Is the C-Word Now a Bad Word?

I was wondering about this, having written about running from the c-word ("conservative") like liberals do. (Although they hide from it less now-- a sign, perhaps, they're on the upswing, or at least believe they are.)

This got me to wondering why I would possibly suggest that we run from the c-word. Is it that I, unbeknownst to myself, now think the term is unpopular, almost as unpopular as "liberal" was from 1983-1991?

I'm not sure, but I do have suspicions that might be the case.

Posted by: Ace at 05:44 PM



Comments

1 First?

Posted by: Dresden at March 14, 2013 05:46 PM (7aSZR)

2 Well she may be worthless, but she helps us take the Senate in 2014, hopefully.

Susan Collins of Maine to run again 2014. That seat was likely Dem if she retired. At least she voted against Obamacare

Posted by: JackJ at March 14, 2013 05:46 PM (4WesI)

3 Is the C-Word Now a Bad Word?

----------------------------------

Try it out on the nearest female and see how she reacts.

Oh, you don't mean THAT C-word....

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 05:47 PM (sTS/8)

4 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a malignant traitor.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at March 14, 2013 05:47 PM (4OvDk)

5
It's because the Left has stereotyped what a 'Conservative' is.

While they condemn others...for, you know, using stereotypes.

Posted by: wheatie at March 14, 2013 05:48 PM (2xMNt)

6 Liberal culture mind thoughts creeping in?

Posted by: Tami at March 14, 2013 05:48 PM (X6akg)

7 Conservative means no more free shit!

Loser!

Posted by: Hrothgar at March 14, 2013 05:48 PM (Cnqmv)

8 I don't think it's the sure winner it was in 1983-1991. Hell, then everybody was tripping over themselves to say they were "fiscally conservative, but socially liberal" and "conservative Democrats" were all the rage.

I'd say it's still better than liberal, but "progressive" still wins over those two.

Posted by: AmishDude at March 14, 2013 05:48 PM (T0NGe)

9 Yes, I suspect conservative has been tainted. Largely because we did not defend it rigorously enough from 1988 until about 2002.

The Media destroyed it and we didn't even notice.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at March 14, 2013 05:48 PM (4OvDk)

10 c.f. Hayek "Why I Am Not A Conservative"

Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 05:48 PM (y15sM)

11 Of course not - but that doesn't mean one has to lead w/it every time.

Posted by: Jess1 at March 14, 2013 05:48 PM (lbiWb)

12 I don't know. When so many people self-identify as conservative, then vote for the liberal/progressive, I wonder if it's time to investigate just what-in-the-hell they think the word means.

Or investigate massive voter fraud.

Posted by: Regular Moron at March 14, 2013 05:49 PM (feFL6)

13 I think the C-word with certain prefixes may have become bad words. "Social conservative" and "neoconservative" primarily among them.

Posted by: The Q at March 14, 2013 05:49 PM (yVmMc)

14 Well I must say it does have the judgmental, sanctimonious,stick up the ass vibe to it.
We need a better label.

Posted by: NeoKong at March 14, 2013 05:49 PM (JWLwG)

15 The Clinton Impeachment was when conservatives were branded witches by the Media that is when it really started. They went after Henry Hyde with a vengance

Posted by: JackJ at March 14, 2013 05:50 PM (4WesI)

16 So, we should "re-brand", i.e. LIE, to folks like "Liberals"/"Progressives"/leftists/communists do?

Posted by: MtTB at March 14, 2013 05:50 PM (8E9QA)

17 I suggest "Libertine."

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at March 14, 2013 05:50 PM (4OvDk)

18 I've thought for awhile now that we need to hijack the term "futurist" and use it for rebranding the way the Left used "progressive."

It's a great (and apt) term for all sorts of reasons: we're the ones actually trying to think about our country's long-term future, and not just live destructively for today; it identifies us with technology and advancement; it moves us towards the libertarian brand and away from the Akin/Palin brand, etc.

Posted by: Jeff B. at March 14, 2013 05:50 PM (/Rmj0)

19 Conservatarian, and proud of it.

Posted by: locomotivebreath1901 at March 14, 2013 05:50 PM (7qVSn)

20
AD AG nailed it.
FWIW, don't get too wrapped up in "branding". Think "presentation".

Posted by: Jess1 at March 14, 2013 05:50 PM (lbiWb)

21 14: Well I must say it does have the judgmental, sanctimonious,stick up the ass vibe to it. We need a better label.

---------------------------

The Party-Til-You-Puke Party

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 05:51 PM (sTS/8)

22

"Conservatism proper is a legitimate, probably necessary, and certainly widespread attitude of opposition to drastic change." -- Hayek

That's what Hayek meant by saying he wasn't conservative. . He would almost certainly identify as conservative under the modern POLITICAL definition.

Posted by: imp at March 14, 2013 05:51 PM (UaxA0)

23 This is like the previous discussion about the word "feminist".

Too many right-wingers are so angry that they just want to fight fight fight instead of learning a lesson about what does and what doesn't reach low-information voters.

I mean, don't they even know any low-information swing voters? Any liberals?

Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 05:51 PM (y15sM)

24 >>>c.f. Hayek "Why I Am Not A Conservative"

But Hayek wasn't really writing about American conservatism, he was disclaiming the (very different) European usage of that term. So it's an inapt comparison.

Posted by: Jeff B. at March 14, 2013 05:51 PM (/Rmj0)

25 Try it out on the nearest female and see how she reacts.

Oh, you don't mean THAT C-word....
Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 05:47 PM (sTS/
Moronettes, please explain to a clueless male why that particular word is so offensive. I honestly don't understand. There are lots of offensive words; why is that particular term so offensive?

Posted by: Ombudsman at March 14, 2013 05:52 PM (HqXYa)

26

They went from "liberal" to "progressive."

And, we fight amongst ourselves between "fiscal conservative" and "social conservative"... ad nauseum.

Posted by: branding at March 14, 2013 05:52 PM (XYSwB)

27 I'm a classical liberal, as Hayek described it.

Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at March 14, 2013 05:52 PM (8ZskC)

28 off topic but had to post this, from Yahoo news:

Ever wonder what goes through Vice President Joe Biden's head? The White House has just launched an audio series called "Being Biden," where the vice president will share his story of a photograph in which he appears.

The first picture featured in the series is of Biden's serving rolls at a wild game dinner in Delaware earlier this month. The vice president is shaking hands with a man wearing a hunting-style shirt featuring deer in the woods as Biden carries a tong in his other hand.

"Hey folks, I want to tell you about this picture you're looking at," Biden said about the picture. "These are a couple of guys in their hunting shirts that I'm serving a meal to, along with the folks you see in the back gourd and the occasion is once a year the Whitehall Neck Sportsman Club holds a dinner.

[oh boy]

Posted by: mallfly at March 14, 2013 05:52 PM (bJm7W)

29 I suggest Congressive.

Posted by: Ronster at March 14, 2013 05:52 PM (pDjY6)

30 Liberals are just watered-down fascists today so they've abandoned the "liberal" label anyway.

Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at March 14, 2013 05:53 PM (8ZskC)

31 So, we should "re-brand", i.e. LIE, to folks like "Liberals"/"Progressives"/leftists/communists do?

It doesn't have to be lying, but yes.

You see it in other areas all the time, and I don't see nearly so much hubbub about it. Companies, products, even actors change their names fairly regularly (the oh-so-sought-after "Laurence Fishburn" used to be billed as "Larry Fishburn." Anyone remember "John Cougar?").

When you get down to it, other than the fact you get to suborn all the fundraising, how is simply "rebranding" different from starting a 3rd party?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at March 14, 2013 05:53 PM (4OvDk)

32 Jeff B:
>> he was disclaiming the (very different) European usage of that term

But, to low-information voters, is the usage really "very different"? I doubt it.

Conservative = scoldy prudes, Scarlet Letter, etc

Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 05:54 PM (y15sM)

33 Ace is attempting to get extra mileage out of his thread tires. Heh.

Posted by: The Little Dutch Boy at March 14, 2013 05:54 PM (vbh31)

34 I always tell people that I am a fiscal conservative, which appears to have no bad connotation whatever. I think the Q is correct in his (her?) comment above. Social conservative is a real turnoff for anyone who isn't one. And, to me, theydiffer from nanny-state libtardsonly in perspective.

Posted by: Peaches at March 14, 2013 05:54 PM (VISKy)

35 Conservatives United Negating Tyranny

Posted by: Craig Poe at March 14, 2013 05:54 PM (BVkEs)

36 Ace, "conservatism" is only a bad word to the politically correct.

People have been brainwashed, since the 70's, to believe that conservative beliefs are not cool: anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-amnesty, anti-large government control for the "socially unjust." They have succeeded in their message, especially to young people.

In my own book, conservative is fine. I can see where people, afraid of taking a stand against the tide, run from this word.

I am not afraid to be a conservative.

Posted by: ChristyBlinky at March 14, 2013 05:55 PM (baL2B)

37 "Prominent" conservatives absolutely suck at branding. They think rebranding means slapping a prefix in front of the same fucking word.

So-con
Paleo-con
Neo-con

And the absolute stupidest, gayest attempt at a brand:

Crunchy con.

Fuckin Rod Dreher. What's wrong with you?

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 05:55 PM (kEj+5)

38 I insist on defining myself as "liberal."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_liberalism
Because, it's true, and also it annoys the left.

I refer to the Left as "the Left," and/or "Progressives," or "statists," when being polite, and other things, when not.

Posted by: BuddyPC at March 14, 2013 05:55 PM (jfUIE)

39 Ace and Roger are right on this, the brand has been irreparably damage by years of Leftist propaganda through their information channels

No matter how many whiteboards and white papers you present, the Left has successfully cause a Rorschach reaction to "conservative" and "Republican" as ... "ICK!!!"

How else could pallid elitists with millions in the bank convince you that Republicans are a white elite party while the Dems are Inclusive Friends of the Poor

Posted by: kbdabear at March 14, 2013 05:55 PM (mCvL4)

40 How about we just call ourselves "Americans"? That sufficiently distinguishes us from those on the other side, I think.

