Gates: Libya Isn't In Our National Interest, Clinton: Yes it Is

Smart Power?

On NBC's "Meet the Press," Gates was asked, "Is Libya in our vital interest as a country?" He answered, "No, I don't think it's a vital interest for the U.S., but we clearly have interests there, and it's a part of the region which is a vital interest for the U.S." Gates' statement wasn't an entirely convincing rationale for a major military commitment, and moderator David Gregory responded by saying, "I think a lot of people would hear that and say well, that's quite striking -- not in our vital interests and yet we're committing military resources."

At that moment, Clinton jumped in to offer an extended justification for going to war. "Did Libya attack us?" she asked. "No, they did not attack us. Do they have a very critical role in this region and do they neighbor two countries -- you just mentioned one, Egypt, the other Tunisia -- that are going through these extraordinary transformations and cannot afford to be destabilized by conflict on their borders? Yes. Do they have a major influence on what goes on in Europe because of everything from oil to immigration?"

At that point, Clinton suggested that the U.S. went to war to repay NATO allies for support in Afghanistan. "We asked our NATO allies to go into Afghanistan with us ten years ago," she said. "They have been there, and a lot of them have been there despite the fact that they were not attacked. The attack came on us…They stuck with us. When it comes to Libya, we started hearing from the UK, France, Italy, other of our NATO allies…This was in their vital national interest…"

We have to go to war when France and Italy's vital interests (aka Libyan Oil) are at stake? Really, that's the story Hillary is sticking with? No War for Europe's Oil!

The amazing thing is we've been engaged in kinetic military action time-limited, scope-limited military action WAR in Libya for over a week now and the Secretaries of State and Defense still can't their story straight on why. Maybe if there were a position of executive authority within the government who was ultimately responsible for this type of decision who could explain why we are in a kinetic military action time-limited, scope-limited military action WAR things would be clearer. Perhaps we could call that job "The President".

Breaking news update....I've just been informed we do have "A President". Here's the current holder of the office.

emptysuit.jpg
President Empty Suit*

As for Clinton's idea that it's in our vital national interest to stand behind our allies when they decide to go adventuring...um, no. The reason they went to Afghanistan is because they were pretty much bound to by a little thing we like to call the North Atlantic Treaty which declared an attack on one was an attack on all. We don't owe them a solid for living up to their sworn obligations. If we're keeping score, I'd say even factoring in Euro 'help' in Afghanistan, the whole, "thanks for saving us from the Nazis and keeping the Soviets in check for 40 plus years" account isn't quite even yet. But who is keeping score?

Oh and Hillary would like the world, especially Bahir Assad, to know this Libya thing is a one off and we're not going to get involved in Syria. So you know...take care of business, we're not going to say or do anything.

Arguing that Qaddafi's longstanding history of brutality distinguished itself from the regime of Syrian President Bashir Assad, Clinton said Syrian circumstances had not aligned in a fashion to suggest that the U.S. would undertake military operations there.

"The situation in Libya which engendered so much concern from around the international community, had a leader who used military force against the protesters from one end of his country to the other, who publicly said things like 'We'll show no mercy,' 'We'll go house to house,' and the international community moved with great speed in part because there's a history here," she told CBS' Bob Schieffer. "This is someone who's behaved in a way that's caused great concern in the past 40-plus years in the Arab world, the African world, Europe and the United States."

When asked about recent brutalities committed by the Syrian regime against civilians, Clinton suggested that "there's a difference between calling out aircraft and indiscriminately strafing and bombing your own cities, than police actions which frankly have exceeded the use of force that any of us would want to see."

I'm not advocating going into Syria (that's a job for Joe Lieberman) but Assad isn't as bad as Kadaffi? Really? I don't think the US Secretary of State should be laying out a road map for a dictator like Assad to follow to keep the killings under some threshold for concern. There's a little thing called "strategic ambiguity", it can be helpful to keep the bad guys guessing what might set you off. But no, Hills just said "have it at Doc!".

If this is Smart Power(tm), I think I would like some old timey Stupid Power about now.

One other thing, some guy over at the New Republic is pretty bummed that Obama hasn't gotten a bump in the polls out of his Libyan, er, thing. (safe link to the Daily Caller). You'll never guess whose fault that is.

A week into American and allied action in Libya, one political result is already clear: Barack Obama has not benefited in the polls. If anything, Obama’s Gallup approval numbers are actually down a few points since American involvement in Libya began.

We can look to political science to understand this trend—specifically, to the idea of the “rally around the flag” effect. A rally effect, by definition, is when a president’s approval numbers increase during a national security event. Unfortunately for Obama, there’s been no rally effect this week. Which, of course, begs the question: Why?

