"Man of Steel" Filmmakers Pretty Sure You Want A Dark, Gritty Superman With Lots of Drama

Trailer 1 and Trailer 2.

Those mournfully blue stormy skies are exactly what I think of when I think of Superman. And the bearded Clark Kent, hitchhiking along a cold, dreary-skied road? It works for Superman just like it worked for John Rambo in First Blood.And there's no difference in the tone of those two movies.

By the way, did aliens move Smallville, Kansas to the Seattle area? What the hell's with the Rainy Pacific Northwest Right On the Ocean crap?

I was just realizing that maybe I'm not a fan of specific stories so much as a specific tone. Among my all time favorite fun-type movies are these:

The first 70s Three Musketeers movie

The first two Superman movies

The first and third Indiana Jones movies

The first three (real) Star Wars movies

If you notice anything connecting them-- besides the fact that they're all action-adventure fantasies, often with some light sci-fi theming -- it's that they share the same tone. The tone is specific: It's light and humorous, but not truly comical, and certainly not campy (like the Schumacher Batman films) nor self-spoofing (like the later Roger Moore James Bond films).

It's just serious enough to not subvert its own premises/fantasy elements, but no more serious than that. They maintain just enough seriously to permit a buy-in, but don't demand you take them any more serious than that.

The comedy element is light comedy (as opposed to full comedy, where any joke is permitted, as comedy is the main thrust). "Light comedy" is a splash of comedy. Because you don't want to subvert the other elements, you can't get ridiculous or completely silly.

Meanwhile the drama is also light drama. Yes, we care whether Indy and his Dad reconnect... but this isn't Sophie's Choice, here. The dramatic element is pretty fluffy. No one's going to be too worried, and no one's going to be crying here.

And the romance? All the romance is... yes, light romance. It's not the main part of the movie, but there is usually a romantic element, generally handled as light comedy.

The specific genre elements are themselves light. Star Wars isn't a deep science-fiction movie; its science-fiction elements are superficial. So's the historical aspect of Three Musketeers, and Indiana Jones.

The word "light" seems to be coming up a lot here. Not campy, and not self-subverting. The humor isn't silly enough to cripple your ability to buy-in to the fantasy premise (and start thinking, "I should be an archeologist, I think"). But the drama isn't so heavy that you have to buy into it, invest in it emotionally, much more than saying "Gee I hope Indy kills that guy."

It's a tone that works, and has worked, and, I suspect, will keep working. The National Treasure movies-- which I liked, and made money -- had this tone. The Marvel-produced superhero movies tend to have this tone, more or less exactly. I suppose part of the reason the other elements (comedy, drama, and romance) are so light is to make room for, and not distract from, the action-adventure element, which is the main draw. The human touches of comedy, drama, and romance are kept light so they exist -- so they're there, for the audience's enjoyment, and to give characters three full dimensions so you can really experience them as flesh and blood human beings one and a half enjoyable dimensions so you can invest slightly in them as they perform feats of derring do.

Movies of this genre that depart from this specific tone tend to do poorly at the box office and disappoint fans. The Schumacher movies were far too silly and campy (especially the second, which kill the Batman franchise, at least until it was resurrected), as were the last two Superman films in the 80s. The Bryan Singer Superman film, on the other hand, was too portentous and self-consciously "epic" to be any kind of fun at all. It also featured, incongruously, the real-life problem of a fatherless children (and a father who'd left his son to be raise by another man).

The Nolan Batman movies (at least the last two) are exceptions to this rule (at least this suggested rule, I mean), as they were pretty dark and "serious." (I guess they were -- I never got how a movie could be all that serious when it's about Batman.)

The Star Wars prequels suffered from all-over-the-map tones, as the Plinkett review noted.

I suppose this "Rule" might be sort of obvious, and it might not be a case of people deciding to depart from the rule, as much as it is that people simply make bad movies and hence fail the rule, because the "light comedy" turns out to be dreadful comedy and the "light drama" turns out to be boredom and the "light romance" turns out to be characters who are chemistry-free ciphers. I guess the Green Lantern movie attempted this tone, for example, but just failed at it, as it failed at everything.

Still, seems to me to be something to shoot for in this kind of movie, if you want people to spend money on it and actually like it. The template, at least for tone, for what is expected and permitted, exists, has numerous exemplars to copy, and works most of the time it's executed (or at least executed competently).

So, this new Superman. It's dark and moody, without bright colors and without clear photography. I feel like I'm looking at a new Jason Bourne movie, where Treadstone agents get a transfusion of Kryptonian blood. It's "gritty," I guess, and "relevant to our times" (btw, do we want to be reminded of our current dreary and horrible times in escapist movies?), and we're supposed to, I guess, really take Superman's emotional journey seriously.

I just don't see it working. Seems too ambitious, and worse than that, the movie seems to be fighting against its own essence. Like it doesn't know what it is, or, worse yet, it knows what it is but doesn't like what it is so is contriving a different personality, wearing a mask.

Come on, it's Superman. The Big Blue Boy Scout, Last Son of Krypton, the Man of Tomorrow. Truth, Justice, and the American Way. Why are we running away from the actual identity of the property?

Now That I Think About It: This tone is tried all the time. It's just botched a lot. Wild Wild West was this tone-- it just sucked at all elements of it. The Men in Black movies were this tone -- but only the first one was good.

All of the X-Men movies tried this tone -- but only three of the five were good.

So, it doesn't always work. It doesn't work automatically. A bad movie will tank even with this tone.

Still, I have to question the decision to depart from it in a Superman film. Movies that deviate from this tone fail more often than those that stick with it.

Posted by: Ace at 04:03 PM



Comments

1 I like dark films, so, to each his own.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:05 PM (QupBk)

2 I had this dream -- maybe you should post this in the sidebar.

Posted by: 42756 at December 11, 2012 04:05 PM (i8c5b)

3 Because after Nolan's Batman, all DC Superhero movies have to be grounded in reality and dark.

Posted by: DarrenODaly at December 11, 2012 04:05 PM (EqXTp)

4 Raquel Welch and Faye Dunaway's boob spillage had nothing to do with your admiration of the first Musketeer movie, did it?

Posted by: kallisto at December 11, 2012 04:06 PM (jm/9g)

5
this version has Superman as a 'grown-ass man in 2012'

Posted by: soothsayer at December 11, 2012 04:06 PM (jUytm)

6 We live in the age of GrimDark cinema and television.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 11, 2012 04:06 PM (v6YdM)

7 The first 70s Three Musketeers movie.

I like the one with Faye Dunaway in it.

Posted by: dantesed at December 11, 2012 04:07 PM (4OP0E)

8 You're telling me that you didn't laugh out loud or shake your head in disgust at the "lasers shooting between glowing skulls" climactic scene in the last Indy movie? Everyone in the theater did one or the other when I saw it.

Posted by: Lincolntf at December 11, 2012 04:07 PM (tkoGU)

9
It's the 'tone' of Political Correctness that fucks up movies.

Posted by: wheatie at December 11, 2012 04:07 PM (CM59X)

10 Nothing like an Ace Movie review! Can't wait for a review of "Indiana Jones and the Fiscal Cliff." I hear its epic.

Posted by: dfbaskwill at December 11, 2012 04:07 PM (71LDo)

11 I have outgrown slapstick. I watched the Three Stooges and enjoyed it, but mostly for how much work the actors did to get the characters right.


I used to love slapstick.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:08 PM (QupBk)

12 Fuck, Ace goes meta. Its a pre-review review.

Subject: Your mind
Status: Blown

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:08 PM (t06LC)

13 I feel like I'm looking at a new Jason Bourne movie, where Treadwell agents get a transfusion of Kryptonian blood.

Treadstone.

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:08 PM (GQ8sn)

14 Who has two thumbs and likes movie reiews and fart jokes?


This guuuuyy........

Posted by: eleven at December 11, 2012 04:08 PM (KXm42)

15
The first and last Indiana Jones movies
I'm hoping this doesn't mean what it sounds like it means, and you just forgot Crystal Skull even existed.

Posted by: Waterhouse at December 11, 2012 04:08 PM (JACEX)

16
"The first 70s Three Musketeers movie"

One of my favorites. In fact, both are.

Posted by: 29Victor at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (ES9R7)

17 Re: your two exceptions. Batman was able to get away with being "dark" because it's about a confused, broken MAN.

The Marvel characters, like Superman, are real superheros. Batman is just a guy. In fact, Nolan kind of turned him into an emo James Bond - tough fighter with lots of cool gadgets to get the job done.

Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (w4fEE)

18 "Because you don't want to subvert the other elements, you can't get ridiculous or completely silly."

Great. Now you tell me. Where were you when I created Jar Jar Binks?

Posted by: George Lucas at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (eHIJJ)

19 Please tell me by 'last Indiana Jones', you mean Last Crusade and not that piece of crap Crystal Skull

Posted by: mugiwara at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (W7ffl)

20 Treadwell agents{...}

Treadstone?

Posted by: Additional Blond Agent at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (PMGbu)

21 "Dark Side" I believe is Hollywood speak for "exploring your inner gayness"

Posted by: kbdabear at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (wwsoB)

22 The 1st National Treasure was ok but the second one was silly.

Posted by: dantesed at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (4OP0E)

23 Come on, it's Superman. The Big Blue Boy Scout, Last Son of Krypton, the Man of Tomorrow. Truth, Justice, and the American Way. Why are we running away from the actual identity of the property?

---

Because Hollywood is run by a bunch of idiots who know little to nothing about the properties being adapted and, instead, tries to take the shit they want to do and make a half-assed attempt to call it Superman.

There are a few infamous stories regarding the aborted Superman reboot with Nic Cage slated to film between Superman IV and Superman Returns.

These included the producer-mandated Giant Mechanical Spider fight, changing Superman's origin so that the suit is the alien source of his power a la Venom, and a Matrix-like ending in which Lex Luthor turns out to be another Kryptonian and gets into a giant wire-fu fight with Supes.

Posted by: Manager, Hôtel des Mille Collines at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (e0xKF)

24 Has anyone seen/written about Lincoln?

Posted by: USS Diversity at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (85EaA)

25 Off, off, damned sock.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:10 PM (e0xKF)

26 In the year 2000 we will be able to preview posts..



Posted by: eleven at December 11, 2012 04:10 PM (KXm42)

27 I had never really thought of this, but I think Ace is onto something, as usual. Real life, for most of us, is a mixture of light drama, light comedy, and light romance as well. Most of us don't take ourselves all that seriously (I know I don't), so I can relate better to a movie that follows that format as well. Seems more like real life. That doesn't mean that serious shit can't be covered as well, because in real life, shit does happen, but it usually doesn't happen constantly.

Posted by: Brent Glines at December 11, 2012 04:10 PM (48wze)

28 The Star Wars prequels suffered from all-over-the-map tones, as the Plinkett review noted.






Is that what it was? I thought they just sucked

Posted by: TheQuietMan at December 11, 2012 04:10 PM (1Jaio)

29 Sorry, I didn't mean the LAST indiana jones movie, I meant the THIRD.

I blocked out the actual fourth movie from my mind. When I said the "first and last" I meant Raiders and Last Crusade.

Posted by: ace at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (LCRYB)

30
"Has anyone seen/written about Lincoln?"

You mean the Vampire guy? Or the one with the surprise ending?

Posted by: America's Youth at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (71LDo)

31 Not a fan of Snyder but eh, it's not like Supes has a storied history of being on the silver screen outside of the first Donner film and the Fleisher cartoons

Posted by: The Dude at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (tw6Ar)

32 24 "Has anyone seen/written about Lincoln?"

I heard it doesn't play well in the theater.

Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (w4fEE)

33 The first 70s Three Musketeers movie

The first two Superman movies

The first and last Indiana Jones movies

The first three (real) Star Wars movies




It's all about the first time with Ace, isn't it.

Posted by: beach at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (LpQbZ)

34
I'm going to see Lincoln this weekend. All the reviews I've read have been good to great.

Posted by: Lincolntf at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (tkoGU)

35 I liked the National Treasure movies and the first Batman. But I thought the first Batman was "dark".

Posted by: Vic at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (YdQQY)

36 I was entertained by Crystal Skull, in about the same way as I'm entertained by SW I-III.

Compared against the shadow of their counterparts, they kind of suck, but against typical movie fare? Worth it.

