Radical: For No Reason Except To Punish Cultures He Abhors, Obama Mandates That Catholic Organizations Must Now Pay for Abortions for Their Workers

Elections have consequences. And Eric, I won.

Gershon uses the term "abortifacient" so I'm thinking this mandate doesn't cover surgical abortions, but abortion-inducing drugs such as Plan B.

But Catholics (and most pro-lifers) consider that an abortion (a hard-to-avoid conclusion when "aborti-" is right there at the start of the word).

The president had every opportunity to back down from confrontation. In the recent ­Hosanna-Tabor ruling, a unanimous Supreme Court reaffirmed a broad religious autonomy right rooted in the Constitution. Obama could have taken the decision as justification for retreat.

And it would have been a minor retreat....

But the administration insisted that the University of Notre Dame and St. Mary’s Hospital be forced to pay for the privilege of violating their convictions.

Obama chose to substantially burden a religious belief, by the most intrusive means, for a less-than-compelling state purpose — a marginal increase in access to contraceptives that are easily available elsewhere. The religious exemption granted by Obamacare is narrower than anywhere else in federal law — essentially covering the delivery of homilies and the distribution of sacraments. Serving the poor and healing the sick are regarded as secular pursuits — a determination that would have surprised Christianity’s founder.

Both radicalism and maliciousness are at work in Obama’s decision — an edict delivered with a sneer. It is the most transparently anti-Catholic maneuver by the federal government since the Blaine Amendment was proposed in 1875 — a measure designed to diminish public tolerance of Romanism, then regarded as foreign, authoritarian and illiberal. Modern liberalism has progressed to the point of adopting the attitudes and methods of 19th-century Republican nativists.

But bishops are pledging to defy the law.

At least three Catholic bishops have said they will not comply with the mandate the Obama administration put in place recently in Obamacare that will force religious employers to pay for birth control, contraception and drugs that may cause abortions in their health care plans.

The Anchoress finds a silver lining -- maybe this will unite Catholics.

I don't know what to say except the arrogance is breath-taking. Obama doesn't understand the point of government.

The point of government is to run an orderly house in which a great many people may live together in relative harmony despite sharply disagreeing with each other on many things.

A hotelier, if his goal is to just run a successful hotel, should not care very much if some rooms are rented by Jews, and some by Catholics, and some by atheists; and some by families, and some by pairs of cheatin' spouses.

Only if the hotelier puts his own moralism over the business would he attempt to force his guests to live by his specific rules of life.

Obama is a moralist, and an arrogant one. For all the talk of Christians being rigid moralists, the dirty little secret is that the left is far more rigidly, arrogantly moralistic, and it is cheerleaded by our cultural institutions (media, academia) rather than pushed back against, so its arrogance is encouraged.

Obama is pushing, very hard, a rigid moral system, and attempting to "shove it down the throats" of people who do not seek nor need his moral instruction.

It just happens to be that his code of morality is an unconventional one, borne not in the first century but in the twentieth, and which, when taken to extremes, has included conceptions of sexuality which are essentially Satanic in their license.

Can he make a little space for those who do not rush to embrace his Madonna Moralism?

No. For to do so would be to confess doubt about the Moral Scheme he has in mind for people; it would signal that he's not utterly certain of his own moral beliefs.

And few on the political left have any sense of modesty about any of their culture-changing schemes.

They are so right that of course the coercive power of the state -- with its machinery of stripping away the property and liberty of those who run afoul of it -- should be deployed to wipe out mendicants and heretics.

One of the most cherished rights, never expressed anywhere but truly central to any truly free society, is the right to be Wrong. By which I mean, you should not just be free to do the things which the hegemonic culture deems to be "right." No one ever tries to outlaw that which they themselves believe to be right.

What they attempt to do, of course, is outlaw that which they believe to be wrong.

If you do not respect a citizen's right to be wrong -- if your first impulse is to use the frightening machinery of state coercion to compel him to be "right," as you see "right" -- then you do not respect him at all.

This is the chief character flaw of the leftist movement -- their inability to respect anyone at all but their own. A very provincial and solipisitically childish way to view the world, of course, which leads to a vicious arrogance in attempting to pound, pound, pound square pegs into the round holes the state has cut for them.

The left would just be wrong, and not dangerous, if it weren't so arrogant about disposing of people's freedom with a single thoughtless line of legislation.

It is that, the arrogance and the profound disrespect of anyone who does not wear the feathers and warpaint of their tribe, that makes them not just wrong but sinister.

Posted by: Ace at 12:31 PM



Comments

1 SCOAMF doesn't want anyone punished with a baby.

Summon the meteors. We're doomed.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 31, 2012 12:33 PM (UOM48)

2 This is a boneheaded move by the JEF. It will cost him the election if nothing will.

Posted by: Cast Iron at January 31, 2012 12:34 PM (EL+OC)

3 Look at how the Left treated Santorum's precious baby girl, Bella. The comments were chilling.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 31, 2012 12:34 PM (UOM48)

4 Barack Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable tyrant.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 12:34 PM (8y9MW)

5 I do not discriminate.

Posted by: #SMOD2012 at January 31, 2012 12:34 PM (GBXon)

6
Amazing thing this health care reform.

We all knew it was being done for one reason: To Control Peoples' Lives.

Posted by: soothsayer at January 31, 2012 12:35 PM (sqkOB)

7 Anyone who still thinks the SCOAMT is a practicing Christian/Catholic is lying to themselves.

Posted by: Unclefacts Out Of Commenting Retirement Just For This One Thing at January 31, 2012 12:35 PM (6IReR)

8 Let's see if he'll mandate no "honor killings" by his fellow Muslims.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 31, 2012 12:35 PM (UOM48)

9 TL;DR Version:
Leftists believe that the correct state of Man is one of subjugation to the Authority (be it a Monarchy or some other form of Autocracy). As such, whenever they are elected, they do what they can to further the goal of getting man back to that state.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 12:35 PM (8y9MW)

10 The anti-Obama rally in NY over this was very culturally diverse. Sayun.

Posted by: Cast Iron at January 31, 2012 12:36 PM (EL+OC)

11 Not the three Catholics with whom I work. They voted for Obama and support him still. One of them goes to Mass every week, while the others attend less often. For these three being a Liberal trumps being a Catholic. They support abortion and gay marriage. To hear the one who attends Mass weekly speak in hushed tones about following the Holy Father is bizarre--I guess following those teachings means only following the ones with which he agrees.

Posted by: Will Not Assimilate For Food at January 31, 2012 12:36 PM (kXoT0)

12 Well said, Ace.

Using Obama's standards, we could, in theory, pass a law that requires all public functions to be co-ed and serve pork.


That would be fun, no?
_

Posted by: BumperStickerist at January 31, 2012 12:37 PM (h6mPj)

13 Obama is a moralist, and an arrogant one. For all the talk of Christians being rigid moralists, the dirty little secret is that the left is far more rigidly, arrogantly moralistic, and it is cheerleaded by our cultural institutions (media, academia) rather than pushed back against, so its arrogance is encouraged.
*
This**

Posted by: dananjcon at January 31, 2012 12:37 PM (8ieXv)

14
It's a trap.

Suck the Conservatives into an icky social issues debate.

Posted by: fixerupper at January 31, 2012 12:37 PM (C8hzL)

15 3 Look at how the Left treated Santorum's precious baby girl, Bella. The comments were chilling.
Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 31, 2012 12:34 PM (UOM4
You mean the child who was recently taken to the hospital or the daughter who passed a couple years back?

Posted by: Minnfidel at January 31, 2012 12:37 PM (vqCPH)

16 Obama. What a jackass.

That is all.

Posted by: Jeff B. supports SMOD/Coldcuts '12 at January 31, 2012 12:38 PM (TsYLl)

17 The man and his entire regime are despicable. Utterly devoid of basic moral fiber or a shred of humility. I spit on him and everyone who thinks, acts or believeslike him. *SPIT!*

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit and ABO supporter at January 31, 2012 12:38 PM (4df7R)

18 Let's see if he'll mandate no "honor killings" by his fellow Muslims.

Why would he. That would indicate some reverence for life- which he obviously does not hold.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 12:38 PM (8y9MW)

19 He ain't too bright.

Posted by: dogfish at January 31, 2012 12:38 PM (NuPNl)

20 This is just so politically stupid, coming on the heels of another stupid decision on the Keystone XL pipeline. Axelrod must really think he'll get more votes from single women by throwing them free birth control than he will lose from the entire Catholic Church raining fire on his head.
I've never seen an incumbent so stupid/arrogant in my life. To not find some way to finesse these issues politically in an election year is just idiotic. Obama has just handed his opponents two GIANT issues, which we can use to pretty much define him as an incompetent ideologue, more concerned with the Siera Club and Planned Parenthood than with jobs and freedom.
I am fervently praying that the new Archbishop of Philadelphia defies this order as well, and I suspect he will. This could very well lose Pennsylvania for Obama.

Posted by: rockmom at January 31, 2012 12:39 PM (qE3AR)

21 I thought Teh Precedent issued an executive order about ObamaCare not paying for abortions. Or is that a separate issue.

Posted by: Penfold at January 31, 2012 12:39 PM (1PeEC)

22 Catholic teaching is that contraceptives like the pill are "abortifacients" Ace. For the reason that the pill, even when it does not block ovulation, prevents implantation. So you have a fertilized egg after conception - remember, conception is the point at which life begins - that is prevented from implanting in the uterus and therefore aborted.

That is what the "abortifacient" language is about. It is far more than Plan B.

I say all that as a devote Catholic.

Posted by: DaveW at January 31, 2012 12:39 PM (4w47S)

23 This is a boneheaded move by the JEF. It will cost him the election if nothing will.

Nah; lefties- Catholic or otherwise- will perform the necessary mental gymnastics to convince themselves that this or any other disagreement they might have with Obama is no big deal. Just a distraction or something.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 31, 2012 12:39 PM (SY2Kh)

24 who do not rush to embrace his Madonna Moralism?

A rather unfortunate metaphor there, Ace.

Posted by: weft cut-loop at January 31, 2012 12:40 PM (+Jr2Z)

25 I will give Opie this. He is uniting America ...against him.

Posted by: dogfish at January 31, 2012 12:40 PM (NuPNl)

26 The dude chose to work with, break bread, expose his children to and keep company with cop-killing bombers (Ayers), pedophiles (Jennings), racists (Wright) and twisted, mad scientists (Holdren) -- I hope no one is surprised.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 12:40 PM (WkuV6)

27 How can we not be arrogantly moralistic when we're so very right?

Posted by: libturd at January 31, 2012 12:40 PM (XdlcF)

28 So from in the liberal mind, this separation of Church and State only goes one way?

Posted by: nevergiveup at January 31, 2012 12:41 PM (i6RpT)

29 It's a trap.

If so, it's a piss-poor one. Because this has nothing to do with moral issues, in themselves, it has to do with usurping a long-established right that various religions are to be left alone within their own moral confines.

This is true across the board, more or less, and to make this an issue at all is simply dumb. Too many people "respect" the Catholic Church and don't really agree with forcing them to provide birth control, let alone "abortion drugs."

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 12:41 PM (8y9MW)

30 Zero hasn't just stepped in the shit, he did a triple back flip and finished with a swan dive into it, no splash.

Posted by: maddogg at January 31, 2012 12:41 PM (OlN4e)

31

I thought Teh Precedent issued an executive order about ObamaCare not paying for abortions. Or is that a separate issue.

-------------------------------

Im altering the deal. Pray I dont alter it any further.

Posted by: Darth Obama at January 31, 2012 12:41 PM (C8hzL)

32 hollowpoint, I don't know even the lefties in my inside-the-beltway parish are having a reaction between "why pick on us" and "why, the SCOTUS already slapped you down, they will slap this down, why antagonize them in front of the Obamacare rulings"

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 12:42 PM (WkuV6)

33 I don't know what to say except the arrogance is breath-taking. Obama doesn't understand the point of government.
----------------------

Oh he understand his point with government. He is a communist and not just a communist in the mold of the State shall own and operate all businesses and means of production. He also knows just as many people throughout history have said, you can not implement communism without a dictatorship.