Posted by: Stu-22 at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (AiYlm)

41 (a repost from last thread)

On a related note, I've been of the belief that we are long overdue for
an attack campaign to smear the "progressive" affiliation. That has been
the boulder the left ran to after they finally learned the "liberal"
label was too dangerous.

----

Seriously, perhaps it would be more effective, and fun!, to attack their labels than try to defend our own.

Posted by: Serious Cat at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (UypUQ)

42 Walk softly, but carry an AR-15.

Posted by: Craig Poe at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (BVkEs)

43 i get what you mean about "more anti-liberal than pro-conservative" Ace. i used to be that way and still am to an extent.

i think the issue with "anti" sentiment though, at least as far as conservatives are concerned, is that it doesn't always ground you in anything solid...think people having a negative reaction to an issue at first, but then coming to accept it later (think conservatives in the future potentially talking about reforming Obamacare for instance and saying repeal would be "unconservative,") while arguing that the _next_ big liberal issue is what's really bad news...but then that's later accepted too

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (60GaT)

44
#34, it's a first step. "Fiscal Conservative" sounds good. Noble. Forthright. Might even be a decent human being.
Now would a Fiscal Conservative pick up a round or two?

Posted by: Jess1 at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (lbiWb)

45 >> Ace, "conservatism" is only a bad word to the politically correct.

i.e. almost everybody under the age of 40.

We kinduv need a few of their votes.

Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (y15sM)

46 If the C-word is so horrible, then it's over anyway. LIB.
Re-branding is pointless - the liberals in the media will just re-focus their hate and "expose" us as the dreaded conservatives, only WORSE because we try to hide it like part of some kind of conspiracy.
Leftist ideas are about to bring doom. Let them own it, and let us be disassociated from it. And again - if America hates conservatives now, then America deserves destruction - Let It Burn. The ideas of the Right are more important than any artifical national construct. If America turns red, then let itbe wrecked utterly. It can be argued that the US should be broken up anyway. We're no longer a united country, and many of us are sick of being stuck with each other.

Posted by: Reactionary at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (jfeoD)

47 What bothers me about the term "conservative" is that it's used in the media as a modifier. Ann Coulter is a "conservative pundit". The National Review is a "conservative journal of opinion". I'm obviously a proud right-winger, but this annoys me because the implication is that the referenced person is out of the mainstream.

You never hear Chris Matthews described as a "liberal pundit"- the implication is that "liberal pundit" is the norm. (Well, yes, it is, but...)

Posted by: Ombudsman at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (HqXYa)

48 @ 37: So-con

Paleo-con

Neo-con



And the absolute stupidest, gayest attempt at a brand:



Crunchy con.

-----------------------------------

I suppose "Keg-Tapping - con" is too unwieldy to ever catch on.

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 05:57 PM (sTS/8)

49

The word conservative sounds straight arrow, stuffy, boring, grey, bowties, buttoned up, clean cut, etc.

Not attractive to the youth on face value.

Not hip, cool, colorful, tolerant, fun, or forward thinking.

Posted by: branding at March 14, 2013 05:57 PM (XYSwB)

50 Crystal Conservatives.

For those who need to balance the budget RIGHT NOW

Posted by: The Q at March 14, 2013 05:57 PM (yVmMc)

51 Archaeofuturists.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 05:57 PM (El+h4)

52 In my own book, conservative is fine. I can see where people, afraid of taking a stand against the tide, run from this word.

But why fight that fight when you could be having much more constructive fights over, say, the direction of the country?

If the first thing you're having to do is defend the term "Conservative" you're a step behind from the beginning. There is a reason Liberals change terms between "Liberal" and "Progressive" every so often.

C'mon- this is the whole point of the Window Soliloquy in Romeo & Juliet- "What's in a name?" Why fight for a name that has become tainted. Instead say, "Yep, that's yucky," pick a new name, and move on.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at March 14, 2013 05:57 PM (4OvDk)

53 I'd rather be a Constitutionalist I guess.

Maybe that's a tent FisCons and SoCons can unite under.

Posted by: akula51 at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (hNXHo)

54 Walk softly, but carry an AR-15.

...and watch out for drones.

Posted by: The Third Horseman of The Apocalypse at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (vbh31)

55 I fear the question is moot. Today I got an email from a vendor saying that the ammo I wanted was available. By the time I had typed in my order, 'Out of Stock'.

"He replied, "When evening comes, you say, 'It will be fair weather, for the sky is red,' and in the morning, 'Today it will be stormy, for the sky is red and overcast.' You know how to interpret the appearance of the sky, but you cannot interpret the signs of the times."

On the plus side, I understand that Batboy: The Musical is in production.

Posted by: toby928© sips the sweet tea of despair at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (QupBk)

56 Although "Porno - con" has kind of a nice ring to it.

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (sTS/8)

57 Oh, hey, maybe if we learned how to say it in spanish, it would sound more appealing.

Posted by: Peaches at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (VISKy)

58 oh, and use words that the Libs have made almost meaningless:

The Society for Economic Justice...
The League for Better Government...
Students for Academic Success...

either that or just "borrow" words the lefties have ruined: imagine a college has announcements for a presentation by the " Progressive Academics Society" and the speaker is Allen West. (He should open with his imitation of Harry Reid.)

Posted by: mallfly at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (bJm7W)

59 If the C-word is so horrible, then it's over anyway. LIB.
Re-branding is pointless - the liberals in the media will just re-focus their hate and "expose" us as the dreaded conservatives, only WORSE because we try to hide it like part of some kind of conspiracy.



Look at how they ripped the Tea Party to shreds. Didn't take long, either, did it.

Posted by: branding at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (XYSwB)

60 In the Picasso vein of "great artists steal," I recommend holding our collective nose(s) and steal away "Anti-Idiotarian" from LGF/Charles J.

Posted by: RamonAllones at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (3lLli)

61 47 "You never hear Chris Matthews described as a "liberal pundit""

You usually hear him described as a "blithering idiot," even by his co-workers and people believing the same things he does.

Posted by: The Q at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (yVmMc)

62 But then, thinking about it, if we want to pat ourselves on the back for being conservative, and noticing that a majority of the population identifies personally as being conservative, then put candidates on the ballot where it is difficult to find the word in their resumes, I mean WTF do we expect?

See; also; Einstein, Albert: definition of insanity
See; coming; 2016: Jeb Bush, Karl Rove

Posted by: Regular Moron at March 14, 2013 05:58 PM (feFL6)

63 I'd rather be a Constitutionalist I guess


Constitutionalist doesn't sound much better than conservative. Do you have any idea how old that thing is?

Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (8ZskC)

64 I had to sit through an ad on Youtube yesterday. Some young woman was dressed up in some kind of extreme-sport gear: googles, helmet, etc. She was ready to do something daring (don't remember what). She then told the camera that "normally she is conservative".

So the association with "conservative" amongst the young is that it's for people who don't take risks and therefore don't have any fun.

It's probably always been this way.

Posted by: boulder toilet hobo at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (QTHTd)

65 I have no idea about conservative. I always refer to myself as a right wing ideologue or a right wing SOB and proud of it

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (9Bj8R)

66
"How else could pallid elitists with millions in the bank convince you that Republicans are a white elite party while the Dems are Inclusive Friends of the Poor"
Oh, I don't know - perhaps the titular head of the "right wing" party spent the better part of a decade avoiding media of all types?*

"Seriously, perhaps it would be more effective, and fun!, to attack their labels than try to defend our own"
Works for me. * Yeah, that's right. I blame Bush.

Posted by: Jess1 at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (lbiWb)

67 >>>Ace, "conservatism" is only a bad word to the politically correct.

People have been brainwashed, since the 70's, to believe that conservative beliefs are not cool: anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-amnesty, anti-large government control for the "socially unjust." They have succeeded in their message, especially to young people.

In my own book, conservative is fine. I can see where people, afraid of taking a stand against the tide, run from this word.

I am not afraid to be a conservative.

...

I don't see how any of that matters.

I do not know the numbers here on anti-conservative sentiment. I have asked this as a question because I don't know. It's a possibility. I'm not saying it's true that conservative is almost as big as a turn-off as liberal once was; I'm just asking if it is. The possibility seems, well, possible to me.

But if it were true (which it may not be) it would not matter that 38% of conservatives really like the word conservative if 53% of the country *dislikes* it.

I keep meaning to link the Gavin Newsome/Adam Carolla/"Racist" controversy. But one thing Newsome said is true: Of the last 5 out of 6 elections, Democrats have won the popular vote. (Bush won in 2000, but lost the popular vote.)

5 out of 6. This is a problem. We can't keep thinking as if this is 1991 and we can say "WE have won 5 of the last 6 elections." We haven't. That was true in 1991. The exact opposite is true now.


Posted by: ace at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (LCRYB)

68 "Fuckin Rod Dreher. What's wrong with you?"

if conservatives became pro-kale they'd be winners yo

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (60GaT)

69 "Hey folks, I want to tell you about this picture you're looking at,"
Biden said about the picture. "These are a couple of guys in their
hunting shirts that I'm serving a meal to, along with the folks you see
in the back gourd and the occasion is once a year the Whitehall Neck
Sportsman Club holds a dinner.

***

A better title than Being Biden would be Biden Boo Boo.

Posted by: WalrusRex at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (Hx5uv)

70 I'd rather be a Constitutionalist I guess.

I like that one, too.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (4OvDk)

71
How about....Reality-Con.
Re-con.

Posted by: wheatie at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (2xMNt)

72 I eagerly await the rebuttal of ..

"Conservatives don't need to rebrand, they just need to email 30 minute Youtube presentations to their friends, link 15 page policy papers on Facebook and Twitter, and start a college organization called "kids with perfectly combed hair and Farah slacks are cool too"

Posted by: kbdabear at March 14, 2013 06:00 PM (mCvL4)

73 The word "conservative" is non-sensical and undescriptive.

What exactly are we trying to "conserve"? Social security? No Child Left Behind? The New Deal? HUD? ObamaCare?

Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 06:00 PM (y15sM)

74 And, yeah, "neocon" has been toxic since the Iraq invasion.

Posted by: boulder toilet hobo at March 14, 2013 06:00 PM (QTHTd)

75 We need a cool logo too.

Posted by: Cicero, Semiautomatic Assault Commenter at March 14, 2013 06:00 PM (8ZskC)

76 oh, and use words that the Libs have made almost meaningless:

The Society for Economic Justice...
The League for Better Government...
Students for Academic Success...


