Plan C: Boehner Says He's Done Negotiating Directly With Obama

A day late and a couple of hundred billion dollars short.

In closed-door meetings since leaving the “fiscal cliff” talks two weeks ago, lawmakers and aides say the Speaker has indicated he is abandoning that approach for good and will return fully to the normal legislative process in 2013 — seeking to pass bills through the House that can then be adopted, amended or reconciled by the Senate.

"He is recommitting himself and the House to what we've done, which is working through regular order and letting the House work its will,” an aide to the Speaker told The Hill.

He should have been doing this all along but better late than never I suppose.

Of course this isn't simply about Boehner finally realizing he sucks at negotiating, it's also about the fact that the next two big showdowns (the debt ceiling and a Continuing Resolution to fund the government through the end of the fiscal year) aren't likely to go any better for the GOP. Boehner's basically saying, call me when you're done I'm not going to get blamed for the next rounds of failure by myself.

Oh, you still think the GOP isn't going to cave on the debt ceiling and will go to the mattresses and shut down the government over the CR? Adorable.

I posted this yesterday at my little blog. I figured I'd spare you for a day from the most depressing part of this whole mess.

First, the concession the GOP got from the last debt ceiling hike was $1.2 trillion in cuts that have now been postponed. Assuming the next debt hike is in the same range that means we’ll have to get another $1.2 trillion in cuts for a total of $2.4 trillion just to keep pace with the debt hikes.

Does anyone honestly believe that’s going to happen in two months when we couldn’t find the first set of cuts in over 15 months?

So these “huge” $2.4 trillion cuts (that will never materialize) won’t even begin to touch the $16.5 trillion and growing debt we already have rung up.

And even in some fairy tale world where these cuts are made and are real, the Democrats will want more revenue as part of any deal (remember the $800 billion Boehner offered up instead of a tax rate hike? Now it will be in addition TO that hike).

And what leverage does the GOP have to get anything for a debt hike? The threat to not raise the ceiling? Well they blinked last year on that and they blinked at going over the cliff when the stakes were “only” tax hikes that could easily be undone quickly. Yet we’re supposed to believe the GOP is willing to hold firm on the ceiling, even if it means irreversible damage such as the “full faith and credit” of the US [technically what could happen is somewhat different from the political and market fallout], an interest rate spike that will balloon our out of control debt exponentially overnight and a global recession as the cherry on top?

It’s not going to happen and everyone knows it.

The last pressure point the GOP will have is the upcoming fight on a Continuing Resolution to fund the government through the end of the fiscal year in September. The only leverage they will have then is the threat of a complete government shutdown.

After blinking on the fiscal cliff and debt ceiling, do you really think they will shut the government down? Really?

This is why Boehner will be reelected Speaker today. Who wants to fight a battle to get to preside over that pending disaster. Oh sure, a bunch will run if by some miracle Boehner doesn't get a majority on the first ballot but run an active coup against him? Nope.

Don't think of the New Years' Day Disaster as the end of a long and horrible year for the GOP, think of it as practice for the real disasters that lay ahead.

Posted by: DrewM. at 10:11 AM



Comments

1 so basically...we're screwed

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 10:13 AM (yAor6)

2 Repubs refuse to raise taxes, Dems refuse to cut spending. Trillion-dollar deficits as far as the eye can see.

Posted by: Cricket at January 03, 2013 10:15 AM (DrC22)

3 But hey, things were awesome when I ran the show. Call me when you need some pointers on how to dominate and look good at the same time.

Posted by: Bill Clinton at January 03, 2013 10:16 AM (HgwiM)

4 Yep. The end game is North Korea or Zimbabwe. With families of Dem officeholders as the new hereditary rulers.

Posted by: NaCly Dog at January 03, 2013 10:16 AM (u82oZ)

5 Where's my money?

Posted by: Chris Christie's chafed thighs at January 03, 2013 10:18 AM (bAGA/)

6 And this really took nothing on his part. He said no after Obama said no.

Posted by: Vic at January 03, 2013 10:18 AM (53z96)

7 Boned. We are.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 03, 2013 10:20 AM (GFM2b)

8 Chris Christie can blow me. Actually, now that I think about it, I wouldn't even let him do that. The Fat Man is dead to me.

Posted by: Blacksheep at January 03, 2013 10:21 AM (bS6uW)

9 I hope Boehner just sticks to regular order from now on. Raise the debt ceiling for this year but only by 80% of what Democrats want. Pass a budget, then pass the 13 appropriations bills as Congress used to do every year. Then adjourn the damn House until the Senate does something.

Posted by: rockmom at January 03, 2013 10:23 AM (NYnoe)

10 Don't think of the New Years' Day Disaster as the end of a long and
horrible year for the GOP, think of it as practice for the real
disasters that lay ahead.

-----

Ahhhh..... the optimism of the new year.


Unfortunately..... I agree. 2013 is gonna suck.

Posted by: fixerupper at January 03, 2013 10:24 AM (nELVU)

11 My understanding is we spent 3.8 T last year and we are slated to spend 4.6 T this year. Does that sound accurate? How is that possible?

Posted by: Eaton Cox is kind of a LIBNO at January 03, 2013 10:24 AM (+wxCD)

12 Congressional Brain Teaser: If you borrowed 40 cents for every dollar you used to run your household, how long until you would go bankrupt?

Answer: But they donated to my campaign!!

Posted by: Cricket at January 03, 2013 10:25 AM (DrC22)

13 My understanding is we spent 3.8 T last year and we are slated to spend 4.6 T this year. Does that sound accurate? How is that possible?

MOAR free shit!

Posted by: rickb223 at January 03, 2013 10:26 AM (hnwp/)

14 There is no such thing as a hill to die on.

Posted by: Vizzini at January 03, 2013 10:27 AM (O7Q1u)

15 My understanding is we spent 3.8 T last year and we are slated to spend 4.6 T this year. Does that sound accurate? How is that possible?

It's called a spending cut, wingnutz. Try to keep up.

Posted by: Barack Hussein Obama at January 03, 2013 10:27 AM (v+QvA)

16 There is no such thing as a hill to die on.
Posted by: Vizzini at January 03, 2013 10:27 AM (O7Q1u)

That hill just got taken by the government by eminent domain.

Posted by: Insomniac at January 03, 2013 10:28 AM (v+QvA)

17 I think Chris Christie the Fat Fuck just found out what sucking up to TFG right before an election costs. Go to him for your money, Moderate.

Posted by: SurferDoc at January 03, 2013 10:28 AM (6H6FZ)

18
Cutting Obama's line of credit will be the best revenge, and the republicans have the power to do that. How could they resist after Obama's arrogant prick-face performance last week.
Btw Ace, I think encouraging Republicans to do the right thingwould be more productive than telling them you expect them to cave. Maybe they won't.

Posted by: Dirks Strewn at January 03, 2013 10:28 AM (VLifP)

19 Congressional Brain Teaser: If you borrowed 40 cents for every dollar you used to run your household, how long until you would go bankrupt?

Answer: You wouldn't. You'd just keep kiting checks at the House bank.

Posted by: rickb223 at January 03, 2013 10:29 AM (GFM2b)

20 that was supposed to be plan A

Posted by: phoenixgirl, Merry 10th day of Christmas at January 03, 2013 10:30 AM (GVxQo)

21 Obama's goal is to break the system. Trying to negotiate him into doing that more slowly is pointless.

Make your demand on a debt limit increase be an actually-passed budget. No more 'continuing resolution' shit.

Posted by: zsasz at January 03, 2013 10:30 AM (RDP+N)

22 It's called a spending cut, wingnutz. Try to keep up.

The sad part is that is actually how they think. Tax cuts = spending money, thus raising taxes = spending less money on tax cuts.

Posted by: Colorado Alex at January 03, 2013 10:30 AM (3x3F6)

23


New Release Cave Grovel starring Jandy "Braying" Baynerd.

Records net negative losses, opening week.

Posted by: beachie at January 03, 2013 10:31 AM (LpQbZ)

24 My understanding is we spent 3.8 T last year and we are slated to spend
4.6 T this year. Does that sound accurate? How is that possible?



By going to 105% on the printing presses.

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 10:32 AM (GQ8sn)

25 Richard, you couldn't answer for yourself, as far as tonight!

Posted by: Deety Chairwoman of the SOOC at January 03, 2013 10:32 AM (aOVhq)

26 TheGOP is dead to me, not just parts of the party, this guy or that guy. Imma change my nic to Libertrollian and call you all names.

Posted by: uterus cannon at January 03, 2013 10:33 AM (3ZtZW)

27 By going to 105% on the printing presses.
Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 10:32 AM (GQ8sn)

Damn the inflation, full steam ahead!

Posted by: Barack Hussein "Farragut" Obama at January 03, 2013 10:33 AM (v+QvA)

28 Answer: You wouldn't. You'd just keep kiting checks at the House bank.
Posted by: rickb223 at January 03, 2013 10:29 AM (GFM2b)


inflation, you saucy lass...

Posted by: Cricket at January 03, 2013 10:33 AM (DrC22)

29 Names! Personal Remarks!

/sorry, not very creative right now

Posted by: Libertrollian at January 03, 2013 10:33 AM (3ZtZW)

30 I am reminded of the Impeachment of Andrew Johnson and the comment from Senator Edmund G Ross who said: "I look down into my open grave."




If our Senators and Representatives are to survive politically, they must not make waves. If the Nation is to survive fiscally, they must.


Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 10:34 AM (bb5+k)

31 Fuck this , Im going fishing, in Canada,for a long time.

Posted by: Rich K at January 03, 2013 10:34 AM (X4l3T)

32 Names! Personal Remarks!
Posted by: Libertrollian at January 03, 2013 10:33 AM (3ZtZW)

Withering rejoinder.

Posted by: Insomniac at January 03, 2013 10:35 AM (v+QvA)

33 Drew- your whining is old. What SHOULD the Republicans done in the cliff negotiation specifically that could have become law and resulted in no taxes going up? What hand did they have to play since taxes were going up with or without them? Stop whining for a second and answer that question.

Posted by: Scofflawx at January 03, 2013 10:36 AM (Z6Os9)

34 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a malignant traitor.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 03, 2013 10:36 AM (5DR1j)

35 JT Marlin upgrades Vaseline Petroleum Products to STRONG BUY.

Posted by: JT Marlin at January 03, 2013 10:37 AM (KYj6u)

36 Just saw the Weather Channel with their version of the news on the Sandy bill. They show all of the crying and gnashing of teeth about needing help NOW interspersed with video of the damage that was created right after the storm. Of course Roker thinks it's a travesty that these poor people have to continue living under such conditions and those bastards in congress better get to passing it even if there is a little bit of pork in it.

Question. Have they not cleaned up any of the mess yet? Are they that lazy?

/s


Posted by: Bruce at January 03, 2013 10:37 AM (hl+bP)

37 Withering rejoinder.
Posted by: Insomniac


Witty addendum!

Posted by: Semi-clever sock at January 03, 2013 10:38 AM (BrQrN)

38 Wheeeeeeeeee!

Posted by: Thelma and Louise at January 03, 2013 10:38 AM (KYj6u)

39 What SHOULD the Republicans done in the cliff negotiation specifically
that could have become law and resulted in no taxes going up?


Socratic method for a moment.

Do we have a tax problem, or a spending problem?
If we have a spending problem, what can be done (via taxes) to fix it?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 03, 2013 10:40 AM (5DR1j)

40 Withering rejoinder.
Posted by: Insomniac

Witty addendum!

Posted by: Semi-clever sock at January 03, 2013 10:38 AM (BrQrN)


Old meme.

Posted by: zsasz at January 03, 2013 10:40 AM (RDP+N)

41 Can anyone name 60 senators who will vote to cut 2 trillion from federal spending? 'cause I can think of maybe 3 or 4.

But, until there are 60 senators willing to actually do something about the spending problem, nothing will happen and it doesn't matter who is speaker.

Posted by: VADM (Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Dispatches) at January 03, 2013 10:40 AM (RESLr)

42 If taxes were going to go up anyway, then why let the leftists frame the debate and concede not only the principle, but basic economic laws?

"Mr. President, raising taxes and increasing the size of government during an economic stagnation destroys wealth and weakens the nation. We will pass a bill that cuts taxes across the board for all levels of income, end baseline budgeting and reduce all levels of government by 10%. Sign it into law, or tell the American people why you are hell bent on destroying our country."