Posted by: Yoshi, Aggrieved Victim of the White Man at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (csi6Y)

37 29 Sorry, I didn't mean the LAST indiana jones movie, I meant the THIRD.

I blocked out the actual fourth movie from my mind. When I said the "first and last" I meant Raiders and Last Crusade.

---

Yeah, most of us block out the sight of Harrison Ford taking it up the ass from Spielberg and Lucas a la The Accused.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (e0xKF)

38 When are you people going to give up on hollywood? Isn't enough enough?

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet, Wonders what Dagny thinks at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (3Y7RV)

39 Was Superman never tempted to conquer the world? Was his early conditioning by the Kents that strong?

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (QupBk)

40 8 You're telling me that you didn't laugh out loud or shake your head in disgust at the "lasers shooting between glowing skulls" climactic scene in the last Indy movie? Everyone in the theater did one or the other when I saw it.
Posted by: Lincolntf at December 11, 2012 04:07 PM (tkoGU)

I was too busy screaming at the screen "You nuked the goddamn fridge you fucking fat bastard! Fucking Shia LeBouf! Why don't you just kick me in the goddam balls! Arrrgh! Now that little fucker is swinging with monkeys from vines and keeping up with the fucking car chase! What the fuck are you assholes thinking! Goddam you Lucas"

Needless to say,I didn't notice that part.Or my pastor sitting a row in front of me.

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (t06LC)

41 OT: Let's say you have a "friend" who has a certain "item" made of steel and plastic that does something with "projectiles." If said "friend" needs said item sold really soon because he is out of work or something and can at this point find no buyers, what should I tell said friend that will not run afoul of the law.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (ZOf1l)

42 By "last" Indiana Jones movie Ace is surely acknowledging that there are only three Indiana Jones movies. I hear they keep talking about a fourth movie, but my guess is it'll never happen.

Posted by: Actually at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (6T8Ay)

43
Ha Ha you assholes. I'd see either one, Vampire or Federal Power Pusher

Posted by: USS Diversity at December 11, 2012 04:13 PM (85EaA)

44 I like how you totally ignored Crystal Skull. "The first and last Indiana Jones movies" and "Yes, we care whether Indy and his Dad reconnect... ". Ace is great with the subtle stuff as well as the overt.

Posted by: BishopWash at December 11, 2012 04:13 PM (j5X5B)

45 Yeah, most of us block out the sight of Harrison Ford taking it up the ass from Spielberg and Lucas a la The Accused.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (e0xKF)


-----
That episode of South Park was Teh Awesome!!

Posted by: fixerupper at December 11, 2012 04:13 PM (nELVU)

46 Or the one with the surprise ending?

He dies!

Posted by: Spoiler! at December 11, 2012 04:13 PM (QupBk)

47 The Kingdom of the Crystal Numbskull...

Posted by: Additional Blond Agent at December 11, 2012 04:14 PM (PMGbu)

48
Cat Woman loves a fat elongated black one!

Posted by: Darth Vader at December 11, 2012 04:14 PM (ndqJC)

49 Because Hollywood is run by a bunch of idiots who know little to nothing
about the properties being adapted and, instead, tries to take the shit
they want to do and make a half-assed attempt to call it Superman.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Except of course this is a DC Comics/Warner Bros production. People might have stopped paying attention as the got older, but Superman in the New52, at least when he makes his first public appearances, is a polarizing figure. He also struggles with identity, and as presented, is a perfect representation of what a lot of adopted kids go through as they get older . . . and, with that, stopping now because getting a little to geeky

Posted by: Chris at December 11, 2012 04:14 PM (VSYYy)

50 Why is Superman hitchhiking?

*boggle*

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:14 PM (GQ8sn)

51 Come on, it's Superman. The Big Blue Boy Scout, Last Son of Krypton,
the Man of Tomorrow. Truth, Justice, and the American Way. Why are we
running away from the actual identity of the property?


Because Camp sucks dick and it's been done before.

The whole genre restarted with Burton's Batman, and, while cartoony around the edges, it was a dark take on what had become goofy-shit, TV show Batman.

Burton took the superhero thing a bit more seriously, and then Schumacher turned back into shit.

The problem with the genre isn't that the celeb-directors try to force more import their version than the material warrants; it's that the genre is worn-out.

It's dead, Commissioner.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 11, 2012 04:14 PM (TtXjG)

52 39 Was Superman never tempted to conquer the world? Was his early conditioning by the Kents that strong?

---

Yes.

He was raised as a God-fearing American farm boy until his power developed as a teenager.

If you want to see what would happen if the opposite were to take place, try the Squadron Supreme / Supreme Power books by J. Michael Straczynski on the Marvel MAX label.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:14 PM (e0xKF)

53
Anybody gonna see Bojangles Unchained?

I'm not.

Every time I see Jamie Foxx all I see is "Sha-nay-nay" from In Living Color.

Posted by: soothsayer at December 11, 2012 04:15 PM (jUytm)

54 OT - Homosexuality isn't genetic anymore. It's passed by a thing which isn't in your genetics - since the evidence doesn't bear that out- but you are still totally born that way or something.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 11, 2012 04:15 PM (Ezq3m)

55 What are we supposed to have, like, 3 allowed topics to discuss?

Posted by: eleven at December 11, 2012 04:15 PM (KXm42)

56 "(btw, do we want to be reminded of our current dreary and horrible times in escapist movies?)"
The first Superman movie was smack dab in the middle of the Malaise era. Escapism was fun during the Carter years, but I guess Hollywood doesn't think we need to escape from the Obama years. We should be THANKFUL for the Obama years.
Also, correction: The Empire Strikes Back is many things, but "light", it is not.

Posted by: Ratzo at December 11, 2012 04:15 PM (6T8Ay)

57 Do I hear Enya?

Posted by: tasker at December 11, 2012 04:15 PM (r2PLg)

58

[i[Why are we running away from the actual identity of the property?


Do you seriously have to ask?

Posted by: hollywoodstockers at December 11, 2012 04:15 PM (LpQbZ)

59 Northrop Frye, phone home.

Posted by: Cricket at December 11, 2012 04:16 PM (DrC22)

60 Except of course this is a DC Comics/Warner Bros production. People might have stopped paying attention as the got older, but Superman in the New52, at least when he makes his first public appearances, is a polarizing figure. He also struggles with identity, and as presented, is a perfect representation of what a lot of adopted kids go through as they get older . . . and, with that, stopping now because getting a little to geeky

---

Just because it is a DC / WB production doesn't mean it will work out right.

For every Watchmen or Dark Knight, they have a shit-show like Catwoman or Jonah Hex.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:16 PM (e0xKF)

61 41
OT: Let's say you have a "friend" who has a certain "item" made of steel
and plastic that does something with "projectiles." If said "friend"
needs said item sold really soon because he is out of work or something
and can at this point find no buyers, what should I tell said friend
that will not run afoul of the law.



All my friends call me Cash.

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:16 PM (GQ8sn)

62
Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 11, 2012 04:14 PM (TtXjG)

Burton didn't take Batman seriously, he took the villains seriously hence why his "Batman movies" frankly suck.

Posted by: The Dude at December 11, 2012 04:16 PM (tw6Ar)

63

Do I hear Enya?
Posted by: tasker at December 11, 2012 04:15 PM (r2PLg)



hehe

omg, now I do

Posted by: hollywoodstockers at December 11, 2012 04:16 PM (LpQbZ)

64 I agree with Ace. In fact, I still prefer the Burton Batman to the Nolan Batman. Ok, I liked 2nd Nolan one with the Joker. The other two were tedious and I have no interest in re-watching. I can re-watch the 89 Batman flick.

And a super-serious Superman is stupid because his power set is stupidly omnipotent.

Once you start thinking about how omnipotent he is it just gets retarded and you end up in Why Does a God Need A Starship? territory.

Too camp is retarded. But super-serious is extra retarded.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 11, 2012 04:16 PM (ZPrif)

65 This will suck. I've always thought Superman was a shitty character anyway. Completely uninteresting.

Posted by: Witchfinder at December 11, 2012 04:17 PM (pLTLS)

66 24 "Has anyone seen/written about Lincoln?"I heard it doesn't play well in the theater.
Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (w4fEE)

From what I've heard, it glosses over what could have made it a great movie. The questionable acts of the Lincoln presidencey (suspension of hebaus corpus, locking up journalists for not supporting the war, etc.) are either shown as lighthearted acts or cheered, and Lincoln not wanting to end slavery at all is not mentioned.
It took a complex man and a compelling story and made a cheerleading biopic out of it.

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:17 PM (t06LC)

67 Well if they ever want a Justice League movie they are going to somehow fit together as well as Avengers did. I'm reminded of the 90's cartoon Superman, it has some serious moments and light hearted comedy, Metropolis looked like a bright modern city without any vast social problems. Whenever Superman traveled to Gotham City the mood changed, although that was just a cartoon. I liked the Nolan films, it was a gigantic step up above gay George Clooney. It was also vastly superior in working a "superhero' into the real world, although since no super powers are implied with most of the Batman universe it seemed more logical.

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 11, 2012 04:17 PM (NzBQO)

68 The only thing I liked about "Crystal Skull" was the return of Marian Ravenwood who was a heck of a lot better than the blonde girlfriend he had in the earlier movies.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at December 11, 2012 04:17 PM (v8RoL)

69
OT - Homosexuality isn't genetic anymore. It's passed by a thing which
isn't in your genetics - since the evidence doesn't bear that out- but
you are still totally born that way or something.


Now you tell me.

Posted by: Freddy Dobbz at December 11, 2012 04:17 PM (ZOf1l)

70 I'll take dark and gritty over ubiquitous dick jokes any day.

Posted by: Christina Hendricks's Mighty Jugs are Really SMOD in Disguise at December 11, 2012 04:17 PM (v6GqR)

71 Would the serial numbers of the item happen to be .. worn .. off or anything?

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:17 PM (QupBk)

72 I'm late to the party today, but I just want to comment on the REMARKABLE RESTRAINT that Steven Crowder showed today with that union asshole that kept attacking him physically.

Crowder is a big boy and as much as I'd like to have seen him pummel that dickwad, he was the better man and the union POS just showed what unions are all about.

That is all.....

Posted by: © Sponge at December 11, 2012 04:17 PM (UK9cE)

73 62
Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 11, 2012 04:14 PM (TtXjG)

Burton didn't take Batman seriously, he took the villains seriously hence why his "Batman movies" frankly suck.

---

The original Batman was OK but suffered over the years.

Batman Returns was an abortion-bucket leftover inferior to the campy Batman Forever. At least the latter had Jim Carrey and Tommy Lee Jones gnawing on the scenery.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:18 PM (e0xKF)

74 Anybody seen Fecal Power II?

Posted by: Cricket at December 11, 2012 04:18 PM (DrC22)

75 Come on, it's Superman. The Big Blue Boy Scout, Last Son of Krypton, the Man of Tomorrow. Truth, Justice, and the American Way all that stuff.

Posted by: Pyrocles at December 11, 2012 04:18 PM (cv5Iw)

76 @41
Gunbroker.
Pardon, steel and plastic projectile thrower broker

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:18 PM (t06LC)

77 And how large are the "projectiles"? Just give ballpark dimensions like 5.56 by 45 or 7.62 by 39, etc.

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:18 PM (GQ8sn)

78
Soothsayer has only two rules:

1. Never apologize to a Democrat

2. Never give the Left any money

I don't go to the movies. I do not watch tv. I pirate all their shit.

Posted by: soothsayer at December 11, 2012 04:19 PM (jUytm)

79
"Has anyone seen/written about Lincoln?"

I heard it doesn't play well in the theater.


Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:11 PM (w4fEE)






Heh.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 11, 2012 04:19 PM (TIIx5)

80 Well in comments at another site they are saying the music is straight from--

LOTR.

Posted by: tasker at December 11, 2012 04:19 PM (r2PLg)

81 Come on, it's Superman. The Big Blue Boy Scout, Last Son of Krypton, the Man of Tomorrow. Truth, Justice, and the American Way. Why are we running away from the actual identity of the property?


--------------------------------------------------


Because, perhaps, there's no truth, justice, or the American way anymore. The atmosphere of doom and dreariness is the "social justice" of the Omerican way now.