Yep, I'll repost from end of last thread, then head out:

You can view some of the names of the "progressive" orgs, here:

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=List_of_progressive_organizations

examples:

Children's Defense Fund
Women's Action for New Directions
Interfaith Alliance
Human Rights Campaign
Schumann Center for Media and Democracy
First Amendment Project
Center for Democracy and Technology
Center for Digital Democracy
Center for Social Media
America Coming Together
Music for America
League of Conservation Voters
League of Rural Voters
American Constitution Society
Women's Media Center
Women's International League for Peace and Freedom
Mothers Against Drunk Driving
etc




Generic Naming

Posted by: branding at March 14, 2013 06:00 PM (XYSwB)

77 Is "Freedomite" too redolent of "Sodomite"?

Posted by: RamonAllones at March 14, 2013 06:00 PM (3lLli)

78 I hate the word conservative. I hate people who call themselves conservatives. I hate the fact that the term is used as a cudgel to define certain individuals in the party as pure and others as pariahs, all for holding ideas that are perfectly in line with conservative principles. So let the term die.

Just like "mainstream/elite" being a pejorative, the GOP is full of people who want to use these phrases to cut down their own party members and instead hurt everybody within the movement.

Posted by: BSKB at March 14, 2013 06:00 PM (4KWOY)

79 Can't we put some bark into the phrase "True Progressive"?

Kinda kills two birds with one stone by pointing out how much they've corrupted the word supposedly at the core of their leftist ideology....plus, well. One side's actually trying to achieve progress.

Posted by: akula51 at March 14, 2013 06:01 PM (hNXHo)

80 I'm a Cheney Republican

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:01 PM (9Bj8R)

81
Liberals actually *do* hate Reality, you know.

Posted by: wheatie at March 14, 2013 06:01 PM (2xMNt)

Posted by: Update5 at March 14, 2013 06:01 PM (taaCl)

83 Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at March 14, 2013 05:53 PM (4OvDk)
Because ideas precede the party.
Futurtarian!

Posted by: Hrothgar at March 14, 2013 06:01 PM (Cnqmv)

84 >>>The word "conservative" is non-sensical and undescriptive.

What exactly are we trying to "conserve"? Social security? No Child Left Behind? The New Deal? HUD? ObamaCare?


Again: "futurist." It works! C'mon, can I get a bandwagon rolling for this?

(Answer: no.)

Posted by: Jeff B. at March 14, 2013 06:01 PM (/Rmj0)

85 >>> if we want to pat ourselves on the back for being conservative, and noticing that a majority of the population identifies personally as being conservative

but it doesn't... 38% identifies as conservative.

with leaners maybe you get there but the leaners keep leaning away from us on Election Day.

Posted by: ace at March 14, 2013 06:01 PM (LCRYB)

86 Fuck it.

Call ourselves the Free Choice Party.

It directly speaks to individual loyalty to the conservative minded, and implies handouts and abortions to the more liberal minded. You know, assholes.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 06:02 PM (kEj+5)

87

We always make fun of the Dems for this "branding" shit. It's not the means, it's the message. the Free Shit Army is on the ascendancy, and there's nothing we can do about it. Relentless indoctrinization, historical illiteracy, and imposed stupidity in the schools have given us two and a half generations of myopic, self-indulgent, feckless retards.

There is no "message" that is going to resonate with this vampiric dependent class of ignoramuses.

Only the sudden imposition of reality will be sufficient to jar these lotus eaters form their slumber.


Posted by: imp at March 14, 2013 06:02 PM (UaxA0)

88 I think maybe the problem is you need to stop being 'conservative' and become 'reactionary'. At that point if you can prove you don't hate Jews and Blacks, need to deny the holocaust or justify slavery, they've crapped their pants.

Your problem is you're trying hard to be reasonable because you think being seen as reasonable is the good thing. But if you accept that conservatism is right-wing lite and right wing lite in this society is really just saying-no-for-awhile-but-then-giving-in-to-the-left it's time to break out the hard stuff.

I'm not a conservative. I'm a Traditionalist.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (El+h4)

89 the leaners keep leaning away from us on Election Day.
Posted by: ace at March 14, 2013 06:01 PM (LCRYB)

Or stay home

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (9Bj8R)

90 And don forget shiny objects. Lots of free, shiny objects.

Posted by: Low Information Voter at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (vbh31)

91 @ 73: What exactly are we trying to "conserve"?

--------------------------------------------------

The ideals behind the American Revolution, as articulated in the Constitution.

And boobehs.

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (sTS/8)

92 86 Fuck it.

Call ourselves the Free Choice Party.


Way to work free in there. That will pique some interest. Seriously. That for all intents and purposes is what it's all about in my book.

Posted by: akula51 at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (hNXHo)

93 Half the people don't vote at all. The question to me is not how to get more of the votes of the people that do vote, but how to get about 8 million votes from the people who normally don't vote at all.

Posted by: toby928© sips the sweet tea of despair at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (QupBk)

94 Bush was defended as a conservative until he pushed for immigration reform, than he was a RINO!!!!!!!!!!.

Posted by: Shoot Me at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (qiXMt)

95 I'm a Traditionalist.
Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (El+h4)


A Fiddler On The Roof?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (9Bj8R)

96 If you do Futurist you'll be pulled into Italian Fascism (if the libs can remember that far back.)

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (El+h4)

97 We need Conservative Pride Parades, and so forth. It's come to this.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (GHpOB)

98 Freemen.

Posted by: toby928© sips the sweet tea of despair at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (QupBk)

99 Whenever "Neocon" is invoked in conversation, I ask the speaker to define what one is. Crickets chirp. To the low information voter/ ideologue, it's a generic term for "someone I disagree with". To the anti-Semite, neo = "New", con = "Jew"


Posted by: Ombudsman at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (HqXYa)

100 Liberals are back to being 'Progressives' now that the 60 year old stigma has fallen off of the label. Being second cousins to Italian fascism, pro-prohibition and a breeding ground for eugenics, phrenology and such, it took a while to shake.

I suggest we grab a-hold of the evergreen 'Classical Liberal', right?? Bound to make a comeback!

Or 'Constitutionalist'.

How about 'Leave us the fuck alone' party?

'Right-wing' and conservative really don't fit any more.

Posted by: coondawg68 at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (VhcOZ)

101 Half the people don't vote at all. The question to me is not how to get more of the votes of the people that do vote, but how to get about 8 million votes from the people who normally don't vote at all.
Posted by: toby928© sips the sweet tea of despair at March 14, 2013 06:03 PM (QupBk)

Yes I think that is very important

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (9Bj8R)

102 It's a bigger reflector of the current culture. Tech talk and technology are the big movers in popular culture. The notion of "classic" or "original" isn't used to sell products much either these days. So, "conservative" has a double whammy of an unfair depiction of the ideology through the biased media AND the fact that things that are "classic", "traditional", "original" etc. aren't as popular as "the latest and greatest".

Posted by: Leigh Scott at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (BRhVY)

103 yes.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (RZ8pf)

104 There is no conservative ...

Only ZULU

Posted by: weft cut-loop at March 14, 2013 06:05 PM (UCv7P)

105
I think its alot easier to attack than defend, let alone rebrand,... with that in mind, lets run a scorched-earth campaign that makes independents perceive democrats/progressives as bureaucratic control-freaks. With the implication that you can better trust conservatives to leave you alone.


Posted by: Serious Cat at March 14, 2013 06:05 PM (UypUQ)

106 @95

You're getting something of the idea; Localism with bite.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:05 PM (El+h4)

107 I don't know about the word conservative. I think it has come to mean unfun. The word Republican is a bigger problem. The media has successfully identified the party as the party of greedy, rich white guys

Posted by: L, elle at March 14, 2013 06:05 PM (0PiQ4)

108 86 Fuck it.

Call ourselves the Free Choice Party.

It directly speaks to individual loyalty to the conservative minded, and implies handouts and abortions to the more liberal minded. You know, assholes.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 06:02 PM (kEj+5)


How about the Traditional Free Choice Party?
I'm opposed to implying anything to assholes.

Posted by: jwb7605 (Let It Burn) at March 14, 2013 06:05 PM (Qxe/p)

109 5 out of 6. This is a problem. We can't keep thinking as if this is 1991 and we can say "WE have won 5 of the last 6 elections." We haven't. That was true in 1991. The exact opposite is true now.
Posted by: ace at March 14, 2013 05:59 PM (LCRYB)



Meh. Between cultural balkanization and the very successful Democrat underclass breeding program, this was inevitable. The blessing of universal suffrage (worst idea ever) are finally becoming apparent.

Scum and grievance mongers can't be won over by anything other than propaganda focused on stoking their hate and envy of everyone else. That's not the conservative ideology, so we're not going to have much luck with things as they are, no matter how we try to re-brand or re-focus or whatever else.

Posted by: Reactionary at March 14, 2013 06:06 PM (jfeoD)

110 The Populist Freemen's Party.

Posted by: toby928© sips the sweet tea of despair at March 14, 2013 06:06 PM (QupBk)

111 I'm telling you though, Reactionary will have its hey day again. Maybe you can just shorten it to Actionary for the contemporary lexicon.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:06 PM (El+h4)

112
Howzabout we counter the Left's gross mischaracterization of us, turn the tables on them and start calling them Progressive Communists?

It's what they really are. Additionally, they're promoting an ancient ideology that has never failed to fail. Forget the deaths under those regimes, concentrate on the very real damage that this sort of "thinking" has wrought in recent American history: record numbers of Americans on food stamps, unemployed, a stagnant economy, massive overregulation strangling businesses, the Green Failure.

The evidence is all around us every day. We'll start winning when we find someone with the balls to start pointing it out and calling bullshit on anyone who says "You're RACIST!"

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at March 14, 2013 06:07 PM (+z4pE)

113 What Used to be Called Normal...you know, love your country, believe in hard work, enjoy freedom...

Posted by: USS Diversity at March 14, 2013 06:07 PM (+bZOu)

114 but it doesn't... 38% identifies as conservative.