He has taken multiple opportunities to violate the Constitution and thumb his nose at the congress and 75% of the population.

In the end, this will not end well.

Posted by: Vic at January 31, 2012 12:42 PM (YdQQY)

34 Next he'll be mandating that Protestants can't have covered dish suppers unless they're halal.

Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 31, 2012 12:42 PM (UOM48)

35 I believe the correct response by the Catholic institutions in question should be (and I say this with all due respect and grovelling and snivelliness to the office of our God-Emperor) - "eat me, loser. No."

Posted by: tubal at January 31, 2012 12:43 PM (BoE3Z)

36 I am not Catholic. So under Catholic religious doctrine, what contraceptive is acceptable, or is it pull out early only?

Posted by: Penfold at January 31, 2012 12:43 PM (1PeEC)

37 For the next person who wants to claim that socons are the ones wanting the government to impose morality: I offer exhibit A as to the contrary.

Even left-wing Catholics who have supported Obama are furious at the President. I have now heard two homilies on this matter, and most priests go out of their way to avoid politics. This could be a game changer.

I hope.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at January 31, 2012 12:43 PM (Ud5vq)

38 I am fervently praying that the new Archbishop of Philadelphia defies
this order as well, and I suspect he will. This could very well lose
Pennsylvania for Obama.

It think he will. I sincerely hope my parish addresses this issue at Mass this week and every week until the election.

We need an itemized list of every obscene statement, ruling, decision, and scandal this fraud pulled during his first term, like a pocket guide, to remind everyone in the months coming up to the election.

This man is not my president, and I want him thrown out of office, post haste.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at January 31, 2012 12:44 PM (IaoJn)

39 Obama's bumper sticker:
*
I'd rather be fucking with Catholics

Posted by: dananjcon at January 31, 2012 12:44 PM (8ieXv)

40 Holding my breath for a restriction on Islamic congregations, .... turning blue .... going to pass out soon

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 12:44 PM (WkuV6)

41 Oh he understand his point with government. He is a communist and not
just a communist in the mold of the State shall own and operate all
businesses and means of production. He also knows just as many people
throughout history have said, you can not implement communism without a
dictatorship.


What he said.

Look, Liberals believe that man needs to be Controlled; that only a select few (who, magically, all seem to end up in government) can be trusted to think for themselves and act in "the common good." And so your liberty must be removed. For the common good.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 12:44 PM (8y9MW)

42
What I don't understand is why the Court is taking it's sweet time hearing all these suits against Obamacare.

Posted by: soothsayer at January 31, 2012 12:45 PM (sqkOB)

43 Bwahaha Notre Dame.




Posted by: befuddled at January 31, 2012 12:45 PM (xJU23)

44 The left has found their Messiah and heretics must be punished.

Posted by: Dr Spank at January 31, 2012 12:45 PM (Sh42X)

45 28 So from in the liberal mind, this separation of Church and State only goes one way?

Posted by: nevergiveup at January 31, 2012 12:41 PM (i6RpT)

In the leftist liberal mindset, EVERYTHING only goes one way. Because anything to goes counter to what they believe is immediately Wrong, and therefore Invalid.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit and ABO supporter at January 31, 2012 12:45 PM (4df7R)

46 Gershon uses the term "abortifacient" so I'm thinking this mandate doesn't cover surgical abortions, but abortion-inducing drugs such as Plan B.

--------

I'm thinking it's a typo for "abortifascist".

Posted by: Anachronda at January 31, 2012 12:45 PM (NmR1a)

47 Damn well said Ace! Oh for one of the candidates to articulate this...slam dunk!

Posted by: ABO at January 31, 2012 12:45 PM (MbeEN)

48 or is it pull out early only?

Yeah, pretty much.

(Cue number from "Meaning of Life" in 3...2...1...)

Posted by: DarkLord©, Rogue Commenter at January 31, 2012 12:45 PM (GBXon)

49
brb, persecutin Christians


Posted by: lolobama at January 31, 2012 12:46 PM (sqkOB)

50 For these three being a Liberal trumps being a
Catholic. They support abortion and gay marriage. To hear the one who
attends Mass weekly speak in hushed tones about following the Holy
Father is bizarre--I guess following those teachings means only
following the ones with which he agrees.


Posted by: Will Not Assimilate For Food at January 31, 2012 12:36 PM (kXoT0)

Yeah, I have an uncle like that. Complete lack of self awareness.One minute he'll claim that it's un-Christian to be Republican because we "only care about the rich" and voting Dem is helping the poor, but bring up abortion and it's suddently "woman's right to choose!!!"

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 31, 2012 12:46 PM (SY2Kh)

51 So when is the Pope going to show up, smack down Barry, and make him jealous of the cool hats?

Posted by: BlueFalcon in Boston *now with accuracy approved by Blue Hen* at January 31, 2012 12:46 PM (ijjAe)

52
brb, wipin my ass with the "Freedom of Religion" clause in the Constitution

Posted by: lolobama at January 31, 2012 12:46 PM (sqkOB)

53 Excellent article, Ace. Also, the article you linked to at podles.org... wow. Intellectually, I know that this debauchery goes on, but it never fails to shock me to actually see it documented, and how shamelessly the Left embraces it.

What a chilling world we live in.

Posted by: Kinley Ardal at January 31, 2012 12:46 PM (EEcH7)

54 I have now heard two homilies on this matter, and most priests go out of their way to avoid politics. This could be a game changer Our fairly liberal pastor even worked it into the ceremony for first penance a few weeks back, and the school sent a note to all parents about it.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 12:46 PM (WkuV6)

55 This is true across the board, more or less, and to make this an issue
at all is simply dumb. Too many people "respect" the Catholic Church and
don't really agree with forcing them to provide birth control, let
alone "abortion drugs."


Agreed. This is a happy turn of events and I hope the USCCB stands together on this. It has a chance to schism the church away from the socialist left. The Church has lost a lot of cred since the pedo scandals. Now Obama is giving them the opportunity to rehabilitate their image in the US by taking a moral stand against government overreach into their charitable institutions. It will highlight the good the church does, all the different organizations they fund and operate, and place the Church on the moral opposite side of the rabid left who should start screeching in 3...2...

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at January 31, 2012 12:47 PM (0q2P7)

56 It's not a "moral system". It's amoral, political, radical, and clearly intent on destroying what little remains of the existing moral order in this society.

You protest Too Little........

Posted by: SantaRosaStan at January 31, 2012 12:47 PM (UqKQV)

57 I know! We'll have Obama speak at the next commencement ceremony. Then He'll be sure to see things our way.

Posted by: The Deacon of Notre Dame at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (8ieXv)

58 Ace, sometimes when you take a break from being snarky and grumpy, you manage to find the time to be profound.

Good job.

(Though the snarky and grumpy is fun, too.)

Posted by: Democrats at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (Xqfwb)

59 For a man who claims not to be particularly faithful, Ace, you have a heart for it and an ear for it. You are in tune with it, and you find just the right words that express the issues that matter in regards to it.

Thanks for this wonderful post.

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (P6QsQ)

60 And yet....people scoffed at Perry, when he used the phrase "Obama's war on Christianity". ......It makes me thinkthat most people really don't like to hear The Truth spoken in a direct way....they seem to want it fed to them, softly, on cat feet.

Posted by: wheatie at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (UOOK1)

61 . So under Catholic religious doctrine, what contraceptive is acceptable, or is it pull out early only?

Actually coitus interuptus is also a no-no. There is no accepted form of contraception. Natural family planning (a much more scientific version of the rhythm method) is the only acceptable away to space the number of kids.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (Ud5vq)

62 @ 14 It's a trap.
...
If so, then it's a durn good one. Nothing wrong with talking about social issues, even though the liberaltarian types don't like to hear about them. Buck up and put some big boy pants on, people.

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (+inic)

63
The Catholic church in the U.S. is a lot like the NRA and Newt.

They all take a good game, but in the end they acquiesce to big government and give up a their core principles.

Posted by: soothsayer at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (sqkOB)

64 39
Obama's bumper sticker:

*

I'd rather be fucking with over Catholics

Posted by: dananjcon at January 31, 2012 12:44 PM (8ieXv)


FIFY

Posted by: Unclefacts Out Of Commenting Retirement Just For This One Thing at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (6IReR)

65

36
I am not Catholic. So under Catholic religious doctrine, what contraceptive is acceptable, or is it pull out early only?



No contraceptive but the rhythm method. Once you stick it in, you gotta finish the business. No condoms allowed.

Am I a bad Catholic? Sometimes.



Posted by: imp at January 31, 2012 12:49 PM (414Gp)

66 The energy at the grassroots level is all generated by average Americans becoming increasingly fed up with elites who keep telling us that we're stupid for believing in God, or patriotism, or the family, or marriage, or even such garden-variety ideas such as people should work for the money they get, people shouldn't live beyond their means, people who pay their bills on time and in full should be rewarded, and people who don't should be punished, and that having a budget and sticking to it, with income and spending in balance, is the bare minimum we should expect from our government. This fiat from Obama against the most basic beliefs of tens of millions of Catholics is just one more instance of why ordinary people who otherwise wouldn't care about politics are so enraged.

Unfortunately, it may be that we're about to nominate a candidate (Romney)who reeks of elitism -- wealth, Harvard, investment banking, etc. It doesn't mean that he'll be a bad candidate. It just means that we're missing the boat. If we had a candidate who could argue against elites (and Obamacare), we'd be in a much better position.

Posted by: The Regular Guy at January 31, 2012 12:49 PM (qHCyt)

67 Catholic teaching is that contraceptives like the pill are
"abortifacients" Ace. For the reason that the pill, even when it does
not block ovulation, prevents implantation. So you have a fertilized egg
after conception - remember, conception is the point at which life
begins - that is prevented from implanting in the uterus and therefore
aborted.

That is what the "abortifacient" language is about. It is far more than Plan B.

I say all that as a devote Catholic.
*** **** *** **** *** **** *** ****
OK then, never mind. He only wants to force the Catholic church to pay for contraceptives. No big deal. Obviously the government should be able to dictate how a religious organization spends its money. In fact, give me one good reason why B'nai B'rith shouldn't be forced to buy pork cracklin's for their employees.

Posted by: Gristle Encased Head at January 31, 2012 12:49 PM (+lsX1)

68 36 I am not Catholic. So under Catholic religious doctrine, what contraceptive is acceptable, or is it pull out early only?

Posted by: Penfold at January 31, 2012 12:43 PM (1PeEC)


According to what I've read in various places, I believe the Rhythm Method is a common mode of contraception in devout Catholic households. But I'm not Catholic either, so that's purely anecdotal on my part.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit and ABO supporter at January 31, 2012 12:49 PM (4df7R)

69 Thanks for the info. I could have asked my dad, who is essentially a born again Catholic, but not really a conversation to have with him.

Posted by: Penfold at January 31, 2012 12:50 PM (1PeEC)

70 Hopefully Romney can make it so they only have to pay half.

Posted by: runninrebel at January 31, 2012 12:50 PM (RiKcH)

71 Vic-

Nothing ends well, otherwise it wouldn't end.

Posted by: ycrt at January 31, 2012 12:50 PM (yasiH)

72
And that shithead Mitt Romney is out there waxing nostalgic about America the beautiful and fruited plains and corn stalks.

Way to connect with the people on the issues, numbnuts.

Posted by: soothsayer at January 31, 2012 12:50 PM (sqkOB)

73 @ 68 According to what I've read in various places, I believe the Rhythm Method is a common mode of contraception in devout Catholic households. But I'm not Catholic either, so that's purely anecdotal on my part.
...
I hear Barry White's very popular for this.

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at January 31, 2012 12:50 PM (+inic)

74 Headline:
Two of America's most powerful religions clash, Catholics versus Obamabots. News at 11.

Posted by: joeindc44 - tebow's new lifting coach at January 31, 2012 12:51 PM (QxSug)

75 I sincerely hope that SCOAMF is never punished with a grandchild. The world can't handle any more of his DNA.


Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 31, 2012 12:51 PM (UOM48)

76 Another reason why people who claim they won't vote for the R candidate if it isn't their R candidate drive me insane with rage.