...To apply this to the current situation, when the United States acted in Libya, many prominent Republicans criticized the intervention—as they were likely to do, considering the extreme, anti-all-things-Obama sentiment that’s taken hold of the GOP. Newt Gingrich, for one, called the operation as “badly run as any foreign operation we’ve seen in our lifetime.” Speaker of the House John Boehner, meanwhile, said he was “troubled” by the fact that Obama undertook action “without clearly defining” the mission. Per Brody’s theory, Obama hasn’t gotten a poll bump.

Looking to the future, as the U.S. political scene becomes increasingly hyper-partisan—with each side of the aisle refusing to find common ground on practically any issue—we can expect that rallying around the flag will become less and less likely. Obama’s polling numbers after the Libya intervention could be just the tip of a future iceberg.

As Mickey Kaus points out at the link maybe it's not the criticism of the policy (which has been pretty mild and there's been a lot of GOP support) but the policy itself. But it can't be that! Obama is awesome and France and the UN said ok! It must be those evil, anti-war Republicans who won't get on board with this awesome new war.

I'd go back to the empty suit nature of this presidency. Obama launched a war and then went to South America for 5 days. Since returning he hasn't been seen in public except on Friday to celebrate Greek Independence Day. President's get support because they lead and ask for it. Obama has hidden first behind military leaders (Admiral Mullen was the only figure on the talk shows last week) and now Clinton and Gates (who can't get their stories straight). Obama will be MIA for about 10 days before we hear from him tomorrow night. I think people would like to support him but he's got to tell us what the hell we're supposed to be supporting first.

*Courtesy of the man, the myth, the legend...Slublog.

Posted by: DrewM. at 11:47 AM



Comments

1 Is it just me or should Slu be denouncing the shit out of himself ?

Posted by: Bill D. Cat at March 27, 2011 11:50 AM (npr0X)

2 Pathetic. You know this Libya thing would've been worth it IF it was also to be used as an example to other regimes say Syria but I guess that's not the case and frankly, the way this Libya thing is going down it's not much of an example to instill fear in other regimes anyway. If you are low hanging fruit, watch out. If you are really mean and have strong friends, continue to do as you wish. We'll stay out. Jeez, this smart power sucks.

Posted by: CDR M at March 27, 2011 11:52 AM (5I8G0)

3 Apart from this debacle of giving close air support for Islamists, Al Qaeada and what not, is the precedent these fools are setting.

Turkey, NATO member, is going more and more Islamic. Thank you Obama! Israel just intercepted a ship from Turkey loaded with weapons for the terrorists in Gaza.

What if Turkey felt it was vital to attack Israel? Israel responds. What does the NATO charter say in these scenarios? And who would Obama support?

Posted by: Lou at March 27, 2011 11:54 AM (olXPW)

4 ok...we know these people are deliberately destroying our country...the are on the WRONG SIDE OF EVERYTHING....we know all this...so what are we going to do about it? voting them out is really not enough........

Posted by: phoenixgirl at March 27, 2011 11:57 AM (eOXTH)

5 Our word for every day since January 20, 2009 has been "incoherence."

I'd like a new word, please.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 11:59 AM (7utQ2)

6 These things are just too nuancecly complicated with infinite layers of nuance and complication for us to understand.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 12:01 PM (mhmc7)

7 ..so what are we going to do about it? voting them out is really not enough........

Posted by: phoenixgirl at March 27, 2011 11:57 AM (eOXTH)
A question I've asked repeatedly over on AT. A question that eventually caused my account to be cancelled. Tough questions really piss some people off, I guess.

Posted by: thatcrazyjerseyguy at March 27, 2011 12:03 PM (hheOH)

8 And this little war/kinetic action/wtf isn't going to last a few days..

US officials: Libyan operation could last months

WASHINGTON
(AP) - U.S.-led military action in Libya has bolstered rebels fighting
Moammar Gadhafi's forces, but the international operation could continue
for months, the Obama administration says.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at March 27, 2011 12:04 PM (9hSKh)

9 I think the Obama administration is incompetent a good deal of the time...but Gaddafi is a mass murdering sob with the blood of hundreds of Americans on his hands. He is not only threatening genocide in his own country, he has a history as a supporter of terrorism with a penchant for wmd. He is a dangerous man and for decades the world has known this.

The thing that sort of bothers me is how so many on the right were pissed at Obama for not dealing with all of this right off the bat and now they are debating whether or not Gaddafi needs to be dealt with.

It kind of reminds me of the idiots in the Democratic party who could not decide who to support in Iraq...Bush or Saddam.