It is still the largest group. Or a plurality. My bad in mis-wording.

Change from 'a majority of Americans' to
'the largest group' or 'a plurality of Americans'.

You didn't respond to the concept of actually putting on the ballot a candidate that the 'plurality' or 'the largest group' of Americans identify with.

Posted by: Regular Moron at March 14, 2013 06:07 PM (feFL6)

115 Jeff B,

I don't mean any disrespect, but you couldn't sell a Kate Upton lap dance to a 16 year old virgin, assbag. "Futurist" is godawful.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 06:08 PM (kEj+5)

116 Constitutionalist?

Posted by: Bosk at March 14, 2013 06:08 PM (n2K+4)

117 We need Conservative Pride Parades, and so forth. It's come to this.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at March 14, 2013 06:04 PM (GHpOB)
I want to be Sister Boom Boom. Boom Boom meaning economic boom, of course.

Posted by: Ombudsman at March 14, 2013 06:08 PM (HqXYa)

118 >>>The blessing of universal suffrage (worst idea ever) are finally becoming apparent.



Scum and grievance mongers can't be won over by anything other than
propaganda focused on stoking their hate and envy of everyone else.
That's not the conservative ideology, so we're not going to have much
luck with things as they are, no matter how we try to re-brand or
re-focus or whatever else.


So if I understand you correctly, your solution is to either 1.) revoke universal suffrage; 2.) give up and cry in your darkened bedroom.

Seriously, why even bother making this point, then? It's like saying "you can't win, don't bother playing." Are you an adult, or are you a whipped cur? You fight ANYWAY. I don't buy what you're selling, but even if I did I wouldn't be sitting around counseling despair, I'd still be trying to do my best.

Posted by: Jeff B. at March 14, 2013 06:08 PM (/Rmj0)

119 Populist appeal: 'You ain't got because someone took it from you. Who did? The Democrats. It's time for payback.'


Posted by: toby928© sips the sweet tea of despair at March 14, 2013 06:09 PM (QupBk)

120 It is.

Because there are no leaders who make a point to call themselves first and always consevative.

So, why should we, lowly nobodies stick our necks out?

Oh, and to the last thread: It's an idea doomed to fail. Because it runs so contrary to pretty much everything the conservative mind is, tells itself it ought to be.

I'm on several boards of non-profits. You'd be surprised how easy it is to do, both the work required and getting on there.

Yet, there only a tiny few conservatives.

So stupid.

Oh, there are all sorts of bullshit excuses, family, jobs, life, etc. but, that's all bullshit.

You make time for what's important. And if the future of your country, the future you'll be giving to your kids isn't important . . . .

Posted by: RoyalOil at March 14, 2013 06:09 PM (VjL9S)

121 Well, *that* day went downhill fast.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at March 14, 2013 06:09 PM (bxiXv)

122 No longer "conservatives" or "Republicans."

Stonecutters.

Posted by: The Q at March 14, 2013 06:09 PM (yVmMc)

123 A Fiddler On The Roof?

***

Is this the country I was born in?
Is this the government today?
I don't remember going crazy.
When did they?

Posted by: WalrusRex at March 14, 2013 06:09 PM (Hx5uv)

124 "futurist" would be so dumb

scifi cons

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 06:09 PM (60GaT)

125 I don't know about the word conservative. I think it has come to mean unfun.

There are a lot of things about defending freedom that aren't "fun".

Posted by: In Flanders Field and Margraten at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (vbh31)

126 We kinduv need a few of their votes.


Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 05:56 PM (y15sM)

Then the party needs to run a youngish person who speaks clearly of these values. Odd that my two sons are conservative and hung onto these values in the midst of university-domino-thinking-libs. There are more conservatives than you think, who finish college and cannot find a job. Per one son, who is a Facebook dude, said the "47%" Romney speech brought them out of their computers like a swarm when fireant hills are kicked. Until then they were---sort of---thinking Paul Ryan was a cool dude and YOUNG.You give people too much credit. I am talking the un-educated college student, swayed (so they think) by free Ramen noodles and Fruit of the Loom underwear (Michael Moore). Many have no freaking idea who is even the Secretary of State, or when WWII ended. They vote en-mass for an image.
You will not persuade a generation with bs. Pendulums swing. I was more liberal in college---and was influenced by both the media and other college students who had a liberal agenda. I repeat, pendulums swing. If the country continues to go downhill with jobs, you bet this pendulum is going to swing conservative...and I do not want that to be the reason, but that is what history teaches.If they want to change a word, and find a more catchy word, fine. PR is everything, and, I agree, conservatives and the GOP stink at this.
While admitting that I cannot stand The Won and the thought of another four years of his prancing ninny-crap, and I pay very little attention to him in my life and turn off TV and have never listened to a speech by him...I remain an eternal optimist that the pendulum will swing back to conservatism. I hope and pray in 2014.

Posted by: ChristyBlinky at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (baL2B)

127 Why is "conservative" a bad word? Well, perhaps it's that "conservative" is too linked with a particular religious viewpoint, particularly on social issues, and conservatives have not been able to explain a conservative economic message other than to keep yelling about not cutting taxes for the rich.

Posted by: SFGoth at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (dZ756)

128 You could take it the other way, and wear Conservative with a perverse kind of pride. It's kind of like the cross - we accept it as a SYMBOL OF HEALING (implicitly) even though it is indisputably a SYMBOL OF TORTURE AND DEATH. Christian was a slur.

Instead of trying to be liked, try to be demonic. Not really demonic, but people in this society give power to the things they really fear and hate. Just be slightly sketchy enough to create that aura of... conservatism.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (El+h4)

129 The day approaches when Conservatives, Republicans, Libertarians, and everyone who isn't a complete loss will unite together under the banner of Honey Badgerism. The rest will unite under the banner of Honey Boo-Booism.

Posted by: Frank Underwood, D-South Carolina at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (fscec)

130 Actually, your observation in the prior post was good. It is that having any modifier, in this case "Conservative" tags something as not the most popular. I'm sure linguists have a name for this. A good example is cameras. In the 1930s a camera (unmodified) was a 4X5 inch Press camera and a "miniature" camera was a 35mm film camera. When 35mm became the most popular, it lost the "miniature" modifier and the 4X5 was modified to "Press Camera". When digital appeared, it modified as a "digital" camera since 35mm was initially still the most popular. Now, Camera = Digital and 35mm = "Film Camera." So, Yes, Drop the modifier to signal that we are not the Other.

Posted by: Update5 at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (taaCl)

131 My bad words of the day are "Bill" and "Gates."A worthy investigative reporter would likely have a field day examining the true motivations of the Gates Foundation and their education reforms. Would pay to have a reporter, instead of sucking on his dick (rather reminiscent of their Obama treatment) directly ask Gates "why do youfeel you are qualified to meddle in public school education when you and your wife went to private schools and you send your kids to private schools?" And don't let him get away with the "making better employees" whine. He knows nothing about education, yet he is the Father of education reform in this country right now.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (RZ8pf)

132

the phrase "True Progressive"

You mean like Teddy Roosevelt?

Pro-eugenics, pro-big government activism, pro-foreign war?

That kind of "true progressive"

TR was no different from today's progressives, he just lacked the marxist veneer.

Posted by: imp at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (UaxA0)

133 >>>I don't mean any disrespect, but you couldn't sell a Kate Upton lap
dance to a 16 year old virgin, assbag. "Futurist" is godawful.


1.) Your political instincts are pretty awful too, so you're nobody to preach, buddy.

2.) You're right, it's not a perfect word. But we are going to lose and lose again if we are simply identified, in a demotic and technologized society, as the movement of The Stultifying Past. There has to be a brand that captures our defense of Constitutional values with a belief in the future, not simply fighting a rear-guard action against history.

Posted by: Jeff B. at March 14, 2013 06:10 PM (/Rmj0)

134 Look let's face facts we have a problem when a certain group in our society votes in the high 90% for any one candidate. It's unintellectual and hard to combat. We better face up to that. And when the "candidate" is one of their own not only do they vote in the high 90% but they turn out. Let's stop dancing around that.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:11 PM (9Bj8R)

135 83-91 when "Liberal" was a shunned word?
Try 83-2008.

And IMO "Republican" is now a much more shunned word than "Conservative."
But Hayek didn't even like the word Conservative.

Posted by: bugle boy at March 14, 2013 06:11 PM (3A16Y)

136 @111 RiverC

I think Action Directe was a French offshoot of the Red Brigades (Brigati Rossi).

Plus an "Aktion" during the Holocaust was a roundup of Jewish ghetto inhabitants, either for immediate execution or placement on trains bound to the death camps.

So "Actionary" strikes me as a lose-lose on either end of the spectrum.

Posted by: RamonAllones at March 14, 2013 06:11 PM (3lLli)

137 just once i'd like to see Jeff B admit that aspects of conservative economic policy aren't popular either. polls say so, case closed, amirite

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 06:11 PM (60GaT)

138 115: "Futurist" is godawful.

-----------------------------

I'm hip. As a subset of the early 20th century Modern Art movement, "Futurist" is fine. As a political identifier -- not so much.

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 06:11 PM (sTS/8)

139 The Mole People. We'll have to be underground if we expect to stay conservative.

Posted by: Lincolntf at March 14, 2013 06:11 PM (ZshNr)

140 Retro is cool in certain circles. It's too bad we can't build a Steampunk Party.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at March 14, 2013 06:11 PM (+z4pE)

141 I don't mean any disrespect, but you couldn't sell a Kate Upton lap dance to a 16 year old virgin, assbag.

Now that's effective branding. Heh.

Posted by: The Third Horseman of The Apocalypse at March 14, 2013 06:12 PM (vbh31)

142 Liberal = Progressive, Socialist, Leftist, Marxist, Utopian

Conservative = Conservative

Posted by: Craig Poe at March 14, 2013 06:12 PM (BVkEs)

143 "futurist" would be so dumb

scifi cons

***

Jeffersonian Starship Troopers

Posted by: WalrusRex at March 14, 2013 06:12 PM (Hx5uv)

144 All I know is that "lemon party" would be a really bad idea.

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 14, 2013 06:13 PM (RZ8pf)

145 >>>Because there are no leaders who make a point to call themselves first and always consevative.

political leaders do. If you mean leaders in other industries, you have a point.

