, but she's not impervious to a logical argument.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:32 PM (xSCb6)

105 Governor Christie, pie with ice cream or whipped cream?

Posted by: Fritz at August 04, 2015 02:32 PM (UzPAd)

106 Why doesn't Christie just have the honesty to come out and say "you know, the RCC frowns on artificial contraception, and I disagree with it on that, so I guess that makes me dissenter on that issue. I'm probably not alone."

Is that so hard?

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:33 PM (12atq)

107 ...which will result in the public opting for the progressive position (no freedom of conscience at all)....

Because the public is all busy bodies? The invisible hand is the reason segregation, boycotts and so forth don't need to be banned by law. Plenty of white supremest tattoo artist that will give a black woman a beauty mark for $40. Or have sex with her.

Posted by: business at August 04, 2015 02:33 PM (rnH8X)

108 Even more strongly, my "rights" are being violated unless I take 3 years out of my life, take an extraordinarily easy graduate curriculum and pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for the privilege.

Sure. You can't refuse to give me a job as cheif surgeon here, 14th amendment! You cannot say I didn't pass the bar, 14th amendment! You cannot say I am too young to drink, 14th amendment! You cannot say I am unable to own a nuclear weapon, 14th amendment!

There is almost nothing on earth that I can be denied, the way the 14th amendment is being interpreted. And that should be patently obvious to any judge and lawyer.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 02:33 PM (39g3+)

109 "Discrimination" itself, as pointed out, violates the basic premise of free association. I agree that the "religious only" exception trivializes the basic freedom of conscience.

I can defend the Doublethink so far as you are talking about large scale employers, application of government, i.e. things that you essentially can't freely shop.

But to justify "anti discrimination" at the point of purchase, particularly if you are not an enormous chain providing essentially the only product of its type, is a bridge way too far.

Slightly on or off topic (as you see it) we need a Big Thinkers Tank to develop sufficiently "wedgy" questions for all the Democrats, e.g.:

1. Just how late into pregnancy would you defend an abortion? 39 weeks? 38? Are there any means of abortion that you consider to be too painful to use at any fetal age?

2. Just why do you think the Framers of the Constiution, and the ratifying State legislatures insisted on a Second Amendment? Was it to defend hunting rights?

3. If a President can unilaterally decide not to enforce immigration law as passed by Congress, or can strike any portion of the Affordable Health Care Act he chooses while enforcing others, in what sense can you say we have the rule of law?

Posted by: NYC Peasant at August 04, 2015 02:33 PM (k8tEg)

110 100 Tell that fat shithead to STFU and go back to that socialist hell hole of a state called New Jersey. The only thing "new" about New Jersey is what new taxes they can come up with each year. Hey Fatso how is Newark doing huh?.....or Camden? Atlantic City?.....

Posted by: Hillary with a Wang! at August 04, 2015 02:32 PM (D0NZx)


I remember a Jersey moron posting how much they paid in property taxes.

Holy ckuf. I cried and I don't even live there.

Get the fuck out of Jersey! Just get the fuck out!

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 04, 2015 02:33 PM (oFCZn)

111 You can't trust a progressive to paraphrase a conservative's words.
_________________________

Sure, but can we trust a progressive to paraphrase Christie?

Posted by: TrivialPursuer at August 04, 2015 02:33 PM (kGrdk)

112 The non constitutional right of Gay marriage must be accepted by all States but the constitutional right to bear arms can be denied by some States. Why even have the Constitution ?

Posted by: Cruzinator at August 04, 2015 02:34 PM (vyAun)

113 If you vote Christie, you're essentially saying "I want the Republican party to become Less Republican." Eventually, you'll be calling yourself a Social Democrat.

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:34 PM (12atq)

114 Why doesn't Christie just have the honesty to come out and say "you know, the RCC frowns on artificial contraception, and I disagree with it on that, so I guess that makes me dissenter on that issue. I'm probably not alone."

Is that so hard?

------

He could say that. He could say I used it in the past but not any more.

Or he could say nothing.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:34 PM (gmeXX)

115
Also:

The Christie camp has been using the hashtag #TellingItLikeItIs to promote the New Jersey governor's campaign on Twitter.




"So he's proactive, huh?"

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at August 04, 2015 02:34 PM (kdS6q)

116 Sure, but can we trust a progressive to paraphrase Christie?

Posted by: TrivialPursuer at August 04, 2015 02:33 PM (kGrdk)


NICE!!!!

Posted by: Dirty Randy at August 04, 2015 02:35 PM (jjaLl)

117 In fairness, Chris Christie's belief in Church doctrine is similar to his belief in the Bill of Rights.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:36 PM (gmeXX)

118 Alright - OT via Hot Air:

Gawker releases Donald Trump's cell phone number. The Donald uses the opportunity to leave a recorded campaign pitch for anyone who calls. Ross Douthat tweets: "You cannot troll the master troll."


Right now Gawker resembles Wile E. Coyote, Super-Genius, after using the latest in Acme products.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Back-to-School Sale on Lunchboxes, Accusations at the Outrage Outlet! at August 04, 2015 02:36 PM (hLRSq)

119 57 Pelosi certainly appears to be excommunicate, she just hasn't been formally declared as such.
Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:23 PM (12atq)

I read an article by her preist who said she had not been excmmunicated but she is denied communion,

Posted by: Vic at August 04, 2015 02:36 PM (GpgJl)

120 I want one example, anywhere in the country, where a bakery( picture a little place with a door with a bell hanging on it, stools lined up in front of the counter, coffee percolating in the big Bunn machine, trays of donuts and cakes, breads, and pastries in the case) saw a person walking in and said, "you leave, get out, I can tell you are gay and I won't sell you a crueller".

Please, tell me where that has happened.

What Christie is saying is that the same person walks into the business and gets to demand that the business sign a contract to bake a cake, transport it to a venue, set up cake at the venue, and possibly stay at the venue during the reception of a ceremony expressly forbidden for them to participate in by their religious beliefs. Business has no ability whatsoever to decline to enter a contract to provide a service and product at the location, time and for the purpose stated, they MUST enter into this contract.

Forced contracts. Forced labor.

Posted by: Jen the original at August 04, 2015 02:36 PM (YP6Ap)

121 The non constitutional right of Gay marriage must be accepted by all States but the constitutional right to bear arms can be denied by some States. Why even have the Constitution ?

At this point, we don't have one. The SCOTUS made that abundantly clear. We don't even have a legislature, since the courts ruled that they can decide what actual living people they could simply ask actually meant by what they wrote down.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 02:36 PM (39g3+)

122 Governor Christie, tell us about the time you used the drapes in the governor's mansion to clean your genitalia.

Posted by: Fritz at August 04, 2015 02:37 PM (UzPAd)

123 Which of Christie's political consultants told him it's a good idea to get people thinking about him having sex?

Posted by: Emmett Milbarge at August 04, 2015 02:37 PM (nFdGS)

124 Does Ace hate the Catholic church? How have I never noticed?

I take issues with Chris Christie's statement....one of which is that he about made me want to hurl at work.

When people state "I'm a Catholic, so..." or "I'm a Catholic, but..." it bothers me, because it makes them the end all, be all of the Catholic church and their members.

He is simultaneously shamelessly clamoring for the Catholic vote, while announcing loud and proud, "I'm Catholic!" and at the same time throwing the Catholic church under the bus by telling people, "But, I don't agree with the Catholic church, so you don't have to worry about me calling the Pope."

Hey, if you are going to be A Catholic Candidate, or THE Catholic candidate, be Catholic. Be unashamedly, unwaveringly, firmly Catholic. If you don't care that much about the Catholic teachings (and that's fine), don't promote yourself as a Catholic candidate. Just be a candidate who happens to go to a Catholic church.

Posted by: TickledPink at August 04, 2015 02:37 PM (RLFFI)

125 Meanwhile, 75% of Americans have delegated our inherent right (and right of the States) to interpret the Constitution and oppose its infringement to another established religion: the High Mystery Cult of the Constution, aka The Supreme Court.

Posted by: NYC Peasant at August 04, 2015 02:38 PM (k8tEg)

126 99 If it came down to Christie-Clinton, I would have to vote Clinton.

Actually, I wouldn't vote at all, given that choice. But, gun-to-head, I'd vote for Clinton over Christie.
Posted by: BlueStateRebel at August 04, 2015 02:31 PM (7ObY1)

WTF ?

