The New York Times discovers to their horror that Social Security is in dire shape

The late-to-the-DOOM-party New York Times discovers what I've been ranting about for several years now: Social Security is in far worse shape than the government admits.

Funny how the NYT only realizes this after they helped get their boyfriend Obama re-elected.

Even a Democrat propaganda sheet like the New York Times cannot ignore the obvious any longer. I just hope all those hopium-addicted Democrat voters remember to thank His Majesty the King when the crash comes.

UPDATED: Added obligatory DOOM cat.


Posted by: Monty at 12:12 PM



Comments

1 DOOOOMMM! And Monty.

My day is complete

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert (All my Hate cannot be found) at January 07, 2013 12:13 PM (8cJXl)

2 Wham Bam We're Screwed. UNEXPECTEDLY!

Posted by: joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at January 07, 2013 12:14 PM (MnSla)

3 Nice to see you again, Dr. DOOM. Hope all is well! I miss your morning posts. ;_;

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at January 07, 2013 12:14 PM (xw1VU)

4 Don't fool yourself. They can and will ignore the causes, and rail against the obstructionist Republicans for preventing meaningful reform.

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at January 07, 2013 12:15 PM (GsoHv)

5 "Let's use 401Ks to prop up Social Security!" in 3... 2... 1...

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 07, 2013 12:15 PM (e0xKF)

6 LOCK BOXX

Posted by: 2 x 4 at January 07, 2013 12:15 PM (CLjYf)

7 Hi Monty. How are things in the Wasteland?

Posted by: maddogg at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (OlN4e)

8 The more I see, the more convinced I am this Administration is more insidious than its most vocal "fellow travelers" realize.

A bunch of standard issue lefties are running around doing their bidding, and slowly waking up to the fact that these people in Washington are something else entirely.

Probably too late.

Posted by: BurtTC at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (BeSEI)

9 Monty sighting !

Posted by: Bill D. Cat at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (tZFXb)

10 From the link: "In the first presidential debate, Mr. Obama described Social Security as “structurally sound,” and Mitt Romney said that “neither the president nor I are proposing any changes” to the program. It was a rare issue on which both men agreed — and both were utterly wrong. "




As I recall, Romney didn't propose any changes to CURRENT recipients....but he did have a plan for the future recipients, yes?

Posted by: Tami at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (X6akg)

11 When will math genius ergie show up to hector us that social security is solvent forevvvvveeeerrrrr.

Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (XvBqx)

12 Posted by: BurtTC at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (BeSEI)

There's a reason they call them useful idiots.

Posted by: Vizzini at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (O7Q1u)

13 Monty! *tosses confetti*


I must say, I am still full of schadenfreude, though sadly not cheese fries, about all the butthurt on the Left about the payroll tax holiday expiration. Welcome to paying for what you want, bitches.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 07, 2013 12:17 PM (VtjlW)

14 "Also in the Times, see our exclusive report: Taxing the wealthy will not bring in enough revenue to do a damn thing. On newstands now!"

Posted by: CJ at January 07, 2013 12:17 PM (9KqcB)

15 Lib? No, Iwb. It Will Burn.

Posted by: bosk at January 07, 2013 12:18 PM (n2K+4)

16 You realize that this is jsut the liberal press smoothing the road for more tax hikes dont you?
We have to raise taxes and do the 5% govt 401K tax that they are talking about for the children to have something when they retire.
I guestimate less than 3 months before they seriously float the 5% govt 401k tax.


Posted by: retired military at January 07, 2013 12:18 PM (SElov)

17 Three lock box!

Posted by: Sammy Hagar at January 07, 2013 12:18 PM (b1VIZ)

18 How can it be doomed. I'm kicking in an extra 2% this year!

Posted by: polynikes at January 07, 2013 12:18 PM (m2CN7)

19 When Republicans talked about SS they are scaring granny and going to force her out in the street and eat cat food. Did the NY Slimes call for higher taxes and blame the Republicans for SS troubles?

Posted by: TheQuietMan at January 07, 2013 12:18 PM (1Jaio)

20 Anybody under thirty who voted for Obama should really contemplate whether they are too stupid to live.

What really frosts me is that the baby boomers have managed to mooch off of both their parents and their children.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:18 PM (T0NGe)

21 As I recall, Romney didn't propose any changes to CURRENT recipients....but he did have a plan for the future recipients, yes?
Posted by: Tami at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (X6akg)

You are correct.

Posted by: polynikes at January 07, 2013 12:19 PM (m2CN7)

22 NO SS REFORM!!!!!

FOR TEH FROZEN GAMMIES!!

Posted by: eleven at January 07, 2013 12:20 PM (KXm42)

23 Turnip. Tabletop vise.

Some assembly required.

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at January 07, 2013 12:20 PM (1OZSU)

24 A bunch of standard issue lefties are running around doing their bidding, and slowly waking up to the fact that these people in Washington are something else entirely.

I remember, I think it was Stanley Kurtz, relaying that some charity-minded liberals had visited the White House in 2009 and were struck by the fact that Obama seemed very uninterested at their attempts to help the poor. It was only when the conversation came around to hurting the rich that he got animated.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:20 PM (T0NGe)

25 "Let's use 401Ks to prop up Social Security!" in 3... 2... 1...
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 07, 2013 12:15 PM (e0xKF)



Yup. It's for Your Own Good. You don't want to have to worry about losing all value in your retirement because cds and other safe investments are paying out at 0.15% now, do you? Of course not. Trust the government, we wouldn't possibly let you down.


What's that? There's no actual vested rights to entitlements, let alone entitlements at a certain level? Don't you worry your pretty little head about that.


Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (VtjlW)

26 First they came for Social Security, then they came for the 401k's...

Posted by: Cricket at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (DrC22)

27 Shouldn't there be a cute puppy or kitteh photo to make this reading more palatable?

Posted by: andycanuck at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (jPVBi)

28 PETITION STATEMENT
We urge you to nominate Paul Krugman for Treasury Secretary. Krugman will protect Social Security and Medicare from benefit cuts, promote policies to create jobs, and help defeat the austerity dogma in Washington and around the world.

-Danny Glover

Posted by: RWC at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (fWAjv)

29 What really frosts me is that the baby boomers have managed to mooch off of both their parents and their children.

The Awesomest Generation.

Posted by: eleven at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (KXm42)

30 SS and Medicare are of course Generational Theft, moving money from the higher income (but still relatively less wealthy) youth to the lower income (but wealthier) elderly.

They don't note that however. Just "keeping old people out of poverty!"

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (Ssth1)

31 Anyone who thinks social security was ever stable is a fool.


It was a non-workable idea when Roosevelt created it.

Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 07, 2013 12:22 PM (bb5+k)

32 Barack Hoover Obama

We better make sure this stuff sticks to the Left despite the GOP's inclination to cover themselves in the same shit.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at January 07, 2013 12:22 PM (KDq5l)

33 I read that whole article and not once did they blame Bush. You sure it was an NYT article?

Posted by: Roy at January 07, 2013 12:22 PM (VndSC)

34 Social Security is in far worse shape than the government admits.

We got this! More spending...

