No, The Navy Didn't Relieve An Admiral Because Of Benghazi

This story is making the rounds and I'm seeing people trying to connect it to Benghazi somehow.

The Navy said Saturday it is replacing the admiral in command of an aircraft carrier strike group in the Middle East, pending the outcome of an internal investigation into undisclosed allegations of inappropriate judgment.

Rear Adm. Charles M. Gaouette is being sent back to the USS John C. Stennis' home port at Bremerton, Wash., in what the Navy called a temporary reassignment. The Navy said he is not formally relieved of his command of the Stennis strike group but will be replaced by Rear Adm. Troy M. Shoemaker, who will assume command until the investigation is completed.

It is highly unusual for the Navy to replace a carrier strike group commander during its deployment.

It is very unusual for the Navy to fire such a high ranking officer but it's not unusual for them to remove a commander who has done something to lose the trust of their superiors.

How do I know this isn't connected to Benghazi? He'd be the worst scape goat in all of history for several reasons.

1. The Stennis Carrier group is in the Persian Gulf area, which is the 5th Fleet Area of Responsibility. It's nowhere near Libya, which is in the 6th Fleet AoR

Most importantly is this little tidbit in the story.

The Stennis group deployed from Bremerton in late August and had entered the Navy 5th Fleet's area of operations in the Middle East on Oct. 17 after sailing across the Pacific.

I don't know exactly where Stennis was on SEPTEMBER 11th but it was nowhere near Libya.

Calendars....How do they work?

My prediction: Gaouette's "judgment" issues have more to do with the port calls in Thailand and Malaysia than nefarious politics.

There are also some rumblings about the General Ham's replacement as Commander of Africa Command being announced this week. If you look at the history of combatant command tours they are usually about 2-2.5 years and this announcement is well within that window. Ham's replacement was simply named, he still must be confirmed by the Senate and then there's usually a few months until the actual change of command.

There are a lot of unanswered questions but trying to fill them in with crazy speculation doesn't help anyone.

Added: There's also a story going around (sorry, no links for nutty conspiracy theories) that General Ham was about to disobey Obama's supposed "stand down" order and was removed from command by his second in command.

Apparently it was only double-secret probation or something.

Posted by: DrewM. at 04:35 PM



Comments

1 First

Posted by: Methos at October 27, 2012 04:36 PM (hO9ad)

2 Typo in the title. Should read "Relieve" not, "Relive".

Posted by: Victoria at October 27, 2012 04:36 PM (tV5ow)

3 I've heard we have more admirals than active ships, anyway, and if that's true the Navy can do without one.

Posted by: boulder Neutral hobo at October 27, 2012 04:39 PM (QTHTd)

4 Victoria,

Thanks.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 04:40 PM (AR+tO)

5 Still a short tour for Ham. But Drew's probably right.

Posted by: Occam at October 27, 2012 04:40 PM (lkUU9)

6 If you look at the history of combatant command tours they are usually
about 2-2.5 years and this announcement is well within that window.


Except that, from what I hear, he's been there 18 months, which is outside that window.

More importantly, why exactly are nominations of any kind happening 2-3 weeks before an election?

Posted by: Methos at October 27, 2012 04:41 PM (hO9ad)

7 I am sitting here trying to imagine the absolute orgasm of coverage this story would be getting of Bush were POTUS.

Posted by: Bill Mitchell at October 27, 2012 04:41 PM (hlUJY)

8 Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable failure.

Posted by: steevy at October 27, 2012 04:42 PM (6o4Fb)

9 We used to have an admiral who like port calls in Hong Kong. He would steam at a flank bell to get us there early.


Nobody ever said a word to him about it then.

Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 04:43 PM (YdQQY)

10 "He assumed his current assignment with the Africa Command on March 8, 2011."

...according to wikipedia. No info given about where he's headed from here.

Posted by: Methos at October 27, 2012 04:43 PM (hO9ad)

11 Well, someone is responsible. Fox says they asked for help 3 times and didn't get it... Who is telling the truth?

Posted by: Hello, it's me Donna not greg/gerg at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM (9+ccr)

12 How do I know this isn't connected to Benghazi? Lots of reasons.

I am guessing you suspect it is not related to benghazi, however, stating you "know" it is not is probably a bit of an overstatement. I am of the opinion that every bit of uncertainty related to benghazi and obama's handling of it is to our advantage so would not rush to help them.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM (Z9EHQ)

13 So it is home ported out of Bremerton, WA. Sorry guys, that place is teh suck.

Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM (YdQQY)

14 Give me Ham on five and hold the Mayo.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM (+XD7n)

15 Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 04:43 PM (YdQQY)

Was that the same one who disallowed playing Doors music?
Because that one liked Hong Kong a lot, too.

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM (Qxe/p)

16 I am of the opinion that every bit of uncertainty related to benghazi
and obama's handling of it is to our advantage so would not rush to
help them.


Because the MSM certainly wouldn't use any overstatement on Romney's part to discredit him, now would it.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 04:45 PM (6TB1Z)

17 Was that the same one who disallowed playing Doors music?


I don't remember him not liking the Doors.

Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 04:46 PM (YdQQY)

18
well, I guess the important thing is we stay accurate and dot all our i's and cross our t's.

Who gives a shit.

Americans are dead and Obama is covering up what happened.

Posted by: soothsayer at October 27, 2012 04:47 PM (jUytm)

19 Well done, Ace. The other side revels in lies, obfuscations and straight out character assassination.

It feels good not to be part of such a slimy team.

On to Nov. 6th!

Posted by: GuyfromNH at October 27, 2012 04:48 PM (kbOju)

20 I quite liked Hong Kong, yes. Stimulating location. As for Jimmy's "music"...just dreadful. My sailors didn't need to hear that.

Posted by: Adm George Morrison at October 27, 2012 04:48 PM (lkUU9)

21 Give me Ham on five and hold the Mayo.
Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM
------------------
You just won the internets.

Posted by: Lurking Flaneur at October 27, 2012 04:48 PM (hPlLv)

22 Is this the same guy who was relieved for spending tens of thousands of dollars on inappropriate travel arrangements?

Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 04:49 PM (YdQQY)

23 make everything questionable, force him and his mininons out of their hidey holes and out into the bright lights where they have to answer questions.

every question is another chance to effff up on tape and effff their story up.

give them more rope

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 04:49 PM (Z9EHQ)

24 I don't remember him not liking the Doors.

Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 04:46 PM (YdQQY)


Well, that rules out Admiral Morrison.
I was on the other carrier mentioned in this (Wiki) bio: http://tinyurl.com/8xtywth

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 04:50 PM (Qxe/p)

25 Posted by: soothsayer at October 27, 2012 04:47 PM (jUytm)


Unfortunately, because the media is completely ignoring this we have to dot eh i's and cross the t's. We have to have proof, and damning proof at that. Hoping Griffin can come through...

Posted by: Hello, it's me Donna not greg/gerg at October 27, 2012 04:50 PM (9+ccr)

26 @22

No. That was his predecessor.

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 04:51 PM (lkUU9)

27 Damn. Another conspiracy theory shot to sh!t.

Posted by: joethefatman™ (@joethefatman1) at October 27, 2012 04:51 PM (MnSla)

28 He'd be the worst scape goat in all of history for several reasons.

*ahem*

*quick wave of the hand*

hellooooo...?

Posted by: ADM Husband E. Kimmel at October 27, 2012 04:51 PM (w95i1)

29
Drew M.,

Good post. Keep us out of the Kos Kids Tinfoil Territory.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 04:52 PM (zLp5I)

30 Unfortunately, because the media is completely ignoring this we have to dot eh i's and cross the t's. We have to have proof, and damning proof at that. Hoping Griffin can come through...
Posted by: Hello, it's me Donna not greg/gerg at October 27, 2012 04:50 PM (9+ccr)

how so? if everyone who cares about the military and obamas behavior in benghazi runs out and starts waving their hands saying "no story here, perfectly normal, nothing to see, move along, keep moving" it is exactly what the mfm will do. mfm

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 04:53 PM (Z9EHQ)

31 PC is killing us. Officers will not stay after they are forced to do PC shit instead of look after their guys. I have hundreds of friends that quit, because the DOD is so full of shit.

That is all, carry on.

Posted by: Billy Bob, pseudo intellectual at October 27, 2012 04:53 PM (wR+pz)

32
There were two drones deployed to Benghazi.

According to Jennifer Griffin's report...anyone with clearance, had access to watching the video feed from those drones.
The drones worked in tandem.
They provided a live feed for over 6 hours of the fire fight.

Would an Admiral have access to that live feed?

Someone let this information out...to FoxNews.
Someone who knew about the 6 hours of drone coverage.

Posted by: wheatie at October 27, 2012 04:54 PM (ipkPX)

33 Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM (Z9EHQ)

Explain to me how a carrier strike group in either the western Pacific or Indian Ocean has anything to do with what happened in Benghazi, Libya on September 11th.

I'll wait.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 04:54 PM (AR+tO)

34 Ike: "Rescue them!"

JFK: "Rescue them, but keep it quiet"

LBJ: "Rescue them with 100,000 Marines landing in Morocco."

Nixon: "Rescue them."

Ford: "Rescue them!"

Carter: "Rescue them next year."

Reagan: "Rescue them!"

GHWB: "Rescue them!"

Clinton: "Poll, please."

W: "Rescue them!"

Ebola: "Fuck them."

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 04:54 PM (+XD7n)

35 i am not saying it is necessary to push the story but where is the advantage in publishing a story dismissing the possibilities?

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 04:55 PM (Z9EHQ)

36
(sorry, no links for nutty conspiracy theories)

So....sidebar then?

Posted by: Leon at October 27, 2012 04:55 PM (PHb2k)

37
It seems obvious that the MSM will not have anything to do with this story... Hopefully, one of the Super PAC's will get a commercial on TV this week and put the Benghazi issue front and center during the last week of the campaign. Better yet, maybe someone can get an interview from General Ham.

We all need to do what we can to keep this story alive through election day. Call those network news offices, post on blogs, tweet relentlessly and most importantly, talk to family and friends...

Posted by: Tony253 at October 27, 2012 04:57 PM (3yMFT)

38 Obviously DrewM is part of the conspiracy.

Heck, he might be leading it.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 04:57 PM (+XD7n)

39 Explain to me how a carrier strike group in either the western Pacific or Indian Ocean has anything to do with what happened in Benghazi, Libya on September 11th.

I'll wait.
Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 04:54 PM (AR+tO)

so, you do not think it is possible he encountered any traffic or had any interaction with personnel that had invlovement with and or in anything related to benghazi?

there he is is on that big old ship, bouncing around in the ocean waiting for his next semaphore signal or carrier pigeon completely removed from interaction with anyone anywhere?

I am not even saying it happened, I am saying let obama and the mfm sort it out in the press.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 04:58 PM (Z9EHQ)

40 Does this tin foil hat make my head look fat??

Posted by: Missy from Mississippi at October 27, 2012 04:59 PM (Dll6b)

41 i am not saying it is necessary to push the story but where is the advantage in publishing a story dismissing the possibilities?

Who's talking about dismissing the possibilities? We just need to be very careful here that we don't do something that inadvertently helps defeat Romney. We have less than 2 weeks to go.

Nothing happens if Romney is defeated. Everything is possible if he wins.


Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 04:59 PM (6TB1Z)

42 Could have been on station in the Persian Gulf on 9-11, Drew. Then, on Oct 17, steamed through Suez Canal into the Med. Absent more info, I'd even say it's likely. Still a stretch to say assets in the Gulf would be called to assist in Libya, of course.

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:00 PM (lkUU9)

43 Obviously DrewM is part of the conspiracy.



Heck, he might be leading it.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 04:57 PM (+XD7n)

Where was he on 9/11/2012? Huh? Huh?

Posted by: Methos at October 27, 2012 05:00 PM (hO9ad)

44 The Benghazi story can take care of itself, and Mitt jumping in now would be very risky.

The MFM is praying for Mitt to say something.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 05:01 PM (+XD7n)

45 uhhhhhhhhhhh

Posted by: phoenixgirl, team dagny, GET THE UN OUT OF THE US at October 27, 2012 05:02 PM (Ho2rs)

46 Who's talking about dismissing the possibilities? We just need to be very careful here that we don't do something that inadvertently helps defeat Romney. We have less than 2 weeks to go.

Nothing happens if Romney is defeated. Everything is possible if he wins.


Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 04:59 PM (6TB1Z)

I am not and have not advocated pushing the story that he had anything to do with benghazi or that there is any conspiracy here. Indeed I would say do not push the stroy.

There is a diference between pushing the story doing nothing and publishing that "I know this isn't connected to Benghazi". I am willing to guess that that is "probably" right, however, no advantages accrues to our side for stating as much.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 05:02 PM (Z9EHQ)

47 I take that back. Misread. According to the story, the Stennis group has never been in the Med. Drew's right.

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:02 PM (lkUU9)

48 You'll forgive us, Drew, if this regime and this story inspire some conspiracy theorizin'...

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 05:03 PM (I2LwF)

49 The pure fact that there is rumors and speculation across the intertubes is not the fault of the peoples , it's Obama and his administration...They have spun this web from day one...

People are pissed and we want answers - NOW !

Posted by: AmericanDawg at October 27, 2012 05:03 PM (XIsD/)

50 The MFM is praying for Mitt to say something.

Ya think?

*** slaps self on back of head ... ***

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:03 PM (Qxe/p)

51 Regardless of the admiral Maria Molina has some nice tits.

Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 05:04 PM (YdQQY)

52 Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM (+XD7n)

How Bout some Coffee Johnny???