Posted by: Cruzinator at August 04, 2015 02:38 PM (vyAun)

127 I remember the good old days when those who thought the Gay Mafia would go Gay Mafia were considered conspiracy loons.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at August 04, 2015 02:38 PM (659DL)

128 Barack Obama is a SCOAMT.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - Derringer Bandit at August 04, 2015 02:38 PM (kff5f)

129 Burn it down.
Scatter the stones.
Salt the earth where it stood.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - Derringer Bandit at August 04, 2015 02:38 PM (kff5f)

130 Apparently we can't even trust the SCROTUS to paraphrase the Constitution accurately.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:38 PM (xSCb6)

131 Can a Muslim (or Hindu , or any other faith) be forced to participate in a Christian ceremony?
Could an atheist baker be forced to participate in any type of religious ceremony?
Can I refuse to do business with customers I simply don't like? In other words could someone refuse to business with gays, not because they're gay but because they're obnoxious or because they want you to provide your service or product at below cost?


Suppose one were asked to cater a sex orgy?

Jews forced to be waiters at a neo-nazi event?

And how is it that producers have no freedom of association but consumers have all they want?

Posted by: AmishDude at August 04, 2015 02:39 PM (b65cm)

132 ***"Actually, I wouldn't vote at all, given that choice. But, gun-to-head, I'd vote for Clinton over Christie."***


Gun to my head, I might opt for the bullet.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:40 PM (xSCb6)

133 Gawker releases Donald Trump's cell phone number. The Donald uses the opportunity to leave a recorded campaign pitch for anyone who calls. Ross Douthat tweets: "You cannot troll the master troll."


Right now Gawker resembles Wile E. Coyote, Super-Genius, after using the latest in Acme products.

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Back-to-School Sale on Lunchboxes, Accusations at the Outrage Outlet! at August 04, 2015 02:36 PM (hLRSq)




Beautiful. So in essence he kind of reverse robocalled people.


I'm getting to be a fan of The Donald. He's showing the rest of them how to fight.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 04, 2015 02:40 PM (oKE6c)

134 Freedom of association implies a freedom to not associate.

-
This isn't Obamacare! Penumbra and emanations don't exceed that far.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 04, 2015 02:40 PM (cQzyY)

135 Pelosi is an apostate jew. Her mother was jewish.

Posted by: the truth at August 04, 2015 02:40 PM (rnH8X)

136 Posted by: TickledPink at August 04, 2015 02:37 PM (RLFFI)

-----

Well said. I think CC's statement was dumb. But it is really dumb because it turns me off as a Catholic. Now maybe it brings more people in, so losing me is not a big deal. But why would I as a Catholic wish to vote for someone who openly acknowledges that they are ok with going against church teaching in their personal life? Why is that an endearing quality? I don't expect my politicians to be saints - we are all sinners. But I don't care for the ones who want the recognition of being a Catholic without the responsibility of one.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:41 PM (gmeXX)

137 Suppose one were asked to cater a sex orgy?

One cheese and sausage party platter, coming right up.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 04, 2015 02:41 PM (2Ojst)

138 Posted by: Mikey NTH - Back-to-School Sale on Lunchboxes, Accusations at the Outrage Outlet! at August 04, 2015 02:36 PM (hLRSq)

He's a 10th Dan Blackbelt at Troll-jitsu.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - Derringer Bandit at August 04, 2015 02:41 PM (kff5f)

139 Gawker releases Donald Trump's cell phone number. The Donald uses the opportunity to leave a recorded campaign pitch for anyone who calls. Ross Douthat tweets: "You cannot troll the master troll."

-
Trump is like a superhero or something.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 04, 2015 02:42 PM (cQzyY)

140 Can a china figurine company that makes wedding cake toppers be forced to include some in their product line that depict two males in tuxes? Just where does "forcible accommodation" end?

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at August 04, 2015 02:42 PM (8ZskC)

141 The thing that should really scare you is that if the DOPe had decided to throw a few hundred million at this Christy Canyon guy we would be begging for the fierce conservatism of ĄJeb!

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at August 04, 2015 02:42 PM (ktt8p)

142 @126

I'm with them. I swore 3 years ago I would never vote for Chris Christie, and I won't.

I'd prefer to sit it out, but gun to the head, I also have to say I'd pick Clinton.

You are choosing between white peaches and yellow peaches at that point. Not much of a difference. If Christie gets elected and mucks it up, I cannot even imagine how far to the left our country would swing to over-correct from it.

Posted by: TickledPink at August 04, 2015 02:42 PM (RLFFI)

143 On the other hand, I think actively agitating for a perfect and complete right to discriminate against whoever you like is a surefire loser position, which will result in the public opting for the progressive position (no freedom of conscience at all).

This argument doesn't hold any water with me. You know what you get when you allow one nose of a camel under a tent? All of a camel. You know what you lose when you give up some of your liberty to the state?

All your liberty.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 02:42 PM (39g3+)

144
gun-to-head, I'd vote for Clinton over Christie.
Posted by: BlueStateRebel




Well, I'm trying to take away your guns to foreclose that option.

Posted by: Chris "The Gunburgler" Christie

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at August 04, 2015 02:42 PM (kdS6q)

145 "You have no right to what I produce. That you can take it by force is no ethical argument."

How would you respond to se pa moron's point that services are different? That is:

"You have no right to determine what I do. That you can make me do it by force is no ethical argument."

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:43 PM (12atq)

146 Chris Christie thinks he has sex but he can't be sure because he hasn't seen his genitals since puberty.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at August 04, 2015 02:43 PM (8ZskC)

147 Trump is like a superhero or something.

Yeah his superpower is in turning everything into a reality show and begin a reality show winner.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 02:44 PM (39g3+)

148 Gawker releases Donald Trump's cell phone number. The Donald uses the opportunity to leave a recorded campaign pitch for anyone who calls. Ross Douthat tweets: "You cannot troll the master troll."


I like to think I generated a few milliTrump by forwarding robocalls from one solar company to another solar company that also places robocalls, and vice versa.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 04, 2015 02:44 PM (oKE6c)

149 Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 02:42 PM (39g3+)

You're right. But when the camel is already in the tent, you have to get him out somehow- and nose first is easier than lifting him bodily and carrying him out.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - Derringer Bandit at August 04, 2015 02:44 PM (kff5f)

150 What do you mean you won't be the photographer for a party I'm throwing?

Posted by: Nudist at August 04, 2015 02:44 PM (HstNY)

151 Trump is like a superhero or something.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 04, 2015 02:42 PM (cQzyY)


At this point I'm expecting Trump to shatter Perry's glasses with just words like in Dune.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 04, 2015 02:44 PM (oFCZn)

152 We opened this can, perhaps with the best of intentions when we started telling private entities when they were not permitted to discriminate. Mostly based on race and religion.

Like I said, best of intentions. Regardless, the worms that came out of that can, cannot be put back in any sort of neat and orderly manner.

Is it being used to bash the "wrong" sorts of people now? You betcha. If you haven't yet had your turn, is it coming? Oh, I can't see why not.

Whatever you do, eventually you'll be on the wrong side.

Posted by: BurtTC at August 04, 2015 02:44 PM (TOk1P)

153 SH, I know some Catholics who are very deliberate about their dissent. They want their dissent to "change the facts on the ground" so that the Church will eventually change its teaching on x, y, or z.

Ordinarily I'd hear this and say "come on, conspiracy theorist."

But I know them personally.

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:45 PM (12atq)

154 145 "You have no right to what I produce. That you can take it by force is no ethical argument."

How would you respond to se pa moron's point that services are different? That is:

"You have no right to determine what I do. That you can make me do it by force is no ethical argument."
Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:43 PM (12atq)



Phew. That was close. I'm not sure whether I count as a good or a service, but either way, a girl's only got so much energy ...

Posted by: Kate Upton at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (oKE6c)

155 #44Turns54


uggggh. The cocksucking there is disgusting.

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (fWAjv)

156 As a pastor who is theologically conservative and red meat politically, I whole heartedly agree with Ace's position. I normally phrase it thus:

People should not be compelled to engage in collaborative artistic efforts against their wills for any reasons whatsoever

In a tattoo shop they have portfolios of clip art. If you're a sucker, walk in and get one. The tattoo artist is not required to commit one iota of personal creative effort to give you that tribal armband you've been jonesing for.