Sheesh. What the hell am I thinking?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:40 AM (XkWWK)

43 Obama's goal is to break the system.

Posted by: zsasz at January 03, 2013 10:30 AM (RDP+N)


He isn't that intelligent. He's an idiot with a checkbook, that is all. He is too STUPID to understand money or economics, he's just an Idiot with a checkbook.


His stupidity may have the UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES of breaking the system, but to think that he has a plan, and that this is it, is just giving a fool too much credit. He is like a reverse Claudius. As Claudius was a brilliant man masquerading as a fool, Obama is a fool masquerading as a brilliant man.


Obama is Mr. Magoo, He's Chance Gardner, He's Double Ought Agent Jethro Bodine, he is a simpleton that has managed to get into high office because he wears the right team colors and his team has control of the ability to speak to the public, while ours doesn't.

Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 10:41 AM (bb5+k)

44 The federal government announced today that in an effort to eradicate the national debt, it will be selling the state of Rhode Island to a group of private investors, for a reported $18 billion. The investors plan to enclose the entire state with an all-weather roof, and turn it into the world's largest shopping mall.

When asked for comment, a White House spokesperson would only say, "Well, at least we didn't sell it to the fucking Japanese."

Posted by: Margaret Lawhawn, WBRZ 2 News at January 03, 2013 10:42 AM (e0xKF)

45 43 Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 10:41 AM (bb5+k)

He's not stupid. He's just an inflexible ideologue who hates America as much as those who put him in power to do their bidding (Soros, Ayers, et al).

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (XkWWK)

46 Just sent a strongly worded email to my RINO Senator. I am sure he will change his ways now.

Posted by: jj at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (gWO5X)

47 We wouldn't lose our credit rating if we don't raise the debt ceiling. Debt service is about $350 billion annually, and our annual tax receipts are something like $2.4 trillion. We can easily service the debt and not lose our credit rating. How the remaining money will be allocated and how to make up for the $1 trillion shortfall will be up to Obama. He'll go after defense spending first, naturally, but that's fine. There's plenty of fat to be cut there by closing down bases in South Korea, Germany, etc.

Posted by: JoeShmoe99 at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (xamKk)

48

Nobel Prize for Monster Carbon Footprint: US Money Printing Machine

We win again!

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (LpQbZ)

49 Of course this isn't simply about Boehner finally realizing he sucks at negotiating,


Look, far be it from me to say that Boehner doesn't suck at negotiating, but I have seen no evidence, at all, that Obama and the Dems were negotiating in good faith at any possible point. Now, the response to that should have been a point blank statement that the Dems were refusing to act in good faith so there was no point in negotiating, but it's not entirely fair to blame Boehner completely.


Start! Soap box time!


Why the hell isn't some group of Republican House members out there trying to point out that the only reason a continuing resolution is needed is because no budget has been passed in 1,000+ days? Make some kind of red blinky spinny counter thing and try to hammer that home. I've given up on the RNC utterly but someone else should at least try the nutty idea of getting out accurate information.


Hmmm. I think I'm going to stay up here for a bit.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (VtjlW)

50 @33 What SHOULD the Republicans done in the cliff negotiation specifically
that could have become law and resulted in no taxes going up?


FTS about taxes not going up. The so-called "independent" "middle-class" voted for Scandi-style government, they should pay Scandi-style taxes. No more of this "paying on Tuesday for an Obamaphone today" crap. Providing the American Sheeple with government at a 46% discount of current taxes is doing nothing whatsoever to forward the cause of conservatives.

So, elections have consequences, bitchz. You re-elected the failure king, this is what you voted for.

Posted by: DocJ at January 03, 2013 10:44 AM (A5uiv)

51

He's not stupid. He's just an inflexible ideologue who hates America as much as those who put him in power to do their bidding (Soros, Ayers, et al).

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (XkWWK)



On that note, what does one track and narrow remind you of?

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 10:45 AM (LpQbZ)

52 The only leverage they will have then is the threat of a complete government shutdown.

No, they can segment and serialize appropriations. Troop lead the assholes.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 10:45 AM (XN0LR)

53 Drew- your whining is old. What SHOULD the
Republicans done in the cliff negotiation specifically that could have
become law and resulted in no taxes going up? What hand did they have
to play since taxes were going up with or without them? Stop whining
for a second and answer that question.





Posted by: Scofflawx at January 03, 2013 10:36 AM (Z6Os9)

All they had to do was nothing. Sequestration was the medicine they thought we needed when they made the deal years ago, but when it came time to jump out of the airplane, they froze.

REAL tax increases coupled with REAL spending cuts is exactly what the nation needs now. The drug addict (government addicted to spending other people's money) needs to be denied it's fix.



Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 10:45 AM (bb5+k)

54 Old meme.
Posted by: zsasz


Snarky retort!

Posted by: Meme Hammering Moron at January 03, 2013 10:45 AM (BrQrN)

55 51 On that note, what does one track and narrow remind you of?
Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 10:45 AM (LpQbZ)


My model train set?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:46 AM (XkWWK)

56 He's not stupid. He's just an inflexible ideologue who hates America as
much as those who put him in power to do their bidding (Soros, Ayers,
et al).


An inflexible ideologue who is impervious to history, experience or advice fits the definition of stupid rather precisely, IMO. I'm with DiogenesLamp on this.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at January 03, 2013 10:46 AM (KYj6u)

57 Hmmm. I think I'm going to stay up here for a bit.

/adjusts wind machine

Posted by: Waterhouse at January 03, 2013 10:47 AM (S/WR4)

58 Why do you assume there will be another additional $1.2 Trillion in cuts? I see no reason why they won't just negotiate the original $1.2 Trillion.

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at January 03, 2013 10:47 AM (f9c2L)

59 Look, far be it from me to say that Boehner doesn't suck at negotiating, but I have seen no evidence, at all, that Obama and the Dems were negotiating in good faith at any possible point. Now, the response to that should have been a point blank statement that the Dems were refusing to act in good faith so there was no point in negotiating, but it's not entirely fair to blame Boehner completely.

---

If they weren't negotiating in good faith, then Boehner should have changed his tactic to "Fuck you, fuck you, fuck you, fuck you, I'm out", passed a bill that would have fixed the problem, and recessed the House.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 10:47 AM (e0xKF)

60 Sources: Chiefs on verge of making Reid coach

Reports: Bills to talk to ex-Bears coach Smith

It's like all they do is play musical chairs?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 03, 2013 10:47 AM (79ueO)

61 Old meme.
Posted by: zsasz

Snarky retort!
Posted by: Meme Hammering Moron at January 03, 2013 10:45 AM (BrQrN)



Stompy.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 10:48 AM (VtjlW)

62 "He isn't that intelligent. He's an idiot with a checkbook, that is all."

I agree with this. My belief (which is not to say that the commenter I quoted believes this as well) is that Obama is doing what he thinks will be best for the country. Unfortunately his beliefs are the idiotic, fairy-tale, feel-goodism, that the lemmings of the country (liberals and frankly some so-called conservatives) believe. The idea that if you create laws for every problem, that if you heavily tax the richest, that if you spend your way through all facets of American life, that it will usher ome utopia. It's never worked. NOT ONCE. Not under dictators, not under free-world leaders. Not under Democrats, not under Republicans. Not with superpowers, not with 3-world hell holes. Not in good times, not in bad times. But liberals continue to believe that if they keep trying that somehow it will finally happen. When the economic pain that is coming happens, liberals will somehow find a way to blame us for it and still believe in their fairy-tale policies.

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 10:48 AM (yAor6)

63 And ending baseline budgeting should be a prime target for a deal on the debt ceiling.

And I will also add that if the GOP goes soft this time around, they won't see a penny from me for 2014 or 2016, and I will not be voting in either election. I'm done.

Posted by: JoeShmoe99 at January 03, 2013 10:48 AM (xamKk)

64
Don't think of the New Years' Day Disaster as the end of a long and horrible year for the GOP, think of it as practice for the real disasters that lay ahead.


This is why I like you, DrewM. You're always such a ray of happybouncy sunshine.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 10:48 AM (4df7R)

65 51

He's not stupid. He's just an inflexible ideologue who hates America as much as those who put him in power to do their bidding (Soros, Ayers, et al).

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (XkWWK)


On that note, what does one track and narrow remind you of?

---

I'm reminded of a quote from the short-lived TV show "Action", where the movie producer is trying to raise money from a bunch of Hasidic Jews.

"Whenever someone tells us to 'Get on the train', it never ends well.'"

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 10:48 AM (e0xKF)

66 Just saw the Weather Channel with their version of the news on the Sandy bill. They show all of the crying and gnashing of teeth about needing help NOW interspersed with video of the damage that was created right after the storm. Of course Roker thinks it's a travesty that these poor people have to continue living under such conditions and those bastards in congress


Ah, isn't it wonderful how the libs can blame Bush for Katrina AND the Republicans for Sandy?

Ain't that somethin'.

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 10:49 AM (LpQbZ)

67 56 An inflexible ideologue who is impervious to history, experience or advice fits the definition of stupid rather precisely, IMO. I'm with DiogenesLamp on this.
Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at January 03, 2013 10:46 AM (KYj6u)

I think we're just quibbling over semantics. Stupid is different from willful ignorance. I believe SCOAMF to be the latter. Joey Bidet is the former.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:49 AM (XkWWK)

68
On that note, what does one track and narrow remind you of?

HIGH SPEED RAIL!!!!!

Posted by: Joey Biden at January 03, 2013 10:49 AM (RDP+N)

69 65 I'm reminded of a quote from the short-lived TV show "Action", where the movie producer is trying to raise money from a bunch of Hasidic Jews.

"Whenever someone tells us to 'Get on the train', it never ends well.'"
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 10:48 AM (e0xKF)

Yikes. Good quote. Reminds me of a comment I heard when working in Hollywood:

"Hollywood would forgive Hitler if he were good box office. Well, maybe not forgive, but certainly forget."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:50 AM (XkWWK)

70 The idea that if you create laws for every problem, that if you heavily tax the richest, that if you spend your way through all facets of American life, that it will usher ome utopia. It's never worked. NOT ONCE. Not under dictators, not under free-world leaders. Not under Democrats, not under Republicans. Not with superpowers, not with 3-world hell holes. Not in good times, not in bad times. But liberals continue to believe that if they keep trying that somehow it will finally happen. When the economic pain that is coming happens, liberals will somehow find a way to blame us for it and still believe in their fairy-tale policies.
Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 10:48 AM (yAor6)

But But But it works in all the textbooks at the best Universities?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 03, 2013 10:50 AM (79ueO)

71 60 Sources: Chiefs on verge of making Reid coach

Reports: Bills to talk to ex-Bears coach Smith

It's like all they do is play musical chairs?

---

The ones who had some sembalance of success play musical chairs.

The shitty ones either go back to being coordinators or MAYBE get one last chance to salvage their career as a head coach. That's why you haven't seen Cam Cameron above the level of OC since the Dolphins canned him after a horrible 1-15 season where they nearly went 0-16.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 10:51 AM (e0xKF)

72 Baseline budgeting should not be on the table for negotiations, just do it.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 10:52 AM (XN0LR)

73 I'm reminded of a quote from the short-lived TV show "Action"


Action is awesome. Though Cherry Falls may be my favorite role Jay Mohr's played.


/adjusts wind machine
Posted by: Waterhouse at January 03, 2013 10:47 AM (S/WR4)



Ha! I'm wearing pants, bitches. *looks down* Man, the ground is really far away.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 10:52 AM (VtjlW)

74 He's not stupid. He's just an inflexible ideologue
who hates America as much as those who put him in power to do their
bidding (Soros, Ayers, et al).





Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (XkWWK)

I disagree completely. The man really is stupid. His entire history demonstrates how stupid he is. He compensates for being so stupid by his ability to talk jive. Since the market in modern day America is so good for jive, he thrives and prospers.

Do not confuse this for intelligence. He is a fool. As Rush Limbaugh said, "Whenever Obama enters a room, he is the least qualified person in that room, and it doesn't matter what the topic is."




Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 10:52 AM (bb5+k)

75 " your whining is old. What SHOULD the Republicans done in the cliff negotiation specifically that could have become law and resulted in no taxes going up? What hand did they have to play since taxes were going up with or without them? Stop whining for a second and answer that question."

Wow that's a lot of hooey in one paragraph.
They could have voted to extend the status quo and refused to touch it. We can't say whether that would become law, since Boehner never tries it.

Taxes weren't going up "without them" since they voted a expiration. They were complicit.