Posted by: kathysaysso at January 31, 2012 12:51 PM (ZtwUX)

77 hollowpoint, I don't know even the lefties in my inside-the-beltway
parish are having a reaction between "why pick on us" and "why, the
SCOTUS already slapped you down, they will slap this down, why
antagonize them in front of the Obamacare rulings"





Yeah, but they'll still pull the lever for Obama come November. At best this sort of thing might reduce turnout, but realistically it'll be forgotten long before November.

And to be fair (Devil's Advocate hat: on), we on the right do the same thing to some extent. How many of us (raises hand) voted for GWB in 2004 despite disagreeing with him on spending, amnesty, etc?

Posted by: Hollowpoint at January 31, 2012 12:51 PM (SY2Kh)

78 We don't really use the rhythm method anymore. As I said, NFP is a bit like the rhythm method, but it involves a lit more rigor. I could go into it, but involves checking vaginal mucous - and people might be on their lunch break.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at January 31, 2012 12:52 PM (Ud5vq)

79 I'm thinking it's a typo for "abortifascist".

Posted by: Anachronda at January 31, 2012 12:45 PM (NmR1a)


The problem for the left is they're not only choosing to "abortafascist," but also to "abortacommie," "abortamarxist," "abortamaoist," etc, etc.

They'll abort themselves into extinction, the soulless bastards. And good riddance.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit and ABO supporter at January 31, 2012 12:52 PM (4df7R)

80 We are religious too!

Reach out and stone someone!

Posted by: Muslim Gay Outreach Assoc. at January 31, 2012 12:52 PM (Usk3+)

81 Next he'll be mandating that Protestants can't have covered dish suppers unless they're halal.
He'll ban them unlessthey meet Mrs. Obama's strict nutritional guidelines and are prepared in a kitchen meeting Health Dept requirements.

Posted by: Lily at January 31, 2012 12:53 PM (9LMu9)

82 75 I sincerely hope that SCOAMF is never punished with a grandchild. The world can't handle any more of his DNA.
Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 31, 2012 12:51 PM (UOM4
*
I could...IYKWIMAITYD.

Posted by: Chris Mathews at January 31, 2012 12:53 PM (8ieXv)

83 Wheatie I think people can be divided into the SMOD party and the cat feet party.

Posted by: Mama AJ at January 31, 2012 12:53 PM (XdlcF)

84 For young men, the rhythm method has little to do with contraception.

Posted by: Dr Spank at January 31, 2012 12:53 PM (Sh42X)

85 The scariest aspect of this is how mind numbingly bad the timing is.

Has this guy given up on re-election or is he this arrogantly out of touch with the electorate?

Without even getting into any moralizing over this, we have ourselves one seriously pathological fuckhead as precedent.

I thought that I was over being shocked by the audacity of this dope.

Posted by: ontherocks at January 31, 2012 12:53 PM (ZJCDy)

86 According to what I've read in various places, I believe the Rhythm
Method is a common mode of contraception in devout Catholic households.


Calling it a 'contraceptive method' is rather like referring to Band-Aids as 'a key part of the surgeon's toolkit'.

Posted by: DarkLord©, Rogue Commenter at January 31, 2012 12:53 PM (GBXon)

87 Coming soon to an Amerika near you!

The One Child Policy!!

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 12:53 PM (P6QsQ)

88

"rhythym method" is just easier for people to understand, Paul. It's OK to use as a shorthand.

Basically there are times you can't stick it in.

Posted by: imp at January 31, 2012 12:54 PM (414Gp)

89 This isn't even just about making the Catholic Church pay for contraceptives and morning-after abortions, either. It's about the U.S. government officially declaring that pregnancy is a disease. That is the only rationale for mandating free contraceptives.

Think about that, and the implications of it. This should offend everyone, not just Catholics.

Posted by: rockmom at January 31, 2012 12:54 PM (NYnoe)

90 All Heil!!!!!!

OBAMA!!!!!

I wonder if he's been reading or watching stuff about Stalin or Hitler and just wants to be part of the club? I've never seen anything like this. This man is a TYRANT! If he'll do this, he'll put evangelicals in camps.... if his limp wristed supporters COULD, that is.. haha try it asshole!

Oh, and fuck you

Posted by: What a Jerk at January 31, 2012 12:54 PM (bcmD0)

91 68
36 I am not Catholic. So under Catholic religious doctrine, what contraceptive is acceptable, or is it pull out early only?

Anecdotal disclaimer - most of my Catholic friends use birth control pills, condoms, and spermicidal foams. They keep hoping, (the guys at least) for some dispensation thingy by the head office promoting more blowjobs and butt-sex.
Go figure.

Posted by: tubal at January 31, 2012 12:54 PM (BoE3Z)

92 36 I am not Catholic. So under Catholic religious doctrine, what contraceptive is acceptable, or is it pull out early only?



Posted by: Penfold at January 31, 2012 12:43 PM (1PeEC)


The rhythm method, as others have suggested. But by far the best method of Catholic contraception is a single aspirin.


Held firmly between her knees.

Posted by: NC Ref at January 31, 2012 12:54 PM (lLKjJ)

93 Yeah, but they'll still pull the lever for Obama come November. At best
this sort of thing might reduce turnout, but realistically it'll be
forgotten long before November.


Many of them, true. But depressed turnout could be the difference in another SCOAMT presidency and a Mittens or Newt presidency. And, if the Catholic Church says "vote against Obama," there are a good number of Catholics who will obey.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 12:54 PM (8y9MW)

94 Without even getting into any moralizing over this, we have ourselves one seriously pathological fuckhead as precedent.

Over/under on OD'ing in office?

Posted by: DarkLord©, Rogue Commenter at January 31, 2012 12:54 PM (GBXon)

95 78 We don't really use the rhythm method anymore. As I said, NFP is a bit like the rhythm method, but it involves a lit more rigor. I could go into it, but involves checking vaginal mucous - and people might be on their lunch break.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at January 31, 2012 12:52 PM (Ud5vq)


I'm pretty sure any mention of mucus - vaginal or otherwise -- is more or less going to ruin everyone's appetite for the rest of the day, lunch or no lunch.

But nonetheless, thank you for the information!

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit and ABO supporter at January 31, 2012 12:55 PM (4df7R)

96 "rhythym method" is just easier for people to understand, Paul. It's OK to use as a shorthand."

Works for me.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at January 31, 2012 12:55 PM (Ud5vq)

97 This Obama fella, he impresses me.

Posted by: Peggy Sanger at January 31, 2012 12:55 PM (EL+OC)

98


More to the point, this is not so much an attack on the Church as a means to destroy private charity. Once the mediating institutions of private charity are gone, only the government can help.


Posted by: imp at January 31, 2012 12:55 PM (414Gp)

99 Consider Catholicism’s most prominent academic leader, the Rev. John Jenkins, president of Notre Dame. Jenkins took a serious risk in sponsoring Obama’s 2009 honorary degree and commencement address — which promised a “sensible” approach to the conscience clause. Jenkins now complains, “This is not the kind of ‘sensible’ approach the president had in mind when he spoke here.” Obama has made Jenkins — and other progressive Catholic allies — look easily duped. In retrospect -- http://minx.cc/?post=285946

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 12:56 PM (WkuV6)

100 "When you become a Democrat, this is your religion." --Nancy Pelosi

Posted by: befuddled at January 31, 2012 12:56 PM (xJU23)

101
I'll sum it up then - it is a belief in utopianism
That the government is right and those who have contrary views are not just wrong but inherently evil and must have their beliefs crushed while the government's view shoved down their throats by any means. This scares me as to what it could mean for all our other faiths.

Posted by: Defector at January 31, 2012 12:56 PM (rLDM0)

102 Mussolini was a Leninist reformer who wanted to bring back the glory of the Roman Empire.
Barack Obama is a sophomoric Marxist who wants to bring back the morality of the Roman Empire.

Posted by: The Terminally Boned at January 31, 2012 12:57 PM (+6ZZN)

103 I hope he doesn't cave on this issue and then become the hero of the damn Papists.

Posted by: Peggy Sanger at January 31, 2012 12:57 PM (EL+OC)

104 and here http://minx.cc/?post=287391

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 12:57 PM (WkuV6)

105 Once the mediating institutions of private charity are gone, only the government can help.

And once "only the government can help" those who require help are subjects, not citizens.

This is also the prime driver behind ObamaCare, for what it's worth.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 12:57 PM (8y9MW)

106 Notice how this shit doesn't go into effect until after the election.....I'm sure by total coincidence

Posted by: Mr Pink at January 31, 2012 12:58 PM (KxqFb)

107 83 .....Wheatie I think people can be divided into the SMOD party and the cat feet party.
.
Heh. ....I think you're right, MamaAJ.

Posted by: wheatie at January 31, 2012 12:58 PM (UOOK1)

108 best post by Ace in months, IMO, if not over a year. excellently (brilliantly?) written. so well said.

well played sir.

Posted by: Vergeltung at January 31, 2012 12:58 PM (jttPx)

109 Does anyone think for one minute that King Putt and his minion Kathleen "Reeducation Camps" Sibelius would ever have issued thisdiktathad the target been muslim institutions?

Posted by: Natasha at January 31, 2012 12:58 PM (jU5uf)

110 I'm sure a lot of the morons are probably not checking religious blogs, especially Catholic ones, on a regular basis. But this has animated us to a degree that no other issue has. I'm sure there will be liberal "Catholics" who continue to ignore what Obama is doing, but there are guys like Michael Sean Winters - probably one of the more prominent Catholic lefties - who have basically told the president to drop dead over this.

If there is one thing that will make me vote for the GOP nominee regardless of who it is, it will be this issue.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at January 31, 2012 12:58 PM (Ud5vq)

111 If only abortion had been legal in 1960 we would've been spared this clown.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at January 31, 2012 12:58 PM (oCGHw)

112 the feathers and warpaint of their tribe

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACIIIIIIIIIIIIIIST!

Posted by: weew at January 31, 2012 12:58 PM (ElfHn)

113 My vote for Ace's best-written post ever.

Posted by: troyriser at January 31, 2012 12:58 PM (vtiE6)

114 Over/under on OD'ing in office?

Posted by: DarkLord©, Rogue Commenter at January 31, 2012 12:54 PM (GBXon)


Have we come to a consensus yet on whether he's a meth addict or a cokehead? My money's on the latter. He just looks too healthy to be a tweaker.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit and ABO supporter at January 31, 2012 12:59 PM (4df7R)

115 Next he'll be mandating that Protestants can't have covered dish suppers unless they're halal.
- - - - -

Regulation of jello salad is the hill to die on.

Posted by: WalrusRex at January 31, 2012 12:59 PM (Hx5uv)

116 men.....if you don't want a child.....don't stick it in while your chick is ovulating.....

Posted by: phoenixgirl at work at January 31, 2012 12:59 PM (mfbqu)

117 I have serious, serious misgivings about the use of Plan B in the first place. The young girls who are taking this do not comprehend that these aren't chicklets and that there can be significant problems with repeated use. The use of Plan B is seen as fairlycommonplace and no big deal. Hell, there's a movie out there right now called The Pill about a guy sticking around after a one night stand for the express purpose of making sure the girl takes the second dose.

I can't discuss the issues of religious freedom without wanting to start screaming.

SMOD. Right the hell now.

(As an aside, there are no words for how happy the HQ's adoption of SMOD makes me)

Posted by: alexthechick at January 31, 2012 12:59 PM (VtjlW)

118 Regulation of jello salad is the hill to die on.

If not that, then regulation of fried chicken.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 01:00 PM (8y9MW)

119 I wouldn't be surprised if this were part of a larger move to force religious institutions out of healthcare entirely. If this decision is somehow upheld by the courts, then the logical recourse for these organizations would be to drop health insurance for their employees. Many or most of those would likely end up on Obamacare. Furthermore, if this were upheld then we're just a hop, skip, and a jump away from the government telling Catholic hospitalsthat they mustperform abortions, which would likely cause them to close their doors.