Posted by: Soona at December 11, 2012 04:19 PM (fLh76)

82 Is that what it was? I thought they just sucked

The beauty and majesty of the Plinkett reviews was how he was able to painstakingly pick out each nugget of corn out of that shit.

Like putting 5 mixed up jig-saw puzzles together.

Posted by: eleven at December 11, 2012 04:19 PM (KXm42)

83 80 Well in comments at another site they are saying the music is straight from--

LOTR.

---

If it's the music I'm thinking of, LOTR swiped it from Requiem For A Dream.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:20 PM (e0xKF)

84 I'm not here to protect him from you. I'm here to protect you from him.

Posted by: Brian Dennehy at December 11, 2012 04:21 PM (Hx5uv)

85 Wasn't Smallville supposed to be in Kansas?

Posted by: jic at December 11, 2012 04:21 PM (cyqHM)

86 Why is a guy who can fly to the sun in a matter of minites hitchhiking?

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 11, 2012 04:21 PM (5TFvk)

87 Would the serial numbers of the item happen to be .. worn .. off or anything?


No very clean and legal, inherited due to death of father-in-law. "Friend" even has pics and specs if someone were interested in emailing.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 04:21 PM (ZOf1l)

88 Report: Obama To Open Direct Talks With Iran, Plan To Shut Israel Out…

And the hits just keep on coming. We could use Superman on this one

Posted by: Nevergiveup at December 11, 2012 04:21 PM (79ueO)

89 My favorite moment in the Indy movies is the one where they go in this really mysterious cave and there's a knight there from, oh, say, the Middle Ages and he starts talking in MODERN ENGLISH! Talk about light comedy!

Posted by: Cricket at December 11, 2012 04:21 PM (DrC22)

90 Remember the piece you ran last week, Ace -- it's all about grabbing those young guys and getting them away from their "World of Warcraft" and "Call of Duty" games and into the theater. You think the 1980s goofy Clark Kent and spunky Lois Lane are going to do that? They want to see shit blow up and CGI that's better than what's on their Xbox, otherwise they aren't going to shell out 11 bucks.

Posted by: rockmom at December 11, 2012 04:22 PM (qE3AR)

91 88 Report: Obama To Open Direct Talks With Iran, Plan To Shut Israel Out…

And the hits just keep on coming. We could use Superman on this one

---

I'm sure that Israel's response will be to "open direct talks between Hamas leadership and Allah. In person."

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:22 PM (e0xKF)

92 If it's the music I'm thinking of, LOTR swiped it from Requiem For A Dream.
Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:20 PM (e0xKF)

_________________

Damn it I can't keep up--off to look for that now.

Posted by: tasker at December 11, 2012 04:23 PM (r2PLg)

93 I'm sure that Israel's response will be to "open direct talks between Hamas leadership and Allah. In person."

That's kinda hawt.

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at December 11, 2012 04:23 PM (/kI1Q)

94 "Friend" even has pics and specs if someone were interested in emailing.

Does your "friend" have overall dimensions of said plastic and metal item? Does said item require one or two hands to operate?

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:23 PM (GQ8sn)

95 @87
Where are you located? Most states selling something like that is no biggie. Hell, go to a gun show and walk around with a sign on it that says for sale.

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:23 PM (t06LC)

96 I'm off to pick up my newly neutered cat, who still has more balls than those fat Union pussies in Michigan.

Posted by: Lincolntf at December 11, 2012 04:23 PM (tkoGU)

97 No very clean and legal, inherited due to death of father-in-law. "Friend" even has pics and specs if someone were interested in emailing.

Does this have to be 20 questions? I think many morons are always in the market for projectile throwers, particularly in .45 ACP.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:23 PM (QupBk)

98 right, smallville, Kansas.

I'm not a huge superman fan (big fan of the movies though).

Posted by: ace at December 11, 2012 04:24 PM (LCRYB)

99 Wow. The new season of Deadliest Catch looks intense!


Wait, that's not what those trailers are for?

Posted by: Ian S. at December 11, 2012 04:24 PM (B/VB5)

100
"The human touches of comedy, drama, and romance are kept light so they exist -- so they're there, for the audience's enjoyment, and to give characters three full dimensions so you can really experience them as flesh and blood human beings one and a half enjoyable dimensions so you can invest slightly in them as they perform feats of derring do."
~ Ace

I attribute this to Political Correctness, Ace.

Political Correctness requires that we be 'two dimensional'...and ignore what really exists.
It requires that we adopt a new vocabulary of terms designed to ignore reality.

If you can't say things like..."Wow she is really tall"...and must instead say:
"Wow she is really vertically challenged."
Then we have been robbed of a basic element of truth and reality.

We can't even call a problem a 'problem' any more...we're supposed to say 'issue' instead.
Well...I say that this is a problem, and I have an issue with it.

Posted by: wheatie at December 11, 2012 04:24 PM (CM59X)

101 90 Remember the piece you ran last week, Ace -- it's all about grabbing those young guys and getting them away from their "World of Warcraft" and "Call of Duty" games and into the theater. You think the 1980s goofy Clark Kent and spunky Lois Lane are going to do that? They want to see shit blow up and CGI that's better than what's on their Xbox, otherwise they aren't going to shell out 11 bucks.

---

Hence we end up with shit like "Battleship", which came off in the trailer like the phony "Michael Bay script for The Dark Knight" circulated on the Internet a few years back.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:24 PM (e0xKF)

102 Too flawless and too invincible makes for an unexciting character. A really good Superman movie would have to either change the character or rely a great villain. To date, no Superman movie as done that so they've all been snoozefests, IMO.

I suggest Brokeback Superman, where the Man of Steel notices certain things about Jimmy that he never really noticed before.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at December 11, 2012 04:25 PM (QKKT0)

103 86 Why is a guy who can fly to the sun in a matter of minites hitchhiking?
Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 11, 2012 04:21 PM (5TFvk)

Giving blowjobs to truckers who pick you up builds charachter.

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:25 PM (t06LC)

104 Battleship was special effects wasted.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:25 PM (QupBk)

105

OT

this is too funny
if you haven't seen it yet from the blaze

This Bed, Bath, & Beyond employee who allegedly decided to announce that they were quitting via a price tag.


http://tinyurl.com/clpcwup

Posted by: beach laughs at December 11, 2012 04:25 PM (LpQbZ)

106 I really don't think even half-joking about violating gun purchasing laws is wise.

There are people who buy and sell guns illegally. They are called criminals. Or in Eric Holder's case, the DOJ.

If you want to buy or sell guns you should comply with all relevant laws in your state.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 11, 2012 04:25 PM (ZPrif)

107
"I was just realizing that maybe I'm not a fan of specific stories so much as a specific tone. Among my all time favorite fun-type movies are these:


The first 70s Three Musketeers movie


The first two Superman movies


The first and last Indiana Jones movies


The first three (real) Star Wars movies

If you notice anything connecting them-- besides the fact that
they're all action-adventure fantasies, often with some light sci-fi
theming -- it's that they share the same tone."

Actually, they share more than that. The Salkinds produced the Musketeers and Superman flicks. And George Lucas created Star Wars and Indiana Jones. Sounds like those guys knew exactly what audiences wanted back then(and then promptly forgot by the mid-80s). Also, all but the Musketeers flicks had John Williams scores.

As for the Man of Steel trailer, I liked it, but I agree that it's taking itself far too seriously. Superman movies should be fun. Nothing wrong with treating the material in a respectful manner as Richard Donner did. But remember to have a little fun with it.

Posted by: Adam_ME at December 11, 2012 04:26 PM (5Grsh)

108 Escapist film should ummm...allow you to escape.

Posted by: @PurpAv at December 11, 2012 04:26 PM (bodka)

109

Dexter.

The anti-superman, sorta.

Posted by: dark and beyon at December 11, 2012 04:26 PM (LpQbZ)

110 102 "A really good Superman movie would have to either change the character or rely a great villain"

Or they could go the Frank Miller route and make Superman the villain, fighting against Batman.

Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:27 PM (w4fEE)

111 @106
Which in most states isn't much. See "gun show loophole, the" or as otherwise known as "private sellers don't have to report gun sales though its a good idea to give a reciept and get a copy of the other guys license unless you live in a fucked up blue state loophole"

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:27 PM (t06LC)

112
OT: Let's say you have a "friend" who has a certain
"item" made of steel and plastic that does something with "projectiles."



Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (ZOf1l)








Tell him to get rid of that sissy crossbow and get a longbow.

*runs away giggling*

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at December 11, 2012 04:27 PM (TIIx5)

113 Ace? Could we get a banhammer in the last thread?

Please?

Posted by: Sean Bannion at December 11, 2012 04:28 PM (sbV1u)

114 Well shit. SMOD misses. Link @ nic....

Posted by: maddogg at December 11, 2012 04:28 PM (OlN4e)

115 You think the 1980s goofy Clark Kent and spunky Lois Lane are going to do that? They want to see shit blow up and CGI that's better than what's on their Xbox, otherwise they aren't going to shell out 11 bucks.

Well, yes, but The Avengers was pretty much the opposite of grim and gritty and it did OK at the box office.

Posted by: Ian S. at December 11, 2012 04:29 PM (B/VB5)

116 Superman: The Grown-Ass Man of Steel.

Posted by: WalrusRex at December 11, 2012 04:29 PM (Hx5uv)

117 A really good Superman movie would have to either change the character or rely a great villain. To date, no Superman movie as done that so they've all been snoozefests, IMO.
*******************

How the fuck was General Zod not a great villain? His lines are almost as memorable as Agent Smith in the Matrix (the first, there were no second or third movies)

And this movie will have General Zod in it again, so it definitely holds promise in that regard.

Posted by: Christina Hendricks's Mighty Jugs are Really SMOD in Disguise at December 11, 2012 04:29 PM (tEkQA)

118 Fuck hollywood, wake me up when bollywood acquires the rights to the superman franchise.

Posted by: SpongeBob Saget at December 11, 2012 04:29 PM (97nMP)

119 They break from the tenor and tone of a hero like Superman precisely becAuse it is a pro-American message.

Posted by: Catmman at December 11, 2012 04:29 PM (C8XlI)

120 I won't ever set foot in a movie theater again in my lifetime.

Too much aggravation, expense and rising blood pressure.

It's not the experience it was even 15 years ago. (and that wasn't so great either).

It can at least be less threatening if you can go to a small town theater but if you only have "urban" venues; forget it. You could get shot, mugged or assaulted (or all three) before the ending credits.

Not worth. I can wait for the DVD and if I'm real impatient, there's always renting.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger (aka Ol' 3 tooth) at December 11, 2012 04:30 PM (3E2th)

121 "if we call them younglings, then it's not as if Annakin is killing kids, right? So what is the tone you're trying to set, dark or ultra dark"

good line from plinkett

Posted by: joeindc44 wonders if anyone has any advice for the GOP at December 11, 2012 04:30 PM (QxSug)

122 It would be a private sale and unknown about sales across state lines. I know in my state where said "friend" lives as well, person to person sales are perfectly legal. Just don't know about state to state.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 04:30 PM (ZOf1l)

123 17 Re: your two exceptions. Batman was able to get away with being "dark" because it's about a confused, broken MAN.

The Marvel characters, like Superman, are real superheros. Batman is just a guy. In fact, Nolan kind of turned him into an emo James Bond - tough fighter with lots of cool gadgets to get the job done.
Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:09 PM (w4fEE)


Bingo. Beat me to it.

Nolan admitted he was trying to make the Richard Donner Superman, with Batman.
Doing that, with an essentially dark and broken source character, is how he impressively achieved the right tonal, and epic balance.

Posted by: BuddyPC at December 11, 2012 04:30 PM (jfUIE)

124 I suggest Brokeback Superman, where the Man of Steel notices certain things about Jimmy that he never really noticed before.

---

Link in name.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:31 PM (e0xKF)

125
114Well shit. SMOD misses. Link @ nic....