Go into a Denny's and order off the menu, same thing.

Go into a bakery and get six premade cupcakes out of the front counter. Same thing.

All of those things should fall clearly and easily under public accommodations.

But the second you have to collaborate with someone who is using their artistic expression to make an item of food or art or furniture or tribal abominations, then they should have full throated first amendment protections for whatever reason at all, vile or upright.

Bakeries should carry a variety of clip art cakes, separating client from artist with a wall of choices BY THE ARTIST. And if you want something else, find a like minded artist to collaborate with.

Posted by: James at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (eitjX)

157 I'm pretty sure the "right" to someone else's labor question had been answered by 1865.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (xSCb6)

158 One cheese and sausage party platter, coming right up.


How YOU doin'?

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (/kI1Q)

159 What do you mean you won't be the photographer for a party I'm throwing?

Posted by: Nudist at August 04, 2015 02:44 PM (HstNY)


Good question. Nudies absolutely luuuurv involving the kiddies in all their frolicking.

Posted by: BurtTC at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (TOk1P)

160 Can a gay abortion Doctor be forced to perform an abortion on an underage, illegal alien lesbian teen mother if the mother states that she wants the fetus gone cause it may be gay?

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (VPLuQ)

161 SH, I know some Catholics who are very deliberate about their dissent. They want their dissent to "change the facts on the ground" so that the Church will eventually change its teaching on x, y, or z.

------

I'm sure there are many. I am on the side of the Church. Which is why I think Christie's comments are dumb. I will not support someone like that.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:47 PM (gmeXX)

162 You have no right to what I produce

Finally! Someone gets it!

Oh, wait. The Horde always got it. It's the rest of the idiots we need to educate.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - Derringer Bandit at August 04, 2015 02:47 PM (kff5f)

163 ""You cannot troll the master troll."


*Snort*

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 04, 2015 02:47 PM (LA7Cm)

164 We opened this can, perhaps with the best of intentions when we started telling private entities when they were not permitted to discriminate. Mostly based on race and religion.


No matter how pure the original intent was, any power that is ceded to the government will eventually be used to oppress selected unpersons.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at August 04, 2015 02:48 PM (8ZskC)

165 The invisible hand is the reason segregation, boycotts and so forth don't need to be banned by law.

-
I agree. Free Adam Smith and much ass will be kicked. And it will be an iron invisible foot inside a velvet boot.

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 04, 2015 02:48 PM (cQzyY)

166 #98 and all:
I am sorry, but I had to shoot Paul Anka.

Posted by: Richard Harris at August 04, 2015 02:48 PM (VcOqI)

167 By the way, I guess I am a surefire loser, because I am firmly in the "Discriminate against whoever you want" camp.

Either everyone can be discriminated against or no one can. It's not okay that we can discriminate against fat people, against smokers, or for no reason whatsoever; but we can't if you fall under certain subsets.


Posted by: TickledPink at August 04, 2015 02:48 PM (RLFFI)

168 "Can a gay abortion Doctor be forced to perform an abortion on an underage, illegal alien lesbian teen mother if the mother states that she wants the fetus gone cause it may be gay?"


Exactly.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 04, 2015 02:49 PM (LA7Cm)

169 You can't trust a progressive to paraphrase a conservative's words.
________

As Ace says, "You can't trust ... a conservative's words."

Posted by: FireHorse at August 04, 2015 02:49 PM (2gwcc)

170 "loser position"

Christie is a submissive by nature. He's always worried about the cost of taking a stand and leading.

Compare, say, Trump.

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:49 PM (12atq)

171 Phew. That was close. I'm not sure whether I count as a good or a service, but either way, a girl's only got so much energy ...

Posted by: Kate Upton at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (oKE6c)


He said "what," not "who."


Just sayin'.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - Derringer Bandit at August 04, 2015 02:49 PM (kff5f)

172 People and businesses should be free to associate with whomever they want to associate with.

It's fucking pathetic that the above statement is debatable.

Posted by: Dang at August 04, 2015 02:49 PM (2oWD2)

173 No shoes
No shirt
No service.

That is apparently OK to say. No one has ever challenged the legality of those signs.

But...

No gender-appropriate clothing
No attempt at modesty
No service.

...is ILLEGAL to say?

Basically, if a guy walks into your store wearing no shirt, you can discriminate against him. But if a guy walks into your store wearing a dress, you CAN'T discriminate against him.

Isn't this kind of random and arbitrary? It has the whiff of some people being in a "protected class" and having special rights that no one else has.

Posted by: zombie at August 04, 2015 02:49 PM (jBuUi)

174 Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:45 PM (12atq)


Also describes every Catholic I personally know.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:50 PM (xSCb6)

175 1. Just how late into pregnancy would you defend an abortion? 39 weeks? 38? Are there any means of abortion that you consider to be too painful to use at any fetal age?


Abortion now, Abortion tomorrow, Abortion forever

Posted by: Nanci George Pelosi Wallace at August 04, 2015 02:50 PM (RDbDo)

176 If a black man comes into my bakery, he can buy anything he wants. If he wants a special cake that says "Kill Whitey" on it, I'm going to kick him out.

I didn't refuse to serve him because he's black.

Same goes for gay people. I will serve them, but not if they ask me to participate in something against my beliefs. That IS NOT the same as "refusing to serve them because they're gay." Not even close.

The problem is: I say "beliefs" and that means an unwavering power... but in a Democrat's ears it means "hobby." As Hillary says, "Just change it."

Posted by: RKae at August 04, 2015 02:51 PM (ALvZ6)

177 Also describes every Catholic I personally know.

-----

You should meet some more Catholics.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:51 PM (gmeXX)

178 Can a gay abortion Doctor be forced to perform an abortion on an underage, illegal alien lesbian teen mother if the mother states that she wants the fetus gone cause it may be gay?

Depends, is the illegal alien lesbian teen mother also transgendered?

Posted by: V the K at August 04, 2015 02:52 PM (O7MnT)

179 But the second you have to collaborate with someone who is using their
artistic expression to make an item of food or art or furniture or
tribal abominations, then they should have full throated first amendment
protections for whatever reason at all, vile or upright.



Your statement reminded me of Heart and Mellencamp and all those ilk who have let ASCAP license their pre-recorded music, then bitched when Republicans or conservatives paid ASCAP the fee to play their pre-recorded music at campaign events.

Doesn't seem much different to me than picking six pre-decorated cupcakes off the rack, but apparently they feel it's akin to being forced to photograph Bill and Ted's wedding...except they get public support and the wedding photographers don't.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 04, 2015 02:52 PM (/kI1Q)

180 He sure sounds like a bad Catholic, but based on my broken-hearted understanding that the vast majority of Catholics also support things like birth control and same sex marriage, I don't know what to say.

Being Catholic isn't all it's cracked up to be anymore. Being "Catholic" seems to be what most of them have in mind.

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 02:52 PM (7Kbxu)

181 If Paul Anka released "Havin' My Baby" today, would it be banned from the airwaves?

Posted by: Music Man at August 04, 2015 02:53 PM (VcOqI)

182 Christie is just toeing the GOPe line, I'm sure most of the other candidates will take that position as well. After all the GOPe line is quite clear: don't do anything that will offend anyone except your voting base because they are already in the bag. Don't take anyone's imagined rights away except those from your staunchest supporters. Move left and keep moving left until we reach the proper mixture of Marxism and Fascism and the Constitution doesn't mean what it says anymore.

Posted by: doug at August 04, 2015 02:53 PM (IYEs/)

183 "Can a gay abortion Doctor be forced to perform an abortion on an underage, illegal alien lesbian teen mother if the mother states that she wants the fetus gone cause it may be gay?"

-
Has the gay abortion doctor shot a lion?

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 04, 2015 02:53 PM (cQzyY)

184 ***"You should meet some more Catholics.


Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:51 PM (gmeXX) "***


After about 30 or so of various ages from all parts of the country, I'm thinking it's not isolated.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:53 PM (xSCb6)

185 Kelly Osbourne ask Donald Trump who would clean your toilets if Latinos leave.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FE-LsDvDelY

Posted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 02:54 PM (S+el1)

186 Listen, there are some tenets of the Catholic church that I don't agree with. I agree with most, theologically. The way things are run here on earth, I have some issues with. (Priests being married, etc)

But, I would never, never, NEVER brag about my Catholicism and then in the same breath, assure people that I am a rebellious Catholic, so they don't have to worry about me swinging things to the Right.