Posted by: Ghost of Lee Atwater at January 31, 2012 01:00 PM (JxMoP)

120 I thought Teh Precedent issued an executive order about ObamaCare not paying for abortions. Or is that a separate issue.

He lied.

Posted by: Joe Wilson at January 31, 2012 01:01 PM (F+Xfj)

121
Girls can't get pregnant if they have sex while standing on their heads.

Posted by: soothsayer's less than accurate biological advice at January 31, 2012 01:01 PM (sqkOB)

122 This is a head-scratcher from a political perspective. PA and FL both have large Catholic populations, and I'm betting that there are smaller but still substantial numbers of Catholics in OH. You've just pissed off a lot of people in states you need to carry. Why? Why didn't his campaign people slap this down hard? I don't get it.

(Oh, and "mendicant"? It means "begging." As in "mendicant friars.")

Posted by: joncelli, too stressed by half at January 31, 2012 01:01 PM (RD7QR)

123 "rhythym method" is just easier for people to understand, Paul. It's OK to use as a shorthand."



Works for me.


It doesn't for me. Rhythm is notoriously unreliable. And that is used as a bludgeon against NFP in that detractors claim over and over again that the Catholic Church doesn't allow some form of actually workable reliable birth control, citing Rhythm method reliabilities over and over again despite the fact that NFP the method actually used compares favorably with any other method once you learn it.

So I HATE it when I hear someone call Catholic birth control Rhythm, it is just someone parroting what the left has told them and furthering a meme that NFP is unreliable by insisting on calling it something else.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at January 31, 2012 01:01 PM (0q2P7)

124 THIS

THIS is why Government can NOT be the provider of health care. THIS is why we must fight against any form of Obamacare - because as soon as the Government is in charge of your "health", and they get to dictate what constitutes "health" - you are at their mercy. They own you. They own your body and your beliefs do not matter any longer. They are the ones who will dictate your most intimate moments. They are the ones who will dictate your conscience. They will dictate the means by which your children will or will not come into the world. They have decided that their is no more need for your God, they will take His place.

They are fashioning themselves into their own idols and mandating that we submit our personal theologies to theirs, and kneel at their feet.


Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 01:01 PM (P6QsQ)

125 Guys -- I am a Catholic capital C. Not the small c kind like Pelosi or Sebelius.
This is an attack on freedom and liberty and right to conscious. Check the first amendment to the constitution. Freedom of religion. Check what is also in that amendment. Freedom of Speech and Press. Those are next.
This is an attack on all of us. Catholics happen to be first in line.

Posted by: newguy40 at January 31, 2012 01:02 PM (kduZC)

126 This guy's a fucking genius!

Posted by: David Frum at January 31, 2012 01:02 PM (F6KtL)

127 Ace, I wish to commend you for this fine, upstanding post! You truly are an officer and a gentleman of the finest order and magnitude. I daresay, your finest work ever, though the greatest among the great. You are the clarissimus maximus of our side in the blogosphere!

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at January 31, 2012 01:02 PM (+inic)

128 I wouldn't be surprised if this were part of a larger move to force religious institutions out of healthcare entirely.

Not just healthcare, all charity. The "no covered dish luncheons" was probably a joke (well, partially) but I have no doubts that he'll start trying to hold benevolence pantries and church-run thrift-stores to the same standards as commercial kitchens/grocery stores and department stores (respectively), just as soon as he thinks he can get away with it.

I'll say it again: their goal is the subjugation of the People.

Posted by: AllenG (Dedicated Tenther) Team Meteor. Now with Cheesecake at January 31, 2012 01:03 PM (8y9MW)

129 The blue collar Pennsylvania Catholics are not going to be amused.


Posted by: mpfs at January 31, 2012 01:03 PM (iYbLN)

130 Not Catholic or any other form of Christian. But I definitely stand with them on this one.

The statists must subjugate all faiths.

Posted by: esch at January 31, 2012 01:03 PM (fZr9T)

131 The Great Uniter.

Posted by: garrett at January 31, 2012 01:03 PM (Vu6tR)

132 From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

Periodic continence, that is, the methods of birth regulation based on self-observation and the use of infertile periods, is in conformity with the objective criteria of morality.158 These methods respect the bodies of the spouses, encourage tenderness between them, and favor the education of an authentic freedom. In contrast, "every action which, whether in anticipation of the conjugal act, or in its accomplishment, or in the development of its natural consequences, proposes, whether as an end or as a means, to render procreation impossible" is intrinsically evil:159



Thus the innate language that expresses the total reciprocal self-giving of husband and wife is overlaid, through contraception, by an objectively contradictory language, namely, that of not giving oneself totally to the other. This leads not only to a positive refusal to be open to life but also to a falsification of the inner truth of conjugal love, which is called upon to give itself in personal totality. ... The difference, both anthropological and moral, between contraception and recourse to the rhythm of the cycle ... involves in the final analysis two irreconcilable concepts of the human person and of human sexuality.


The point is, Mr. Obama, that this isn't just some knee-jerk, conservative, weird, fascistic attitude that the Catholic Church adopted just out of meanness. It comes from deep consideration by some very intelligent, thoughtful people over thousands of years about what it means to be married and what the purpose of human sexuality is. You might disagree. But it's the unthinking dismissal of the legitimacy of Catholic beliefs that has the bishops (and, soon, regular Catholics all over America) enraged. This will really cost Obama in states like Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, etc., i.e., where there is a heavy concentration of old-school Catholics.

Posted by: The Regular Guy at January 31, 2012 01:03 PM (qHCyt)

133 His internal polling must be terrible. The only reason to do this is to get his base up from the couch and off the bong. It won't be implemented, he just lost 9-0 on this issue, why piss of potential voters -- because he needs the give the base some raw meat. And, bashing papists is good, not as good as jew kicking, but OK.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 01:04 PM (WkuV6)

134 I let the guy shower my titties with his hot stuff!

Posted by: Megan McCain at January 31, 2012 01:04 PM (F6KtL)

135 i'm sorry.....but jello salad is not the hill to die on.....jello salad is the worst thing ever.....and don't think you protestants are the only people to have it at your church functions.......us catholics have had to suffer with it at every God Damn potluck and family function since it's invention.........i distinctly remember my gram and grandaunt explaining what fruits you must never put in your jello salad if you want it to set properly

Posted by: phoenixgirl at work at January 31, 2012 01:04 PM (mfbqu)

136 So I HATE it when I hear someone call Catholic birth control Rhythm, it is just someone parroting what the left has told them and furthering a meme that NFP is unreliable by insisting on calling it something else.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at January 31, 2012 01:01 PM (0q2P7)


I think it's less people parroting and more people not having ever heard "NFP" or knowing what it means. That's me in a nutshell. *shrug* Either way, the point of NFP or the less scientific "rhythm" method appears to be abstaining from sex during the time a woman is ovulating. The former is simply much more accurate, I assume, than the latter.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit and ABO supporter at January 31, 2012 01:04 PM (4df7R)

137 This is an attack on all of us. Catholics happen to be first in line.



Posted by: newguy40


Usually it's my people.

Posted by: mpfs, Joo at January 31, 2012 01:04 PM (iYbLN)

138 Why? Why didn't his campaign people slap this down hard? I don't get it.

(Oh, and "mendicant"? It means "begging." As in "mendicant friars.")


I don't think he expected the notoriously liberal USCCB to actually take a stand against him.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at January 31, 2012 01:04 PM (0q2P7)

139 Here is barrys end game,

Only the government and its leftist minions should be in charge of or distributing charity.

All of this plays towards the larger leftist end game, statism and the marginalization of anything not controlled by the government or its willing aparatus on the left.

In other words zero wants no competition to his church, the church of government

Posted by: rumcrook at January 31, 2012 01:04 PM (HfJVN)

140 Excellent article, Ace. Also, the article you linked
to at podles.org... wow. Intellectually, I know that this debauchery
goes on, but it never fails to shock me to actually see it documented,
and how shamelessly the Left embraces it.

What a chilling world we live in.



Posted by: Kinley Ardal at January 31, 2012 12:46 PM (EEcH7)

***************************
No wonder Sandusky fit in so well on a university campus.

Posted by: Captain Hate at January 31, 2012 01:05 PM (z5C1s)

141 Bunch of malcontents clinging bitterly to their guns, Bibles, and children.

Posted by: Pope Obama at January 31, 2012 01:05 PM (Hx5uv)

142
Obamacare is the quickest way for the Left to CONTROL what you EAT, what you DRIVE, how much you SPEND, and what you BELIEVE.


Posted by: soothsayer at January 31, 2012 01:05 PM (sqkOB)

143 Brilliant, Ace. You're a modern day Thomas Paine.

If Thomas Paine was a disgusting little furry thing with an unseemly penchant for humping other peoples' garbage, that is.

Posted by: al-Cicero, Tea Party Jihadist at January 31, 2012 01:05 PM (QKKT0)

144
oh, and CONTROL when you DIE

Posted by: soothsayer at January 31, 2012 01:05 PM (sqkOB)

145 137
This is an attack on all of us. Catholics happen to be first in line.






Posted by: newguy40


Usually it's my people.


Posted by: mpfs, Joo at January 31, 2012 01:04 PM (iYbLN)




Don't forget us.

Posted by: the crackahs at January 31, 2012 01:06 PM (UOM48)

146

So I HATE it when I hear someone call
Catholic birth control Rhythm, it is just someone parroting what the
left has told them and furthering a meme that NFP is unreliable by
insisting on calling it something else.



Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative

******* ********* ********* ******

Or, Mike, it's a semi-devout Catholic (my one "cafeteria" sin, I admit) who doesn't find the phrase "rhythym method" to be some sort of slur denoting terrible unreliability, and would rather not talk about mucous.

Thanks.

Posted by: imp at January 31, 2012 01:06 PM (414Gp)

147 The former is simply much more accurate, I assume, than the latter.

Yeah you could make the same argument for the calling a diaphram a condom because they are both physical barriers. That happen to do the same thing in a very different way.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at January 31, 2012 01:06 PM (0q2P7)

148 As a libertarian, I'm always amused by the Rights outrage, when someone from the left tries to use Goverment power to coerce them into somthing...

The same Right who constantly uses Government power, to coerce people into doing what THEY want...

Please explain how this is any different, than sponsoring a Consitutional Amendment to tell people who they can Marry? or telling a State they can't Legalize Marajuana? or creating the mechanism to search us all at Airports?

Its the POWER that corrupts... it really does not matter who is making the rules, they should not have the Power to do so on a free people.

Posted by: Romeo13 at January 31, 2012 01:06 PM (lZBBB)

149 Next move, FWS is going to send in armed raid teams to save the snakes from abuse in Alabama.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 01:07 PM (WkuV6)

150
Uh.....didn't the Catholic Church come out recently with a condemnation of "Black Liberation Theology"....? Or did I dream that.

Posted by: wheatie at January 31, 2012 01:07 PM (UOOK1)

151 Yeah, you fuckers thought you were untouchable from me. Think again my bitches. Separation of church and state means you cannot be separate from me. Owned.

Posted by: ObamaCare at January 31, 2012 01:07 PM (F6KtL)

152 but I have no doubts that he'll start trying to hold benevolence pantries and church-run thrift-stores to the same standards as commercial kitchens/grocery stores and department stores (respectively), just as soon as he thinks he can get away with it.This reminds me of that new food safety proposal (or is it a law?) that applied industrial standards to farmers markets and home gardens.
You might just be right about this.

Posted by: Ghost of Lee Atwater at January 31, 2012 01:07 PM (JxMoP)

153 OBAMA 2012:
Takin' it to the babies before the babies bring it to us.

Posted by: reason at January 31, 2012 01:07 PM (V40IZ)

154 If the Church is to remain faithful to its principles, won't they be forced to close the Catholic hospitals? That would be Armegeddon in healthcare.