Posted by: Evilpens at October 27, 2012 05:04 PM (ck76k)

53 *** slaps self on back of head ... ***
Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:03 PM (Qxe/p)

```

Careful! Don't want to knock anything loose!

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 05:04 PM (3ziXJ)

54 What about the replacement of Gen. Ham? Is that also false?

Posted by: TD, one of the proud 53% at October 27, 2012 05:05 PM (DQMcq)

55 Posted by: Evilpens at October 27, 2012 05:04 PM (ck76k)

No thanks!

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 05:06 PM (3ziXJ)

56 Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:00 PM (lkUU9)

No it couldn't have.

The story itself says it didn't get their until mid-October. The first two weeks of October they were in Thailand and Malyasia.

Are you saying they departed Bremerton on August 28th, went to Libya (via the Pacific-Indian Ocean, Red Sea, Suez Canal) for no reason and then went halfway back across the world to Asia and then back again to the Gulf?

That's your story?

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 05:06 PM (AR+tO)

57 "Obama,would be committing political suicide if he fired Carter Ham. Ham is one of the highest ranking gays in the military. Obama’s base would rise up and oft him themselves. Ham will be reassigned quickly to a parallel or better position somewhere the press has limited access i.e. Norad or the Pentagon."

http://tinyurl.com/8zshgvn

Been reading around and this comment stuck in my mind for some reason.

Posted by: What do you do all day if you don't watch tv, anne? at October 27, 2012 05:06 PM (oZfic)

58 @51

True, but I still maintain that her head is too big for her body. There's real danger of her tipping over, Guam style.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:06 PM (6TB1Z)

59 You know, I'd like to believe that General Ham behaved in a principled way, but my experience a USAF junior officer thirty years ago was that senior officers (mainly O-6s, where I was) could easily sacrifice subordinates if their boss told them to: in fact, would look puzzled at the suggestion that there was an alternative.


But maybe it's different now, or in the Army.

Posted by: PersonFromPorlock at October 27, 2012 05:06 PM (2VCZA)

60 These guys could be re-assigned because they are making statements regarding a certain stuttering clusterfuck of a commander in chief...Hate to ad to the rumor mill but that's what we're here for right? In addition to the Commander of AFRICOM, all the subordinate commanders are on the circuits. They all get the TOPSECRET satellite downlinks with the same intell. Meaning, they saw and heard the debacle in Benghazi in real time...There could be minor mutiny in the flag ranks going on right now...

Posted by: You heard it here first at October 27, 2012 05:07 PM (cBYCG)

61 "There are also some rumblings about the General Ham's replacement as Commander of Africa Command being announced this week. If you look at the history of combatant command tours they are usually about 2-2.5 years and this announcement is well within that window. Ham's replacement was simply named, he still must be confirmed by the Senate and then there's usually a few months until the actual change of command."

This doesn't really prove anything either way.




Oh well, at least you got to shit on mentally-ill people, and that's always a good deed.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:07 PM (SAA1o)

62 Or, if you prefer, gangnam style.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:07 PM (6TB1Z)

63 54 What about the replacement of Gen. Ham? Is that also false?

Posted by: TD, one of the proud 53% at October 27, 2012 05:05 PM (DQMcq)


No. That one is true.
Unless the Defense Department is lying: http://tinyurl.com/9xyw2gh

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:08 PM (Qxe/p)

64 56 see 47

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 05:08 PM (3ziXJ)

65 I took it back a few posts down, Drew. No hard feelings.

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:09 PM (lkUU9)

66 Bart who lurks...put a link in the cheerleading thread, it's # 285 re: General Ham giving a speech the other day to cadets. Everybody split to another thread.

Posted by: concrete girl at October 27, 2012 05:09 PM (y2Ojs)

67 I took it back a few posts down, Drew. No hard feelings.

Posted by: occam


RINO.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:10 PM (6TB1Z)

68 OK, Panetta said he made the decision (with Ham) not to deploy. Fox reported that Glen Doherty and his team came in from Tripoli after the fighting began in Benghazi. Who sent them and who were they? And, what does this story mean?
http://tinyurl.com/8q6xw4y

Posted by: Liberty Lover at October 27, 2012 05:10 PM (aTqVQ)

69 Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:09 PM (lkUU9)

It made me laugh to think what a track of that voyage would have looked liked.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 05:12 PM (AR+tO)

70 DrewM. is better then us. That's all this post is about.

Posted by: lowandslow at October 27, 2012 05:12 PM (GZitp)

71 OT

http://tinyurl.com/9pgf8cw

WH considering new Tax cut

Posted by: Evilpens at October 27, 2012 05:12 PM (ck76k)

72 OK, Panetta said he made the decision (with Ham) not to deploy.

Sorry, but no sale. When a US embassy is under attack and the ambassador is missing, one person should be making the calls, and he didn't.

I suspect that Panetta, good loyal Dem that he is, is covering for his boss because he figures if he doesn't, he's out of a job, and if he does, who knows?

Or, he could just be an idiot. Either way, Obama should have made the call.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:13 PM (6TB1Z)

73 DrewM. is better then us. That's all this post is about.

Better than you, sure.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:13 PM (6TB1Z)

74 I'm going to have to call BS on this being well within the window of a tour.

From Ham's Wiki Bio:
"Commanding General, U.S. Army, Europe and Seventh Army 2008–2011"
"Commander, United States Africa Command 2011–present"


Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:13 PM (Qxe/p)

75 @67

DINO is closer. But what the hell.

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:14 PM (lkUU9)

76 Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 05:06 PM (3ziXJ)

HAHA!!

Posted by: Evilpens at October 27, 2012 05:14 PM (ck76k)

77 I do not believe in coincidences.

AP Poll finds over 50% of Americans are racist.........or hold racist views...........even when NOT specifically asked about race.

ABC Nightline airing documentaries on today's Ku klux Klan. One Klan leader barfs that if Obama is re-elected there will be a race war.

------------------------------------

Hey white folks, you're just gonna have to prove ONE MORE TIME that you are not racist by voting for Obama.

Posted by: White People: More Guilty Now than 4 Years Ago at October 27, 2012 05:14 PM (AzwZn)

78 70

But of course. After all, isn't picking on mentally-ill people the mark of The Superman?

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:14 PM (SAA1o)

79 Okay. So.

Who gave the order to not allow a rescue?

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 05:14 PM (I2LwF)

80 DINO is closer. But what the hell.


You're no closer. Put the coffee down.

Posted by: Fred Flintstone at October 27, 2012 05:15 PM (z9HTb)

81 >>>Hey white folks, you're just gonna have to prove ONE MORE TIME that you are not racist by voting for Obama.



I'll vote for him next year.

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 05:16 PM (I2LwF)

82 73

Meow.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:16 PM (SAA1o)

83 At this point, given what happened and the number of totally implausible explanations by this administration, I question everything I see taking place on the geo-political and military stage. It doesn't mean I wear a tin foil hat or believe things at first glance. It means I don't trust these sons of bitches.

Posted by: Honey Badger at October 27, 2012 05:16 PM (ZFXqT)

84 79 Okay. So.

Who gave the order to not allow a rescue?

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 05:14 PM (I2LwF)


IF Ham was relieved for "poor decisions" or "insubordination" or the like, my guess would be his immediate boss: Leon Panetta.

Which means Obama has "plausible deniability".
Even though he was probably in the room.

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:17 PM (Qxe/p)

85 Asshole Meth Addict Breaks Into 90 Year Old Man's Home, Shoots 90 Year Old Man In The Face, Sues 90 Year Old Man After Arrest

http://bitly.com/S7gkMH

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 05:17 PM (3ziXJ)

86 One person made the call. It's a big call and an unusual call and one person made it and held to it despite updates of the situation. For a US embassy under attack, the call should have been made by the president.

So if he made the call, that's very bad. But if he went to bed, zoomed off to a fundraiser and left the call to someone else...that's bad also.

That's not even going near how outrageous the call to stand down was.

Posted by: S. Weasel at October 27, 2012 05:18 PM (YOBrO)

87 Obviously DrewM is part of the conspiracy. Heck, he might be leading it.

DrewM might be a Sekrit Sikh.
I knowthat I've never seen him without a turban.

Posted by: garrett at October 27, 2012 05:18 PM (6BaWJ)

88 Some lefty sucker-of-TFG-cock (BIRM) was just arguing with me on twitter. First premise: Repubs are hypocrites for calling out TFG on Benghazi but not GWB on 9/11. I pointed out that GWB didn't order FDNY to stand down and not rescue anyone.
Second premise: talking about Benghazi and the CIA being endangers CIA operations. I pointed out that it's common knowledge that anywhere there is an Embassy, there's CIA.
Third premise: TFG doesn't have control or knowledge of day-to-day ops. I pointed out live Pred feed to WH situation room.

He finally gave up.

Posted by: Country Singer at October 27, 2012 05:18 PM (meVGV)

89 John Bolton says we need to hear from Gen. Ham.

Posted by: TD, one of the proud 53% at October 27, 2012 05:18 PM (+uFux)

90
AP Poll finds over 50% of Americans are racist.........or hold racist
views...........even when NOT specifically asked about race.


I don't know why AP would say such a thing about Blacks, Hispanics and American Indians. I don't believe it for one second.

Posted by: Leon at October 27, 2012 05:19 PM (PHb2k)

91 Twitchy picked your tweets up. Good job, Drew.

Posted by: Liberty Lover at October 27, 2012 05:19 PM (aTqVQ)

92 Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:13 PM (Qxe/p)

He hasn't be relieved, his relief has been named. That's simply the first step in a long process. The nomination of Rodriquez has to go to the Senate then there's a several months long transition period.

Look at the dates on Ham's record. He was confirmed in in November and didn't take over until April of the following year. Ham will be there until about that time.

Look at any other combatant command tour (don't confuse nomination/confirmation dates with change of command date) and they are in the same window.

Or don't.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 05:19 PM (AR+tO)

93 @80

I'm not going home. I'm going to Wisconsin.

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:20 PM (lkUU9)

94 79 and who decided to do nothing ... the inaction was on purpose. This wasnt a god damn mistake, it was strategic decision not to act. Whatever the fuck happened, 4 men are dead. I question everything this admin does. Everything.

Posted by: Honey Badger at October 27, 2012 05:20 PM (ZFXqT)

95 Has anyone been able to harmonize the CIA statement, the WH statement, Panetta's statement?

CIA:
“We can say with confidence that the Agency reacted quickly to aid our colleagues during that terrible evening in Benghazi. Moreover, no one at any level in the CIA told anybody not to help those in need; claims to the contrary are simply inaccurate. In fact, it is important to remember how many lives were saved by courageous Americans who put their own safety at risk that night—and that some of those selfless Americans gave their lives in the effort to rescue their comrades.”

WH:"Neither the president nor anyone in the White House denied any requests for assistance in Benghazi," National Security Council spokesman Tommy Vietor told Yahoo News by email.

Panetta: "We didn't have good eyes on the situation. There were security forces there on the ground, but they're in the middle of a firefight - not sending a Sitrep (Situational Report)."

I suspect all have been carefully crafted to be literally accurate, however misleading and self-serving. I think the White House will argue the "request for assistance" went to CIA, not White House. White House will claim it gave DOD go ahead if DOD determined it had adequate intel to successfully complete a rescue mission (i.e., code for sit on your hands, I can't afford a bad outcome, tonight we're packing for VEGAS, baby!)

Posted by: USA at October 27, 2012 05:20 PM (RIg+t)

96 The lawyering-up on November 7th will be epic in scale.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 05:20 PM (+XD7n)

97
Yeah, I think its very possible that they don't even bother Prezzy Osissywad with this type of stuff, because they know he can't make a decision anyway.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at October 27, 2012 05:21 PM (PHb2k)

98 Also, hot women's attraction to beta blogger types?

Myth.

you welcome.


#drewm#sadist@wetblanket


Posted by: T. Hunter at October 27, 2012 05:22 PM (EZl54)

99 It's good to know Drew M. has the SCOAMF's back.

Posted by: Ian S. at October 27, 2012 05:22 PM (rPA5/)

100 I'm no good at conspiracy theories, so I'll do this instead:

President Obama visits the doctor, and says, "Doc....this is embarrassing, but every time I look in the mirror I get sexually aroused". The doctor gives a noncommittal grunt, and replies, "I'm not surprised, Mr. President, you're a pussy".

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at October 27, 2012 05:22 PM (L7hol)

101 Look at the dates on Ham's record. He was confirmed in in November and didn't take over until April of the following year. Ham will be there until about that time.

Look at any other combatant command tour (don't confuse nomination/confirmation dates with change of command date) and they are in the same window.

Or don't.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 05:19 PM (AR+tO)


I am assuming that means you think April 2011 to "present" falls within a "normal tour" window.

We will just have to disagree on that point.

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:23 PM (Qxe/p)

102 Looks like the Indonesian jihadists are pissed off at the youtube move too.

>>JAKARTA, Indonesia (AP) — Indonesia's anti-terror squad arrested 11 people suspected of planning a range of attacks on domestic and foreign targets including the U.S. Embassy and a site near the Australian Embassy, police said Saturday.

http://tinyurl.com/9seorkj

Posted by: JackStraw at October 27, 2012 05:23 PM (TMB3S)

103 A big chunk of the sixth fleet was off the west coast of Africa down off Congo on Sept 11. Whereas the Fifth fleet was in the Arabian Gulf and in port in Bahrain. At that point air assets and Marines from the 5th may have been closer then the 6th.

Drew is more then likely correct, but the lack of transparency by the Administration is what fuels these rumors and speculation.

Posted by: Quilly Mammoth at October 27, 2012 05:23 PM (8YINY)

104 "I'm not surprised, Mr. President, you're a pussy dick"


FIFY

Posted by: Country Singer at October 27, 2012 05:24 PM (meVGV)

105 I haven't read all the comments yet ,on purpose. For the first time in my adult life I don't trust our CIC, gov'mt and am waivering on the Military. It's truly a sad day. Let me clarify, military spox.

Now I will go back and read.

Posted by: Infidel at October 27, 2012 05:24 PM (prnik)

106
We do not need the tin foil cap conspiracy theories to explain what happened at Benghazi. Simple incompetence and timidity / cowardice suffices.

Obama and the idiots at State wanted to play nice with the Libyans, and did not want a big, scary security force in Libya.

Terrorists being terrorists wanted to attack the US interests, and saw a weakly secured target. And Benghazi was full of islamic terrorist types (militias).

The idiots (in DC somewhere)that told the CIA to stand down thought that 5 or 6 or however many retired Seals could not affect the Consulate fight. They were forgetting that these were Seals and they were fighting Arab terrorists in a motley militia.

The idiots (again in DC or Africom) did not want to commit US forces to the fight "when things were unclear." It appears that they'd rather let them get overrun, and then with things "clarified," in the morning, they would somehow magically know what to do.
a. They were afraid the Libyan "government" might take offense. Rather than explaining to them that we get offended when our consulates are attacked.
b. We might rock the boat in Libya, and stir up all the islamic terrorist militias. They might start lashing out if we defended our people.
c. DC players were afraid it would turn into a Blackhawk Down scenario with every islamic jihadist scum in a town full of jihadist scum attacking the rescuers. -- After all, the entire Libyan Debacle in 2011 started after Khadaffi said he was going to sort out the islamic jihadi scum in Benghazi. Then the French convinced us to help out the jihadi scum so they could re-write their Libyan oil contracts. (Blood for Oil!!!)
d. It would be over before we get our people there.
e. The pilots might bomb something or hit something that the Libyans claimed was a bus full of nuns and children. see b. and c. above.
f. This would interfere with Obama's re-election campaign.

Nope, just let it blow over. Hope for the best. There was a huge security force of 6-10 people coming from Tripoli. Any hour now, there is plenty of time. They can stabilize the situation. After they find a plane to rent in Tripoli... After the militia clowns in Benghazi figure out who is in charge at the airport and is allowed to escort them to the safe house. Who cares if the Arab blow hards take an hour to decide?
By then it should be dawn too. Things always look better in the morning?

And then the bad guys get in one more shot, and kill Doherty and Woods with mortars after the Tripoli "rescue mission" arrives.


Incompetence and cowardice explains the entire disaster.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 05:24 PM (zLp5I)

107 100

I question the veracity of that joke.


Obama is, in fact, an asshole.


And aroused by such.




Well, I guess it was mostly true.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:25 PM (SAA1o)

108 "Al-Qaeda Leader Calls for Muslims to Kidnap Westerners in Exchange for Imprisoned Jihadists"- http://bit.ly/S2LgKy

Posted by: Miss80sBaby at October 27, 2012 05:27 PM (YjDyJ)

109 Didn't a couple of ships just run into each other about a month or so ago. That would get someone tossed out on there butt.

Posted by: Oldsailors Poet, Wonders what Dagny thinks at October 27, 2012 05:27 PM (kc2b9)

110 "We do not need the tin foil cap conspiracy theories to explain what happened at Benghazi."

You and DrewM, the masters of slaying strawmen.

Posted by: lowandslow at October 27, 2012 05:28 PM (GZitp)

111 Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:23 PM (Qxe/p)

No I think April 2013 falls in the normal window.

Rodriquez has not taken command of AfriCom yet. He won't for months.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 05:28 PM (AR+tO)

112 Its a good thing the media is the cool head in the room. Waiting until the internal investigation is complete before transcribing the results of said investigation.

Posted by: Up with people at October 27, 2012 05:29 PM (kzFo5)

113 If Benghazi is as they claim a case where US forces simply could not rescue Americans in danger, then this Country is totally fucked.

The truth is we had the ability to save them, but not the leadership.

Fucking lying worms.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 05:30 PM (+XD7n)

114 Hey Vic- Ham is not that guy. Someone on another Ace thread stated who the investigated for spending too much guy was, and I think his last name started with an "M". Marks? Not sure, but Hamm is not the guy you were thinking about.

Posted by: freeus at October 27, 2012 05:30 PM (caDgg)

115 White House will claim it gave DOD go ahead if DOD determined it had
adequate intel to successfully complete a rescue mission (i.e., code for
sit on your hands, I can't afford a bad outcome