Saying so, to injure and undermine a failed leadership, so that it is discredited, and replaced, is not "whining".

"If they weren't negotiating in good faith, then Boehner should have changed his tactic to "Fuck you, fuck you, fuck you, fuck you, I'm out", passed a bill that would have fixed the problem, and recessed the House."

Excellent.

Posted by: Chris Balsz at January 03, 2013 10:54 AM (3GtyG)

76 My model train set?

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:46 AM (XkWWK)



You have a monorail?
cool.

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 10:54 AM (LpQbZ)

77 He keeps using that word, negotiating. I do not think it means what he thinks it means.

Posted by: dogfish at January 03, 2013 10:54 AM (N2yhW)

78 "Better late then never"

Wait, so Boehner is like the Titanic?
http://tinyurl.com/c8wu8r

Posted by: Ed Wood VS Godzilla at January 03, 2013 10:55 AM (obHYs)

79 Rueful remembrance of the days when conservatism was winning. Angry denunciation of useless politicians who squandered Reagan's gains! Astonishment that someone like Obama is even President. Dire warnings that we haven't seen the worst yet. Grim resignation to the fact that what once was, will never be again.

Posted by: Jones in CO at January 03, 2013 10:55 AM (8sCoq)

80 HIGH SPEED RAIL!!!!!
Posted by: Joey Biden at January 03, 2013 10:49 AM (RDP+N)



Good boy, Joey. *pat on head

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 10:55 AM (LpQbZ)

81 When asked for comment, a White House spokesperson would only say, "Well, at least we didn't sell it to the fucking Japanese."

-------------
NICE

Posted by: gigg423 at January 03, 2013 10:56 AM (41VCE)

82 "Better late then never"

---

I hear that line and think of Cheech Marin referring to the ghosts disembarking from the Titanic in Ghostbusters 2.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 10:56 AM (e0xKF)

83 How come Boehner always negogiates bent over with his pants down?

Posted by: dogfish at January 03, 2013 10:56 AM (N2yhW)

84 Let's turn that frown upside down, Mister Vulcan! We won on tax hikes!!!

Posted by: Neelix at January 03, 2013 10:56 AM (jPVBi)

85
So, elections have consequences, bitchz. You re-elected the failure king, this is what you voted for.


Posted by: DocJ at January 03, 2013 10:44 AM (A5uiv)


Agreed. The Obama voters very badly need a lesson in higher taxes. If the Republican house should have done anything, it should have been to bring the pain to this group as much as they possibly can.

Likewise, cutting 800,000 jobs out of the Military will put these people back in the US, and leave them thirsting for blood at those who did it to them.
Sequestration was the correct answer. Forced Tax increases coupled with Forced Spending cuts. Like with that Star Trek Episode. Show people the ugly side of war, so that they won't want any more of it.







Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 10:57 AM (bb5+k)

86 81 When asked for comment, a White House spokesperson would only say, "Well, at least we didn't sell it to the fucking Japanese."

-------------
NICE

---

Yeah, that's a favorite bit of mine from Schizopolis by Stephen Soderberg, which was filmed in Baton Rouge.

The fact that he got the co-anchor of the local ABC station to do that performance for him made me die laughing, as I'd heard her doing serious news for years before that.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 10:57 AM (e0xKF)

87 How come Boehner always negogiates bent over with his pants down?

Saves time.

Posted by: Barney Frank at January 03, 2013 10:57 AM (RDP+N)

88 The shitty ones either go back to being coordinators or MAYBE get one last chance to salvage their career as a head coach. That's why you haven't seen Cam Cameron above the level of OC since the Dolphins canned him after a horrible 1-15 season where they nearly went 0-16.
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 10:51 AM (e0xKF)


Case in point: Romeo Crenell. I love Romeo, I really do, but he's just not head coach material. He is, however, a KICK ASS defensive coordinator.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 10:58 AM (4df7R)

89 Ha! I'm wearing pants, bitches. *looks down* Man, the ground is really far away.
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 10:52 AM (VtjlW)


oh oh
high altitude radiation
get off that plane!

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 10:58 AM (LpQbZ)

90 "He is, however, a KICK ASS defensive coordinator."

i'd be too with those tapes

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 10:59 AM (yAor6)

91 Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 10:48 AM (yAor6)



Spot on.


Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 10:59 AM (bb5+k)

92 Case in point: Romeo Crenell. I love Romeo, I really do, but he's just not head coach material. He is, however, a KICK ASS defensive coordinator.

---

The only reason he got another chance is that the Chiefs had hired former Patriots GM Scott Pioli as their new GM. That's also why they hired that worthless fat fuck Charlie Weis as their OC.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 10:59 AM (e0xKF)

93 Boehner should be replaced by someone with a brass set, maybe michelle bachman.

Posted by: Caustic at January 03, 2013 10:59 AM (/b8+5)

94 93 Boehner should be replaced by someone with a brass set, maybe michelle bachman.

---

I'd go with Trey Gowdy (R-SC) if he decides he's not going to run against Miss Lindsay in 2 years.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:00 AM (e0xKF)

95 Case in point: Romeo Crenell. I love Romeo, I really
do, but he's just not head coach material. He is, however, a KICK ASS
defensive coordinator.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 10:58 AM (4df7R)

----
See also: Gunther Cunningham

Posted by: fixerupper at January 03, 2013 11:00 AM (nELVU)

96 Case in point: Romeo Crenell Jason Garret. I love Romeo RedJ, I really do, but he's just
not head coach material. He is, however, a KICK ASS defensive offensive
coordinator.


Fixed, to be more relevant to me. Because I'm just that important.

Honestly, though, with Jason Garret, I'm wondering if what he really needs to be a good head coach is an offensive coordinator. There are a lot of coaches who can be good head coaches OR good coordinators, but can't handle both duties.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 03, 2013 11:01 AM (5DR1j)

97 Agreed. The Obama voters very badly need a lesson in higher taxes.

For children, life's lessons are great. But, for a country, a nightmare. The libs have pushed through their big government food stamp feeding and nocare policies to the point of virtually no return. That is all they wanted -- before the masses woke up. They know the conservatives will clean up the mess, but they won. They won because satan was elected twice.

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 11:01 AM (LpQbZ)

98 What SHOULD the Republicans done in the cliff negotiation specifically that could have become law and resulted in no taxes going up?

A week ago, or in August 2011 when the fiscal cliff outcome was fashioned?

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at January 03, 2013 11:01 AM (iO3BG)

99 94 93 Boehner should be replaced by someone with a brass set, maybe michelle bachman.

---

I'd go with Trey Gowdy (R-SC) if he decides he's not going to run against Miss Lindsay in 2 years.
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:00 AM (e0xKF)


Gowdy or Gohmert. Bachmann as well just because they all but supported her Democrat opponent to be rid of her.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 11:02 AM (XkWWK)

100 Rueful remembrance of the days when conservatism was winning.

You must be really old. We haven't been "winning" since the early 1900's.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 03, 2013 11:03 AM (SY2Kh)

101 Disenchanted losers, gotta love em. No matter the party outsiders have been making the same claims yet being ignored. When the realization finally hits home, and for all it is ALWAYS too damn late, that those demonized outsiders were correct then the wailing and gnashing of teeth starts.

Because the chosen ones could never be part of any extraordinary group which nags continually about flaws in the system.

Posted by: Mike Hunt at January 03, 2013 11:03 AM (G6kli)

102 Case in point: Romeo Crenell. I love Romeo, I really
do, but he's just not head coach material. He is, however, a KICK ASS
defensive coordinator.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 10:58 AM (4df7R)


This is true. Same with Wade "Sad Santa" Phillips and Noval "Pock Neck" Turner (although in Norv's case it's offensive coordinator and he doesn't realize it yet but he was already given way too much rope by Jack Kent Cooke and AJ Smith, which cost the latter his job).

Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:03 AM (OW/Yj)

103 Who wants to fight a battle to get to preside over that pending disaster

I would kill for that job.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 03, 2013 11:03 AM (evdj2)

104 Hey, OSP (if you're arround)- I'm not sure if you saw it in the prior thread, but how did you go about getting your book published. Did you go through a publisher, or self-publish, or what?

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 03, 2013 11:03 AM (5DR1j)

105 >>>By going to 105% on the printing presses.

Prepare Printing Presses for Ludicrous Speed.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at January 03, 2013 11:03 AM (0q2P7)

106 "Boehner should be replaced by someone with a brass set, maybe michelle bachman."

Bachmann? LOL...no. I'd say Ryan but he apparently has decided to become some establishment lackey. Cantor? maybe, but he is Boehner's right-hand man. He seemed to have voted No after they made sure they had all the votes they needed. Tim Scott? he's being "promoted" to the Senate now. I see more potential in the Senate for good leaders then the House. Kinda sad, considering we're the minority in the Senate.

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:04 AM (yAor6)

107 Headline Update:

Plan C: Flounder Says He's Done Taking His Brother's Car On Road Trips

Posted by: Count de Monet at January 03, 2013 11:04 AM (BAS5M)

108 This is true. Same with Wade "Sad Santa" Phillips and Noval "Pock Neck" Turner (although in Norv's case it's offensive coordinator and he doesn't realize it yet but he was already given way too much rope by Jack Kent Cooke and AJ Smith, which cost the latter his job).

---

I'm a Saints fan and I'd still love to hand AJ Smith some rope.

He may have helped the Saints get Brees and Sproiles, but he also completely fucked Marty Schottenheimer and was a big reason why the Chargers never made it to the Super Bowl.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (e0xKF)

109 A week ago, or in August 2011 when the fiscal cliff outcome was fashioned?

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk

+1 That little fact keeps getting overlooked, forgotten, buried.

Posted by: dogfish at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (N2yhW)

110 76 You have a monorail?
cool.
Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 10:54 AM (LpQbZ)


I'm actually designing a retro-futurist model based on a design by E.W. Chalmers-Kearney.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elfric_Wells_Chalmers_Kearney

It will have a "Blade Runner" meets "Metropolis" vibe. Drive system is the key stumbling block.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (XkWWK)

111 Honestly, though, with Jason Garret, I'm wondering if what he really needs to be a good head coach is an offensive coordinator. There are a lot of coaches who can be good head coaches OR good coordinators, but can't handle both duties.
Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 03, 2013 11:01 AM (5DR1j)


That's the thing. I think there are a lot of good coaches out there, but there aren't a lot who can be good at all three phases of the game. You might be a great coach on the offensive side of the ball, but you need really strong coordinators on defense and special teams to have a successful, balanced team. So when bad teams hire coaches to shore up the weaker aspects of their game, I think they really have to pay attention to the coordinators who themselves shore up the weaker aspects of the COACH. I don't know how many GMs and owners actually do that.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (4df7R)

112 Names! Personal Remarks! Posted by: Libertrollian at January 03, 2013 10:33 AM (3ZtZW)
Withering rejoinder.


Completely OT NSFW link.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (zF6Iw)

113 The Obama voters very badly need a lesson in higher taxes.

What fraction of them actually pay income taxes?

Getting all your withholding back in April (plus some extra money for each bastard) does not count as "paying income taxes."

Posted by: Kinder, Gentler HeatherRadish™ at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (ZKzrr)

114 105 >>>By going to 105% on the printing presses.

Prepare Printing Presses for Ludicrous Speed.

---

Note to the Feds - We will NOT take plaid bills.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:06 AM (e0xKF)

115 I think we're just quibbling over semantics. Stupid
is different from willful ignorance. I believe SCOAMF to be the
latter. Joey Bidet is the former.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 10:49 AM (XkWWK)

No, I genuinely believe Obama can't do math as well as a fifth grader. (Well, okay, maybe an eight grader.) I think his grasp of history is just as bad, all in all I perceive us to have someone with the knowledgeable competence of a Junior High school child. Even his taunting fits as a Junior High School trait.

The man has bungled everything he has ever done. Except for his ability to talk jive and con fools, the man would be a beggar. He truly is an emperor with no clothes. He's dumb as a rock, but he is ruthless enough and vicious enough to get into power, where let's face it, the primary requirement is the ability to hurt those who would challenge you.

He has the "Battlestar Gallactica" of Media apparatus behind him, and that is the only reason he ever managed to get into power. On his own? He's just shit. I wouldn't trust him to run a lemonade stand.





Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:06 AM (bb5+k)

116 Boehner was a fool to think he could negotiate with the flap-eared commie in the first place. Never negotiate with a three year old child with a full diaper.