Posted by: Il Douche at January 07, 2013 12:23 PM (FcR7P)

35 A bunch of standard issue lefties are running around
doing their bidding, and slowly waking up to the fact that these people
in Washington are something else entirely.

Probably too late.


Posted by: BurtTC at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (BeSEI)


Communist "useful idiots" have been working to enable Nazis. That's sort of how it worked out the first time as well.



Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 07, 2013 12:23 PM (bb5+k)

36 By the way I've been advocating for a monkey to take DrewM's coblogger place but having Monty post is much , much better than a monkey.

Posted by: polynikes at January 07, 2013 12:23 PM (m2CN7)

37 Don't sock me damn you.

Posted by: Michelle Ugenti at January 07, 2013 12:23 PM (SLhOh)

38 Check out #4 in the multimedia link. "In 2028, all people aged 55-59 predicted to die."

HOLY SHIT!!!! THAT'S ME!!!

Posted by: EC at January 07, 2013 12:23 PM (GQ8sn)

39 If I'm hit by a truck later today, I can die happy.

Monty!!

Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 07, 2013 12:23 PM (UOM48)

40 12 -

Which was fine, when they were "useful" to the Soviet government, and its rotten agenda. Well, not fine, but not as dangerous.

What I am wondering, and this may be naive on my part, is whether any of them will wake up and realize it's their own nation, and their own government being run by marxist revolutionaries, and whether that will cause some of them to change sides at some point.

Probably not.

Posted by: BurtTC at January 07, 2013 12:23 PM (BeSEI)

41 "They told me if I voted for Mitt Romney..."

Posted by: t-bird at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (FcR7P)

42 Austerity dogma? Fucking retard.

Posted by: eleven at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (KXm42)

43 It was a non-workable idea when Roosevelt created it.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 07, 2013 12:22 PM (bb5+k)



Now, that's not true. It's just that when Roosevelt created it, the retirement age just so happened to be older than the average life expectancy. The proles weren't supposed to live to collect.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (VtjlW)

44
For those who require a cute kittah pic, I present this for your ocular delight.


http://tinyurl.com/7taato7

Posted by: maddogg at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (OlN4e)

45 Aren't we all predicted to die?

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (A98Xu)

46 Monty pots DOOM! Should have known SS would draw him out.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (53z96)

47 29 What really frosts me is that the baby boomers have managed to mooch off of both their parents and their children.


----

You mean the children they didn't "choose" to put through a garbage disposal at Planned Parenthood...

Posted by: Jenny Tries Too Hard at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (b+8h9)

48 28 We urge you to nominate Paul Krugman for Treasury Secretary. -Danny Glover
Posted by: RWC at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (fWAjv)


St Paul has a blog post today letting us know that he's too big for the job

(and he loves his pussy)

Posted by: Cricket at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (DrC22)

49 Monty!!


Just toss a couple Obama coins ($1T) at the SS fund.


Problem solved!

Posted by: fluffy at January 07, 2013 12:25 PM (z9HTb)

50 I think the AARP is going to cancel their subscription to the Times.

Posted by: Roy at January 07, 2013 12:25 PM (VndSC)

51 Anybody under thirty who voted for Obama should really contemplate whether they are too stupid to live.



\Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:18 PM (T0NGe)



Life is going to give them the chance to find out. I think for a large chunk of them, the answer is going to be "Yes."





Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 07, 2013 12:25 PM (bb5+k)

52 Posted by: maddogg at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (OlN4e)

F you >-(

Posted by: RWC at January 07, 2013 12:25 PM (fWAjv)

53 Shouldn't we be talking about binders, tampons, free birth control and stuff?

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:25 PM (A98Xu)

54 Anyone who thinks social security was ever stable is a fool.


It was a non-workable idea when Roosevelt created it.


I think public pensions should be illegal.

I have no problem with defined-benefit contributions (401Ks) with no limit on employer matches, but no government should be held to the promises made by previous governments.

This applies to social security and public employee pensions.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:25 PM (T0NGe)

55 At this point Monty I think worrying about SS is just rearranging the deck chairs. The whole thing is going down.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:25 PM (53z96)

56 Steven Moore interviewed Boner after TFG finished with him, and said Boner was shocked, shocked that Obama believes our only spending problem was due to medical care costs.

Obamacare has fixed all of that, so all we need to do now is RAZ MOR TAXES!

Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 07, 2013 12:26 PM (UOM48)

57 By the way I've been advocating for a monkey to take DrewM's coblogger
place but having Monty post is much , much better than a monkey.


I was thinking Lemur, but ok.

Posted by: eleven at January 07, 2013 12:26 PM (KXm42)

58 It's simple.. we just need to raise more "revenue" to pay for it..... obama...

Posted by: Hello, it's me Donna let it burn really.really bummed at January 07, 2013 12:26 PM (9+ccr)

59 MONTY! Long time no doom!

The Gray (and increasingly Dessicated) Lady is an affront to the mythical profession known as "journalism."

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 07, 2013 12:26 PM (4df7R)

60 Hey Jane,

Any hotels around the Beaufort, SC you recommend for graduation? Making plans now.

Posted by: EC at January 07, 2013 12:26 PM (GQ8sn)

61 According to that chart at the NYT, we should actually be encouraging obesity. So in affect Michelle Obama is the number one enemy of social security solvency.

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at January 07, 2013 12:27 PM (NzBQO)

62 45 Aren't we all predicted to die?
Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:24 PM (A98Xu)


Wait until my death panel gets going!

Posted by: Dr Barack Omedicine at January 07, 2013 12:27 PM (DrC22)

63 Burning, burning, burning...
Rawhide!

Posted by: rickb223 at January 07, 2013 12:28 PM (GFM2b)

64 Social Security ran a deficit in 2010: It spent $49 billion dollars more
in benefits than it received in revenues, and drew from its trust funds
to cover the shortfall. Those funds — a $2.7 trillion buffer built in
anticipation of retiring baby boomers — will be exhausted by 2033, the
government currently projects.


What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?

Posted by: pep at January 07, 2013 12:28 PM (YXmuI)

65 Yet, no politician will say the truth, which is what Karl Denniger said:

"Likewise, older geezers (that would include me) have been promised
government benefits such as Social Security and Medicare. We paid into
these programs for years. But at the same time we also voted for people who already spent the money we paid in on other things,
much as you might spend the moneyfrom your piggy bank. Having done
that, and gotten the benefit from it, we now are demanding that we also get to spend the money again when we retire or get older."
===================
The ugly truth is, the FSA has a significant component of conscripts among the elderly. Even among those who self-identify as conservative.

Now, they'll say they paid in and were promised. And it's not fair to take it away, not even a penny.

But, what's fair about foisting that debt upon others?

Which is the greater evil?

Posted by: RoyalOil at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (imtbm)

66
What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?
Posted by: pep at January 07, 2013 12:28 PM (YXmuI)


Trust Funds = Printing press.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet, aka Jack July author of Amy Lynn available on Amazon. at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (l86i3)

67 You won't all die, some will be raptured like me.

Posted by: Zombie Jerry Falwell at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (L7std)

68 Yay doom, and where is my tomato soup

Posted by: the aristocratic leek at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (uFY4s)

69 What really frosts me is that the baby boomers have managed to mooch off of both their parents and their children.

The Awesomest Generation.


