The House GOP Is Ready To Cave on Sandy Pork . . . And The Debt Ceiling

A couple short items to put on your radar. First, if you didn't see it, here's my post detailing all the wasteful spending in the Sandy relief package that will be taken up by the House today.

Second, last night the GOP-led House Rules Committee blocked almost all amendments to the Sandy bill that would have trimmed out the fat. I suspected the GOP was ready to welcome defeat on this yesterday. Now we know for sure. They just want the issue gone.

There's something else in the air here in D.C. too. And that is the feeling, propelled by pieces like this one in Politico and this column by Ed Morrissey that conservatives in the GOP would prefer to get the debt ceiling out of the way so they can score points off of a government shutdown -- or the threat of a government shutdown -- in late March, when the current CR expires.

This seems, to me, to be skipping past the immediate problem, the debt ceiling, in favor of fantasizing about a supposedly easier fight to be had months from now. My concern is what form a debt ceiling deal will take since these folks are so obviously telegraphing their disinterest in fighting that battle. In case you were wondering, that sound you hear is Speaker Boehner's leverage slamming the door on its way out.

This is doubly confusing because not only is the debt ceiling our immediate problem, but it is the only one of the two on which we poll better. Whereas the public at least says it supports spending cuts equal to the amount we raise the debt ceiling (they say this, but I'm not sure they mean it), the public absolutely hates government shutdowns.

Shutdowns poll terribly. That's why both parties try so hard to avoid them. But Ed and Politico's GOP whisperers are kidding themselves if they think that Sen. Reid will take the blame for the next one, particularly because Ed and Politico's GOP whisperers have gone to such lengths to explicitly describe this GOP strategy and detail its benefits. That type of talk does not exactly give the impression that the GOP wants to avoid a shutdown.

I suppose I should slightly amend that previous bit: shutdowns poll terribly, except in some deep red districts. That's more truthful and it gets to the heart of the issue here. Most Republican congressmen want to avoid a shutdown because their constituents want it avoided. They're not looking to upset their constituents and that's reasonable since the alternative is a Democrat in that seat.

However, a small group of congressmen come from such solid red districts that they could threaten to close the government for months and they'd never face even the threat of electoral punishment for it. In fact, some of these districts would welcome not just the threat of a government shutdown, but an actual government shutdown. Which means their priorities are exactly opposite the priorities of most of their GOP colleagues.

Do you see where this is going? Because it is a repeat of the Plan B debacle. The Safe Republicans from solid red districts will refuse to cut a deal, even one that cuts spending, because they can survive a gov't shutdown that cuts more. Meanwhile, Republicans in unsafe districts will have to go to the Democrats to cut a deal if they want to avoid losing their seats. And any deal that depends on House Democratic support for passage will be further to the left than a deal that had received uniform Republican support.

The far right,* because it refuses to work with their Republican colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the case.

Anyway, the course has been set. All that's left is to watch this trainwreck.

*Update: Several commenters are unhappy with my use of the phrase "far right."

What I meant by that was, as I had previously written in the post, those members who are from such safe districts that they can give their GOP colleagues the middle finger on the issue of a government shutdown. Instead of "far right," it would have been better had I continued to use the phrase "conservatives" or "more conservative members." "Far right" was too antagonistic.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at 09:10 AM



Comments

1 Let it burn

Posted by: cajun carrot at January 15, 2013 09:11 AM (UZQM8)

2 Same shit, different day.

Posted by: Vizzini at January 15, 2013 09:12 AM (O7Q1u)

3 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a malignant traitor.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:13 AM (/eBe8)

4 So, apparently, are the House Republicans.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:14 AM (/eBe8)

5 Comrades, what do you mean? According to the MFM those evil conservatives are denying help to the poor peoples affected by Sandy



WASHINGTON (AP) — House conservatives opposed to more deficit spending tried Monday to chip away at the $50.7 billion Superstorm Sandy aid package
by requiring offsetting spending cuts to pay for recovery efforts and
by stripping money for projects they say are unrelated to the Oct. 29
storm or not urgently needed.
The push by budget hawks for amendments sets up a fight with Northeast lawmakers
in both parties eager to provide recovery aid for one of the worst
storms ever to strike the region as the House moves toward expected
votes Tuesday on the emergency spending package.

Posted by: TheQuietMan at January 15, 2013 09:14 AM (1Jaio)

6 Most Republican congressmen want to avoid a shutdown because their constituents want it avoided.


Most of their constituents don't have a clue what a shutdown would mean.

Posted by: cajun carrot at January 15, 2013 09:14 AM (UZQM8)

7 Let it be the left-most deal that could pass.

Posted by: Felt Wrapper at January 15, 2013 09:17 AM (ecmD4)

8 Ah, the stupid party still being stupid.

Posted by: CDR M at January 15, 2013 09:18 AM (dKV5k)

9 Gabe a nice analysis, Cajun Carrot the "shutdown" will be whatever President Giggles makes it since he controls the flow of priority in fund dispersal and priority.

The problem is he would happily refuse to pay the Military, and might even gum up the works on Social Security delivery and like an Olympic gymnast escape the blame for the pratfall.

The media, the media, the media.

That's all I have to say about that, as forrest Gump says,.

"brace for impact"

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 09:18 AM (LRFds)

10 At least moochelle's ass keeps getting bigger, that's kind of a good thing.

Posted by: Killerdog at January 15, 2013 09:19 AM (OzLmI)

11 Easy math: GOP = FAIL

It pretends to look for a hill to die on and never finds one.

Whigs ver. 2.0.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at January 15, 2013 09:19 AM (eHIJJ)

12 From the News Dump, I will re-post here:


A call for impeachment may go nowhere, but the act itself is desperately needed to arouse a demoralized and increasingly indifferent people.

Whether it's about the gun-grabbing or the unilateral action on the debt ceiling, a call for impeachment is more than warranted.

"If we do not choose a hill to die on, the left will choose a ditch for us to die in."

Shit Sefton said, Vol. 1

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 15, 2013 09:19 AM (XkWWK)

13 Night all,

I just washed the 'peoples car" Now they tell when I get back to the US I have to repaint the debt ceiling.

Damn!

Posted by: Judge_Roy_bean at January 15, 2013 09:20 AM (42wQ/)

14 Damn those conservatives. How dare they represent their constituents. If only they were like the rest of the RINOs in the Republican party, everything would be right as rain.

Posted by: Jon in TX at January 15, 2013 09:20 AM (PKRPm)

15 The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican
colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final
legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the
case.


Fuck that noise. It's funny how it's always the "far right" who refuses to work with "their Republican colleagues," and never the "Republican colleagues" who are refusing to work with the "far right."

It couldn't possibly be that we've seen this played out before innumerable times and know that the Left will never, ever compromise. If we don't force spending cuts through any means necessary, then there won't be spending cuts. And if there aren't going to be spending cuts anyway, I might as well vote for the Democrat.

At least when he raises spending (and my taxes) more of the free shit will come my way.

No. The Moderate Republicans can, for once, toe the fucking line and say, "We have come this far, and will go no further" to the Democrats instead of to the Conservatives. Why is that plan never on the table?

What is the point of electoral victory if the policies won't change?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:20 AM (/eBe8)

16 You're still an idiot gabe.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 09:20 AM (uhftQ)

17 Gabe,

The constant triangulation and game playing is exactly what has gotten us to this point. Perhaps if more GOP politicians actually voted according to the platforms they ran on this would be resolved in favor of a sane financial plan for the country.

But every time Republican pundits say things like "The far right, because it refuses to work with their Republican
colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final
legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the
case,
damages the bran, and plays into the hands of the far left.

Do you really believe that the electorate will punish the Republican party in November 2014 for a shutdown in early 2013? I don't.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 09:21 AM (GsoHv)

18 Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 09:20 AM (uhftQ)

Fuck off.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 09:22 AM (GsoHv)

19 Hey New Yorkers, if any of your .223 Saiga magazines are looking for a good home...

Posted by: GGE of the Moron Horde, NC Chapter at January 15, 2013 09:22 AM (yh0zB)

20 SiD.

Shut it Down.

Posted by: akula51 at January 15, 2013 09:24 AM (YesJa)

21 Of course they will cave.
Boehner is gutless.

Posted by: NeoKong at January 15, 2013 09:24 AM (JWLwG)

22 We already knew they were all in for the pork labeled Sandy. As for the debt ceiling I always figured they would do just like they did last time, fold like a $2 suit.

Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:24 AM (53z96)

23 The Donks and the GOP triangulate against taxpayers and reformers, not actually against each other. It's what they do; they just take turns leading the charade.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at January 15, 2013 09:24 AM (eHIJJ)

24 I'm in NY and I don't know a single person who gives a shit if the feds shut down for a few days. Does anyone?

Posted by: mugiwara at January 15, 2013 09:24 AM (W7ffl)

25
Damn those conservatives. How dare they represent their constituents.

This is a two-way street. Sure, you don't like when I tell the conservatives to work with their colleagues to avoid legislation that is further to the left than it otherwise would be.

But you also shake your fist at these other Republicans who, after all,are simply representing their constitutents that want to avoid a shutdown. As you say, "how dare they represent their constituents."

My ultimate point is that I'd like to avoid legislation like the fiscal cliff deal that could have been further to the right, if only the right had worked together.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 09:25 AM (B2LxR)

26 Repubs won't even fight for my incandescent bulbs. I'm expected to believe they are going to fight for the solvency of my country?

Posted by: Cicero Kid at January 15, 2013 09:25 AM (deKG5)

27 However, a small group of congressmen come from such solid red districts that they could threaten to close the government for months and they'd never face even the threat of electoral punishment for it. In fact, some of these districts would welcome not just the threat of a government shutdown, but an actual government shutdown.

Shut. It. Down. and Sell. It. Off.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 09:25 AM (GFM2b)

28 The "far right"?


Could you go back to putting this shit right up front so I know not to waste my time reading your crap again?

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 09:25 AM (ROv35)

29 Shorter Gabe: If it weren't for all of these Teabaggers and unhlpful hobbits the adults could come to agreement and hit the bars before 5pm.


ALL THIS IS IS DECIDING WHETHER WE WILL BE HANGED OR WHETHER WE WILL BE PUT BEFORE A FIRING SQUAD, CONSERVATIVES SHOULD HAVE NO PART IN IT!




Posted by: General Woundwort at January 15, 2013 09:26 AM (RrD4h)

30 As for the "Shutdown" being bad for anyone... no. What is much more likely (in a protracted shutdown) is that people will look around and see that their mail is still being delivered, that the Military is still on the clock, their SS checks are still coming, their Medicare is still working (entitlements are not subject to the "shut down" as they are not discretionary spending), etc., and start to ask, "So what's the big deal?"

Of course, for that to work you'd have to sustain the shutdown for (minimum) one month. And no Republican in my lifetime has had the balls to do such a thing.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:26 AM (/eBe8)

31 The GOP: Forever one more surrender from victory.

Seriously, if you're a conservative and you are still a registered Republican, you're doing it wrong.

Posted by: DrewM. at January 15, 2013 09:26 AM (x8U/s)

32 At least when he raises spending (and my taxes) more of the free shit will come my way.

Good for you. Not a penny of it will be coming my way (my fault, for not whelping a bunch of bastards instead of working and whatnot).

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at January 15, 2013 09:27 AM (ZKzrr)

33
damages the bran, and plays into the hands of the far left.
Do you really believe that the electorate will punish the Republican party in November 2014 for a shutdown in early 2013?


You're too hung up on the Republican "brand." Individual members do not care much about the brand when their own reelection is on the line. They care about what's going to get them reelected. And you better believe they will feel pressure from their constituents in 2014 if they force a shutdown in 2013. A shutdown means a series of not very good things will happen that any primary or general election challenger would be a fool not to exploit.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 09:27 AM (B2LxR)

34 Do you see where this is going? Because it is a repeat of the Plan B debacle.



The Plan B debacle, which wouldn't have made a fucking bit of difference because it would've been roundly ignored by the MFM, was brought on by Boehner being too fucking lazy and inept to have all his troops in line since early November to vote for it. That strategic dunce decided to purge people at the last moment instead of doing it earlier when nobody would've given a flying fuck. The weepy sap has been a poor excuse for a leader since day 1 and, even with the November election, he still knew who would be in place through the end of the year. The donks stay united because they wouldn't put up with anybody this hapless.

Posted by: Captain Hate at January 15, 2013 09:27 AM (5lhIT)

35
The spending cuts offered are a chimera because they largely take place in the out years and won't happen anyway. Those unreasonable "far right" Representatives are right in rejecting any deal that doesn't include real right-the-hell-now cuts in spending.

Trying to lay blame for this debacle on the unreasonableness of the "far right" is just as shrill as Obama's press conference yesterday.

Posted by: Homer at January 15, 2013 09:28 AM (tVWQB)

36 As for "blame for a shut down" I don't think there would be any big outcry from the tax payers. As a matter of fact, I don't think there was a lot of "blame" back when Newt was in and Clinton shut it down.


What we had was a MFM and no alternative to them at that time so they got to set the tone w/o any blowback.


I say S.I.D. and fuck the torpedoes, full steam ahead.

Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:28 AM (53z96)

37 Repubs won't even fight for my incandescent bulbs.

That's untrue. The House passed a couple bills last year. Known pederast Harry Reid didn't bring them up for a Senate vote.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at January 15, 2013 09:28 AM (ZKzrr)

38 But you also shake your fist at these other Republicans who, after all,are simply representing their constitutents that want to avoid a shutdown.

A four year, drunken sailor spending spree does not a Republican make. (My apologies to drunken sailors. THEY stop spending when they run out of money)

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 09:28 AM (GFM2b)

39 LiFB. There's no stopping them, the Grasshoppers are coming. And I, for one, welcome our Acrididae Overlords. The burning needs to come while I'm still strong enough to deal.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 15, 2013 09:28 AM (evdj2)

40 Wait, Tea Partiers to blame for House cave ins?

Really?

Posted by: Golan Globus at January 15, 2013 09:29 AM (/1U3u)

41 OT maybe? Instead of posting in dead thread. Here is a cartoon of Colin Powell from 1995. Somethings never change.

http://annapuna.blogspot.com/2013/01/powells-stance.html

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at January 15, 2013 09:29 AM (QidfK)

42 Not a penny of it will be coming my way (my fault, for not whelping a bunch of bastards instead of working and whatnot).

Oh, I'm sure if the Democrats had enough power, they'd find some way to help add you to the ranks of the FSA. Maybe we should try that, and then we would have that evil "far right" that causes so much apparent angst screwing things up.

Yeah, if you can't tell, I'm pissed.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:29 AM (/eBe8)

43 The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican
colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final
legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the
case.




OK Gabe since you are using the same terminology the MFM and the Dems use how about tell us what the "Far Right" is.

Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:30 AM (53z96)

44 Oh, I'm sure if the Democrats had enough power, they'd find some way to help add you to the ranks of the FSA.

I'm white, straight, and my degree is not in Wymyn's Studies. They hate me.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at January 15, 2013 09:30 AM (ZKzrr)

45 I feel like your putting my balls on the window sill and slamming the window down on them. It's kinda early in the AM to be doing that. Can't we wait till noon for gloom and doom?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 15, 2013 09:30 AM (9Bj8R)

46 Can anybody tell me why we even have a debt ceiling anymore? At this point of our assured demise, it serves no purpose because, obviously, nobody in Washington gives a damn about it. They're all consumed with media portrayals and their own reelection skins. Just remove the damned thing and let the debt soar and soar and soar. Then Granny won't have to hear another word about not getting her SS check and the R's will still lose to the media.

/what an effin joke

Posted by: Lady in Black at January 15, 2013 09:31 AM (ATdet)

47 The system is not functioning because there are in actuality three political parties gumming up the works, the democrats, a united front, the republicans, democrats who got elected as republicans, were once called conservative democrats and conservative republicans who are now demonized for their fiscal conservatism. You could almost include the democrats who follow the dictates of the president to the letter as an additional 4th party as they are out there but, ultimately, the democrats, unlike the republicans, present a united front.

The republicans are just being honest by joining the democrats to fight their conservative counterparts as they agree with the democrats as regards these individuals.

Posted by: Caustic at January 15, 2013 09:32 AM (/b8+5)

48 Obama's stash get replenished and the Republican's get the blame. Situation Normal.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 15, 2013 09:32 AM (evdj2)

49 I think we should get rid of the debt ceiling and just mint trillion dollar platinum coins.

Posted by: Golan Globus at January 15, 2013 09:32 AM (/1U3u)

50 What do you mean "once again"? Are you STILL pretending Plan B would have passed the Senate???

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 09:33 AM (TULs6)

51 A call for impeachment may go nowhere, but the act itself is desperately needed to arouse a demoralized and increasingly indifferent people.

Dude, a call for impeachment and a guv shutdown are totally gonna interrupt my flow of free shit. We cannot let this stand.


Onward to 20 trillion!!!11


Posted by: Free Shit Army at January 15, 2013 09:33 AM (UZQM8)

52 Let it Fern.

Posted by: Forest Gump at January 15, 2013 09:33 AM (gkmF0)

53 Not a penny of it will be coming my way (my fault, for not whelping a bunch of bastards instead of working and whatnot).

None my way either. I'm the last "unprotected" class that it is still legal to discriminate against.
Damn my parents for having a white, male baby!
Honestly? Fuck the FSA and their enablers.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 09:33 AM (GFM2b)

54 @19, you are cracking me up.

BTW in keeping with 19's post any AK 30 rounders or 75 round drums, Saiga 12 20 round drums from NY fellers will find a good home in Texas.

I will name them, walk them daily in air and sunshine and feed them alot!

NY fellers .. may God have mercy on your soul! You voted for this shit!