Posted by: Rodent Liberation Front at January 31, 2012 01:07 PM (lgw0N)

155 Barack Hussein Obama is a stuttering clusterf*ck of a miserable tyrant.

I do not denounce myself.

Posted by: Alte Schule at January 31, 2012 01:08 PM (MLJu8)

156 This is, after all, the only guy in the Ill. Senate that thought its cool to let an abortion survivor just die in a closet. A cold, cold heart beats in this SCOAMF

Posted by: Schwalbe: The Me-262© at January 31, 2012 01:08 PM (UU0OF)

157 Catholics and Jews will still overwhelming vote for the JEF

Posted by: Velvet Ambition at January 31, 2012 01:08 PM (mFxQX)

158
Barack Smeagol is devoid of any human feelings, he just wants the ring.

The citizens elected a emotionally stunted child who will stop at nothing to make everyone pay for his abandonment by his parents.

Posted by: Guy Mohawk, team smod recruit at January 31, 2012 01:08 PM (XrrP7)

159 It's about the U.S. government officially declaring that pregnancy is a disease. That is the only rationale for mandating free contraceptives. Think about that, and the implications of it. This should offend everyone, not just Catholics.

Personally, I've always thought of pregnancy as more of a parasitic infestation...

Posted by: reason, back when he was single, at January 31, 2012 01:09 PM (V40IZ)

160 imp -- viscosity and temperature, are important to shade tree auto mechanics and fathers of five.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 01:09 PM (WkuV6)

161 This was a surpassingly great post, and hits the nail squarely on the head. Modern leftists are more vigorously and maliciously censorious than any Victorian ever was. Their preaching is loveless and vile.

Posted by: Reactionary at January 31, 2012 01:09 PM (xUM1Q)

162

the only guy in the Ill. Senate that thought its cool to let an abortion survivor just die in a closet.

How this didn't trip EVERYONE's alarm bells (everyone not brainwashed by PP, that is), I'll never understand.

Posted by: imp at January 31, 2012 01:09 PM (414Gp)

163
noodle post up

Posted by: soothsayer at January 31, 2012 01:09 PM (sqkOB)

164 34
Next he'll be mandating that Protestants can't have covered dish suppers unless they're halal.


Posted by: Jane D'oh at January 31, 2012 12:42 PM (UOM4

Goodness. That makes me very upset. I think I'll make some jello.

Posted by: Lutheran Church Ladies at January 31, 2012 01:10 PM (RD7QR)

165 "The same Right who constantly uses Government power, to coerce people into doing what THEY want... "

Ahh, here we go. Vague sentiment of outrage based on absolutely no evidence.

"Please explain how this is any different, than sponsoring a Consitutional Amendment to tell people who they can Marry?"

I didn't realize that's what the amendment did. You mean to tell me that two individuals, as it stands today, don't have the right to live together as husband and husband? Oh, that's right, they do. But you want government to sanction that union. So it's actually you who wants to use the government in order to promote a particular version of morality.

Posted by: Paul Zummo at January 31, 2012 01:10 PM (Ud5vq)

166 Uh.....didn't the Catholic Church come out recently with a condemnation of "Black Liberation Theology"....? Or did I dream that.
Posted by: wheatie at January 31, 2012 01:07 PM (UOOK1)
Wasn't that just Liberation Theology, which is just communism with a christian bumper sticker. I think it was the Jesuits pushing that in Central America.

Posted by: Rodent Liberation Front at January 31, 2012 01:10 PM (lgw0N)

167 Margaret Sanger would be so proud of Obama.

Posted by: mpfs, Joo at January 31, 2012 01:11 PM (iYbLN)

168 who doesn't find the phrase "rhythym method" to be some sort of slur
denoting terrible unreliability, and would rather not talk about mucous.

Thanks.


OK Personal note. Also Catholic, have used NFP for years, *every* person where this little conversation comes up, first words "Rhythm method but that doesn't work very well" I have gotten real tired of the sneers of those who think they understand the Church's views on reproduction and explaining the differences on why NFP works really well and Rhythm does not. And explaining the Church has no desire to force children on you, that you cannot care for by denying you some way of planning a family.

I should start charging people a dime every time they tell me that to donate to NFP education.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose Camellia Sinensis Operative at January 31, 2012 01:11 PM (0q2P7)

169 150 Uh.....didn't the Catholic Church come out recently with a condemnation of "Black Liberation Theology"....? Or did I dream that. .
-----
.
Yeah, it did.....I just looked it up.
.
So maybe Barky is even more pissed at the Catholic Church now, and this is why he is picking on them in this way. .....Because it seems like a really stupid thing to do in an election year.

Posted by: wheatie at January 31, 2012 01:12 PM (UOOK1)

170

I know jean, I'm not disputing there's a big, big difference. But it's not a reason to get sidetracked from ace's awesome post.



won't they be forced to close the Catholic hospitals? That would be Armegeddon in healthcare.

Posted by: Rodent Liberation Front


"Gee, that would be a shame," says Lord Barry the Wise.

Posted by: imp at January 31, 2012 01:12 PM (414Gp)

171 Ace for "Poor Man's Russell Kirk Award"?

Posted by: wte9 at January 31, 2012 01:12 PM (B7VmV)

172 Some of the best healthcare I have gotten in my life has been at Catholic Hospitals.

Gawd, how stupid can this idiot be?

Posted by: mpfs, Joo at January 31, 2012 01:13 PM (iYbLN)

173 <<Personally, I've always thought of pregnancy as more of a parasitic infestation...>>

That takes more than 18 years to get rid of and often pops back up at the most inopportune moments.

Posted by: Buzzsaw at January 31, 2012 01:13 PM (tf9Ne)

174 I think some common sense regulation of freedom of religion along with common sense regulation of gun laws is something we can tackle.

Posted by: E. Holder at January 31, 2012 01:13 PM (1eLab)

175 People can make their own choices in regards to contraceptives. The Government has no business telling the Catholic Church that they have to pay for it. None. Zip. Zero. Nada.

I'm not Catholic but I didn't just fall off the turnip truck either. The drive here is to further the meme that the religious are neanderthals and bigots, and that all obstacles to contraception, abortion, gay marriage, etc are primitive and must be replaced with the Utopian Progressive model. This extends to evangelicals, Orthodox Jews and observant Christians of other denominations.




Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 01:13 PM (P6QsQ)

176 Margaret Sanger would be so proud of Obama.


Posted by: mpfs, Joo at January 31, 2012 01:11 PM


Maggie was a racist who would have done all she could to convince Stanley Ann to abort the fetal tissue in 1961

Posted by: Terminator T-800 at January 31, 2012 01:14 PM (Y+DPZ)

177 162 Cause it's not a baby until a doctor declares it to be one.

/sarc

Posted by: esch at January 31, 2012 01:14 PM (fZr9T)

178 Please explain how this is any different, than sponsoring a Consitutional Amendment to tell people who they can Marry? or telling a State they can't Legalize Marajuana? or creating the mechanism to search us all at Airports?
How this is different would be that there is explicit language in the Bill of Rights that protects the "free exercise" of religion, and that Congress shall pass no law abridging that exercise.

As to legalization of marijuana, I think potheads are more of a menace than Catholics, but whatever. And last I checked there was no actual Constitutional amendment regarding gay marriage, and it WAS the states that were making those decisions.

And I think everyone here would agree that "unlawful search and seizure" and "due process" are thrown under the bus with the TSA, and that it should be dismantled and thrown on the ash heap of history, along with quite a few other clauses from the Patriot Act.

Posted by: MWR, Proud Tea(rrorist) Party Hobbit and ABO supporter at January 31, 2012 01:15 PM (4df7R)

179 Their preaching is loveless and vile.

Posted by: Reactionary at January 31, 2012 01:09 PM


Wonderfully put.

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 01:15 PM (P6QsQ)

180 You mean to tell me that two individuals, as it stands today, don't have the right to live together as husband and husband? Oh, that's right, they do. But you want government to sanction that union. So it's actually you who wants to use the government in order to promote a particular version of morality. I've never been able to get the gay marriage types to explain what the compelling government interest is in their relationships. Government got involved in regular marriages to control genetic issues, control STDs, and promote stable or growing populations. Why do the gays want Government involved -- do they really want a mandatory HIV test, because that would be in the government's interest.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 01:15 PM (WkuV6)

181 This would reverse if Catholics stopped patronizing the businesses that promote abortion.

Lefties for all their talk about greed, are deeply and firmly in love with their own money.

Posted by: kbdabear at January 31, 2012 01:16 PM (Y+DPZ)

182 166 ......Wasn't that just Liberation Theology, which is just communism with a christian bumper sticker. I think it was the Jesuits pushing that in Central America.
.
You're right.....they didn't use the word 'Black' in front of Liberation Theology. .....But it's the same thing, basically. .....If they condemned Liberation Theology, then the condemnation would apply to Black Liberation Theology....which is based on Liberation Theology.

Posted by: wheatie at January 31, 2012 01:16 PM (UOOK1)

183 Even E.J. Dionne at the Washington Post has expressed his concern over the matter. Chickens coming home to roost, indeed.

Posted by: mrp at January 31, 2012 01:16 PM (HjPtV)

184 Margaret Sanger would be so proud of Obama. She would have beaten his mom to death -- after aborting Obama; her vileness is a stain on our history.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 01:17 PM (WkuV6)

185 If you want to weep for your country go look at the comments on that article on the WaPo.

Posted by: Mr Pink at January 31, 2012 01:18 PM (KxqFb)

186 There are sorts of wonderful things in the new ACA. This is only the first step. Next we're making it illegal to manufacture cheese.

Posted by: N. Pelosi at January 31, 2012 01:19 PM (1eLab)

187 They have decided that their is no more need for your God, they will take His place.

They are fashioning themselves into their own idols and mandating that we submit our personal theologies to theirs, and kneel at their feet.

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 01:01 PM (P6QsQ)

I agree completely mama, and the arrogance of Obama's position makes me want to scream.

But at the same time it is a comfort because God does not take stuff like this lying down.

Mr. Obama now has bigger concerns than Mitt Romney or Newt Gingrich or any of his other potential opponents. He has sown the seeds of his own demise, I only pray that it comes about sooner rather than later.

Posted by: Nighthawk at January 31, 2012 01:19 PM (RSqz2)

188 It is said that one cannot legislate morality. This is, of course, pure poppycock. What these people mean to say is that one cannot legislate morality that I disprove of - legislating my morality is just hunky-dory.

Posted by: Mikey NTH at January 31, 2012 01:20 PM (hLRSq)

189 This will really cost Obama in states like
Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, etc., i.e., where there is a
heavy concentration of old-school Catholics.

Posted by: The Regular Guy at January 31, 2012 01:03 PM (qHCyt)
Speaking as one of those old-school Catholics (not old, just old school), Obama just set himself on fire and is going down in flames. Bishop Morlino issued an all-points-bulletin on this very topic, which means the rain of fire has begun from the faithful to the SCOAMF.
Already, several Catholic Charities offices have closed their doors because the locals and Feds have mandated that they arrange adoptions to gay couples, which violates Catholic beliefs. Now he's going after the hospitals, the healthcare facilities, and even the dioceses who offer insurance to their employees. I can assure you that this will not stand. As it is, many dioceses self-insure, so that they don't use any of the insurance companies that DO pay for abortions or abortifacients. If dioceses are forced to give up health insurance entirely, there will by many of us who spend our days marching on Washington and generally raising hell.
And yes, all acts of conjugal love must be free, fruitful, and open to life, meaning no condoms or other barriers, and nothing to prevent fertility. That is what God made sex for, between married people, according to the Catholic Church. We have no problem with the atheistic government feeling differently, but we pray that the world might learn the truth. The difference is that we legislate nothing, and force nobody to violate their own conscience in any matter.

Posted by: tcn at January 31, 2012 01:21 PM (ZOUmX)

190 @ 148 Please explain how this is any different, than sponsoring a Consitutional Amendment to tell people who they can Marry?
...
Would now be an appropriate time to point out that gays have the exact same marital rights as straights?