Posted by: eleven at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (KXm42)


Actually baby boomers did pay for their own bulge in the system TWICE though massive hikes that were supposed to get the bulge past. All the accountants said after the second hike that was accompanied by the reduction in benefits that it was now sound.

But that assumed that the government would not simply raise spending and use the SS money to do that.

So what did they spend the money on? The FSA of course.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (53z96)

70 What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?
Posted by: pep at January 07, 2013 12:28 PM (YXmuI)

We'd show you but they are in a lock box. A. lock. box.

Posted by: RWC at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (fWAjv)

71 "To save Social Security, which has lifted generations of elderly people out of poverty, ..."

Because they learned not to save for themselves. And I don't agree with the initial premise of "lifting generations...out of poverty."

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (A98Xu)

72 What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?
Posted by: pep


Are you one of us? No?

Then no.

Posted by: Top. Men. at January 07, 2013 12:30 PM (BrQrN)

73 Post election news can be boiled down to the following headline.

"It Turns Out The Tea Party Was Right About Everything"

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at January 07, 2013 12:30 PM (0q2P7)

74 You people should all calm down. Obamacare solves both rising healthcare costs and Social Security in one--er--fell swoop. Let the old people die!

"I actually think that the tougher issue around medical care — it’s a related one — is what you do around things like end-of-life care —"

Posted by: Cricket at January 07, 2013 12:30 PM (DrC22)

75 What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?>>

Sure over there in the file cabinets you will find IOUs worth trillions.

Posted by: Govt File cabinet guard with a great pension at January 07, 2013 12:30 PM (81UWZ)

76 They will simply propose a 30 percent VAT to close the gap

Posted by: the aristocratic leek at January 07, 2013 12:31 PM (uFY4s)

77 I probably pumped close to a couple hundred grand into this Ponzi scheme over the decades since I had my first job.

I'm quite sure I'll never see a dime of that money when I turn 65...mostly because I don't think the USA will exist when I'm 65.

Posted by: @PurpAv at January 07, 2013 12:31 PM (iHs4Z)

78 What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?
Posted by: pep

I'm right here!

Posted by: 50 Trillion Dollar Coins at January 07, 2013 12:31 PM (BrQrN)

79 Click the link at the NYT story to see their graphs.

Apparently, the SS Administration is predicting that everyone between the ages of 55-59 years old will die in 2028.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 07, 2013 12:32 PM (SY2Kh)

80 What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?


Posted by: pep at January 07, 2013 12:28 PM (YXmuI)

Oh, the printing press? Well it's right over the....I've said too much!

Posted by: Lil Timmy at January 07, 2013 12:32 PM (NzBQO)

81 43 -

Same thing as birth control, which was supposed to be for "darkies" and other assorted undesirables. Then when young, white "Christian" women started using it, well.....

Posted by: BurtTC at January 07, 2013 12:32 PM (BeSEI)

82 60
Hey Jane,

Any hotels around the Beaufort, SC you recommend for graduation? Making plans now.


Posted by: EC at January 07, 2013 12:26 PM (GQ8sn80



Best Western in Beaufort, across the street from the city marina. They're very Marine family-friendly, have graduation info, maps, etc. They're within walking distance of several great restaurants. Try Paninis.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 07, 2013 12:32 PM (UOM48)

83 I do not share Monty's belief that Social Security is doomed. The Burning Times and attendant collapse into savagery will occur long before SS actually becomes insolvent.

However, The Humungous does offer benefits, of a sort.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at January 07, 2013 12:32 PM (ll6WS)

84 I'm rich beeeyotch.


http://tinyurl.com/bqywn9z

Posted by: RWC at January 07, 2013 12:32 PM (fWAjv)

85 Monty are you still "Kindleing"> Wifey has done moved on to a Samsung Galaxy Tab 2 and she likes it better than the Kindle.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:33 PM (53z96)

86 Now, they'll say they paid in and were promised. And it's not fair to take it away, not even a penny.

But, what's fair about foisting that debt upon others?



I love asking that question to the senior cohort. The blank stares I get in response are priceless. I've gotten into some quite heated discussions with those who are firm on the I paid in the money is mine position. When I point out that I have been paying in as well and I will never ever ever see a penny and how is that fair, the response is more or less you're a liar and/or you figure it out. Saying that I am trying to figure it out is met with utter indifference.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 07, 2013 12:33 PM (VtjlW)

87 Same thing as birth control, which was supposed to be for "darkies" and other assorted undesirables.

*Sigh* I know, I know. The best laid plans and all that.

My bad.

Posted by: Margaret Sanger at January 07, 2013 12:33 PM (BrQrN)

88
Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 07, 2013 12:32 PM (SY2Kh)


Line up here. Men on the left, women on the right.

Posted by: Sammy Hagar at January 07, 2013 12:33 PM (b1VIZ)

89 Because they learned not to save for themselves. And I don't agree with the initial premise of "lifting generations...out of poverty."
Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (A98Xu)


The ugly truth is SS was meant for orphans and the eldery that could not care for themselves. Decades of lies by politicians have turned it into an entitlement, something it was never meant to be. The money is gone and we have no mechanisms to bring it back. If you are depending on it your screwed.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet, aka Jack July author of Amy Lynn available on Amazon. at January 07, 2013 12:33 PM (l86i3)

90 Tomorrow, the NYT op-ed will suggest bringing in specific experts known for working with this type of system. Most notably, Bernie Madoff.

Posted by: Roy at January 07, 2013 12:33 PM (VndSC)

91 It's really very simple.

As the SS trust fund is depleted, the Federal Reserve will lend money that it creates out of thin air to banks. The banks, in return will buy up all the Treasury securities needed to continue along this path. At some point, the SS OAP will become "needs-based", meaning that if you have a nice 401(k) or other wealth, you will be screwed out of your SS "pension".

In a normal country, this would lead to economic collapse under a mountain of hyper-inflation. As the world's largest economy, however, the USA may just get away with it.

Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:34 PM (V70Uh)

92 Remember that "pill" Obama referred to when the woman asked about her elderly mother who had an operation and lived a number of years more?

I think Obama is serious about expanding that program.

See: The UK "Death Pathways" program.

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:34 PM (A98Xu)

93 MONTY!!!

Posted by: Andy at January 07, 2013 12:34 PM (C/NnJ)

94 What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?
Posted by: pep at January 07, 2013 12:28 PM (YXmuI)

*****

They're right there, on that Excel spreadsheet.See? There with the red letters, commas and zeroes. Trust me.

Posted by: Gubmint Actuary at January 07, 2013 12:34 PM (1OZSU)

95 Shouldn't we be talking about binders, tampons, free birth control and stuff?

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:25 PM (A98Xu)



You mean the important issues that the election was decided on?

Posted by: TheQuietMan at January 07, 2013 12:34 PM (1Jaio)

96 In a normal country, this would lead to economic collapse under a mountain of hyper-inflation. As the world's largest economy, however, the USA may just get away with it.

Oh, I don't know about that.

Posted by: Math at January 07, 2013 12:35 PM (BrQrN)

97 Thanks for the DOOM cat, Monty.

Can we also have the DOOM logo?