Posted by: TickledPink at August 04, 2015 02:54 PM (RLFFI)

187 "Did you know that in 1992 there was an episode of Seinfeld where Elaine
was on her way to a lesbian or gay wedding. Apparently in 1992 gay
people didn't need the government to acknowledge their love or threaten
people's livelihood if they didn't agree with it."

=========

They'd never get away with that episode today. The lesbian wedding is treated like a punch line rather than celebrated. It's not a "very special episode" of Seinfeld.

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 02:54 PM (7Kbxu)

188 And the problem with Christie is that he's viewing a religious exemption as something government allows you to have.

That can be whisked away tomorrow.

...Or do we really believe that Lucy is going to let Charlie Brown kick that football?

Posted by: RKae at August 04, 2015 02:55 PM (ALvZ6)

189 "Being "Catholic" seems to be what most of them have in mind."

Which is why, if I'm not mistaken, why they're considered swing voters.

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 02:55 PM (12atq)

190 After about 30 or so of various ages from all parts of the country, I'm thinking it's not isolated.

------

I'm sure not. But there are actually many of us Catholics who take the Church's position seriously. I'm happy so many claim to be Catholic. I hope one day they will be full practicing Catholics.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 02:55 PM (gmeXX)

191 Posted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 02:54 PM (S+el1)


I don't think that link links to what you think you're linking.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:55 PM (xSCb6)

192 Cut your own lawns; clean your won toilets, bake your own cakes.

Posted by: Immigration Man at August 04, 2015 02:56 PM (VcOqI)

193 Once you have government regulating or mandating who can or cannot exercise a right, then you have lost that right.

Perhaps not today and maybe not tomorrow but eventually.

Look at religion, once they allowed government to get in the business of deciding who or what is a church or religion it was only a matter of time before they began removing the right to practice one's religion as delineated by it's professors.

Fatso is just another Big Government pol and just because he mouths off at teachers and unions, people for get that.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 04, 2015 02:56 PM (x3GpS)

194 Christie is a submissive by nature. He's always worried about the cost of taking a stand and leading.

I thought he had cajones back in the day taking on the teachers' union in NJ. I liked him a lot then. Not sure what happened since. Maybe I missed something.

Posted by: OregonMuse at August 04, 2015 02:57 PM (j1VIK)

195 I am sorry, but I had to shoot Paul Anka. Posted by: Richard Harris at August 04, 2015 02:48 PM (VcOqI)

Good work. I sunk the Edmund Fitzgerald.

Posted by: Gordon Lightfoot at August 04, 2015 02:57 PM (xQX/f)

196 So if I own a bookstore, I can decide not to stock books by George Boosh, but can I be sued if I don't want to stock explicit gay porn by Mapplethorpe?

Posted by: NYC Peasant at August 04, 2015 02:57 PM (k8tEg)

197 It may be isolated, but it may also be you. Most of the Catholic friends I have are fervant Catholics. I do also know some more liberal Catholics. Most people I know are faithful Catholics though.

There was a survey that came out that said something like 90% of Catholic women use birth control. I just don't believe it. I'm guessing they did their survey on the campus of Boston College or something. It's all in context.

Posted by: TickledPink at August 04, 2015 02:58 PM (RLFFI)

198 I don't think that link links to what you think you're linking.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 02:55 PM (xSCb6)

Sure as hell didn't. Try this one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qukPLN1kFws

Posted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 02:58 PM (S+el1)

199
"Abortion now, Abortion tomorrow, Abortion forever"


What a beautiful statement.

Posted by: Mr. Doo Doo at August 04, 2015 02:58 PM (OD2ni)

200 "I don't think that link links to what you think you're linking."


"Chloe Donald" What's a "Chloe Donald?"

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 04, 2015 02:58 PM (LA7Cm)

201 And that tommylotto sounds like a troublemaker to me.

Better put a watch on them.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 04, 2015 02:58 PM (x3GpS)

202 Has the gay abortion doctor shot a lion?

Depends, is the illegal alien lesbian teen mother also transgendered?

Only for the Horde...let me try this again.

Can a world famous gay abortion Doctor who donates the meat from his African lion hunts be forced to perform an abortion on an underage, illegal alien, self identifying black, but born to white parents, transgendered lesbian teen mother if the mother states that she wants the fetus gone cause it may have the Gay gene?

Did I miss anything?

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at August 04, 2015 02:58 PM (VPLuQ)

203 I attended Mass with my brother's family about a year and a half ago, and they literally started sneering and jeering during the homily because the priest was criticizing abortion and same-sex marriage.

I was flabbergasted. I don't understand what their Catholicism means to them. It seems to have something to do with doing charity and voting Democrat and that's it.

In which case I don't understand what they need the church for.

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 02:58 PM (7Kbxu)

204 Cut your own lawns; clean your won toilets, bake your own cakes.


In that particular order?..... cause eww.

Posted by: eleven at August 04, 2015 02:59 PM (IPzoI)

205 Kelly Osbourne ask Donald Trump who would clean your toilets if Latinos leave.

Kelly Osborne is truly the Wise Conscience of A Generation.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at August 04, 2015 02:59 PM (8ZskC)

206 We opened this can, perhaps with the best of intentions when we started telling private entities when they were not permitted to discriminate. Mostly based on race and religion.

Like I said, best of intentions.


Yep. And in the process of all those good intentions and trying to help people out... we destroyed the rest of the good we already had.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 02:59 PM (39g3+)

207 There was a survey that came out that said something like 90% of Catholic women use birth control.

------

I'm willing to bet it would be less if it was Church-going Catholics. But even in that smaller category, the usage rate may be quite high. But I think it is probably decreasing because I think a lot of those liberal priests have been weeded out, and I think priests are bringing it up more often in their homilies. Just my observation. Your's may be different.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 03:00 PM (gmeXX)

208 Tommylotto?


That's a signal from God that I should play the lotto tonite.

Posted by: eleven at August 04, 2015 03:00 PM (IPzoI)

209 112 The non constitutional right of Gay marriage must be accepted by all States but the constitutional right to bear arms can be denied by some States. Why even have the Constitution ?
Posted by: Cruzinator at August 04, 2015 02:34 PM (vyAun)


When the Bill of Rights was originally written it only applied to the federal government. The courts screwed it up by trying to incorporate parts of it to the States. One at a time. And somehow they never gor around to the second until Hellor.

Posted by: Vic at August 04, 2015 03:00 PM (GpgJl)

210 They'd never get away with that episode today. The
lesbian wedding is treated like a punch line rather than celebrated.
It's not a "very special episode" of Seinfeld.


Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 02:54 PM (7Kbxu)


I'm kinda looking forward to the day when Larry Gelbart's corpse is dug up so it can be put on trial for putting Klinger in a dress and making him the butt of the jokes.


Good liberals of the past will be made to pay for their lack of adherence to Party doctrine.

Posted by: BurtTC at August 04, 2015 03:01 PM (TOk1P)

211 How fast could Christie eat a four tiered Gay Marriage Cake? Would he eat it faster if it were shaped like a cock? Stuff Republican voters need to know.

Posted by: Super Creepy Eric Hoteham at August 04, 2015 03:01 PM (oDCMR)

212 I attended Mass with my brother's family about a year and a half ago, and they literally started sneering and jeering during the homily because the priest was criticizing abortion and same-sex marriage.

-----

See that often gets a standing ovation in my parish.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 03:01 PM (gmeXX)

213 "No shirt, no shoes, no service..."

Whatever happened to the signs I remember seeing posted everywhere - "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" ??

Some of y'all don't get it - I will discriminate against anyone I wish to. I will support whomever I wish to.
Want to buy a cupcake in my bakery, but I don't like your mustache? Get out.
Expect to hire me to paint your house but I don't like your cat? Bye.

If I lose my house and starve to death in the process because I'm an idiot, so be it. But don't try to legislate me into complying with your PC worldvieww.

Posted by: Chi at August 04, 2015 03:01 PM (nKL+X)

214 Kensington, are you in the UK?

Posted by: Feh at August 04, 2015 03:01 PM (12atq)

215 Honestly, who wants to think of some fat, squatty midget having sweaty sex right after lunch?

The guy was done with most people after the duplicity with Obama and the Sandy handouts.

Plus he's a Springsteen fan.

Ew.