Posted by: maddogg at December 11, 2012 04:28 PM (OlN4e)

Teased again.
*le sigh*

Posted by: wheatie at December 11, 2012 04:32 PM (CM59X)

126 Bottom line: Dark Knight made a boatload of money. The next Superman movie must therefore be like Dark Knight.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 11, 2012 04:32 PM (SY2Kh)

127 sounds like this movie is saying, "We're totally f*cked"


because, in fact, you know, we are totally f*cked. Survive four more years of O'Sh*tstain, we won't.


so, then, Art imitates Life. That's far out....

Posted by: Wally in Walla Walla at December 11, 2012 04:32 PM (Dll6b)

128 @122
Find a FFL dealer in your area if it is across state lines. Thoseneed to be transferred. A dealer usually charges a nominal fee (I've bought for less than $5, most transfers around $20)A list of FFL dealers can be found on gunbroker.com. Just put in your zip.

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:32 PM (t06LC)

129 We can't even call a problem a 'problem' any more...we're supposed to say 'issue' instead. Well...I say that this is a problem, and I have an issue with it.
Posted by: wheatie at December 11, 2012 04:24 PM (CM59X)


--------------------------------------------------


Heh. I go round and round with my corporate mangers on this one term. They cannot stand the word "problem". I keep using it, though, because that's what I usually want to talk about. Company problems.

I keep telling them that problems can be solved, but issues are around forever.

Posted by: Soona at December 11, 2012 04:32 PM (fLh76)

130 I second using gunbroker.com. I've had only good results there.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:33 PM (QupBk)

131

It all starts with a very good script, one that makes it all the way to shooting intact without anyone's "input."

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 11, 2012 04:34 PM (XkWWK)

132 Heh. I go round and round with my corporate mangers on this one term. They cannot stand the word "problem". I keep using it, though, because that's what I usually want to talk about. Company problems. Posted by: Soona at December 11, 2012 04:32 PM (fLh76)

I hate that.

I never understood how a "problem" ceases to be a "problem" because we start calling it a "challenge."

Posted by: Sean Bannion at December 11, 2012 04:34 PM (sbV1u)

133 Anyone see the Ironman 3 trailer and think they are taking themselves to seriously now?

Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 11, 2012 04:34 PM (NzBQO)

134
I liked 'Battleship'. It was fun.
There was a clear storyline, and lots of stuff getting blown up.
The good guys won.

What was so bad about 'Battleship'?
Where did I go wrong in enjoying it?

Posted by: wheatie at December 11, 2012 04:34 PM (CM59X)

135 Speaking of guns...here are Charles Barkley's comments on the NFL murder.

I still think he's a blowhard, but he makes lots of sense.

http://tinyurl.com/c7mv5qm

Posted by: CharlieBrown'sDildo at December 11, 2012 04:35 PM (GsoHv)

136
I love both Musketeer movies--I think they are the best film treatment out of many done of two of my favorite books, and yes, the tone was perfect.
Weren't the original books themselves compilations of a running serial by Dumas? Maybe that's the connection to the classic comic aspect in common among the films you reference--they are 19th century serial adventures!

Posted by: barbarausa at December 11, 2012 04:35 PM (WWeoI)

137 OT -- Homosexuality isn't genetic anymore. It's passed by a thing which

isn't in your genetics -- since the evidence doesn't bear that out- but

you are still totally born that way or something.

Wasn't daddy ass fucking me handing on his genes to me?

Posted by: Fred P. Knobbs at December 11, 2012 04:36 PM (jPVBi)

138
129...I keep telling them that problems can be solved, but issues are around forever.

Ooo, that's good, Soona.
Very nice.
I salute you for that one.

Posted by: wheatie at December 11, 2012 04:36 PM (CM59X)

139 Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:33 PM (QupBk)

Sounds good will do. Want the item to be sold to someone reputable and that is why I asked you guys.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 04:36 PM (ZOf1l)

140 I was waiting for this thread to comment on the Plinkett Titanic review.

Generally speaking, I liked it (although I'd never seen Titanic, funny how that is) but at the end, he laments how the most popular movies are action schlock.

It's the conceit of the filmmaker that people go to movies to engage in some sort of intellectual exercise. I hate it when people think that there's something important about watching an important movie rather than just having fun with an exciting story and compelling non-hackneyed characters.

Here's the thing: People go to movies, generally, for the same reason they go on a roller coaster. Nobody complains about the weak plotting or lack of thematic consistency for space mountain. We don't have 3-D, surround-sound, lush landscapes, CGI and beautiful actors/actresses to say something important.

It's just a ride. If you want an intellectual exercise, don't engage in a non-interactive medium.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 11, 2012 04:36 PM (T0NGe)

141

Pa Kent suggesting letting a school bus full of kids die as Plan A.

There's edgy for you....

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 11, 2012 04:36 PM (kdS6q)

142 You forgot the hypothesis that everything is made for 17 year old boys. Aren't teenage boys moody and introspective? They all think they're deep and poetic. Don't they all have a Superman complex? I think Ace is proving the hypothesis correct.

Posted by: Nate in New Orleans at December 11, 2012 04:36 PM (lhX9P)

143 The first two Superman movies would have been good with different actors for Clark/Superman and Lois Lane. Other than that they were okay. Oh, and a Valerie Perrine topless seen would have worked, too.

Posted by: somebody else, not me at December 11, 2012 04:37 PM (nZvGM)

144 What was so bad about 'Battleship'?
Where did I go wrong in enjoying it?


It just isn't the type of entertainment that a thinking person would seek out.

*sniff*

Posted by: Joe Scarborough, An Intellectual at December 11, 2012 04:37 PM (QKKT0)

145
I prefer the Super Friends take on Superman.

I want to see a Hall of Justice and a Legion of Doom.


Meanwhile...

Posted by: soothsayer at December 11, 2012 04:38 PM (jUytm)

146 The Nolan Batman movies (at least the last two) are exceptions to this
rule (at least this suggested rule, I mean), as they were pretty dark
and "serious." (I guess they were -- I never got how a movie could be
all that serious when it's about Batman.)

Well in defense of Batman...
He was a very dark character, borderline crazy/psychotic himself.
In the comics, sans Robin.

So dark and serious does fit that particular super hero.

Posted by: MityMaxx at December 11, 2012 04:38 PM (I13Dg)

147 Just out of sheer curiosity, which one do you like more: The Long Good Friday or Miller's Crossing?

Posted by: Ray at December 11, 2012 04:38 PM (Z2aee)

148 Want the item to be sold to someone reputable and that is why I asked you guys.

I'm dying to know what it is since you are being so mysterious. A class 3 item? A classic?

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:39 PM (QupBk)

149

sheeeeet.....nobody makes a movie bout me.....

Posted by: Aquaman at December 11, 2012 04:39 PM (nELVU)

150 Worst. Trailers. Ever.

Posted by: eureka! LiFBer at December 11, 2012 04:39 PM (HPRku)

151 @146

I think that was the intent of Batman: a man stares into the abyss and the abyss stares back

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:40 PM (t06LC)

152 The real question is, have you seen the international trailer? http://www.imdb.com/video/imdb/vi2458822425/

It explains a little more about the darkness of the plot.

Posted by: DocBallerPHD at December 11, 2012 04:40 PM (KfsHF)

153 The word "light" seems to be coming up a lot here.


I'll add the biggest thing for me - all those movies you reference like their characters. That's the single biggest determiner for me as to whether I will like something. Do the creators of the characters like their characters? If not, why should I?

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with bacon cheddar fries. at December 11, 2012 04:41 PM (VtjlW)

154
Thinking Man's entertainment? Where the hell do you find that on TV or in the movies? The best you'll get is mind-candy caramel.

Re-read Catch-22.

Posted by: USS Diversity at December 11, 2012 04:41 PM (85EaA)

155 147 Just out of sheer curiosity, which one do you like more: The Long Good Friday or Miller's Crossing?

---

I'm setting up the biggest deal in Europe with the hardest organization since Hitler stuck a swastika on his jockstrap.

Posted by: Harold Shand at December 11, 2012 04:41 PM (e0xKF)

156
Needs that Richard Pryor character.

Posted by: Dr. Varno at December 11, 2012 04:41 PM (3wGX5)

157 Anyone see the Ironman 3 trailer and think they are taking themselves to seriously now?


Posted by: Adam Smith's Invisible Pimp Hand at December 11, 2012 04:34 PM (NzBQO)

no and Tony Stark has been more serious as a character be it him as an asshole drunk or a douche bag in getting people registered in 52. Third film looks damn good, even with a white dude being Mandarin

Posted by: The Dude at December 11, 2012 04:42 PM (tw6Ar)

158 149 sheeeeet.....nobody makes a movie bout me.....
Posted by: Aquaman at December 11, 2012 04:39 PM (nELVU)


What Hollywood will do with your story:

Make you a woman and call the film "Aqua-Vulva" starring Sandra Fluke.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 11, 2012 04:42 PM (XkWWK)

159 eh. I go round and round with my corporate mangers on this one term. They cannot stand the word "problem". I keep using it, though, because that's what I usually want to talk about. Company problems. Posted by: Soona at December 11, 2012 04:32 PM (fLh76)


I can't believe they didn't say opportunity.

It's not a problem, nor an issue, but an opportunity.

Posted by: beach at December 11, 2012 04:42 PM (LpQbZ)

160 I haven't seen The Long Good Friday but I thought Miller's Crossing was great.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (QupBk)

161 Just don't know about state to state.

Unless you got a FFL, you're prohibited from shipping a firearm.

And...although no 4473 is required for private sale all of the prohibitions and exclusion of the 4473 apply. If it could be shown you had prior knowledge the buyer wasn't qualified, you could in theory be prosecuted on a private sale. The standards used to determine if that prior knowledge may have existed aren't clearly spelled out.

If there's any doubt at all, just tell the buyer you want to have the thing processed through a FFL. Most will do the logbook work and IC for a nominal fee.

Its cheap insurance against getting a knock on your door at oh-dark-hundred by some Feds asking questions you don't have the answers to.

Posted by: @PurpAv at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (bodka)

162 :::23 Come on, it's Superman. The Big Blue Boy Scout, Last Son of Krypton, the Man of Tomorrow. Truth, Justice, and the American Way. Why are we running away from the actual identity of the property? :::

Because it's a weak, tired, outdated property?

The best thing about the first film was Gene Hackman and Ned Beatty as Lex Luthor and Otis.

I'd love to see a darker reboot. The Superman story is so squeaky clean - just an endless succession of clear cut black and white choices. Even when he has to sacrifice Lois, he doesn't *really* have to sacrifice. He can just spin the planet backwards, destroying all life on earth turning back time.

C'mon. That shit didn't even work in Ferris Bueller's Day Off with the Ferrari.

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (/tzTG)

163 They are wrong. I actually don't want any superman at all, ever.

Posted by: doug at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (TEIU+)

164 I'm dying to know what it is since you are being so mysterious. A class 3 item? A classic?

Both! It's probably a Sturmgewehr 44!

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (GQ8sn)

165 Now Ace is reviewing movie trailers? I'm beginning to suspect his diet consists exclusively of coffee and pizza rolls.

Posted by: Supermanatee, the love child of Power Girl and Aquaman at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (yn6XZ)

166 Taken was light?
Casiono Royale was light?
Law Abiding Citizen was light?
See a trend?

Posted by: Hard Right at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (uhftQ)

167


What Hollywood will do with your story:

Make you a woman and call the film "Aqua-Vulva" starring Sandra Fluke.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 11, 2012 04:42 PM (XkWWK)



Or, just make Avatar.

Posted by: blue = green at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (LpQbZ)

168 149 sheeeeet.....nobody makes a movie bout me.....
Posted by: Aquaman at December 11, 2012 04:39 PM (nELVU)


In all seriousness, I would bet that virtually all of DC and Marvel's characters are or have been in development as a feature film at one time or other over the past 30 years.

Me? I want to see "My Mother, The Car" as a feature.



Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (XkWWK)

169 It just isn't the type of entertainment that a thinking person would seek out.*sniff*
Posted by: Joe Scarborough, An Intellectual at December 11, 2012 04:37 PM (QKKT0)


---------------------------------------------------


That's why I like action/adventure like Indiana Jones and the like. I don't have to think. I can just sit back and enjoy. I don't go to movies for profound messages. I get those from books.

I guess Thelma and Louise is more your speed.