Posted by: Judge_Roy_bean at January 15, 2013 09:34 AM (42wQ/)

55 Maybe you guys are fucked, when even the moderates have their head up their ass ignoring that democrats exist while they bash the true cons for being unrealistic.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 09:34 AM (TULs6)

56 Your sibilant preezy just got through telling you there will be no negotiation on the debt ceiling, and it's the "far right" that are being uncompromising?

OK, then.

Posted by: Waterhouse at January 15, 2013 09:34 AM (q33yg)

57 This is like the election all over again. The leftist establishment wants to divide SoCons and FisCons and utterly destroy the GOP.

With the shaky ass coalition that's keeping them in power - many elements of which basically hate each other - it's really a shock that nobody within leadership on the right has the nuts to fight fire with fire.

Nobody seems to have the balls to call a liar a liar.

The real shame is a bunch of evil white dudes that wrote our evil, evil Constitution basically foresaw all of it...literally centuries ago. We've "evolved" so much over those centuries, but human nature remains...human nature.

SiD.

Posted by: akula51 at January 15, 2013 09:35 AM (YesJa)

58 Every conservative in Congress should go on TV and call Obama a "fucking liar" and scumbag…..
heh

Posted by: redguy at January 15, 2013 09:35 AM (oKH8p)

59 The far right?


Boy oh boy, not even bothering to hide the contempt at this point, are you?

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 09:35 AM (v07al)

60 There is one political party in DC. The Protect My Own Ass, Hey, You Know This Commie Stuff Is a Pretty Good Way to Do That Party.

Posted by: The Mega Independent at January 15, 2013 09:35 AM (gkmF0)

61
Excellent article.

http://tinyurl.com/cytgjx6

Posted by: maddogg at January 15, 2013 09:35 AM (OlN4e)

62 Gabriel is not alone in this characterization, but I want to point it out and correct it:

THE GOP IS NOT CAVING. THEY ARE DOING EXACTLY AS THEY INTENDED TO DO ALL ALONG.


"Caving" would entail listening to the people like us who want to look at reality and do something about it now, while we still have a choice.

This is not what they want. Any reduction in spending also means a reduction in their power, collectively and individually.

Public choice theory shows that it is highly unlikely that any political actor will give up his power without some other gain. And since there's really nobody to kick them out of office if they are not sufficiently to the right, there's very little pressure on them to do "the right thing."

So "caving" in this case would be to do what we want them to do, not doing what the democrats want to do.

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:35 AM (I2Bgm)

63 Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at January 15, 2013 09:29 AM (QidfK)
-----
Thanks Anna !

Posted by: Lurkasaurus at January 15, 2013 09:35 AM (2J7cE)

64 A "far right republican" would have been a liberal democrat a generation ago.

Posted by: Terry at January 15, 2013 09:35 AM (VvdHP)

65 Just another phrase meaning "this isn't the hill to die on".


One other thing we need to get out there. If the Republicans do freeze the debt ceiling or refuse to pass another CR there is still money to spend. The government will not automatically default and starve 90 year old widows, making them eat dog food.


They will simply have to prioritize spending. Perhaps some of that Sandy bill pork will have to be held in abeyance so they can pay interest on the debt and by dog food for grandma.

Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:36 AM (53z96)

66 "OK Gabe since you are using the same terminology the MFM and the Dems use how about tell us what the "Far Right" is.


Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:30 AM (53z96)"



I'm going to set the odds of Malor answering that question at about the same as Piers Morgan defining "assault weapon".

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 09:36 AM (ROv35)

67 Guess who the most prominent "far right" representatives of the Party have been. John McCain and Mitt Romney. You know it's true because The Donks and the MFM (BIRM) told us so. Over and over and over.

We haven't had a far right representative since Goldwater, so all this fear and angst of the "far right" in the GOP is horseshit. Complete, utter, manufactured horseshit. Yet here some of us are lamenting that a portion of the "far right" might decide to stand its ground.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at January 15, 2013 09:36 AM (eHIJJ)

68
What do you mean "once again"? Are you STILL pretending Plan B would have passed the Senate???

No, I never pretended that (although, several commenters repeatedly accused me of it). I said that it's better to start a negotiation further to the right. Unfortunately, because Plan B didn't pass, the House GOP didn't have a leg to stand on when the Senate came calling, since conservative cut the legs out from under the rest of the conference.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 09:38 AM (B2LxR)

69 Oh, I'm sure if the Democrats had enough power, they'd find some way to help add you to the ranks of the FSA.

They would. Anything to save a vagina.
(My apologies to HeatherRadish. The left sees her that way. I do NOT see her that way)

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 09:38 AM (GFM2b)

70 Lurkasaurus, hope it helps.

The chattering classes in DC depends upon people having no memory of anything more than ten years ago.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at January 15, 2013 09:38 AM (QidfK)

71 As I said the other day, Boehner amazingly is in a good position going into these negotiations because by having that dogshit "payroll tax holiday" go away, and in effect restoring the funding of social security to the level it should be at (assuming people believe in it), non high earners have had their paychecks decline and are in no fucking mood to have the JEF increase taxes at all. The problem will be, as I see it, if the light doesn't go on for him that the Indonesian is not interested in negotiations. I don't think a fucking one of the Repubs, including that asshole Romney, have been willing to call that fucking turd out on not having a concept of what to do for the economy except drive it into the shitter but is only looking for political gains. Instead they treat him like a dimwit kid who really means well, which he does not. If Boehner doesn't realize this we're completely fucked.

Posted by: Captain Hate at January 15, 2013 09:40 AM (5lhIT)

72 The chattering classes in DC depends upon people having no memory of anything more than ten years months ago.

FIFY.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:40 AM (/eBe8)

73 Now how did I know this was gonna happen?

Posted by: Laura Castellano at January 15, 2013 09:40 AM (luhCM)

74 Gabe, your "further to the right" is still a move to the left.
It's been going on my entire life.
You know how slow I am? When I first started coming here it took me about a month to figure out you were one of "them".

Posted by: teej at January 15, 2013 09:40 AM (eVZCn)

75 LiFB. There's no stopping them, the Grasshoppers are coming.

I've got some DDT for the grasshoppers. Figuratively speaking, of course.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 09:40 AM (GFM2b)

76 Malor, maybe you should go back to writing about theoretical coins.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 09:41 AM (ROv35)

77 If Boehner doesn't realize this we're completely fucked.

Breaking news: We're completely fucked.

Posted by: Vizzini at January 15, 2013 09:41 AM (O7Q1u)

78
"Republicans in unsafe districts will have to go to the Democrats to cut
a deal if they want to face electoral disaster."

So basically, Republicans aren't at fault - their bosses constituents are

Posted by: RayJ at January 15, 2013 09:42 AM (pI/IV)

79 Oh, I'm sure if the Democrats had enough power, they'd find some way to help add you to the ranks of the FSA.

I'm white, straight, and my degree is not in Wymyn's Studies. They hate me.

But you have a 'gina. That's ammo in the WoW against me, SWMNK. Single white male, no kids.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 09:43 AM (GFM2b)

80 I think it's good that Gabe is a regular blogger here. It shows us the leftmost point of view that we should sometimes seriously consider-- and at other times, ignore or poke fun at.

Anyway, Gabe is a liberal Republican, and he gives us a window into which to peer at such a creature, and perhaps understand a little about how such a beast thinks.

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:43 AM (I2Bgm)

81 I had a comment posted, but it got rejected for being too long. So allow me to paraphrase Robert DeNiro in The Untouchables concerning my response to the feckless, ball-less, corrupt sons of bitches in the Rules Committee:

I want them dead! I want their house burned to the ground! I want to go to their graves and piss on them!"

BYW, sven, thanks for the nice words on the headlines thread. I blush!

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 15, 2013 09:43 AM (zF6Iw)

82 As far as I am concerned the Republican Party has one foot on a banana peel and the other on the edge of the political abyss. They are falling for every BS thing the Democrats throw at them to destroy the Party.


They have the stupidest leadership now that they have ever had. And what is bad is they all got voted back into those positions this month.

Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:43 AM (53z96)

83 "since conservative cut the legs out from under the rest of the conference.


Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 09:38 AM (B2LxR)"



Yep, those evil conservatives.


Why the fuck I continue to rubberneck your posts and comments is as inexplicable as why you're allowed to post here.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 09:43 AM (ROv35)

84
The chattering classes in DC depends upon people having no memory of anything more than ten years months ago.

What are you talking about? We've always been at war with Eurasia.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 09:43 AM (TULs6)

85 Any game plan that hinges upon a flash of insight from Weeping Boehner is a plan doomed to magnificent, explosive failure.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 09:43 AM (v07al)

86 Pollywogette- if you're around- check your mail.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:44 AM (/eBe8)

87 Those anti-pork Republicans who would rather shut down the government than keep borrowing against my child's credit are THE ONLY PEOPLE IN WASHINGTON WHO DESERVE TO BE REELECTED.
Spare me the "long game" routine. I've been hearing it from accomplice Republicans for twenty-five years.

Posted by: Sam In VA at January 15, 2013 09:44 AM (rFiOs)

88 Republicans in unsafe districts will have to go to the Democrats to cut
a deal if they want to face electoral disaster.




After that last disaster of an election I don't think there are any Republicans left in "unsafe districts".

Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:45 AM (53z96)

89
since conservative cut the legs out from under the rest of the conference.

Deep in the koolaid of Parlimentarian proceduralism. In no sane world would that teacup tempest amount to squat. Fortunately, we don't live in a sane world.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 09:45 AM (TULs6)

90 This is not a correct analysis. There are more solid red districts than lighter red ones. Remember the big shift in 2010? Only 15 percent of Congressional seats changed parties. The other 85 percent were solid red or solid blue.

What deep-red district Congressmen might fear is the primaries, with the TEA Party so active. Might be easy to run to the right of a Republican if he's caught compromising with the Democrats.

However, I haven't seen that much electoral competence by TEA Party candidates, so if I were a solid red Congressman, I wouldn't fear them that much.

Posted by: Michael Rittenhouse at January 15, 2013 09:45 AM (2Oas0)

91
Anyway, Gabe is a liberal Republican, and he gives us a window into which to peer at such a creature, and perhaps understand a little about how such a beast thinks.

No, I'm a Republican that wants to cut spending, lower taxes, and win back the Senate in 2014. I am not a Republican that enjoys watching the Democrats takeourcongresscrittersto the woodshedevery couple of months.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 09:45 AM (B2LxR)

92 All these congressmen will be adorning lamp posts in the future. The neo-Jacobins will not discriminate.

Posted by: @PurpAv at January 15, 2013 09:45 AM (BNacf)

93
The House GOP Is Ready To Cave on Sandy Pork . . . And The Debt Ceiling




"I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here!"

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at January 15, 2013 09:46 AM (kdS6q)

94 >>>The House GOP Is Ready To Cave on Sandy Pork . . . And The Debt Ceiling<<<<
Well of course they will dahrling.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at January 15, 2013 09:46 AM (p/cQy)

95 This post is kind of like a stock broker who has lost half of your investment money telling you "just wait a little longer, it'll work out in the long run guaranteed!"


At a certain point you have to realize the poor fellow is delusional and walk away. >_>

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 09:46 AM (v07al)

96
Republicans in unsafe districts will have to go to the Democrats to cut
a deal if they want to face electoral disaster.


That is and will remain the case. There is no deal with the Senate and the President, there is no deal without Democrats. They were always going to have to go to democrats to cut a deal. Always. There's no scenario that has enough Republicans.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 09:47 AM (TULs6)

97 "Anyway, Gabe is a liberal Republican, and he gives us a window into which to peer at such a creature, and perhaps understand a little about how such a beast thinks.


Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:43 AM (I2Bgm)"



It's nothing we don't already know. He thinks he's playing some sort of 11 dimensional chess, while the left is dragging him behind a truck by a slinky.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 09:47 AM (ROv35)

98 Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:20 AM (/eBe


*waves paw imperially* Presume I said that. Hell, that contains more profanity than what I was typing so I'm going to go with that version instead of mine.


This seems, to me, to be skipping past the immediate problem


We are in this current mess because every immediate problem has been kicked down the road. Every single one.

Guess what? The job of a Congresscritter is not to get reelected. It's not to bring home pork to its district. It is to do what is best for the country. If what is best for the country is saying no, no more debt, no more buying our own bonds, no more pretending that Math will not win in the end, then that is what should be done.

Oh, that's unrealistic? That's impossible? That is just not how the game is played? Reality will not give a shit when, not if, when everything comes crashing down. If the Republican party is not willing to stand up and scream stop, then the Republican party deserves to be destroyed.


This isn't a game. This isn't about Team Red and Team Blue. This isn't about what does and doesn't poll well. This about the future of our country. If it makes me a member of the far right to say that we cannot and should not engage in the future debt slavery of this country's children and grandchildren, so be it. So be it.



Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 09:47 AM (VtjlW)

99 I expect the Media-protected Democrats to get everything they want, and the Media-denied Republicans to do everything they can to make the Media like them. The American people? Pfft, which channel do they run, again?

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at January 15, 2013 09:48 AM (DuH+r)

100 No, I'm a Republican that wants to cut spending, lower taxes, and win back the Senate in 2014. I am not a Republican that enjoys watching the Democrats takeourcongresscrittersto the woodshedevery couple of months.


There are ways to beat the democrats; none of them have to do with comparative voting records.

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:48 AM (I2Bgm)

101
No, I'm a Republican that wants to cut spending, lower taxes, and win back the Senate in 2014. I am not a Republican that enjoys watching the Democrats takeourcongresscrittersto the woodshedevery couple of months.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 09:45 AM (B2LxR)

(A. Pixy strikes again. (B. Sir, nothing less that total obstinancy has any chance of victory at this point in the game. It's either LiB or hit the emergency brake, it cannot be something where we continue to negotiate in good faith, because the Dems are surely not.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 09:48 AM (v07al)

102 No, I'm a Republican that wants to cut spending, lower taxes, and win back the Senate in 2014

In other words, you're "far right".

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 09:48 AM (GQ8sn)

103 Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 09:27 AM (B2LxR)

I am concerned with the "Brand," because I don't fool myself that a viable third party will have any influence for a generation (at least). For better or for worse, the Republican party is what we have.

The fact is, if the Republicans stood together and forced a shutdown, Obama would make significant short-term political gains. But will those translate to electoral success in November 2014, if the Republicans can show that the spending cuts were as a result of their unity?

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 09:48 AM (GsoHv)

104 "The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican
colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final
legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the
case."

Shorter Gabe: I don't like it when people with principles show me and the rest of the RINOs as the spineless sacless jellyfish we are.

I'm surprised you can take time from your chain-licking to post on this blog.

Posted by: SDN at January 15, 2013 09:49 AM (mZJ8q)

105 Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate: "At a certain point you have to realize the poor fellow is delusional a GD crook and walk away. >_>"

Edited for the current reality.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at January 15, 2013 09:49 AM (eHIJJ)

106 Guess what? The job of a Congresscritter is not to get reelected. It's not to bring home pork to its district. It is to do what is best for the country. If what is best for the country is saying no, no more debt, no more buying our own bonds, no more pretending that Math will not win in the end, then that is what should be done.


Alex, the problem is that this is exactly what their job is- to continue the gravy train for themselves.

If they were judged on their help or hindrance to our country's fortunes, they would damn well all be conservatives and damn well have fixed the problems.

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:50 AM (I2Bgm)

107 Never let a crisis go to waste. Especially the fat, jiggly parts.

Posted by: Rahm Christie at January 15, 2013 09:50 AM (7h5MH)

108 The hill to die on is always the next one.

Let's face the real truth-- the problem with the GOP is not that they fear losing the debate, it's that they really don't want smaller government or any of the things that go with it. A big wing of the party are just Democrats that want taxes low.

Posted by: zsasz at January 15, 2013 09:52 AM (RDP+N)

109 Anyway. I like Gabe's posts.

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:52 AM (I2Bgm)

110 Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 09:47 AM (VtjlW)

Pretty sure you just gave me a stiffy.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at January 15, 2013 09:52 AM (p/cQy)

111 They were always going to have to go to democrats to cut a deal. Always. There's no scenario that has enough Republicans.

True, but false.

If you actually go with a "Government Shutdown" (which isn't), then it will only take a few weeks for people to realize that they're still getting their free crap, and that the "shutdown" doesn't actually affect them.

Then, it's up to the Democrats to explain exactly why they want all this spending. The burden shifts from us ("why do you want to cut police, firefighters, and teachers!?") to them ("What am I getting for my money, exactly?"). They'll still win the negotiation, but they'll win it less. Right now they have no reason to negotiate, because we've shown that we're completely unwilling to use any weapon at our disposal.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (/eBe8)

112 What is the point of electoral victory if the policies won't change?
Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:20 AM (/eBe


What AllenG said. I can't say it any more succinctly, and my response would contain a helluva lot more invocations of "cocksuckers" and "motherfuckers."

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (4df7R)

113 GOP, the French of American politics. They are good a caving and giving up without a fight.

Posted by: Dave in Houston at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (wB5dd)

114 The American public can't remember anything that happened more than two weeks ago.

Given that, why would the Republicans face massive electoral defeats a year and half after a hypothetical shutdown? I mean, that's assuming people would be even be pissed that the feds shutdown, I've yet to meet a single person who thinks this would affect them in any way.

Posted by: mugiwara at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (W7ffl)

115 alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy@98,

Exactly. Either you believe the reality that is facing us and act like a sane, responsible person would or you're a fool of historic measure. Pick a path.

And make it quick because time is not a friend.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (eHIJJ)

116 So, "getting reelected" ought to be the number one concern of every Republican. So that he can go back into Congress and work on his next reelection. And the one after that.

Duly noted. Good grief, what a party.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (DuH+r)

117 The fact is, if the Republicans stood together and forced a shutdown, Obama would make significant short-term political gains.