Posted by: marcus T at August 04, 2015 03:02 PM (GGCsk)

216 @ Chi, 213

Standing O! This is exactly how I feel.

Posted by: TickledPink at August 04, 2015 03:03 PM (RLFFI)

217 No, I'm in Chicago. My "Kensington" is a neighborhood in Brooklyn, NY that I used to live in.

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:03 PM (7Kbxu)

218 Kelly Osbourne ask Donald Trump who would clean your toilets if Latinos leave.

That kind of transcends the racism of low expectations into just plain "that's all they're good for" racism.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 03:03 PM (39g3+)

219 158 One cheese and sausage party platter, coming right up.


How YOU doin'?
Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 04, 2015 02:46 PM (/kI1Q)

I was referring to the orgy, not the food. But I'm doing just fine, thanks for asking!

Posted by: Insomniac at August 04, 2015 03:03 PM (2Ojst)

220 On the other hand, I think actively agitating for a perfect and complete
right to discriminate against whoever you like is a surefire loser
position...


Worked for us.

Posted by: Founding Fathers at August 04, 2015 03:04 PM (1+7D3)

221 ***"Plus he's a Springsteen fan."***


That alone is grounds for disqualification.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 03:04 PM (xSCb6)

222
So Krispy Creosote knows his way around a Coney Island Whitefish.

I REALLY didn't want to know that.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at August 04, 2015 03:04 PM (fKmBJ)

223 Posted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 02:54 PM (S+el1)

Interesting. So Progressives admit all they want Hispanics around for is (a) their votes, and (b) domestic servants.

Democrats still have this hard-on for 'servitude' by distinct population groups, don't they?

Posted by: Mikey NTH - Back-to-School Sale on Lunchboxes, Accusations at the Outrage Outlet! at August 04, 2015 03:04 PM (hLRSq)

224 "I'm kinda looking forward to the day when Larry Gelbart's corpse is dug
up so it can be put on trial for putting Klinger in a dress and making
him the butt of the jokes"

======

I would make popcorn if this ever happened!

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:04 PM (7Kbxu)

225 Nobody cleans a toilet like a Latino.

Posted by: Kelly Osborne at August 04, 2015 03:05 PM (8ZskC)

226 I think, much to my chagrin, that we have created a bright-line rule: Any time you take or receive a dollar in commerce you forfeit your first amendment rights. Basically, we have elevated economic interests above Liberty interests.

Posted by: ObjectionSustained at August 04, 2015 03:05 PM (1/hKC)

227
"Gawker releases Donald Trump's cell phone number. The Donald uses the opportunity to leave a recorded campaign pitch for anyone who calls. Ross Douthat tweets: "You cannot troll the master troll."


If I rememeber correctly, Lucianne Goldberg turned the tables on fatso Michael Moore during the Clinon impeachment saga. Fatso set up a website dedicated to a camera watching her apartment 24/7 and she sold advertisements which she put on her windows.

Posted by: Mr. Doo Doo at August 04, 2015 03:05 PM (OD2ni)

228 "He says, "Like a good Catholic, I pick and choose what teachings I'll follow. I, not the Church, define what 'Catholic' is and means for me."

Sort of like the present Pope...

Posted by: Thor's feather duster at August 04, 2015 03:05 PM (JgC5a)

229 The Third Amendment now has an exception. If the soldier is gay you must provide quarter.

Posted by: Cruzinator at August 04, 2015 03:05 PM (vyAun)

230 "That kind of transcends the racism of low expectations into just plain "that's all they're good for" racism."

Heh, it really does. Latinos can't graduate, get an office job, move to the 'burbs, Kelly?

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 04, 2015 03:05 PM (LA7Cm)

231 226 I think, much to my chagrin, that we have created a bright-line rule: Any time you take or receive a dollar in commerce you forfeit your first amendment rights. Basically, we have elevated economic interests above Liberty interests.
Posted by: ObjectionSustained at August 04, 2015 03:05 PM (1/hKC)

The underlying argument, and I've seen it made expressly, is that engaging in commerce is a privilege granted you by the state, and they are free to fashion the contours of that privilege however they like.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 04, 2015 03:06 PM (2Ojst)

232 ***"Plus he's a Springsteen fan."***


That alone is grounds for disqualification.

AND a Dallas Cowboys fan. Strike 2!

Posted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 03:07 PM (S+el1)

233 "Sort of like the present Pope..."
=======

...who is adored by my brother and his family and cited for justification when they sneer and jeer at anti-same sex "marriage" homilies during Mass.

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:07 PM (7Kbxu)

234 "AND a Dallas Cowboys fan. Strike 2!"


Now this is starting to hit a little close to home.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 04, 2015 03:08 PM (LA7Cm)

235 "Sort of like the present Pope..."
=======

...who is adored by my brother and his family and cited for justification when they sneer and jeer at anti-same sex "marriage" homilies during Mass.

-----

He is also against abortion and gay marriage.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 03:08 PM (gmeXX)

236 172 People and businesses should be free to associate with whomever they want to associate with.

It's fucking pathetic that the above statement is debatable.
Posted by: Dang


All of this is based on the Jim Crow laws that existed in parts of the South from the 1870s to the 1950s.

So a law that sounded all high and mighty and universal was written to prevent Jim Crow laws.

But no one ever imagined that it could be, would be, be or should be applied to other situations. Or that it would apply to reverse situations.

If you are white, just TRY walking into a black-owned barber shop in the most all-black hostile ghetto, and ask for a crew cut.

They will "refuse to serve you," to put it euphemistically.

But no one, NO ONE, contests this or disputes the right of the black barber to refuse white customers.

I personally have witnessed white people entering certain Chinese-owned businesses -- not ones for tourists or for the general public but hardcore Chinese businesses where the owners don't even speak English -- and been refused service. It isn't so overt that a bouncer ejects the white person from the business, it's "de facto" refusal in that the white person is ignored or waved away or barked at in Chinese and then dismissed. The gwailos just give up and leave.

This happens every day, somewhere. And no one, frankly, gives a shit.

But gays...are demanding special treatment. Treatment that no one else gets.

Furthermore, you can't tell who's gay just from their appearance, unlike with "racial discrimination." Sure, some people have attuned "gaydar," but it's often inaccurate. So what we're talking about here is discriminating against people based on vague unprovable assumptions about their private behavior. Is that illegal? Why?

"Gay" is not a definitive category. Is it OK to discriminate against a guy who screws girls 99% of the time, but every now and then will let a tranny hooker suck his ding-dong?

Posted by: zombie at August 04, 2015 03:08 PM (jBuUi)

237 Basically, we have elevated economic interests above Liberty interests.

Posted by: ObjectionSustained at August 04, 2015 03:05 PM (1/hKC)

Do you really think it has anything to do with economics? It's about identity power. To the extent that money is part of that power source, then sure, it's economic, but that's really not what this is about.

Posted by: BurtTC at August 04, 2015 03:08 PM (TOk1P)

238 remember a Jersey moron posting how much they paid in property taxes.

Holy ckuf. I cried and I don't even live there.

Get the fuck out of Jersey! Just get the fuck out!

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at August 04, 2015 02:33 PM (oFCZn)
==========================

2.25% of your assessed value in Princeton NJ.

ie, $22,500 per million dollars in assessed value (about the value of a 2800 sq ft house on a third of an acre lot).

Posted by: Suffering NJ Moron at August 04, 2015 03:08 PM (LISuA)

239 the day i GAF about what the Jersey Whale has to say on anything is the day i'll need to be committed...

Posted by: redc1c4 at August 04, 2015 03:09 PM (lsWof)

240 Interesting. So Progressives admit all they want Hispanics around for is (a) their votes, and (b) domestic servants.


Related: One of the funniest classics Iowahawk ever wrote.

http://tinyurl.com/8lsttd

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at August 04, 2015 03:09 PM (8ZskC)

241 Three trips to Country Buffet each day, along with snacking between meals on two bags of Cheetos, washed down with a few gallons of something akin to a Little Debbie/Kit Kat/lard slurry will be 100% effective in preventing pregnancy.

Posted by: model_1066 at August 04, 2015 03:09 PM (WEvvb)

242 The underlying argument, and I've seen it made expressly, is that engaging in commerce is a privilege granted you by the state, and they are free to fashion the contours of that privilege however they like.