Posted by: Soona at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (fLh76)

170 "Come on, it's Superman. The Big Blue Boy Scout, Last Son of Krypton,
the Man of Tomorrow. Truth, Justice, and the American Way all that
stuff."

===============

Remember when they dropped the "American way" from Superman Returns? It was just "truth, justice, and all that stuff!"

Hollywood douchebags.

Posted by: Kensington at December 11, 2012 04:44 PM (H84UO)

171
Needs that Richard Pryor character.
Posted by: Dr. Varno




Desperately lacking in Otis and Toupee Luthor.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 11, 2012 04:44 PM (kdS6q)

172 141 "Pa Kent suggesting letting a school bus full of kids die as Plan A."

He's really playing his character from the end of "No Way Out."

Pa Kent, Soviet spy.

Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:44 PM (w4fEE)

173 I'd love to see a darker reboot. The Superman story is so squeaky clean -
just an endless succession of clear cut black and white choices. Even
when he has to sacrifice Lois, he doesn't *really* have to sacrifice. He
can just spin the planet backwards, destroying all life on earth turning back time.


I do like Lex Luthor's plan of detonating a nuke underneath the San Andreas fault line and turning Nevada into beachfront property.

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:44 PM (GQ8sn)

174 160 I haven't seen The Long Good Friday but I thought Miller's Crossing was great.
Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (QupBk)


Both quite good, though Miller's Crossing was shot and directed much better IMHO.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 11, 2012 04:44 PM (XkWWK)

175

Now Ace is reviewing movie trailers? I'm beginning to suspect his diet consists exclusively of coffee and pizza rolls.
Posted by: Supermanatee, the love child of Power Girl and Aquaman at December 11, 2012 04:43 PM (yn6XZ)



hehe, yea.

I wonder if he requests the drafts of Hollywood Reporter.

Posted by: blue = green at December 11, 2012 04:45 PM (LpQbZ)

176 Battleship was fun. I feel bad for tim riggins, his movies flopping this year

Posted by: joeindc44 wonders if anyone has any advice for the GOP at December 11, 2012 04:45 PM (QxSug)

177 re: "Burton didn't take Batman seriously"

Because Batman is ridiculous. He's a stock noir detective, darkly driven by Death and etc., and...he dresses up like a fucking bat. That's just astoundingly stupid behavior that no amount of "He must hide his identity, for..." can excuse. So it has to be treated like an awkward given we won't really talk about except to allow that the dude is kind of weird and up-his-own-ass, and have other characters make some jokes about that--then the audience can forget about it and enjoy whatever revenge-stalking story this repugnantly malformed character is in.

Burton precisely hit the limit of how seriously you can take Batman and not look stupid yourself. Nolan's Batman movies...do not succeed at this. And he must know it. Once the (absolutely retarded) origin story is sorted, Batman is barely in them.

Posted by: oblig. at December 11, 2012 04:45 PM (cePv8)

178 An interesting thing about the Superman mythology is that, despite him being nearly all-powerful in his own right, he always chose to subordinate himself to the higher ideals of 'truth, justice, and the American way'.

There's a reason for this. A reason why the invincible-being-with-the-heart-of-a-Boy-Scout always worked, even if it was a little old fashioned and hokey. It's simple, and everyone knows it instinctively. It's this:

- A man who's not extremely well grounded when he wrestles with the allure of his own godlike power is nothing more than a moral time bomb. Without the idea of faith and service, too much power will make any man a monster. -

That was Superman's charm. He was grounded in very (dare I say) conservative values. Values rooted in consequences he was powerful enough to not suffer, but values he cherished anyway because he knew they were right. Take away that very heavy anchor and he becomes a petty and jealous god in the making.

Superman as 'dark' and 'edgy' doesn't work for precisely this reason. At best, you get a petty tyrant. At worst, a invincible moralistic busybody.

Posted by: Artemus Khan, Supervillain-Billionaire-Layabout at December 11, 2012 04:45 PM (27tUc)

179 Weren't the original books themselves compilations
of a running serial by Dumas? Maybe that's the connection to the classic
comic aspect in common among the films you reference--they are 19th
century serial adventures!

Posted by: barbarausa


Yes, it looks like it was. I guess that was the standard mode for popular authors way back when.

Funny, thing about The Three Musketeers; it's been remade as a film over 20 times, not counting animated versions.

First one in 1903 all the way to an execrable version last year an another in development now.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at December 11, 2012 04:45 PM (TtXjG)

180 166 "Taken was light?

Casiono Royale was light?

Law Abiding Citizen was light"

One of these things is not like the other, one of these things just doesn't belong.

Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:45 PM (w4fEE)

181 I'm dying to know what it is since you are being so mysterious. A class 3 item? A classic?

No. I just didn't know how it would take since it might be considered a sensitive subject. Sorry to be so James Bondish. It is a SW Model 59 9MM with 3 full capacity mags and a customized leather holster and mag holder. Just was wanting it sold soon since "friend" isn't working and it would be nice to buy his kids some gifts. That's all.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 04:46 PM (ZOf1l)

182 Pull my finger.

Posted by: the abyss at December 11, 2012 04:46 PM (jPVBi)

183 Darkest dreariest movie ever?

The Road

Posted by: polynikes at December 11, 2012 04:46 PM (m2CN7)

184 @17

Exactly, and in the other example, the X-Men films, what made them "serious/dark"- the conflict between humans and mutants - had always been the core element of the comics they were based on.

Posted by: Jon (not the troll) at December 11, 2012 04:47 PM (1wPNG)

185 well, Superman isn't american anymore, Superman is now a citizen of world.

Truth, Justice and the American Way?

pfffht, hogwash!


/sarc -off

Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 04:47 PM (jdOk/)

186 No. I just didn't know how it would take since it might be considered a
sensitive subject. Sorry to be so James Bondish. It is a SW Model 59 9MM
with 3 full capacity mags and a customized leather holster and mag
holder. Just was wanting it sold soon since "friend" isn't working and
it would be nice to buy his kids some gifts. That's all.


*slaps forehead*

You had us going that it was something really awesome like a gun with a beer opener on the slide.

Gunbroker.com - it's the ebay of guns and gun accessories. Your best bet is trying to offload it there.

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:48 PM (GQ8sn)

187


In summary, there are too many remakes.

Posted by: beach at December 11, 2012 04:48 PM (LpQbZ)

188 I thought the third MIB movie was okay, if for no other reason than enjoying Brolin's spot-on Tommy Lee Jones impression.

Posted by: apotheosis at December 11, 2012 04:48 PM (xWk3U)

189 "Darkest dreariest movie ever? The Road
Posted by: polynikes "
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lame, boring, garbage.

Posted by: Hard Right at December 11, 2012 04:48 PM (uhftQ)

190 Apropos of nothing, I watched Resident Evil (5?): Retribution last weekend at some point. That franchise has jumped the shark. Even Milla Jovovich, sad to say getting a bit long in the tooth, couldn't save it.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:48 PM (QupBk)

191 Darkest dreariest movie ever?



The Road


The Divide

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:49 PM (GQ8sn)

192 ...Woman of Kleenex.

Posted by: Dr. Varno at December 11, 2012 04:49 PM (3wGX5)

193
This movie review is called: "Fuck you, Hollywood. You SUCK!!!"
Four Stars

Posted by: Sharkman at December 11, 2012 04:49 PM (03IDC)

194 187


In summary, there are too many remakes.

---

Executives see less danger in a shitty remake than a great original film, if only because they know how to market a shitty remake.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:49 PM (e0xKF)

195 damn, i can't seem to help myself....


i'll just say "No" i don't want a dark version of Superman and leave it there.

Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 04:49 PM (jdOk/)

196 Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:48 PM (GQ8sn)

Shit, now I wish it was. I didn't want to get in trouble that's all.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 04:49 PM (ZOf1l)

197 Miller's Crossing. Wait, what?

Posted by: Some Guy in Wisconsin at December 11, 2012 04:49 PM (dQSbv)

198 The other reason the Batman movies work is, the Batmobile. Few people talk about this, but damn near every boy I've ever known had some toy version of a Batmobile, and they will go see every iteration of Batman on screen just to see what newstuff they can do with the Batmobile. The Nolan movies were great because they start off with that damn fantastic Batmobile built by Mr. Fox.

Superman has no gadgets, no supercar, just his own powers, which aren't as cool and don't lend themselves to a "darker tone."The original Superman movies worked because they were more or less romatic comedies and not superhero-actuion movies.

Posted by: rockmom at December 11, 2012 04:50 PM (NYnoe)

199
Chuck Norris used this sort of 'formula' in all his old movies...

He, as the hero, would get beat up repeatedly and go through all sorts of hell...for the biggest part of the movie.
Then at the very end, he would finally get to kill the bad guys.

It was brutal and exausting to watch...but in the very end you got some reward for sticking it out and watching it.

Nolan's Batman movies did this too.

But something I don't like in recent movies...is seeing the bad guysportrayed as someone we should have sympathy for.
I don't want to have sympathy for the bad guys.

Posted by: wheatie at December 11, 2012 04:50 PM (CM59X)

200 You can fly, you can stop bullets, you are Superman but you are a tragic figure? Only one thing can do that to a man with all those powers.

Yep , power of the P.

Posted by: polynikes at December 11, 2012 04:50 PM (m2CN7)

201 Apropos of nothing, I watched Resident Evil (5?): Retribution last
weekend at some point. That franchise has jumped the shark. Even Milla
Jovovich, sad to say getting a bit long in the tooth, couldn't save it.


I'm sorry to see this franchise drive into the ditch after the first two movies. The last few movies have been almost exactly the same with very little universe arc exploration or advancement. And why the fuck does Wesker need sunglasses in an underground base?!?!?

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:50 PM (GQ8sn)

202 Homosexuality isn't genetic anymore. It's passed by
a thing which isn't in your genetics - since the evidence doesn't bear
that out- but you are still totally born that way or something.

Posted by: Bevel Lemelisk at December 11, 2012 04:15 PM (Ezq3m)

------
You mean you dont get gay thru politically correct rewrites?????

Posted by: The Green Lantern at December 11, 2012 04:50 PM (nELVU)

203 Well hey don't worry ace everything will be great since Warner bros seems to want to completely copy marvel and tie Nolan's batman and superman to their justice league movie. Hey how do you fuck up a movie with batman and superman? Well you don't make batman Bruce Wayne that's how!

Posted by: Buzzion at December 11, 2012 04:51 PM (95gQg)

204 Darkest dreariest movie ever?



-----

Aeon Flux.

Worst.Fucking.Movie.EVAH.

Posted by: fixerupper at December 11, 2012 04:52 PM (nELVU)

205
Posted by: Jon (not the troll) at December 11, 2012 04:47 PM (1wPNG)

you should check out the new series, All New X-Men. Quite interesting as it deals with Hank going back in time and bringing back the original X-Men team to modern times.

Posted by: The Dude at December 11, 2012 04:52 PM (tw6Ar)

206 The Superman comics are bright and optimistic. The Batman comics are dark and unhappy.
Soa dark Superman movie is like a bright Batman movie. Forget it! We like dark Batman movies because that's what Batman is. We liked Superman movies 1 and 2 because that's what Superman is.
A dark Superman movie? That's not Superman. That's Batman wearing the Superman costume.

Posted by: Food at December 11, 2012 04:54 PM (tuPiK)

207 Oh and I'm really dying to read ace's future review of the Robocop remake. The first one was a fucking classic. Dark, intense, and ultraviolent for the sake of showing absurd violence as comedy.

I'm not having any doubts the remake will suck the dry, chapped skin flakes off the underside of Fred Dobbs' ballsack.

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:54 PM (GQ8sn)

208 Aeon Flux was bad, Ultraviolet just as bad.
Worst ever? Robot Jox.

Posted by: Hard Right at December 11, 2012 04:54 PM (uhftQ)

209 But something I don't like in recent movies...is seeing the bad guysportrayed as someone we should have sympathy for.
I don't want to have sympathy for the bad guys.

---

About the only time a bad guy is allowed to be a moustache-twirling Snidley Whiplash is when they're a rich white guy.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:54 PM (e0xKF)

210 199 "But something I don't like in recent movies...is seeing the bad guysportrayed as someone we should have sympathy for.
I don't want to have sympathy for the bad guys"

There's a fine line there, because you don't want to have bad guys just being bad for no reason.