If you're claiming that Republicans don't claim to be out and proud down-the-line conservatives you're on crack.

Posted by: ace at March 14, 2013 06:13 PM (LCRYB)

146 All I know is that "lemon party" would be a really bad idea.
Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 14, 2013 06:13 PM (RZ8pf)

Ah pucker up sweetie

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:13 PM (9Bj8R)

147 aspects of conservative economic policy aren't popular either. polls say so

Very true. Hardly any free shit. That bites.

Posted by: Low Information Voter at March 14, 2013 06:13 PM (vbh31)

148 >>>just once i'd like to see Jeff B admit that aspects of conservative
economic policy aren't popular either. polls say so, case closed,
amirite


Since when have I denied that? Cutting entitlement spending = not popular. But...it can be sold if pitched in terms of absolute necessity. You have to find an appealing jar to sell the castor oil in.

Posted by: Jeff B. at March 14, 2013 06:13 PM (/Rmj0)

149 And what I mean is, we don't need new organizations, we need to take over what's here.

We can do it.

Cause if we can't be bothered to join what is already here, what makes us think conservatives will join a new organization? (Tea party notwithstanding.)

Posted by: RoyalOil at March 14, 2013 06:14 PM (VjL9S)

150 ::;119 Populist appeal: 'You ain't got because someone took it from you. Who did? The Democrats. It's time for payback.' :::

Sadly, Yes.

Populism works. See: Democrats, The

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 06:14 PM (kEj+5)

151 Or we could go for some of that green vote and call ourselves Primitives.

Posted by: WalrusRex at March 14, 2013 06:14 PM (Hx5uv)

152 116
Constitutionalist?

Posted by: Bosk at March 14, 2013 06:08 PM (n2K+4)


I like this one! Thanks.

Posted by: ChristyBlinky at March 14, 2013 06:14 PM (baL2B)

153 I have to admit, in recent years, I've been moving away from a self-identification as "conservative" and toward "liberty lover." This is not because there's anything wrong with conservatives or conservatism, per se, except that the term itself is subject to change. I'm not interested in conserving now the things we fought thirty years ago.

Liberty, on the other hand, is timeless, and is, or should be, our goal.

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at March 14, 2013 06:14 PM (U+vgB)

154 Whatever the name, we'll need a viral flash mob video to publicize it.

Posted by: Lincolntf at March 14, 2013 06:14 PM (ZshNr)

155 "Conservative" started to become a bad word when the congenitally retarded Bush clan grabbed ahold of it and, while identifying as conservatives with various flavor toppings (e.g. "compassionate conservative"), proceeded to govern in a way completely incompatible with actual conservatism.

As has been said before and will have to be said again, the cretinous Bush family destroyed the hugely important post-Reagan legacy. Rebuilding from that disaster will take a generation. We should start by burning every living Bush family member at the stake, and firing the ashes into the Sun on a huge rocket. (Only mildly tongue in cheek here.)

Posted by: torquewrench at March 14, 2013 06:14 PM (gqT4g)

156 Don't be ruled by the Left.

Posted by: Islamic Rage Boy at March 14, 2013 06:15 PM (e8kgV)

157 It doesn't matter what we call ourselves if we don't break the voting patterns of certain voting groups. If we can't do that, we can call ourselves "Losers"

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:15 PM (9Bj8R)

158 That would be the Sound of Music kind of flash mob, not the rob the Victoria's Secret type of flash mob, right?

Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at March 14, 2013 06:15 PM (RZ8pf)

159 O/T: Reuters' Matthew Keys indicted for conspiring with hacker group 'Anonymous'
DRUDGE
Oh my!

Posted by: Attila at March 14, 2013 06:15 PM (Cs2tJ)

160 @ 150: Populism works. See: Democrats, The

-------------------------------------------------

It's given Bill O'Reilly a helluva career, too.

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 06:16 PM (sTS/8)

161 Well, perhaps it's that "conservative" is too linked with a particular religious viewpoint

Here we go, again...

Posted by: My Little Pony at March 14, 2013 06:16 PM (vbh31)

162 155
"Conservative" started to become a bad word when the congenitally
retarded Bush clan grabbed ahold of it and, while identifying as
conservatives with various flavor toppings (e.g. "compassionate
conservative"), proceeded to govern in a way completely incompatible
with actual conservatism.

As has been said before and will have
to be said again, the cretinous Bush family destroyed the hugely
important post-Reagan legacy. Rebuilding from that disaster will take a
generation. We should start by burning every living Bush family member
at the stake, and firing the ashes into the Sun on a huge rocket. (Only
mildly tongue in cheek here.)



Posted by: torquewrench at March 14, 2013 06:14 PM (gqT4g)

---
^^^THIS^^^

Posted by: Craig Poe at March 14, 2013 06:16 PM (BVkEs)

163 ChristyBlinky:
>> Until then they were---sort of---thinking Paul Ryan was a cool dude and YOUNG.

Yeah, I totally agree. Paul Ryan was not the problem.

Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 06:16 PM (y15sM)

164 I'm puzzled that we aren't selling this point: Why settle for what little the government gives you when you could be making as much money as you felt like under Conservatism?

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at March 14, 2013 06:17 PM (+z4pE)

165 ::;1.) Your political instincts are pretty awful too, so you're nobody to preach, buddy::;

Yeah, but the kids love me.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 06:17 PM (kEj+5)

166 Well, let's see...

When the last "conservative" president was in power, he....

1. federalized local public education via NCLB
2. turned budget surpluses into large deficits
3. incompetently managed two war / nation-building missions
4. shredded the 4th amendment via the Patriot Act
5. followed up and expanded upon the "everyone gets a house" policies of the Clinton administration
6. dropped regulations on capital requirements for derivative purchases, allowing investment banks to dramatically increase their exposure to this type of nonsense
7. presided over the largest economic collapse since the Great Depression
8. BAILED out the Wall Street bastards who helped create the collapse

So, who ruined the word "conservative"? I blame the media.

Posted by: stickety at March 14, 2013 06:17 PM (+Vm+w)

167 Oh please stop blaming the Bush Family. I hear enough of that from obama

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:17 PM (9Bj8R)

168 For all the grief we give the Bush family, we should also attack the GOP establishment in general for giving us such godawful candidates.

Remember who the choices were after 8 years of Democrat governance?

Bush and McCain.

Real conservative choices there.

Posted by: The Q at March 14, 2013 06:18 PM (yVmMc)

169 It depends who you're talking to. I bet you'll find that young people often don't like the word "conservative" but grown-ups do.
What are you going to call people who want to restore the ordered liberty of the Founders?

I dunno about re-branding conservatism, but I do think we need to rebrand "liberalism." Never call them "liberals." Call them leftists. Call them left-wing. Call them statists. Above all else, call them the ESTABLISHMENT, the ruling class.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at March 14, 2013 06:19 PM (C8mVl)

170 SouthParkism

Posted by: RamonAllones at March 14, 2013 06:19 PM (3lLli)

171 So, was this *intended* to bring out every fucking internecine grievance possible and let everyone get their hate on?

I don't know, forgot to post puppy and kitten pictures?

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at March 14, 2013 06:19 PM (bxiXv)

172 Still, this whole thing reeks of the Conservative problem itself. Conservatives, like center-left liberals, WANT to be liked and be popular. Note this is distinct from being actually popular, which as we know can paradoxically come from being very unconcerned with popular opinion.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:19 PM (El+h4)

173 @ 165: Yeah, but the kids love me.

------------------------------------

And by "love" you mean, "Appreciate the fact that I don't beat them if they scrub the skid marks out of my skivvies."

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 06:19 PM (sTS/8)

174 148 entitlement reform is fine. i'm talking a general economic message that places too big of a focus on cutting spending as the end-all v. growing the economy, the latter of which has no new rhetoric.

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 06:20 PM (60GaT)

175 Why does Mr. AceofSpades always have a gawdawful ugly face up in the right sidebar?

Posted by: Low Information Voter at March 14, 2013 06:20 PM (vbh31)

176 in polls for decades, American identify themselves as conservative over liberals by a two to one margin. 2 to 1


if you throw in "Moderate" as a third choice, you get a 2-2-1 ---- two out of five are cons, two of five are moderates, one is liberal

Posted by: Jerry Jack in Jacksonville at March 14, 2013 06:20 PM (Dll6b)

177 >> the cretinous Bush family destroyed the hugely

important post-Reagan legacy


America would actually be a freer and more prosperous country today if Michael Dukakis had won that election, God help us all.

Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 06:20 PM (y15sM)

178 Here's another thing... In my state (R) Governor. State House (R) majority. House of Reps (R) majority. Senate split. Every four years the voters swell for the Presidential vote and the state goes for the (D).

What the hell can we do? It almost seems as if the voters in the state have an issue with ONE candidate every four years.

Posted by: Regular Moron at March 14, 2013 06:21 PM (feFL6)

179 I suggest "Libertine."


I prefer "Hun".

Posted by: rickb223 at March 14, 2013 06:21 PM (d0Dmj)

180
My biggest beef with the Bushes...is that they don't *defend* conservatism.
They ride on it.

They depend on others to defend it...while they ride on it, and ride it into the ground.


Rick Perry today, in a short speech, defined and defended conservative principles more than I have ever heard the Bushes do.
Perry did this, while openly mocking Barky too.

Posted by: wheatie at March 14, 2013 06:21 PM (2xMNt)

181
How about Comb-over Conservatives? Desperate to connect with a youthful generation that has no interest in them other than as a wallet to pay for their rent/drugs/obamaphones?

This really recalls the futile attempts by the Greatest Generation to connect with the Free Love culture of the 60s and Cocaine Summer of the 70s.