Oddly enough its often espoused by alleged free market fiscal conservative types as well. We're so inculcated and indoctrinated into leftist cant that its a constant struggle to break free.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 03:09 PM (39g3+)

243 Kelly Osbourne could clean toilets.

It'd be nice if she'd contribute for once.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 04, 2015 03:09 PM (oVJmc)

244
"Nobody cleans a toilet like a Latino."

I'm not Latino!

Posted by: Mr. Clean at August 04, 2015 03:09 PM (OD2ni)

245
Plus he's a Springsteen fan.
Posted by: marcus T




When Chris gets that twinkle in his eye and puts "Rosalita" on the turntable, I know the night isn't going to end well for me.

Posted by: Mrs Christie

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at August 04, 2015 03:09 PM (kdS6q)

246 Yeah, I remember Pelosi calling abortion a sacrament.

Even at the time I thought that was pretty creepy, but I had no effin idea that it was not a metaphor but a literal and exact statement of truth.

Well, we all know better now, don't we ?

Anybody wanna guess who I think they are worshipping with that sacrament of theirs ?

Posted by: sock_rat_eez at August 04, 2015 03:10 PM (go6ud)

247 Trump is like a superhero or something.

Yeah his superpower is in turning everything into a reality show and begin a reality show winner.

-
Can you imagine Trump negotiating with Iran?

Posted by: The Great White Snark at August 04, 2015 03:10 PM (PcnHS)

248 There's so etching wrong with the "off the shelf" rule, however common sense it might seem it's off into the weeds right away with many ordinary services ...perhaps the key word is "service" vs product.... attached to parties and receptions and weddings in particular....

Tent set up, flower arranging, dance floor assembly, security, limousine service...

These things require active on site participation by the vendors. It suggests, I will act to promote and enable this ceremony or this party celebrating it.

It's one thing to sell or rent, say, temporary dance floors or tents, another to out them together or set them up. And any sort of customization with a message, similarly requires action on the part of the vendor peculiar to the event.

How do you get out of those weeds? Businesses IMO, should be forced. Y public opinion nd poulR dem d and the incentives of making money guide their choices, but they should be able to selectively serve one type of wedding over another, or refuse those that they don't care for.

Just like employers should be able to provide or not provide insurance for healthcare as they see fit, or to pick and choose what they will exclude from coverage. So yeah, I guess there is no hope. Government decides what is good and we all have to turn our conscience or even tastes over to our overlords.

Posted by: SarahW at August 04, 2015 03:10 PM (3fTXW)

249 Ricardo Kill

Decided on my Alaskan land. On the North Fork of the Big river about 5o miles SE of Mcgrath. 11 acres 12k.

Posted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 03:10 PM (S+el1)

250 176 If a black man comes into my bakery, he can buy anything he wants. If he wants a special cake that says "Kill Whitey" on it, I'm going to kick him out.

I didn't refuse to serve him because he's black.

Same goes for gay people. I will serve them, but not if they ask me to participate in something against my beliefs. That IS NOT the same as "refusing to serve them because they're gay." Not even close.

Posted by: RKae


Well put!

Posted by: zombie at August 04, 2015 03:11 PM (jBuUi)

251 I'm kinda looking forward to the day when Larry Gelbart's corpse is dug up so it can be put on trial for putting Klinger in a dress and making him the butt of the jokes.
------------------------------
Great point, Burt.

But even worse - he was not only the butt of jokes, he was using his Caitlyn routine to get a section 8 discharge.
He was portraying CRAZY by dressing as a woman.
Can you imagine that being done today?

Posted by: Chi at August 04, 2015 03:11 PM (nKL+X)

252 "[Pope Francis] is also against abortion and gay marriage."
=======

Yes, but he's not doing a good job of communicating it. Instead, what he's communicating is "Who am I to judge?" which is then used by liberal Catholics to justify supporting abortion and same-sex "marriage."

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:11 PM (7Kbxu)

253 @213 "No shirt, no shoes, no service..."



Whatever happened to the signs I remember seeing posted everywhere - "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" ??



Some of y'all don't get it - I will discriminate against anyone I wish to. I will support whomever I wish to.

Want to buy a cupcake in my bakery, but I don't like your mustache? Get out.

Expect to hire me to paint your house but I don't like your cat? Bye.



If I lose my house and starve to death in the process because I'm an
idiot, so be it. But don't try to legislate me into complying with your
PC worldvieww.


*standing ovation*

Posted by: some random meathead at August 04, 2015 03:11 PM (1+7D3)

254 Can you imagine Trump negotiating with Iran?

Given where the bar has been set, he can't help but succeed.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 04, 2015 03:12 PM (oVJmc)

255 If I rememeber correctly, Lucianne Goldberg turned the tables on fatso Michael Moore during the Clinon impeachment saga. Fatso set up a website dedicated to a camera watching her apartment 24/7 and she sold advertisements which she put on her windows.

The Dork from Davison (he's not actually from Flint, Michigan) actually punked his own damned fat self back on election day 2012 and tweeted his own cell phone number (810.522.839. Not sure if it still works...

Posted by: AltonJackson at August 04, 2015 03:12 PM (ZQfW9)

256 Furthermore, you can't tell who's gay just from their appearance, unlike with "racial discrimination." Sure, some people have attuned "gaydar," but it's often inaccurate. So what we're talking about here is discriminating against people based on vague unprovable assumptions about their private behavior. Is that illegal? Why?

Well, sometimes they come in a-flamin', but maybe that's more in the realm of conduct than appearance. Although there are plenty of them, as you know, who go WAY out of their way to signal it by appearance.

Posted by: Insomniac at August 04, 2015 03:12 PM (2Ojst)

257 So I can get me some Hitler Birthday cakes made by Jewish bakers?

Posted by: Super Creepy Eric Hoteham at August 04, 2015 03:12 PM (oDCMR)

258 I personally would not permit businesses to discriminate against gay people for being gay



seriously ace? You need to rethink this.

Posted by: some random meathead at August 04, 2015 03:12 PM (1+7D3)

259 "AND a Dallas Cowboys fan. Strike 2!"

Careful.

Them's bordering on fightin' words.

Posted by: AllenG (DedicatedTenther) - Derringer Bandit at August 04, 2015 03:13 PM (kff5f)

260 810.522.8398

damn autocucumber emoticon

Posted by: AltonJackson at August 04, 2015 03:13 PM (ZQfW9)

261 Pope Francis is too occupied with pushing Global Warming/Climate Change and Marxism to be bothered with other moral issues.
Funny thing, I keep looking for the Bible verse that gives mankind dominion over the weather.
Not finding it anywhere.

Posted by: Thor's feather duster at August 04, 2015 03:14 PM (JgC5a)

262 [Pope Francis] is also against abortion and gay marriage."
=======

Yes,
but he's not doing a good job of communicating it. Instead, what he's
communicating is "Who am I to judge?" which is then used by liberal
Catholics to justify supporting abortion and same-sex "marriage."


Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:11 PM (7Kbxu)


Oh, I don't for a minute believe the Fresh Pope is against abortion or same-sex marriage. He's got to say he is, just like Barack Obama had to say he was against SSM, but it's with a wink and a knowing nod.

Posted by: BurtTC at August 04, 2015 03:14 PM (TOk1P)

263 ***"If you are white, just TRY walking into a black-owned barber shop in the most all-black hostile ghetto, and ask for a crew cut."***


Ironically, my lilly white ass routinely walks into the black-owned barber shop in the black majority neighborhood I live in here in the deeeeeep south (Mississippi) and get a hair cut and have a grand old time yammerin' with the all black staff.


Though I will be moving back to FL soon.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at August 04, 2015 03:14 PM (xSCb6)

264
"On the other hand, I think actively agitating for a perfect and complete right to discriminate against whoever you like is a surefire loser position, which will result in the public opting for the progressive position (no freedom of conscience at all)."
Which is pretty much word for word the exact same position HUCK/AKIN took on abortion a few threads down, and got hammered for.
I swear if Ace was just a poster here and not the host a third of the commenters would be Emmanuel Goldsteining him for his opinions too, calling him filthy names,calling him a troll and insisting he be banned.
What was the phraseAce used? Ah yess, "tribal signaling".

Posted by: MAx at August 04, 2015 03:15 PM (LAliD)

265 Three trips to Country Buffet each day, along with snacking between
meals on two bags of Cheetos, washed down with a few gallons of
something akin to a Little Debbie/Kit Kat/lard slurry will be 100%
effective in preventing pregnancy.