Posted by: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus at January 31, 2012 01:23 PM (+inic)

191 59 For a man who claims not to be particularly faithful, Ace, you have a heart for it and an ear for it. You are in tune with it, and you find just the right words that express the issues that matter in regards to it.

Thanks for this wonderful post.
Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 12:48 PM (P6QsQ)


Very much in agreement!

Posted by: baldilocks at January 31, 2012 01:23 PM (T2/zQ)

192 Not just healthcare, all charity.

See re: MA and Catholic charities and adoption. Not to mention the case in, I think AZ where a photographer was forced to accept bookings for gay weddings. It is not remotely paranoid to believe that there is a strong, strong push to claim that it is illegal to run a business or organization along religious lines. Hell,I read something yesterday where a school newspaper ran pro and con articles on adoption by gay parents and then there was shrieking about how even airing the con side was bullying.

Thisbrings up a great point, shouldn't Islamic financial institutions be forced to give little ol' me interest free financing? If we're being intellectually consistent and all.

C'mon SMOD. Any time now. Annnny time.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD 2012 at January 31, 2012 01:24 PM (VtjlW)

193 Gays spitting out Communion wafers and desecrating Catholic relics? = Free Expression demanding tolerance!

They wouldn't have the same feelings if some Catholics went to a gay bar and pissed on the AIDS quilt

Posted by: kbdabear at January 31, 2012 01:27 PM (Y+DPZ)

194 I think AZ where a photographer was forced to accept bookings for gay weddings. Those pictures would have same quality as a Soviet automobile.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 01:27 PM (WkuV6)

195 The drive here is to further the meme that the religious are
neanderthals and bigots, and that all obstacles to contraception,
abortion, gay marriage, etc are primitive and must be replaced with the
Utopian Progressive model.


Some day these children, like most children, will learn that they are NOT REMOTELY smarter than their parents. I love the progressive meme that somehow anyone older than they are are primitive, because the children are soooo damned sophisticated. You would think that 2,000 years of rational Catholic thought and inspiration would count for something, but then the young are generally idiots in need of education, if not an occasional smack upside the head.


Posted by: tcn at January 31, 2012 01:28 PM (ZOUmX)

196 Andi Sullivan will scribble a rant about how all this is good, and since he's nominally Catholic the MBM will say he speaks for all of us

Posted by: kbdabear at January 31, 2012 01:29 PM (Y+DPZ)

197 Why do the gays want Government involved -- do they
really want a mandatory HIV test, because that would be in the
government's interest.

Posted by: Jean at January 31, 2012 01:15 PM (WkuV6)

*******************************
Because the ones that are stumping for this are tools of the left. I'm old enough to remember when those cocksuckers declared themselves sexual supermen who weren't going to be bound by the institutions of us "breeders". I said "Fine; have fun buttfucking yourselves for eternity. Just stay off my lawn and leave me the fuck alone". They weren't happy with that because they're never happy; so they got their marching orders from the left to fuck things up for everybody by redefining what "marriage" is. Fuck that shit. I took them at their word once and I'm all tapped out on sympathy for them.

Posted by: Captain Hate at January 31, 2012 01:29 PM (z5C1s)

198 I hope Mittens and Newt are taking notes...Somebody here who actually knows people in the campaigns (Iknow your out there)really needs to get a post like this to the right people in the campaigns.

Posted by: dananjcon at January 31, 2012 01:29 PM (8ieXv)

199 Some day these children, like most children, will
learn that they are NOT REMOTELY smarter than their parents. I love the
progressive meme that somehow anyone older than they are are primitive,
because the children are soooo damned sophisticated.


Posted by: tcn at January 31, 2012 01:28 PM


My dad used to say "you kids think you invented fucking"

Posted by: kbdabear at January 31, 2012 01:31 PM (Y+DPZ)

200 YOU KNOW WHO THIS BENEFITS?

Posted by: Rick Santorum, noted Catholic, at January 31, 2012 01:32 PM (+hPIb)

201 196
Andi Sullivan will scribble a rant about how all this is good, and since
he's nominally Catholic the MBM will say he speaks for all of us



Posted by: kbdabear at January 31, 2012 01:29 PM (Y+DPZ)

Oh my Dear Lord. Will homosexuals never figure it out?


Posted by: tcn at January 31, 2012 01:32 PM (ZOUmX)

202 Obamacare is the quickest way for the Left to CONTROL what you EAT, what you DRIVE, how much you SPEND, and what you BELIEVE.




Posted by: soothsayer at January 31, 2012 01:05 PM (sqkOB)


Remember- in the end it didn't matter that 2+2=5, or 3, or anything that Big Brother said it was.

All that mattered is that you NEEDED Big Brother to tell you the right answer.

Posted by: Nighthawk at January 31, 2012 01:32 PM (RSqz2)

203 Let's face it. Anti Catholicism is still an acceptable form of discrimination in the US.
The US Catholic Bishops have rolled for years. Pelosi and Sebelius and the doof of a NY governor should be actively and publicly denied the Eucharist.
My own Bishop of Monterey has been completely and totally silent on the HHS mandate. I called the office and never even got a call back.
I'm convinced that only a small authentic remnant of Catholics will remain in the US. Many will call themselves catholic and go to Mass and receive our Lord unworthily and it will be up to the Faithful to make reparation and stand in line of battle. Regina Martyrum Ora Pro Nobis.
We are not necessarily doubting that God will do the best for us; we are wondering how painful the best will turn out to be. CS Lewis.

Posted by: newguy40 at January 31, 2012 01:32 PM (kduZC)

204 kbdabear - my wife would slap me if I ever used such a vulgar line on my 21-year-old stepdaughter.
Which is why I make sure to only use it whenher mom'sout of earshot.

Posted by: reason at January 31, 2012 01:33 PM (+hPIb)

205 Obama is an evil liberal fascist.

A totalitarian motherfucker.

Fuck Obama.

Posted by: Clubber Lang at January 31, 2012 01:34 PM (ZPrif)

206 Didn't Catholics support Obama more than other Christian groups? Schadenfreude.

Posted by: SFGoth at January 31, 2012 01:35 PM (dZ756)

207 "Plan B" is not an abortifacient, it prevents sperm meeting egg.


Posted by: SarahW at January 31, 2012 01:35 PM (LYwCh)

208
So...you're catholic and/or you're religious...and you want an abortion?
So...uh...what happened to abstinence and sin?

Posted by: Warren Bonesteel at January 31, 2012 01:35 PM (E7Z1r)

209 Newguy: If you are waiting for the bishops in CA to do anything about this, you wait in vain. The USCCB is a rotten organization, without canonical standing, but so many of the JPII bishops treat it like the messiah. However, a few of the JPII bishops and certainly all of the B16 bishops realize how lousy the USCCB is both spiritually and politically, and work around it to a much better end. The wheel of the Catholic Church turns slowly, but it does turn.

Posted by: tcn at January 31, 2012 01:35 PM (ZOUmX)

210 The majority of Hispanics are Catholic, a lot of them devoutly so. Most of them will still vote for the SCOAMF, but possibly enough of them won't to swing things in a close election

When Reno and Holder ordered the Elian Gonzales raid, they figured that some pissed off Cubans in Miami wouldn't matter in the big scheme of things.

If he hadn't pissed them off, it's likely that Florida would have gone to Gore without a recount even being necessary

Posted by: kbdabear at January 31, 2012 01:35 PM (Y+DPZ)

211 Maybe this will help get all those principled Christians who refuse to vote Romney off the sidelines for the upcoming election.

Posted by: E.M. August at January 31, 2012 01:37 PM (zeBNm)

212 We are not necessarily doubting that God will do the best for us; we are
wondering how painful the best will turn out to be. CS Lewis.
Posted by: newguy40 at January 31, 2012 01:32 PM



.... Worth repeating.

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 01:39 PM (P6QsQ)

213 As for those who note the fallen-away Catholics and the cafeteria Catholics, B16 said that it is possible that the Church would become much smaller, but much holier, in the long run.

Posted by: tcn at January 31, 2012 01:40 PM (ZOUmX)

214 Remember when Obamacare was hanging by a thread, and some idiot congressman wanted a piece a paper from Obama saying Obamacare wouldn't cover Abortions? Some Presidential decree ha

I swear it was top news for a MONTH!!

Nevil Chamberlain would be proud. No direct comparison here.


why oh why are nobody talking about this?

Posted by: What a Jerk at January 31, 2012 01:41 PM (bcmD0)

215 Let's see, we have how many Catholics on the Supreme court when this case comes up? 4, 5?
Of course the liberals will immediately demand that they all recuse themselves...

Posted by: Harry Stamper at January 31, 2012 01:41 PM (SO2Q8)

216 This is an attack on all of us. Catholics Christians happen to be first in line.

Posted by: newguy40



Yes.

Posted by: baldilocks at January 31, 2012 01:42 PM (T2/zQ)

217 This was discussed on the morning TV news while I was getting ready. They had the Dallas bishop on, and presented him with the statistic that 95% of Catholics state that they have used birth control at some point.
His rebuttal was brilliantly simple, and hearkens back to the wisdom of most everyones' mother: "95% of people doing something still does not make it right."
The surface-Catholics of the Democratic Party will try to corral their "fellow" believers. Expect a lot of airtime for Nancy Pelosi in the near future. But I honestly think that Obama has now set himself at a big disadvantage among many Christian voting groups. Time will tell if and how he tries to reappease them.

Posted by: reason at January 31, 2012 01:44 PM (+hPIb)

218 I swear it was top news for a MONTH!!
Nevil Chamberlain would be proud. No direct comparison here.
why oh why are nobody talking about this?
Posted by: What a Jerk at January 31
--
Stu(pid)pak

Posted by: Progressive Tyranny at January 31, 2012 01:44 PM (sJKFk)

219 I disagree with the title of this post only in that Obama has more motives than pissing off Catholics. He's a pro abortion guy through and through wherever he can find it -- or make it happen more "freely".

Posted by: Random at January 31, 2012 01:45 PM (YiE0S)

220 150


Uh.....didn't the Catholic Church come out recently with a condemnation of "Black Liberation Theology"....? Or did I dream that.



Posted by: wheatie at January 31, 2012 01:07 PM (UOOK1)


Actually Pope Benedict slammed it thoroughly back in the 80s when he was Cardinal (Bishop?) Ratzinger.

Posted by: baldilocks at January 31, 2012 01:45 PM (T2/zQ)

221 Posted by: Captain Hate at January 31, 2012 01:29 PM (z5C1s)
*
Growing up in the 80's really brain fucked me into thinking that compassion for the gay community, suffering from the AIDS epidemic was theonly thoughtfull, right thinking disposition. The MTV-MFM media blitz and scare tactics used to make me feel as if I was a bad person for thinking that lifestyle was wrong was relentless and it worked. In the 25+years since, we've seen what the progressiveGLBT agendahas bought this country; I've come to realize that as a dopey teenager I was prettysmart after all.

Posted by: dananjcon at January 31, 2012 01:45 PM (8ieXv)

222 He is a scumbag who commits an impeachable offense about once a week. Yet there is probably a solid 40% who think he's the tits and will support him again. Which only goes to show how profoundly screwed we are.

Posted by: real joe at January 31, 2012 01:48 PM (979FD)

223 Marco Rubio just introduce a bill in the Senate to kill this mandate for any individual or organization that opposes contraception or abortion for religious reasons.

I hope he can get this to a vote. Can't wait to see how Mr. Famously Pro-Life Catholic Bobby Casey votes on this one. He's up for reelection this year. Muaahahaha

Posted by: rockmom at January 31, 2012 01:48 PM (NYnoe)

224 Actually, it is an attack on everyone. In my city, there are some small hospitals, but, two out of the three BIG ones are Catholic hospitals and they have built satellite hospitals in at least two of the largest suburbs. If they close their doors, it hurts everyone ALL AT ONCE. The sheer number of unemployed will be staggering, not to mention the other economic impacts such as those hospitals not buying supplies, etc. What about the folks who are in the middle of cancer treatment, where do they go? Even if the legalities could be worked out, so that someone else could take over those hospitals within a few months, it would still be a nightmare.