The result, Sammy Davis in a Nehu jacket and love-beads instead of a proper tux.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at March 14, 2013 06:21 PM (kdS6q)

182 Seriously, why even bother making this point, then? It's like saying "you can't win, don't bother playing." Are you an adult, or are you a whipped cur? You fight ANYWAY. I don't buy what you're selling, but even if I did I wouldn't be sitting around counseling despair, I'd still be trying to do my best.
Posted by: Jeff B. at March 14, 2013 06:08 PM (/Rmj0)


Fair enough. Sometimes my old enthusiasm for the struggle flares up a bit and I spout off. And I am grateful for your efforts - you and those like you may help buy extra time forothers amongus to strip all we can out of this place before the collapse. But an ever increasing share of your "fellow Americans" resent/hate you. They're the ones breeding the slums to overflowing, teaching the kids in public schools and universities, running the bureaucracies. You are fighting to save a nation that doesn't want to be saved.

So, if it's true that we've hit the point that "conservative" really is a bad word, then screw 'em all. LIB.

Posted by: Reactionary at March 14, 2013 06:21 PM (jfeoD)

183 You are just a ray of sunshine today ace.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose at March 14, 2013 06:22 PM (uvjrz)

184 Read My Lips - Fool

Posted by: Craig Poe at March 14, 2013 06:22 PM (BVkEs)

185 Margarita DeVille:
>> I dunno about re-branding conservatism, but I do think we need to rebrand "liberalism." Never call them "liberals." Call them leftists. Call them left-wing. Call them statists. Above all else, call them the ESTABLISHMENT, the ruling class.

Amen, sister.

Posted by: sandy burger at March 14, 2013 06:22 PM (y15sM)

186 not to cramp your Style, man, but there have been nationwide polls on this area ( political preferences and voting behavior since the 1950s

consistent results, they demonstrate...

Posted by: Jerry Jack in Jacksonville at March 14, 2013 06:22 PM (Dll6b)

187 There is no conservative ...Only ZULU
Posted by: weft cut-loop
***

It's Zuul darn it. I am so going to fire my PR guy.

Posted by: Zuul the Gatekeeper of Gozer at March 14, 2013 06:22 PM (uhftQ)

188 @ 168: we should also attack the GOP establishment in general for giving us such godawful candidates.

---------------------------------------

Oh Jesus fucking Crawfish -- what "establishment" chose our candidates for us? Who "made" the individual candidates decide to run or not run?

Talk about populist bullshit....

Posted by: Norman Bean at March 14, 2013 06:22 PM (sTS/8)

189 :;;And by "love" you mean, "Appreciate the fact that I don't beat them if they scrub the skid marks out of my skivvies.":::

No, I mean it's never a bad time for a Ghostbusters reference.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 06:22 PM (kEj+5)

190 @182

I got called 'dirty' by a black kid today walking through a Giant food market.

To be fair, I was wearing a bowtie, vest, and matching navy pants/coat/hat.

But still.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:23 PM (El+h4)

191 eh, just call myself a Dirty Conservative

Posted by: The Dude at March 14, 2013 06:23 PM (vJdyz)

192
Here's another point we're not selling: The bigger Washington becomes, the less you have.

So much low-hanging fruit, so many unwilling to grasp it.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at March 14, 2013 06:23 PM (+z4pE)

193 Conservatarian

Posted by: Craig Poe at March 14, 2013 06:23 PM (BVkEs)

194 I regard "conservative" as dispensable in that it's a poor descriptor of the position in general, and in the sense that it is a descriptor, it lacks a great deal: a sense of energy, hopefulness, purposefulness, etc. It feels like we're about preserving historic buildings or something.

"Liberal" had the same issues for the left (as does the word left) but "progressive" is really a lot better, as much as I now have a loathing for the word.

Hmmm.

Posted by: TexasDan at March 14, 2013 06:24 PM (Fa3Hi)

195 The language has been degraded. I consider myself a "classical liberal". This means that I want the state to do only those things I am unable to do for myself (build roads, sewers, etc.) and stay the hell out of my business at all other times. Thomas Jefferson was a classical liberal.

Posted by: navybrat at March 14, 2013 06:24 PM (CgiRY)

196 "When the last 'conservative' president was in power, he....



1. federalized local public education via NCLB

2. turned budget surpluses into large deficits

3. incompetently managed two war / nation-building missions"
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

And he did (3) after having pledged, as a candidate, that once President, he would have nothing to do with nation-building, saying that it was a fundamentally flawed concept!

So: taking one strong public position while a candidate, and then in office turning around and doing precisely the opposite thing, and having it be a total disaster, and selling all this crap to the ordinary public as "conservatism", and then wondering why "conservative" has become a bad word.

This is, of course, Bush family tradition.

Bush the Lesser (that is, Bush 41, distinguished from his son Bush 43, or Bush the Even Lesser), went out on the campaign trail and said, "Read my lips, NO NEW TAXES". Then in office, Bush the Lesser promptly socked Americans with a fat new tax hike. Then BTL was completely surprised when the electorate responded to his inconsistency by saying, "If this is 'conservatism', we want no more of that shit," and threw his ass out of office, replacing him with a liberal.

Bushes delenda est. With extreme prejudice. Sow the earth of Kennebunkport with salt afterward.

Posted by: torquewrench at March 14, 2013 06:24 PM (gqT4g)

197 Not to anyone who matters, I'm proud to be a conservative

Posted by: phoenixgirl at March 14, 2013 06:24 PM (GVxQo)

198
This argument is a little bacwards. People vote for persons, not party labels. Get more attractive and interesting voices like Rubio, Rand P., Cruz, Dr. Carson out talking up conservatism and these voices will gradually re-define the party label and philosophy. Its about the Person You Guys.

Much like the nonsensical "Wii" brand-name, which was panned the moment Nintendo revealed it for the first time, the product ended up defineing the name than the name did the product.

Posted by: Serious Cat at March 14, 2013 06:24 PM (UypUQ)

199 Thought for the day:

With Vice President Joe Biden attending the pope's investiture in Rome Tuesday and President Obama leaving for the Middle East the same day, there is potential for a very rare occurrence: That both may be out of the country at the same time.

White House Deputy National Security Adviser Ben Rhodes said that generally the administration tries to coordinate trips so that doesn't happen, but he's not sure about next week.

"I actually don’t know for certain if they’ll be abroad at the same time," Rhodes said Thursday.

(PHOTOS: Obama’s 24 international trips)

The ceremony in Rome is scheduled to take place in the morning and Obama isn't scheduled to leave the United States until the evening so it is technically possible Biden could be back in time. But it's unclear if he is leaving Rome so quickly. His official schedule has not been released.

Any time the president or vice president travels from their normal routines in Washington, they face increased risk security-wise. And having them both traveling at the same time presents a risk that most administrations don't take -- that something tragic could happen to both of them, leaving the presidency in the hands of the third in the line of presidential succession. In this case, House Speaker John Boehner.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:25 PM (9Bj8R)

200 Directing Integrated Republican Theories to Youth

Posted by: Lincolntf at March 14, 2013 06:25 PM (ZshNr)

201 @198

AS they say, True Reaction sells itself.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:25 PM (El+h4)

202 I'm going to start telling people I'm a Tory. I don't think that brand is too badly tarnished.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 14, 2013 06:25 PM (mNCbk)

203 Got it:

Wolverines.

Posted by: TexasDan at March 14, 2013 06:25 PM (Fa3Hi)

204
Do you want to know the biggest problem with 'conservatism'?

It's that people believe they had 8 years of it with President Bush. So that's their notion and experience with conservatism.

Posted by: Soothsayer, of the Righteousness and Harmonious Fists at March 14, 2013 06:26 PM (oxIUw)

205 We are the dirty ones.
We are the tired ones.
We are the overmuch adapting T.S.Eliot ones.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:26 PM (El+h4)

206 Once the burning begins, I'll come out in the open as a Jacobin.

Posted by: @PurpAv at March 14, 2013 06:27 PM (mNCbk)

207 This is stupid. Liberals control the entire media/entertainment/academic infrastructure and cosmetic bullshit like this won't work like it does for them.

Posted by: Zippity Doo Dah at March 14, 2013 06:27 PM (E55AK)

208 @206

As long as leftists hate it it should work out fine.

Us dirty folks will keep the dirt real over here for ya.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (El+h4)

209 :::202 I'm going to start telling people I'm a Tory. I don't think that brand is too badly tarnished.
Posted by: @PurpAv at March 14, 2013 06:25 PM (mNCbk).:::

Yeah, but you act like a Whigger.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (kEj+5)

210
With Vice President Joe Biden attending the pope's investiture in Rome Tuesday and President Obama leaving for the Middle East the same day, there is potential for a very rare occurrence: That both may be out of the country at the same time.

At least I get a day off.

Posted by: The Chicken at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (+z4pE)

211
Corporate toadies?

Posted by: Ed Anger at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (tOkJB)

212 the only problem i have with the term "conservative" is that come election time every Republican (and some Dems) will start calling themselves one when in fact they are nothing of the sort.

is McCain a conservative, is Graham, is Cantor or Boehner?

no, they aren't but they claim to be.

this causes all kinds of confusion, especially amoungst the low-info types on our side who go around calling themselves conservatives but support nanny-state programs like S.S., Medicare/Medicaid, and others.

if you support Big Gov. programs, you are a Big Gov. statist, not a conservative.

Posted by: Shoey at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (jdOk/)

213 Once the burning begins, I'll come out in the open as a Jacobin.


Posted by: @PurpAv at March 14, 2013 06:27 PM (mNCbk)

that's a good one

Posted by: The Dude at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (vJdyz)

214 >>> Social conservative is a real turnoff for anyone who isn't one. And, to me, theydiffer from nanny-state libtardsonly in perspective.

Nanny state libtards get upset if the wrong thing goes in your mouth. Social cons get upset if the wrong thing goes in your butt. Sometimes you get the cross-over ones, like Mike Huckabee. Or, as I will henceforth call him, the "human conservapede"

Posted by: wooga at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (76Gx5)

215 Conservative Reptilian Overlords

Posted by: Craig Poe at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (BVkEs)

216 Wolverines.


The Honey Badger Party.
"Because Honey Badger don't give a shit".

Posted by: rickb223 at March 14, 2013 06:29 PM (d0Dmj)

217 #1) Take over at least half the media
#2) Invade the school system
3) Invade the legal system

Posted by: Zuul the Gatekeeper of Gozer at March 14, 2013 06:29 PM (uhftQ)

218 198

nah i think if Rubio offers aspirational stories but his politics are identical to McCain/Romney people're gonna notice

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 06:29 PM (60GaT)

219 Yeah, but you act like a Whigger.
Posted by: Empire of Jeff at March 14, 2013 06:28 PM (kEj+5)



I hate it when the local kids do that.