Come out to the Indiana State Fair with me later this month, you'll see that's not true.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 04, 2015 03:15 PM (/kI1Q)

266 263 ***"If you are white, just TRY walking into a black-owned barber shop in the most all-black hostile ghetto, and ask for a crew cut."***


Ironically, my lilly white ass routinely walks into the black-owned barber shop in the black majority neighborhood I live in here in the deeeeeep south (Mississippi) and get a hair cut and have a grand old time yammerin' with the all black staff.


Though I will be moving back to FL soon.
-----------------------
Do you get a line cut on the side?

Posted by: Super Creepy Eric Hoteham at August 04, 2015 03:15 PM (oDCMR)

267
"Great point, Burt.

But even worse - he was not only the butt of jokes, he was using his Caitlyn routine to get a section 8 discharge.
He was portraying CRAZY by dressing as a woman.
Can you imagine that being done today?"


I am surpirsed that notorious libs like Alan Alda and Mike Farrell have not been required to publicly confess their crimes of participatation in that and beg for forgiveness from the SJW's.

Posted by: Benji Carver at August 04, 2015 03:15 PM (OD2ni)

268 Can you imagine that being done today?

There's an episode of 'The IT Crowd' that's only from 2008.

Douglas, the bizzare boss, winds up dating a woman who tells him he used to be a man. He says he doesn't care, but it turns out he wasn't paying attention and thought she said 'I'm from Iran.'

A) When he finds out the truth, he's horrified and sickened.

B) The episode ends with them in a brutal, over-the-top fistfight.

NONE of that would happen now, and that was less than 10 years ago on BRITISH TV.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at August 04, 2015 03:16 PM (oVJmc)

269 "Decided on my Alaskan land."

Congrats, wrg. Gotta get a map.


Sounds like a good price.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at August 04, 2015 03:17 PM (LA7Cm)

270 ...who is adored by my brother and his family and cited for justification when they sneer and jeer at anti-same sex "marriage" homilies during Mass.

I've never been to a mass where they talk about that. The sermons are always about how we need to be doing more for the poor, and the 'children going to bed hungry in our communities.' Occasionally we get a global warming sermon about how God named us stewards of the earth and we are squandering it. You'd think maybe planned parenthood would have come up recently, but...no. 100% go out and help the poor, every week. A fine sentiment, but rather intellectually lazy, IMO.

Jesus comes up every so often, but mostly it's about giving the poor money. Or giving the parish money for things. Or giving money to the Bishop. Those two things take precedence over the poor, naturally.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 04, 2015 03:17 PM (FhT/k)

271 Can you imagine Trump negotiating with Iran?

It would start out fine, but then his ego would get in the way and start a war.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 03:18 PM (39g3+)

272 "242 The underlying argument, and I've seen it made expressly, is that engaging in commerce is a privilege granted you by the state, and they are free to fashion the contours of that privilege however they like.

Oddly enough its often espoused by alleged free market fiscal conservative types as well. We're so inculcated and indoctrinated into leftist cant that its a constant struggle to break free.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 03:09 PM (39g3+) "

Exactly right.
Economic freedom is one issue where I am squarely in Ayn Rand territory.

Posted by: sock_rat_eez at August 04, 2015 03:18 PM (go6ud)

273 It's much easier to be successful as a politician if you have no convictions.

Atta boy, Chris.

Posted by: Mitch at August 04, 2015 03:18 PM (laMCB)

274 A classic line from Air America's Randi Rhodes that got her fired from the network right before it cratered:

Hillary is a big fucking whore, too. You know why she's a big fucking whore? Because her deal is always, "Read the fine print, asshole!"

Posted by: Randi Rhodes (not Randy Rhodes) at August 04, 2015 03:18 PM (LISuA)

275 Posted by: Ricardo Kill

Salmon/trout river out the front door, Revelation mountains out the back. Moose, caribou, Dall sheep, Mountain goats. Good times, good times.

Posted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 03:19 PM (S+el1)

276 It would start out fine, but then his ego would get in the way and start a war.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 03:18 PM (39g3+)
============================

and by his usual standards of argument, they would deserve it!

Posted by: Randi Rhodes (not Randy Rhodes) at August 04, 2015 03:20 PM (LISuA)

277 Which is pretty much word for word the exact same position HUCK/AKIN took on abortion a few threads down, and got hammered for.

Pretty sure Huck/Akin got hammered for thinking abortion is a loser issue and we should stop talking about baby part harvesting, or we'd lose seats.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 04, 2015 03:21 PM (FhT/k)

278 I've never been to a mass where they talk about that. The sermons are always about how we need to be doing more for the poor, and the 'children going to bed hungry in our communities.' Occasionally we get a global warming sermon about how God named us stewards of the earth and we are squandering it.

------

Gosh, you all go to some liberal parishes. No wonder my experience is so different. My pastor talks about sin and abortion, contraception, fornication, drunkenness, being slaves to electronic devices often. And the Church is packed.

Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 03:21 PM (gmeXX)

279 Can you imagine Trump negotiating with Iran?

It would start out fine, but then his ego would get in the way and start a war.


If he sends Omarosa to handle it, you know there's going to be trouble.

Posted by: Brother Cavil, down with Eph 6:12-13 at August 04, 2015 03:21 PM (2l5vw)

280 We got Willowed...

Posted by: Chi at August 04, 2015 03:21 PM (nKL+X)

281 So if a vegetarian restaurant refused to make me a steak I could sue because they are discriminating against me because I'm a carnivore? No steak, no peace!

Posted by: TheQuietMan at August 04, 2015 03:22 PM (493sH)

282 He was portraying CRAZY by dressing as a woman.
Can you imagine that being done today?


That's a staple of drag...but it's understood they're slagging women, not gays, so that makes it OK for some reason.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 04, 2015 03:22 PM (/kI1Q)

283 Commerce is actually an expression of speech. You are making claim to a belief you hold that you're commerce is worth a certain value and for anyone to receive the benefit of your commerce must accede to your belief and pay that value.

All actions by an individual are expressions of "speech".

Therefore refusing someone your commerce is an expression of speech and cannot be regulated by Congress or the States.

I've long felt that the Civil Rights Act and a whole bunch of laws that were created during that era were wrong.

Not in the intention, that of ensuring that no ones rights were abridged due to their color. But that they were not explicitly limited to governments.

But then, that was the idea. The Civil Rights movement was not necessarily just about the rights of Blacks but also about destroying the last of Southern Rebellion.

In doing so, however, the entirety of the Bill of Rights was threatened and was made moot by the added amendments.

Anytime you discriminate, that's discrimination. Matters not if your reasons are "pure" or for a favored group.

What's happening now was inevitable and I hope there's some blacks who see this and understand how catering to them had led to their actually losing more than they gained.

Bon Apetit.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 04, 2015 03:23 PM (x3GpS)

284 Farrakhan: "We must rise up and kill those who kill us."

Story at Breitbart.

I get the feeling he's not talking about PP.

Posted by: SMFH at it all at August 04, 2015 03:24 PM (zyIlW)

285 (Failed, loser artist sitting in his "studio," surrounded by the half-finished remnants of his ugly modern art projects. The phone rings.)

"Yeah?"

"Is this Brandon McCoy, Professional Artist?"

"Oh, right, yes, let me start the conversation again: Brandon McCoy, Professional Artist at your service!"

"Are you available to create a massive sculpture for our new corporate headquarters?"

"(Head spinning) Why, yes -- sure! How did you hear about me?"

"We saw your portfolio online and were impressed. We'd like to hire and pay you $1 million to create sculpture for our lobby. We see that you created sculptures for other lobbies before."

"Yes, I made a styrofoam Che Guevara for the Institute of Social Justice. And then I made an abstract vagina out of toilet bowls for the Gender Studies Department. What were you thinking of as regards to your sculpture?"

"Well the name of our company is Praise the Lord Aluminum Sidings. We'd like you to make a 50-foot high Jesus Christ punching Barack Obama in the face."

(Silence)

"Hello? Are you there?"

"Um, I don't think I can do that."

"Why not? We'll pay you $1 million!"

"No, that sculpture would violate my beliefs."

Now -- according to the New Normal, Brandon McCoy, Professional Artist does NOT have the right to refuse this request! He MUST make the statue for these potential customers, because if he doesn't he is "discriminating" against them based on his "beliefs."