How can he make any more political gains? He alr4ady own totally the FSA and thre MFM, 90% of the Jews, and 9o% of the rich.


The only thing he doesn't own now is that "far right" who Gabe seems to hate.

Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (53z96)

118 108 The hill to die on is always the next one.

Let's face the real truth-- the problem with the GOP is not that they fear losing the debate, it's that they really don't want smaller government or any of the things that go with it. A big wing of the party are just Democrats that want taxes low.


Public choice theory predicts it

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (I2Bgm)

119 Posts 98-103 were exceptionally good by nailing the root of the problem which seems to completely elude Malor.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (ROv35)

120 The final resting place of three American service members has been finally found. The J2F Duck was part of a rescue mission to locate a crashed B-17 when it went down in white out conditions in Greenland.

http://tinyurl.com/ahycu2b

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at January 15, 2013 09:54 AM (QidfK)

121 This idea that there's a small cabal of idiot conservatives holding the GOP back from victory is undermined by a few inconvenient facts....

1- According to the Politico piece, "GOP officials said more than half of their members are prepared to allow
default unless Obama agrees to dramatic cuts he has repeatedly said he
opposes."

2- There wouldn't be a GOP majority in the House without those whacky conservative troublemakers.

3- Cathy McMorris Rodgers in the Politico story is a Boehner loyalist. He helped her beat conservative favorite Tom Price for the number 4 spot in the GOP leadership.



Posted by: DrewM. at January 15, 2013 09:54 AM (x8U/s)

122 I am not a Republican that enjoys watching the Democrats take our congresscritters to the woodshed every couple of months.

Then tell the critters to take back their balls from the jar in the fridge, grow a apine, and fight. Contrary to popular belief, there ARE hills worthy of dying on.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 09:54 AM (GFM2b)

123 Everyone acts like the GOP politicians do not want big government, big spending. They do want it, at least most do. That is their power.

The GOP only plays lip-service to their base. DEMS and PUBS are the same. Remember what the GOP did when they led all three branches?

Posted by: Mekan at January 15, 2013 09:54 AM (hm8tW)

124 And, BTW, I dislike jumping on Gabe, but - The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the case.

What "compromise?" Preezy Smails has already thrown down the gauntlet of "you'll get nothing and like it!" A compromise would mean that the party of pedophiles, dog-fuckers and murderers give somewhat in order to reach an agreement. You're asking the "far right" (which is what, exactly? Please define your term, would you?)to compromise with RINOs interested only in placating their Democrat masters. Fuck that.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 15, 2013 09:54 AM (zF6Iw)

125 The only thing the squish'n'cave GOP set is accomplishing here is to negate any incentive for conservatives to bother voting for them in 2014.
You folks have funtrying to getelected on the support of liberal republicans.

Posted by: Sam In VA at January 15, 2013 09:54 AM (rFiOs)

126 116 So, "getting reelected" ought to be the number one concern of every Republican. So that he can go back into Congress and work on his next reelection. And the one after that.

Duly noted. Good grief, what a party.



Politicians are not exceptional at governing; they are only exceptional at getting elected. That's a paraphrase of H.L. Mencken and as true today as it was then.

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:55 AM (I2Bgm)

127 Our best hope: that obama overplays his hand, which he is bound to do.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 15, 2013 09:56 AM (9Bj8R)

128 This isn't a game. This isn't about Team Red and
Team Blue. This isn't about what does and doesn't poll well. This
about the future of our country. If it makes me a member of the far
right to say that we cannot and should not engage in the future debt
slavery of this country's children and grandchildren, so be it. So be
it.









Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 09:47 AM (VtjlW)


See, this is how I would prefer to start my mornings, instead of being told I'm an idiotic Far Right Winger. (I take that as a compliment btw)

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 09:56 AM (da5Wo)

129

Seems to me that a lot of these DC chumps said the last deal was good because now we were playing on our home turf, and yet now the story is the other guys have all the advantage, we must retreat for better footing.

Again.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at January 15, 2013 09:56 AM (p/cQy)

130 It's a crying shame that Gabe's "far right" are the only people who revere and govern by any principles anywhere near the Constitution's.

Yes, America, by constitution and Constitution, is too far right for Americans and their representatives.

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 09:57 AM (I2Bgm)

131 "No, I'm a Republican..."
Yup. You and Colin Powell"

Posted by: teej at January 15, 2013 09:57 AM (+8t8s)

132 98 AlexTheChick,

The enslavement of my child and potential grandchildren's economic potential is no less worthy a cause for vigilant use of my vote than slavery of the African-American was in my great great grandfather's day.

Lord knows I have posted here often enough that you know even as a Friedman school economics Republican I counseled backing McCain and Romney full bore to halt the closest thing to a Marxist this nation ever nominated in modern times.

Gabe when I said "nice analysis" I was thanking you for your honest appraisal as a New EUtopian "conservative."

If the best you can offer me is 85% tyranny then it is perhaps time to move as many of my people as I can to the back of the car before the train hits the wall and save as many as I can.

How long 'til you explain politely that I have to embrace New York's idiotic 7 shot mag rule on the federal level as "the only sane option?"

You write well Gabe, and you present your viewpoint ably. I'd perhaps in your shoes try to get a job at Al-Wa-Po or possibly Al-NYT you are just the type of "rabid right winger" they'd love to have as a "voice of Republican balance" in the op/ed section.

I happen to think you will serve the GOP well.

I just won't be a member.

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 09:58 AM (LRFds)

133 yeah Im tired of this play nice shit. If we had guys capable of advancing a conservative fucking agenda I would be more inclined to play along, but these fucking guys are almost as addicted to spending as the clusterfuck democrats.

Posted by: gigg at January 15, 2013 09:58 AM (41VCE)

134 We are in this current mess because every immediate problem has been kicked down the road. Every single one.

Guess what? The job of a Congresscritter is not to get reelected. It's not to bring home pork to its district. It is to do what is best for the country. If what is best for the country is saying no, no more debt, no more buying our own bonds, no more pretending that Math will not win in the end, then that is what should be done.

Oh, that's unrealistic? That's impossible? That is just not how the game is played? Reality will not give a shit when, not if, when everything comes crashing down. If the Republican party is not willing to stand up and scream stop, then the Republican party deserves to be destroyed.


This isn't a game. This isn't about Team Red and Team Blue. This isn't about what does and doesn't poll well. This about the future of our country. If it makes me a member of the far right to say that we cannot and should not engage in the future debt slavery of this country's children and grandchildren, so be it. So be it.


Cut. Print. Bronze this. Install spotlights on it!

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 09:58 AM (GFM2b)

135 Instead of saving their obstructionism for the CR, they should dig in their heels and practice. Give no ground. Look what Walker faced in WI. Sure he later said he regretted how ugly it got and maybe he could have been nicer about it. But who is he kidding? He beat the commies' asses. Romney/Ryan couldn't even carry the state. Conservatism always wins. No one looks at DC living fat off the land and feels bad when their open bar gets shut down. Bus in the hippies. Let's roll.

Posted by: Tattoo De Plane at January 15, 2013 09:58 AM (7h5MH)

136 Hey Malor, are you going to define "far right"?

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 09:58 AM (ROv35)

137
Gabe,
My concern of course is that when you look at the "Moderate Republicans" busy trying to avoid a shutdown, most of them are just engaging in bread and circuses for their constituents.

Listen, I get that you have to represent your constituents, that does not mean bribing them with highway funding, military contracts to local corperations, whatever. There's a balance that's supposed to take place between giving your constituents wht they want, and giving the country as a whole what it needs to survive (since persumably your constituents don't want the collapse of government.) Representitives are supposed to be able to balance the competing claims morons voting for them make (i.e. "More free stuff! And Lower Taxes!")
Having said that if we agree that the level of deficit we're running is bad for the country as a whole, siding with democrats to reduce spending in such a way that doesn't actually solve any problem but rather merely provides some wall paper to "give the constituents what they asked for" (in a sort of lawyerly way, you gave them "cuts" the exact meaning of what they asked for, not the intent of their asking: budget stability, but I digress) you have not represented your consituents very well. Sure you may have managed a short term (bread and Circus) style pandering, but all while destroying their long term interests. And for what? To stay in power.

So it seems slightly odd to say that "the far right" should work with "moderates." Both groups should be looking for a solution that signficantly cuts deficits getting the government on the road to sane spending. (Democrats should, in theory too, but they just want power.) If "the far right" is going to compromise, why should it not be that they ask only for what's needed to accomplish that goal (rather than the significantly more cuts I suspsect many of them would like.) Of course that won't be seen as "compromise" because for some odd reason the impossible goal of no cuts is set up as the other extreme option, and so "mild cuts" ends up being the compromise. (which BTW Gabe is exactly what you sound like.)

Posted by: tsrblke at January 15, 2013 09:59 AM (GaqMa)

138
The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican colleagues on a compromise...




"Oh, wicked, bad, naughty, evil Zoot!"

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at January 15, 2013 09:59 AM (kdS6q)

139
The Republicans in Congress are like that friend you've known forever and is a good friend and he seems like a great guy but never manages to have a girlfriend because no matter who the girl is, she's not quite the right one.

You know, sharp elbows- whatever.

and then one day- he comes out as gay.


The Reps never can find the right time to stand on principle for the good of the nation-


one day they will come out as gay. i.e.. Progressive Dims in Rep clothing.

Posted by: naturalfake at January 15, 2013 09:59 AM (UgFxe)

140 Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 09:53 AM (53z96)

"Short-term," as in: transient...ultimately unimportant.

My point is that I do not give a rat's ass that Obama's polling numbers go up for a few months while the Republicans' go down. All that matters is electoral success in 2014 and 2016, and I am not convinced that refusing to increase the debt limit will hurt the Republican party in those elections.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 09:59 AM (GsoHv)

141 With the electorate the way it currently is, we aren't going to get the smaller government we desire. Move to a red state. The FSA won't ever get the memo.

Romney got a higher percentage of the white vote than Reagan in 1980. The electorate has been permanently changed, and as much as we hate it, small government conservatism is no longer even close to a majority of the dolts who vote in presidential years.

Solution? Move to a red state and push your leaders to fight for the 10th Amendment. Between the corrupt media and the terminally stupid FSA it's just not possible to get what we want done. I cant fault pragmatists for attempting to drag things as far right as they can.

Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 09:59 AM (CBCxo)

142
OT/ Just like to report that we received our first paycheck, and this middle class person in MD, is now $250 a month poorer, isn't that special.
Hey, I thought Obummer said I wouldn't be taxes, O my garsh did he lie...

Posted by: spypeach at January 15, 2013 10:00 AM (pwTow)

143 Well put Sven.

Posted by: gigg at January 15, 2013 10:00 AM (41VCE)

144 This isn't a game. This isn't about Team Red and Team Blue. This isn't about what does and doesn't poll well. This about the future of our country. If it makes me a member of the far right to say that we cannot and should not engage in the future debt slavery of this country's children and grandchildren, so be it. So be it.
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 09:47 AM (VtjlW)


AtC, have I mentioned lately that I have a serious girl!crush on you? Because yeah, I totally do.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:00 AM (4df7R)

145 You're asking the "far right" (which is what, exactly? Please define your term, would you?)

Centrist: Stalin
Far right: Hitler

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at January 15, 2013 10:00 AM (ZKzrr)

146 "See, this is how I would prefer to start my
mornings..."

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 09:56 AM (da5Wo)

That's because you are boring.

This is how I like to start my mornings.......

http://tinyurl.com/ayeg63y

NSFW

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 10:02 AM (GsoHv)

147 We're not watching the train-wreck, we're in the train-wreck... and Casey Jones is stokin' the boiler.

Posted by: The sound of battle in the distance at January 15, 2013 10:02 AM (z6z3v)

148 So, "getting reelected" ought to be the number one concern of every Republican. So that he can go back into Congress and work on his next reelection. And the one after that.

That makes them Obama Right. Hell of an aspiration.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 10:02 AM (GFM2b)

149 OT/ Just like to report that we received our first paycheck, and this
middle class person in MD, is now $250 a month poorer, isn't that
special.


I calculated my 2013 Obama tax hike to be the equivalent of five car payments.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at January 15, 2013 10:02 AM (ZKzrr)

150 With that said, I completely agree with CBD, a shutdown now will be old news by the time 2014 rolls around, I cant see it having much impact, especially b/c the midterm electorate is going to be more GOP friendly anyway.

Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 10:03 AM (CBCxo)

151
146
"See, this is how I would prefer to start my

mornings..."

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 09:56 AM (da5Wo)

--------------------------

That's because you are boring.

This is how I like to start my mornings.......

http://tinyurl.com/ayeg63y

NSFW




Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 10:02 AM (GsoHv)


Quality, but anyone that describes starting their morning with Dear Leader as boring, hasn't been paying attention.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:03 AM (da5Wo)

152 I got a slightly over 2% pay raise this year (hey, I'm not knocking it, I know some people didn't get any). When I got notification of that, I told my wife: "Well, the good news is that, after the Payroll Tax increase, we should just about break even."

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 10:04 AM (/eBe8)

153 Can someone please explain to me how the American public that has no attention span is going to be angry at the GOP in Novenber 2014 over something they did in early 2013? Something that most people rather agree with no less?

Posted by: mugiwara at January 15, 2013 10:04 AM (W7ffl)

154 I'm going to say it...



AtC for Congress.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:04 AM (GQ8sn)

155 29 Shorter Gabe: If it weren't for all of these Teabaggers and unhlpful hobbits the adults could come to agreement and hit the bars before 5pm.


ALL THIS IS IS DECIDING WHETHER WE WILL BE HANGED OR WHETHER WE WILL BE PUT BEFORE A FIRING SQUAD, CONSERVATIVES SHOULD HAVE NO PART IN IT!

Posted by: General Woundwort at January 15, 2013 09:26 AM (RrD4h)


Firing squad? No guns! (SFX of gallows trap door) Uh oh...

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 15, 2013 10:04 AM (XkWWK)

156 I think the we (republicans) might take some bumps in the midterm, but if we stick to our fiscal guns we will be a stronger more principled party. Democrats did not get such a strong dedicated base by caving and fucking giving up on there insane principles. Our principles are sane, valid and always fucking work. If we just stick to them we will be better off.

Posted by: gigg at January 15, 2013 10:05 AM (41VCE)

157 I thought I accidentally logged on to Dem. Underground. His "blame the tearorists" rant would fit in perfectly there.

Posted by: yinzer at January 15, 2013 10:05 AM (/Mla1)

158 Maybe if leadership didn't take every opportunity to sell out conservatives they might be able to come up with something that the whole GOP caucus could support. Let the whole goddamned thing burn. the American people opted for nation suicide the moment they reelected Obama.

Posted by: we are so screwed, deliver us oh SMOD at January 15, 2013 10:05 AM (HEa5q)

159 with their Republican colleagues on a compromise...

"Oh, wicked, bad, naughty, evil Zoot!"


ISWYDT. Bravo.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 10:06 AM (GFM2b)

160 Can someone please explain to me how the American public that has no
attention span is going to be angry at the GOP in Novenber 2014 over
something they did in early 2013?


Because shut up, that's why.

We can't even test the premises anymore, we just have to "accept" that "conservatism is dead." Never mind that Conservatism hasn't been tried since 1987, at the latest.

Wait. Yes it has. In Texas, and Oklahoma, and other Red States. And how do their economies and fiscal situations compare to the Nation as a whole, or to the Blue States, again?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 10:06 AM (/eBe8)

161 Unexpectedly? Where's the Unexpectedly?!

Oh, right, this is ACE. Thought I was on MSNBC for a moment there.

Posted by: Not Ready to Unsock at January 15, 2013 10:06 AM (1FLBb)

162 James O'keefe exposing the journalist scumbags at the Journal-News:

http://tinyurl.com/byroex6

Hypocrisy, how does it work again?

Posted by: Witchfinder at January 15, 2013 10:06 AM (s/PhC)

163 Or Business Insider, or Wall Street Journal, or NYT, or WaPo, HuffPo, Little Green Fagballs, etc. etc. etc.

Posted by: Not Ready to Unsock at January 15, 2013 10:07 AM (1FLBb)

164 "Moderate" is just another term for liberal. It is another PR scheme dreamed up by the MFM. A Republican with an ACU rating of 40 is a "Moderate". A Democrat with a 15 ACU rating is a "Moderate". Don't look for any Democrats with an ACU rating much higher than 15. That great "Moderate" that everyone raves about, Lieberman, had a 20 and a 15 lifetime.


So any time you hear about a "moderate" Republican think Democrat with an "R" after his name.

Posted by: Vic at January 15, 2013 10:07 AM (53z96)

165 I calculated my 2013 Obama tax hike to be the equivalent of five car payments.
Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at January 15, 2013 10:02 AM (ZKzrr)I was just telling that to my mother, that basically that was almost a car payment a month. Wonder if I senda letter to Obummer if he'll pay off my car, oh and maybe magically get my house to beworth more than the mortgage...On second thought I'll just tell him to SMD

Posted by: spypeach at January 15, 2013 10:08 AM (pwTow)

166 Hypocrisy, how does it work again?
Posted by: Witchfinder at January 15, 2013 10:06 AM (s/PhC)
---

We need to ban guns. Please excuse me while I holster my concealed carry piece.

Posted by: Diane Fuckstein at January 15, 2013 10:08 AM (1FLBb)

167 Veritas video reporter James O’Keefe has released a new video of his team posing as an anti-gun group promoting an initiative to journalists.

At each home, the group dubbed as “Citizens Against Senseless Violence” asks each homeowner if they are willing to put up a “Gun Free” sign in their yard.

O’Keefe primarily focuses his efforts on employees of the Journal-News – the New York newspaper that published a controversial map of registered gun owners online.