Yes, I think you've got it. Deliberate ambiguity and plausible deniability. Well, plausible to those who are deliberately obtuse, anyway.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:30 PM (6TB1Z)

116 106

Look, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with most of what you wrote (even though I mostly just skimmed through it) but one quick point:

"We do not need the tin foil cap conspiracy theories to explain what happened at Benghazi. Simple incompetence and timidity / cowardice suffices. "

The question isn't whether some explanation or another "suffices." The question is whether it is actually true.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:31 PM (SAA1o)

117 It is highly unusual for Barky Obama to tell the truth.

Posted by: Killerdog at October 27, 2012 05:32 PM (Oi60j)

118 Short answer is always correct:

Obama is a liar, all else falls from that

Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 05:32 PM (YdQQY)

119 LOL

Posted by: Vic at October 27, 2012 05:33 PM (YdQQY)

120 http://tinyurl.com/9ndkhz9

General William "Kip" Ward is the guy who was being investigated.

Posted by: freeus at October 27, 2012 05:34 PM (caDgg)

121
How clever to put up one item (Gaouette) which is likely accurate, and then coyly slip in another (Ham) as if it is equally accurate.
2.5-3 years /= 1.5 years.
Is damage control your profession? I hope it is not math.

Posted by: Armchair1 at October 27, 2012 05:35 PM (FXJ3W)

122 Who knows why the admiral is being replaced.

I wonder if this tweet from the official US Marines twitter account has something to do with this or is completely unrelated:

U.S. Marines @USMC

"Today we did what we had to do. They counted on America to be passive. They counted wrong." — Ronald Reagan, Libya (1986)


At the very least this should give everyone pause before dismissing the speculation going on as "tin foil hat" type stuff.

Posted by: 2012independent at October 27, 2012 05:35 PM (JvBHg)

123 Asking questions about events is not tin foil territory. Refusing to believe facts that you discover that disprove "the theory" is. Asking questions is not.

Posted by: Honey Badger at October 27, 2012 05:35 PM (85x54)

124
Here is a weird part that still bugs me...so we had CIA there.... and then after the event we were all waiting for the CIA or somebody to show up for 2 weeks while reports were rummaging thru the consulate picking up sensitive info. So that's weird.

And then lets say they didn't react to the 9/11 attack (which they didn't) because they thought the fight was over earlier, well then, why wouldn't you still be going to secure the site in the immediate aftermath (supposedly the danger is past at that point). That's even weirder.

Something smells here concerning the reaction. 2 weeks later?


Posted by: Guy Mohawk at October 27, 2012 05:36 PM (PHb2k)

125 Brett Baier is investigating the Navy change of command in mid east - his tweet :
Interesting sudden move at sea for the navy - we're investigating this:

Posted by: AmericanDawg at October 27, 2012 05:36 PM (XIsD/)

126
106
"We do not need the tin foil cap conspiracy theories to explain what happened at Benghazi. Simple incompetence and timidity / cowardice suffices."

And carries none of the penalties of malfeasance.
How perfectly convenient.

Posted by: Armchair1 at October 27, 2012 05:37 PM (FXJ3W)

127 So now what the fuck do I do?

Posted by: Emily Litella at October 27, 2012 05:37 PM (z9HTb)

128 Sorry, but no sale. When a US embassy is under attack and the ambassador is missing, one person should be making the calls, and he didn't.


------------------------------------------------------------


Despite Drew trying to calm us down on Ham and the admiral, the rest of the story still stands. I'm still sticking with my theory that the SCOAMT observed, shrugged his shoulders, looked at his watch, and then walked out of the room.

Posted by: Soona at October 27, 2012 05:37 PM (01q+u)

129 Second video in a row now that I've noticed that the Secret Service guys are hanging way back when Barky comes prancing onto the stage the way he does. Mitts guys envelope him. Barky's - a 30 foot buffer. Or I could be imagining the whole thing.

Posted by: Up with people at October 27, 2012 05:37 PM (kzFo5)

130 Donna, and the help asked for through the months leading up to 9-11

Posted by: willow at October 27, 2012 05:39 PM (hX8cq)

131 Posted by: Armchair1 at October 27, 2012 05:35 PM (FXJ3W)

I hope timekeeping isn't your profession since you don't understand when the clock starts and stops on combatant command tour.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 05:40 PM (AR+tO)

132 Second video in a row now that I've noticed that the Secret Service guys are hanging way back when Barky comes prancing onto the stage the way he does. Mitts guys envelope him. Barky's - a 30 foot buffer. Or I could be imagining the whole thing.
Posted by: Up with people at October 27, 2012 05:37 PM (kzFo5)

it is obama's gutsy call, he is going to pull a cleavon little - from blazzing saddles - and rescue himsef. he does not want ss in there screwing things up.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 05:40 PM (Z9EHQ)

133 Carrier Strike Group Three was in the Seventh Fleet's AOR on September 11, 2012, and took part in a exercise off Guam.

However, Admiral Gaouette would have received all the same info about the attacks as the rest of the navy. He could easily have demanded that his strike group be sent to the Middle East as soon as possible and been told to shut up. If he pushed back, he could've been relieved of command.

It's not "tinfoil hat" speculation at all. And nobody's claiming he's being made a scapegoat; those of us who think it's connected to Benghazi think he could've been cashiered because he loudly and forcefully criticized the decisions being made, thus falling into the category of "questionable judgment" in that he dissed the C-in-C.

As for General Carter Ham, he could easily have been TEMPORARILY relieved of command and then reinstated so that he wouldn't resign and spill the beans.

None of this is "crazy speculation."

Posted by: Llarry at October 27, 2012 05:40 PM (5l2tw)

134 Romney dodges bullet: NYT endorses Obama

Posted by: USA at October 27, 2012 05:41 PM (RIg+t)

135 No I think April 2013 falls in the normal window.

Rodriquez has not taken command of AfriCom yet. He won't for months.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 05:28 PM (AR+tO)


As I said, we'll have to agree to disagree on it.
I think 17 months from taking the position to the announcement that he is being replaced is a very short span of time.

You don't. Got it.

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:42 PM (Qxe/p)

136 Romney's gonna make you pray the gay away!

Posted by: Listen to the Children at October 27, 2012 05:42 PM (8HhF2)

137
Second video in a row now that I've noticed that the Secret Service guys are hanging way back when Barky comes prancing onto the stage the way he does. Mitts guys envelope him. Barky's - a 30 foot buffer. Or I could be imagining the whole thing.Posted by: Up with people at October 27, 2012 05:37 PM (kzFo5)


Obama probably has a much more secure perimeterwith lots more SS securitythan Romney/ Also, I can see the prima donna saying stand back.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 05:43 PM (zLp5I)

138 Brett Baier is investigating the Navy change of command in mid east - his tweet :
Interesting sudden move at sea for the navy - we're investigating this:
\

OH NO!! Now Bret Baier is a Tin foil hat WACKO right DrewM

Posted by: Evilpens at October 27, 2012 05:44 PM (ck76k)

139
Drew what is it about port calls in Thailand and Malaysia that would call the Admiral's judgement into question?
Unless he threw a Toga party for the crew at the Royal Thai Palace with two dozen individual acts of perversion so profound and disgusting that decorum prohibits listing them here.
Quel dealio?

Posted by: MikeD at October 27, 2012 05:44 PM (p8QOg)

140 @136

Okay, that's random. But at least it distracts us from yet another suicidal fight.

This just in, Michelle Bachmann still good looking.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:44 PM (6TB1Z)

141 Obama probably has a much more secure perimeterwith lots more SS securitythan Romney/ Also, I can see the prima donna saying stand back.
Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 05:43 PM (zLp5I)

I think I saw an nterview where he says he taught keanau reaves how to do the matrix thing where you stop the bullets in mid flight simply by waving your hand.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 05:45 PM (Z9EHQ)

142 President Romney needs to issue a very clear order on Day 1.

"If Americans are in danger, anywhere in the World, rescue them. I'll back you up."

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 05:46 PM (+XD7n)

143 136

I never really understood why "trying to pray the gay away" was such a terrible "sin" in Leftists' (atheist!) eyes.



Granted, it's not as moral as encouraging them to bugger each other, but what do I know...

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:47 PM (SAA1o)

144 Secret Service guys are hanging way back when Barky comes prancing onto the stage the way he does.

When I started middle school, I was assured by my more experienced friends that one did not go for big arm movements while dancing at the sock hop. It was better to keep one's elbows plastered to one's sides. Barky does this when he makes an entrance. You'd think he'd have gotten over middle school by now.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:47 PM (6TB1Z)

145 Obama Spokesman: "Obama Didn't Deny Permission To Send Rescue Force To Benghazi"

Well, that settles that - when you hear it from an Obama spokesmen, you cantake it to the bank. Now about Sununu's comment on Powell...

Posted by: sherlock at October 27, 2012 05:47 PM (TQbuA)

146 President Romney needs to issue a very clear order on Day 1.

"If Americans are in danger, anywhere in the World
-----
President me would be saying if any American has a hair on his head harmed, evacuate Mecca. Thats why they don't let me be president.

Posted by: Up with people at October 27, 2012 05:47 PM (kzFo5)

147 I think I saw an nterview where he says he taught keanau reaves how to do the matrix thing where you stop the bullets in mid flight simply by waving your hand.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 05:45 PM (Z9EHQ)


I saw that too!
It's seared -- seared -- in my memory!

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:48 PM (Qxe/p)

148 Compare this to the Argo episode re: the hostages in Iran. Affleck's character says "F U, I'm bringing them out". That was optimal.

Posted by: SFGoth at October 27, 2012 05:48 PM (g+h9h)

149 Why denigrate people for "nutty conspiracy theories" when we've been about a cover-up regarding Ben Ghazi for weeks now?

It's not outside the realm of reality to question the timing of the replacement of such prominent military positions.

To mock those who question only makes you look arrogant and foolish.

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 05:48 PM (oHt/L)

150 Navy has been relieving CO's at the rapid rate the last couple of years. Usually sexual, or near sexual, hijinks. Zero tolerance these days for stuff that would have been acceptable, if not encouraged, behavior a generation ago.

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:48 PM (lkUU9)

151 Now Bret Baier is a Tin foil hat WACKO right DrewM

No, it's an appropriate stance for a journalist. It isn't for a presidential candidate 10 days from winning.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:48 PM (6TB1Z)

152 Drew what is it about port calls in Thailand and Malaysia that would call the Admiral's judgement into question?
Unless he threw a Toga party for the crew at the Royal Thai Palace with two dozen individual acts of perversion so profound and disgusting that decorum prohibits listing them here.
Quel dealio?
Posted by: MikeD at October 27, 2012 05:44 PM (p8QOg)


Who the fuck knows? All I know is that I spent the whole freaken day in Alcohol and Drug course and how as a Senior Officer/Leader in the US Navy what I should do so I do not end up on the front page of the Navy Times as having been relieved of Command?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:48 PM (oSFWF)

153 So, as usual, President Present will be able to say "not me" someone else made the mistake.

Awesome.

And it will take him until Nov. 7 or so to come up with a story.

Basically, Obama is a constitutional monarch - he just flies around and does ceremonial shit.

Posted by: Sexypig at October 27, 2012 05:49 PM (vTSVM)

154 Second video in a row now that I've noticed that the Secret Service guys are hanging way back when Barky comes prancing onto the stage the way he does. Mitts guys envelope him. Barky's - a 30 foot buffer. Or I could be imagining the whole thing.

I noticed this at teh Ryan rally the other night. SS everywhere. When he came on stage there were 2 in front, 3 on the side a huge I mean huge guy within 15 feet of Ryan. And this is a red county. Only 3K people at the most in the small venue. Lots of kids.

Posted by: Infidel at October 27, 2012 05:49 PM (prnik)

155
Let me guess: Gen. Ham decided he couldn't work with the
bastards who put the kibosh on a Benghazi rescue mission. Via @TypicalCon. [rdbrewer]

Posted by: Gerry at October 27, 2012 05:49 PM (rAOS4)

156 Yeah, a clusterfuck somewhere in the chain of command results in the deaths of 4 Americans, a high ranking officer in that chain is getting replaced 6 weeks later, after only 18 months, and we're all crazy pants for thinking the two might be connected.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at October 27, 2012 05:49 PM (GEICT)

157 Affleck's character says "F U, I'm bringing them out". That was optimal.
Posted by: SFGoth at October 27, 2012 05:48 PM (g+h9h)

obama - "F U, I'm leaving them there". is he issuing wapons with the obama logo like the japanese did with the chrysanthemum on the ariaska?

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 05:50 PM (Z9EHQ)

158 Nobody denied permission to rescue them and yet somehow the rescue never happened.

Were they using this site's software to send messages?

Sorry, low blow.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 05:50 PM (+XD7n)

159 Drew, is it your assertion that rdbrewer's comment about the replacement of General Ham on the sidebar is "crazy speculation"?

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 05:50 PM (oHt/L)

160 To mock those who question only makes you look arrogant and foolish.


Posted by: Sgt. York


So, you're just asking questions, is that it?

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:50 PM (6TB1Z)

161
"We do not need the tin foil cap conspiracy theories to explain what happened at Benghazi. Simple incompetence and timidity / cowardice suffices."

And carries none of the penalties of malfeasance.
How perfectly convenient.

Posted by: Armchair1 at October 27, 2012 05:37 PM (FXJ3W)


Malfeasance? No, their idiocy is more like involuntary manslaughter.

We knew we should have prevented the deaths by beefing up security, but we did not because of politics. No, not money, political considerations.

We could have sent fighters and Spectre gunships. They would have provided heavy weapons support to a compound hit by RPGS and mortars. But someone did not. And after 6 hours, the mortars got lucky and killed and wounded several retired seals at the CIA safehouse. We did not because of politics. No, not lack of resources, political considerations.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 05:51 PM (zLp5I)

162 Despite Drew trying to calm us down on Ham and the admiral

I'm calm...I'm calm. Nothing to see, her. Big nothingburger. Not the hill to die on. My tinfoil hat is back in it's protective case. Let cooler heads prevail. Lord knows, I don't want to appear stoopid to the left and the MSM.

How did I do?

Posted by: Soap MacTavish at October 27, 2012 05:51 PM (vbh31)

163 156 Yeah, a clusterfuck somewhere in the chain of command results in the deaths of 4 Americans, a high ranking officer in that chain is getting replaced 6 weeks later, after only 18 months, and we're all crazy pants for thinking the two might be connected.

Posted by: BCochran1981 at October 27, 2012 05:49 PM (GEICT)


Why yes. Yes we are.
Personally, I think we should wait for the entire investigation to unfold.

It will turn out there actually WAS an impromptu demonstration!

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 05:52 PM (Qxe/p)

164 Very good assessment of events from John Hinderraker here:

http://tinyurl.com/8rtflav

Posted by: Liberty Lover at October 27, 2012 05:52 PM (aTqVQ)

165 151

Well, then I guess it's quite fortunate that none of us are actually presidential candidates...

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:52 PM (SAA1o)

166 I feel foolish today.

I passed this info on in an email laced with outrage.

Sigh.

It's BS.

I only sent it to one person, but it was my dad.

Posted by: Samwise Gamgee at October 27, 2012 05:53 PM (SKX2R)

167 153

The Queen of America.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:54 PM (SAA1o)

168 @162

Good. That's better.

Posted by: Republican Establishment at October 27, 2012 05:54 PM (EZl54)

169 142 President Romney needs to issue a very clear order on Day 1. "If Americans are in danger, anywhere in the World, rescue them. I'll back you up."
And perhaps adding:

"No captain can do very wrong if he places his ship alongside that of the enemy." - Horatio Nelson

Posted by: sherlock at October 27, 2012 05:54 PM (TQbuA)

170 Well, then I guess it's quite fortunate that none of us are actually presidential candidates...

That's right, because like it or not, we can do nothing if Barry is reelected. He'll use his office and the media to cover his tracks.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:54 PM (6TB1Z)

171 What the fuck, guys?

Don't you know that Mitt Romney is going to require a Mormon be quartered in every household in America??????

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (BuSM8)

172 My mother is senile, has alzhiemers, is in a nursing home, and my cock sucking ( well actually muff diving) asshole sister got her a absentee ballot and will submit it with obama's name on it. My mother doesn't know what day it is, who the President is, or what happened 1 minute ago. And my shit head liberal sister thinks that is moral?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (oSFWF)

173 160

Sort of like an (actual) journalist?

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (SAA1o)

174 Now, is it possible that the video WAS to blame.....?

hmmmmmm?


let's be fair !



Posted by: Republican Establishment at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (EZl54)

175 "No captain can do very wrong if he places his ship alongside that of the enemy." - Horatio Nelson

Posted by: sherlock


Erm...

Posted by: Bull Halsey, chasing after phantom Japanese fleets while leaving the landing beaches undefended at October 27, 2012 05:56 PM (6TB1Z)

176 Don't you know that Mitt Romney is going to require a Mormon be quartered in every household in America??????
Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (BuSM

Can i put in my request now for a young blond female?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:56 PM (oSFWF)

177 >>Romney dodges bullet: NYT endorses Obama

Well they endorsed Carter in 1980 so they have integrity, or something.

Posted by: Gordon undead Ramsay at October 27, 2012 05:56 PM (9HhTH)

178 I dropped this on the dead thread, "... but there was enough information to send the less capable team from Tripoli?" The paucity of information excuse has holes.

The Hamm replacement is odd. You don't do it mid-crisis, just as a courtesy to avoid any appearance of tampering with his judgement or character, and second, the Senate isn't going to do anything until after the election - and you just tossed them a perfect reason to have another hearing into the mess, why?

Posted by: Jean at October 27, 2012 05:56 PM (OTtAK)

179 172 "doesn't know what day it is", sounds like a Biden voter to me.

Posted by: Liberty Lover at October 27, 2012 05:57 PM (aTqVQ)

180 161

But wouldn't putting politics ahead of American lives be sort of ... not nice (or "optimal")?

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 05:57 PM (SAA1o)

181 That's right, because like it or not, we can do nothing if Barry is reelected. He'll use his office and the media to cover his tracks.
Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 05:54 PM (6TB1Z)