Posted by: Terrye at March 27, 2011 12:04 PM (bNnwW)

10 Obama's little wag the dog adventure might hurt him. The rebels are limping and are unable to take cities without massive support. Meanwhile gas rises. Americans are not in the mood for another war. I'm not.

Posted by: Flapjackmaka at March 27, 2011 12:05 PM (c5RQr)

11 The thing that sort of bothers me is how so many on the right were pissed at Obama for not dealing with all of this right off the bat and now they are debating whether or not Gaddafi needs to be dealt with. It kind of reminds me of the idiots in the Democratic party who could not decide who to support in Iraq...Bush or Saddam.
Posted by: Terrye at March 27, 2011 12:04 PM (bNnwW)
Nope. I was pissed at president empty suit because he would not say anything. He would not say if we would intervene or do nothing President present.
I doubt he will get a warm reception at the military college tommorow.

Posted by: Flapjackmaka at March 27, 2011 12:07 PM (c5RQr)

12 These people need to STFU. I don't remember past Sec of State and Defense debating a "war" on national TV while it is still going on.

I guess no one wants to miss being on TV so they all parade out to make fools of themselves.

"Smart Power" brought to you by "His Lord Barrack Hussein Obama, the most magnificent"

(And dumb fuck liberals throughout the nation)

Posted by: Kemp at March 27, 2011 12:08 PM (JpFM9)

13 I thought Rush's take on Obama Friday was pretty good. He said (paraphrasing): "There is some thought out there that everything Obama does is designed to hurt America, and there is some evidence that is happening. But, it's also possible for him to be woefully incompetent at the same time."

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 12:09 PM (mhmc7)

14 Distraction.
Please look over there while we continue to destroy the fabric of the country.
Thank you.

Posted by: Don't Fall For It! at March 27, 2011 12:11 PM (qpERk)

15 "The Obama Misery Index and the Rise of Obamavilles" is the best blog
post I've read in a long time. This is why President Obama will be a
one-term president!

I
can't recommend this piece highly enough. This will be all the ammo
we'll need when talking to other voters during the 2012 general
election.

We need to pin people's misery on President Obama!

Posted by: Dan at March 27, 2011 12:12 PM (9L1z6)

16 Maybe if there were a position of executive authority within the government who was ultimately responsible for this type of decision who could why we are in a kinetic military action time-limited, scope-limited military action WAR things would be clearer. Perhaps we could call that job "The President".
No, not "The President". How about "Cabinet Czar"?

Posted by: AmishDude at March 27, 2011 12:15 PM (BvBKY)

17 Hah. That shot reminds me of something I put together before the 2008 election.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 12:20 PM (AZGON)

18 Meeza not know that Obamaman beeza so's stupid. Leastaways, when we Gungans starts a war, weeza doods it for the little Gungans. Thems that can't swims.
Meeza also not all hyped about you Hoomans neithers.

Posted by: Jar Jar Binks at March 27, 2011 12:21 PM (d0Tfm)

19
Gingrich: "We'll Be Running for President Within a Month."

Who's this 'we' white man? We've already had a two-fer with the Grifter's Bill and Hillary and don't need a repeat with Newt and Callista. (A great name for a stripper)

Posted by: Fish the Impaler at March 27, 2011 12:21 PM (ZHsNw)

20 Bring in the stunt president, and CGI his ass some moxy.

Posted by: Darth Ballerina at March 27, 2011 12:23 PM (EvCiU)

21 Interesting chain mail

POLK COUNTY FLORIDA SHERIFF, GRADY JUDD.

An illegal alien, in Polk County, Florida, who got pulled over in a routine traffic stop, ended up "executing" the deputy who stopped him. The deputy was shot eight times, including once behind his right ear at close range. Another deputy was wounded and a police dog killed.
A state-wide manhunt ensued.The murderer was found hiding in a wooded area. As soon as he took a shot at the SWAT team, officers opened fire on him. They hit the guy 68 times.

Naturally, the liberal media went nuts and asked why they had to shoot the poor, undocumented immigrant 68 times.

Sheriff Grady Judd told the Orlando Sentinel:
"Because that's all the ammunition we had."
Now, is that just about the all-time greatest answer or what!

The Coroner also reported that the illegal alien died of natural causes.
When asked by a reporter how that could be, since there were 68 bullet wounds in his body, he simply replied:
(BEST QUOTE of 2009)

"When you are shot 68 times you are naturally gonna die."
GOD BLESS AMERICA!

Posted by: Stupid stuff at March 27, 2011 12:24 PM (wdthA)

22 Hah. That shot reminds me of something I put together before the 2008 election.

That is fantastic.