Armed security welcomes the Veritas team at some of the homes, hired by some of the newspaper’s employees to protect them after bloggers retaliated by posting their names and addresses online.

Armed guards for me but not for thee: democratic meme

From Weasel Zippers

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 15, 2013 10:08 AM (9Bj8R)

168 Can someone please explain to me how the American public that has no attention span is going to be angry at the GOP in Novenber 2014 over something they did in early 2013? Something that most people rather agree with no less?
Posted by: mugiwara at January 15, 2013 10:04 AM (W7ffl)


Further, could someone explain to ME what policy positions these "moderate republicans" campaigned on during the last election cycle? What did they actually tell their constituents they would do if they got elected? How many of them said they'd "fight for spending cuts" or "fight to bring down the debt"? Seriously, how many? Because I can guarantee you there are more republicans who DIDcampaign on those policies than those who DIDN'T. If that's what your constituents elected you to do, then DO IT.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:08 AM (4df7R)

169 James O'keefe exposing the journalist scumbags at the Journal-News:



http://tinyurl.com/byroex6



Hypocrisy, how does it work again?


He's fucking awesome. We need more people like him who still have a pair of balls.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:08 AM (GQ8sn)

170 IIRC the government was shut down several times when Reagan was president and it forced the Dems to the table.

In any case, the government shuts down every weekend and federal holiday (excluding the military and security services) with not ill effects.

SID, LIB.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 15, 2013 10:08 AM (XkWWK)

171 Fuck off.
Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo
-------------------------------------
You first

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:09 AM (uhftQ)

172 again, pixy loves my spaces, I'm going to have to make them less scrumptious.

Posted by: spypeach at January 15, 2013 10:09 AM (pwTow)

173
1. 'Far Right' repubs refuse to raise debt limit and increase spending.
2. 'Moderate' repubs then make a deal with dems.
3. Debt Limit rises and spending increases.
4. Gabe blames 'far right' repubs for debt limit and spending increase.

Got it.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at January 15, 2013 10:10 AM (p/cQy)

174 The question is moot. Wait ... what year is this?

Posted by: mayan calendar at January 15, 2013 10:10 AM (evdj2)

175 168, I can explain that. Many people think its 2 PARTIES, Dems and repubs.

Its one party the flip side of the same coin. A party of professional paid off politicians.

I think the tea party is real, they have not been sucked in yet.

Posted by: Judge_Roy_bean at January 15, 2013 10:11 AM (42wQ/)

176 CharlieBrown'sDildo, upset I spoke the truth about your boyfriend?

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:11 AM (uhftQ)

177 160: Thats my point, we have total control of 24 states, and the Governor's seat in an additional 6. Until Barry is gone, the states are the place to get conservative ideas implemented.

The good thing about Obama's army of imbeciles is they are too functionally retarded to decipher ballots that don't have "Obama" on them, and thus dont vote in anything but presidential elections. Thats how we built this massive state and local advantage. The obama coalition is obama specific, and until he's gone dont expect much out of DC.

Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 10:11 AM (CBCxo)

178 GOP=NHL

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at January 15, 2013 10:12 AM (wbmaj)

179 The question is moot. Wait ... what year is this?

Posted by: mayan calendar at January 15, 2013 10:10 AM (evdj2)


Thanks for coming. Be sure to pick up your gift bag on the way out.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:12 AM (GQ8sn)

180 Oh, OT: Joe Kennedy III just busted out over the weekend saying he's going to make coming after your guns a high priority.

Posted by: Truman North at January 15, 2013 10:12 AM (I2Bgm)

181 Posted by: Witchfinder at January 15, 2013 10:06 AM (s/PhC)

Fantastic!

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 10:12 AM (GsoHv)

182 "The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the case."

This argument is used each and every time, and, frankly, it's getting tiresome.

Most of the time, the conservatives go along, and each time the legislation is STILL to the left. It ALWAYS moves to the left, so what difference does it makes if it moves a little or a lot?

So because they wouldn't support 'Plan B', we got what we got, right? Plan B was somewhat to the left, while what we got was 'more to the left' (somehow. I don't know how, you just throw out these statements with no references).

Posted by: blindside at January 15, 2013 10:13 AM (x7g7t)

183 This one is so easy:

When going back to training camp each fall, I had to run a 1/2 mile in under 150 seconds, rest 10 minutes and then run a quarter mile in under 60 seconds.

I puked every year.

What do these flabby fucksticks have to do when they return to congress? Get their balls tickled by an intern and then pick some of the choice morsels off of the capitol buffet.

The fucking job is too attractive. It's too fecking cushy. It's too easy. It needs to be more, oh, Japanese maybe. You know, Tai Chi every morning at 4:30 am. Fitness testing every year, with immediate dismissal for failure.

Get these old, fucking scrotums with teeth out of there and get some MOH winners in there. Oh wait. MOH Winner is a hard job. And normally you have to die to get it. Funny thing, it doesn't pay as well as these moldy cheese, tennis ball walker, mutherfuckers get paid either.

Can't shut these icons of efficiency down. No way. They're holding this fragile economy together. Why hell, I'll bet Pat Leahy thwarted a Chinese takeover between movie cameos.

Goddam!!! Throw a 55 gallon drum of Ortho Bug Destroyer Super Killer Fogger into the Rotunda and be fucking done with it.

Posted by: Opus An Arcus at January 15, 2013 10:13 AM (m14S3)

184 160 Allen G,

Average Joe will make a drive by any second and explain that the prosperity in the ArkLaTex is from federal handouts and that Michigan, Pennsylvania, New York, Illinois, and California are the engine of the national economy.

I'll make about twelve posts of various forms of pointing out the flaw in in AJ's "mehtods" get frustrated dropn about six "fuck yous" run my post count up about 40 with just Joe, AlextheChick will break out Stompy boots, Allen G will post something somewhere in the negative zone, Vic will point out the GOP is held hostage by the moderate wing, and the GOP will wind up caving to Obama or allowing him to create wholecloth a brand new power.

Anyone who thinks the Democrats look at the red States and see anything other than a piggy bank are refusing to reason through that they are not able to be swayed or reached anymore because they are media thralls.

Texas SHOWED them a recovery within this dpression and they simply want to spread the rot to Texas.


RUN RED, keep the red red and if need be foster a new nation.

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 10:13 AM (LRFds)

185 Posted by: Guy Mohawk at January 15, 2013 10:10 AM (p/cQy)

Ah, but instead of the ratchet going five notches to the left, it only went four notches left!

That would be the same kind of "victory" as a "spending cut" that increases spending by only nine percent annually instead of ten percent.

Posted by: Waterhouse at January 15, 2013 10:13 AM (q33yg)

186 The obama coalition is obama specific, and until he's gone dont expect much out of DC.

I would love not to get much out of DC. Instead, I'm afraid we're going to get quite a bit. Hard. Without lube.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 10:14 AM (/eBe8)

187 Spot-on, Gabe. If the GOP's goal is to win hearts and minds via a govt shutdown they're delusional. All this oh so principled true con foot stomping does nothing but advance Barack/Reid/Pelosi's agenda. Instead of Plan B we got Plan F for Failure. Moving on, Re Sandy, it simply doesn't work as a political strategy to use this bill to force spending cuts, however they should demand unrelated pork be excised. We should go after Dems every hour of every day on how they squander tax dollars via DISCRETIONARY spending. Get those taxpayers/Obama voters who are angry because they just had their taxes increased angry about the waste they're paying for.

Posted by: danishova at January 15, 2013 10:15 AM (twzzy)

188 Yeah "far right" is about ad helpful as "extreme pro-lifers" is.

Posted by: Y-not on the phone at January 15, 2013 10:15 AM (5H6zj)

189 With that said, I completely agree with CBD, a shutdown now will be old news by the time 2014 rolls around, I cant see it having much impact, especially b/c the midterm electorate is going to be more GOP friendly anyway.
Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 10:03 AM (CBCxo)


I disagree, if only because the JEF's MO would be to shut off all the goodies for his FSA first, then would be able to run on a platform of "remember how those racist Rethuglicans voted to starve you?"

And Gabe, in the interest of full disclosure, would you please define "far right?" Because, at the moment, it seems your definition means only "somebody who doesn't agree John Boehner is the shiznit."

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 15, 2013 10:16 AM (zF6Iw)

190
Iconcede that my use of the phrase "far right" was too antagonistic. I should have simply used "conservatives," as I did earlier in the post,or perhaps "more conservative members" to simply mean those congressfolks in districts safe enough that they can give the middle finger to their GOP colleagues.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:16 AM (B2LxR)

191 170 In any case, the government shuts down every weekend and federal holiday (excluding the military and security services) with not ill effects.

Someone in the media should be screaming this at the top of their lungs. Bolling? Gutfield? Guilfoyle?

Bueller?

SiD

Posted by: akula51 at January 15, 2013 10:16 AM (YesJa)

192
Hypocrisy, how does it work again?

Posted by: Witchfinder at January 15, 2013 10:06 AM (s/PhC)
----

Heh posting "I do need to pull the fade" and then not being able to putter around the house getting your files ready to go out and posting anyway.

No they do not see any hypocrisy b/c they never were engaged in an exercise of ethical politics friend they are at war.

Time for the Conservatives to accept that we are at war, and to quit bargaining with the 85% devil.

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 10:16 AM (LRFds)

193 To add to this: First you're upset because the leadership is going to pass the pork-laden Sandy bill (racking up more debt), then you're upset because conservatives won't go along on a debt ceiling bill and will risk a shutdown which 'polls terribly.'

Enough of the polls. We aren't a Democracy that goes in what ever direction the 'polls' say it should.

Shut the government down and people might actually see that, gosh, we don't need this big-ass Federal government. THAT is what libs are so afraid of. A 6 or 12 week shutdown during which people discover nothing has really changed.

Posted by: blindside at January 15, 2013 10:17 AM (x7g7t)

194 >>The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican
colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final
legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the
case.


They are not colleagues, they are No Labels types without the no labels label.
aka Stealth Traitors, Reach Arounds, Compromisers, Hey What's With The Gridlockers, etc.

The real problem is there are far too many people calling themselves Republican for no apparent reason, which to me implies corruption.

But I guess that's crackpot conspiracy theory.

Posted by: ontherocks at January 15, 2013 10:17 AM (aZ6ew)

195
4. Gabe blames 'far right' repubs for debt limit and spending increase.

It seems to me that's all that's left now anyway. We all know what is going to happen, all this bluster and kabuki is about determining who gets blaimed for it. CYA all around.

The US Ship of State is the Costa Concordia. Sure, the Captain is saying everything is fine and there's just a small problem with the stabilizers. Pay more attention to the crew scrambling for life boats. Not my fault! He did it!

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 10:17 AM (TULs6)

196 Show some backbone. Stand up and FIGHT!

Posted by: France at January 15, 2013 10:18 AM (SO2Q8)

197 Oh and hey, you know what? I am going to invoke the Absolute Moral Authority staff of +15 bitchiness.


I have no skin in this game, not really. I have no children. I will have no grandchildren. The future financial destruction of this country is not my problem because, in the long run, I will be dead. It should make me no never mind what will happen 50-60 years out because, again, in the long run, I will be dead.


Thus, when I stand athwart screaming stop, I am doing so based on principles, not purely from self-interest. There is self-interest, don't get me wrong. I desperately do not want someone else telling me how to live my life. That's what my parents are for. But long term? Why should I care what happens to other people's kids? Why? Because it's wrong. It is wrong, it is immoral, it is unjust to do what we are doing to future generations.

So yes. *smacks staff on the ground* I do hereby invoke Absolute Moral Authority on this.


Love, despair, you know the drill.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:19 AM (VtjlW)

198 Iconcede that my use of the phrase "far right" was too antagonistic. I should have simply used "conservatives," as I did earlier in the post,or perhaps "more conservative members" to simply mean those congressfolks in districts safe enough that they can give the middle finger to their GOP colleagues.
Posted by: Gabriel Malor
************************
You are a SCOAMF and a RINO idiot. Please post elsewhere.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:19 AM (uhftQ)

199 Huh. Gabe, I was under the impression that "conservative" and "more conservative" were synonymous with "good" and "better".

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:20 AM (n7GP0)

200 189: Thats certainly possible, but using the Walker recall as a model; even taking away the FSA's toys doesn't necessarily get them off their asses when St. Barry isn't on the ticket. Wisconsin had a turnout increase of around 500K from the recall to the general and over 4/5s voted for Barry. He's got a lot of lazy and/or stupid fans.

Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 10:20 AM (CBCxo)

201 You are a SCOAMF and a RINO idiot. Please post elsewhere.
Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:19 AM (uhftQ)

I don't know who you are, but if your intention is to insult everyone here and make an ass of your self, your doing a good job.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 15, 2013 10:20 AM (9Bj8R)

202 Iconcede that my use of the phrase "far right" was too antagonistic.

Will you be so kind as to edit appropriately, then? Or is this a "sorry-but-not-really"?

Posted by: Brother Cavil, High Priest of the Gods of the Copybook Headings at January 15, 2013 10:21 AM (GBXon)

203 So AtC, when are you going down to the registrar's office and file the paperwork?

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:22 AM (GQ8sn)

204 "...give the middle finger back to their GOP colleagues.

FIFY

Posted by: teej at January 15, 2013 10:22 AM (W50F+)

205 197 I have no skin in this game, not really. I have no children. I will have no grandchildren.

It is wrong, it is immoral, it is unjust to do what we are doing to future generations.


We read from the exact same sheet of music. No offspring, I shouldn't give a fuck...yet I do.

Damn you, Thomas Jefferson and your peers.

Damn you for writing down a bunch of shit that made a lot of sense a couple hundred years ago.

SiD

Posted by: akula51 at January 15, 2013 10:22 AM (YesJa)

206 I don't know who you are, but if your intention is to insult everyone here and make an ass of your self, your doing a good job.
Posted by: Nevergiveup
******************
Just insulting those who insult me. Try reading AND understanding.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:22 AM (uhftQ)

207 201 NGU,

It takes a lot to make me seem restrained every once in a while we get a troll that makes me not even in the top 5 on crazy nut posters here.

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 10:22 AM (LRFds)

208
Gabe, I was under the impression that "conservative" and "more conservative" were synonymous with "good" and "better".

Only when they achieve good and better results, like lower spending and lower taxes, and, generally, fiscal responsibility. Authorizing the gov't to incur debt and then refusing to pay for it (which is what a debt default is) is not fiscally responsible behavior. Similarly, pushing for a gov't shutdown rather than negotiating spending cuts is not fiscally responsible behavior.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (B2LxR)

209 This new guy reminds me of "Totally Irrational Political Malcontent" that used to snark around here, but for real.

Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (CBCxo)

210 I disagree, if only because the JEF's MO would be to shut off all the
goodies for his FSA first, then would be able to run on a platform of
"remember how those racist Rethuglicans voted to starve you?"


Except that, for most of it, he can't. Entitlements are "non-discretionary spending." Even in the event of a "Shutdown" those bills are paid. Some geriatric patient may not be able to get help from Medicare Customer Support as quickly as they do now, but the entitlements will still be paid.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (/eBe8)

211 So AtC, when are you going down to the registrar's office and file the paperwork?
Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:22 AM (GQ8sn)



Yeah. No. Though I will concede that my campaign would be, what's the term I'm looking for, lively. That's it. Lively.

I'm pretty sure the first time I say "Well. I see they hired you for your tits and not your brains" to a local newsanchorette will spell the end of my campaign.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (VtjlW)

212 I have an idea: do the right thing. Don't spend money you don't have.

Posted by: Minuteman at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (YOWAW)

213 207 201 NGU,

It takes a lot to make me seem restrained every once in a while we get a troll that makes me not even in the top 5 on crazy nut posters here.

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 10:22 AM (LRFds)



Don't sell yourself short Sven!

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (n7GP0)

214 Who could have foreseen the day that a man of Kenyan descent would be grabbing our guns, de-valuing our dollars, killing the best health care system in the world ever, and make us pay for his ugly wife to travel the world on our dime. Who. Coulda. Seen.

Posted by: sTevo at January 15, 2013 10:25 AM (YSd1Q)

215 Ah yes, RINO gabe, who made it a point to insult Conservatives get's some of his medicine back, and I'm a troll.
Been here a long time folks.It seems we have more whinny little girls than ever before and CBD and NGU are proving.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:25 AM (uhftQ)

216 So yes. *smacks staff on the ground* I do hereby invoke Absolute Moral Authority on this. Love, despair, you know the drill.

A worthy rant, my Empress. You are exactly the sort of person the Founding Fathers had in mind when they wondered who to entrust with power in this new nation. What does it say about the modern USA when the "moron" commenters at a smart military blog care more about the country - and could run it better - than the collection of perverts, drunk, murderers and thieves who have abrogated that power to themselves?

*bows deeply* Your tea, Imperial One.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 15, 2013 10:25 AM (zF6Iw)

217 Who has the God damned matches?

Posted by: phoenixgirl so done with the GOP at January 15, 2013 10:25 AM (xsBv/)

218 208 negotiating spending cuts

Since 2007 and the dawn of the Reid/Pelosi era, how exactly has that worked out for your average taxpayer?

As well as "leading from behind" does in our "foreign policy"?

Posted by: akula51 at January 15, 2013 10:25 AM (YesJa)

219 So these cocksuckers in NY are limiting magazine size to 7 fucking rounds? These people are complete blathering idiots.

Posted by: Lurkasaurus at January 15, 2013 10:25 AM (2J7cE)

220 Akula, Alex the Chick you both have the principles because you love as a whole the system and the American people and want a healthy, prosperous, stable future that is governed by people working within the limits of the Bill of rights and probity.

I respect that deeply, I have a 7 pound weight that has turned into an 86 pound boy way too fast for my liking that I pray one day carries a 7 pound weight.