```

At last, someone else recognizes that a single comment thread on ace.mu.nu can shift the vote by five to ten percent.

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 05:57 PM (3ziXJ)

182 @178

Inertia, aka Army fuel

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 05:58 PM (lkUU9)

183 My mother doesn't
know what day it is, who the President is, or what happened 1 minute
ago. And my shit head liberal sister thinks that is moral?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (oSFWF)



Did you ask your sister that?

Posted by: Tami at October 27, 2012 05:58 PM (X6akg)

184 <<So, you're just asking questions, is that it?



Posted by: pep>>

Am I?

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (oHt/L)

185 Did you ask your sister that?
Posted by: Tami at October 27, 2012 05:58 PM (X6akg)

Did I ask her what?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (oSFWF)

186
My mother is senile, has alzhiemers, is in a nursing home, and my cock sucking ( well actually muff diving) asshole sister got her a absentee ballot and will submit it with obama's name on it. My mother doesn't know what day it is, who the President is, or what happened 1 minute ago. And my shit head liberal sister thinks that is moral?
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (oSFWF)
Tell her you're inspired by her example, and will be happy to do the same for her should she become (further) incapacitated.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (U+DUu)

187
My mother is senile, has alzhiemers, is in a nursing home, and my cock sucking ( well actually muff diving) asshole sister got her a absentee ballot and will submit it with obama's name on it. My mother doesn't know what day it is, who the President is, or what happened 1 minute ago. And my shit head liberal sister thinks that is moral? Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (oSFWF)


One, request the ballot for mom first.
two, have her removed from the voter rolls. you may need a court document showing conservatorship or a doctor's note.
three, if your sister forged mom's name, have her prosecuted.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (zLp5I)

188 The Ham and Gaouette issues are likely co-incidences with Benghazi, nothing more.

It is sad that we suspect otherwise and with good cause.

Let's put the burden on the Administration to prove it a co-incidence rather than a burden on us to show it is not.



Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (+XD7n)

189 Did I ask her what?



Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (oSFWF)

If she thinks that's a moral thing to do?

Posted by: Tami at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (X6akg)

190 I guess Drew is the janitor at the headquarters on weekends and he's just trying to clean up our mess...

Posted by: AmericanDawg at October 27, 2012 06:00 PM (XIsD/)

191 Never - that's part of the problem. If someone could get to the polls a hundred years ago, they can do it now. Finished my chores for the day, trying to take a bubble bath, but this shit just f*cks with my bp. Only 10 more days. God help us all!

Posted by: Infidel at October 27, 2012 06:00 PM (prnik)

192 188 The Ham and Gaouette issues are likely co-incidences with Benghazi, nothing more.

It is sad that we suspect otherwise and with good cause.

Let's put the burden on the Administration to prove it a co-incidence rather than a burden on us to show it is not.



Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (+XD7n)

exactly / winning!

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 06:00 PM (Z9EHQ)

193 178 I dropped this on the dead thread, "... but there was enough information to send the less capable team from Tripoli?" The paucity of information excuse has holes.

The Hamm replacement is odd. You don't do it mid-crisis, just as a courtesy to avoid any appearance of tampering with his judgement or character, and second, the Senate isn't going to do anything until after the election - and you just tossed them a perfect reason to have another hearing into the mess, why?

Posted by: Jean at October 27, 2012 05:56 PM (OTtAK)


Stop that.
DrewM has already severely chastised me for finding it odd.

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 06:00 PM (Qxe/p)

194 <<That's right, because like it or not, we can do
nothing if Barry is reelected. He'll use his office and the media to
cover his tracks.



Posted by: pep>>

Then it's a good thing people are asking questions now, isn't it?

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:00 PM (oHt/L)

195 One, request the ballot for mom first.
two, have her removed from the voter rolls. you may need a court document showing conservatorship or a doctor's note.
three, if your sister forged mom's name, have her prosecuted.
Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (zLp5I)

We both have power of attorney and theoretically she needs my concurrence on everything. Of course on this she went behind my back.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:01 PM (oSFWF)

196 At last, someone else recognizes that a single comment thread on ace.mu.nu can shift the vote by five to ten percent.

Well, last I checked, but I could be wrong, this thread was about whether or not Romney should be pounding the table about this, and demanding explanations for (likely but unproven) malfeasance, or should let things unfold with people like BB developing the story. But hey, there's a hill. Let's die on it. Because.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 06:01 PM (6TB1Z)

197 I feel foolish today. I passed this info on in an email laced with outrage. Sigh.
It's BS.
I only sent it to one person, but it was my dad.


Actually, it's nothing of the sort. Drew doesn't seem to know much about the military.

His point is that people are claiming Admiral Gaouette was relieved of command as a scapegoat and that General Ham is still in command of AFRICOM.

Gaouette was relieved for unspecified "questionable judgment." Criticizing Obama and demanding that his carrier strike group be sent in would fall under that definition. Criticizing the C-in-C will get you immediately fired.

Ham could have been temporarily relieved of command for disobeying orders and preparing to send in a rescue team. He then could've been talked into staying on the job for the good of the nation. All military men know that having the C-in-C revealed as a disgusting, incompetent, lying turd is bad for national security. And Ham took an oath to obey his orders.

Don't feel foolish, The only foolishness is the knee-jerk reaction of saying with absolute certainty that neither of these two stories have anything to do with Benghazi.

Posted by: Llarry at October 27, 2012 06:01 PM (5l2tw)

198 Posted by: Guy Mohawk at October 27, 2012 05:36 PM (PHb2k)

I remember a rant on here. Something about the FBI waiting for visas to go into Libya. I remember it was an epic AOSHQ rant.

Posted by: What do you do all day if you don't watch tv, anne? at October 27, 2012 06:02 PM (oZfic)

199 If she thinks that's a moral thing to do?
Posted by: Tami at October 27, 2012 05:59 PM (X6akg)


Yeah and she starts in on women, vaginas, gay marriage, and abortion. And after I ask her what the hell she is talking about and what that has to do with anything I end up telling her to fuck herself.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:02 PM (oSFWF)

200 <<Let's put the burden on the Administration to prove it a co-incidence rather than a burden on us to show it is not.







Posted by: eman>>


Because even if it does turn out to be a coincidence, then it is clearly massive incompetence. Staff shake-ups in the area of conflict are never a good idea.

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:02 PM (oHt/L)

201
172My mother is senile, has alzhiemers, is in a nursing home, and my cock sucking ( well actually muff diving) asshole sister got her a absentee ballot and will submit it with obama's name on it. My mother doesn't know what day it is, who the President is, or what happened 1 minute ago. And my shit head liberal sister thinks that is moral?

Damn.
That's pretty bad.
I admire your restraint, Nevergiveup.....I would beopening a can of whoopass on her.
But then, I'm a girl and could get away with it.

Posted by: wheatie at October 27, 2012 06:03 PM (ipkPX)

202 I think this is great!

http://tinyurl.com/cw8z9sa

(until DrewM tells me to think otherwise)

Posted by: USA at October 27, 2012 06:03 PM (RIg+t)

203 Drew, is it your assertion that rdbrewer's comment about the replacement of General Ham on the sidebar is "crazy speculation"?

Am I?

You tell me.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 06:03 PM (6TB1Z)

204 196

No. It was about someone posting something somewhere, and someone with authority freaking out about it and teaching us all about morality, ethics, and things of that nature.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:03 PM (SAA1o)

205 Well, last I checked, but I could be wrong, this
thread was about whether or not Romney should be pounding the table
about this, and demanding explanations for (likely but unproven)
malfeasance, or should let things unfold with people like BB developing
the story. But hey, there's a hill. Let's die on it. Because.


Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 06:01 PM (6TB1Z)

I think you might be wrong about that.....does Romney's name appear in Drew's post anywhere? You were the first person to throw Romney's name in this discussion.

Posted by: Tami at October 27, 2012 06:03 PM (X6akg)

206 The admiral's "questionable judgment" might consist of mouthing off to the SecDef and/or POTUS.

The "this isn't linked, move on" posture is misguided and premature. That it came so soon after the Ham situation at least plausibly suggests linkage.

There is more to military interactions than looking at a globe.

Posted by: dawnfire at October 27, 2012 06:03 PM (eEeH7)

207 Dear Bull Halsey, chasing after phantom Japanese fleets while leaving the landing beaches undefended,

Yeah,it's sort of a prerequisiteto know where the fucking real fleet is, Bull. Thanks a big fucking lot.

Tin Can Sailors

Posted by: sherlock at October 27, 2012 06:04 PM (TQbuA)

208 Damn.
That's pretty bad.
I admire your restraint, Nevergiveup.....I would beopening a can of whoopass on her.
But then, I'm a girl and could get away with it.