Posted by: rickl at January 07, 2013 12:35 PM (zoehZ)

98 Ah, teh kitteh.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:35 PM (53z96)

99 Exactly, Quiet man.

Why all this talk of the Economy, SS and Cliffs?

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (A98Xu)

100 Not doomy enough! I demand grumpy cat!

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (NzBQO)

101 Isn't the SS "trust" fund, a lot like an Obama "promise"? Those words used to mean something.

Posted by: Roy at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (VndSC)

102 Wooo Hooo Monty!!!!!

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (/b8+5)

103 74 You people should all calm down. Obamacare solves both rising healthcare costs and Social Security in one--er--fell swoop. Let the old people die!


--------

Republicans want you to die quickly!

We, on the other hand, want you to die a little slower, and wait until you've paid enough taxes to keep your betters in golf shoes and designer gowns...

Posted by: Alan Grayson at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (b+8h9)

104 Best Western in Beaufort, across the street from the city marina.
They're very Marine family-friendly, have graduation info, maps, etc.
They're within walking distance of several great restaurants. Try
Paninis.


Thanks!

My wife wants to rent a house because her son's girlfriend's family wants to come to and she wants to be nice and make room for everyone. I said no, because that's not our responsibility and we're only staying for two nights. It's not a vacation. We're there and then we pick him up and go home.

Posted by: EC at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (GQ8sn)

105 Well at least it will be on the network news and paper now. The spouse keeps telling me all they have to do is get rid of waste and abuse! Honey, I know you depend on that check, and so will I in a few years, but let's not lie to ourselves eh?

Tellin ya, they totally lose objectivity at that point.

Posted by: jeanne at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (GdalM)

106 HAHAH...Monty added a cat to make this post 74.2% better.

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (A98Xu)

107 if you have a nice 401(k) or other wealth, you will be screwed out of your SS "pension".


So as long as I have a little bit of blood left they'll keep squeezing?

Posted by: The Anemic Turnip at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (1OZSU)

108 Speaking of hyperinflation, look at DOOM Kitteh's belly.

Posted by: t-bird at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (FcR7P)

109 Does anyone remember which post had the kitteh walking down the railroad tracks?


I have looked for that post for hours.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (53z96)

110 Kitty don't care about no DOOM.

Posted by: eleven at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (KXm42)

111 Because they learned not to save for themselves. And
I don't agree with the initial premise of "lifting generations...out of
poverty."

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (A98Xu)

Plus that's a broad statement, SS has maybe been around for 3 generations? The generation it was created for. The "Greatest Generation" and the Baby Boomers.
At best it lifted one out of poverty. And they were arguably only there as a result of the great depression.What was meant to be a safety net has instead become the default retirement plan (and so it's more likely than not kept the latter 2 generations in poverty.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (Ssth1)

112 What trust funds? Where are they? Can I see them, please?

Ahem. The "Trust Fund" is US Treasury bonds. So when SS was flush they drained it by having the SS fund buy US Treasuries, in that way giving the general fund money with which to operate. With of course the promise to pay it back from the general fund when the bonds matured. In this way SS was made into a generally funded program, first raided of excess funds now reimbursed by continued deficit spending.

The best part? The BEST PART!? Those Trillions tied up in US treasuries that SS is holding is NOT part of "US Public Debt" because it is "internal" to the government. So that big 16 TRILLION dollar number we keep banting about? Yeah it doesn't include the treasury bonds held by SS.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at January 07, 2013 12:37 PM (0q2P7)

113 This coming Friday will be the first paycheck ofr the new year for many. I'm looking forward to it, though I will take a whipping myself.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:37 PM (QupBk)

114 Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:29 PM (A98Xu)
Plus that's a broad statement,

Maybe, but it's right the fuck on.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet, aka Jack July author of Amy Lynn available on Amazon. at January 07, 2013 12:37 PM (l86i3)

115 You realize that, now, the NYT has done more to make the case for Social Security reform than the Republican Party leadership.

Posted by: AD at January 07, 2013 12:37 PM (IUieK)

116
Times readers look at that piece and think, "See, the Trust Funds are paying out and we're okay until 2053! Party on, Garth!"

So even though the piece is a dose of reality, it's only the tip of how truly boned we are.

Posted by: spongeworthy at January 07, 2013 12:37 PM (r5w1L)

117 As conservatives, do we really want to save Social Security?

I'm wondering if the smarter play is to let it blow up rather than fix it with proposals like raising the age of eligibility. Same with Medicare.

Personally, if I could opt out, I would take that deal in a heartbeat, the problem is, will society have the backbone to say "tough shit" if someone invests poorly and they're a broke senior citizen?

Posted by: McAdams at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (yXhiA)

118 Monty! DOOM! is what keeps me going on days like this.

Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 75% more DOOM! at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (xAtAj)

119 Well at least it will be on the network news and paper now.

Probably not in the way that you think. "After years of neglect by Republicans..." etc., etc.

Posted by: t-bird at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (FcR7P)

120 The SS trust fund is chump change compared to the national debt.

Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (V70Uh)

121 Excellent kitteh.

Posted by: Y-not's collies at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (5H6zj)

122 Monty are you still "Kindleing"> Wifey has done moved on to a Samsung Galaxy Tab 2 and she likes it better than the Kindle.

--------

Yep. I use a Kindle for basic book-reading, but I've converted my Fire to a generic Android tablet. It can still run the Kindle reading app just fine. If and when I upgrade the tablet, I doubt I'll get a Kindle Fire; I'll probably go with a Nexus tablet. But for book reading? A paperwhite Kindle is on my "buy next" list.

Posted by: Monty at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (4Pleu)

123 I wonder if learning stuff like this caused Mitt Romney to rethink his candidacy, perhaps, later than sooner?

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (/b8+5)

124 Personally, if I could opt out, I would take that
deal in a heartbeat, the problem is, will society have the backbone to
say "tough shit" if someone invests poorly and they're a broke senior
citizen?


Posted by: McAdams at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (yXhiA)

It's not going to go away. They're just going to raid our pensions and 401(k)'s to pay for it.

Posted by: HoboJerky, now with 75% more DOOM! at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (xAtAj)

125 The Horror. The Horror.

Posted by: Zombie Colonel Kurtz at January 07, 2013 12:39 PM (b1VIZ)

126 What was meant to be a safety net has instead become the default retirement plan (and so it's more likely than not kept the latter 2 generations in poverty.)
Posted by: tsrblke (work) at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (Ssth1)

That's exactly right.

One thing the left does well? Getting the masses rely on and expect entitlements.

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:39 PM (A98Xu)

127 Here ya go Vic... http://tinyurl.com/a76z7v4

Posted by: Tami at January 07, 2013 12:39 PM (X6akg)

128 I just hope all those hopium-addicted Democrat voters remember to thank His Majesty the King when the crash comes.

Yeah, good luck with that.

The very definition of a liberal - to paraphrase F. Scott Firzgerald - is to hold two opposing thoughts in the mind, and believe both of them.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 07, 2013 12:39 PM (1m6Ax)

129 Next up, story in Slime. Newspaper are fucking the walking dead.


Zombies rule!