Posted by: Will Not Assimilate For Food at January 31, 2012 01:48 PM (kXoT0)

225
Just remember, folks - Muslims are COMPLETELY EXEMPT from Obamacare, due to their religious tenets against insurance of any kind.

No doubt Muslim health organizations/hospitals will also be exempt from this type of ruling.

Under the god-king Obama, some are more equal than others.....

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX at January 31, 2012 01:49 PM (0xqzf)

226 I think AZ where a photographer was forced to accept
bookings for gay weddings.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD 2012 at January 31, 2012 01:24 PM (VtjlW)


New Mexico.

Posted by: baldilocks at January 31, 2012 01:49 PM (T2/zQ)

227 you can have all the diversity you want. Any of the government santioned diversity.

You can choose
Belief set 'A' or
Belief set 'A' or
Belief set 'A' ...

Posted by: Barak at January 31, 2012 01:49 PM (SO2Q8)

228 I'm pretty sure in a couple of weeks, Obama will also mandate that synagogues pay for Palestinian explosives.

Posted by: SpideyTerry at January 31, 2012 01:52 PM (0eyhw)

229 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

It is so tiresome, pushing back against this onslaught.
It is easy to see why people just give up.

Posted by: BFD at January 31, 2012 01:52 PM (huR71)

230 Hey, settle down there Papists, I mean, Catholics. I'm planning a nice wine and crackers summit where we can all sit down for a meaningful dialogue about how you acted stupidly.

Posted by: Barry "Love Machine" Obama at January 31, 2012 01:54 PM (qndXR)

231 On a related note, scientists from the National Institute of "Health" (there's that word again) say that killing the disabled isn't necessarily wrong. Killing totally disabled patients does them no harm.
“Then killing her cannot disrespect her
autonomy, because she has no autonomy left. It also cannot be unfair to
kill her if it does her no harm.”

Nor, they say, is life “sacred”. The only relevant difference between
life and death is the existence of abilities – and a brain-damaged
person no longer has these.
f killing were wrong just because it
is causing death or the loss of life, then the same principle would
apply with the same strength to pulling weeds out of a garden. If it is
not immoral to weed a garden, then life as such cannot really be sacred,
and killing as such cannot be morally wrong.”





Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 01:55 PM (P6QsQ)

232 TCN -- I expect the Bishops to lead us according to their Holyt Orders. "To those who are given much, much will be required." They will have much to answer for if the fail their flock. Pray for the Bishops. The yneed our prayers more than many others.
My Pastor spoke passionately about the need for all of us to stay on the Barque of St Peter. Within the safety for Christ's Bride the Church there is safety and salvation. Outide... not so much.
St. Bernard: "When the world rages, when the wicked become furious, when the flesh turns against the spirit, I will hope in Him. Who ever trusted in Him, and was put to shame?"

Posted by: newguy40 at January 31, 2012 01:56 PM (kduZC)

233 There's another reason besides punishing a culture he abhors. President Obama really, really likes abortion. As in loves it and wants more of it at every possible opportunity. That's the only conclusion I can draw from his continuous drive to have more of them and praise them so highly. Obama hates babies.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at January 31, 2012 01:56 PM (r4wIV)

234 This is merely the tip of an agenda iceberg. Progressivism (Marxism / Socialism etc take your pick) believes in an all knowing administrative class of your betters ruling from the top down. They also believe that man must be freed FROM religion, not freedom of religion. If you doubt this, read Marx and read Dear Leaders own words.
If this disaster of an administration gets a second term expect a further push on euthanasia.

If anyone else has ever had the stomach to read Woodrow Wilson's favorite book "Phillip Dru, Administrator", this is a blueprint of how the radical progressive mind operates. If the appointed administrator likes cremation over caskets expect "Burial Reform"

Posted by: Progressive Tyranny at January 31, 2012 01:57 PM (sJKFk)

235 The administration has already offered a compromise to the anti-abortion extremists who oppose this sensible healthcare measure. Secretary Sebellius has postponed implementation for a year to permit religious organizations to plan for their orderly compliance. This is a balanced approach, and it is shameful that the Republicans are again politicizing and obstructing progress on this important issue.

Posted by: Fallen Catholic at January 31, 2012 01:57 PM (bN5ZU)

236 sorry for the bad formatting there - here's the URL

http://tinyurl.com/7ul7npr

we are just weeds to be pulled, according to the NIH

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 01:57 PM (P6QsQ)

237 Libs like diversity in all things...except thought.

Posted by: Rodent Liberation Front at January 31, 2012 01:57 PM (lgw0N)

238 So can we just stop following Executive Orders now?

Posted by: greatgoogitymoogity at January 31, 2012 01:58 PM (lhKh4)

239 Good post Ace. I think this is a potential game-changer. I have no expectation that the GOP nominee will use this as a campaign issue. However, I will. I gives me one more in-road in talking to some of my lib Catholic friends [not the moonbat left ones though] just what Obama is about.
I can't rely on the Catholic Church to take this as far as it needs to be taken. But it is nice that the Church is in the fight. Actually having this addressed from the pulpit appears to be a big deal, out of the norm.
Agoal of the Left is to destroy the Church. And to do it from within. The Church has been "infiltrated" if you will. Alinksy organizations [and I mean ones clearly traceable to SA's industrial org in Chicago] are operating in Catholic Churches in the Pacific NW, specifically Spokane and Portland. The SEIU shows up at their events. I suspect this is occuring elsewhere.
John Paul II recognized the communist influence of "liberation theology" being practiced in the southern hemisphere and stomped on it. Liberation theology is essentially Marxist revolution wrapped in some Gospel readings. Priests in S. America were actually fomenting political violence.
So pray for the Church because it needs your prayers.
And tell your Catholic friends that under Obama some religions are more equal than others. And apparently their beliefs don't matter.

Posted by: The Poster Formerly Known as Mr. Barky at January 31, 2012 01:59 PM (qwK3S)

240 I have not yet begun to bitterly cling.

Posted by: the scoamf ain't seen nothin yet at January 31, 2012 02:00 PM (RzLbD)

241 It is so tiresome, pushing back against this onslaught.

It is easy to see why people just give up.



Posted by: BFD at January 31, 2012 01:52 PM


Wrestling is hard work. We wrestle on.
Chin up. We are not alone.

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 02:00 PM (P6QsQ)

242 It's not worth getting angry about

Posted by: Mitt, I hate The Tea Party at January 31, 2012 02:01 PM (2Gb0y)

243 Obama really, really likes abortion. As in loves it and wants more of
it at every possible opportunity. That's the only conclusion I can draw
Posted by: Christopher Taylor at January 31, 2012 01:56 PM


Me too. Since he was in Illinois, it's been his not-so-secret passion.

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 02:03 PM (P6QsQ)

244 Barry 230-- "...settle down there Papists..."
You forgot Mackeral Snapper.

Posted by: newguy40 at January 31, 2012 02:04 PM (kduZC)

245 One of the Bishops asked all Catholic's tp pray to St Michael. This is a declaration of war.
PRAYER TO


SAINT MICHAEL

THE ARCHANGEL

St. Michael the
Archangel,

defend us in battle.

Be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the Devil.

May God rebuke him, we humbly pray,

and do thou,

O Prince of the heavenly hosts,

by the power of God,

thrust into hell Satan,

and all the evil spirits,

who prowl about the world

seeking the ruin of souls. Amen..

Posted by: Pecos at January 31, 2012 02:09 PM (2Gb0y)

246 If you like your Fetus...

Posted by: BH-OBGNY at January 31, 2012 02:09 PM (8ieXv)

247 Ace: "It is that, the arrogance and the profound disrespect of anyone who does
not wear the feathers and warpaint of their tribe, that makes them not
just wrong but sinister."

Reading that reminded me of this quote: "But the man living one inch beyond the boundary is an inveterate foe."

SCOAMF doesn't stop at viewing the 'other' as sinister. The 'other' is foe and must be destroyed because his existence is a constant reproach. SCOAMF must destroy the foe or reexamine his own views.

Posted by: Retread at January 31, 2012 02:11 PM (joSBv)

248
@240 I have not yet begun to bitterly cling.

I am SOOOO stealing that....

Posted by: Teresa in Fort Worth, TX at January 31, 2012 02:12 PM (0xqzf)

249 SMOD?

Posted by: dontheflyer at January 31, 2012 02:13 PM (Ibx+6)

250 Great post.

Yesterday when researching this I came across comments from Karl Denninger at the Market Ticker. The forums over there are generally an interesting read. I've noticed that not all Catholics are having the reaction that you would expect. Nor are they realizing the constitutional implications.
His is here: h t t p : / / m a r k e t - t i c k e r . o r g / a k c s - w w w ? p o s t = 2 0 1 2 8 1
His article is entitled "Catholic Church Hypocrisy: Obamacare"

I go to church every week. They didn't read a bishop's letter to us or include it in the bulletin. I can confirm from friends in brooklyn and on long island that they weren't read any letters nor was there a letter in the bulletin. So that is 3 NY diocese. I guess the NY bishops have held this off until this coming weekend.

Posted by: ambrosia at January 31, 2012 02:13 PM (oZfic)

251 235
The administration has already offered a compromise to the anti-abortion
extremists who oppose this sensible healthcare measure. Secretary
Sebellius has postponed implementation for a year to permit religious
organizations to plan for their orderly compliance. This is a balanced
approach, and it is shameful that the Republicans are again politicizing
and obstructing progress on this important issue.

Can't tell if trolling or just stupid.

Posted by: real joe at January 31, 2012 02:14 PM (979FD)

252 "No Gods; No Masters!"

Posted by: Zombie Margret Sanger at January 31, 2012 02:15 PM (sJKFk)

253 pecos

that is one of my favorite prayers........

Posted by: phoenixgirl at work at January 31, 2012 02:20 PM (mfbqu)

254 Great post, Ace. I agree with the Anchoress, I believe this is a huge issue that may unite, finally, the Catholic vote against Obamacare. On first pass, because they did not LOOK at the bill, many were blindly voting for Dear Leader due to liberal parish priests saying he was compassionate, etc.

This is huge, that Bishops are standing up to him (finally. Senator Rubio is fighting against this (of course), as will the entire GOP. I hope this is the tipping point for the end of SCOAMF's reign of terror.


Posted by: ChristyBlinky,Romneybot loves Rubio at January 31, 2012 02:21 PM (baL2B)

255 When this gets to the Supremes how will it be argued?

Posted by: ambrosia at January 31, 2012 02:22 PM (oZfic)

256 I'm just waiting for the announcement from either the Turd-in-chief or the SC that Christianity is hereby outlawed.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at January 31, 2012 02:22 PM (zhe90)

257 What I would like to see is every Catholic church from now to the election tell their congregations to choose between voting for this turd or remaining a member.

Posted by: Vashta Nerada at January 31, 2012 02:27 PM (zhe90)

258 Psalm 109:8.

Posted by: ChristyBlinky,Romneybot loves Rubio at January 31, 2012 02:35 PM (baL2B)

259 Help me Obama! The Catholics won't pay for my abortions as mandated by law! They are stealing my abortion vouchers ! Smack them down with thy mighty pimp-hand and they shall know that you are 'the One'!

Posted by: cackfinger at January 31, 2012 02:46 PM (a9mQu)

260 One problem I have is this: The left wing Catholic Church has no problem supporting positions that would piss on individuals, tell them to break the law (immigration) and redistribute income. To be clear, the Church hierarchy is left wing and oppressive government doesn't bother it in the least. While Obama is wrong, my sympathy level for the Church isn't that high. If Obama said I'm cool with the no coverage, are you cool with me sticking it to every other citizen and organization, the Church would say yes.

Posted by: ejo at January 31, 2012 02:47 PM (QD+0n)

261 real joe - I can't tell if it is over-the-top snark or just stupid. The argument it makes is basically, "you have a year to comply with my wishes" is a balanced compromise to pushback of the original "you must immediately comply with my wishes."
I'm leaning towards stupid.