Posted by: wheatie at October 27, 2012 06:03 PM (ipkPX)

Yeah I hear ya, but I have bigger fish to fry with my sister and since NJ will probably not be that close, I am not going to go ballistic and go to court to stop her, though I could.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:04 PM (oSFWF)

209 196 Well, last I checked, but I could be wrong, this thread was about whether or not Romney should be pounding the table about this, and demanding explanations for (likely but unproven) malfeasance,
Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 06:01 PM (6TB1Z)

```

Forgive me, I didn't catch on to that. Looking back I can totally understand why you feel that way. After all, the first five mentions of Romney in this thread were yours, and the next six were someone's sock. The rest are jokes, socks, or "this will not be a problem with Romney in office." I hope you can understand my confusion.

Now back to lurking.

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:05 PM (3ziXJ)

210 14 Give me Ham on five and hold the Mayo.
Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 04:44 PM (+XD7n)


************

I'm sure it's been said, but it's

"Give me Hamm on white, hold the Mayo."

Posted by: Boomer Redneque thinks Obama is the ineffective sphincter of an incontinent asshole at October 27, 2012 06:05 PM (eQnzo)

211 @197

Or, Gaouette may have been seen coming out of a whorehouse in Thailand by a subordinate with an ax to grind, and ham may be retiring.

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 06:05 PM (lkUU9)

212 >>Don't feel foolish, The only foolishness is the knee-jerk reaction of saying with absolute certainty that neither of these two stories have anything to do with Benghazi.

Ding ding.

Posted by: JackStraw at October 27, 2012 06:06 PM (TMB3S)

213 <<Well, last I checked, but I could be wrong, this thread was about
whether or not Romney should be pounding the table about this, and
demanding explanations for (likely but unproven) malfeasance,>>


You could be wrong. Romney doesn't appear anywhere in Drew's post and the thread overall is simply asking the general question for the sake of the general public whether or not these military replacements are ill-timed or part of a cover-up. I've seen no comments in this thread that Romney should be asking these questions.

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:06 PM (oHt/L)

214
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:01 PM (oSFWF)


Condolences. I am sorry you have to deal with her, when she should know what is moral and ethical and ignores it..

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 06:06 PM (zLp5I)

215 SOS -----> Benghazi ? still under investigation, but I will take full credit for what happened.
DOD------> Benghazi ? still under investigation and BTW you stupid American peeps, quit trying to figure this out on your own!
POSBooBoo----->Benghazi ? The administration is investigating this. We will get it right! Read the transcript fool!
CIA----> Benghazi ? No one asked us anything.
MSM----> News blackout due to covering Barbra Streisand rants and doomed USA predictions via youtube of singing 8 years olds kept up way past their bed time.
Solution?-----> It's time to send in the Texas Rangers! They will have the full answer within 48 hours if not sooner!!! Kick butt!!!

Posted by: bayway48 at October 27, 2012 06:07 PM (FzYtL)

216 <<Am I?

You tell me.>>

Why? I'm not asking you any questions and I owe you no explanations.

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:08 PM (oHt/L)

217 Rescuing diplomats involved in a covert, cowboy gun-running operation? Not optimal.

Posted by: Commander Gutsy Call at October 27, 2012 06:08 PM (vm7ot)

218 Don't you know that Mitt Romney is going to require a Mormon be quartered in every household in America??????


Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM
------------------
Does that mean I have to start wearing pants?

Posted by: Lurking Flaneur at October 27, 2012 06:08 PM (hPlLv)

219 How would asking a question or two about this Benghazi situation lead to Romney's "defeat"?

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (yJYwC)

220 Because even if it does turn out to be a coincidence, then it is clearly massive incompetence. Staff shake-ups in the area of conflict are never a good idea.
Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:02 PM (oHt/L)

Okay.

But, delaying a scheduled command change could also hint of conspiracy.

If they would just tell us the truth, honest and reasonable folks among us would have no need to speculate.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (+XD7n)

221 @215...(can't resist)...will Josh Hamilton be going? Will they resign him?

Posted by: occam at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (lkUU9)

222 The Ham and Gaouette issues are likely co-incidences with Benghazi, nothing more.

Maybe. But it's not "tinfoil hat territory" and "crazy speculation" to say they might be connected to Benghazi.

General Stanley McChrystal was fired for criticizing Obama and Biden. It's entirely possible that Admiral Gauoette was relieved of command for criticizing the decisions made to not send help to Benghazi, and it's possible that Ham was temporarily relieved of command but reinstated.

To state otherwise is simply silly.

Posted by: Llarry at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (5l2tw)

223
These 4 speed bumps that I had nothing to do with are not optimal for my campaign.

Posted by: Barry Oflustercluck at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (PHb2k)

224 218 Don't you know that Mitt Romney is going to require a Mormon be quartered in every household in America??????


Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM
------------------
Does that mean I have to start wearing pants?
Posted by: Lurking Flaneur at October 27, 2012 06:08 PM (hPlLv)

If that's the case I'm keeping mine in the basement.

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:10 PM (3ziXJ)

225 219

You shouldn't have asked that question. Obama just won because of you. I hope you're proud of yourself.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:10 PM (SAA1o)

226 219 How would asking a question or two about this Benghazi situation lead to Romney's "defeat"?

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (yJYwC)


Because it will be revealed that Mormons are behind it.

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 06:10 PM (Qxe/p)

227 <<And my shit head liberal sister thinks that is moral?>>

If she's liberal, 'moral's got nothing to do with it.

I've got a liberal sister myself; not only does 'moral' have nothing to do with it, common sense doesn't either, most of the time.

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:11 PM (oHt/L)

228 226

That's true. Romney probably orchestrated the whole thing.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:12 PM (SAA1o)

229 You shouldn't have asked that question. Obama just won because of you. I hope you're proud of yourself.

Obama just jumped up 50 points on Intrade.
Good job guys.
Good.
Job.

Posted by: Methos at October 27, 2012 06:12 PM (hO9ad)

230 Well, all I know is that we have 4 Americans dead, including an ambassador.

I will not be told to sit down and shut up. I don't think Ham's removal is totally benign, because he did speak to Jennifer Griffin.

Since Brett Baier thinks the admiral's removal is odd, I will go with his investigating, and see what happens.

Romney needs to stay out of this, as I also think he might be receiving false or incomplete information.

For those who think I am tin foil, I would remind you that there are a lot of connections Obama has that were ascribed as tin foil when people brought them up 4 years ago. Does anyone think he will support Israel? Does anyone think he might have been sending guns to Al Qaeda in Syria? Why was the increased security to Libya denied?

Pffft. I don't know enough about the military to post authoritatively, but I sure as heck know when things are fishy, and this Benghazi thing is in that category.



Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:12 PM (GoIUi)

231 Posted by: pep>>
Then it's a good thing people are asking questions now, isn't it?


Posted by: Sgt. York


216
<<Am I?
You tell me.>>
Why? I'm not asking you any questions and I owe you no explanations.


Posted by: Sgt. York



Ummmmm

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 06:13 PM (6TB1Z)

232
Basically nobody is going to claim anything for the fiasco in Benghazi. The buck wasn't passed, there was no buck, if there was a buck it fell out somewhere or the buck got stolen, whats a buck? Stand up Buck, what am I saying?, God love ya.

I guess they all feel this is better from a political point of view. I think they will realize on Nov. 6th they are wrong.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at October 27, 2012 06:13 PM (PHb2k)

233 <<If they would just tell us the truth, honest and reasonable folks among us would have no need to speculate.>>

Pretty much, yeah.

Even if it is scheduled changes, prudence would simply delay the changes until after the election just to avoid the appearance of malfeasance. And we know how hung up they are on appearance.


Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:14 PM (oHt/L)

234 How would asking a question or two about this Benghazi situation lead to Romney's "defeat"?

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (yJYwC)

The MFM would accuse Mitt of politicizing and interfering with US foreign policy and the tragic deaths of four brave Americans.

Mush-brained voters (they are legion) would soak it up like the good little sponges they are.

Mitt is wise to let Ebola have this all to himself.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 06:15 PM (+XD7n)

235 Posted by: pep>>
Then it's a good thing people are asking questions now, isn't it?




Posted by: Sgt. York

216

<<Am I?
You tell me.>>
Why? I'm not asking you any questions and I owe you no explanations.




Posted by: Sgt. York


Ummmmm


Posted by: pep>>

You misspelled "yes".

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:15 PM (oHt/L)

236 And we know how hung up they are on appearance.
Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:14 PM (oHt/L)

```

Well, sorta. Their two "sex" spokeswomen are on the rather, erm... Well.... Let's just say they're 2AMers.

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:16 PM (3ziXJ)

237 Thanks Miss Marple. You articulated that much better than I could. I gotta tune out for a while. My health can't take it.

Posted by: Infidel at October 27, 2012 06:16 PM (prnik)

238 230

It's almost as if Leftists having an easy way to dismiss anything inconvenient to them as "thin shat" is somehow beneficial to them and Leftism...

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:16 PM (SAA1o)

239
A guy on Greta last night said it best....

Romney is caught in a catch-22.
If he brings up Benghazi...then they [team-O] will say, "Romney is politicizing it!"

If he doesn't say anything about it...then they say, "Well if Romney isn't bringing it up, then it must not be important!"


So, as usual, Barky and his media coxuckers are trying to have it both ways.

Thank God FoxNews is still digging away at this whole thing.

Judge Jeanine Piro will be doing her whole show tonight, on the Benghazi attack.
She will have Tyrone Woods' family on, as guests, during part of it.

Posted by: wheatie at October 27, 2012 06:16 PM (ipkPX)

240 Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (oSFWF)

When my father was incapacitated (coma) I had guardianship and he could note vote until he went before a judge with documentation that he had full mental capacity.

If you have guardianship...you can call the election officials and notify them that a vote is being cast on behalf of your mom when it shouldn't be.

Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:16 PM (JWLqy)

241 @221...not until Nolan Ryan says so. He wants him in chewing tobacco rehab...lol!!

Posted by: bayway48 at October 27, 2012 06:16 PM (FzYtL)

242 The Ham and Gaouette issues are likely co-incidences with Benghazi, nothing more.

Maybe. But it's not "tinfoil hat territory" and "crazy speculation" to say they might be connected to Benghazi.

General Stanley McChrystal was fired for criticizing Obama and Biden. It's entirely possible that Admiral Gauoette was relieved of command for criticizing the decisions made to not send help to Benghazi, and it's possible that Ham was temporarily relieved of command but reinstated.

To state otherwise is simply silly.

Posted by: Llarry at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (5l2tw)

Yes, the part of my post you left out says something along those lines.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 06:17 PM (+XD7n)

243

time to go choke a bitch

bbl

Posted by: soothie at October 27, 2012 06:17 PM (gQJLM)

244 230
Well, all I know is that we have 4 Americans dead, including an ambassador.
I
will not be told to sit down and shut up. I don't think Ham's removal
is totally benign, because he did speak to Jennifer Griffin.
Since Brett Baier thinks the admiral's removal is odd, I will go with his investigating, and see what happens.
Posted by: Miss Marple
--------------------------------------------------------------
+ 1 , Damn Good Post !

Posted by: AmericanDawg at October 27, 2012 06:17 PM (XIsD/)