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at January 07, 2013 12:40 PM (tWFaN)

130
What was meant to be a safety net has instead become the default
retirement plan (and so it's more likely than not kept the latter 2
generations in poverty.)
a massive welfare program.
Posted by: tsrblke (work) at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (Ssth1)


FIFY

Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:40 PM (V70Uh)

131 I'm wondering if the smarter play is to let it blow up rather than fix it with proposals like raising the age of eligibility.

It's not going to blow up in the sense of not paying out. What will happen is that some recipients will get clipped by means-testing and no real COLAs. Everyone else will just get clipped. Like getting only 50% of what they have been promised per month.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:41 PM (QupBk)

132 I just hope all those hopium-addicted Democrat voters remember to thank His Majesty the King when the crash comes.



Yeah, good luck with that.


Those that don't learn to accept reality will be swept away by it.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at January 07, 2013 12:41 PM (0q2P7)

133 Increasing retirement age to up around 70, and "means testing" "double/triple-dipper" payouts will be the next ploys to keep it "solvent".




Posted by: @PurpAv at January 07, 2013 12:41 PM (iHs4Z)

134 Remember that "pill" Obama referred to when the woman asked about her elderly mother who had an operation and lived a number of years more?

I think Obama is serious about expanding that program.


He doesn't care. He'll be long gone once the shit hits the fan.

Some people just want to watch the world burn.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:41 PM (T0NGe)

135 The very definition of a liberal - to paraphrase F. Scott Firzgerald -
is to hold two opposing thoughts in the mind, and believe both of them.


You know I think this is absolutely true.

Posted by: eleven at January 07, 2013 12:41 PM (KXm42)

136 The very definition of a liberal - to paraphrase F. Scott Firzgerald - is to hold two opposing thoughts in the mind, and believe both of them.
Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 07, 2013 12:39 PM (1m6Ax)


The problem with today's leftists is that they no only hold those two opposing thoughts inside their head, but they speak them aloud as if they weren't contradictory as hell.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 07, 2013 12:41 PM (4df7R)

137 The best part? The BEST PART!? Those Trillions tied up in US treasuries
that SS is holding is NOT part of "US Public Debt" because it is
"internal" to the government. So that big 16 TRILLION dollar number we
keep banting about? Yeah it doesn't include the treasury bonds held by
SS.


Incorrect. The amount currently owed to the SS "Trust Fund" is included in the $16 Trillion.

Unfunded liabilities, however, are not counted like they are in the private sector.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 07, 2013 12:41 PM (SY2Kh)

138 Yep
We'll keep on truckin'

Oh, did I say truck in'?

I meant suckin'...we'll keep sucking up all your disposable income

No families or kids for you under-thirty suckas !

Now go fetch me a bourbon and sweet tea chop chop
No

Posted by: The boomers at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (G9qZk)

139 The money is gone and we have no mechanisms to bring it back. If you are depending on it your screwed.>>

This is the part that pisses me off the most. When I started my career 25+ years ago I started saving knowing SS wouldn't be there for me. I was cruising along quite nicely until govt tinkering in the economy kicked me in the nadds. SO now even though I went without all those years I will likely get no benefit from my frugality.

Posted by: Buzzsaw at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (81UWZ)

140 I doubt I'll get a Kindle Fire; I'll probably go
with a Nexus tablet. But for book reading? A paperwhite Kindle is on my
"buy next" list.



Posted by: Monty at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (4Pleu)

When wifey expressed interest in the Fire I had her call SIL who has had one fr a while to see what she thought. There were a LOT of negative feedback reviews on the Fire due to the charging plug.
SIL recommended the Samsung Galaxy Tab 2 which was available at Wal Mart for $200. Wife loves it. And it is an Android and she is running the Kindle program on it.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (53z96)

141 As conservatives, do we really want to save Social Security?

I'm
wondering if the smarter play is to let it blow up rather than fix it
with proposals like raising the age of eligibility. Same with Medicare.

Personally,
if I could opt out, I would take that deal in a heartbeat, the problem
is, will society have the backbone to say "tough shit" if someone
invests poorly and they're a broke senior citizen?


Posted by: McAdams at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (yXhiA)

I understand the sentiment, but as long as SS exists the deck will be stacked against those of us who want to work without it. Salaries take into account the SS contribution (so do benefits needed to save.)So yeah, we need to somehow deal with it, otherwise we'll be screwed from both ends. (Even if that's reforming it out of existence.) Letting it blow up is not really an option.

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (Ssth1)

142 I think the lefties are pretty disappointed we're not dying off in the time frames they'd hoped for.

Reading about the Death Pathway in the UK and it's supporters is chilling. If Obamacare goes whole hog, they HAVE to implement that to bring costs down *cough*.

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (A98Xu)

143 Posted by: EC at January 07, 2013 12:36 PM (GQ8sn)

You're going to end up paying for everything anyway so maybe the house is the better alternative. Your wife realizes this, smart woman you got there.

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (/b8+5)

144 Like getting only 50% of what they have been promised per month.

BTW, does anybody know exactly what they "had been promised"? I've never heard a dollar amount.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (T0NGe)

145 I'm wondering if the smarter play is to let it blow up rather than fix it with proposals like raising the age of eligibility.

The honest thing would be to tell everyone 55 and under, you aint gettin it, start planning.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet, aka Jack July author of Amy Lynn available on Amazon. at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (l86i3)

146 This coming Friday will be the first paycheck ofr the new year for many. I'm looking forward to it, though I will take a whipping myself.

Amen.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (GFM2b)

147 115 -

"Republican Party leadership..."


Three words that do not belong together.

Posted by: BurtTC at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (BeSEI)

148 I was reading a DU thread posted before on the payroll tax holiday ending, and the libshits there kept saying SS going bankrupt are Rethuglican lieeees!!!111

It seems to be a play on words though, because while it's not going bankrupt as the word is technically defined it would become insolvent, and in the mid 2030s there would only be enough to cover 3/4s of the populace at the current payout rate. But this isn't going bankrupt.

They are absolutely convinced we just need a meager tax hike and social security would be funded for the next 500 years.

Posted by: Christina Hendricks's Mighty Jugs Would Look Right at Home in the Rockies at January 07, 2013 12:43 PM (+AV7H)

149 A paperwhite Kindle is on my "buy next" list.

Get one. I bought my Mom one for Christmas and not only does she love it (technophobe that she was) but I loved it so much I'll be getting one soon.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 07, 2013 12:43 PM (1m6Ax)

150 This should be printed out and nailed to every damn drone as well as all branches of the government. You can choose where to nail it.


http://tinyurl.com/azbgx8k

Posted by: RWC at January 07, 2013 12:43 PM (fWAjv)

151 BTW, does anybody know exactly what they "had been promised"? I've never heard a dollar amount.

I get a statement from the government at least yearly. Are you on the lam?

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:44 PM (QupBk)

152 @122

The Google Nexus is a great tablet. Wait. They have introduced the 3G tablet plus Wifi in the UK, so it will be coming here soon.

I got an Ipad for Christmas. OK it is nice, but every fucking thing on the store costs money, and half the apps I have on the Nexus are not even available.

The seven inch is nice, I know it's seven inches, it's half the length of my dick.