If anything it is a "cheat sheet" for fiscal restraint and zealous guarding of prosperity amongst sane parents.

Alex I know your conservatism is not always the easiest luggage to carry socially in all likelihood with some.

I deeply respect that you're with us.

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 10:26 AM (LRFds)

221 All we have at the federal level is control of the purse and we won't even use that. That's what gets me most.

Posted by: Y-not on the phone at January 15, 2013 10:26 AM (5H6zj)

222 I'm pretty sure the first time I say "Well. I see they hired you for
your tits and not your brains" to a local newsanchorette will spell the
end of my campaign.



It would be that awesome and you know it!

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:26 AM (GQ8sn)

223 Will you be so kind as to edit appropriately, then? Or is this a "sorry-but-not-really"?Posted by: Brother Cavil, High Priest of the Gods of the Copybook Headings at January 15, 2013 10:21 AM (GBXon)Generally, it is viewed as very bad form to go back and sanitize a blog post over something it got wrong. We hate when the media does that and we don't do that here. I said it. I got called out on it. It would be wrong to whitewash it now.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:26 AM (B2LxR)

224 Well hell you guys are bumming me out, I would love to be "reasonable" and say, yes we need to concede on minor issues in order to advance "critical" issues. But past experience has told me this does not work. No really it does not work. We got big gains in the midterm because of far right nutjobs like Bachman. Why can we not accept that? We lost to a cult of personality that was playing to total idiots and a willful media. If the republicans keep going "squishy" they will get ass raped in the midterms. And frankly maybe they should.

Posted by: gigg at January 15, 2013 10:26 AM (41VCE)

225 He's got a lot of lazy and/or stupid fans.
Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 10:20 AM (CBCxo)

Those are the low information voters. they don't like politics, but they're legion and Barry built an entire GOTV apparatus with them in mind. That's why he ran as a celebrity and did all those fluffball interviews in women's magazines and ran his commercials during the real house wives of wherever. Dude was able to swing an election on the chronically apathetic vote.

Posted by: we are so screwed, deliver us oh SMOD at January 15, 2013 10:26 AM (HEa5q)

226 So, the "Far Right" is comprised of those who can actually count and realize that this administration is destroying our economy?

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at January 15, 2013 10:27 AM (yiIja)

227 When the debt ceiling is off the table, what leverage do the budget cutters have?

None.

Embrace the suck and enjoy the burning.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 15, 2013 10:27 AM (evdj2)

228 @ Opus 173 I admire your enthusiasm.

I am old now. I just want to draw a line in the sand and say.."ya'all ain't taking one more thing from me."

Cross that line fuckers! I triple dog dare you!

I stand behind that line, armed to the teeth, and my family stands behind me.

Its terrible to grow old. But old people know they ain't got long and generally don't give a flying fuck!

Don't fuck with old people, they don't give a shit!

Posted by: Judge_Roy_bean at January 15, 2013 10:27 AM (42wQ/)

229 "The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican colleagues on a compromise, will once again have impelled final legislation that is further to the left than would otherwise be the case."

As if they were even consulted.

Posted by: DocMerlin at January 15, 2013 10:27 AM (eQ/jF)

230
So these cocksuckers in NY are limiting magazine size to 7 fucking rounds? These people are complete blathering idiots.


It's ok if you have an M1911, but not so much for other......items.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:28 AM (GQ8sn)

231 Authorizing the gov't to incur debt and then
refusing to pay for it (which is what a debt default is) is not fiscally
responsible behavior.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (B2LxR)

That is a fundamental misunderstanding of what the debt limit is.

Not increasing the debt limit means that we will not borrow any more money. It says nothing about not paying our current debts. The federal government has ample inflows to pay all debt service.


Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 10:28 AM (GsoHv)

232 So, the "Far Right" is comprised of those who can actually count and realize that this administration is destroying our economy?
Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit.
************
Careful, you'll get called a troll for saying stuff like that.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:28 AM (uhftQ)

233 Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:28 AM (GQ8sn)

I have eight round mags for my 1911.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 10:28 AM (GsoHv)

234 Authorizing the gov't to incur debt and then refusing to pay for it
(which is what a debt default is) is not fiscally responsible behavior.


Neither is "pay[ing] for it" when that requires accumulation of more debt.

It is not fiscally prudent to pay of one credit card by going and getting (and maxing out) another credit card. Which is what the SCOAMT wants us to do. At some point, in fact, the fiscally responsible thing to do is the debt default- call your creditors and say, "I'm plumb out of money. You can take smaller payments until I'm back on my feet, or you can take nothing. Just let me know which one you prefer."

You're falling for Obama's argument that raising the debt ceiling is "paying for debts already incurred." No, it's not, and no, they haven't been. Not raising the debt ceiling is saying we will not incur further debt. If debts are not then paid, that's a function of a failure to property prioritize spending, not a failure to incur more debt.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 10:28 AM (/eBe8)

235 Generally, it is viewed as very bad form to go back and sanitize a blog
post over something it got wrong. We hate when the media does that and
we don't do that here. I said it. I got called out on it. It would be
wrong to whitewash it now.


Just put and "EDIT: " up there and we'll call it even.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:29 AM (GQ8sn)

236 Similarly, pushing for a gov't shutdown rather than negotiating spending cuts is not fiscally responsible behavior.

I've got work to do, but I had to address this. Gabe, the problem is that - as we've seen over and over and over and over! - the Democrats will not, do not and never will act in good faith regarding cuts! Poor old GWHB learned that the hard way. Pushing for a shutdown is, IMO, the only response to outright liars like Harry "want a Walnetto, little boy?" Reid and Nancy "who would Jesus abort?" Pelosi. So what's your solution to that problem?

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 15, 2013 10:29 AM (zF6Iw)

237
"The far right, beacuse it refuses to work with their Republican colleagues on a compromise"
Hey Gabe, have a point beside slamming the base?
The Cap'n is as liberal an aparatchik as you. Pete Sessions is a Boy Scout.
This is a rambling documentation of the Party of Schtoopid falling all over itself to retreat in terror of the left. The best that can be said for your analysis is that its incoherence mimics House 'leadership'.

Posted by: gary gulrud at January 15, 2013 10:29 AM (uv0Aw)

238
Only when they achieve good and better results, like lower spending and lower taxes, and, generally, fiscal responsibility. Authorizing the gov't to incur debt and then refusing to pay for it (which is what a debt default is) is not fiscally responsible behavior. Similarly, pushing for a gov't shutdown rather than negotiating spending cuts is not fiscally responsible behavior.
Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (B2LxR)



Okay. I'll bite. What is your suggestion for consequences in order to achieve those goals? I would hope you know me well enough by now to know I'm being serious. Those of us who disagree with your post do so because refusing to raise the debt limit and placing the proposition of a government shutdown on the table are seen as two of the only available avenues to stop the never ending growth of Leviathan. You reject this. Fair enough. Then what do you suggest be done otherwise?

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:29 AM (VtjlW)

239 Authorizing the gov't to incur debt and then refusing to pay for it (which is what a debt default is)

Why are you buying innumerate Barry's line that you have to raise the debt ceiling to pay for the debt? That's not the case at all. The government takes in way more money than required to pay for debt service.

Posted by: Waterhouse at January 15, 2013 10:30 AM (q33yg)

240 I just got here and haven't read any of the comments but let me just say I couldnt disagree with Gabe more.

Posted by: Mr Pink at January 15, 2013 10:30 AM (jyF71)

241 And I'm so excited that the one thing we have going for us, the governors, will have Chris Christie at the helm soon.

Are we going to get a post about Jan Brewer embracing the medicaid expansion btw?

Posted by: Y-not on the phone at January 15, 2013 10:30 AM (5H6zj)

242
I have an idea: do the right thing. Don't spend money you don't have.

Far-Rightist! I'll bet you also want to adhere to that "Constitution" thingy.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at January 15, 2013 10:30 AM (yiIja)

243 Gabe, I can respect a change when it's labeled, a remark perhaps noting "Edited for better/more appropriate/less offensive word choice". A stealth mod is what the issue is.

Which, by the way, you've already edited it once without note.

Let's try this again, shall we...?

Posted by: Brother Cavil, High Priest of the Gods of the Copybook Headings at January 15, 2013 10:30 AM (GBXon)

244 I have eight round mags for my 1911.

Yeah, I was meaning that the limitation doesn't really make much sense and I would love to hear how they came up with 7.

I feel bad for the ParaOrdnance M1911 owners.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:31 AM (GQ8sn)

245 Who has the God damned matches?Posted by: phoenixgirl so done with the GOP at January 15, 2013 10:25 AM (xsBv/)How bout a blow torch instead.

Posted by: spypeach at January 15, 2013 10:31 AM (pwTow)

246
AllenG and CBD, you've put your finger on what's wrong with federal spending in general, but that hardly does us any good with Obama vowing to prioritize entitlements over debt payments.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:31 AM (B2LxR)

247 @217- I have a few boxes worth of "strike anywhere", hermetically sealed in a mayonnaise jar on Funk and Wagnall's porch..

Posted by: teej at January 15, 2013 10:31 AM (iW2D2)

248 I think Lance Armstrong was already down a ball due to testicular cancer. He lost the other one by going on Oprah. Empty nutsack.

Posted by: Fourth Virginia at January 15, 2013 10:32 AM (wbmaj)

249
Seems to me that a lot of these DC chumps said the last deal was good because now we were playing on our home turf, and yet now the story is the other guys have all the advantage, we must retreat for better footing. Again.

Hehehehe. You noticed that?

Noooo!We have always been at war with Eastasia!

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 10:32 AM (TULs6)

250 Is there a welcoming party for those of us who recently joined the far right?

Posted by: Math at January 15, 2013 10:32 AM (/Mla1)

251 34Do you see where this is going? Because it is a repeat of the Plan B debacle.



The Plan B debacle, which wouldn't have made a fucking bit of difference because it would've been roundly ignored by the MFM, was brought on by Boehner being too fucking lazy and inept to have all his troops in line since early November to vote for it. That strategic dunce decided to purge people at the last moment instead of doing it earlier when nobody would've given a flying fuck. The weepy sap has been a poor excuse for a leader since day 1 and, even with the November election, he still knew who would be in place through the end of the year. The donks stay united because they wouldn't put up with anybody this hapless.
Posted by: Captain Hate at January 15, 2013 09:27 AM (5lhIT)***************>>>>>>>>>Captain, in actuality Plan B was something that should have not happened at all. Boehner was all cute and became Mr. Wheeler-Dealer instead of following the Constitutional order for Budgeting.

Posted by: Minuteman at January 15, 2013 10:32 AM (YOWAW)

252 I'm pretty sure the first time I say "Well. I see they hired you for your tits and not your brains" to a local newsanchorette will spell the end of my campaign.

At least you'd make it to a campaign. I wouldn't make it past "exploratory" committe.
True story: My sister won election to office as a 'pub in an extreme 'pub county. At here victory party I had a couple of county big wigs ask me why I didn't go into politics. My reply?
"One day we are going to wind up having to shoot you sons a bitches. And I don't want to be one when we do". The stricken look on their faces was priceless.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 10:32 AM (GFM2b)

253 Is there a welcoming party for those of us who recently joined the far right?
Posted by: Math
***************
Apparently it's hosted by CBD, Sven, and Never Give Up. They loves them some Gabe.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:33 AM (uhftQ)

254 Posted by: Judge_Roy_bean at January 15, 2013 10:27 AM (42wQ/)

I hear you Judge and I'm no spring chicken. But I'm the new 30 as far as I'm concerned and I'll hold my ground as well.

But these fucking dustballs in D.C. are old AND soft. They are spoiled like chicken livers left out on the dock in the July sun. They're only good for catching catfish now.

I was inartful to make it look like I wanted them out because of their advance age. I should have been more clear in fact that it's their advanced aging in the D.C. cheese factory that has put me off.

That's as close to PC as I can get.

Posted by: Opus An Arcus at January 15, 2013 10:33 AM (m14S3)

255 I feel bad for the ParaOrdnance M1911 owners.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:31 AM (GQ8sn)

So do I, and I would be glad to help them out for 50 cents on the dollar.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 10:33 AM (GsoHv)

256 and half the citizens said, Hey let's hit the gutter, I've never had that particular experience in my lifetime.
and the leaders said, well how fast or how slow , matters not, as long as we reach our destination.

and halleluyah's were said, and the citizens went back to their people's choice awards.

Posted by: ette at January 15, 2013 10:34 AM (nqBYe)

257 Hollywood studio Sony has been forced into a fresh defence of the controversial film Zero Dark Thirty, about the hunt for Osama bin Laden, after a member of the body that organises the Oscars called for a boycott.

Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences (Ampas) member David Clennon said last week he would not be voting for Kathryn Bigelow’s film, which has been nominated for five Oscars, and urged others to snub a movie that he said “promotes the acceptance of the crime of torture, as a legitimate weapon in America’s so-called War on Terror”. Writing on the truth-out.org website, he added: “I cannot vote for a film that makes heroes of Americans who commit the crime of torture.”

In response, Sony president Amy Pascal said she was “outraged” that an Academy member would try to influence the voting process. “Zero Dark Thirty does not advocate torture,” she said on Friday. “To not include that part of history would have been irresponsible and inaccurate. We fully support Kathryn Bigelow and [screenwriter] Mark Boal and stand behind this extraordinary movie. We are outraged that any responsible member of the Academy would use their voting status in Ampas as a platform to advance their own political agenda.”

???They are outraged that any member of the Academy would use movies to advance their political platform? Were has this person been hiding? Under a rock?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 15, 2013 10:34 AM (9Bj8R)

258 I think Lance Armstrong was already down a ball due to testicular cancer. He lost the other one by going on Oprah. Empty nutsack.
Posted by: Fourth Virginia at January 15, 2013 10:32 AM (wbmaj)

Maybe Oprah will buy him some Neuticles™ and a new car since, you know, he won't be cycling anymore.

Posted by: Insomniac at January 15, 2013 10:34 AM (DrWcr)

259 The "far right" Republicians from "deep red" districts face a greater threat in a mid-term primary then their softer red cousins. Their soft red cousin are at risk in a general election during a Presidential cycle.

Now is the time for the soft reds to rally to the Consevative flag, not to muddle around in the center, time enough for that in 2015.

Posted by: Jean at January 15, 2013 10:35 AM (iO3BG)

260 So do I, and I would be glad to help them out for 50 cents on the dollar.


I can also "charter a boat" for them to take a 3 hour tour on.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:35 AM (GQ8sn)

261 Thank you for the tea, MPPPP. Btw, if I haven't said, I really really love the Hollywood stories.


I deeply respect that you're with us.
Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 10:26 AM (LRFds)



That is kind of you to say. Thank you.


In there is hope for humanity news, it's cold and pouring rain here and the boss just announced that he wants us to order in for lunch so we don't have to go out in the rain. Those of you who suffered through the years of me whining about the hateful fucks for whom I used to work will understand why that nearly made me cry.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:35 AM (VtjlW)

262 I have eight round mags for my 1911.

Yeah, I was meaning that the limitation doesn't really make much sense and I would love to hear how they came up with 7.

I feel bad for the ParaOrdnance M1911 owners.


THAT'S a feafure, not a bug.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 10:35 AM (GFM2b)

263
Just put and "EDIT: " up there and we'll call it even.

Done.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:36 AM (B2LxR)

264 Bbbbbut bbbbut bbbbut the really smart people were telling us just 2 weeks ago, how caving on the fiscal cliff was a smart move because it gave the GOP all this new power in the debt ceiling debate.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at January 15, 2013 10:36 AM (HDgX3)

265 Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:33 AM (uhftQ)

Try to follow along. I know it will be tough, but maybe your mom can lend you a dictionary.

Some posts are intended to be free-for-alls, where anything goes.

Some posts, such as this one, are intended to be sounding boards for the ideas of the posters. The intellectual examination of the post is what people enjoy.

Your idiotic blather is not intelligent, it's not enjoyable, and it's not amusing.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 10:37 AM (GsoHv)

266 246 Gabriel Mallor,

Gabe you are saying it is OUR fault that King Putt will willfully blow out the brains of the republic's credit rating?

When I have a debt due that exceeds my budget I dip into my savings....*bzzzt* what 'savings I'm now the federal government?

When I was less fiscally responsible prior to having the boy and I had a debt that exceeded my slack budget I reduced my luxuries and paid the bill, and when I finally was down to 36 dollars a month for food allowance because of the massive pay cut i had taken in El Paso following my wife and decided my marriage trumped my running back to my better job I went bankrupt.

Pity I couldn't counterfeit money like Timmy Turbo tax functionally does.

Thanks for your clarification, it was edifying.

Maybe i need to move to the Pink districts in new England and become a pro underground poker player.

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 10:37 AM (LRFds)

267
Bbbbbut bbbbut bbbbut the really smart people were telling us just 2 weeks ago, how caving on the fiscal cliff was a smart move because it gave the GOP all this new power in the debt ceiling debate.

Please list the names of these "really smart people."

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:37 AM (B2LxR)

268 Is there a welcoming party for those of us who recently joined the far right?

Posted by: Math


Welcome to the Dark Side. We have Jello salads.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at January 15, 2013 10:38 AM (ZKzrr)

269
Yeah. No. Though I will concede that my campaign would be, what's the term I'm looking for, lively. That's it. Lively.



I'm pretty sure the first time I say "Well. I see they hired you
for your tits and not your brains" to a local newsanchorette will spell
the end of my campaign.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (VtjlW)

Au contraire, mademoiselle, it will mark the beginning of a glorious conquest.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 10:38 AM (v07al)

270 So, uh...all that "stimulus" and those evil unfunded wars brought on by Dick Cheney and Bush - why isn't anyone challenging the fact that they just became part of the Federal spending baseline?