Posted by: Fritz at January 03, 2013 11:07 AM (/ZZCn)

117 Hmmm. I think I'm going to stay up here for a bit.

Allow me to polish your stompy boots to a blinding sheen, Imperial One.

And have some tea.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 03, 2013 11:07 AM (zF6Iw)

118 A week ago, or in August 2011 when the fiscal cliff outcome was fashioned?


Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk
+1 That little fact keeps getting overlooked, forgotten, buried.


Oh it was warned. Gee it looks like Boehner is betting all in that Romney is going to win. He might want to have a fall back strategy. Well we just saw what that fall back was.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at January 03, 2013 11:07 AM (0q2P7)

119 But But But it works in all the textbooks at the best Universities?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 03, 2013 10:50 AM (79ueO)


As Reagan quipped, "Capitalism works so well in practice that some Economists are starting to wonder if it will work in theory. "



Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:07 AM (bb5+k)

120 #33

There was plenty that could have been done. The big issue wasn't legislation. All that had to be done was make the Bush cuts permanent or give them another ten years.

The big issue was messaging. One of the core message from Obama to his base is that they don't have more because rich people are holding out on them. As if the rich sneaked into their houses at night and stole it. If you cannot fight this bullshit message then all else is a waste of time. It was failure to counter bullshit messages that lost the election and will lose the country as a functioning entity.

This is the big point of failure for the GOP. Part of the problem is the MSM only allowing one side's messages to get through but we do have Fox and AM radio. But I cannot recall even one occasion of a GOP representative making a statement of principles to to the nation through whatever outlet would listen. Hell, they could just hire Steyn to write a speech for them and buy five minutes of prime time network TV to get it out there. It would be cheap compared tot he consequences of the GOP remaining without any explanation of their motives other than what the DNC chooses to paint them with.

Every news outlet has the traitorous Christie whining about not passing a massively pork laden bill. Where is the rebuttal?

This is why the nation is circling the drain.

Posted by: epobirs at January 03, 2013 11:08 AM (kcfmt)

121 Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:04 AM (yAor6)

Bachman would go straight to the American people and explain her motivations to them and encourage them to pressure their guys/gals to "do the right thing".

The men will all just fold like boehner.

Posted by: Caustic at January 03, 2013 11:08 AM (/b8+5)

122 74 Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 10:52 AM (bb5+k)

Again, I'm not necessarily quibbling with you. Book smart? No, he's a dolt. But he's shrewd enough to manipulate the Free Shit Army in a way that no other lib could. So there's that.

But yeah, least qualified person in any room he enters. Even alone in the shitter.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 11:08 AM (XkWWK)

123 There are 3 classes of Obama voters and only one of them pay any taxes. There is the FSA - no taxes, unions - pay taxes, and really rich - pay no taxes.


So an increase in taxes has little impact on the average Obama voter. They are that 50% of the public who pay no taxes.

Posted by: Vic at January 03, 2013 11:08 AM (53z96)

124 He may have helped the Saints get Brees and
Sproiles, but he also completely fucked Marty Schottenheimer and was a
big reason why the Chargers never made it to the Super Bowl.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (e0xKF)


You realize the Bolts never won a single playoff game under Schottenheimer despite having a great regular season record and home field advantage. Not.One.Fucking.Game. That makes reaching the Super Bowl somewhat problematic.

I witnessed the playoff genius of Marty in Cleveland. Fuck that turd.

Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:08 AM (OW/Yj)

125 "Except for his ability to talk jive and con fools, the man would be a beggar."

bingo! the big problem with politicians is that one must be elected to become a "decision maker". some are good at getting elected, but suck at their jobs. some would be great at the job, but suck at getting elected.

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:09 AM (yAor6)

126 124 He may have helped the Saints get Brees and
Sproiles, but he also completely fucked Marty Schottenheimer and was a
big reason why the Chargers never made it to the Super Bowl.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (e0xKF)

You realize the Bolts never won a single playoff game under Schottenheimer despite having a great regular season record and home field advantage. Not.One.Fucking.Game. That makes reaching the Super Bowl somewhat problematic.

I witnessed the playoff genius of Marty in Cleveland. Fuck that turd.

---

I think Marty had a lot of the same issues as former Saints coach Jim Mora... They had playoff issues because they didn't play to win, they played not to lose.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:10 AM (e0xKF)

127 "Bachman would go straight to the American people and explain her
motivations to them and encourage them to pressure their guys/gals to
"do the right thing"."

before or after she is laughed at? McMorris (R-WA) would be taken more serious as a female GOP speaker then Bachmann. Bachmann is too busy telling us how Rick Perry is going to make all our girls sexual deviants or something.

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:11 AM (yAor6)

128 Look, far be it from me to say that Boehner doesn't suck at negotiating,
but I have seen no evidence, at all, that Obama and the Dems were
negotiating in good faith at any possible point.
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (VtjlW)
Agreed.
Of course if you know you're dealing with someone not negotiating in good faith the proper response isn't to negotiate with yourself as Bohener did (revenue is on the table....here's $800b in revenue...ok, tax rates have to go up).Or maybe Boehner didn't realize Obama wasn't negotiating in good faith.Either of those things makes Boehner a bad negotiator.

Posted by: DrewM. at January 03, 2013 11:12 AM (UfvyB)

129 Almost reminded me of one of Monty's posts. Nothing like DOOM for breakfast.

Posted by: BTM at January 03, 2013 11:12 AM (9aeie)

130 Names! Personal Remarks! Posted by: Libertrollian at January 03, 2013 10:33 AM (3ZtZW)

Withering rejoinder.



Completely OT NSFW link.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (zF6Iw)

Witty bon mot on a dying/dead thread.

Posted by: Vizzini at January 03, 2013 11:13 AM (O7Q1u)

131 Just sent a strongly worded email to my RINO Senator. I am sure he will change his ways now.
Posted by: jj at January 03, 2013 10:43 AM (gWO5X)
----------------------------------------------------

You forgot to say, "A. STRONGLY. WORDED. EMAIL."

Posted by: Virginia SoCon at January 03, 2013 11:13 AM (+/C3g)

132 "I think Marty had a lot of the same issues as former Saints coach Jim
Mora... They had playoff issues because they didn't play to win, they
played not to lose."

reminds me of Tony when he was here in Tampa. He could get us to the playoffs but not until Gruden pushed the team in 2002 did we really go all the way. unfortunately it was at the tail-end of our great runs. I still mantain the only reason Tony won the SB in Indy was because Manning was so willing to takeover the team and take risks on the field, ignoring the times Tony just wanted to punt the ball. That and Grossman's horrible play that day.

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:13 AM (yAor6)

133
Hmmm, follow the regular rules of conduct on future legislation? Now that's a novel idea.

As long as the Congress can't establish annual budgets, I consider them in contempt of the Constitution and, well, just plain contemptible.

Posted by: Marmo at January 03, 2013 11:14 AM (QW+AD)

134 I actually think Boehner is safe as speaker of the House.
I mean seriously, who would want to lead a bunch of pansies into a dark alley knowing they don't have your back.
Hell that's the way I feel about these Nancy's and I'm just a run of the mill shlub.

Posted by: Drider at January 03, 2013 11:15 AM (HaJD9)

135 bingo! the big problem with politicians is that one must be elected to become a "decision maker". some are good at getting elected, but suck at their jobs. some would be great at the job, but suck at getting elected.
Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:09 AM (yAor6)


Obammy would have been an excellent Axelrod. it suits his temperament. As Preezy? He sucks. It requires actual work and compromise. Oh, and brain power. A dog can look at you with big brown eyes that just BEG you to share your bacon, and I dare you to be able to resist those eyes for long. But that same dog wouldn't know how to cook the bacon if you gave him a frying pan, turned on the stove, and set up a corkboard with illustrated instructions. "All I wanted was the bacon," the dog would say (if it could talk). "I didn't think you'd actually make me WORK for it."

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 11:15 AM (4df7R)

136 some would be great at the job, but suck at getting elected.

Rick Perry, I'm lookin' at you man.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at January 03, 2013 11:15 AM (KYj6u)

137 >>>before or after she is laughed at?

*yawn*
Bachmann aint the end all be all of Reps. But one thing she does have that is in short supply, that Boehner has absolutely 0 of, is political courage.

Yea she'd be laughed at and it wouldn't faze her a bit. She would be attacked and demonized, and it wouldn't faze her a bit. Her very seat and re-election and career might be on the line, and it wouldn't faze her a bit.

I'll tell you what I could definitely get behind her about now. She ain't the brightest bulb in the box, but she ain't stupid either. And unlike almost all of her contemporaries she has something they don't ...balls.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose is Shrugging at January 03, 2013 11:16 AM (0q2P7)

138 Reagan was a great president and not too shabby as a candidate.

Boy, could we use an army of Reagans in Congress right now.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 11:16 AM (XkWWK)

139 I still mantain the only reason Tony won the SB in Indy was because Manning was so willing to takeover the team and take risks on the field, ignoring the times Tony just wanted to punt the ball. That and Grossman's horrible play that day.

---

Here's a theoretical for you...

If the Saints had beaten the Bears that year and we got Manning vs. Brees in that Super Bowl, would Manning have a ring?

The Saints team that season was far inferior to the won which one the Super Bowl a few years later, but everything was aligning just right for them that year.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (e0xKF)

140 "She ain't the brightest bulb in the box"

but let's make her speaker! that's the ticket!

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (yAor6)

141 Names! Personal Remarks! Posted by: Libertrollian at January 03, 2013 10:33 AM (3ZtZW) Withering rejoinder. Completely OT NSFW link.

--------------------------------------

Debate whether to click. Insert Admiral Ackbar quote.

Posted by: Virginia SoCon at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (+/C3g)

142 What fraction of them actually pay income taxes?

Getting all your withholding back in April (plus some extra money for each bastard) does not count as "paying income taxes."


Posted by: Kinder, Gentler HeatherRadish™ at January 03, 2013 11:05 AM (ZKzrr)

And that is my point. The Rich end of his voters need to be decimated with taxes, and the poor end of his voters needs to be also decimated with taxes.

I am off the opinion that a shotgun blast to everybody will get more screams from the people who need to scream. *WE* are already screaming.



Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (bb5+k)

143 Back to AtC's "Barky wasn't negotiating in good faith..."

Of course he wasn't. But the correct thing to do, then, was to say "The President refuses to negotiate in good faith. We are going to pass a bill that does X (whatever the R original offer was, maybe watered down some). If the President and Senate Democrats wish to negotiate in good faith, they can do so via the legislative process- by offering and passing amendments to the bill we propose."

That's the problem with these "negotiations" in the first place, really. That "negotiation" is supposed to be part-and-parcel of the legislative process. One chamber passes a bill. The other chamber modifies it. It goes back to the original chamber for as-is passage, or more modification. Eventually it goes to joint committee to see if a real compromise can be hammered out.

Doing this "negotiate with the president" stuff doesn't get anything done, because they can say whatever they want for the cameras, and then pass something completely different.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (5DR1j)

144 49 Why the hell isn't some group of Republican House members out there trying to point out that the only reason a continuing resolution is needed is because no budget has been passed in 1,000+ days?

That would require organization. They would rather spend their time arguing and sniping at each other via Politico and other outlets.

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (YjDyJ)

145
if we know anything, it's that when John Boehner says "no" or "never" it always means "yes" and "eventually."

Posted by: Soothsayer at January 03, 2013 11:18 AM (jlW3q)

146 before or after she is laughed at? McMorris (R-WA) would be taken more serious as a female GOP speaker then Bachmann. Bachmann is too busy telling us how Rick Perry is going to make all our girls sexual deviants or something.

I agree. Bachmann could easily be goaded into talking about something goofy.

What we need is an amoral bastard who hates Democrats.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at January 03, 2013 11:18 AM (Ezq3m)

147 The only way spending cuts will happen is if we force sequestration. That was, after all, the genius soution agrred to by all parties when the Super Committee failed.

Posted by: Marmo at January 03, 2013 11:18 AM (QW+AD)

148 Still looking for ANY evidence that this shmuck is up to doing anything but drinking, tanning and golf.

As someone pointed out earlier The Boston Fucking Globe likes him.

Posted by: ontherocks at January 03, 2013 11:18 AM (aZ6ew)

149

John Boehner has an Indian name:

He Who Draws Many Lines In Sand

Posted by: Soothsayer at January 03, 2013 11:19 AM (LL42r)

150 What we need is an amoral bastard who hates Democrats.

---

Too bad former Majority Whip Roy Blunt is now in the Senate.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:19 AM (e0xKF)

151 "What we need is an amoral bastard who hates Democrats."

yep

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:19 AM (yAor6)

152 Bachman would go straight to the American people and explain her
motivations to them and encourage them to pressure their guys/gals to
"do the right thing".