I am a dreamer.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at January 07, 2013 12:44 PM (tWFaN)

153 :::124 Personally, if I could opt out, I would take that
deal in a heartbeat, the problem is, will society have the backbone to
say "tough shit" if someone invests poorly and they're a broke senior
citizen?


Posted by: McAdams at January 07, 2013 12:38 PM (yXhiA) ::::

Not necessary. I would be happy to take in any seniors that want to learn new job skills, like picking oakum.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff Workhouses and Shanty-Town Condominiums at January 07, 2013 12:44 PM (ll6WS)

154 The very definition of a liberal - to paraphrase F. Scott Firzgerald - is to hold two opposing thoughts in the mind, and believe both of them.
Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 07, 2013 12:39 PM (1m6Ax)

*****

Without experiencing cognitive dissonance.

Posted by: Seamus Muldoon at January 07, 2013 12:44 PM (1OZSU)

155 Amish Dude,

Don't you receive an annual statement?

It tells you how much you should get.


Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:44 PM (V70Uh)

156 BTW, does anybody know exactly what they "had been promised"? I've never heard a dollar amount.


-----

You've never gotten a statement in the mail?

Posted by: Jenny Tries Too Hard at January 07, 2013 12:44 PM (b+8h9)

157 Accountants are telling people to have as much tax taken out of their paycheck as they possibly can so they aren't hit with a huge bill at tax time. Heard this from one or two people and now I'm hearing it from many many more so must be the right course?

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 12:45 PM (/b8+5)

158 Increasing retirement age to up around 70, and "means testing"
"double/triple-dipper" payouts will be the next ploys to keep it
"solvent".


They already do this for us feds. My wife's pension will be reduced because we're both Feds. Why my pension should have any bearing on hers is beyond me.

Posted by: pep at January 07, 2013 12:45 PM (YXmuI)

159 Just raid the 401's. That money is just sitting there. Get it in the game.

Posted by: RWC at January 07, 2013 12:45 PM (fWAjv)

160 Posted by: Tami at January 07, 2013 12:39 PM (X6akg)


Thank you Tami

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:45 PM (53z96)

161
You've never gotten a statement in the mail?
Posted by: Jenny Tries Too Hard at January 07, 2013 12:44 PM (b+8h9)


I get one every year. It's like a comedy in black and white.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet, aka Jack July author of Amy Lynn available on Amazon. at January 07, 2013 12:46 PM (l86i3)

162 You can now get your SS estimate online. ss.gov

Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:46 PM (V70Uh)

163 I get a statement from the government at least yearly. Are you on the lam?

Ah, that thing. It's not a bill, so I don't read it.

Yeah...I think that crap has to stop.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:46 PM (T0NGe)

164 You've never gotten a statement in the mail?

I get that statement every year and I laugh and laugh and laugh.

Then I drink heavily.

Posted by: Sean Bannion at January 07, 2013 12:46 PM (1m6Ax)

165 sorry. ssa.gov

Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:46 PM (V70Uh)

166 Never. You should withhold as little as the government will let you get away with. If you are worried about paying, start a dedicated savings account and put the money in there.

Take the meager .25% interest for yourself.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:47 PM (QupBk)

167 crap forgot the quote

Heard this from one or two people and now I'm hearing it from many many more so must be the right course?

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:47 PM (QupBk)

168 What if that "all people ages 55-59" predicted to die in 2028 isn't a prediction. What if it's the plan. The ultimate shafting of Gen X.

whatever. we're used to it.

Posted by: DCPensFan at January 07, 2013 12:47 PM (ma/2m)

169 I get one every year. It's like a comedy in black and white.

-------

One day, I'm going to record my husband reading his and mine and post it on YouTube. It's kind of scary.

Posted by: Jenny Tries Too Hard at January 07, 2013 12:47 PM (b+8h9)

170 I get those Social Security statements too. It's like those Publishers Clearinghouse Sweepstakes mailers, showing me the money I COULD get.

Posted by: EC at January 07, 2013 12:47 PM (GQ8sn)

171 I would be happy to take in any seniors that want to learn new job skills, like picking oakum.

We're spending to much on oakum. From now on, we'll do only half the seams. Should save on ship weight, too.

Posted by: Chuck Hagel at January 07, 2013 12:47 PM (YXmuI)

172 Ah, that thing. It's not a bill, so I don't read it. Yeah...I think that crap has to stop.
Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:46 PM (T0NGe)


You know what would save the gubmint some money? NOT SENDING THOSE DAMN THINGS OUT ANYMORE. (Please pardon the 'caps). The cost of printing and mailing all those envelopes has got to be at least a few billion dollars. It's not much, but Christmas, if we're not willing to quit spending the chump change then why even bother talking about the big stuff?

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 07, 2013 12:48 PM (4df7R)

173 "There's a reason they call them useful idiots.


Posted by: Vizzini at January 07, 2013 12:16 PM (O7Q1u)"

I remember reading something about the Communist Party in the USSR which indicated that nearly every important decision was made by about 3% of the party. Obviously, there was overlap between those decisions and what the other 97% of the party wanted, but the other 97% didn't have the authority to make those decisions, regardless.
Which means that, yeah, 97% of the party was made of up of useful idiots whose historical legacy is helping enable the murder of 20 million+ of their fellow citizens.

Posted by: BS Inc. at January 07, 2013 12:48 PM (eP0u9)

174 166 Never. You should withhold as little as the government will let you get away with. If you are worried about paying, start a dedicated savings account and put the money in there.

Take the meager .25% interest for yourself.
Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:47 PM (QupBk)

That's what I thought. Makes you wonder why different people's accountants are giving this advice.

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 12:48 PM (/b8+5)

175 BTW, does anybody know exactly what they "had been promised"? I've never heard a dollar amount.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (T0NGe)

You can get a statement by request from the SS admin. I used to get one every year from work. My retirement is actually based on that amount. My pension will decrease by that amount as soon as I start receiving SS.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:48 PM (53z96)

176 151 -

He's Amish, I think is the answer to your question.

Still, when I get my statement it's good for a chuckle, as either the money is NOT going to be there when I retire, or those numbers will be enough by then to possibly buy one loaf of bread per month.

Posted by: BurtTC at January 07, 2013 12:48 PM (BeSEI)

177 You're going to end up paying for everything anyway
so maybe the house is the better alternative. Your wife realizes this,
smart woman you got there.

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 12:42 PM (/b8+5)

Not paying for the gf's family. That's where I draw the line.

Posted by: EC at January 07, 2013 12:48 PM (GQ8sn)

178 The calculation for your benefit is pretty straight-forward. Look up the calculation on the website.

Don't act surprised when you realize that it REALLY is welfare. The benefits for the poor are disproportionately generous. After you have crossed the second elbow, there is not much reason to keep working if you don't have to.

Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:49 PM (V70Uh)

179 I like the SS statements because they list every year that I've paid FICA. The early years are cute. Like $62.00

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:49 PM (QupBk)

180
>>>Incorrect. The amount currently owed to the SS "Trust Fund" is included in the $16 Trillion.

I just checked the daily treasury report. I stand corrected. Apparrently I became confused between "Debt held by the public" and "Public Debt"

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at January 07, 2013 12:49 PM (0q2P7)

181 "does anybody know exactly what they "had been promised"?"

technically, you're not promised shit. See Flemming v. Nestor. SCOTUS ruled in the 60s that there is no contractual obligation to benefits.