A great villain has a clear reason for doing what he/she does that makes total sense to him/her.

The Joker in the 2nd Nolan Batman is a great example of a character with a clear, logical motivation (logical to him) but not at all sympathetic.

Posted by: The Q at December 11, 2012 04:54 PM (w4fEE)

211 You're a mean drunk, Superman.

(I'm only writing the punchline because I assume everyone has heard that joke a dozen times).

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 11, 2012 04:54 PM (SY2Kh)

212 I watched Resident Evil (5?)

Is 4 any good? Big Lots had it for like $3

Posted by: @PurpAv at December 11, 2012 04:55 PM (bodka)

213 speaking of movies... does anyone buy Tom Cruise as Jack Reacher?


it's so ridiculous.

Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 04:55 PM (jdOk/)

214 39
Was Superman never tempted to conquer the world? Was his early conditioning by the Kents that strong?

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:12 PM (QupBk)

___________________
This is why I've never cared for superhero stories. In the real world Superman would rule the world not be a reporter.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 11, 2012 04:55 PM (HDgX3)

215

Darkest dreariest movie ever?


They ought to make a movie out of the book Unconsoled.


I blame a friend, who told me to read it.

It is so dark.
So ... unconsoled'ish.

Posted by: beach at December 11, 2012 04:55 PM (LpQbZ)

216 213
speaking of movies... does anyone buy Tom Cruise as Jack Reacher?


it's so ridiculous.



He wore 24 inch lifts for that movie.

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (GQ8sn)

217 The Divide


Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:49 PM (GQ8sn)


I haven't watched that many dark movies, but 8mm was pretty dark.

Posted by: © Sponge at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (UK9cE)

218 Dark and dreariest day, ever.

November 7, 2012.

Posted by: eureka! LiFBer at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (HPRku)

219 Is 4 any good? Big Lots had it for like $3


Posted by: @PurpAv at December 11, 2012 04:55 PM (bodka)

the movies? god no, they all suck.
the game? yeah

Posted by: The Dude at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (tw6Ar)

220 Darkest dreariest movie ever?


Wait, I have it...


Irreversible.



Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (GQ8sn)

221 I dunno, this one probably has some light moments in it. Evan Nolan's Batman films, as grim as they were, had funny moments throughout them (almost all done by Michael Caine, of course).

I like movies that don't insult my intelligence, and if making superhero flicks darker is what's needed to keep them from being silly, I'm OK with it.

Posted by: UGAdawg at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (WYOrt)

222 207 Oh and I'm really dying to read ace's future review of the Robocop remake. The first one was a fucking classic. Dark, intense, and ultraviolent for the sake of showing absurd violence as comedy.

I'm not having any doubts the remake will suck the dry, chapped skin flakes off the underside of Fred Dobbs' ballsack.

---

I'm dreading the remake of The Warriors, which is supposed to take place in LA instead of New York and get rid of all the garish gang themes that helped make the original so memorable.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:57 PM (e0xKF)

223 >>>Darkest dreariest movie ever?


Hardcore with George C. Scott.

Posted by: Dr. Varno at December 11, 2012 04:57 PM (3wGX5)

224 Irreversible.


Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (GQ8sn)

Monica Bellucci and a fire extinguisher, whats not to like?

Posted by: The Dude at December 11, 2012 04:57 PM (tw6Ar)

225 Darkest dreariest movie ever?





Hardcore with George C. Scott.


Yeah, that was a fucked up movie.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 04:58 PM (ZOf1l)

226 I haven't watched that many dark movies, but 8mm was pretty dark.

This is light years ahead in terms of dark content. Similar to "The Road", it's about what happens in the aftermath of a cataclysmic event (nuclear war) with a group of people stuck in the basement of an apartment building. Eventually, they start going crazy and really, really bad things happen like what you saw in "The Road".

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:58 PM (GQ8sn)

227 So in other words, there's good lowbrow schlock and there's bad lowbrow schlock. Got it.


Posted by: Fuck piggy union whores at December 11, 2012 04:58 PM (E55AK)

228 I haven't watched that many dark movies, but 8mm was pretty dark.


Posted by: © Sponge at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (UK9cE)

-----
Yup. And the only Nick Cage movie I could ever really stomach...

Posted by: fixerupper at December 11, 2012 04:58 PM (nELVU)

229 I haven't watched that many dark movies, but 8mm was pretty dark.
Posted by: © Sponge at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (UK9cE)

Yeah that was dark but the bad guys got killed so it had some redeeming qualities. I don't like dark films but 8mm is one of my favorite movies.

Posted by: polynikes at December 11, 2012 04:58 PM (m2CN7)

230 Is 4 any good? Big Lots had it for like $3

Afterlife is better than the one I just saw. I don't like the ever increasing size and strength of the monsters. Or the increasingly pointless actions of Umbrella Corp.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 04:58 PM (QupBk)

231 speaking of movies... does anyone buy Tom Cruise as Jack Reacher?


it's so ridiculous.
Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 04:55 PM (jdOk/)



I used to hate Cruise. His boyish look, and all that. In the beginning, I didn't think he was a very good actor.

But, I never miss his movies, now. I think he's grown as an actor.

He also tries different things.

Collateral is a good example.

Posted by: beach at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (LpQbZ)

232 223 >>>Darkest dreariest movie ever?

---

Outtakes from Twilight Zone - The Movie featuring Vic Morrow.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (e0xKF)

233 This is why I've never cared for superhero stories. In the real world Superman would rule the world not be a reporter.
Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 11, 2012 04:55 PM (HDgX3)

That is the only thing that makes the charachter interesting. A man who has the power to rule the world, but the moral conviction to say no.

King George III once said that if Washington turned over his sword to congress after winning the revolution, he would be the greatest man that ever lived. Same idea here. I wish a movie about Superman would focus on that more.

Posted by: Jollyroger at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (t06LC)

234 So you haven't seen it yet?

A New Hope looked campy as shit after Star Trek set the tone.

Posted by: Not Ready To Unsock at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (BgIBZ)

235 "They ought to make a movie out of the book Unconsoled. "

They made one out of "Requiem for a Dream", which was the bleakest thing I've ever read until I decided to read "Let's Go Play at the Adams" a couple of months ago.

Posted by: UGAdawg at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (WYOrt)

236 I want to see Superman in a future that was imagined in about 1955.

That's what superman I want to see.
Oh well.

Posted by: Truman North at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (UFQGb)

237 I tried to watch Spiderman 4 last night. Fell asleep immediately and woke up when it was over. Tried again. Got far as Martin Sheen and decided no way am I watching this. Why did they even feel the need to make a Spiderman 4? It is the same old shit rehashed.

Posted by: Walkers! at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (0Ufr+)

238 I've actually seen all the Resident Evil movies and I can't tell you anything about them. Zombies. Hot chicks. Evil corporations.

At some point there were clones. And sometimes people have superpowers and/or turn into tentacle monsters.

Oh, and giant monsters. Sometimes there are, like, giant troll-monsters with giant swords. I think.

I think the world got destroyed several times. I think there were dream sequences.

No idea what really happened.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (ZPrif)

239 Nothing beats Robot Jox for worst movie.
Not The Last Boyscout, Waterworld, Hudson Hawk, or Ishtar.

Posted by: Hard Right at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (uhftQ)

240 (almost all done by Michael Caine, of course).


SHE WAS ONLY. FIFTEEN. YEARS. OLD!

YOU WERE ONLY SUPPOSED TO BLOW THE BLOODY DOORS OFF!

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (GQ8sn)

241
He wore 24 inch lifts for that movie.
Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 04:56 PM (GQ8sn)

maybe they should have made all the other actors play their parts whilst standing on their knees?

Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 05:00 PM (jdOk/)

242 Yup. And the only Nick Cage movie I could ever really stomach...

Really? How about Leaving Las Vegas? Seeing him die and Elisabeth Shue naked was a pretty good twofer.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 05:00 PM (ZOf1l)

243 Yup. And the only Nick Cage movie I could ever really stomach...


Posted by: fixerupper at December 11, 2012 04:58 PM (nELVU)


My wife kept asking me "are there really people out there who like that stuff?" I felt bad telling her, "yep" and never mentioned that I'd seen clips once or twice.


I thought the first Saw was pretty good and pretty dark as well. The rest.....eh.

Posted by: © Sponge at December 11, 2012 05:00 PM (UK9cE)

244 Darkest dreariest movie ever?

Absolute Power.

The movie begins with the President of the United States having rough sex with his young, hot mistress.

And then the Secret Service busts in and accidentally kills the mistress.

Posted by: Bill Clinton at December 11, 2012 05:01 PM (w4fEE)

245 Oh and I'm really dying to read ace's future review of the Robocop remake.

I hear Brian Dennehy turns in a brilliant performance as Detroit.

Seriously, I'll be rooting for Detroit to be burned to the ground.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 11, 2012 05:01 PM (T0NGe)

246 Still though, you're right, I think Superman is inherently cornier (and hard to pull off in a dark tone) than Batman because Superman has paranormal attributes whereas Batman is just a rich man with access to superior technology. But I thought the Nolan Batman films were going to suck and they turned out to be fantastic.

Posted by: Not Ready To Unsock at December 11, 2012 05:01 PM (BgIBZ)

247 Why did they even feel the need to make a Spiderman 4? It is the same old shit rehashed.

---

Sony had a small timeframe to either make a Spidey sequel with Sam Raimi's crew or to do a complete reboot.

Raimi et all bailed, so we got a remake.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 05:01 PM (e0xKF)

248 Monica Bellucci and a fire extinguisher, whats not to like?

10 minutes of watching her on the floor.

Posted by: EC at December 11, 2012 05:01 PM (GQ8sn)

249
I recently watched a movie called...'Sinners and Saints' (2010).
I enjoyed it, because lots of bad guys got blown away and the good guys survived.

It had a dark and brooding hero cop, played by Johnny Strong.
[Yes, that's his real name.]

Here's a taste:

http://youtu.be/7Tb12T3mXFs

Johnny Strong is also a musician...and that is his music used in the video, and in the movie.
He hasa band called Operator.
He also makes knives.

Posted by: wheatie at December 11, 2012 05:02 PM (CM59X)

250 The Last Boy Scout is one of my top guilty pleasure movies.

Posted by: polynikes at December 11, 2012 05:02 PM (m2CN7)

251 Gosh I guess it's been a while since I've invested myself emotionally in the source material. I mean to say I want to see the Silverage Superman. That was the superman I first met but it was the superman I first liked.

Posted by: Truman North at December 11, 2012 05:02 PM (UFQGb)

252

Hudson Hawk is good.

Posted by: soothsayer at December 11, 2012 05:02 PM (jUytm)

253 236)
been done, it's the Superman cartoon from the 90's.237)
They remade it so they wouldn't lose the property

Posted by: The Dude at December 11, 2012 05:02 PM (tw6Ar)

254 Aeon Flux.

Worst.Fucking.Movie.EVAH.
Posted by: fixerupper at December 11, 2012 04:52 PM (nELVU)



Ultraviolet.

Not even William Fucking Fichtner could save that movie.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Now with bacon cheddar fries. at December 11, 2012 05:02 PM (VtjlW)

255 :::Superman as 'dark' and 'edgy' doesn't work for precisely this reason. At best, you get a petty tyrant. At worst, a invincible moralistic busybody.:::

And either of those would make for a more complex and interesting character, and you would have more choices for supporting characters, rather than the regular two types Superman movies are limited to: Antagonists or Fawning Fans.

How about letting this caped cocksucker *develop* his moral code like we all do - through a series of mistakes and bad choices?

How does he know how hard to punch a human villain or blow them over with his breath? What if he crushed someone's sternum before he learned to pull his punches? Or impaled someone he blew away onto a fence?

Wouldn't that be more interesting than "Pa told me to be a good man?"

Posted by: Empire of Jeff at December 11, 2012 05:03 PM (/tzTG)

256 This movie will suck. This fact will have nothing to do with whether or not this movie makes money.

Posted by: Some Guy in Wisconsin at December 11, 2012 05:03 PM (dQSbv)

257 Maybe I've grown queer in my old age, but I have been a fan of Cruise ever since Interview With the Vampire. That movie also made me realize that no matter who he laid, Brad Pitt is the worst actor in Hollywood.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 05:03 PM (ZOf1l)

258 It looks like a Superman movie I really don't care to see. Superman should be fun. But then I'd have said the same about James Bond and I guess I'm wrong about that. Of course there have been a lot of Bond movies, maybe the old formula just wore out.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at December 11, 2012 05:03 PM (HFSSn)

259 250 The Last Boy Scout is one of my top guilty pleasure movies.