Posted by: reason at January 31, 2012 02:49 PM (F26eZ)

262 Obama is not specifically anti-catholic, and he's certainly not a muslim. He's an atheist, which is totally understandable considering the influences he was raised with. When will he finally reveal that? How about January 21, 2013, the day after he's sworn in for his second term?

As for Catholic opposition to contraception - I remember when the pope came out against condoms years ago and people went crazy - "is he nuts?" is all I heard. But his point was that (in my parlance) whenever you stick this in that, there are consequences - and the prospect of pregnancy and disease are only the most visible. Sex must mean something, we must respect the act because we'll surely be forced to deal with the after effects, whether they be physical or psychological.

I know we live in a time when modern man has made the only sin 'judgementalism.' But we've made a mess of our culture, and it's hard to tell me your free when all around you we have come to resemble beasts more than man. Apparently we can't handle freedom. Thus comes the collar...

Posted by: Shane at January 31, 2012 02:53 PM (nMmXj)

263 By the way, if you type "Obamacare" and "waivers" into Google, you quickly find articles telling you that, as of earlier this month, 1,231 companies had received waivers from Obamcare from the Department of Health and Human Services. So, to add insult to outrage, essentially Obama is more than willing to grant waivers to companies and entities (read: unions) that want to opt out of Obamacare, but can't find it in his heart to allow exceptions for believing Catholics who don't want to pay for insurance that includes services to which they have serious moral reservations.

Just so we know what he really thinks of us.

Posted by: The Regular Guy at January 31, 2012 02:54 PM (qHCyt)

264 Obama - of the New World Taliban.
He just considersabortions ashonor killings.

Posted by: Roy at January 31, 2012 03:19 PM (VndSC)

265 Well, go ahead, Notre Dame. Give him another honorary degree and make him commencement speaker again for his general awesome awesomeness.

(I stopped supporting ND in any way after that happened. It's so great when a general lay person can see shit like this coming and the flagship Catholic institution of America refuses to. They'll never ever revoke the honor though.)

Posted by: Filly at January 31, 2012 03:35 PM (u6ZqI)

266
"Archbishop Timothy Dolan noted that‎”The Amish do not carry health
insurance. The government respects their principles. Christian
Scientists want to heal by prayer alone, and the new health-care reform
law respects that. Quakers and others object to killing even in wartime,
and the government respects that principle for conscientious objectors.
By its decision, the Obama administration has failed to show the same
respect for the consciences of Catholics and others who object to
treating pregnancy as a disease.” This injustice is not something that
need solely concern the Catholic Church — if the federal government can
force Catholics to act against their consciences, they can force anyone
to act against their conscience, Jew, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist and
Atheist, and by the same pitiful reasoning.
Mr. President, take it back."


from Patheos dot com

Posted by: mama winger at January 31, 2012 03:40 PM (P6QsQ)

267 And if he does rescind it, will the Church hop back on the bandwagon and support 0 and his continuing effort to stick it to all citizens? If I were a betting man, I would go with "Yes".

Posted by: ejo at January 31, 2012 03:51 PM (WjOZK)

268 Posted by: Filly at January 31, 2012 03:35 PM (u6ZqI)

Rumor has it that many Catholic alumni of Georgetown, upon seeing the crucifix covered for bo's speech, suddenly had no money for the alumni giving campaign.

Posted by: ambrosia at January 31, 2012 03:54 PM (oZfic)

269 Pope Benedict XVI is the pope for a reason. I mean look at his last name and tell me you don't think he's up for the fight: "Rat" "zinger"

Posted by: ambrosia at January 31, 2012 03:59 PM (oZfic)

270 Obama has made Jenkins — and other progressive Catholic allies — look easily duped.


Here's the thing on that quote, though-- no way Notre Dame was "duped." They knew damn well who he was. This was just another example of ND, like WAY too many other Catholic institutions, wanting to be a secular university in a Catholic parish.

I figured that out when my superior at the Catholic college where I was teaching told me to stop praying before class.

Posted by: Filly at January 31, 2012 04:09 PM (u6ZqI)

271 I can guarantee you that Father Pfleger here in Chicago (ie. the white priest who, minstrel like, affects a phony black accent from the pulpit and pretty much has been allowed, under the jackass Cardinal George, the ability to spew any racial bile imaginable) will be right back up on the bandwagon. Frankly, the Catholic Clergy isn't particularly trustworthy on issues like this. They are left wingers.

Posted by: ejo at January 31, 2012 04:32 PM (WjOZK)

272 affects a phony black accent from the pulpit

Are you serious? And they let him, they don't mock or dislike that? You'd think blacks would be annoyed at best at that, if not deeply offended.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at January 31, 2012 05:18 PM (r4wIV)

273 Contributions in my parish are way down from even a couple of years ago. It's not as if they don't have the money, believe me, they have it. They just aren't giving it to the parish and they are using as their excuse that they aren't going to contribute to court settlements and causes they don't espouse. And many feel angry and betrayed by the closing of St. Vincent's Hospital. They are still giving to charities that are Catholic, just strategically and after looking at the balance sheet of the charity. I wonder if this is going on all over the country or just in my parish and the parishes of some of my friends.

Posted by: ambrosia at January 31, 2012 05:19 PM (oZfic)

274 ambrosia, my husband and I are sending our tithe to places other than our parish, but not because of the sex scandals. It's because we cannot be assured that some of it won't go to support of illegal immigration lobbying. I'll donate goods such as canned food but not cash... never know what it's going to be used for.

Posted by: Filly at January 31, 2012 05:31 PM (u6ZqI)

275 "Only if the hotelier puts his own moralism over the business would he
attempt to force his guests to live by his specific rules of life."

You have just summed up the complete folly that is Socialism and the Left Wing.

Posted by: Smokey Behr at January 31, 2012 05:56 PM (QyeW7)

276 Ambrosia and Filly --
We split our donations about 50-50 between "charities" and "parish"
For the parish, we give a very small amount to what had been our main parish. But, over the past couple years has lacked genuine authentic teaching and preaching. Frequent (more than 2X per month) problematic abuses during Mass. We started attendance of TLM on Sundaysin July of '11. This has been everything we could hope for in licit, reverence and hoilness. The TLM is struggling with low but steady attendance. So, the majority of our "parish" related is now going to support this newer TLM group (not yet it's own parish). The other more liberal parish continues to put $ in the collection if the weekly posted summaries are to be believed. I have not heard any lack of giving of funds due to the priest abuse scandal. Generally, the folks who wanted to use that as an excuse to leave the Faith did so several years ago.

Posted by: newguy40 at January 31, 2012 06:17 PM (kduZC)

277 It's Alinsky. Forcing the Church to live by Her own rules means shutting down hospitals, charities, foster homes, and social services. People still need these services, and now Big Daddy Government is the only game in town.

We hear all the time that if a government service is cut back or ended, then people will suffer, even though communities and churches used to fill these needs, pre-Nanny State era.

Posted by: VKI at January 31, 2012 06:18 PM (TKoA3)

278 In other news (sorry if already covered) Komen Foundation severed all ties with Planned Parenthood today!

FINALLY, October won't PISS ME OFF.

Posted by: Cathy at January 31, 2012 06:26 PM (yySDN)

279 Posted by: newguy40 at January 31, 2012 06:17 PM (kduZC)

Is TLM, "the latin mass"? I'm hearing a lot about clandestine latin masses in both DC and NYC. In my parish there is a core group who decided rather than leave when the abuses came to light they would instead stay and fight.

Posted by: Filly at January 31, 2012 05:31 PM (u6ZqI)


Yeah I always give food too, every week. Originally it went to the illegal folks but lately I'm hearing from my friends who are very active that it is going to people you would not expect. It's tough times, really tough times and without the food from the church family I don't know what people would do. My friends who are Catholics and doctors are starting to get angrier than I've ever seen them. A lot of them have lucrative practices affiliated with big shot hospitals but they also work at the Catholic hospitals, sometimes for free, because they want to give back. I'm not so sure if the bishops decide to back down if the laity will let them. I think he might have awakened a sleeping giant.

Posted by: ambrosia at January 31, 2012 07:08 PM (oZfic)

280 Posted by: VKI at January 31, 2012 06:18 PM (TKoA3)

To see that written out, making perfect sense made me say that prayer to St. Michael, again.

Posted by: ambrosia at January 31, 2012 07:11 PM (oZfic)

281 BHO has now shown himself to be a complete Cultural Marxist. He will undermine all customs, traditions and morals.

Posted by: Great Reagan's Ghost at January 31, 2012 07:14 PM (bohBF)

282 FINALLY, October won't PISS ME OFF.


Posted by: Cathy at January 31, 2012 06:26 PM (yySDN)8

Posted by: SMOD at January 31, 2012 07:38 PM (UOM48)

283 281
BHO has now shown himself to be a complete Cultural Marxist. He will undermine all customs, traditions and morals.


Posted by: Great Reagan's Ghost at January 31, 2012 07:14 PM (bohBF8

Posted by: SMOD at January 31, 2012 07:39 PM (UOM48)

284 Ambrosia -- Yes. TLM = Traditional Latin Mass. Both Blessed JPII and Benedict 16 have made a strong effort to promote and instruct a greater number of Latin Masses. Google motu proprio or Summorum Pontificum. I would definately encourage you to look for one nearby. This is truly the Mass of the Ages. You can look here for a TLM near you.
http://www.traditio.com/nat.htm

I don't know about celebrating the Latin Mass clandestinely. I think that would be frowned upon by the local ordinary. On the other hand, we may all return to drawing fishes in the dirt to recognize our brothers and sisters. Or, celebrating the Mass in secret as occurred in Spain during their Civil War and in England during the so called reformation.

Posted by: newguy40 at January 31, 2012 07:40 PM (kduZC)

285 Obama does this to other religions because he's a Muslim, and all other religions must be wiped out.

Posted by: BeckoningChasm at January 31, 2012 09:27 PM (i0App)

286 When religion/church teaches morality they have no authority to enforce their teachings, it is up to the individual to walk out the door and choose to either follow the message or not. When a government thinks to teach morality they do have the authority to enforce whatever they want to say is 'morality." That is the reason our US Constitution reads, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;" Compare and contrast that to the Theo-political establishment of Shari'ah compliance law within Islam and Islamic states and their "Morality Police."

Oh, be sure to send a big f'k you card to Boehner and any House
member who agreed, and signed, the continuing resolution which funds
the government through the end of fiscal 2012 back in December, and tell
them f'k you very much for the “compromise” it contained between House
leaders and Obama and the Democrat Senate that allowed Obama the funds
to implement this. The CR which, “…expressly denied the administration
the funds to carry out some regulatory activities but did not deny it
the funds to carry out the sterilization-contraception-abortifacient
regulation.

Posted by: halodoc at January 31, 2012 09:40 PM (gLiPk)

287 All those who eat and drink of the Sacred Species without recognizing Jesus Christ, eat and drink to their own condemnation. All civil rights cases are paid for by the taxpayer. The Catholic school girls' civil rights have been violated. Soul rape and contempt for their virginity and innocence as well as for their sovereign personhood. God did not putthe girlshere to be abused. Just because Obama leaves born children to die of neglect, let us haul these evildoers into a court of law and demand an apology and $1.00 for the girls' pain and suffering. An apology is required and must be forth coming. It is another example of the boot on the neck. Next time it will be your neck or mine.

Posted by: Mary De Voe at January 31, 2012 11:06 PM (kycC2)

288 278 The Left is mad about that. As always I don't know if they're serious or if they're just trying to wrestle the issue away from us.

Posted by: Anony at January 31, 2012 11:25 PM (Yigvc)

289 Thank you, Bishops.

I think I just found a reason to go back to church.

BTW, Ace, I'm going to use your arguments on a few liberals--I think it may just work.

Posted by: PJ at February 01, 2012 01:00 AM (DQHjw)

290 www.genset-china.com

Posted by: kadin at February 02, 2012 12:06 AM (2HMCV)






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