Posted by: DCPensFan at January 07, 2013 12:50 PM (ma/2m)

182 Monty!!! Doom!!! My life is complete!

Posted by: San Antonio Rose welcomes back Monty and DOOM! at January 07, 2013 12:50 PM (bPJlD)

183 Makes you wonder why different people's accountants are giving this advice.

Perhaps their customers can't be trusted to save.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:50 PM (QupBk)

184 Vic,

Maybe not. My BiL (retired Navy Capt.) just started collecting his SS. No deduction for Navy pension. Apparently the rules were changed.


Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:51 PM (V70Uh)

185 technically, you're not promised shit. See Flemming v. Nestor. SCOTUS ruled in the 60s that there is no contractual obligation to benefits.
Posted by: DCPensFan at January 07, 2013 12:50 PM (ma/2m)


One of the reasons why it chaps my ass that we call these things "entitlements." You're not entitled to jack shit. Can we start calling them what they are please? Government liabilities?

The only people who should be entitled to anything are military vets.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 07, 2013 12:52 PM (4df7R)

186 The last SS statement that I received had a "promise" of around $800 a month if I retire at 65.

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at January 07, 2013 12:52 PM (YmPwQ)

187 Worst possible reaction to the statement in the mail, though--- My brother died a young single man, no kids. But he worked hard, made some decent money, paid in since he was 16. Of course the government doesn't see fit to give any of that money back to his family. Instead as we were scrambling around trying to clean out his apt in time to avoid paying more rent, making funeral arrangements, we get his statement detailing all the money they kept for a retirement Tomas would never have, or to provide for kids he'd never raise.

Posted by: Jenny Tries Too Hard at January 07, 2013 12:53 PM (b+8h9)

188 In the OSP plan, I would drop all benifits 5% a year until they are gone.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet, aka Jack July author of Amy Lynn available on Amazon. at January 07, 2013 12:53 PM (l86i3)

189 Save us, Obie Wan K'No-Budget! You're our only hope!

Posted by: Princess Deadbeat at January 07, 2013 12:53 PM (RDP+N)

190 #32 Barack Hoover Obama

The fiscal cliff deal was kinda like your first little rail. Anybody know where I can score an eight ball?

Posted by: Barry "Deviated Septum" Soetoro at January 07, 2013 12:53 PM (wAQA5)

191 Maybe not. My BiL (retired Navy Capt.) just started
collecting his SS. No deduction for Navy pension. Apparently the rules
were changed.

Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 12:51 PM (V70Uh)


Separate issue, mine is an actual choice I made to allow more money earlier. It was called the "SS option" and it did exactly what I described more money now but decreases later when SS kicks in by that amount.



The other two options were "lump sum" which I could not take at the time due to age and standard age 83 amortization.

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:53 PM (53z96)

192 If wishing for every executive, editor, reporter, pressman and janitor at the NYT to be stricken with incurable rectal prolapseand blue waffle disease is wrong, then I don't want to be right.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 07, 2013 12:54 PM (zF6Iw)

193 Welcome to paying for what you want, bitches.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 07, 2013 12:17 PM (VtjlW)


Yeah, if only it stopped there. Instead, I'm fucking paying for what they want. And most of them aren't.

*remembers why nobody will sell him a Rage-meter*

Posted by: BCochran1981 at January 07, 2013 12:54 PM (da5Wo)

194 What? SSI in trouble? Looks like those Ocare death panels are going to be real busy the next few years.....until the "problem" is solved, of course.

Posted by: Soona at January 07, 2013 12:54 PM (1hr+f)

195 Ace up

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 12:55 PM (53z96)

196 new Ace Doom up

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:55 PM (QupBk)

197 "$800 a month if I retire at 65."

There, just like the Times said, you've been lifted out of poverty!!

Posted by: mare at January 07, 2013 12:55 PM (A98Xu)

198 What really frosts me is that the baby boomers have managed to mooch off of both their parents and their children.
The Awesomest Generation.
Posted by: eleven at January 07, 2013 12:21 PM (KXm42)


I'm going with "economic pedophiles," myself

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 07, 2013 12:56 PM (zF6Iw)

199 The honest thing would be to tell everyone 55 and under, you aint gettin it, start planning.

My dad told me that forty years ago. However, he neglected to mention that Obama was coming.

Posted by: t-bird at January 07, 2013 12:56 PM (FcR7P)

200
But he worked hard, made some decent money, paid in since he was 16.[i/]


Contracting with a minor?

Posted by: Cicero Kid at January 07, 2013 12:58 PM (b1VIZ)

201 Mare, yes, and if I hold out and retire at, say, 72, the max is something around $1300 a month.
I'm going to Disney World!

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at January 07, 2013 12:59 PM (YmPwQ)

202 Posted by: Jenny Tries Too Hard at January 07, 2013 12:53 PM (b+8h9)

Yep and not enough people are told that current fica taxes go to pay current recipients, not future, so its just another tax, there is no lockbock, there is no technical promise of return.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at January 07, 2013 12:59 PM (69Mdf)

203 166 Never. You should withhold as little as the
government will let you get away with. If you are worried about paying,
start a dedicated savings account and put the money in there.



Take the meager .25% interest for yourself.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 07, 2013 12:47 PM (QupBk)



That's what I thought. Makes you wonder why different people's accountants are giving this advice.

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 12:48 PM (/b8+5)

Accountants have made a living convincing people a bigger return in better. So they have an incentive to tell people to over-withhold. FWIW, the only thing I'd caution is I think there's a penalty if your final withholding falls below some % of your total taxes. But you can just tack a bunch on withholding at the end (when you estimate your taxes) to avoid that.

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at January 07, 2013 12:59 PM (Ssth1)

204 barrel?

Posted by: Vic at January 07, 2013 01:00 PM (53z96)

205
16 You realize that this is jsut the liberal press smoothing the road for more tax hikes dont you? We have to raise taxes and do the 5% govt 401K tax that they are talking about for the children to have something when they retire. I guestimate less than 3 months before they seriously float the 5% govt 401k tax.


About a year ago articles started to appear talking about how awful Roth IRAs were, because they deprived the government of tax revenue. I expect that to be one of the first things that they go after. They'll tax the money when it goes in, and tax it when it comes out.

Posted by: Colorado Alex at January 07, 2013 01:00 PM (3x3F6)

206 Here is the story. I just confirmed it with my sister. My Bil received his first SS OAP payment the end Dec. His first of the year navy pension payment was NOT offset anything. Perhaps there is a lag and that will be "fixed". According to her, he looked into it and found that "they changed the rules."

Posted by: Al at January 07, 2013 01:02 PM (V70Uh)

207
I love how the NYT pretends Social Security has "assets"
Yeah, IOU's are assets.
Really. They are.

Posted by: Jay at January 07, 2013 01:02 PM (QEnFN)

208 Contracting with a minor?


----

That's one way to look at it. But of course it's different when the government does it, right?

Posted by: Jenny Tries Too Hard at January 07, 2013 01:02 PM (b+8h9)

209 About a year ago articles started to appear talking about how awful Roth
IRAs were, because they deprived the government of tax revenue. I
expect that to be one of the first things that they go after. They'll
tax the money when it goes in, and tax it when it comes out.