Posted by: Reactionary at March 14, 2013 06:29 PM (jfeoD)

220 At least I get a day off.

And I can come out from under the sofa. Woof.

Posted by: Bo at March 14, 2013 06:29 PM (vbh31)

221 Here's the ugly truth: unless we are picking off at least one of Gore's states, we aren't winning in 2016 or 2020 or 2024 or any future date. Since the pendulum-swing required to force out an existing party is strong enough to reflect shifting attitudes in the various states, my #1 rule with elections still holds and has held since the 18th century. It holds because for an electorate to toss out one party there are "canaryin the coalmine" states that indicate as such. WV in 2000. NC,VA, CO in 2008. MA in 1980. CA in 1992. And so on and so on...If we aren't looking at really flipping states like Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Michigan, etc, we're fucked. The demographic and partisan shifts during Presidential elections have been so substantial that a state like Wisconsin that became redder in state governance than South Carolina in 2010 still voted for Obama by 7 points.

Until those lost suburban voters and the younger vote is played for we're the minority party for at least another decade.

Posted by: CAC at March 14, 2013 06:30 PM (p7Xiw)

222 @212

That's because conservatism is a chimera except in limited scopes and circumstances. If homosexuality became the norm, conservatives would be pro-gay.

Conservatism, like many of the assumptions in our founding documents, works right when society is at least partly sane and partly barbaric. When it's crazy and whipped, forget it.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:30 PM (El+h4)

223 Invade the school system

Ceding the School System to the Liberals was the biggest mistake we ever made

Posted by: Nevergiveup at March 14, 2013 06:30 PM (9Bj8R)

224 Lets call ourselves (beyond morons) common sense get your hands out of my pocket people. And always remember to call 'liberals' fascist scum on the wrong side of the bell curve.

Posted by: angel with a sword at March 14, 2013 06:30 PM (3RiPs)

225 I think of conservatives as realists and liberals as idealists.

Posted by: Marmo at March 14, 2013 06:31 PM (pcgW1)

226 202 "'I'm going to start telling people I'm a Tory. I don't think that brand is too badly tarnished."

It is, big time. If they election were held today, they'd lose 100 seats with Labour holding an 84 seat majority.

Cameron's done half-assed austerity and sullied the name of that policy.

Posted by: The Q at March 14, 2013 06:31 PM (yVmMc)

227 218198

nah i think if Rubio offers aspirational stories but his politics are identical to McCain/Romney people're gonna notice
Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 06:29 PM (60GaT)


... all ready have noticed.

(nice Amnesty bill you got there Senator Rubio.)

Posted by: Shoey at March 14, 2013 06:31 PM (jdOk/)

228 Do You Feel Lucky Punk Conservative

Posted by: Craig Poe at March 14, 2013 06:31 PM (BVkEs)

229 @221

I say unite the rightwing voices and let them talk to each other. Don't kick anyone out; don't set or force a party line or agenda. At some point a party line will form, but it needs to do so organically.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:32 PM (El+h4)

230 I just call myself a "Tenther" (as in Tenth Amendment) instead of conservative.

Hmmm. I should start a blog. I'm sure "dedicatedtenther" is available.

Posted by: wooga at March 14, 2013 06:32 PM (76Gx5)

231 Social cons get upset if the wrong thing goes in your butt.

So do we. It's an exit, not an entrance, dumbshit.

Posted by: Proctologists and ER docs at March 14, 2013 06:32 PM (vbh31)

232 "222 @212

That's because conservatism is a chimera except in limited scopes and circumstances. If homosexuality became the norm, conservatives would be pro-gay.

Conservatism, like many of the assumptions in our founding documents, works right when society is at least partly sane and partly barbaric. When it's crazy and whipped, forget it.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:30 PM (El+h4) "

Partly barbaric?

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at March 14, 2013 06:33 PM (GHpOB)

233 222

true dat

Posted by: Shoey at March 14, 2013 06:33 PM (jdOk/)

234
In the movie ratings, 'R' stands for...Realism.

People say..."get real"...when someone is being foolish.

The Left claims to love 'reality', but they ignore it and live in their fantasy world for most of the time.

Which is why I think we should use the word 'Reality' in our re-branding.
If you look at conservative principles...they embrace the reality of common sense.

So again, I suggest Reality-Con...or Re-Con...as a way to convey what conservatism is really about.

Posted by: wheatie at March 14, 2013 06:34 PM (2xMNt)

235 @232

When you think you actually could credibly get beat or shot by an ordinary person for doing something - not something deadly, but maybe just something dumbass - society is the right amount barbaric.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:35 PM (El+h4)

236
"Oh please stop blaming the Bush Family. I hear enough of that from obama"

We blame the Bushes for the polar opposite reason that TFG does.

Additionally, TFG's blame is built on the lie that the Bushes were *actually* conservatives (or whatever the label is now). They most certainly were not in anything much more than their claim to be so. The balance of the their records screams Big Government. TFG is happy to hang the label "conservative" on those failures.

Of course I'd prefer GHWB and GWB to TFG. I'd be an idiot or a capital L-Libertarian (same difference) to say there's no difference. But we must, must, must very soon get Constitutionalist, small-government, small-l-libertarians into offices or it Will Be Over.

Posted by: Jaws at March 14, 2013 06:35 PM (4I3Uo)

237 198 ---"This argument is a little backwards. People vote for persons, not party labels. Get more attractive and interesting voices like Rubio, Rand P., Cruz, Dr. Carson out talking up conservatism and these voices will gradually re-define the party label and philosophy. Its about the Person You Guys."

Posted by: Serious Cat at March 14, 2013 06:24 PM (UypUQ)
-----------------
Wise words, IMO.

Posted by: Margarita DeVille at March 14, 2013 06:36 PM (C8mVl)

238 Until those lost suburban voters and the younger vote is played for we're the minority party for at least another decade.

Posted by: CAC at March 14, 2013 06:30 PM (p7Xiw)

---How about we flip the script and for the urban voters? Call me a dreamer, but I think a Dr. Carson candidacy could play very well in city precincts. Such as Philadelphia... Detroit.

Posted by: Serious Cat at March 14, 2013 06:36 PM (UypUQ)

239
Social cons get upset if the wrong thing goes in your butt.

So do we. It's an exit, not an entrance, dumbshit.


And ignore me too while you're at it.

Posted by: The Concept of Mating Parts at March 14, 2013 06:36 PM (+z4pE)

240 It didn't take long for the left to paint the Tea Party as an amalgam of astroturfed fringe lunatics, did it? Words are useless when you are outsiders to all the things that define a culture.

I've said it a million times, but it's still true, lots more wingnuts putting their kids in a position to get into good schools and get good jobs is the only way things change.

Posted by: Zippity Doo Dah at March 14, 2013 06:37 PM (E55AK)

241 I'm telling you, they'll never get anywhere until they're not afraid to be hated.

Even when confronting the Dem's on bizarre lists of prohibited guns, Repub's are always *not* taking that extra step into Reaction. Some of them are intelligent enough to do it with a deadly calm and wit, but don't. That's because they're conservatives mentally and not reactionaries.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:37 PM (El+h4)

242 lately I just call myself a conservative libertarian.

it's not a completely accurate description of my political philosphy but it does capture the essense of it.

Posted by: Shoey at March 14, 2013 06:38 PM (jdOk/)

243 Good schools are shiz. You need to rebuild the culture from scratch at this point.

Read 'The Last Psychiatrist's blog. He talks about the scam that college has become.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:39 PM (El+h4)

244 I will give you an example of how liberalism and "progressive" political correctness works. I give you my mother-in-law, who I have never had a cross-word with as I was raised, in the deepest of the redneck South, to respect my elders. Even Yankee mother-in-laws who have grown liberal after their Reagan-Conservative husband dies.


She voted for Obama. She is a very devout Catholic who has become liberal in her old age due to liberal family members who have her ear, plus watching CNN around the clock and only reading news in the paper. No way, no how, would my father-in-law have voted for Obama. He was a director of a defense contracting company, a conservative to the core when his son (and I) were more liberal in college. I married into this very Catholic family to a son who had Protestant beliefs before I met him. I did not influence him, much to her disbelief.


In addition to the media and liberal bent of other family, her own brother came out of the closet as a middle-aged widower with grown children. In order to accept him and his partner (also formerly married middle-aged guy) into the fold, and, in her mind, believe her brother will be in heaven, she now believes he was born this way. Her liberal thinking started with this. Since the 70's this has been the message for gay-rights (they were born this way, and God approves of sinning...the same as He would approve of me committing adultry while going to church and proclaiming to be a Christian), in addition to blurring over scripture vs sodomy...that the word "homosexual" was not addressed in the Bible. In that aspect, like Clinton's definition of "is" during his impeachment proceedings, they are correct. The gay-rights movement attached themselves to the coattails of civil rights. It became very unpopular, over the last few decades, to be against gay-marriage or conservative values like being anti-abortion. Churches are dividing, today, over these issues.


As I said, over time, as an adult and parent, I became more conservative. I asked my mother-in-law (again, a staunch Catholic in her own eyes, attending mass daily) how she could vote for pro-abortion candidates. She could not answer this question...yet her vote goes with the tide and admits to voting for The Won.


We, the collective body of conservative constitutionalists, are not only going against the tide of popular thinking but against the media. That is the main problem: the biased media. I do not know how that message will change.

Posted by: ChristyBlinky at March 14, 2013 06:39 PM (baL2B)

245
Y'all are flailing. You were in the last post and no less in this effort.


It's evident what the other side is.

We, on the other hand, are Americans. They aren't.

If some don't want to be Americans, fine.

Can't stop believing in America and it's advantages so get confrontational with these assholes and ridicule the living shit out of them.

Do that enough and we win.

Posted by: irongrampa at March 14, 2013 06:40 PM (SAMxH)

246 Take 100 people off the streets randomly selected.

Tell them you're fiscally conservative, I'd say 65 will nod in agreement.