---

We're getting our asses kicked by the inventor of Scrabble!

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 05:03 PM (e0xKF)

260 Posted by: Flatbush Joe

A perfect summation of the franchise. Lots of stuff happens, Jovovich gets naked at some point, shooting.

You could really watch them in any order I think.

Posted by: toby928© for TB at December 11, 2012 05:03 PM (QupBk)

261 > Worst ever? Robot Jox.

Dude I will fight you. That movie was a goddamn masterpiece compared to Wing Commander

Posted by: apotheosis at December 11, 2012 05:04 PM (xWk3U)

262 "They ought to make a movie out of the book Unconsoled. "

They made one out of "Requiem for a Dream", which was the bleakest thing I've ever read until I decided to read "Let's Go Play at the Adams" a couple of months ago.
Posted by: UGAdawg at December 11, 2012 04:59 PM (WYOrt)



It's actually The Unconsoled by Kazuo Ishiguro (I correct myself).

I total mindfark.



I see they made a movie out of Perfume. I did not know that.

One helluva a book. Read it if you haven't.

http://www.amazon.com/Perfume-Story-Murderer-Patrick-Suskind/dp/0375725849


Posted by: beach at December 11, 2012 05:04 PM (LpQbZ)

263 Ace, I'm with you on the desired tone for adventure movies. I'll add another example: "The Mummy" movie from 1999.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120616/

It hit the light adventure tone, except when it didn't. And every time it deviated from that tone I hated it.

It got too "heavy" in the part where several men died horribly due to the mummy's curse. IIRC there was a scene where a man had already lost his eyeballs and knows the mummy is about to kill him and has no way to escape; then sure enough he dies screaming. He wasn't a nice man, but still!

Then it got downright campy in a part at the end where the male hero was fighting mummies. IIRC he hit a mummy in the head, and the head went spinning around and around with a cartoonish ratchety sound.

The correct emotions to hit: "wow that's cool" "wow I wish I could do things like what he just did" "oh man how will they get out of this situation"

The wrong emotions to hit: "eewwww" "um, that looks like a painful way to die... yes, that really looks painful... oh man when will it stop" or... "ha ha ha that is so ridiculously silly"

Posted by: mr_jack at December 11, 2012 05:05 PM (TMG3G)

264 Oh and I'm really dying to read ace's future review of the Robocop remake.

I hear Brian Dennehy turns in a brilliant performance as Detroit.

Seriously, I'll be rooting for Detroit to be burned to the ground.
Posted by: AmishDude at December 11, 2012 05:01 PM (T0NGe)

damn that was funny, thanks I needed that.

Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 05:05 PM (jdOk/)

265 261 > Worst ever? Robot Jox.

Dude I will fight you. That movie was a goddamn masterpiece compared to Wing Commander

---

"Southland Tales." Full stop.

Posted by: Brandon In Baton Rouge at December 11, 2012 05:05 PM (e0xKF)

266 Luther turns Metallo loose on Supes a the Grand Canyon.

That could be a 45 minute fight scene.

You don't need a lot of depth or backstory for Superman. We all know Superman.

Posted by: Truman North at December 11, 2012 05:05 PM (UFQGb)

267


SCORSESE:


TAXI DRIVER


That's about as dark as it gets.


Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 11, 2012 05:05 PM (XkWWK)

268 This thinking stuff is too hard.

I want tits and a few fart jokes. I don't want to be an intellectual any more.

Posted by: jwest at December 11, 2012 05:05 PM (ZDsRL)

269 Oh by the way (spoiler alert) Killing Me Softly is a boring tedious movie, and don't bother.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 05:06 PM (ZOf1l)

270 This is why I've never cared for superhero stories. In the real world Superman would rule the world not be a reporter.

Posted by: Mr. Moo Moo at December 11, 2012 04:55 PM (HDgX3)



That is the only thing that makes the charachter interesting. A man
who has the power to rule the world, but the moral conviction to say no.


Part of it is that he was raised in the heartland of America with American values. That corny American Way stuff is what keeps him from going all Mussolini on everybody. If he were raised in Indonesia with a nanny and then moved to Hawaii to be raised by a bank vice president and sent to private schools, he'd be a tyrant.

Forget the rain, I want him to actually be in Iowa. In the wintertime. When it's cold. Really, really cold.

And then he says, "Fuck this shit" and flies around the world to move it closer to the sun to exacerbate global warming. Because, fuck winter.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 11, 2012 05:06 PM (T0NGe)

271 Ultraviolet.



Not even William Fucking Fichtner could save that movie.


AtC? Badmouthing a Milla Jovovich movie?

Do we need to call 911? Is that some sort of secret code for "Please help, I'm being held hostage"?

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 11, 2012 05:07 PM (SY2Kh)

272 Posted by: mr_jack at December 11, 2012 05:05 PM (TMG3G)


gotta disagree, the version of "The Mummy" with Brandon Frasier Rachel Weiss was pitch perfect from beginning to end.

probably the best mummy movie ever made.

Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 05:07 PM (jdOk/)

273 So, ace, you prefer things that are "light" to things that are "dark"?

RACIST

Posted by: Jason Whitlock at December 11, 2012 05:07 PM (2jQGY)

274 Worst movie ever? Heaven's Gate has to be in the running. The ironic thing is I love the music. It has a great soundtrack. Battlefield Earth sucks donkey dongs. Catwoman was horrible. The two Matrix sequels were awful, a particular disappointment given that the first film was great. And unfunny comedies are legion. One particular disappointment for me was The Nude Bomb.

Posted by: WalrusRex at December 11, 2012 05:08 PM (Hx5uv)

275 If only they could get Ted Knight to narrate like on Super Friends.

Posted by: Dr. Varno at December 11, 2012 05:09 PM (3wGX5)

276 Battlefield Earth at least had the side benefit of giving us one of the best Rifftrax episodes ever.

Posted by: apotheosis at December 11, 2012 05:09 PM (xWk3U)

277 "I want tits and a few fart jokes."

And some thinly-veiled racist dog whistles. You know how I love those.

Posted by: jwest at December 11, 2012 05:09 PM (ZDsRL)

278 SCORSESE:





TAXI DRIVER





That's about as dark as it gets.







Posted by: J.J. Sefton at December 11, 2012 05:05 PM (XkWWK)

Fuck Godfather II, that movie made DeNiro a fucking star.

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 05:09 PM (ZOf1l)

279 And then he says, "Fuck this shit" and flies around the world to move it
closer to the sun to exacerbate global warming. Because, fuck winter.


*vapors*

Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at December 11, 2012 05:10 PM (/kI1Q)

280 Meatballs sucked, I can't believe I cashed that paycheck.

Posted by: Bill Murray at December 11, 2012 05:11 PM (ZOf1l)

281 worst movie?

go to netflix and click on a stinky little turd called "Of Alien Orgin",

i had to re-learn how to read after watching it.

Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 05:11 PM (jdOk/)

282 and my spelling never recovrd

Posted by: Shoey at December 11, 2012 05:12 PM (jdOk/)

283

Aeon Flux.



Worst.Fucking.Movie.EVAH.

Posted by: fixerupper at December 11, 2012 04:52 PM (nELVU)





Ultraviolet.



Not even William Fucking Fichtner could save that movie.



Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD



Maybe I'm biased b/c I find Milla Jovich irresistible, but I though Ultraviolet was a 2.5 out of 5 star.

Aeon Flux was pretty shitty acting, and a bad plot, but very nice visuals (yes, including those). 2 out of 5

my standards for chick-hero sci-fi is exceptionally low, but it has to have some redeeming quality. Both of those movies were watchable, though not re-watchable.



Posted by: imp at December 11, 2012 05:13 PM (UaxA0)

284 There are only two movies I ever came close to walking out of: Battlefield Earth, and that craptastic Fiennes/Thurman Avengers flick (Steed/Peel, not the other Avengers). Of the two, the second was worse--I was at least able to laugh off Battlefield Earth. I just shook my head at the other.

Posted by: Brother Cavil at December 11, 2012 05:14 PM (GBXon)

285 Superman remakes, Batman remakes, Robocops remake........

How much longer before someone decides we need a relaunch of the Police Academy series......only darker and grittier.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at December 11, 2012 05:15 PM (OWjjx)

286 :::How about letting this caped cocksucker *develop* his moral code like we all do - through a series of mistakes and bad choices?...Wouldn't that be more interesting than "Pa told me to be a good man?" :::

It would be more interesting, no question. But people with basically unlimited power and no moral guidance don't develop into angels. They turn into Kim Jong Il. Weird. Narcissistic. Paranoid.

If you can get your way every single time, and are basically immune to consequences, there's practically zero chance you'll develop into anything more than that kid from the Twilight Zone that could change reality by wishing it. What value does compromise or hard work have to someone who needs neither to succeed?

It would be a great allegory about coupling unchecked power with cheap adolescent morality, but that sort of tale would hit *way* too close to home for your Hollywood liberal set. The very last thing they want is to show what would happen if you gave Superman-level power to a bright-eyed young leftist.

Posted by: Artemus Khan, Supervillain-Billionaire-Layabout at December 11, 2012 05:16 PM (27tUc)

287 "Shaving Ryans Privates" was disappointing. Too much emphasis on the penis, not enough on the penis to vagina dialogue. Same thing with "Bareback Mountain". Too much guy on guy stuff. Where do they get these ideas?

Posted by: Samuel Adams at December 11, 2012 05:16 PM (ZOf1l)

288 Worst Movie and no one mentioned "The Fish that Saved Pittsburg"

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at December 11, 2012 05:16 PM (OWjjx)

289 Does Charlize Theron wear dentures or something?

I can only assume that she keeps getting work because of her having incredible BJ skills.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at December 11, 2012 05:17 PM (SY2Kh)

290 *vapors*


Posted by: HeatherRadish™ needs a beer at December 11, 2012 05:10 PM (/kI1Q)


Awesome.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 11, 2012 05:17 PM (T0NGe)

291 The Last Boy Scout is one of my top guilty pleasure movies.

That's the one where the cars blows up after landing in a pool. Love that.

Posted by: eleven at December 11, 2012 05:17 PM (fsLdt)

292 In late 21st-century America, farm-raised Smallville kid Clark Kent must carve out a future for himself and those he loves as his country, long sliding into fascism, descends into civil war shortly after the onset of World War III.



_>



I think it would be interesting. ._. Particularly with good villains like Zod around, and with Supes being of the more limited variant - no warp flight through space, no living inside the sun, just super strong, durable, and able to leap tall buildings in a single bound.



It'd be original, at least...

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at December 11, 2012 05:18 PM (O/vys)

293
Leonard Part 6

Posted by: Dr. Varno at December 11, 2012 05:19 PM (3wGX5)

294 239 Nothing beats Robot Jox for worst movie. Not The Last Boyscout, Waterworld, Hudson Hawk, or Ishtar.

---------

Leonard, Part 6?

Posted by: Citizen Anachronda has not seen Robot Jox at December 11, 2012 05:19 PM (xGZ+b)

295 I am not a Superman fan. What is so heroic when only one thing can hurt you?

On that same note.....how can you be all dark and down if only one thing can hurt you....oh yeah be a Democrat....they are all victims.

Posted by: ALL_IS_LOST at December 11, 2012 05:19 PM (T/L2Z)

296 Battlefield Earth brings back fond memories of my family sitting in the living room, making a thousand and five wisecracks at what we universally agreed to be the single worst film ever produced.



How did someone in the filming crew not stop and say "Guys, this is stupid, we need to throw this away"?

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at December 11, 2012 05:20 PM (O/vys)

297 In the real world Superman would rule the world not be a reporter.

Or maybe you're just projecting.

Posted by: @PurpAv at December 11, 2012 05:20 PM (bodka)

298 The first 70s Three Musketeers movie

The very first one was rollicking fun. Raquel dies in the sequel and the mood is much darker even before that. I wish they hadn't done that, because it makes me sad to think about it. Sorry to be such a sap. But the first one is is a beautiful romp without being saccharine sweet and the sequel spoiled it a bit.