Wait, but Roth's tax when it goes in I thought? So what Tax money are they whining about?
(FWIW, when I use an IRA it's usually a standard, and it's usually just enough to acomplish some goal on my taxes to get my AGI below whatever I'm avoiding.

I figure all that pre-tax money combined with time will be more than post tax money combined with time minus the later taxes. But either one's a gamble (I'm gambling on either a collapse or tax reform lowering rates, vs. Status quo and increases.)

Posted by: tsrblke (work) at January 07, 2013 01:04 PM (Ssth1)

210 Wait, but Roth's tax when it goes in I thought? So what Tax money are they whining about?
The tax collected from money deposited in a Roth IRA is less than the tax break received when the money is withdrawn. That difference is what the left is complaining about.

Posted by: Colorado Alex at January 07, 2013 01:07 PM (3x3F6)

211 About a year ago articles started to appear talking about how awful Roth IRAs were, because they deprived the government of tax revenue. I expect that to be one of the first things that they go after. They'll tax the money when it goes in, and tax it when it comes out.

---

Which is why I stopped investing in the damn things when the JEF got elected.

I didn't want more money stuck in a place where I couldn't easily retrieve it.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 07, 2013 01:11 PM (e0xKF)

212 38 Check out #4 in the multimedia link. "In 2028, all people aged 55-59 predicted to die."

---------

CAROUSEL! RENEW! RENEW!

Posted by: Anachrond 5, blinking red at January 07, 2013 01:13 PM (IrbU4)

213 43 It's just that when Roosevelt created it, the retirement age just so happened to be older than the average life expectancy. The proles weren't supposed to live to collect.

---------

CAROUSEL! RENEW! RENEW!

Posted by: Anachrond 5, blinking red at January 07, 2013 01:14 PM (IrbU4)

214 Here's a mystery. Get an email asking me to listen to Beck. In the first hour he said his sources say the Republican party is done. Sidekick says "providing the truth comes out". Beck goes to commercial. Never says another word? Now, was only half listening but why the tease?

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 01:42 PM (/b8+5)

215 Its Simply New York Times.... We kill the batman.

Posted by: The Joker at January 07, 2013 01:43 PM (obHYs)

216 @213: LOL. Been too long since I've seen that movie...

Posted by: Tex Lovera at January 07, 2013 01:43 PM (wtvvX)

217 Welcome back, Doomster!!!

Posted by: Tex Lovera at January 07, 2013 01:44 PM (wtvvX)

218
The crazy part is that the last time I checked, the SS "trust fund" was "earning" like 4.5%. So we're paying imaginary money imaginary interest to pump up the value of the trust fund.


If cutting tiny amounts now is tough there's no way to cut the amounts necessary neededto pay off thetrust fund in the future - that money will need to be printed.


One interesting factoid about the SS funds being a part of the $16T debt is that if the SS bonds are paid off first with incoming revenue then that opens up the same amount under the debt limit for more borrowing. Don't believe the SCOAMF when he says that the debt limit will not allow SS checks to go out.

Posted by: lymond at January 07, 2013 01:45 PM (RxLT6)

219 144 BTW, does anybody know exactly what they "had been promised"? I've never heard a dollar amount.

---------

You should get junk mail from the Social Security folks every year around your birthday full of lies promises.

Posted by: Citizen Anachronda at January 07, 2013 01:49 PM (IrbU4)

220 I've been paying into SS since 1965. I know and KNEW it was a ponzi scheme. What bothers me is that I saved privately and didn't take a bunch of frivolous vacations, expenses, etc. Now, since I have private money ( 401k)they will want to take it away (means test) so I can finance my wasteful neighbors retirement. Never been to Hawaii. Been to mexico but that isn't going to happen again.Also paid off an ex-wife :-)
Paid hundreds of thousands in and now they want my private money? Of course they do.

Posted by: free tibet with purchase of equal value tibet at January 07, 2013 01:53 PM (fHWdz)

221 Everyone has already stripped their 401k's. Better to use all the government employee pensions and all the union employee pensions. If you think SS can be "propped up".

Posted by: Caustic at January 07, 2013 01:56 PM (/b8+5)

222 DOOM Cat?

Want!

Posted by: logprof at January 07, 2013 02:16 PM (StDOM)

223
That was a nice little tastefrom the Doomster.
But when do we get the Full Monty?

Posted by: Ron Penfound at January 07, 2013 02:31 PM (Q1DS+)

224 "What really frosts me is that the baby boomers have managed to mooch off of both their parents and their children." --the so-called Amish Dude.

That is well. May it continue to frost you for the rest of your little life.
You assert this to be true of at least 50.1% of all persons born between 1946 and 1964, based only on their date of birth. This is why you are forced to make your living as an arithmetic teacher. So much rage, so little consequence.


Posted by: comatus at January 07, 2013 02:31 PM (qaVK+)

225 You should get junk mail from the Social Security folks every year around your birthday full of lies promises jokes.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at January 07, 2013 02:48 PM (DXlwL)

226 Late to thread but must add "Monty! Yay!" I appreciate your doom threads because they give name and form to the horror I can *feel* coming. And that helps make manageable.

Posted by: Polliwog the 'Ette, still a Hobbit at January 07, 2013 03:11 PM (wbeNt)

227 I disagree with some conservatives though that say we should means test SS, that really does seem to me that you're punishing people who save or are successful. I also think you'd see people gaming the system where they liquidate everything and then plead poverty when they got close to retirement.

If Democrats start going after 401ks and Roths to pay for SS, they really are going to scare the shit out of the middle class. Maybe they'll finally stop worrying about stupid shit like free birth control.

My guess is it will never be "fixed" until it crashes, which is why I think it's almost suicidal for Republicans to address it. We've known what's coming for around 40 years and yet we still couldn't hit the brakes because people won't get it until it blows up.







Posted by: McAdams at January 07, 2013 03:31 PM (yXhiA)

228 @43 Alexthechick

Please be careful or you will be put in your place by a stupid liberal (BIRM) due to a technicality.

Life Expectancy is an average and skewed by infant mortality. The greater number of people dying in childhood the lower the life expectancy.

So to say life expectancy was 65 in 1938 or whenever this monstrosity was created (and infant mortality higher) is misleading. You're walking into a trap: Working people did live to collect.

The problem is many people NOW are living well into their 80s and the system hasn't really been adjusted.

I do not know the origins of the SS design. But, as we all know, it is a Ponzi scheme. Money is not save or invested. You have no account. The money instead is passed from young Peter to pay older Paul. That's another problem as we all know. Not enough Peters.

So I suspect this design was chosen for the Great Depression was deflationary. Then, as now, they didn't want people saving just spending. Take Peter's money before he saves it (to where we can't rob it). They want an inflation bias. So Grandma is now dependent on Uncle Sam and thanks to him is always behind the inflation eight ball. Wall St has nothing on Uncle.

SS when not stolen, I think, returns 2%. The Harvard endowment returns, what? 14%.

We should be thanking our government (and him) for all this benevolence.

Posted by: Sefton at January 07, 2013 07:12 PM (mLJfI)






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