Right. Because if there's one thing the American people are truly yearning for, it's more Crazy Eyes on TV.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 03, 2013 11:19 AM (SY2Kh)

153 Laugh all you want at Michele Bachmann. She called out Huma Weiner and the Muzzie Bro'hood and got ripped from both sides of the aisle.

Tardisil aside, she is an effective and vocal proponent of conservatism. I would not be displeased at all if she somehow wound up in a position of leadership. Considering the fact, as I mentioned earlier, that the RCCC gave her ZERO support, and that the establishment hate her, that alone is credential enough.

But I love Gowdy and Gohmert.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 11:19 AM (XkWWK)

154 It was good to talk about another country's problems for once (previous thread), and now, back to reminding ourselves how irrevocably screwed we are.


Let it burn!

Posted by: Kinley Ardal, LiB advocate, connoisseur of cheesecake at January 03, 2013 11:19 AM (xw1VU)

155 What's all this talk about a spending problem? The only spending problem I can imagine is if the government cut back its spending on all of the stuff we get. Just put some more zeroes down on that sheet there, see how easy it is?

Posted by: Most of the USA at January 03, 2013 11:20 AM (zpqa2)

156
John Boehner must have eyes in the back of his head becausr he is an expert at walking backwards.

Posted by: Soothsayer at January 03, 2013 11:20 AM (xVKk3)

157 What we need is an amoral bastard who hates Democrats.

If my dad wasn't so moral, I'd nominate him. There would be much less, "My friend across the aisle," and a lot more, "That fucking jackass over there with the three chins and irritable bowel syndrome."

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 11:20 AM (4df7R)

158 151 "What we need is an amoral bastard who hates Democrats."

yep
Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:19 AM (yAor6)


Reporting for duty!

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at January 03, 2013 11:21 AM (XkWWK)

159 But I love Gowdy and Gohmert.

---

Besides those two, how about Rep. Jason Chaffetz (R-UT)?

I wish he'd have run against that worthless fuck Orrin Hatch, but it is what it is.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:21 AM (e0xKF)

160 What we need is an amoral bastard who hates Democrats

So, Gowdy or Chaffetz

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 11:21 AM (Hw3Gh)

161

But I still like Boehner.

It's Mitch McConnell who is a rotten cocksuckah.

Posted by: Soothsayer at January 03, 2013 11:22 AM (hNqVf)

162 "I wish he'd have run against that worthless fuck Orrin Hatch, but it is what it is."

we should have run a woman, Palin would have endorsed her

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:22 AM (yAor6)

163 Time Warner Cable pulled the plug on Current TV just hours after news of the cable channel’s sale to Al Jazeera became official.

“This channel is no longer available on Time Warner Cable,” read an on-screen message where Current TV used to be found.

Al Jazeera took a major step into the U.S. cable market Wednesday by acquiring beleaguered Current TV and announcing plans for a U.S.-based news network to be called Al Jazeera America. But while the new channel will soon be available in 40 million households, Al Jazeera faced a setback when Time Warner Cable — which reaches 12 million homes — announced it was dropping the low-rated Current, which occupied a spot that could have been switched to Al Jazeera America.


I gotta find out what Fios is doing. I just may have to switch to Time Warner

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 03, 2013 11:23 AM (79ueO)

164 151 "What we need is an amoral bastard who hates Democrats."

Actually, I'd say we need an amoral BITCH. That would really fuck with their heads. The Dems are such a bunch of good-ole-boy misogynists and homos -- and that includes the women -- it would be fun to see them twitch and spit about having to deal with a woman.

Besides Bachmann, who I know y'all have been 'discussing,' do we have ANY decent female reps?

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 11:23 AM (4df7R)

165 Gotta to have a Speaker from an absolute Red lock down district. Speaker may have to do some unpopular shit.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 11:24 AM (Hw3Gh)

166 Doing this "negotiate with the president" stuff
doesn't get anything done, because they can say whatever they want for
the cameras, and then pass something completely different.


Posted by: AllenG at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (5DR1j)


Saying you are going to "negotiate" with Barack Obama is like saying you are going to wrestle with a pig. It ought to be beneath your dignity and the outcome will be the same.

Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:24 AM (bb5+k)

167 Kristi Noem (SD) is a pretty good rep, by reports in Human Events.

Posted by: Jay in Ames at January 03, 2013 11:25 AM (i2Lsf)

168 Gotta to have a Speaker from an absolute Red lock down district. Speaker may have to do some unpopular shit.

Yep.

Saying you are going to "negotiate" with Barack Obama is like saying
you are going to wrestle with a pig. It ought to be beneath your
dignity and the outcome will be the same.


Yep.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Channelling Breitbart at January 03, 2013 11:26 AM (5DR1j)

169 Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (YjDyJ)

The bigger issue is conservatives need to stop thinking non-committed, low information voters care about process. They simply don't. Saying "No Senate Budget in xxx Days!" doesn't rally a single new person to our side.

Our PR sucks not just because of our mechanisms but what we try and talk about.

Posted by: DrewM. at January 03, 2013 11:26 AM (UfvyB)

170 Actually, I'd say we need an amoral BITCH.


*buffs nails*

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 11:27 AM (VtjlW)

171 Perspective on Current TV's success: Its average 42k primetime viewers
is a little less than the 2nd-place 5pm local newscast in Memphis.

Posted by: Jones in CO at January 03, 2013 11:27 AM (8sCoq)

172 I don't get the tax breaks for Disney. They are one of the most hugely profitable companies on the planet, run by the most vocal bunch of leftists you would ever meet. Why do they even want a tax break?

Posted by: navybrat at January 03, 2013 11:28 AM (BzGtc)

173 Plan D: I'll negotiate with Obama. But I won't eat the ice cream at the White House Social.

Plan E: I'll eat the ice cream. But not vanilla. I will not violate my core principles.

Plan F: I'll eat vanilla ice cream, but no toppings.

Plan G: Fudge, but no sprinkles.

Plan H: OK, sprinkles.

Posted by: egd at January 03, 2013 11:28 AM (XVGEg)

174 it would be fun to see them twitch and spit about having to deal with a woman.

Eh. They get a few of their scrunts to mewl about "conservative women aren't real women" and the MFM lets loose a torrent of rape "jokes", and Barry smirks and nothing changes.

Posted by: Kinder, Gentler HeatherRadish™ at January 03, 2013 11:28 AM (ZKzrr)

175 Actually, I'd say we need an amoral BITCH. That would really fuck with their heads.

They're expecting that.

They could never beat Dick Cheney in an argument. After saying he's white and evil, they got nothing, because he agrees with them. We need a guy like that.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at January 03, 2013 11:28 AM (Ezq3m)

176 I want Allen West as Speaker. He would physically intimidate the JEF which is the only thing the community activist punk cares about.

Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:29 AM (OW/Yj)

177 Done negotiating?

I had a stripper girlfriend who used to call it riding the pole.

Let me tell you, John, you're not done until the man says you're done, and you ain't the man in this case.

Posted by: BurtTC at January 03, 2013 11:29 AM (TOk1P)

178 Whoa time is the big meeting?

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 11:30 AM (Hw3Gh)

179 Actually, I'd say we need an amoral BITCH.

Over here! Pick me! Please please please! I have no morals, I promise!

Oh, wait. Never mind, I thought you said witch.


Posted by: Christine O'Donnell at January 03, 2013 11:31 AM (SY2Kh)

180 obama hates Cantor

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 03, 2013 11:31 AM (79ueO)

181 A week ago, or in August 2011 when the fiscal cliff outcome was fashioned?

Since the fiscal cliff negotiation did not include an option to go back in time and recast history, let's assume I meant reality not fantasy scenarios.

Posted by: Scofflawx at January 03, 2013 11:31 AM (Z6Os9)

182 I want Allen West as Speaker. He would physically
intimidate the JEF which is the only thing the community activist punk
cares about.


Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:29 AM (OW/Yj)


I love this idea. It will actually work to improve things. Therefore our side will not even consider it.



Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:31 AM (bb5+k)

183

Virginia Fox


Posted by: Soothsayer at January 03, 2013 11:31 AM (hNqVf)

184
The illiberals won the fiscal debate long ago. We are just playing out the string now. The more the Republican establishment demonstrates that it is simply a moderate arm of the Democrat party, the more people demand that Republicans "do something" to retrieve fiscal sanity.


This is a most strange delusion.

Posted by: Meremortal, time to slutdrop the GOPe at January 03, 2013 11:32 AM (1Y+hH)

185

Mean Jean Schmidt

Posted by: Soothsayer at January 03, 2013 11:32 AM (hNqVf)

186 #163

TWC carries Al Jazeera in my region. I suspect it may just be a transitional thing as Current always lost money. Once it's up and running as Al Jazeera US it will probably be back on TWC.

Posted by: epobirs at January 03, 2013 11:32 AM (kcfmt)

187 obama hates Cantor

A southern, conservative, capitalist Jew, imagine that.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 11:32 AM (Hw3Gh)

188 137 And unlike almost all of her contemporaries she has something they don't ...balls.

She voted for Medicare reform but initially refused to defend the concept. It would not call that brave.

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 11:32 AM (YjDyJ)

189
TFG has no idea nor clue how to "negotiate." We've heard his method: "I get everything I want, you get nothing." Knowing his background as a dyed-in-the-wool Marxist, he is well versed in destruction and "fundamental transformation," and the Cloward-Piven strategy of breaking institutions.

I can't and won't give him the benefit of the doubt: he is hell-bent on destroying our country in any way he can. Yeah, he's a dolt, too. That's the worst possible thing we could have at the seat of power.

We need someone on our side to finally call him out on all his destructive policies, using plain language and simple math. Someone who actually puts the country ahead of their own job security. I don't know who that is, I thought Boner would've had at least the beginnings of a pimple of a testicle, but I was wrong. Boner needs to be replaced ASAP.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit. at January 03, 2013 11:33 AM (yiIja)

190
All of you = Spalding Smails

Posted by: Soothsayer at January 03, 2013 11:34 AM (jlW3q)

191 "She voted for Medicare reform but initially refused to defend the concept. It would not call that brave."

but..but..she stood behind bushes as the gays had their rally! courage!

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:34 AM (yAor6)

192 Since the fiscal cliff negotiation did not include an option to go back in time and recast history, let's assume I meant reality not fantasy scenarios.

So you want to pretend that 'half-a-loaf' negotiating didn't put us into this position to start with and then argue this was the best deal we could get.

The deal in 2011 was built around a prophecy which was wrong. You have to make deals for immediate gains in Washington or you have nothing.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at January 03, 2013 11:34 AM (UyYYt)

193

TWC carries Al Jazeera in my region. I suspect it may just be a transitional thing as Current always lost money. Once it's up and running as Al Jazeera US it will probably be back on TWC.
Posted by: epobirs at January 03, 2013 11:32 AM (kcfmt)


I saw an article somewhere this AM about Intel coming up with a chip and table top box that will allow you to bypass all cable companies and order what ever channels you want on an individual basis.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 03, 2013 11:35 AM (79ueO)

194 Instead of voting for Boehner for a year, can they make him Speaker for two months and then revisit. Put some backbone in his suit for the next round.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 11:35 AM (Hw3Gh)

195 The bigger issue is conservatives need to stop thinking non-committed, low information voters care about process. They simply don't. Saying "No Senate Budget in xxx Days!" doesn't rally a single new person to our side.

Our PR sucks not just because of our mechanisms but what we try and talk about.
Posted by: DrewM. at January 03, 2013 11:26 AM (UfvyB)



At what possible point did I suggest that as the only means of attack? We have to start everywhere and hell fucking yes we need to point out to those people who believe that there are well informed voters that they do not know jack shit. I will happily concede that saying that no budget has been passed in X number of days is not aimed at low information voters. So stipulated. What it is designed to do is to provide a hook into those who believe that what they hear from Brian Williams is the news and that they know what's going on. No. They don't. I can't tell you how many Republican voters I talked to during the months leading up to the election who had no fucking clue that there's been no budget passed in over three years. That information needs to be hammered over and over and over again, in addition to going all out on other fronts.