WTF was up with that shit? Why do one-time expenditures mean we'll spend the same amount (plus 8% or whatever) next year on different shit?

I assume that Sandy pork is going to be part of the permanent spending baseline now as well?

Fuck.

Why can't someone go on TV and just say "believe it or not, the math is really simple. We had X amount of spending in 2007. Congress NEVER planned to make a bunch of UNEXPECTED...EMERGENCY spending measures to become permanent parts of our budget."

I'd love to go tell my wife "honey, I blew the supercharger in the Cobra again. We're going to need to drop $8k on a newer better one this weekend."

And by the way, honey, I'm sorry - but I'll be needing to spend that same $8k on hookers and blow ad infinitem.

Wanna go for a ride?

Posted by: akula51 at January 15, 2013 10:38 AM (YesJa)

271
Some posts, such as this one, are intended to be sounding boards for the ideas of the posters. The intellectual examination of the post is what people enjoy.

+1.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:38 AM (B2LxR)

272 Zombie Uncle Milton Friedman explains it all to us:

http://tinyurl.com/bbx4r8m

Didn't expect it work against us, did you?

Posted by: John P. Squibob at January 15, 2013 10:39 AM (kqqGm)

273 why does this thread smell funny?

Posted by: spypeach at January 15, 2013 10:39 AM (pwTow)

274 Ohhhhhh, the Saiga 12 just showed up. Now that is a shotgun! Whooo Hoooo!

20 round drums all sold out, but them 15 rounders showed up.

Posted by: Judge_Roy_bean at January 15, 2013 10:40 AM (42wQ/)

275
"House GOP Is Ready To Cave on [fill in the blank]."


Posted by: rrpjr at January 15, 2013 10:40 AM (4uTbM)

276 Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 15, 2013 10:37 AM (GsoHv)

It really is worthless responding to nasty prick drive by one trick pony trolls. I made the mistake of doing that on this thread also. Ignore it and hopefully it will go away.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 15, 2013 10:40 AM (9Bj8R)

277 There. Was that so hard?

(Note: Pretty sure I've seen the Proprietor of This Establishment follow that protocol from time to time. Really, folks can respect someone who says they're changing something and explains why!)

Posted by: Brother Cavil, High Priest of the Gods of the Copybook Headings at January 15, 2013 10:40 AM (GBXon)

278 Anyone in the LiB camp agreed with you GM.

They'd just rather LiB. That is to say, fight for a shutdown and get liberal legislation passed to quicken the burning.

Still not sure that I agree, but that's the sentiment here.

Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 74% more DOOM! at January 15, 2013 10:41 AM (FsUAO)

279 Similarly, pushing for a gov't shutdown rather than negotiating spending cuts is not fiscally responsible behavior.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:24 AM (B2LxR)


"Negotiating spending cuts."
Yeah. Ok. Here's the problem. The Democrats are standing in front of us and declare "We're going to fuck you in the ass now." Conservatives like CBD, AllenG, myself, AtC and plenty of other people around here are of the opinion that we should scream "The hell you are!" and then fight with everything we have to prevent it from occurring. Those Republicans who've been doing our "negotiating" turn around and say, "Ok, we're going to get fucked here and if we fight it, it's going to really hurt. Mr. Democrat, we agree that you can fuck our ass, but only this once and only if you use KY." The Democrats laugh and say, "Ok, just this once, but no KY. I'm going to spit on it." Republicans "Deal!"
Guess what? They don't even spit on it. And it doesn't matter. Because whether they spit on it, use KY or just have it..WE'RE STILL TAKING IT UP THE ASS.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:41 AM (da5Wo)

280 Spy peach

Because "caustic" is curious, the cat piss troll

Posted by: phoenixgirl so done with the GOP at January 15, 2013 10:41 AM (xsBv/)

281 Hard right? I ususally refer to them as High Maintenance Conservatives.

That said, if the GOP gives in to the pork laden Sandy billwithout cutting any of the pork at all, they should be referred to as the Gimp Republicans.

Posted by: polynikes at January 15, 2013 10:41 AM (m2CN7)

282 It really is worthless responding to nasty prick drive by one trick pony trolls. I made the mistake of doing that on this thread also. Ignore it and hopefully it will go away.
Posted by: Nevergiveup
******************
Been posting here for years, youmoron. I don't live here like you do tho.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:42 AM (uhftQ)

283 @274 Rub it in. I'm in California

Posted by: Darth Chipmunk at January 15, 2013 10:42 AM (0tRzD)

284 Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:41 AM (da5Wo)


You are not tricking me into talking about Anne Hathaway again.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:43 AM (VtjlW)

285 Awesome. Thanks for the formatting Pixy.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:44 AM (da5Wo)

286 >>Instead of "far right," it would have been better had I continued to use
the phrase "conservatives" or "more conservative members." "Far right"
was too antagonistic.


Great, moderation.......

....the irony it burns my pants

Posted by: ontherocks at January 15, 2013 10:44 AM (aZ6ew)

287 That said, if the GOP gives in to the pork laden Sandy billwithout cutting any of the pork at all, they should be referred to as the Gimp Republicans Democrats.

Next...

Posted by: Brother Cavil, Ampersand Wrangler at January 15, 2013 10:44 AM (GBXon)

288 Been posting here for years, youmoron. I don't live here like you do tho.
Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:42 AM (uhftQ)


if you've been here for years? how come ya don't know we are honored here to be called 'Morons"?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 15, 2013 10:45 AM (9Bj8R)

289 I'm not annoyed with you using the phrase "far right." I am annoyed with you thinking the more conservative members had any input whatsoever.

Posted by: DocMerlin at January 15, 2013 10:45 AM (eQ/jF)

290 From reading the posts I detect a perturbation in the force (that's not related to masturbation you fappers!).

In the words of Rodney King (who should have got his ass kicked for driving drunk and on drugs)..can't we all get along?

If not everybody grab a pistol and I will show you the shanghai shuffle!

Posted by: Judge_Roy_bean at January 15, 2013 10:45 AM (42wQ/)

291 Hard right? I ususally refer to them as High Maintenance Conservatives.


Actually, we are about as low maintenence as they come.
Spend only what is authorized by the constitution, leave me the fuck alone, and Get off my lawn!

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (GFM2b)

292 Imagine republicans not raising taxes

Posted by: phoenixgirl so done with the GOP at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (xsBv/)

293 Zombie Uncle Milton Friedman explains it all to us:

http://tinyurl.com/bbx4r8m

Didn't expect it work against us, did you?


To add, let's just change his last words a little bit:

"...make it politically profitable for the wrong right people to do the right wrong things."

So we're left with these options:

Stay home in 2014

Tea Party candidate in primary or general election

Let it Burn (Sorry, Uncle Milton's axiom just threw that option out the window)

Posted by: John P. Squibob at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (kqqGm)

294 Imagine republicans not raising taxes
Posted by: phoenixgirl so done with the GOP at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (xsBv/)

It's easy if you try.

Sorry. I hate that stupid song.

Posted by: Insomniac at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (DrWcr)

295
Similarly, pushing for a gov't shutdown rather than negotiating spending cuts is not fiscally responsible behavior.

A long time ago Ace wrote a post about "negotiating" with Iran. He made the point that while the rhetoric of "negotiating" was fine, the effort was doomed to failure because Iran refused to negotiate in good faith. Therefore, how do you have a negotiation if the other party has no intention of actually dealing with you.

Hence we have stupid agreements-in-name-only where Iran pinkie-swears not to develop nuclear weapons, but then goes ahead and does it anyway. How do you negotiate with that?

This is the same kind of dynamic. Gabe, you're excoriating the 'far right' for not negotiating, when in reality the Dems who are across the table are refusing to deal in good faith. Seems to me your ire should be placed on the side(s) who are demanding this spending, not the people who are trying to reign it in.

Posted by: JohnTant at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (tVWQB)

296 You are not tricking me into talking about Anne Hathaway again.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:43 AM (VtjlW)


Anne Hathaway you said?

http://tinyurl.com/d7bn8h4



NSFW

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:47 AM (da5Wo)

297 No sale GM. Any blame on the "far right" is beyond ridiculous.

Posted by: SH at January 15, 2013 10:47 AM (gmeXX)

298 I read up to post 174, then skimmed to here...

did I miss Gabe's post defining the "far right"?

Posted by: USMC8541 at January 15, 2013 10:48 AM (v3pYe)

299 292 Imagine republicans not raising taxes

Posted by: phoenixgirl so done with the GOP at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (xsBv/)

Right after I imagine the left standing up for the 2nd Amendment.



What a wonderful world it could be (insert music notes)

Posted by: RWC at January 15, 2013 10:48 AM (fWAjv)

300 Been posting here for years, youmoron. I don't live here like you do tho. Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:42 AM (uhftQ) if you've been here for years? how come ya don't know we are honored here to be called 'Morons"?
Posted by: Nevergiveup
*****************
It's what I usually call stupid people. Although it wasn't meant in the positive/joking wayAce means it.
My issues with gabe go back to an offensive post he made hereon Cuba and then his continued RINO douchebaggery. If you want to lick his taint, fine. Just don't expect me to.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:48 AM (uhftQ)

301 BSR, so your the other subversive in Falls Church.

Posted by: Jean at January 15, 2013 10:49 AM (UyYYt)

302 why does this thread smell funny?

Posted by: spypeach at January 15, 2013 10:39 AM (pwTow)

-----
Old thread smell with a whiff of new troll.

Posted by: fixerupper at January 15, 2013 10:49 AM (nELVU)

303 but that hardly does us any good with Obama vowing to prioritize entitlements over debt payments.

It wouldn't matter if he did or not. Sad-but-true, Entitlements are "non-discretionary" and debt payments are not. And you can forget that whole 14th Amendment thing- the Democrats certainly will if it becomes inconvenient.

Further fact, though, is that the President has virtually no say-so, if the House would actually grow some balls. The House holds the purse strings. Whatever happened to splitting up the spending authorizations?

Here is what I would do if I were the House Republicans.

1) Absolutely refuse to raise the debt ceiling without real, immediate, net spending cuts.
2) Pass a budget that does both- real cuts and hike the debt ceiling (see, we can compromise).
3) Go ahead and pass (because the Democrats in the Senate will reject that) another budget that does not include the debt ceiling hike, and only includes spending cuts.
4) (Because that won't pass the Senate, either) Discrete spending bills for specific services- here's this year's funding for Medicare, this other bill funds Social Security, the third funds the Military, etc.
5) Do not negotiate on any of those. Say, "These are your options. Pick one. Until you do, we're going to adjourn for 24/7 Parcheesi parties."
6) Go out on the Capitol Steps every single day and say, "We have provided the Senate and the President with several options for funding the government, including full debt service. So far, the Senate has not provided a single reasonable compromise. The President rejected compromise from the outset. We will be happy to return to the table when the President and the Senate are willing to do so. And simply calling our proposals "unacceptable" and proposing more spending and more debt is not returning to the table- that was their initial position."

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 10:50 AM (/eBe8)

304 Old thread smell with a whiff of new troll.
Posted by: fixerupper
***********
I've probably been posting here longer than you. So by that standard you are a troll.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:51 AM (uhftQ)

305 ahh..I saw the edit. Thx for the clarification Gabe.

Posted by: USMC8541 at January 15, 2013 10:51 AM (v3pYe)

306 Sorry, but the post didn't read like a "sounding board" to me.
It read like Gabe, as usual, blaming things on the "far right".

I guess he did get plenty of sound back though. And a lot of comments from folks you don't see post very often.
Scary smaht, that second part.

Posted by: teej at January 15, 2013 10:51 AM (5gfow)

307 "Similarly, pushing for a gov't shutdown rather than negotiating spending cuts is not fiscally responsible behavior."



And at what point in the GOP's history of negotiat___ does your argument have any merit?


Don't puff up and talk about results when the people you seem to think have the skill to negotiate something fiscally responsible have never achieved a result that remotely resembles success either fiscally or electorally.


You really don't think very well.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 10:52 AM (ROv35)

308 http://theweek.com/bullpen/column/238762/why-a-government-shutdown-would-help-the-gop

Counter-point to the idea that we can't have a shutdown.

Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 74% more DOOM! at January 15, 2013 10:52 AM (FsUAO)

309 301: Yeah in the broad "undefined region of Fairfax County" meaning of Falls Church. Not in the city itself. Still the blue lagoon however, Jim "Ted Kennedy's drunker mentally-challenged clone" Moran's district.

Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 10:52 AM (CBCxo)

310 298 did I miss Gabe's post defining the "far right"?

I think we settled on "Republicans who disagree with President Obama's vision for Fundamentally Transforming America."

Posted by: akula51 at January 15, 2013 10:52 AM (YesJa)

311 I'm feeling kinda demoralized by this post.

Posted by: Invictus at January 15, 2013 10:52 AM (OQpzc)

312 5) Do not negotiate on any of those. Say, "These are your options. Pick one. Until you do, we're going to adjourn for 24/7 Parcheesi parties."


Parcheesi is fun.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:52 AM (VtjlW)

313 Notice, btw, that the problem is always the "extreme" and "antagonizing" positions of the right. Even folks on "our side" like Gabriel repeat this nonsense. There's only one "extreme" side in this debate: Obama's.

Posted by: Sam In VA at January 15, 2013 10:53 AM (rFiOs)

314 AllenG - any argument about proces is going to be a loser for us. Government shutdowns poll poorly until the actual shutdown. Shut it down. Shut it down. Shut it down. Any deal before a shutdown is going to be worse for us. Even if we cave after a shutdown, the deal will still be better.

Who am I kidding, people like GM who know better will say we need to give in. Why the GOP worries about polling is beyond me.

Posted by: SH at January 15, 2013 10:53 AM (gmeXX)

315 Instead of "far right," it would have been better had I continued to use the phrase "conservatives" or "more conservative members." "Far right" was too antagonistic.

Or how about "republicans in safe districts?" Because just being from a solid red district doesn't necessarily make you a conservative, let alone a strong conservative.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:54 AM (4df7R)

316 Actually, we are about as low maintenence as they come. Spend only what is authorized by the constitution, leave me the fuck alone, and Get off my lawn!
Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (GFM2b)

Never, eversatisfied is the definition of High Maintenance.

Posted by: polynikes at January 15, 2013 10:55 AM (m2CN7)

317 I've probably been posting here longer than you. So by that standard you are a troll.

Posted by: Hard Right at January 15, 2013 10:51 AM (uhftQ)


A troll is determined not by tenure, but by the quality and content of it's postings.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:55 AM (da5Wo)

318 Parcheesi is fun.
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:52 AM (VtjlW)


I've never played Parcheesi, though I've always wanted to. The name makes me hungry, though. Mmmm, cheeeeesy.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:55 AM (4df7R)

319 Any chance the sequestration cuts will happen, or will the reasonable, common sense republicans run screaming from that too?

Posted by: Invictus at January 15, 2013 10:55 AM (OQpzc)

320 "Generally, it is viewed as very bad form to go back and sanitize a blog post over something it got wrong. We hate when the media does that and we don't do that here. I said it. I got called out on it. It would be wrong to whitewash it now."



Retractions are bad form? Does your degree smell like crackerjacks?

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 10:55 AM (ROv35)

321 by the quality and content of it's postings.

I make it up in volume.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 15, 2013 10:56 AM (evdj2)

322 Lucy from Peanuts: "I don't care if I'm well-liked or not, just so I'm popular!"


Applies well to the GOP. -.- Allen's List of Asskicking would go a long way towards getting us on track - therefore the GOP will have nothing to do with it.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 10:56 AM (v07al)

323 It's funny how often left wing republicans and democrats unite in condemning the "far right"....I mean it's almost as if they both are the same fucking kinds of people.

Posted by: Mr Pink at January 15, 2013 10:56 AM (jyF71)

324 I make it up in volume.


Heh. I was #10 last week. w00t!

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:56 AM (GQ8sn)

325 I've never played Parcheesi, though I've always wanted to. The name makes me hungry, though. Mmmm, cheeeeesy.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:55 AM (4df7R)

Hey now, yesterday's morning thread left me feeling hungry all day. ;_; Let's be careful bringing up food again!

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 10:57 AM (v07al)

326 However, a small group of congressmen come from such solid red districts that they could threaten to close the government for months and they'd never face even the threat of electoral punishment for it. In fact, some of these districts would welcome not just the threat of a government shutdown, but an actual government shutdown. Which means their priorities are exactly opposite the priorities of most of their GOP colleagues

------

And yet their priorities are exactly right for America. You don't always need a big majority to push the country, sometimes you just need a signifiant minority who can push the country. The minority won't get what they really want, but they will get a better deal than if they did not exist.

Posted by: SH at January 15, 2013 10:57 AM (gmeXX)

327 AllenG, gotta keep it simple:

1> No debt ceiling without a budget. People can relate to that.

2> Pass a budget, he'll, pass three or four give the Senate a choice

3> Pass emergency CRs for SS and Medicare/Aid, and other critical things, separate short term CRs. Use this mechanism to translate into a mode of separate short term appropriations.

4> End withholding and make healthcare a personal deduction, sigh

Posted by: Jean at January 15, 2013 10:57 AM (iO3BG)

328
It wouldn't matter if he did or not. Sad-but-true, Entitlements are "non-discretionary" and debt payments are not.

I do not share your confidence that Obama would not break the law.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 10:58 AM (B2LxR)

329
by the quality and content of it's postings.



-------------

I make it up in volume.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 15, 2013 10:56 AM (evdj2)

--------------
Heh. I was #10 last week. w00t!


Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 10:56 AM (GQ8sn)



*raises eyebrow*

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:58 AM (da5Wo)

330 This crap reminds me of that pathetic attempt to dump that dickless turd Boehner.

If anything GOP leadership is less honest than SCOAMF, and play right into the hands of the incompetent, malevolent demagogue.