The 1993 version isn't bad either; Oliver Platt is especially effervescent, but it doesn't have Raquel. She may be best know as an absolute goddess, but she she is an exceptionally gifted comic actress.

Posted by: kraki at December 11, 2012 05:21 PM (ylLDT)

299 Agree on Battlefeld Earth. Mindnumbing dull insipid adjective adjective....

Posted by: eleven at December 11, 2012 05:22 PM (fsLdt)

300 The worst critically acclaimed movie of all timehas to be:

There Will Be Blood.

If they made terrorists watch that movieI would themost vocalanti-torture protestor evah!

Posted by: polynikes at December 11, 2012 05:28 PM (m2CN7)

301

Battlefield Earth is the first movie I can remember in which teh villians are pudgy dreadlocked cosplay stoners.

I thought that was brilliant


Posted by: imp at December 11, 2012 05:28 PM (UaxA0)

302 How did someone in the filming crew not stop and say "Guys, this is stupid, we need to throw this away"?

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at December 11, 2012 05:20 PM (O/vys)

(a) They were getting paid, with (b) Scientology money.
Win-win, bay-bee!

Posted by: AmishDude at December 11, 2012 05:28 PM (T0NGe)

303 > How much longer before someone decides we need a relaunch of the Police Academy series......only darker and grittier.

IN A WORLD...WHERE CRIME RULES THE STREETS

*fade in to Tackleberry in something that looks like HALO armor carrying a gun twice as large as himself*

...WHERE THE INNOCENT ARE VICTIMIZED...

*fade cut to newlyweds Mahoney and Thompson screaming rage at the sky over the corpse of their dog, who was caught by the bumper of an Impala during a drive-by*

...WHERE THE GUILTY GO UNPUNISHED...

*fade cut to Hightower and Jones watching a sneering mobster walk out of the courtroom after acquittal*

...ONE TEAM OF MISFITS MUST STAND ALONE AGAINST THE TIDES OF CHAOS.

*smash cuts to Sweetchuck hacking a computer in a dark room with fixed-width fonts projected on his face, Hooks in a catsuit capoeira-kicking the shit out of ten guys in ski masks, explosions, a car chase, explosions, Zed setting off an explosion, exploding car chases, exploding buildings, Commandant Lassard slamming a phone down, explosions*

*fade cut to Mahoney and Thompson holding hands resolutely at the window of a pet store, looking forward to an uncertain future, and puppies*

POLICE ACADEMY: ACADALYPSE NOW

Posted by: apotheosis at December 11, 2012 05:29 PM (xWk3U)

304 Scruffy beard guy stars in:

Superhipster; Lost between adolescence and beta-manhood.

Posted by: Fritz at December 11, 2012 05:29 PM (ZA675)

305 for the record I liked "Wild, Wild, West"

Posted by: El Patron AuthorLMendez, Wishing Everyone Happy Holidays at December 11, 2012 05:30 PM (yAor6)

306 Superman is archaic not for the corny Americanism or his unending list of superpowers.

It's archaic because he works for a newspaper.

What the hell is a "newspaper"?

Posted by: AmishDude at December 11, 2012 05:31 PM (T0NGe)

307 Batman could ditch the tone because he's the only superhero who could, theoretically, exist in this world. He's not supernatural and that movie wadnt action adventure, it was something else. All the other movies you mention have a supernatural or fantastic element that the tone allows us to accept. I'd ad back to the future to this list.

Well except for three musketeers. But I've never seen that.

Posted by: Elizabethe at December 11, 2012 05:34 PM (ee1Wr)

308 Not gonna lie. I was all prepared to hate it, but it looks pretty awesome to me. Especially because it has crab fishing in it.

Posted by: pep at December 11, 2012 05:34 PM (6TB1Z)

309 "That Dark Knight Rises picture looks like it's going to be a big hit! Let's get a copy of the script, and wherever it says Batman we write in Superman, and wherever it says Bane we write in Zod! Can't miss!"

Posted by: Trimegistus at December 11, 2012 05:37 PM (OuDuJ)

310 Just based on your description (not having watched the trailer), are they're rebooting Superman not in a Rambo or Nolan Batman mode, but with a Twilight-style emo gravitas-lite tone? Including the requisite gloomy-picturesque-epic Pacific Northwest locale.

Posted by: shoeless hunter at December 11, 2012 05:51 PM (9196u)

311 Wild Wild West (the movie) blew chunks because it had a producer who insisted on his pet CGI item (a giant mechanical spider) which, to tie all this together, same producer tried to pawn off on Kevin Smith on one of his story treatments for "Superman Lives". Watch the original "A Night with Kevin Smith" for a 25-minute explanation of this.

Posted by: Kevin in ABQ at December 11, 2012 05:54 PM (BvTwT)

312 "'Man of Steel' Filmmakers Pretty Sure You Want A Dark, Gritty Superman With Lots of Drama"

Whereas what I want is... not Hollyweird crap. None of it. No Superman. No Star Trek. No Star Wars. No, no, no.

What I want is to starve the beast.

This last election cycle? When Hollyweird poured huge amounts of money into re-electing the SCOAMF?

Yeah. That money. There were bitter disappointments about seeing Obama back in, but not about the Hollyweird money. Because not even one thin dime of it came originally from me. Not even a penny. Because I'm on an absolute boycott of Hollyweird crap. And, frankly, it's been a huge boon to my life. Not only am I not giving money to people whose politics are diametrically opposed to mine, but I have more time for actual real-world enjoyments.

All it takes is the modest sticktoitiveness to shut off the TV and stop going to the movies. Really not all that hard at all.

Beast. Starvation. Some assembly required.

Posted by: torquewrench at December 11, 2012 05:54 PM (ymG7s)

313 Worst movies: Intercessor - Another Rock n Roll Nightmare.
Maidstone, starring directed by Norman Mailer.

Compared to those two, Troll 2 and Manos are Star Wars.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at December 11, 2012 05:56 PM (HFSSn)

314 The 'Diehard' franchise, and the Blade series. Patterns to be immitated.

Posted by: Man of Flesh & Blood at December 11, 2012 06:03 PM (QgpEL)

315 308 Especially because it has crab fishing in it.

--------

Crab fishing? I've heard of it.

Posted by: Sandra Fluke at December 11, 2012 06:13 PM (xGZ+b)

316 Young Clark is in the North Pacific because he's heading to the Arctic to create the Fortress of Solitude. Don't you folks know your canonical Superman stories?

Posted by: Mister X at December 11, 2012 06:35 PM (go4rb)

317 The third Men In Black was good too. The second one was so bad that I forget what made it bad.

Posted by: Anwyn at December 11, 2012 06:36 PM (DFGSG)

318 Ace missed out on the latest trailer-

Here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVpSz0ZIvs0

It fills out the story a bit more, if you read between the lines.

Superman is isolated because he's the only one of his kind - i.e. a god among men.

People are frightened of his power- see Mom not thanking the hell outta Ma Kent's boy for saving her son.

Superman withdraws from the world to crab fish(?)

Zod shows up. Supes is no longer alone.

Zod knows what his role in our world is - absolute ruler.

Will Superman join Zod or be true to his inner boy scout?

Hijinks ensue.


It could work, perhaps very well as long as they don't drag the isolated god/ will he be good/won't he be evil thing past the first movie.

This movie needs to end with Superman becoming the Superman we know.

If done right it could be powerful.

Posted by: naturalfake at December 11, 2012 06:38 PM (54vf8)

319 how about The Man who would be King?
The last starfighter?
lot of fun movies to enjoy, just not much from this century

Posted by: joe mack at December 11, 2012 06:41 PM (ZGKN0)

320 This wouldn't be the first time the geography of Smallville has been futzed with. The series Smallville showed in one episode that Metropolis could be seen from the Smallvillle water tower. In fact, throughout the series, Metropolis was always just a short drive away. My how close New York is to Kansas.

Posted by: Rusty Nail at December 11, 2012 07:01 PM (WWuYG)

321 Superman is an american nationalist figure. American nationalism is dead(2012). Enjoy the decline.

Posted by: red at December 11, 2012 07:09 PM (7us0J)

322 I was thinking things were getting too dark in movies after seeing Skyfall (the lastest James Bond film). When did James Bond films get to be so dreary and dark. I miss Sean Connery and Roger Moore (the films used to be exciting and fun to see, now everything is so doom and gloom, where the hell were the Bond girls???).

Posted by: M.C. at December 11, 2012 07:13 PM (8kcx6)

323 The Star Trek movies were the same way - the second movie was the best, because it set the right comedic tone, and captured the mood of the original series.

Posted by: norrin radd at December 11, 2012 07:19 PM (HRn0l)

324 I disagree Ace. Given their relatively recent vintage (both created in the late '30s) and their outre birthplace (pulp-derived comics), Superman and Batman haven't yet been issued the dramatic license necessary for subjective interpretation. Everyone has an idea in their heads about what these characters should be or how they should look and any deviation from those self-imposed standards is considered non-canonical.

Older name-brand heroes like Hercules and Tarzan are given wide latitude as to how they're interpreted. I seem to remember in one of the Burroughs books Tarzan engaging in a gory battle with a male gorilla that ended with Tarzan ripping out the creature's throat, yet we don't consider that interpretation inconsistent with the recent Disney cartoon. Likewise Hercules was recently given the Disney treatment and in the mythological stories he murders his wife and child in a fit of rage.

We don't consider these wildly varying interpretations at odds because those literary creations have transcended popular culture to become archetypes unto themselves. We don't consider Tarzan or Sherlock Holmes or Hercules or Hamlet to be "ours" in any meaningful sense. They belong to literature and literature belongs to everyone. As such they can be interpreted in any way the artist who uses them sees fit.

With characters like Superman, Batman, and Indiana Jones, however, we are possessive of them in a visceral sense. In some cases these characters were touchstones of our childhood and that attitude informs our belief that they are inviolable. These characters are in a transitional stage from pop cultural icons into transcendent literary creations. A hundred years from now not a second thought will be given to a "darker" Superman or a "lighter" Batman. Their journey from pulp to literature will be complete.

Oh yeah, and Let It Burn.



Posted by: MorphysGhost at December 11, 2012 07:56 PM (tDieS)

325
I agree with you about Superman not being dark and gritty. The main hook for Superman is in the conflict of power vs. morality, his high moral standards always win. It's about optimism. That power doesn't corrupt. Metropolis is an example of the goodness of technological progress, everything bright and clean with generally happy citizens. Utopian vs. Distopian. Metropolis vs. Gotham.
The latest incarnation of Batman is good because it's dark and gritty. The first Micheal Keaton "Batman" was good but the later films added too much of the campiness from the old TV series. They were trying to make a superhero movie and spoof the idea of heroism at the same time, they failed to do either. Also, commercially, Batman does better when he's dark and gritty. Scooby Doo/Super Friends era Batman had nowhere near the success of Batman: The Animated series or the even darker video game version found in "Batman: Arkham Asylum". Guess the "Dark Knight" is supposed to be dark.

Posted by: DeanCainsAgent at December 12, 2012 03:20 AM (oybD6)

326 The best, most concise summation of what Superman is comes on the first page of All Star Superman, seen here: http://www.griph.net/2010/03/in-praise-of-brevity/

Posted by: kalel666 at December 12, 2012 08:45 AM (8WPsB)

327 The post expresses my opinion about tone perfectly. Mel Gibson's a great example of a director who can't do tone, but who's a great actor. It's the difference between The Road Warrior and Mad Max 3, or between Rob Roy and Braveheart (I wanted to like Braveheart but it just sucked). Or Revolution with Al Pacino and The Patriot. Mel Gibson's great when he doesn't direct, tone-deaf when he does.

Posted by: Loge at December 12, 2012 10:47 AM (vGACX)

328 Good TV series also adhere to this formula, or I should say the all-time best do. Cheers was a comedy with just the right amounts of drama and romance thrown in. The Wire and Rome were dramas with great comedic touches thrown in amidst the overall gloominess of the tone.

Posted by: logprof at December 12, 2012 09:45 PM (gBuIk)






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