You say our PR sucks because we focus on the wrong things to discuss. I say our PR sucks because we don't even talk about incredibly fucking obvious things that have a simple number on it. I want the Republicans to start somewhere, anywhere, and that seems like the easiest damn place in the world to begin.

As far as low information voters, I have a new pet theory that they are not low information voters so much as single information voters. The single bit of information about which they care is who will give me the most free shit. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, the Republicans can say to them that will convince them that they shouldn't get the free shit in the first place. No amount of PR will fix that.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 11:36 AM (VtjlW)

196 The problem is the deal simply reflects what the American public wants. We can blame the Republicans all we want, but all things considered it is not a terrible deal considering that Obama won a fairly decisive victory in November. This deal simply reflects a status quo of what our representatives have voted for for the past 30 years. Low taxes but high spending. And why shouldn't that rule out. For the past 30 years we have basically had this with deficit spending and what is the result. A great quality of life. We may be robbing the future to pay for the present, but human nature is to do that. The public's behavior will only change when catastrophe hits. We few conservatives will be hard pressed to win the long-term argument until that happens.This deal is simply a reflection of the status quo. Expecting our representatives to make the hard decisision is simply not going to be done without a strong single leader with some conviction to lead the country. No person of that ilk has been on the ballot for quite some time.

Maybe the GOP will cave again. I don't know, but history indicates that that is what they will do. If they have one advantage it is that tax increasesare now off the table for practical purposes.

In the long run, America loses with this deal because deficits and debt continue to go up. But why should we expect anything differently? No bank has yet to collect on this credit card debt. No bank has yet to foreclose on anything. No bank is attempting to seize assets. Until that time, spend, spend, spend.

Posted by: SH at January 03, 2013 11:37 AM (gmeXX)

197 >We need someone on our side to finally call him out on all his
destructive policies, using plain language and simple math. Someone who
actually puts the country ahead of their own job security.


There's the rub. Today's politicians put their Party's success ahead of what's good for the country. It's all about who is seen as having 'beaten' the other side. It's all sound bites and talking points and polls and finger-pointing with these pigs. What's good for America doesn't even enter into the mix. May they all drown in lakes of blood.

Posted by: Jones in CO at January 03, 2013 11:37 AM (8sCoq)

198
now that the Republicans gave way on taxes, there will be more political pressure for Democrats to demonstrate moderation by agreeing to some meaningful reforms on spending.

Ed "Brown and Serve" Morrissey


Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at January 03, 2013 11:37 AM (kdS6q)

199 Therefore our side will not even consider it.





Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:31 AM (bb5+k)


Of course they won't; the Repukes are as scared of him as the donks. That's why they used that "bipartisan" canard to get him redistricted out of a fucking job to clear the way for more Cheeto Crists.

Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:38 AM (OW/Yj)

200 We have to Attack Attack Attack and stop playing defense

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 03, 2013 11:38 AM (79ueO)

201 Boehner just isn't bad at negotiating, he too is horrible on messaging. GOP are at huge, huge disadvantage with getting out the truth, that the Speaker should, well be a good speaker! Would be smart to set a deal for in order for Boehner to stay on, he needs to assign an effective spokesperson to expose the progs and true fiscal danger of U.S..

Class warfare? Why not play their game and tell the well-fare class their entitlements are in danger because of billions wasted on stupid wind turbines and give litany of every cockamamie pet project of the progs. Expose budgets of secret Czars etc...

Posted by: Deli LLama at January 03, 2013 11:39 AM (lGu1O)

202 Alexthechick - at a minimum, end withholding so the rest of the country, not in the free shit army has to write a check.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 11:40 AM (Hw3Gh)

203 Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 11:36 AM (VtjlW)

That comment was to miss80sbabe, not you.

Posted by: DrewM. at January 03, 2013 11:40 AM (UfvyB)

204 After the last election, Ace and others wrote about how conservatives need to end their obsession with Washington drama, that the votes cast there are the result of what happens across the electorate leading up to the vote.

That lasted about two days. Obviously, the Cliff Deal is big. As the next one will be. And the one after that. But it's not the horse, it's the wagon. Members of Congress, of either party, will cast votes that conservatives like when we make it politically profitable for them to do so. That's the horse that pulls the wagon.

Right now, the perception is that there is little to be gained poltically by governing conservatively. Until we change that, nothing else matters.

Posted by: CJ at January 03, 2013 11:40 AM (9KqcB)

205 Plan C Plan 9 from Outer Space

Posted by: @PurpAv at January 03, 2013 11:40 AM (hc3eM)

206 I'm done dealing withDems in general. Known Dems have been dropped from my friends lists, and any democrats I encounter will be met with open hostility. This has already caused friction within my own family, but fuck em., I don't care anymore.

Posted by: TC at January 03, 2013 11:41 AM (vYB+W)

207 Drew - I agree nobody really cares about process. That doesn't mean we should abandon it - we should be the party of the Constitution - but we should not be the party that whines to the refs about the rules.

Posted by: SH at January 03, 2013 11:41 AM (gmeXX)

208 "Except for his ability to talk jive and con fools, the man would be a beggar."


Psychopathic empty canvas.

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 11:42 AM (LpQbZ)

209 There is nothing, absolutely nothing, the Republicans can say to them
that will convince them that they shouldn't get the free shit in the
first place. No amount of PR will fix that.


So very true.

The end of our republic was figuring out the idea of giving free shit to people in exchange for votes.

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 11:42 AM (GQ8sn)

210 195 -

I think your suggestion also begins the process that Dems ALWAYS use, but R's can't seem to understand: you aren't going to convince anybody TODAY, but it's about laying the groundwork.

So yeah, every day they're in session, somebody in the Senate gets up and announces "it's been XXXX days since this body passed a budget."

Do it every day between now and November 2014, and it might help make a dent. But Republicans won't do it.

Posted by: BurtTC at January 03, 2013 11:44 AM (TOk1P)

211
Boehner just isn't bad at negotiating, he too is horrible on messaging.
GOP are at huge, huge disadvantage with getting out the truth, that the
Speaker should, well be a good speaker!




Amen to this. I saw him on FNS a few Sundays ago and he looked like this sullen inarticulate asshole who was incapable of making a single fucking point. And this was with Chris Wallace being less of a dickhole than usual.

Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:44 AM (OW/Yj)

212 ...political pressure for Democrats to demonstrate moderation...

In what parallel universe is this supposed to happen? Can I book passage there?


Posted by: @PurpAv at January 03, 2013 11:45 AM (hc3eM)

213 That comment was to miss80sbabe, not you.
Posted by: DrewM. at January 03, 2013 11:40 AM (UfvyB)



You hush you with your facts and your reality. I'm enjoying it up here on my soap box.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 11:46 AM (VtjlW)

214 "Maybe the GOP will cave again. I don't know, but history indicates that that is what they will do. If they have one advantage it is that tax increasesare now off the table for practical purposes. "

This is delusional. He can demand a tax hike in every continuing resolution. Each one will be a showdown and the GOP has already decided to cave to move forward.

Posted by: Chris Balsz at January 03, 2013 11:46 AM (3GtyG)

215 EC, no, they always knew how to do that. It was figuring out how to get invisible taxes collected, so that the sheep didn't notice the shearing.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 11:46 AM (Hw3Gh)

216
These are not negotiations, and they never will be. The power imbalance is to the extent that the relationship between Obama and the House GOP is effectively a captor/captive situation. Think torture. Think hazing. Think cat-and-mouse.

This power imbalance is wrong. This power imbalance does not exist. The only reason this power imbalance seems to be baked into the ground rules is because the only tool in the House GOP's bag--the power of the purse--is off the table.

The democrats didn't take this power off the table. Obama didn't take this power off the table. This power is off the table because fifth-column backstabbers claiming to be on your side employ every tactic in the passive-aggressive playbook to create and sustain the fiction that employing or even credibly threatening to employ so blunt a tool would certainly backfire.

The most fucked up thing about Charlie Brown, Lucy, and the football is that the person holding the ball wears the same uniform as the placekicker.

Posted by: FRONT TOWARD LEFT at January 03, 2013 11:47 AM (V3kRK)

217 People will always want their free shit, but progs are too successful on scaring the free shit getter's, that it is the evil GOP who will take it away. Wouldn't be a lie to let the free shit getter's know is it the Dems wasteful spending, like giving Mooslimb Bro'Hood in Egypt billions and other waste that threatens their free shit.

Posted by: Deli LLama at January 03, 2013 11:47 AM (lGu1O)

218 169 Our PR sucks not just because of our mechanisms but what we try and talk about.

I agree, but making their case to the public also requires unity and message discipline, two departments where they are sorely lacking.

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 11:47 AM (YjDyJ)

219 I can't believe this crap.

Posted by: Iowa at January 03, 2013 11:47 AM (t1NLo)

220 Of course they won't; the Repukes are as scared of him as the donks.
That's why they used that "bipartisan" canard to get him redistricted
out of a fucking job to clear the way for more Cheeto Crists.


That, and because it really was a bipartisan Florida redistricting panel. But mostly because it really was a bipartisan Florida redistricting panel.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 03, 2013 11:48 AM (SY2Kh)

221 If they have one advantage it is that tax increasesare now off the table for practical purposes. "

Once a nerd lets a bully beat them up and steal their lunch money once, they'll be giving it up willingly every day from then on.

Posted by: @PurpAv at January 03, 2013 11:48 AM (hc3eM)

222 IF Boner is re-elected to the House leadership.... GOP goes down even faster than it already is...

Hmmm... maybe I should stop complaining about it... and LET THEM Burn?

Posted by: Romeo13 at January 03, 2013 11:49 AM (lZBBB)

223 Wouldn't be a lie to let the free shit getter's know is it the Dems wasteful spending, like giving Mooslimb Bro'Hood in Egypt billions and other waste that threatens their free shit.

First you have to threaten their free shit. I'm not seeing anyone doing that but The Math, and like the Mills of God, he grinds slow.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 03, 2013 11:49 AM (evdj2)

224 As I said on the earlier thread, it was revealing (though not at all surprising) that Issa came out for Boehner.

These phonies are all talk and nothing more than props for the commies to agitate against.

This is why West would never be voted Speaker by the RINOS, he actually means what he says and is willing to back it up.

No way the Repukes could ever let him confront SCOAMF on their behalf, he might get mad at THEM.

Posted by: ontherocks at January 03, 2013 11:49 AM (aZ6ew)

225 Does anyone else feel as I do, these political hacks have no intention of paying down the debt.Eventually the music stops and I for one am dying of the suspense of what flavor of tyrant takes over from there.

Posted by: Drider at January 03, 2013 11:50 AM (HaJD9)

226 The power imbalance is to the extent that the relationship between
Obama and the House GOP is effectively a captor/captive situation.


Stockholm syndrome.

Posted by: @PurpAv at January 03, 2013 11:50 AM (hc3eM)

227 The GOP (and conservative) messaging should be left to Rubio, Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, and Paul Ryan from the national perspective and from the state perspective Jindal and Martinez. The GOP should get those faces on the Sunday talk shows for the next 2 years. Fresh faces (none are tied to Bush), diverse faces (you know important to the media), but they are also articulate and well versed in conservatism. Not someone like Mitt who has never really seemed to absorb what conservatism is. I would be confidant with any of those people on the Daily Show.

Posted by: SH at January 03, 2013 11:50 AM (gmeXX)

228 OH.... and for those who think Revenues are now off the Table...

Obama has already says he will next go after 'Deductions' of the rich.... you know... those things the REPUBS gave him the idea for??

Posted by: Romeo13 at January 03, 2013 11:50 AM (lZBBB)

229
>>> Posted by: Iowa at January 03, 2013 11:47 AM (t1NLo)

I see you, Dunce.

Posted by: Soothsayer at January 03, 2013 11:51 AM (/v7wy)

230 The biggest mistake was separating the spending cuts from the tax rate discussion. Although the dems will try to get more tax rate hikes in the debt limit discussion they don't really care, they do not want any spending cuts.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at January 03, 2013 11:51 AM (69Mdf)

231 Did we get permanent tax rates this time or not?

Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 03, 2013 11:51 AM (evdj2)

232
Our PR sucks not just because of our mechanisms but what we try and talk about.


Posted by: DrewM at January 03, 2013 11:26 AM (UfvyB)


Everything about government is above their comprehension level. They ought not even be involved in the process at all!!!! A Society that needs to cater to the opinions of Oprah watchers cannot be repaired.

If we can't make them HURT when they do the wrong thing, we can't correct the nation's direction. I think we are there.


Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (bb5+k)

233 "She ain't the brightest bulb in the box"

but let's make her speaker! that's the ticket!
Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:17 AM (yAor6)


I wonder how many times you praised Newt, regardless of the stupid sh*t coming out of his mouth, or the foot in mouth syndrome.

Bachmann is a beast.

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (LpQbZ)

234 222 IF Boner is re-elected to the House leadership.... GOP goes down even faster than it already is...

You can't beat somebody with nobody.

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (YjDyJ)

235 The illustration that best comes to mind is the Exxon Valdez. Boehner is the GOP's 'Joseph Hazelwood' as he has skillfully piloted the party onto a political reef where the is no 'win' for the foreseeable future. One day they will write books about this fiasco. The really sad thing is, this very well could bea 'party highlight'over the next four years.

Posted by: Foghorn Leghorn at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (n8LUb)

236 I never thought I would actually believe this, but the democrats are purposely trying to destroy this nation as quickly as possible. It's the only thing that makes sense at this point.

It's 100% obvious to everyone that spending needs to be cut. We all know this. It's not even slightly a question. And what do we get? Even more spending and more taxes!

They are calling it cuts to buy a little time. I think they want this ship to capsize this term. And calling increased spending "cuts" allows the liberal media to spread the lie without hurting their warped sense of integrity.

Republicans are complicit for their own reasons.

The time to act is quickly approaching.

Posted by: Someone who is Ready at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (NQ76q)

237 228 OH.... and for those who think Revenues are now off the Table...

Obama has already says he will next go after 'Deductions' of the rich.... you know... those things the REPUBS gave him the idea for??

But, but,but I could have sworn that they said that these taxes are set permanently.

Posted by: Drider at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (HaJD9)

238 220 -

Define "bipartisan."

Posted by: BurtTC at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (TOk1P)

239 Did we get permanent tax rates this time or not?

As permanent as anything ever done by Congress.

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (GQ8sn)

240 Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 03, 2013 11:49 AM (evdj2)


The biggest problem this country has... is that it has not Taught the TANSTAAFL (There aint no such thing as a free lunch) idea to its ECONOMISTS or general population, for a couple of generations.

Posted by: Romeo13 at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (lZBBB)

241
Amen to this. I saw him on FNS a few Sundays ago
and he looked like this sullen inarticulate asshole who was incapable
of making a single fucking point. And this was with Chris Wallace being
less of a dickhole than usual.


Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:44 AM (OW/Yj)

Unfortunately, the ones who can best articulate with true passion are Boehners enemies. Boehner's hatred of patriots, Tea Party and any non-entrenched politician is another X for Boehner. His spokesperson Michael Steel is another disappointment.

Posted by: Deli LLama at January 03, 2013 11:53 AM (lGu1O)

242 "I wonder how many times you praised Newt"

I didnt vote for Newt in the primary....

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:53 AM (yAor6)

243 >>I agree, but making their case to the public
also requires unity and message discipline, two departments where they
are sorely lacking.
Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 11:47 AM (YjDyJ)

Because historically the traditional GOP elitist RINOs have ALWAYS treated conservatives like trailor trash to be ridiculed.They see the party as their birthright and not a guardian of the Constitution.

Posted by: ontherocks at January 03, 2013 11:54 AM (aZ6ew)

244 I've been watching a lot of The Sopranos series over Christmas. I know, I know. I'm late to the party.

Anyway, there's a storyline early in the series where a regular john businessman loses at cards in a game run by Tony's crew, and they end up becoming "partners" with him in his sporting goods store. What they do is run up the debt of the business, buying things on credit that they then take for themselves, until the regular john (who had been a high school friend of Tony's and assumed that he wouldn't screw him) is bankrupt and ruined.

Republicans are like the regular john who thinks the Democrats are buddies (i.e., a normal political party composed of American citizens who love their country and want what's best for it, and who will end up compromising to save it), but doesn't realize that they are actually an organized criminal enterprise whose purpose is not governance, but looting the treasury. The goal of the Democratic Party is to transfer as much of the wealth of America and as much of the wealth of the world they can borrow on the country's credit to their own constituencies and cronies, before the country goes bankrupt.

We have to stop pretending that the Democrats will ever do the right thing. They won't.

Posted by: The Regular Guy at January 03, 2013 11:54 AM (qHCyt)

245 "Bachmann is a beast."

yeah and Rick Santorum is the next George Washington

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 11:54 AM (yAor6)

246 231 Did we get permanent tax rates this time or not?


Posted by: toby928© for TB at January 03, 2013 11:51 AM (evdj2)


Tax rates can ALWAYS be changed... the only thing this did was make it so Congress did not have to EXTEND them... ie... no action now will keep them the same... while in the past it took a positive action or they would be raised...

Posted by: Romeo13 at January 03, 2013 11:54 AM (lZBBB)

247 Sorry for all CAPS....THEY ARE NOT REVENUES!! THEY ARE TAXES!! CALL THEM AS SUCH!!! REVENUES ARE CREATED BY BUSINESSES!

Posted by: Steff McKee at January 03, 2013 11:54 AM (WVIkK)

248 The biggest problem this country has... is that it has not Taught the
TANSTAAFL (There aint no such thing as a free lunch) idea to its
ECONOMISTS or general population, for a couple of generations.



Fuck that shit. Too hard!

Posted by: Generation X, Y, and Z at January 03, 2013 11:55 AM (GQ8sn)

249 The biggest mistake was separating the spending cuts from the tax rate
discussion. Although the dems will try to get more tax rate hikes in the
debt limit discussion they don't really care, they do not want any
spending cuts.


They don't want any spending cuts, no. We know that Obama's "balanced approach" bit was always a lie. Most people don't, or don't want to believe it.

However, the Dems are in a much weaker position to ask for more tax hikes after they already got their precious little tax hike on The Rich.

The sequester cuts weren't done away with by this deal. They were pushed back a couple months and it's likely that they'll get watered down, but they're still on the table.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 03, 2013 11:55 AM (SY2Kh)

250 We need someone on our side to finally call him out
on all his destructive policies, using plain language and simple math.

Posted by: Backwards Boy who did not vote for this shit. at January 03, 2013 11:33 AM (yiIja)


You said "math." You lose with his voters. Didn't you watch "Idiocracy"?


Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:55 AM (bb5+k)

251 THEY ARE NOT REVENUES!! THEY ARE TAXES!! CALL THEM AS SUCH!!! REVENUES ARE CREATED BY BUSINESSES!


Posted by: Steff McKee at January 03, 2013 11:54 AM (WVIkK)


Orwell would agree with you both in your specific example and how totalitarian cocksuckers jack around with the definition of words.

Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:57 AM (OW/Yj)

252 237
...
Obama has already says he will next go after 'Deductions' of the
rich.... you know... those things the REPUBS gave him the idea for??

Posted by: Drider at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (HaJD9)

Supposedly he has already made several attempts. In each of his crazy budgets even Dem Senators laughed. Think he also tried to sneak it into of mandatory funding bills.

Posted by: Deli LLama at January 03, 2013 11:57 AM (lGu1O)

253
I saw an article somewhere this AM about Intel
coming up with a chip and table top box that will allow you to bypass
all cable companies and order what ever channels you want on an
individual basis.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at January 03, 2013 11:35 AM (79ueO)


Yeah, I tried to get Ace's attention regarding that yesterday. De-Bundling is in our best interest in my opinion. Cutting funding to socialist/democrat supporting channels is a good thing.
I would urge people to drop every network, perhaps even including Fox.





Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 11:57 AM (bb5+k)

254
President of a has-been nation nose-diving into the deck or
Private citizen enjoying the fruits of my labors and my lovely wife and family?

Get it now?

Posted by: Mitt 'Mitt' Romney at January 03, 2013 11:58 AM (EZl54)

255
Obama has already says he will next go after 'Deductions' of the rich.... you know... those things the REPUBS gave him the idea for??

---

OK, the first one that goes is the one to deduct state and local taxes from federal taxes.

In other words, the deduction which helps blue states the most by covering up the true costs of living there.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 11:59 AM (e0xKF)

256 I want Allen West as Speaker. He would physically
intimidate the JEF which is the only thing the community activist punk
cares about.


Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:29 AM (OW/Yj)



Would love this, too.
Make the JEF so small.
West could do it.

Posted by: LiBeach at January 03, 2013 11:59 AM (LpQbZ)

257 Yeah, I tried to get Ace's attention regarding that yesterday.
De-Bundling is in our best interest in my opinion. Cutting funding to
socialist/democrat supporting channels is a good thing.


This is why internet tv rocks. I get to pick what I want to watch and spend time/money on. Only those channels with actual content good enough to watch get to flourish, the others ones fade away. It's market forces all over again.

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 11:59 AM (GQ8sn)

258
Right now, the perception is that there is
little to be gained poltically by governing conservatively. Until we
change that, nothing else matters.

Posted by: CJ at January 03, 2013 11:40 AM (9KqcB)


Media media media media media media media.

Till we have an "air" force, we aren't going to "win" anything.



Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:00 PM (bb5+k)

259 OT, but since we've passed 250 comments I'll go for it.

RE: The New Delhi rapists who raped a young woman who later died from her injuries. May they all be hung, drawn, quartered, and fed their own genitals before being permitted to die as they are pissed on by members of the general population. ESPECIALLY the "kid."

Okay. I return you to your regularly scheduled groin-punching of our idiot Congress.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 12:02 PM (4df7R)

260
The end of our republic was figuring out the idea of giving free shit to people in exchange for votes.


Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 11:42 AM (GQ8sn)

Lyndon Baines Johnson. That is the guy who murdered the Republic. The trillion dollar per year war on poverty was nothing but a trick to get votes for Democrats by giving away free money to the foolish poor.

It worked to get them into power, but the tactic destroyed the ship they wanted to captain.



Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:02 PM (bb5+k)

261 I want Allen West as Speaker. He would physically

intimidate the JEF which is the only thing the community activist punk

cares about.





Posted by: Captain Hate (dagny 2013 return tour?) at January 03, 2013 11:29 AM (OW/Yj)





Would love this, too.

Make the JEF so small.

West could do it.



West would say, "I've scraped off bigger turds off my boots than you. What makes you think I wouldn't scrape your scrawny ass off mine right now?"

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 12:03 PM (GQ8sn)

262 243 Because historically the traditional GOP elitist RINOs have ALWAYS treated conservatives like trailor trash to be ridiculed.They see the party as their birthright and not a guardian of the Constitution.

It is not just the "moderates" constantly fighting with the conservatives. The conservatives feud and so do the "moderates".

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 12:03 PM (YjDyJ)

263
Do it every day between now and November 2014, and it might help make a dent. But Republicans won't do it.

Posted by: BurtTC at January 03, 2013 11:44 AM (TOk1P)

If we owned a network, we could do a count up clock like they did for Hostages. (Alexthechick's idea) Since we don't, we can't get our message out.


Solution? Own a network.





Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:04 PM (bb5+k)

264 258, bang my drum, withholding, withholding, withholding. If it was so important to W Wilson we should get rid of it on that principle alone.


Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:04 PM (PVNda)

265 We have to stop pretending that the Democrats will ever do the right thing. They won't.

They won't, but they don't have to. They control the Senate and White House.

This internal sniping and bitching is counter productive and just plain stupid. It doesn't matter who the Speaker is or what he does, because there exists no magic spell to make elected Democrats vote like Republicans.

No amount of negotiating, bloviating on Sunday TV, grandstanding, or "balls" can change that. The only thing that can is an election, and we're facing the consequences of losing the last one.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 03, 2013 12:04 PM (SY2Kh)

266 West would say, "I've scraped off bigger turds off my boots than you. What makes you think I wouldn't scrape your scrawny ass off mine right now?"
Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 12:03 PM (GQ8sn)


And I would fall even more in love with him than I am already. *dreamy sigh*

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit at January 03, 2013 12:05 PM (4df7R)

267 *buffs nails*
Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Team Stompy. at January 03, 2013 11:27 AM (VtjlW)


Still on your soapbox looking down all the 'ettes tops?

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert at January 03, 2013 12:05 PM (8cJXl)

268 Saw a poster somewhere claim that Chavez has bit the big one. Unable to confirm at this time though.

Posted by: Meremortal, time to slutdrop the GOPe at January 03, 2013 12:06 PM (1Y+hH)

269 end up becoming "partners" with him in his sporting goods store. What
they do is run up the debt of the business, buying things on credit that
they then take for themselves


This is known as "busting out" a business.

The Democrats are busting out the USA.