245 Mitt is wise to let Ebola have this all to himself.
Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 06:15 PM (+XD7n)

```

Agreed. His own people are making the case against him well enough.

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:17 PM (3ziXJ)

246 The admiral's "questionable judgment" might consist of mouthing off to the SecDef and/or POTUS.

The
"this isn't linked, move on" posture is misguided and premature. That
it came so soon after the Ham situation at least plausibly suggests
linkage.

There is more to military interactions than looking at a globe.


Spot on. Drew said people were accusing Obama of "scapegoating" Admiral Gauoette over Benghazi. Drew apparently doesn't know that military leaders can be relieved of command simply for sending impolitic messages to their higher ups.

Something along of the lines of "Why the fuck aren't we doing something? The fighting has been going on for five hours! What's the holdup?" would've been enough.

Plus, the brass doesn't even have to have a good reason for relieving someone of command. Commanders serve "at the pleasure of the Commander-in-Chief."

Look how think skinned Obama is and what a liar and toady Panetta is. You think they would put up with a lowly admiral questioning them?

Ham is different. If he resigned this close to an election, the media couldn't ignore the story, so they could've temporarily relived him and then appealed to his patriotism to get him to stay on the job.

Posted by: Llarry at October 27, 2012 06:18 PM (5l2tw)

247 For those who think I am tin foil, I would remind you that there are a
lot of connections Obama has that were ascribed as tin foil when people
brought them up 4 years ago.


Personally, I don't think that of you at all. And you are correct about the "crazy speculation" regarding Teh One that in many instances proved to be founded. I can understand the desire to maintain some level of integrity here on this blog, but condescension here on the part of some becomes irritating, at best.

Posted by: Soap MacTavish at October 27, 2012 06:18 PM (vbh31)

248 236

That's because they spent most of their spokesperson budget on the males...

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:18 PM (SAA1o)

249 When my father was incapacitated (coma) I had guardianship and he could note vote until he went before a judge with documentation that he had full mental capacity.

If you have guardianship...you can call the election officials and notify them that a vote is being cast on behalf of your mom when it shouldn't be.
Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:16 PM (JWLqy)

I will make a few calls on Monday, However, that is when Sandy is due to strike NJ, and I am on Duty Tomorrow so I will do that when I can. First I will try Republican Headquarters here in NJ to see if you have any advice

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:18 PM (oSFWF)

250
219 How would asking a question or two about this Benghazi situation lead to Romney's "defeat"?

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at October 27, 2012 06:09 PM (yJYwC)




Because the MFM media will latch on any tin foil conspiracy bullshit and smear the entire story as tinfoil conspiracy bull shit. They will not mention people are asking "WHO ordered the STAND DOWN?" they will only say that the Admiral was not relieved because he could not participate in the rescue at Benghazi, because hewas actually near Guam!
Chuckle, chuckle, Ha Ha!!
Aint them wingnutz stoopid.

If there is no tinfoil, they will use the fact that their favorite whipping boy, Glen Beck is asking questions. and again discredit the questions.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 06:19 PM (zLp5I)

251 248 Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:18 PM (SAA1o)

HA

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:20 PM (3ziXJ)

252 <<Then it's a good thing people are asking questions now, isn't it?






Posted by: Sgt. York

<<Am I?
You tell me.>>
Why? I'm not asking you any questions and I owe you no explanations.






Posted by: Sgt. York


Ummmmm




Posted by: pep>>

You know what? My bad. I should have realized your comprehension problems when you asserted that some were demanding that Romney should be asking these questions. I didn't think the question mark would throw you off. My fault for using proper punctuation when the statement clearly is not an interrogative. Allow me to replace the confusing mark with one that will allow for those with comprehension issues:

"Then it's a good thing people are asking questions now, isn't it."

We apologize for the confusion. Juice boxes will be handed out after nap time.

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:21 PM (oHt/L)

253 #199 Nevergiveup, it's highly unlikely your mother's vote will control the outcome of the election. So don't worry about that.

However, I would make your sister aware that if she does this again you will file a report with the election board and the Secretary of State. I also would move to have your mother declared incompetent and removed from the roles.

What your sister did is a felony.

Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:22 PM (GoIUi)

254 246

It's almost as if being Commander-in-Chief is important... and gives you power, and stuff of that nature.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:22 PM (SAA1o)

255 <<Well, all I know is that we have 4 Americans dead, including an ambassador.
I

will not be told to sit down and shut up. I don't think Ham's removal

is totally benign, because he did speak to Jennifer Griffin.
Since Brett Baier thinks the admiral's removal is odd, I will go with his investigating, and see what happens.
Posted by: Miss Marple>>

You win +1 internet.

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:23 PM (oHt/L)

256 Yeah and she starts in on women, vaginas, gay
marriage, and abortion. And after I ask her what the hell she is talking
about and what that has to do with anything I end up telling her to
fuck herself.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:02 PM (oSFWF)

I would have said You sent out the form and mailed it?
aww cht , i had ordered a ballot and did the same thing, I hope they don't arrest Mom for fraud.

Posted by: willow at October 27, 2012 06:23 PM (hX8cq)

257 However, I would make your sister aware that if she does this again you will file a report with the election board and the Secretary of State. I also would move to have your mother declared incompetent and removed from the roles.

What your sister did is a felony.
Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:22 PM (GoIUi)

Yes, that is sound advise. Unbelievable that my fucked up sister is forcing me to do shit like this.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:23 PM (oSFWF)

258 Here's the thing. The american people are entitled to answers and we are not getting them, so are only choice it to put the pieces of this puzzle together. Some of them fit - and some do not. General Ham's departure fits, the Rear Admiral's does not. If the CIA operatives were told to stand down, then is is perfectly reasonable to assume that the African Command was given the same order. It is also reasonable to assume that if the targets were painted with a laser designator, the General would have had a clear target.If Obama was truthful that he gave an express order to do everything possible to provide assistance, there would be a few more dead terrorists and possibly a different outcome. That did not happen, so at the very least he did not give the order, and at worst he ordered the commander relieved of duty. The latter is the most plausible.

Posted by: Radar at October 27, 2012 06:25 PM (Z64pB)

259 Yeah and she starts in on women, vaginas, gay
marriage, and abortion. And after I ask her what the hell she is talking
about and what that has to do with anything I end up telling her to
fuck herself.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:02 PM (oSFWF)

Add mail fraud charges, too.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 06:25 PM (+XD7n)

260 Well, maybe it's just me, I think we're at the point where Mitt would have to do something much worse than ask a "what happened?" question to hurt himself in the election. I understand the reasons why he should probably leave the mess alone for now, but it still irks me that this obvious demonstration of Zero's incompetence can still be seen as a liability ....to Romney.

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at October 27, 2012 06:25 PM (yJYwC)

261 In 258 - my spelling sucks when I'm pissed.

Posted by: Radar at October 27, 2012 06:26 PM (Z64pB)

262 nevergiveup, you already know choice means Their choice is the correct one.

Posted by: willow at October 27, 2012 06:26 PM (hX8cq)

263 I love how sure of yourself you are, Drew. Me, I'm going to wait to see what Bret Baier finds out. He's been tweeting about this story today. He's the one who has been on top of Benghazi all along from the melt-down interview of Steph Cutter to the hour-long Fox special "Death and Deceit". If Bret thinks this is a story, I will, too, thankyouverymuch.

Posted by: Aslan's Girl at October 27, 2012 06:26 PM (KL49F)

264 Drew, do you have any gory details about Thailand? Those sex filled rumors tend to leak out pretty quickly. I can easily see him mouthing off to his staff about Benghazi and some quisling Dim forwarding a few choice comments to DC.

Even if Hamm's replacement was in cycle, you would delay it given the circumstances.

Regardless, I like how Romney is handling this. He is winning and doesn't have to swing at every pitch.

Posted by: Jean at October 27, 2012 06:26 PM (kdfQ/)

265 The most important thing for Mitt is winning the election. We are all screwed and the truth will never come out if he doesn't. After he's president, Mitt can ask all the questions he wants. Until then, he needs to keep focused on the economy, because that's the one thing the media can't spin away, no matter how hard they try.

Posted by: not the mama at October 27, 2012 06:27 PM (kzCIn)

266 While conspiracy theories often end up covering up more facts that conspirators themselves through distraction, there is such a thing as overreacting.

You can say, "sorry, you need to prove that with facts before it's more than a rumor," or you can say "you people are fucking nuts" and start a flame war, factionalize people, and generally create just as much of a distraction from the actual facts as the conspiracy theory itself.

So, you know, kind of "doubling down."

I would just say (and have said), "prove it."

Unless someone is trying to make a conspiracy theory the core of a campaign or drowning out reality with it, the more serious problem is the fact-vacuum and the stream of lies that are precipitating it.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at October 27, 2012 06:27 PM (bxiXv)

267 but it still irks me that this obvious demonstration of Zero's incompetence can still be seen as a liability ....to Romney.
Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at October 27, 2012 06:25 PM (yJYwC)

This is the power of the MFM.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 06:27 PM (+XD7n)

268 Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:18 PM (oSFWF)

I recently called my local voter registrars office on my father's behalf because he told me that someone at the retirement home said he was "too old" to vote.

I asked the registrars office if an absentee ballot was requested for him.....It had not...thankfully....but they were very helpful.

I'd start there and voice your concerns

Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:27 PM (JWLqy)

269 I understand the reasons why he should probably
leave the mess alone for now, but it still irks me that this obvious
demonstration of Zero's incompetence can still be seen as a liability
....to Romney.

Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet


Agreed, but it is what it is.

Posted by: pep at October 27, 2012 06:28 PM (6TB1Z)

270
#199 Nevergiveup:

Is your sister going to fill in the ballot (as best as she can) as your mother would've if she still had all of her mental faculties?

Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:28 PM (tOkJB)

271 <<Well, sorta. Their two "sex" spokeswomen are on the rather, erm... Well.... Let's just say they're 2AMers.

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough>>

True as that is, you aren't exactly their target demographic.

("Wait, if Democrats think SHE's pretty, then so am I...I'm gonna go vote for Obama!")

They've perfected identity politics to both an art and a science.

Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:28 PM (oHt/L)

272 Hell, email me her name I'll file mail fraud charges if you want to stay out of it.

Posted by: Jean at October 27, 2012 06:28 PM (kdfQ/)

273 Doing my second ORCA training right now at this very moment...

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 06:28 PM (I2LwF)

274 O/T but connected to news blackouts:

There is a $43 trillion dollar lawsuit for RICO vs Holder et all. (Spire Law Group). It is in WSJ Marketwatch. Or, just google "43 trillion RICO" and you will see it was mentioned by a few outlets on October 25th. There is even a bizarre connection with CNBC Digital Klein, whose children were murdered, had the story up. Then they pulled the story.

The White House? Has no comment.

I think we are living in scary times. Pray for this country.


Posted by: ChristyBlinky, unbanned, ready to get this done at October 27, 2012 06:29 PM (baL2B)

275 Over at Breitbart:


Reports indicate two drones and an AC-130 gunship were in the area
when Benghazi was attacked, yet their resources were not used.

This runs completely against the current explanation coming out of
the White House, which is that Obama did everything he could once he
learned of the attack.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk at October 27, 2012 06:30 PM (PHb2k)

276
"Pray the gay away" - is thatthe sermon next Sunday?

Posted by: Reverend Robinson at October 27, 2012 06:31 PM (khZbv)

277 Is your sister going to fill in the ballot (as best as she can) as your mother would've if she still had all of her mental faculties?
Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:28 PM (tOkJB)

My mother would vote for Abe Lincoln or FDR if you told her to. Does that answer your question? She does not know if I have any kids and if I do what sex they are of how old and after I tell her, she asks the same thing a minute later. We call her 30 second Irene. My sister will voting twice by doing this.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:31 PM (oSFWF)

278 Re: Tin Foil Hats

What is really sad is that even the most normal and logical among us are somehow lumped into the category of tin foil hat wearers just for wondering out loud.

Sadder still is that we have a president who has been so shady that these same folks are compelled to believe that nothing is out of the realm of possibility for TFG.

Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:32 PM (JWLqy)

279 275

Obama did everything he could. To cover his own ass.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:32 PM (SAA1o)

280
Posted by: Damn Sockpuppet at October 27, 2012 06:25 PM (yJYwC)


Because the fucking undecided and squishy independents are ignorant self absorbed pricks. Any question about Obama's incompetence will be played by the MFM as mean attacks by theRomney Monster.

The undecideds are stupid low information voters, thatthey will believe the MFM, and may vote for the incompetency in chief.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 06:33 PM (zLp5I)

281 Posted by: Jean at October 27, 2012 06:26 PM (kdfQ/)

My guess on the Thailand/Malaysia connection was simply based on the fact most "judgement" based reliefs seem to involve alcohol and/or woman (especially of the junior rank variety).


Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 06:34 PM (AR+tO)

282 #257 Nevergiveup, I have a union-brainwashed brother. Here we are in 2012 and he STILL has a "Get out of the Bushes" bumper sticker on his truck. Last time I was at his house, he had photos of Barack and Michelle on hos fridge, which no doubt were because of his donations.

I am avoiding him until after the election. Unfortunately, he is the one who has Thanksgiving. I am seriously thinking about getting a case of the flu and skipping the whole fiasco.

One of the things I hate Obama for is his causing division amongst families. I am old enough to remember my southern democrat dad and my conservative grandpa having good-natured political discussions, sort of like people talked about football teams. That isn't possible anymore.

Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:34 PM (GoIUi)

283 Now I have another problem. My youngest daughter 23 just was assigned to be the Manager of a whole floor in a Macy's in NJ. Fine. But she is planning to go to work on Monday and stay all day just went this super storm is set to hit. The Gov. here just declared a State of Emergency and told people to stay off the roads on Monday. The manger of the store is on vacation until Monday. I told her to call the Manager of the Store she was trained at and get some answers. There is NO way Macy's should be open on MOnday here in NJ past noon.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:34 PM (oSFWF)

284 My mother would vote for Abe Lincoln or FDR if you told her to. Does that answer your question? She does not know if I have any kids and if I do what sex they are of how old and after I tell her, she asks the same thing a minute later. We call her 30 second Irene. My sister will voting twice by doing this.
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:31 PM (oSFWF)

My Mom is in the same shape.

Luckily, no one in my family would ever do what your sister has done.

Good luck, fellow Moron.

Posted by: eman at October 27, 2012 06:35 PM (+XD7n)

285 That isn't possible anymore.
Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:34 PM (GoIUi)

Nope it's war

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:35 PM (oSFWF)

286 In a normal, more moral America, to say as DrewM did, that "There are a lot of unanswered questions but trying to fill them in with crazy speculation doesn't help anyone" would be sensible. First, not all speculation is crazy (how would you know?) Second, DrewM's statement will have little effect so long as the Obama regime continues to stonewall.

- Good point about the Stennis inchop date to 5th fleet.

Posted by: Andy S. at October 27, 2012 06:36 PM (q72+j)

287 I'll go one step further and say anyone who doesn't question the timing of General Ham's removal is being willfully obtuse. Ham was well aware of al Qaeda's presence in Libya and the fact that they had scooped up tons of Gadaffi's weapons.

I don't believe for a second he thought this was a reaction to some dumb youtube video, he had responsibility for watching terrorists across Africa and he knew about the planned protest in Egypt, which had nothing to do with the video either, and he was aware that the Brits had already fled Benghazi along with the Red Cross because of terrorist attacks.

He knew what was happening and he was told to do nothing. Look how pissed off we are, can you imagine how pissed off he was?

>>Ham echoed fears previously voiced by U.S. officials to ABC News about a possible foothold extremist groups like al Qaeda may be trying to make in Libya and elsewhere in Africa. AQIM, an al Qaeda offshoot based in northwestern Africa, has publicly said it has "benefitted" from the chaos in Libya already.

http://tinyurl.com/93mey5n

Posted by: JackStraw at October 27, 2012 06:36 PM (TMB3S)

288
#277 My mother would vote for Abe Lincoln or FDR if you told her to. Does that answer your question?

No. I'm asking if:

Is your sister going to fill in the ballot as your mother would've if she still had all of her mental faculties?

Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:37 PM (tOkJB)

289 My awesome grandmother just passed at age 94.

I can't say I didn't think about pulling an absentee ballot for her and voting in RI-2 as well as my home in MA-4.

I didn't do it nor would I. But I thought about it.

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 06:38 PM (I2LwF)

290 OOOPS!
Gallup: Obama's Job Approval Drops 7 Points in 3 Days

Posted by: USA at October 27, 2012 06:39 PM (RIg+t)

291 286

In a normal, more moral America, everything would be different.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:39 PM (SAA1o)

292 Condolences Truman. 94 is a good long time.

Posted by: Beto at October 27, 2012 06:39 PM (BAnPT)

293 ("Wait, if Democrats think SHE's pretty, then so am I...I'm gonna go vote for Obama!")
They've perfected identity politics to both an art and a science.
Posted by: Sgt. York at October 27, 2012 06:28 PM (oHt/L)

```

It's so true. The manipulators have been developing this general technique at least as far back as the development of agriculture, if not before. I used to find the term "sheep" or "sheeple" very annoying but the sad fact is even with today's near universal literacy, education, and internet access half or more of the populace will shuffle right along behind whoever coos the their favorite lullaby.

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:40 PM (3ziXJ)

294 "Gallup: Obama's Job Approval Drops 7 Points in 3 Days."

Horrors. It must be because of this irresponsible speculation! Everyone shut up, so his job approval can rise!

Pffft. I do NOT like being told to sit down and shut up.

Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:41 PM (GoIUi)

295 Thanks, Beto. She was a real cool chick, and lived independently until she fell, tragically, in August. 60 days on morphine fries your mind. In the end she was ready to say goodbye.

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 06:41 PM (I2LwF)

296 290 OOOPS!
Gallup: Obama's Job Approval Drops 7 Points in 3 Days

Posted by: USA at October 27, 2012 06:39 PM (RIg+t)


Breitbart seems to think it's because of all the people with tin foil hats.
http://tinyurl.com/8azzk5u

I mean, we've had 6 or 8 perfectly reasonable, totally different explanations given to us, and we still seem to think we're not getting the real story!

Posted by: jwb7605 at October 27, 2012 06:42 PM (Qxe/p)

297 "One of the things I hate Obama for is his causing division amongst families."

Oh yeah...Barry brought 'the Chicago way' onto all our T-Giving tables.

"They bring a knife, we bring a gun." Bast^rd. I am tired of being 'nice' to family members who continually berate, call names and generally act nasty over St Barack.