SID or LIB, whichever is more doable.

Posted by: ontherocks at January 15, 2013 10:58 AM (aZ6ew)

331 Hey now, yesterday's morning thread left me feeling hungry all day. ;_; Let's be careful bringing up food again!
Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 10:57 AM (v07al)



Mother.Fucker. I never did get bbq.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 10:59 AM (VtjlW)

332 Hey now, yesterday's morning thread left me feeling hungry all day. ;_; Let's be careful bringing up food again!
Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 10:57 AM (v07al)


This is true. My apologies!

To assuage your appetite, try focusing on a mental image of Helen Thomas as the fat dancer in Jabba's court in "Return of the Jedi." I find it does wonders to keep me from bingeing on junk food.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:59 AM (4df7R)

333 Inquiry. I read here often, and so I fancy myself well caught-up on most Moron jargon, but SID is unfamiliar to me. o.o What does that mean?

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 10:59 AM (v07al)

334
Any chance the sequestration cuts will happen, or will the reasonable, common sense republicans run screaming from that too?

Stop noticing things. You're not suppose to notice that. Um... teh gehys! Abortion! Binders!

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 11:00 AM (TULs6)

335 *raises eyebrow* Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 10:58 AM (da5Wo)

Well, there you go, you did it now. BC will be upping his posting count. Now it will be endless pictures of boobehs just to generate comment volume.

Wait.

I'm failing to see the downside here....

Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 15, 2013 11:00 AM (sbV1u)

336 any argument about proces is going to be a loser for us.

That's why I'm not arguing about "process." Read my suggestion again. "Here is what we have done. Here is what we require from the Democrats before we do any more." None of that is the opaque "process" arguments that Republicans tried to use (and I still submit would have worked if they'd stuck to their guns instead of going home for Christmas) against Obamacare.

My plan would, almost inevitably, lead to a shutdown. You're absolutely right- any deal prior to a shutdown puts the shutdown on the D side of the table. That is, any potential shutdown plays for the Democrats, because people say they don't want one. If, on the other hand, we finally stop negotiating, it will turn into a real shutdown. People will hate it at first. They'll cry and scream and throw a tantrum. And then they'll see that their Social Security check came as scheduled, and that the mail has been running, and they'll realize, "Wait, so what 'shut down' in this shutdown?"

Do you think even the average Obama voter is going to go to the mattresses to raise the debt ceiling for the EPA?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 11:00 AM (/eBe8)

337 330: We really did miss a golden opportunity to dump the orange one. Too bad no one had the balls to step up and run against him. I get that its the job the speaker to negotiate, he just sucks at it.

Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church at January 15, 2013 11:00 AM (CBCxo)

338 Sir Malor, voting for a progressive that wears the GOP name in an unsafe district is worse than voting for the democrat in the race...imho.

We need a coalition of Constitutional/fiscal conservatives to fight for our country. I no longer believe this can be done under the GOP name.

I voted for the progressive Republican for President many times and it has led us here.

Posted by: Mekan at January 15, 2013 11:00 AM (hm8tW)

339 Now it will be endless pictures of boobehs just to generate comment volume.


Go on . . .

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 15, 2013 11:01 AM (VtjlW)

340 To assuage your appetite, try focusing on a mental image of Helen
Thomas as the fat dancer in Jabba's court in "Return of the Jedi." I
find it does wonders to keep me from bingeing on junk food.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:59 AM (4df7R)

There is not enough brain bleach on the damn planet to undo the horror of such an image.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 11:01 AM (v07al)

341 try focusing on a mental image of Helen Thomas as
the fat dancer in Jabba's court in "Return of the Jedi." I find it does
wonders to keep me from bingeing on junk food.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:59 AM (4df7R)


Now that was just cruel and unnecessary.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 11:01 AM (da5Wo)

342 Inquiry. I read here often, and so I fancy myself well caught-up on most Moron jargon, but SID is unfamiliar to me. o.o What does that mean?
Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 10:59 AM (v07al)


"Shut It Down."

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 11:01 AM (4df7R)

343 33 Kinley Ardel,

SID Shut It Down

Posted by: sven10077 at January 15, 2013 11:01 AM (LRFds)

344 There is not enough brain bleach on the damn planet to undo the horror of such an image.
Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 11:01 AM (v07al)


Now that was just cruel and unnecessary.
Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 11:01 AM (da5Wo)



Killed your appetite though, dinnit?

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (4df7R)

345 SID = Shut It Down

Companion to LIB "Let It Burn".

Posted by: Brother Cavil, Ampersand Wrangler at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (GBXon)

346 If we can't even dump Boner as speaker then effectively none of this shit matters. Do everything Obama says, and then agree low taxes are bad and that high taxes are the greatest. Hold press conferences where you denounce the rich as not paying their fair share and how evil corporations are hiding profits.

Why the fuck not, it's going to be what Boner is pretty much going to do anyway except he will cry while doing it.

Posted by: Mr Pink at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (jyF71)

347 Actually, we are about as low maintenence as they come. Spend only what is authorized by the constitution, leave me the fuck alone, and Get off my lawn!
Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 10:46 AM (GFM2b)

Never, eversatisfied is the definition of High Maintenance.


Then the "high maintenence" is more closer to the squishy middle than the hard right. Spend only what is authorized by the USC, leave me the fuck alone and stay off my lawn keeps me pretty satisfied. It seems the left & squishy middle are the ones that are never satisfied to do that.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (GFM2b)

348
To assuage your appetite, try focusing on a mental image of Helen

Thomas as the fat dancer in Jabba's court in "Return of the Jedi." I

find it does wonders to keep me from bingeing on junk food.



Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 10:59 AM (4df7R)

------

I see dead boners.... they are EVERYWHERE.

Posted by: fixerupper at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (nELVU)

349 try focusing on a mental image of Helen Thomas as the fat dancer in Jabba's court in "Return of the Jedi." I find it does wonders to keep me from bingeing on junk food.

Starring Helen Thomas as "Pizza the Hutt"

Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 15, 2013 11:03 AM (sbV1u)

350 The GOP leadership, which stands for business as usual, doesn't know what to do with a party that doesn't.

They think this is a replay of Bubba Clinton and Newt, but Bubba has been replaced by Hugo Chavez.

Whole different ball game.

Posted by: PJ at January 15, 2013 11:04 AM (ZWaLo)

351 Then the "high maintenence" is more closer to the squishy middle than the hard right.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (GFM2b)


Yep. "Cut spending, but don't touch my ethanol subsidies! Cut spending, but don't touch my medicare! Cut spending, but green everything!"

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 11:04 AM (4df7R)

352
SID... Shut It Down.


I prefer Sudden Indonesian Deportation..... but .... baby steps.

Posted by: fixerupper at January 15, 2013 11:04 AM (nELVU)

353
Aaaaand, Guy Benson over at Townhall has joined his Salem colleague Ed Morrissey in wanting to move past the debt ceiling to fight the budget/shutdown battle instead.

http://goo.gl/8vwHs

I really think skipping the debt ceiling fight is a mistake.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 11:05 AM (B2LxR)

354 Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 15, 2013 11:00 AM (sbV1u)



You should scroll back up. Look for a link from me and one from CBD.




Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 11:05 AM (da5Wo)

355
It's sad and revealing that we understand that this administration is actively employing the Cloward-Piven Strategy and is demonizing those who recognize that fact. Our national debt has risen some 60% during TFG's Reign of Error.

There is absolutely no difference between a family that would spend irresponsibly and a government. The results are a disaster. We're already seeing the effects of such fiscal irresponsibility: rising unemployment, rampant inflation, millions of people with a greatly reduced standard of living, etc.

If we are to survive as a free people, we have to start disregarding the political strategies and machinations and start demanding that those we send to Washington start doing what WE want them to do, not what the lobbyists or whoever else is currently pulling their strings want them to do. This means responsible spending in accordance with our laws and a simple recognition of reality. Unless and until this starts to happen, we are on the road to ruin, and everyone with two functioning neurons to rub together knows it. We'll be following every other failed society if we do otherwise, and IT DOESN'T NEED TO HAPPEN!

/rant

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at January 15, 2013 11:05 AM (yiIja)

356 I see dead boners.... they are EVERYWHERE.
Posted by: fixerupper at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (nELVU)


I laughed. A LOT.

Starring Helen Thomas as "Pizza the Hutt"
Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 15, 2013 11:03 AM (sbV1u)


DO NOT RUIN PIZZA FOR ME. :-P

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 15, 2013 11:05 AM (4df7R)

357 Are these the same GOP Congressmen that put the kabosh on Plan B? If so, they are definitely of the LIB coalitionwhich is good but they are doing it wrong. LIB is supposed to makethelow information voter realize that its the dems thatstarted the out of control fire. So far these LIB congressmen have done their best to keep the perception of blame on the GOP.

Posted by: polynikes at January 15, 2013 11:05 AM (m2CN7)

358 Well, there you go, you did it now. BC will be upping his posting count.
Now it will be endless pictures of boobehs just to generate comment
volume.


Boobeh spam isn't technically considered spam.

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 11:06 AM (GQ8sn)

359 We really did miss a golden opportunity to dump the orange one. Too bad no one had the balls to step up and run against him. I get that its the job the speaker to negotiate, he just sucks at it.

Posted by: BSR: Live from Falls Church


*Sobs* I hate you! You don't understand....he's the Captain of America and I love him!

*Slams door, throws one pillow, buries head in other.* *SOBS*

And I'm not ORANGE! All my girlfriends love my coppery tone!

Posted by: Joanne Boehner at January 15, 2013 11:06 AM (BrQrN)

360 The GOP leadership, which stands for business as usual, doesn't know what to do with a party that doesn't.

They think this is a replay of Bubba Clinton and Newt, but Bubba has been replaced by Hugo Chavez.

And the GOP leadership is not Newt.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 11:06 AM (GFM2b)

361 To MWR, yes, it did indeed kill my appetite. XD
As for THIS:


I see dead boners.... they are EVERYWHERE.


Posted by: fixerupper at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (nELVU)


I am only just now recovering from the roaring laughter. Wow, I needed that. XD

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate at January 15, 2013 11:07 AM (v07al)

362 I do not share your confidence that Obama would not break the law.

Huh? Maybe I misread your post, but I thought you were saying that Obama had promised to pay entitlements ahead of debt. Which is what I'm saying would happen no matter what TFG had said.

If you meant that he would prioritize debt ahead of entitlements... how? He doesn't control spending. He doesn't get to write the checks. The House does. The law is already written that says HHS and SSA and DoD get to pay their bills even during a shutdown. None of that goes through the President. He can't order HHS and SSA and DoD to make their checks out to our foreign lenders. That's not within his power, let alone authority.

Or did you miss the part where I'm not terribly concerned by our failure to pay our credit cards for a couple of months?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 11:07 AM (/eBe8)

363 *Sobs* I hate you! You don't understand....he's the Captain of America and I love him!



*Slams door, throws one pillow, buries head in other.* *SOBS*



And I'm not ORANGE! All my girlfriends love my coppery tone!

Posted by: Joanne Boehner at January 15, 2013 11:06 AM (BrQrN)



That would be funny if it wasn't true.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 15, 2013 11:07 AM (da5Wo)

364 Stop noticing things. You're not suppose to notice that. Um... teh gehys! Abortion! Binders!
Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 11:00 AM (TULs6)

Want to buy an Establishment Republican rifle? I has never been fired, and only dropped once.

Posted by: Invictus at January 15, 2013 11:08 AM (OQpzc)

365 Captain, in actuality Plan B was something that
should have not happened at all. Boehner was all cute and became Mr.
Wheeler-Dealer instead of following the Constitutional order for
Budgeting.

Posted by: Minuteman at January 15, 2013 10:32 AM (YOWAW)


You may well be correct, but that wasn't the point of my comment; rather it was that Mr Wheeler Dealer is completely inept when it comes to keeping the troops in line ,ie. being a fucking leader. Which, btw, Gabe completely ignores in his knee jerk need to blame everything on conservatives. When Pelosi had to get her dimwits in line for Bammycare, she cut the fucking nuts off all those "blue dog" catamites and had them all marching at her heel like the gelded eunuchs they were and are. That is completely lost on Admiral Wrongway Peachfuzz Boehner, who can be bought and sold for a shot of Kesslers and would rather be smoking cigs and weeping about being born over a bar than do one iota of arm twisting that goes along with the job.

I know it's popular to pile on McConnell here, but he does more in a minority leadership position than that orange skinned crying pile of shit who's in the skipper's seat.

Posted by: Captain Hate at January 15, 2013 11:09 AM (5lhIT)

366 Have to get my high maintenance, will never ever be satisfied till we get back to doing things according to the Constitution, self outta here.
Gee this one was fun.

Posted by: teej at January 15, 2013 11:09 AM (8Jp6C)

367 Want to buy an Establishment Republican rifle? I has never been fired, and only dropped once.


She say soul brotha GOP too beaucoup.

* holds out hands about a foot apart *

Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 11:10 AM (GQ8sn)

368 Wife scheduled a procedure late last year for this month. $100 co-pay. Gets a call yesterday. As of Jan 1, 2013 co-pay is now $500. Affordable Health Care.

Posted by: SurferDoc at January 15, 2013 11:10 AM (6H6FZ)

369 Guess I'm high maintenance too because of wanting to hold my ground. I should just go along to get along.

Posted by: Burn the Witch at January 15, 2013 11:11 AM (ROv35)

370 Then the "high maintenence" is more closer to the squishy middle than the hard right. Posted by: rickb223 at January 15, 2013 11:02 AM (GFM2b)
Tell me something that you have been satisfied with that the GOP has done. Hell theyhad zero votes for Obamacare and the HMC were screaming that these RINOs didn't do enough andput the blame onthe GOP.

Posted by: polynikes at January 15, 2013 11:13 AM (m2CN7)

371 Since when is 'balance the budget' considered 'far right?' Isn't it common sense, not a spot on the political spectrum, to balance the fucking books?

If spending isn't the problem, according to Barack Gump the famous economist, why not just stop collecting taxes? We are already borrowing 40%, why not borrow 100%?

Posted by: Schwalbe: The Me-262© at January 15, 2013 11:13 AM (UU0OF)

372 Boobeh spam isn't technically considered spam. Posted by: EC at January 15, 2013 11:06 AM (GQ8sn)

Well hell, there it is in black and white in the Code of Moron Regulations:

"§ 2391(a)(1) Nothwithstanding any other provision of §2687 regarding post content, links to pictures of boobehs, bresticles, baby lambs, pointy elbows, sweater puppies (or in the case of Tara Rosenblum, sweater buffalo), unreasonably short skirts, kittehs, and manatees, shall not be considered spam subject to penalties prescribed under §1502(a). This section does not apply to any post content related to longbows or crossbows (see §3007)"


I stand corrected.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 15, 2013 11:13 AM (sbV1u)

373 That may be a fine example of Ohio Orange Snake but it's no way too beaucoup.

Posted by: John Boehner at January 15, 2013 11:13 AM (evdj2)

374 Do you think even the average Obama voter is going to go to the mattresses to raise the debt ceiling for the EPA?

Why do you want to poison our children with dirty air and water?

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at January 15, 2013 11:14 AM (ZKzrr)

375 368 $100 co-pay. Gets a call yesterday. As of Jan 1, 2013 co-pay is now $500.

That must have been the "Patient Protection" part of PP/ACA.

Sigh...

SiD

Posted by: akula51 at January 15, 2013 11:15 AM (YesJa)

376 @257 David Clennon - best known for being the Stoner Dude in John Carpenter's The Thing. Not someone worth listening to.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at January 15, 2013 11:21 AM (DuH+r)

377 Related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5ssctlLNys

Posted by: Free Shit Army at January 15, 2013 11:24 AM (UZQM8)

378 Off Free Shit Sock!

Posted by: cajun carrot at January 15, 2013 11:24 AM (UZQM8)

379 Help me here Gabe, because I'm still totally lost as to what a compromise looks like.
In my mind (and perhaps I'm right) the "more conservative" members of the party would like to reduce government a whole heck of a bunch, more than is necessary to get spending in line (note this != "more than is needed" or "more than is good.)
The democrats want to grow government.

Wouldn't a compromise (that the moderate Rs as you call them) want to support is one that gets spending in line (or very very close to that?). It's a compromise for the "more conservative" party members too. But those offers have never been on the table. Usually there's some sham cuts but that's about it.
If the democrats aren't even coming close to that (again, the sham cuts) then it's not really a compromise, it's a concession for them, what is there to pull them into a coalition? But for some reason (fear of a shutdown) the Moderate R's run to that bullshit. How is that "compromise?" rather than concession?
(Also again, my post above under my house Hash as to what is really representing one's constituent.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at January 15, 2013 11:24 AM (Y0nDU)

380 just one more thing to add.

fkn media.

and alex's tea.

Posted by: ette at January 15, 2013 11:25 AM (nqBYe)

381 Posted by: Schwalbe: The Me-262© at January 15, 2013 11:13 AM (UU0OF)

You're talking to fuckers who haven't submitted a budget in four years and won't submit one for another Fore!

If the Pubs get the White House again, do a head fake on not releasing a budget...revel in the hypocrisy.

Posted by: cajun carrot at January 15, 2013 11:26 AM (UZQM8)

382 Caller on Chris Plante's show 5 mins ago:

"We threw out the English for less than what the government is doing to us now".

Posted by: ontherocks at January 15, 2013 11:27 AM (aZ6ew)

383 "But you also shake your fist at these other Republicans who, after all,are simply representing their constitutents that want to avoid a shutdown. As you say, "how dare they represent their constituents."

My ultimate point is that I'd like to avoid legislation like the fiscal cliff deal that could have been further to the right, if only the right had worked together.'"