Oh wait -- repressive police-state laws only apply to conservatives and Christians. My bad. Carry on.

Posted by: zombie at August 04, 2015 03:24 PM (jBuUi)

286 Flush your own shit.

Posted by: Mr. Clean at August 04, 2015 03:25 PM (VcOqI)

287 Posted by: SH at August 04, 2015 03:21 PM (gmeXX)


Most of the priests I've met are stridently left wing. Many are pro choice and pretty socially liberal.

They love Francis. They never spoke out against Benedict or John Paul, but they LOVE Francis.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 04, 2015 03:25 PM (FhT/k)

288
Posted by: MAx

Funny troll. Facts are hard!

Moo Moo thinks that the best thing to do is to ignore this whole baby-ripping apart-nonsense and proceed to improving his tax brackets.

Is that your position troll?

Posted by: some random meathead at August 04, 2015 03:26 PM (1+7D3)

289 249 Ricardo Kill

Decided on my Alaskan land. On the North Fork of the Big river about 5o miles SE of Mcgrath. 11 acres 12k.
Posted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 03:10 PM (S+el1)

McGrath! Hope you own a float plane!

Posted by: joncelli, Boned like You at August 04, 2015 03:27 PM (RD7QR)

290 I've long felt that the Civil Rights Act and a whole bunch of laws that were created during that era were wrong.

It didn't make anything better, apparently. The left (and GOP) still claim racism is as bad today as it was back then.

Maybe banning the confederate flag will fix it, though.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at August 04, 2015 03:28 PM (FhT/k)

291 So.

the Mexicans are the Morlocks?

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at August 04, 2015 03:29 PM (x3GpS)

292 Wake me up when someone finds a business (for profit) that has religious beliefs...

Posted by: scrood at August 04, 2015 03:33 PM (3b9U4)

293 "Gosh, you all go to some liberal parishes."
=========

My own parish in Chicago is a devout place where they do the Latin Mass on Sundays and they preach according to Church teachings.

Unfortunately it is unusual in Chicago. Most other churches I've attended are like the one nearest my home where the priest will start the Mass with a few jokes and practice his stand-up routines before launching into his personal improvised liturgy. The crowd loves it. They love a good show. It's all very entertaining.

If you enjoyed the music, the band will announce from their position next to the altar that they're selling their CDs in the back of the Church after Mass, too!

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:34 PM (7Kbxu)

294 Posted by: zombie at August 04, 2015 03:24 PM (jBuUi)

That was beautiful.

Posted by: HR braucht ein Bier at August 04, 2015 03:34 PM (/kI1Q)

295
Gosh, you all go to some liberal parishes. No wonder my experience is so different. My pastor talks about sin and abortion, contraception, fornication, drunkenness, being slaves to electronic devices often. And the Church is packed.


I hope he preaches Christ and Him Crucified most of all.

I get the feeling he's not talking about PP.

He should be, since they kill more blacks every day than anyone else does all year long.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at August 04, 2015 03:36 PM (39g3+)

296 To my mind, the key distinction is "involuntary servitude" -- if there's a cake sitting on a shelf with a price, the "servitude" part is "baked into the cake" already and anyone should be able to put down the requisite funds and walk away with the cake. But if anyone walks in and says, "I don't want the chocolate cake on the shelf, can you bake me a red velvet cake for my celebration of Hitler's birthday?", the shopkeeper should be able to say, "no."




If the customer were to say, "fine -- I'll take the chocolate cake from the shelf" and puts money on the counter, then the shop should sell him the cake.

Posted by: cthulhu at August 04, 2015 03:38 PM (EzgxV)

297 My own parish in Chicago is a devout place where they do the Latin Mass on Sundays and they preach according to Church teachings.


Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:34 PM (7Kbxu)


St. John Cantius?

Posted by: TheQuietMan at August 04, 2015 03:42 PM (493sH)

298 "St. John Cantius?"
========

No, though that is a wonderful church.

I attend St. Thomas More on the South side. It's a lot more low key (and, unfortunately, lower attended) than St. John Cantius.

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:47 PM (7Kbxu)

299 St. John Cantius?

Posted by: TheQuietMan


Maybe St. John Moses.

Posted by: Moderate Salami -- Cecil the Dead Lion for Prez at August 04, 2015 03:48 PM (/Ho8c)

300 No, though that is a wonderful church.
I attend St. Thomas More on the South side. It's a lot more low key (and, unfortunately, lower attended) than St. John Cantius.


Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 03:47 PM (7Kbxu)



That was my old parish until I moved north. Fr. Brankin was the pastor then.

Posted by: TheQuietMan at August 04, 2015 03:53 PM (493sH)

301 'children going to bed hungry in our communities.'


Bullshit. When's the last time anyone has seen someone who looks malnourished? The poorest people are the fattest, as any trip to Walmart will prove.


I hate that "people are starving" meme.

Posted by: Kate Upton at August 04, 2015 03:54 PM (oKE6c)

302 Sock off.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at August 04, 2015 03:55 PM (oKE6c)

303 "That was my old parish until I moved north. Fr. Brankin was the pastor then."
==========

We just lost all three priests, including a particularly fine pastor who was forced into retirement when he turned 70 this Summer.

The church has been reduced to two priests now, new arrivals to the parish both, and I pray they stay the course with the Sunday Latin Mass.

Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 04:03 PM (7Kbxu)

304 The church has been reduced to two priests now, new arrivals to the parish both, and I pray they stay the course with the Sunday Latin Mass.


Posted by: Kensington at August 04, 2015 04:03 PM (7Kbxu)




I hope so too. I grew up in that parish and it's very difficult to find a good one to go to. As mentioned before, too many of them are trying to be hip and modern. Even the look of the new ones are revolting.

Posted by: TheQuietMan at August 04, 2015 04:14 PM (493sH)

305
You can't trust a progressive to paraphrase a conservative's words.

You can trust there'll be a paraphrase. It will just to be accurate, and will consist of "racist, racist, homophobe, transfphobe, misogyny, Islamophobe, nativist, racist, racist".

Posted by: I R A Darth Aggie at August 04, 2015 04:24 PM (1hM1d)

306
or not accurate...

Posted by: I R A Darth Aggie at August 04, 2015 04:24 PM (1hM1d)

307 Kelly Osbourne ask Donald Trump who would clean your toilets if Latinos leave.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FE-LsDvDelYPosted by: wrg500 at August 04, 2015 02:54 PM (S+el1) Pffft. The Irish.

Posted by: thatcrazyjerseyguy at August 04, 2015 04:29 PM (PIX+b)

308 Wake me up when someone finds a business (for profit) that has religious beliefs...


Hobby Lobby. I believe they were recently in the news.

Posted by: Grump928(c) at August 04, 2015 04:34 PM (evdj2)

309 Wake me up when someone finds a business (for profit) that has religious beliefs...

----

Scientology.

Posted by: RKae at August 04, 2015 04:57 PM (GEzOQ)

310 zombie @285 - That's it! All bakers, pizza parlor owners, and wedding dress seamstresses must designate themselves "artists". The Left loves artists, and especially artists who demand "freedom" to create what they will, without government interference. "Every cake is a work of art!" would be a fine slogan.

Posted by: Dr. Mabuse at August 04, 2015 06:51 PM (VBbCO)

311 Yeah, well, f*ck those people. Go get into the mainstream. Get a real job. Go do something where you get yer' hands dirty ... not some look-down-on-the-ants in the street kind of job! I would much rather that it burned. Red hot. Burned. On fire!

Posted by: goon at August 04, 2015 08:16 PM (gy5kE)

312 @193
Eleventy.

Christie is reflecting the Progressive zeitgeist be seeking to "balance" actual liberty by allowing only those with State approved special licenses to exercise them.

In the same spirit we have seen attempts to define "official" journalists who are entitled to source protection vs mere "bloggers" who are subject to license by the State.

The catagory of "hate speech" has been carved from the First Amendment, which is of course an entirely illegitimate concept, but Haters are of course carved out of the ability to exercise rights, much as Muslims are granted special dispensation by the State to engage in Hate Speech because Islam and non Western.

And of course black Americans have special licenses to riot and even have a special Reality Waiver to ignore the facts in police/civilian confrontations, because History and Racism.

Liberty and equality under the law? We have the legal vestiges of a society that once valued them.

Posted by: NYC Peasant at August 05, 2015 09:41 AM (k8tEg)

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