Tell them you're socially conservative, 65 of them will either frown or roll their eyes.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 14, 2013 06:41 PM (HDgX3)

247 i think a conservatism that knows exactly what it wants to conserve is better than calling yourself, errr, a reactionary, which just sounds like knees jerking

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 06:41 PM (60GaT)

248
I'd go with:

Running dog lackeys of the corporate slave masters.

Posted by: Ed Anger at March 14, 2013 06:42 PM (tOkJB)

249 @244

As an Orthodox Christian I often have to make the distinction between homosexual activity (which is what the scripture considers abhorrent) and homosexuality, which is not mentioned at all. 'Sexuality' as such is not a topic; you're expected to be responsible with your parts regardless of how you feel about another person, man, woman, space alien, end of story.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:42 PM (El+h4)

250 But reaction has punch, like progress has punch. Just say 'Reactionary' loudly, and then 'Conservative' and you will understand the fact that language is still aural.

Posted by: RiverC at March 14, 2013 06:44 PM (El+h4)

251 237
198 ---"This argument is a little backwards. People vote for persons,
not party labels. Get more attractive and interesting voices like Rubio,
Rand P., Cruz, Dr. Carson out talking up conservatism and these voices
will gradually re-define the party label and philosophy. Its about the
Person You Guys."



Posted by: Serious Cat at March 14, 2013 06:24 PM (UypUQ)

_________

I disagree. In general people vote for the party. This is especially true at the state/local. I have no clue who my state rep/senator is or who my county commissioner is. I just always vote for the (R) and hope for the best.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 14, 2013 06:45 PM (HDgX3)

252 Tell them you're socially conservative, 65 of them will either frown or roll their eyes.

That's right. Fuck anything that moves, I always said.

Posted by: Zombie Caligula at March 14, 2013 06:45 PM (vbh31)

253
but really political labels are meaningless...

"Political tags -- such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and so forth -- are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire."

- Robert Heinlein

Posted by: Shoey at March 14, 2013 06:47 PM (jdOk/)

254 I disagree. In general people vote for the party. This is especially true at the state/local. I have no clue who my state rep/senator is or who my county commissioner is. I just always vote for the (R) and hope for the best.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at March 14, 2013 06:45 PM (HDgX3)


I want to slap you, and then never stop slapping you, not because you vote for R's but because you do so in such an unthinking and fatalistic manner, good God man!

use your brain!

Posted by: Shoey at March 14, 2013 06:49 PM (jdOk/)

255 "Tell them you're fiscally conservative, I'd say 65 will nod in agreement."

and at least half of those will consider Obama fiscally conservative

term is meaningless. if we hiked the hell out of taxes to balance the budget, that would be fiscally conservative. everyone considers themselves fiscally conservative as in "i don't want money wasted" but vastly differ on what counts as waste/unnecessary

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 06:50 PM (60GaT)

256 230 "I just call myself a "Tenther" (as in Tenth Amendment) instead of conservative. Hmmm. I should start a blog. I'm sure "dedicatedtenther" is available."

You're onto a good idea but I think you should expand it to calling yourself a nine-tenther.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

We have forgotten where we came from. If you come for my 357 you're going to get a 125 grain semi-jacketed hollow point in the forehead.

Posted by: angel with a sword at March 14, 2013 06:51 PM (3RiPs)

257 I disagree. In general people vote for the party.

80-ish percent of people do, nowadays. The others pick the...how do I put this discreetly?!...the less unfuckable guy (if the candidates are two guys). The "R" on the "R" guy is a blinding halo of unfuckability. He can take it off and horseshoe it onto the other guy's head if he wants, but...he won't.

Bush managed it just by being an actual guy (who sucked and was hated but was a guy), then the last two were these nervous weirdos who can't handle themselves, and Rubio and Jindal and Bush MXMLXXXIV are weak creeps nobody can trust, and there's no way Cruz or Paul will ever make it near the head of "the line"...

I'm looking forward to President Weiner. I think he'll be our last.

Posted by: oblig. at March 14, 2013 07:00 PM (cePv8)

258 In the previous thread MJ proposed creating a conservative organization called "The Irony Club".

Given that Barack Obama's election and reelection largely consisted of getting politically uninvolved people to vote for him for trivial reasons, it seems that the winning strategy may well be to persuade the under 40 crowd to vote for equally trivial reasons. Wearing flannel and drinking Pabst Blue Ribbon is an ironic statement. So is wearing those silly skimpy brim hats.

Perhaps the only chance a conservative has any more is to be the ironic choice. If that is the case, Ron Paul, Pat Buchannan or Newt Gingrich might have a better chance than Bobby Jindal or Paul Ryan. Sara Palin might actually be the most electable candidate in an irony campaign.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-hole at March 14, 2013 07:08 PM (31Nrp)

259 lol

Posted by: JDP at March 14, 2013 07:09 PM (60GaT)

260 I consider myself a Yoreist in that I propose returning to days of yore.

Posted by: Warden at March 14, 2013 07:19 PM (HzhBE)

261 Liberal is always the dumb ass dirty word. Conservative, oh they are trying their darndest, still rules the most.

Posted by: Prescient11 at March 14, 2013 07:19 PM (tVTLU)

262 If it were the case "conservative" was an unpopular designation, republicans in name only wouldn't pretend to be one come election time. Leftist run from being named liberal, they are now progressives.

Posted by: Herronblade at March 14, 2013 07:24 PM (gqLBw)

263 Beliebers.

That's all I got.

Posted by: DamnDirtyRINO at March 14, 2013 07:39 PM (m0h0I)

264 Didn't every term for "opposed to leftism" start off as kind of a left-wing pejorative, like Reactionary? Sometimes I think that only leftism is really a thing, and what's against it is just a preference for normalcy. Maybe we should be called Normalists, or Contras. Or we should say, I'm a member of several of the overlapping groups that oppose Leftism for various reasons, such as wanting to have a job even if the Party thinks what I do for a living isn't as sustainable as it should be.

Posted by: Dave M at March 14, 2013 07:58 PM (tveBH)

265 I still think the term 'American Revolutionary' ('revolutionary' as in Washington, Jefferson, Adams, Franklin, et al) is superior to the term 'conservative', and far more descriptive.

Posted by: troyriser at March 14, 2013 08:08 PM (ptcFO)

266 I don't buy the "run away". Liberals did not start to run away from "liberalism" because it became unpopular, but it became unpopular when they stopped defending it in the late 60's and 70's. If you won't make the case for something, OF COURSE it will fall out of fashion.

Note that, even now, "fiscal conservative" is a label most people claim (often falsely.)

Posted by: George LeS at March 14, 2013 08:09 PM (C4s3i)

267 I stopped calling myself a conservative after the last election.

Like others here, what exactly do I want to conserve. The nanny state, the
near police state, ignoring the constitution, ignoring the rights and liberties
of the individual, our oppressive tax state, our corrupt and incompetent elected
reps at the state and federal levels, our school system that seems to primarily
employ bullies, thugs and tards, or a media that isn't much different than
the type of the Soviet Union?

Radical Reactionary is what I now prefer. At least with that label I can
explain my specific beliefs.

Posted by: ExSnipe at March 14, 2013 08:25 PM (PBm/l)

268 Hell no the c-word is not a word to be avoided. It is to be owned, with pride. I am a conservative, first and foremost. Anyone who thinks they should duck and cover from it probably isn't too conservative to begin with. Self-awareness is important. The other day I was making a snide comment about Liberals and my 16 year old said "you say that now with derogatory meaning," and I replied, "you're damn right I do and that is exactly how I mean it too." Being a Liberal now days is akin to being a thief and a liar. And take note, I say Liberal with capital "L" not lower case "l". LibProg collectivist jackasses, both DINOs and RINOs wouldn't know what liberalism and liberty were if it walk up and bite them on the ass.

Posted by: halodoc at March 14, 2013 09:56 PM (Fzbp3)

269 Instead of RINO, how about scruntservative?

Posted by: Ostral B Heretic at March 14, 2013 11:01 PM (79AXR)

270 Huge terrorist attack, murdering hundreds of Americans. That will bring back the "c" brand.

Do not lose hope little brothers.

Posted by: andrew breitbart at March 15, 2013 10:24 AM (xsG+Y)

271 I don't use the "c" word. I now refer to myself as "Totally Fucking Dead."

Posted by: andrew breitbart at March 15, 2013 10:49 AM (xsG+Y)

272 "14 Well I must say it does have the judgmental, sanctimonious,stick up the ass vibe to it.
We need a better label.
Posted by: NeoKong at March 14, 2013 05:49 PM (JWLwG)"

Sure. Then you can run that one into the ground by being endlessly "pragmatic", submissive to your opponents, and insulting to your base too. Good thinking. If you label a bowl of the same old shit 'peaches' it will draw in the peach loving crowd. Until they look in the bowl.

Posted by: Cackfinger at March 15, 2013 04:48 PM (CCHli)

273 Never, ever, rebrand a political movement. The global warming movement was about to take over the world when they started calling it "climate change"; for that matter the USSR was doing just fine until it started talking about "democratic centralism".

Posted by: karl at March 16, 2013 12:29 AM (01IIz)

274 Re: clinging to the C-word.
The goal is to win, not to cling to a name for our identity. If changing the name helps to communicate the message; then change the name. "A rose by any other name, smells as sweet", right? Who cares about the title. Titles can mislead accidently or deliberately. It is the "content of our characters" and the context of our beliefs that must be communicated without running into the social auto-block switch that kicks in at the mention of conservative.

Posted by: I'd rather be surfin at March 16, 2013 10:27 AM (g5wi5)

275 Ace,
What about holding an internet-wide contest for
"Name our political ideology"

IF you do this- some suggestions:

Judges should test names for possible weaknesses:

For example: can this name be twisted to link to a negative idea- (think about the "tea baggers" mockery)
Can it be connected to any negative historical organization or event?
How does it SOUND when spoken?
How does it LOOK when read and how does it LOOk in a LOGO
Regional, ethnic, religious, gender reactions to the word
PLEASE recruit marketing people to help you judge, and run some test marketing groups to see how it flies.

Posted by: I'd rather be surfin at March 16, 2013 10:36 AM (g5wi5)






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