Of course, if I counter their venom, I would be 'the bad guy'. So mostly I am silent and pray and wait.

Posted by: Lizabth at October 27, 2012 06:42 PM (JZBti)

298 Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 06:38 PM (I2LwF)

My Condolences ! Truman !! 94 is one hell of a Life Hope I live that long !

Posted by: Evilpens at October 27, 2012 06:42 PM (ck76k)

299 I am avoiding him until after the election. Unfortunately, he is the one who has Thanksgiving. I am seriously thinking about getting a case of the flu and skipping the whole fiasco.

Miss M., Thanksgiving is after Romney's election. Your cheerful demeanor will no doubt ease your brother's depression.

Posted by: real joe at October 27, 2012 06:42 PM (PD2ad)

300
# 276:

"Pray the gay away" - is thatthe sermon next Sunday?

No, that's what Moochelle whispers to herself when she dresses in her slinkiest negligee on a Saturday night.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at October 27, 2012 06:42 PM (L7hol)

301 that poll about racism that AP is touting?

When you read the fine print and the questions they asked, you find that they were asking political questions. (not about the candidates by name but about how things are in the country and so forth)

I think they used that to determine a person political leanings but I also suspect they used it to weight the responses on the intrinsic side.

i thought it was interesting that on the outright obvious questions, Republicans scored like 80% bigoted and Democrats only 30% while when they did the intrinsic questions, they found that Democrats were bigots by 55% and Republicans by 65%

At the bottom of this page == http://tinyurl.com/9q557l4 is the link to the analysis and the details about the questions and how they took the poll.

Posted by: Jcw46 at October 27, 2012 06:42 PM (Vh0f5)

302 293

Leftists believe that human beings are, or can be turned into, social animals. They act accordingly. And seem to have quite a bit of success.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:43 PM (SAA1o)

303 "lived independently until she fell"

That part, saddens and terrifies me the most.

Posted by: Beto at October 27, 2012 06:44 PM (BAnPT)

304 294

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:44 PM (SAA1o)

305 Is your sister going to fill in the ballot as your mother would've if she still had all of her mental faculties?
Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:37 PM (tOkJB)

My mother has not really had her mental facilities for over 7 years and which point she probably did not know obama from bozo? I have no idea what my mother would think? And neither does my sister.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:44 PM (oSFWF)

306
OK,we are all pissed about Benghazi. What can we do?

How about talking to our friends, neighbors, colleagues asking,
WHO ordered the stand down?
WHO ordered the stand down?

The sad part is we may have to explain what a Benghazi is. And what happened on 9/11/12. But if we ask our circles of influence, the word will get out. And eventually the news must cover it. WE have NINE days.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 06:45 PM (zLp5I)

307 AP: conservative views = racism, therefore conservative-minded people = racists. Duh!!!

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 06:45 PM (I2LwF)

308 “Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win”
― Sun Tzu, The Art of War

Posted by: Truck Monkey at October 27, 2012 06:45 PM (jucos)

309 Is your sister going to fill in the ballot as your mother would've if she still had all of her mental faculties?

Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:37 PM (tOkJB)


That's completely academic.

I await correction if someone knows something I don't, but in the US proxy voting in general elections is illegal, period, full-stop, no matter how unfair his sister thinks it is.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at October 27, 2012 06:46 PM (bxiXv)

310 Pffft. I do NOT like being told to sit down and shut up.


Posted by:--------------- Miss Marple

Piers Morgan tried to do the same thing with Ann Coulter the other day , it didn't end well for the Slimy Brit...

I believe I saw the clip over at News Busters...

Posted by: AmericanDawg at October 27, 2012 06:46 PM (XIsD/)

311 Maybe this is why Adm Gaouette is headed back to Bremerton.

http://tinyurl.com/9ft9b7t

Maybe catapulting Malaysians off the Stennis is not such a good thing.

"The abrupt landing and abrupt take-off, which packs a 4 G-force, jolted and shocked the senses out of the novices in what was described as a "never thought of" experience"

Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:46 PM (JWLqy)

312
#305 Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:44 PM (oSFWF)

Then she definitely shouldn't be voting for your mother.

Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:48 PM (tOkJB)

313 “Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win”
― Sun Tzu, The Art of War
Posted by: Truck Monkey at October 27, 2012 06:45 PM (jucos)

"Winners go home and fuck the prom queen"
John Patrick Mason ( Captain- British S.A.S. )

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:49 PM (oSFWF)

314
Here's what that creepy children singing for Obama video reminded me of -- this clip from the movie 1984 where the uniformed children are singing in praise of the Party:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VUP6piYJKs

Posted by: "we are the children" at October 27, 2012 06:49 PM (Q2wni)

315 302

I will concede this: they did not choose to be born into a system devised on the principle of individual initiative and personal responsibility. I suspect it would have been more fair for them (and us) if they had been born into a European nation where "kiss the master's feet" is a two millennia tradition and they could more easily believe themselves to be, "safe from pain, and truth, and choice, and other poison devils."

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:49 PM (3ziXJ)

316 Then she definitely shouldn't be voting for your mother.
Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:48 PM (tOkJB)


Of that, I have no doubt

Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:49 PM (oSFWF)

317
"Winners go home and fuck the prom queen"
John Patrick Mason ( Captain- British S.A.S. )
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:49 PM (oSFWF)

prom queen is overrated, go for her angry jealous friend, she will work harder

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 06:50 PM (Z9EHQ)

318 Thank you, Jcw46! I've been wanting to see the exact nature of the survey.

Posted by: S. Weasel at October 27, 2012 06:50 PM (YOBrO)

319 308

Leftists definitely believe that. That's the way they like to fight. A priori.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:50 PM (SAA1o)

320 letting your obama loving sister vote for you mom is practically euthanasia.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 06:50 PM (Z9EHQ)

321 “Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.”
― Sun Tzu, The Art of War

Posted by: Truck Monkey at October 27, 2012 06:50 PM (jucos)

322
Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:46 PM (JWLqy)

Someone has confused catapults with arrester systems in the article. I do not think it was the PIO though.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 06:51 PM (zLp5I)

323 "Winners go home and fuck the prom queen"
John Patrick Mason ( Captain- British S.A.S. )
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:49 PM (oSFWF)

prom queen is overrated, go for her angry jealous friend, she will work harder
Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 06:50 PM (Z9EHQ)
-----------------------------------------------------------
I thought that fat girls tried harder.....

Posted by: Truck Monkey at October 27, 2012 06:52 PM (jucos)

324 OMG!!

That picture at Africom.com - that's supposed to be General Ham? That's not him! That's . . . . that's . . . . omigawd, this is all getting just WAAAAAAYY too complex for me . . .

That's not Ham! That's Brett Kimberlin!

Posted by: bobby b at October 27, 2012 06:52 PM (uvdTG)

325 Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 06:51 PM (zLp5I)

ah what do I know my husband was a brown shoe...and P3s never landed on ships....as far as I know

Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:53 PM (JWLqy)

326
282 #257 Nevergiveup, I have a union-brainwashed brother. Here we are in 2012 and he STILL has a "Get out of the Bushes" bumper sticker on his truck. Last time I was at his house, he had photos of Barack and Michelle on hos fridge, which no doubt were because of his donations.





-------Reminds me of the time I worked at a temp job. On the first day I kinda sorta rearranged my area....The first thing I took down was a pic of Hillary...lol, thanks for reminding me.

Posted by: concrete girl at October 27, 2012 06:53 PM (y2Ojs)

327 I thought that fat girls tried harder.....
Posted by: Truck Monkey at October 27, 2012 06:52 PM (jucos)

further from the prom queen the harder they work.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 06:53 PM (Z9EHQ)

328 307 AP: conservative views = racism, therefore conservative-minded people = racists. Duh!!!
Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 06:45 PM (I2LwF)

```

Ha, RT had a headline about a new survey which conclusively proved that 70% of Americans are racist. The comments were most amusing.

(I check RT and a couple other foreign sites when I don't think I'm getting the story straight from the US gov't. Of course, I don't think they'll write anything that would hurt Obama so close to the election considering his election is in their best interests.)

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:54 PM (3ziXJ)

329 Even if the Adm Gaouette is and was in the Indian Sea or Persian Gulf for the entire time, he can still be relieved "Because of Benghazi."

Not because he actually -did- or -tried- to do anything in particular. But because he couldn't restrain himself. A "Who the flaming fuck ordered -this-?!?" is pretty much normal -here-. But saying the same thing anywhere it can be reported back to higher could well be enough.

Posted by: Al at October 27, 2012 06:54 PM (MzQOZ)

330 324

Good point...

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:54 PM (SAA1o)

331 DrewM:"Explain to me how a carrier strike group in either the western Pacific or Indian Ocean has anything to do with what happened in Benghazi, Libya on September 11th.

I'll wait. "

Well, as you noted the Stennis inchoped to 5th fleet well after 9/11/12, but your question asks how "a carrier group in WestPac or the IO could have anything to do with Libya." 5th fleet covers the Red Sea as well as the areas you mention. So, had there been no 6th fleet ARG or CTF near Libya on 9/11, and there was a 5h fleet ARG or CTF in the Red Sea, then there's your answer. But, if the dates you quote for Stennis inchoping to 5th fleet are correct, then the admiral embarked in ("in" not "on") Stennis would obviously not have had anything to do with the situation in Benghazi. I just thought I'd give a literal answer to your question as asked.

- I have never heard of a change of command announcement six months prior to end of tour, so I think there may be something to the Ham story. The question is was Ham relieved of command, and of so, why.

Posted by: Andy S. at October 27, 2012 06:54 PM (q72+j)

332 317
"Winners go home and fuck the prom queen"
John Patrick Mason ( Captain- British S.A.S. )
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 06:49 PM (oSFWF)

prom queen is overrated, go for her angry jealous friend, she will work harder
Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 06:50 PM (Z9EHQ)



If at all possible, do them both. The spirit of competition will bring out the best in them. And I can't stress this enough: you haven't lived until you've delivered the double facial.

Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 06:55 PM (I2LwF)

333
#311

Twin 550 MW nuclear reactors? Holy shit! I should call my doctor now, because this boner is going to last longer than four hours.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at October 27, 2012 06:56 PM (L7hol)

334

"Therefore those skilled in warfare move the enemy, and are not moved by the enemy."

Posted by: Beto at October 27, 2012 06:56 PM (BAnPT)

335 Regarding the fact we have 9 days, rd, I recommend talking this up.

I have found it very effective to hang around the meat department at the grocery and look for likely suspects, then comment about th sky high cost of beef. ($17.00 for a chuck roast!!) I make a comment about the prices, and then, depending on their reaction, I can tell if they are Obama or Romney voters.

If they are Obama voters, I ask them if they know about how the EPA and Obama have driven up the cost of fuel, which causes grocery prices to rise. If they are receptive, I talk about inflation caused by printing more money.

If they are Romney voters, I get them to talking and (since I am an older person and possibly hard of hearing) I talk real loud with them, and then THEY get real loud, and then everyone in the area hears all of the stuff we are saying!

I do this every time I go to the grocery store.

Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:56 PM (GoIUi)

336
Is your sister going to fill in the ballot as your mother would've if she still had all of her mental faculties?



Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:37 PM (tOkJB)





Um. What? You'd have to check the exact requirements of your state but filling in a ballot for someone else is really really really damn illegal, absent certain very specific circumstances (ie physically unable to complete and have an appointed person complete it at your request in your presence).


Disclaimer time: not your lawyer, not licensed in your jurisdiction, general information only. If your sister is aware that your mother is mentally incompetent and she is still voting for her, then she is very likely violating her duties as power of attorney and not only can but should be replaced. Not to mention the whole really damn illegal thing.



In other news, how many penalties have there been in the Florida Georgia game, 100+?

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. We're not worthy. at October 27, 2012 06:56 PM (Gk3SS)

337
Nevergiveup:

I'm helping my father vote. He has senile dementia but hates Obama and several others on the ballot. He'll vote the way he wants to.

Posted by: Ed Anger at October 27, 2012 06:57 PM (tOkJB)

338
Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:53 PM (JWLqy)


Naw, I was referring to the Malaysian MFM'er. He tried, but I think he got a little confused in his description of what stops the planes.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 06:57 PM (zLp5I)

339 Ace and/or co-bloggers...this seems like a big deal not reported on 25th.

From the $43 trillion RICO lawsuit vs Government officials including Holder, Anita Dunn, Jarret, Corzine, and Geitner (bailout moneyhas not been repaid). From WSJ Marketwatch 10/25/12:


“In the District Court lawsuit, Spire Law Group, LLP — on
behalf of home owner across the Country and New York taxpayers, as well
as under other taxpayer recompense laws — has expanded its mass tort
action into federal court in Brooklyn, New York, seeking to halt all
foreclosures nationwide pending the return of the $43 trillion
($43,000,000,000.00) by the “Banksters” and their co-conspirators,
seeking an audit of the Fed and audits of all the “bailout programs” by
an independent receiver such as Neil Barofsky, former Inspector General
of the TARP program who has stated that none of the TARP money and other
“bailout money” advanced from the Treasury has ever been repaid despite
protestations to the contrary by the Defendants as well as similar
protestations by President Obama and the Obama Administration both
publicly on national television and more privately to the United States
Congress.

Because the Obama Administration has failed to pursue any of the
“Banksters” criminally, and indeed is actively borrowing monies for Mr.
Obama’s campaign from these same “Banksters” to finance its political
aspirations, the national group of plaintiff home owners has been forced
to now expand its lawsuit to include racketeering, money laundering and
intentional violations of the Iranian Nations Sanctions and Embargo Act
by the national banks included among the “Bankster” Defendants. “

Posted by: ChristyBlinky, unbanned, ready to get this done at October 27, 2012 06:58 PM (baL2B)

340 Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:56 PM (GoIUi)

I like the way you work

Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 06:58 PM (JWLqy)

341 335

That's awesome.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:58 PM (SAA1o)

342 If at all possible, do them both. The spirit of competition will bring out the best in them. And I can't stress this enough: you haven't lived until you've delivered the double facial.
Posted by: Truman North at October 27, 2012 06:55 PM (I2LwF)
---------------------------------------------------------
Brings to mind the story of two bulls (one young, one old) at the top of a hill looking down over a field of cows. The young one says to the old one, "Hey, lets run down there and fuck one of those cows!" The old bull looks at the young bull and said, "How about we walk down there and fuck them all."

Posted by: Truck Monkey at October 27, 2012 06:59 PM (jucos)

343 339

Wow. Sounds like a good way to get suicided.

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 06:59 PM (3ziXJ)

344 Naw, I was referring to the Malaysian MFM'er. He tried, but I think he got a little confused in his description of what stops the planes.
Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 06:57 PM (zLp5I)

Ah give em a break his senses were still jolted and shocked

Posted by: kawfytawk at October 27, 2012 07:00 PM (JWLqy)

345 When I encounter an Obama supporter I ask them "Why are you for criminal abuse of power and Big Brother government?"

Posted by: Beto at October 27, 2012 07:02 PM (BAnPT)

346 That's awesome.
Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 06:58 PM (SAA1o)

```

I thought so too until about 60 seconds after I read it, when I was overcome with the urge to go by a roast, some carrots, onions, and potatoes and had to settle instead for a $2 Beef Pot Roast flavored microwave dinner from my freezer Q.Q

Posted by: D. R. Ainsborough at October 27, 2012 07:02 PM (3ziXJ)

347 Good thing there's no linky thingy for crazy nutty VP theories.

Posted by: Sherriff Joe Biden at October 27, 2012 07:03 PM (Nts6c)

348 GOTV

Posted by: Project ORCA at October 27, 2012 07:03 PM (biKeO)

349
Regarding the fact we have 9 days, rd, I recommend talking this up.

I have found it very effective to hang around the meat department at the grocery and look for likely suspects, then comment about th sky high cost of beef. ($17.00 for a chuck roast!!) I make a comment about the prices, and then, depending on their reaction, I can tell if they are Obama or Romney voters.