Posted by: @PurpAv at January 03, 2013 12:06 PM (hc3eM)

270 264 258, bang my drum, withholding, withholding, withholding. If it was so important to W Wilson we should get rid of it on that principle alone.

---

The government will fight that one tooth and nail.

Getting rid of withholding by employers and requiring all taxpayers to pay checks either quarterly or annually will mean cash flow problems for the government as well as people getting more upset when they have to write a check to the government instead of having those costs hidden.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at January 03, 2013 12:07 PM (e0xKF)

271 Why do we need a network or over the air media, no one s watching them. We need innovative, push channels that go right to likely conservative voters, screw the mass barrage - go direct.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:07 PM (DRG6e)

272 269 end up becoming "partners" with him in his sporting goods store. What
they do is run up the debt of the business, buying things on credit that
they then take for themselves

This is known as "busting out" a business.

The Democrats are busting out the USA.

---

Did someone order a case of sterno and a pack of matches?

Posted by: Henry Hill at January 03, 2013 12:07 PM (e0xKF)

273 btw i'm happy to see little to no you know who around here lately.

Posted by: AuthorLMendez, El Patron at January 03, 2013 12:08 PM (yAor6)

274 Getting rid of withholding by employers and requiring all taxpayers to
pay checks either quarterly or annually will mean cash flow problems for
the government as well as people getting more upset when they have to
write a check to the government instead of having those costs hidden.


You know what would happen? People would be too broke to ever write the first check. Suddenly, they'd have all this additional money that wasn't withheld and they'd think they were rich. That money that was supposed to be sent to pay their taxes with would be promptly spent. A shit ton of people in this country can't make a fucking budget lasting longer than one day. I have absolutely no faith they'd be able to handle this any better.

But it would be an eye opener for sure.

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 12:10 PM (GQ8sn)

275 It takes deliberate ignorance of everything that has gone before, this is the 3rd deal, where we taken to the cleaners, like when Bond was tricked by Le Chiffre, right before he nearly died,

Posted by: phillip fry at January 03, 2013 12:10 PM (Jsiw/)

276 @rollcall RT @dnewhauser: Jim Jordan said he's voting for Boehner, said he'll become speaker.

^They way they conduct this vote also means that no one can rely on the peer pressure method for or against.

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 12:10 PM (YjDyJ)

277 Brandon, preferably annual taxes due in certified funds at the end of the government fiscal year, a few days before Election Day.

Cash flow problems? They're just printing the stuff now, what would change.

Angry voters, scared politicians. Feature, not bug.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:10 PM (DRG6e)

278
Well, whatever it is that is on the table, if there was an intrade bet on if the repubs would cave it would be at 99% in the affirmative.

OTOH, I believe both are 2 sides of the same coin so one side or the other will always cave to the more debt, more spending side. The boning will continue until there are no more bones.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at January 03, 2013 12:11 PM (69Mdf)

279 as well as people getting more upset when they have to

write a check to the government instead of having those costs hidden.


That's kinda the point.

But yeah, what EC said.

Posted by: Kinder, Gentler HeatherRadish™ at January 03, 2013 12:12 PM (ZKzrr)

280 EC, "Suddenly, they'd have all this additional money that wasn't withheld and they'd think they were rich. That money that was supposed to be sent to pay their taxes with would be promptly spent". You know what that's called, stimulus. Hell, zombie Meynard would love it.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:12 PM (DRG6e)

281 279 as well as people getting more upset when they have to

write a check to the government instead of having those costs hidden.

That's kinda the point.

But yeah, what EC said.

---

Yes, that IS the point.

And it's exactly why the government would piss and moan so hard if the possibility were even brought up.

Posted by: Henry Hill at January 03, 2013 12:13 PM (e0xKF)

282 If they aren't moaning, we aren't pushing hard enough.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:14 PM (DRG6e)

283
EC, "Suddenly, they'd have all this additional money that wasn't
withheld and they'd think they were rich. That money that was supposed
to be sent to pay their taxes with would be promptly spent". You know
what that's called, stimulus. Hell, zombie Meynard would love it.


And then we'd be back to automatic wage garnishments for the fuckups who can't handle a little independent responsibility and planning, which brings us back to square one again.

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 12:15 PM (GQ8sn)

284 282 If they aren't moaning, we aren't pushing hard enough.

---

That was always my philosophy.

Posted by: Zombie John Holmes at January 03, 2013 12:16 PM (e0xKF)

285 EC, except with a Federal felony rap to get them off the voter rolls.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:17 PM (DRG6e)

286 It's 100% obvious to everyone that spending needs to
be cut.

Posted by: Someone who is Ready at January 03, 2013 11:52 AM (NQ76q)


You must not know anyone with a credit card problem. It is not at all obvious to these people that they can't continue their spending spree.

Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:19 PM (bb5+k)

287
EC, except with a Federal felony rap to get them off the voter rolls.


You really think that will stop them from voting? Look at who the biggest fuckups of anti-automatic withholding would be and their voting registration. There's no way that will happen to them.

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 12:20 PM (GQ8sn)

288
We have to stop pretending that the Democrats will ever do the right thing. They won't.

Posted by: The Regular Guy at January 03, 2013 11:54 AM (qHCyt)

A lesson that George HW Bush couldn't seem to grasp.

Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:21 PM (bb5+k)

289 @ChadPergram Took 9 ballots to re-elect Speaker Gillett in 1923. Took 163 ballots to pick Speaker in 1856.

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 12:23 PM (YjDyJ)

290 258, bang my drum, withholding, withholding,
withholding. If it was so important to W Wilson we should get rid of it
on that principle alone.







Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:04 PM (PVNda)

Yes, that would be very helpful. No, they won't do it.


Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:24 PM (bb5+k)

291 We have to stop pretending that the Democrats will ever do the right thing. They won't. Posted by: The Regular Guy at January 03, 2013 11:54 AM (qHCyt)

A lesson that George HW Bush couldn't seem to grasp.
Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:21 PM (bb5+k)


Nor Dubya Bush, either. For that matter, the lesson is lost on anyone outside the audience of this blog.

Posted by: Mary Poppins' Practically Perfect Piercing at January 03, 2013 12:25 PM (zF6Iw)

292 Why do we need a network or over the air media, no
one s watching them. We need innovative, push channels that go right to
likely conservative voters, screw the mass barrage - go direct.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:07 PM (DRG6e)


If you don't counter propaganda, it stands.


Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:26 PM (bb5+k)

293 EC, we need to move 5% of the voters, writing a check would do it. Getting some media air time, a pretty speaker, or a better candidate won't. Let Adam Smith do his thing, make the cost of government a critical piece of information for the low-information voter, it will work better then letting the media bury a story on the 2000 day without a budget.

And, just do it. Do not appropriate funds for the collection or management of bi-weekly, employer 941 submissions. Leave the only mechanisms estimated quarterly payments or a check with your return. An entire financial industry will spring up overnight to help you manage those funds.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:27 PM (5TFvk)

294 to my knowledge Boehner's caucus in the past wouldn't agree to a Big Deal that included some form of tax increases, which Obama's obviously always gonna insist on in exchange for spending cuts.

if the proposed compromises were bad then that's a good thing, but he's sorta boxed in here, i dunno what an alternative supergenius supertoughguy negotiator would be able to change given the current dynamics.

Posted by: JDP at January 03, 2013 12:28 PM (8HhF2)

295 Diogenes, if a tree falls in the forest. Counter it, directly to people who are receptive. Anyone watching The View is a lost cause.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:29 PM (5TFvk)

296 EC, we need to move 5% of the voters, writing a check would do it.
Getting some media air time, a pretty speaker, or a better candidate
won't. Let Adam Smith do his thing, make the cost of government a
critical piece of information for the low-information voter, it will
work better then letting the media bury a story on the 2000 day without a
budget.



And, just do it. Do not appropriate funds for the collection or
management of bi-weekly, employer 941 submissions. Leave the only
mechanisms estimated quarterly payments or a check with your return. An
entire financial industry will spring up overnight to help you manage
those funds.


Oh I agree with this strategy 100%. Anything to enlighten the low-info voters to the real cost of government is a win in my book.

The problem becomes getting it past certain pols that rely on keeping a large portion of the populace in the dark. It won't ever make it past committee.

Posted by: EC at January 03, 2013 12:30 PM (GQ8sn)

297 JDP, he could have taken Obama's definition of rich at 450K, rolled that into an AMT fix, made the the Bush rates permenant, slashed all the kickbacks to Hollywood and Buffet, actually increased revenue, and preserved the Pubs tax hike virginity. Done it in a five page bill, and recessed the House.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:33 PM (5TFvk)

298 EC, one guy, House Appropriations Committee Chairman can do it.

Posted by: Jean at January 03, 2013 12:35 PM (5TFvk)

299 Time for a new plan.

Let It Burn.

Posted by: Count de Monet at January 03, 2013 12:37 PM (BAS5M)

300 @robertcostaNRO Rep. Justin Amash just voted for Raul Labrador on the House floor

@robertcostaNRO Bachmann did not vote in the speakership election. Not on floor, or at least we can't see her here.

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 12:39 PM (YjDyJ)

301 @robertcostaNRO Breaking: Cantor just got a vote, as did Allen West from Paul Broun

@rollcall RT @DavidMDrucker: Cantor votes for Boehner, for those counting

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 12:43 PM (YjDyJ)

302 Let. It. Burn.

Posted by: Truck Monkey at January 03, 2013 12:45 PM (DhgcT)

303 If 17 D-Lites vote for someone other than Boner Bella Pelosi will return to Speaker of the House.

Posted by: Butters at January 03, 2013 12:46 PM (NIZHJ)

304 Only five votes for "Other" thus far, and two of those are from Ds.

Posted by: 80sBaby at January 03, 2013 12:48 PM (YjDyJ)

305 Media media media media media media media. Till we have an "air" force, we aren't going to "win" anything.

Posted by: DiogenesLamp at January 03, 2013 12:00 PM (bb5+k)

Screw that. We win we speak in complete sentences about limited government. Bill Whittle: What a Republican Sounds Like

http://tinyurl.com/bb8ffad
Whittle: Where We Go Now
http://tinyurl.com/amptqjg

The solution doesn't begin in Washington, folks. Politicians only do what their voters demonstrate they want done. They aren't demanding limited government. We have a strong case to make to change that, but we haven't made it.

Posted by: CJ at January 03, 2013 12:52 PM (9KqcB)

306 Who cares? It doesn't matter who the Speaker is, so long as they know they're easily replaceable. A Speaker who's ensured his position by default has no reason to do the will of the House and every reason to use his position purely for political theater and personal gain.

This is exactly why the GOP is the useless mess it is today. They live in a constant state of learned helplessness. They know exactly what needs to be done and exactly how to do it, but instead of doing it they conveniently convince themselves that it's all just impossible. Unfathomable. Terrible. Nope, can't do that either. And always for reasons beyond their control, of course.

They allow their actions to be dictated by the stated expectations of people who want them to fail. So they fail. Even when they're in charge they're not really in charge.

Posted by: GalosGann at January 03, 2013 12:53 PM (T3KlW)

307 Yeah, lots of R disasters to come:

1. The R Caucus is going to chisel NY & NJ on Sandy relief.
2. The R Caucus is going to be all by its lonesome in Congress the day of the Debt Ceiling vote, cuz the Ds will all have walked out.
3. Obambi's gonna ask the R Caucus to go first on spending cut ideas, and the R Caucus won't do it, so all cuts will be D cuts -- to the military.
4. Biden's going to introduce the firearms reform bill thru the Senate, and the R caucus will gut it.
5. The Senate Ds will pass Dream Act 3.0, but the R caucus will gut it.

How much will the above be popular? I'd say zero, plus or minus none.

Posted by: Rex the Wonder God at January 03, 2013 02:11 PM (21TJo)






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My Own Micah Wright Style Confession of Dishonesty
Outraged "Conservatives" React to the FMA
An On-Line Impression of Dennis Miller Having Sex with a Kodiak Bear
The Story the Rightwing Media Refuses to Report!
Our Lunch with David "Glengarry Glen Ross" Mamet
The House of Love: Paul Krugman
A Michael Moore Mystery (TM)
The Dowd-O-Matic!
Liberal Consistency and Other Myths
Kepler's Laws of Liberal Media Bias
John Kerry-- The Splunge! Candidate
"Divisive" Politics & "Attacks on Patriotism" (very long)
The Donkey ("The Raven" parody)
News/Chat