Maybe you could start with not throwing conservatives under the bus every time something happens to Republicans. There are more moderate R's than conservative R's, especially in leadership, so why is all the blame cast on conservatives? The next step would be for leadership to stop kicking conservatives off their committees. Finally, how about including them in planning efforts instead the relegating them to the sideines,then expecting them to toe the line, a line which invariably means continually moving the country to the left.

Posted by: Jon In TX at January 15, 2013 11:28 AM (+A7/9)

384 Posted by: Jon In TX at January 15, 2013 11:28 AM (+A7/9)

Because racist.

Posted by: cajun carrot at January 15, 2013 11:30 AM (UZQM8)

385 I am sure I am demoralized for no reason. There must have been a battle we have won on some level during the last 4 years of the takeover by the progressives?

I mean something for the good of the country? i have forgotten while being constantly inundated with the rick rolling going on.

i srsly need a reminder. not snark.

Posted by: ette at January 15, 2013 11:30 AM (nqBYe)

386 ok maybe a bit of snark. still i am at a loss here.

Posted by: ette at January 15, 2013 11:31 AM (nqBYe)

387 The House should pass a new set of debt ceiling .. one just one.

There should be a a debt ceiling for every 3 months for the next two years.
Of course, they could set the ceilings so as to slowly reign in the debt.

Posted by: Islamic Rage Boy at January 15, 2013 11:33 AM (e8kgV)

388 Posted by: ette at January 15, 2013 11:30 AM (nqBYe)

There hasn't been one, and anyone who says otherwise is a liar.

Posted by: cajun carrot at January 15, 2013 11:33 AM (UZQM8)

389 The House should pass a new set of debt ceiling .. not just one.

There should be a a debt ceiling for every 3 months for the next two years.
Of course, they could set the ceilings so as to slowly reign in the debt.

Posted by: Islamic Rage Boy at January 15, 2013 11:33 AM (e8kgV)

390
Gabe, you liberal POS that helped get Romney the nomination, it's not the 'far right' congressmen that are causing the stuff to be further left, it is the lack of backbone of the liberal GOP members that is causing it.
You can't win an election being wishy washy no matter how much you want to stroke the Romney's and the McCain's. The few 'far right' congressmen have it right, it's time to differentiate between the two parties; no more having the GOP be the right ring of the socialist party in this country, and that is all that those GOP members that are trying to compromise away the country are, THEY ARE THE FAR RIGHT.......of the American Socialist Party.

Posted by: doug at January 15, 2013 11:34 AM (uJ8q7)

391 THEY ARE THE FAR RIGHT.......of the American Socialist Party.
Posted by: doug at January 15, 2013 11:34 AM (uJ8q7)

Theory of Relativity, not just for physics.

Posted by: cajun carrot at January 15, 2013 11:35 AM (UZQM8)

392 That damnable far right*, always wanting to slow down our national fiscal death spiral! Can't they see that many of our esteemed congress peoples are as useless as teets on a boar hog and can only win reelection if they can ride that death spiral to victory?!

And by "esteemed", I of course mean Republican --- what, is there some other way to judge a member of congress?

Death spiral for the win!

Posted by: Ken at January 15, 2013 11:40 AM (3ar4L)

393 I think this entire debt situation is analogous to a family that has a steady income, but decides to take out a new credit card to pay off the *minimum* required monthly payment on the old credit card, instead of cutting the cable TV.

But then, I don't lean Progressive, so I can see the situation honestly, unlike Ben Bernanke and the overwhelming majority of journalists. Naturally, I have to post my opinion here, whereas they get to spread their ideas before millions.

Posted by: D. at January 15, 2013 11:51 AM (FXdTf)

394 Adopting the slanted language of your enemy is a sure-fire way to rally your troops. That is all.

Posted by: The Poster Formerly Known as Mr. Barky at January 15, 2013 11:52 AM (qwK3S)

395
The next step would be for leadership to stop kicking conservatives off their committees.

Straw man. Those three were replaced by members withjust asconservative voting records. They weren't kicked because they were conservatives, they were kicked because they were assholes. Amash andHuelskampwere kicked becausethey weretroublemakers who spent as much time attacking the GOP as they did the Democrats.Schweikert was the leaker of the Sea of Gallillee story that embarrassed a dozen members during election season.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 11:53 AM (B2LxR)

396
There are more moderate R's than conservative R's, especially in leadership, so why is all the blame cast on conservatives?

The conservatives are the ones refusing to play ball with their colleagues. The "moderate" ones would much rather work a deal with the conservatives than the Dems. But when the conservatives say "screw you" to their colleagues and then go back to their districts to brag about how conservative they were, the "moderate" Republicans are left with little choice but to work with Democrats if they want to keep their seats.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 11:55 AM (B2LxR)

397 The GOP is caving? I'm shocked, shocked!

Posted by: Tonic Dog at January 15, 2013 12:00 PM (X/+QT)

398 Just.Do.Nothing.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 15, 2013 12:01 PM (evdj2)

399 15

Fuck that noise. It's funny how it's always the "far right" who refuses to work with "their Republican colleagues," and never the "Republican colleagues" who are refusing to work with the "far right."
Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 15, 2013 09:20 AM (/eBe>>
>>>
>>
>
>
This kind of division warms the heart of trolls and shitstains everywhere. You should be duly proud, Allen.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:04 PM (Es6pN)

400 390
Gabe, you liberal POS that helped get Romney the nomination, it's not the 'far right' congressmen that are causing the stuff to be further left, it is the lack of backbone of the liberal GOP members that is causing it.
Posted by: doug at January 15, 2013 11:34 AM (uJ8q7)>>>
>>
>
>
This kind of division warm the hearts of trolls and shitstains everywhere. You should be duly proud, Doug.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:06 PM (Es6pN)

401
The "moderate" ones would much rather work a deal with the conservatives than the Dems.

What fucking deal? The conservatives don't control the Senate or the veto pen. May as well be thatthey would much rather work a deal with William Howard Taft.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:08 PM (TULs6)

402
You're perpetuatinga fiction that the moderates had to deal with the dems because the true cons wouldn't compromise.

But the moderates would have had to deal with the dems regardless. This is just deflecting blaim.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:09 PM (TULs6)

403
That is completely lost on Admiral Wrongway Peachfuzz Boehner, who can be bought and sold for a shot of Kesslers and would rather be smoking cigs and weeping about being born over a bar than do one iota of arm twisting that goes along with the job.
I know it's popular to pile on McConnell here, but he does more in a minority leadership position than that orange skinned crying pile of shit who's in the skipper's seat.
Posted by: Captain Hate at January 15, 2013 11:09 AM (5lhIT)
>>>
>>
>
This kind of division, blah blah blah. You should be duly proud, Captain. Ah-blah, ah-blah, ah ...... blahhhhhh.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:10 PM (Es6pN)

404
Posted by: Bill Kilgore

Wow you're really a broken record aren't you? Are you duly proud?

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:13 PM (TULs6)

405
What is a true con? A person who eschews scientific method for "the word of God?" A person who insists the earth is only as old as the Old Testament says? A person who blasts Muslim extremist social policies, but supports American politicians who call apregnancy conceived from rape to be God's blessing? I'm. Just. Wondering.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:14 PM (Es6pN)

406 Is this one of those shutdowns where 95% of the budget is deemed "critical" and they payments keep going out. Only cops/teachers(sic) are affected?

Or would this be a real shutdown? Don't answer that.

Hold firm on the debt ceiling and many of our problems will be solved!

Posted by: Tonic Dog at January 15, 2013 12:15 PM (X/+QT)

407 I'm a broken record? How do you think the "true cons" sound to anybody with half a brain and the will to succeed politically? Take your time. I'll wait.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:15 PM (Es6pN)

408 Boring troll is boring.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 15, 2013 12:16 PM (evdj2)

409
What is a true con?

Me? I use that term as short-hand for the "far-right" or whatever Gabe is talking about. The faction oppositionally defined to the RINO faction. Matters not to me what we call them.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:18 PM (TULs6)

410
How do you think the "true cons" sound to anybody with half a brain and the will to succeed politically?

LOFL, this comes from the unity troll? Such divisiveness! You should be duly proud of yourself.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:20 PM (TULs6)

411
The true con's are doomed to go the way of the moral majority. It's been a fun ride, now please just disappear and let culture evolve. Buh-bye.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:20 PM (Es6pN)

412
LOFL.

Where did the unity trolling go? Can't you even bother to try to sockpuppet or something? You can't just do 180 like that.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:22 PM (TULs6)

413 Bill Kilgore, you are warming the hearts of trolls and shitstains everywhere with that kind of division!

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:23 PM (TULs6)

414
True cons are such deep thinkers - they are radically principled to their core beliefs, possess sincere spiritual intentions and are deeply patrioti(skip!) patrioti(skip!) patrioti(skip!) patrioti(skip!) ....

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:24 PM (Es6pN)

415
Entropy, you're ignoring my point, like so many other folks above did. So I will rephrase, yet again.

We have a problem. There are several stakeholders that are negotiating over how this problem is solved, or if it is even to be solved. Those stakeholders, as I see it, are the House conservatives, the rest of the House GOP, the House Dems, the Senate Dems, and the WH. (note, the Senate GOP is so weak right now, we can skip them)

Generally, the stakeholderswill have to negotiate with each other in sequence. Sometimes, though, as I explain below,not at all

How do we get to an optimum solution, that is, the most conservative deal possible to be negotiated?

Well, start from therule of negotiationthat we should start our negotiations with a strong position as far to the right as we can get. And thenuse that position to keepeach subsequent negotiation as far to the right as possible. For example, the best we can hope for is this:

House cons and House GOP work out a unified House GOP deal.
House Dems get left out.
The unified House GOP deal pulls the Senate Dems to the right.
The ultimate Senate deal is further to the right than it otherwise would have been and the WH signs it.

What we are getting instead is this:

House cons take their ball and go home.
House GOP works out a deal with House Dems. (NOTE: this deal is further left than a unified GOP deal would have been.)
The House deal doesn't pull the Senate Dems as far to the right as the unified House GOP deal would have.
The ultimate Senate deal is to the left of where it would have been and the WH signs it.

Thus, the House cons' decision to give their GOP colleagues the finger and then go boast to their constituents about how conservative they are results in a deal that is further to the left than it otherwise would have been.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 12:25 PM (B2LxR)

416 Yeah, *I'm* the broken record.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:25 PM (Es6pN)

417
Oh look. I broke his hinges. Seems the term "true con" was just too much for him.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:25 PM (TULs6)

418 True con = someone who doesn't agree with ME.

RINO = someone who doesn't agree with ME.

You will notice that whatever disagreements the democrats have amongst themselves, they seem to be able to act as a unified force in Congress.

Unity and party discipline, how does it work?


Posted by: Miss Marple at January 15, 2013 12:26 PM (GoIUi)

419
Well, start from therule of negotiationthat we should start our negotiations with a strong position as far to the right as we can get. And thenuse that position to keepeach subsequent negotiation as far to the right as possible.

Then why didn't we do that? Boner could have taken a vote on keeping 100% of the tax cuts and he would have gotten held his whole caucus.

House cons and House GOP work out a unified House GOP deal.
House Dems get left out.
The unified House GOP deal pulls the Senate Dems to the right.
The ultimate Senate deal is further to the right than it otherwise would have been and the WH signs it.


It doesn't actually work that way. Epic proceduralism. Like the whole outcome of the 'negotiation' hinges on 1 sides opening gambit. Give me a break. None of this shit matters at all.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:29 PM (TULs6)

420
One of the funny things, Kilgore, is that you seem to think I'm a true con.

You're just racking up points left and right.

I'm not even a con.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:29 PM (TULs6)

421 At least 25% of the defense program is pure pork. Nevertheless, all self described conservative go stark raving nuts whenever anyone mentions that it could be or should be cut.

Posted by: VADM (Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Dispatches) at January 15, 2013 12:32 PM (3xuEM)

422 Discussing the finer points of congressional strategizing with Entropy is like teaching a toddler calculus. He couldn't do it if he wanted, but rather than admit its beyond his grasp, he just says "Thith ith THTUPID" and heads for his big wheel.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:33 PM (Es6pN)

423 Bill, knock it off.

Posted by: Gabriel Malor at January 15, 2013 12:34 PM (B2LxR)

424
okay.

Posted by: Bill Kilgore at January 15, 2013 12:35 PM (Es6pN)

425 I still find it hillarious that I made him drop the faux 'unity' shtick in about 12 seconds. That's gotta be a record or something.

Posted by: Entropy at January 15, 2013 12:35 PM (TULs6)

426 Obama would love a shut down

Posted by: occam at January 15, 2013 12:46 PM (hgDJr)

427
"Straw man. Those three were replaced by members withjust asconservative voting records. They weren't kicked because they were conservatives, they were kicked because they were assholes. Amash andHuelskampwere kicked becausethey weretroublemakers who spent as much time attacking the GOP as they did the Democrats.Schweikert was the leaker of the Sea of Gallillee story that embarrassed a dozen members during election season."
I don't think you understand what a strawman is. I said they were kicked off. They were. You want to say why they were kicked off, which isn't a strawman at all. Now, what's funny is that you say they were kicked off because they were "assholes". I guess they were assholes for not going along with leadership plans, which is pretty much the synthesis of your entire post, only against the "far right" this time. Conservatives see it differently. I never saw one article that pushes the line you are.
"Politico Reporter Jake Sherman confirms that rumors coming from Quayle campaign blaming David Schweikert for leaking story are false". So if you have evidence that Schweikert did leak it, then post it.
"The conservatives are the ones refusing to play ball with their colleagues. The "moderate" ones would much rather work a deal with the conservatives than the Dems. But when the conservatives say "screw you" to their colleagues and then go back to their districts to brag about how conservative they were, the "moderate" Republicans are left with little choice but to work with Democrats if they want to keep their seats."
Yeah, it's always the conservatives refusing to play ball. When do the moderates play ball? Oh yeah, when they agree with the Dems. Maybe moderates should be more concerned for the country than keeping their seats. I mean really, how much different would things turn out if the Dems held those seats. I guess we could be saddled with Obamacare. Oh wait. I guess we could be saddled with 16T in debt. Oh wait. I guess we could get S-CHIP and NCLB. Oh wait. I could go on and on, but pretty much, the Dems have gotten nearly everything they wanted already anyway, at least to some degree. What have conservatives gotten? Low taxes? Sort of. Outside of that, pretty much squat.

Posted by: Jon in TX at January 15, 2013 12:57 PM (PYAXX)

428 Obama would love a shut down

Then it's a win-win, dunderkind.

Posted by: toby928© at January 15, 2013 01:09 PM (QupBk)

429 Oh, heavens, yes, let's avoid a shutdown because Obama would "love it." Whatever we do, let's not make the hard arguments or try to point out that a shutdown isn't such a bad thing.

This is pathetic.

The GOP's primary function in American politics
since the New Deal has been to (A) slow down the pace at which America
moves down the trajectory set by the left without changing said
trajectory in the slightest, and (B) to prevent a genuine opposition
movement from taking root and rising up by channeling into the GOP the
energies that would otherwise be spent building such a movement?

I'm going LP. There's no reason at all to support the GOP anymore.

Posted by: Mr. Estrada at January 15, 2013 01:39 PM (Ja0Ds)

430 "This seems, to me, to be skipping past the immediate problem, the debt ceiling, in favor of fantasizing about a supposedly easier fight to be had months from now."

Hey, now. That's a perfect plan. It works every time!

Posted by: GalosGann at January 15, 2013 01:42 PM (T3KlW)

431 Gabe, 1995 was a long time ago.

Let it go.

Posted by: eman at January 15, 2013 01:46 PM (tBnjP)

432 "Obama would love a shut down"

After a time, Obama may find that having is not so pleasing a thing, after all, as wanting.

It is not logical, but it is often true.

Posted by: GalosGann at January 15, 2013 01:47 PM (T3KlW)

433 Nope, what's happening is

Obama moves to Left.
Right Wing holds to Republican platform.
Center Left GOP abandons Republican platform.
Center Left GOP joins with Harry Reid "to get past this".
Obama signs legislation.

Nobody elected these Republicans to give up and work with Democrats. Instead of preserving their seats, they are certainly going to be destroyed in 2014, when they get flak from both Left and Right.

Posted by: Chris Balsz at January 15, 2013 03:56 PM (H/NTD)

434 Malor is an attorney, and he definitely thinks like one. As an attorney, I can spot that detached legal reasoning immediately.

What he doesn't really understand is the emotional level - that he and his moderate ilk are offering conservative voters perpetual "lesser of two evils" situations and can't understand why they aren't ok with it.

And this "lesser evil" choice is the only one constantly offered. Rarely do we hear of a "good" sought or obatined that we can rally behind, or a fight worth fighting and "dying for". It's always a "take it on the chin now, and MAYBE in six months we MIGHT be able to have an edge in another matter". So, as an example, either voters concede to :having two limbs cut off" as ti were, or they "let" the Dems cut all four off, because the Dems think being a limbless torso that has someone else care for is A-OK, and the masses are dumb enough to agree. The conservatives don't want to have all four limbs cut off, or any for that matter, can't understand why that would be a "good thing" at all, or why they should roll over and accept such a settlement situation without fighting?

If you can't understand why people won't rally behind that "position" over and over and over, you're lost in the procedural fog, and in turn, blame those that aren't lost with ya.

Posted by: Saltydonnie at January 15, 2013 04:16 PM (v2B2W)

435 Can I have a damn budget please. If Reid doesn't give us that, shut the fucker down.

It's not even the Repubs fault, they've been asking for a budget for three years.

Posted by: Ken s at January 15, 2013 07:00 PM (caupe)

436 Does the Sandy bill include government subsidies to the Holocaust museums?
That is all I need to know right now.

Posted by: Gerbil Malodor at January 30, 2013 03:29 PM (T5dvf)






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