If they are Obama voters, I ask them if they know about how the EPA and Obama have driven up the cost of fuel, which causes grocery prices to rise. If they are receptive, I talk about inflation caused by printing more money.

If they are Romney voters, I get them to talking and (since I am an older person and possibly hard of hearing) I talk real loud with them, and then THEY get real loud, and then everyone in the area hears all of the stuff we are saying!

I do this every time I go to the grocery store.
Posted by: Miss Marple at October 27, 2012 06:56 PM (GoIUi)


^^^^YES!!!!^^^^

This is one way we all canchange a vote or two. IMO, People believe in their neighbor's judgement. That is one reason political signs work.
WORD OF MOUTH works.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 07:04 PM (zLp5I)

350 345

Well, I assume it's because they are in favor of Ingsoc. Which seems like a profoundly-unwise idea.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 07:04 PM (SAA1o)

351 And my shit head liberal sister thinks that is moral?
Posted by: Nevergiveup at October 27, 2012 05:55 PM (oSFWF)

----------->>>
It's actually illegal to cast an absentee ballot in another person's name. But with leftists, the ends justify the means.

I'd suggest that you call the appropriate board of elections. If you don't want to get your sister in legal trouble, tell the board that you had heard a rumor that your Alzheimer's-stricken mother was sent an absentee ballot.

Posted by: Retired Buckeye Cop at October 27, 2012 07:04 PM (nYHk7)

352 349

Political signs also have to do with peer pressure.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 07:06 PM (SAA1o)

353 Time to put this thread out of my misery.

Posted by: USA at October 27, 2012 07:07 PM (RIg+t)

354 on was on the elevator this morning, in our apartment building, and everyone was talking about how they were voting for Romney. never heard anyone discuss anything conservative in our building. never. ever.

It was romney discussion without abandon. not expecting him to take the state but if the liberals in my building are going romney obama is in dire straits.

Posted by: yankeefifth at October 27, 2012 07:07 PM (Z9EHQ)

355 “He who is prudent and lies in wait for an enemy who is not, will be victorious.”
― Sun Tzu, The Art of War

Posted by: Truck Monkey at October 27, 2012 07:07 PM (jucos)

356 "The most reliable and best armed groups of the mass of revolutionary contingents organised to take extreme measures to overcome the famine shall be detailed for dispatch to all stations and all uyezds of the principal grain supplying gubernias. These groups, with the participation of railwaymen delegated by local railway committees, shall be authorised, firstly, to control the movement of grain freights; secondly, take charge of the collection and storage of grain; thirdly, adopt the most extreme revolutionary measures to fight speculators and to requisition grain stocks. When making any record of requisition, arrest or execution, the revolutionary contingents shall summon at least six witnesses to be selected from the poorest section of the population closest at hand." -- Lenin

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 07:09 PM (SAA1o)

357 "In Death Ground, Fight" - Sun Tzu, The Art of War.

Posted by: Al at October 27, 2012 07:10 PM (MzQOZ)

358 Final - K-State 55 Texas Tech 24

If Georgia hangs on to beat Florida a #2 BCS ranking should be in the offing. And if OU beats ND and Miss St were to beat Bama...

Posted by: teej says go K-State at October 27, 2012 07:10 PM (/BwGa)

359 we can haz new thread?

Posted by: chemjeff on the phone at October 27, 2012 07:10 PM (C9WKQ)

360 Nyet!

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 07:12 PM (SAA1o)

361 Time to shop and put miss marples ideas into effect.

Posted by: rd wants the MSM to do their jobs at October 27, 2012 07:12 PM (zLp5I)

362
131 Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 05:40 PM (AR+tO)
1 year, 7 months, 10 days was Ham's duration from assuming command to the announcement that Rodriguez was replacing him. Approval will take what, 2 months? maybe 3? So that's a 2 year stint end to end, when 3 years or more is average. Check out EUCOM history, since AFRICOM is new.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EUCOM
The timing of the replacement, barely a month after the September 11th debacle, is *interesting* to say the least. Especially considering the direct involvement of the parties involved, the disavowments and prevarication which followed, and appearance of communications that hint that maybe, just maybe, SECDEF TOTUS weren't being 'the most transparent leaders ever'
Gaouette Ham are two completely different stories. Why you chose to incorporate them as somehow connected (both 'nutty'? is that how you phrased it or something to that effect?) places your objectivity and agenda in question. Alinsky's Rule #5 perchance?

Posted by: Armchair1 at October 27, 2012 07:12 PM (FXJ3W)

363 362

It's also interesting considering how image-obsessed Leftists tend to be.

Posted by: Mirror-Universe Mitt Romney at October 27, 2012 07:15 PM (SAA1o)

364 new thread

Posted by: chemjeff on the phone at October 27, 2012 07:19 PM (C9WKQ)

365 Posted by: Armchair1 at October 27, 2012 07:12 PM (FXJ3W)

Even if you think it's early consider this: Panetta doesn't think Obama is going to win and he wants to name his replacement and try to sneak the confirmation through in the lame duck.

Posted by: DrewM. at October 27, 2012 07:31 PM (AR+tO)

366
That makes more sense. Still the timing just sets a big flag.
The next ten days will be mighty interesting. Waiting to see if more stuff comes out into the open.
We sure need it.
No harsh feelings then

Posted by: Armchair1 at October 27, 2012 07:35 PM (FXJ3W)

367 Nutty conspiracy theories, maybe: but they flood into the vacuum left by the Fourth Estate not doing its fucking job and reporting the goddamn facts.

Posted by: beverly at October 27, 2012 08:07 PM (w/8oh)

368 http://goo.gl/G6eiE

Huh? Panetta said he consulted with both Ham and Dempsey.

Posted by: holmes at October 27, 2012 08:31 PM (Q38Em)

369 Nevergiveup

If you're still around, this is about your daughter and Macy's.
If her boss is still on vacation on Monday, given that a huge hurricane is bearing right down on his store, he's a dumbass. And incompetent.

That being said...closure decisions are made by the district manager in conference with the most senior manager in the building. it is highly likely that the mall will close sometime Monday, and thus they will make the decision to close Macy's also.

we had a conference call on Friday to discuss this very scenario.

don't worry. Most retailers are safety conscious these days, and do not do the crazy things they did in years past. Back then, the philosophy was, if the customers still want to shop, we'll stay open. no longer true. thank the lawyers for this one.

Posted by: In the Belly of the Beast-Kathy in MD at October 27, 2012 09:08 PM (A5iH4)

370 I served 4 years on the Stennis and still have some contacts there. The story is (and this is second hand from the Stennis reactor dept., so probably 4-5 degrees removed from the principals) that Adm Gaouette was removed for being a first class asshole. The specific tale was that he berated an IC2 (E-5) for not getting a PA system working. For those who don't know, the only thing an admiral should say to a junior sailor is "good job" or equivalent. Any problems should flow through the chain of command to the chief.

So no, this had nothing to do with Bengazhi.

Posted by: Jeff Gauch at October 27, 2012 09:14 PM (N49zT)

371 ...Adm Gaouette was removed for being a first class asshole.

Things must have changed then. Thirty years ago a 'flamer' was regarded as a character-building experience for his juniors.

Posted by: PersonFromPorlock at October 27, 2012 09:32 PM (2VCZA)

372 His juniors, sure. The problem comes from yelling at someone else's subordinates. Not only is it unsporting for an O-8 to chew out an E-5, it also undermines the authority of everyone between them in the chain of command, from the ship's CO down to the chief.

Posted by: Jeff Gauch at October 27, 2012 11:03 PM (N49zT)

373 Current Stennis sailor here. On 11 Sept we were still somewhere in the vicinity of Hawaii, doing flight ops. So no, Adm. Gauette was not relieved for Benghazi.
No idea about the misconduct allegations, though they announced on the 1MC (PA system) that it was an IG investigation, and that announcement was the first I heard about it. I myself, working in Logistics, suspected it was financial related, improper use of funds, but I really don't know. Way above my pay grade.

Posted by: unkownsailor at October 28, 2012 03:24 AM (e88kd)

374 Appreciate your clear-headed analysis on this. We can only progress on substantiated proven arguments, not wishful thinking and conspiracy theories...

Posted by: soopermexican at October 28, 2012 03:36 AM (52BzA)

375 I don't know, of course, but I suspect that I have been personally acquainted with more flag officers of all services than most of the commentators here, including Mr. Drew M.

The ones that I have known run the spectrum from salt of the earth to military genius to junkyard dog to scumbag to total idiot.

But, given the Benghazi situation as described, I cannot imagine that any of them would NOT try something to save those men.

None of the flags that I have ever known or worked for would have done nothing. Some may not have gotten it right; but do nothing? No.

One time the Air Force had a pilot down in Bosnia. Despite slim to zero chances of success, Adm. Smith moved heaven and earth to get that man back. And they did.

Something is very very wrong here. Panetta is lying.

HASC needs to subpoena the Chairman and Gen. Ham and find out exactly what the hell happened and why.

Posted by: VADM (Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Dispatches) at October 28, 2012 07:00 AM (p4U6S)

376 The interesting thing about many conspiracy theories is if they sound logical or appropriate. That is, this story (about General Ham) would not sound consistent with the known pattern of behavior of most other presidents. It does sound consistent with the known pattern of behavior of Barack Obama.

Actually, I would have expected him to dither until the General actually did something and then take the credit if it worked.

Posted by: Sabba Hillel at October 28, 2012 10:18 AM (6M5VX)

377 355 “He who is prudent and lies in wait for an enemy who is not, will be victorious.”
― Sun Tzu, The Art of War

We will kill you in your sleep, on Christmas.
- George Washington.

P.S. Nobody ever surrendered to the Chinese.

Posted by: VADM (Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Dispatches) at October 28, 2012 11:52 AM (p4U6S)

378 Benghazi. Ham replaced. Sometimes the obvious answer is the correct answer.

Posted by: Mr. Khan at October 28, 2012 12:23 PM (6MiMG)

379 Yep. Bangkok. Wall to wall lbfm's. They do nothing for one's judgement.

Posted by: HtP at October 28, 2012 04:19 PM (jx2j9)

380 This looks really bad for Obama, given his known track record. My bet that these military guys made the move, surely not intending to provoke Obama, but they now need to be shut up! Truth will out after elections.

Posted by: padraeg at October 28, 2012 05:01 PM (12XHu)

381 Sorry, too many coincidences here. How often does a carrier group commander get relieved in the middle of a deployment-- in the MidEast? This is something big. Add in the General Ham incident and dozens of very CIA and DoD people upset extremely agitated about the stand down orders, on top of Obama's already very suspicious behavior and we may have coup fears- justifiably so.

You can prattle on about nutty conspiracy theories all you want, but we are sitting on a powder keg. we can only hope the election defuses it by ejecting this toxic faux "President.".

Posted by: GM at October 28, 2012 06:16 PM (9wauV)

382 I know you're not trying covering for Obama on this, but you've made assumptions that have that effect. You say that "the Stennis Carrier group is in the Persian Gulf area....It's nowhere near Libya," but you don't say where in the Persian Gulf they were. IF they were in the northern part of the Gulf, they would have been from 600 to 800 miles away. That would be an easy 90 minute flight for fighters moving at subsonic speed. The attack lasted for four hours. Maps....How do they work?

Posted by: Tom Mannis at October 29, 2012 10:49 AM (tNq7p)

383 Yesterday, I went to vote.. I was met out side the precinct by two obama supporters who asked me to vote for obama.,.I am very upset over the whole obama fantasy, but the bengazi deal has pushed me over the edge..I asked them in a very loud voice, "what do you guys want to do , kill some more navy seals? "" Of course, they started yelling. I then told them they had put a community organizer in as comander in chief and some of the blood was on their hands. They yelled louder. I yelled " Liberal fools and walked off..As I was walking to the buildinganother group of people out side the precinct appaulded me. When I came out they were waiting for me and thanked me for what I had said..We need a sighn at every polling place.
OBAMA=DEAD SEALS

Posted by: capt. Bill at October 30, 2012 10:00 AM (hKBck)

384 You little men sit on here and pretend you have all the answers, pretend that you know what should have been done. Perhaps some of you were in the military. My guess is MOST of you were little fish that spent a lot of time hating guys in charge. Most of you are also the types that think Politics, Sports and Religion are all the same thing. You want your guy to "win" and are willing to say anything to that end. I'm glad you "men" are sitting in your shorts in front of your computers and not on the line some place where real decisions have to be made. It's easy to do what you do. Easier to go vote and yell at someone else who believes differently. This is all a game to you. It's easy to sit in your underpants, scratching your tired, worn-out balls and scream at the President, call him names, write your little posts that hint that you might have some inkling as to what's going on because you were a cook on a tin boat someplace. You have more testosterone than common sense and intelligence. If we are lucky, no one will ever read your pathetic scratchings and you will eventually die as you lived, clawing at what you don't understand.

Posted by: TargetBill at November 03, 2012 09:17 AM (BsY0z)

385 You're a little off on your #'s for Gen. Ham its only been 1 1/2 yrs ( 3/2011 to 8/2012 (if a skunk gets hit in the road it's nose might not work but it still smells)--- so the 2 to 2 1/2 does not jive

Posted by: John at November 05, 2012 09:05 AM (tTidN)

386 Rear Admiral Raeoutte was involved in the cover up of bin Laden! That is the missing link to his sudden dismissal.

Posted by: Maureen at November 22, 2012 12:26 PM (3Uy4y)






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