Is it just me or should Slu be denouncing the shit out of himself ?

Already done. Tightened up the cilice this morning.

Posted by: Slublog at March 27, 2011 12:32 PM (t5qD1)

23 I'm still thinking that this may be BAD for our interests. Maybe because the rebels are going to be worse, maybe because "we" are handling the coalition so badly. Take your pick...orlist other reasons.

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 27, 2011 12:33 PM (XdlcF)

24 "Gingrich:  "We'll Be Running for President Within a Month."

Someone needs to tell Pelosi's sofa buddy that when a politician speaks of himself in the third person or the royal We, it's the kiss of doom. Also known as Dole's Syndrome.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 12:35 PM (AZGON)

25 I'm using our soldiers as mercenaries - paid by U.S. tax payers, of course, because we've stolen the world's wealth.

Posted by: Fair is Fair Barry at March 27, 2011 12:36 PM (xs5wK)

26 High praise, Slu. I thank ye humbly.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 12:36 PM (AZGON)

27 Maybe if there were a position of executive authority within the government who was ultimately responsible for this type of decision who could why we are in a kinetic military action time-limited, scope-limited military action WAR things would be clearer. Perhaps we could call that job "The President".
And maybe, just maybe, once we get this "President" fellow, we could ask himto go on national television and tell the American people what we're doing and why.
I know. What an imagination I've got, right?

Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 27, 2011 12:37 PM (yLJzo)

28 In Newts defense, he was probably talking about "we as a country". He's still a no-good, cheatin', sell-out tool.

Posted by: Like a low wattage ham hock at March 27, 2011 12:41 PM (lT0LC)

29 "We'll Be Running for President Within a Month."

Stick a sock in it, Newt. Nobody takes you seriously anymore.

Posted by: Soap MacTavish at March 27, 2011 12:42 PM (vbh31)

30 "And maybe, just maybe, once we get this "President" fellow, we could ask him to go on national television and tell the American people what we're doing and why."

Hey, wait... Then who is that clown racking up the miles and expenses on Air Force One, taking vacations every two days? And are you telling me we have squatters in the White House?

Where did that woman with the Klingon costume come from? Are we having a Star Trek convention in the West Wing?

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 12:42 PM (AZGON)

31 Can't go to war against Asshead after he's had so many pics taken with the grinning faces of Nanny Pelosi, Turban Durbin, Lurch, and other easily recognized Democrat faces.

It would be a windfall for GOP campaign ads, if they actually had the brains and balls to use such ads over Johnny Mac or Lindsey Grahamnesty's objections

Posted by: kbdabear at March 27, 2011 12:43 PM (vdfwz)

32 So it's okay for Clinton to bomb Serbia back to the stoneage for humanitarian reasons, it was completely fine for him to bomb an aspirin factory in Iraq because he thought it was a WMD production facility, it's okay for Obama to order a 30,000 troop surge in Afghanistan, and it's okay for Obama to bomb Libya for "humanitarian," reasons . . .
but Bush was completely out of line for invading Afghanistan on the grounds of national security risks? Bush was evil for invading Iraq for humanitarian reasons and what we perceived to be national security risks?
Better yet, it's okay for Obama to bomb a country without even seeking congressional approval, but Bush was an unconstitutional douche for following the rules by informing Congress as outlined in the War Powers Act of 1973?
Oh, and Bush totally went into Iraq for oil, even though only 1% of our total oil imports came from there. Libya has one of, if not the, highest oil reserves in Africa. But Obama doesn't care about oil, right? Only "evil Republicans" care about stuff like that . . .

Posted by: Jack Camwell at March 27, 2011 12:43 PM (y9qON)

33 Right Clinton . . . let's prevent destabilization of the area by blowing the shit of Libya. This woman needs to go back to another law firm where she can make shady real estate deals.

Posted by: rplat at March 27, 2011 12:45 PM (4vq8i)

34 Nice work on the "Memoirs of a SSC" blog, kdba. Me been lazy lately.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 12:46 PM (AZGON)

35 We have to go to war when France and Italy's vital interests (aka Libyan Oil) are at stake? Really, that's the story Hillary is sticking with? No War for Europe's Oil!
So the next question followed up and asked what "vital interests" were and tried to pin her down even more, right?

Posted by: Delusional Mama AJ at March 27, 2011 12:46 PM (XdlcF)

36 Re Hillary stepping on Bobo Gates.
This is a woman scorned, who couldn't reprimand her husband because he was President. Then she gets shafted out of her life long dream to be President Hillary by a slick half black Chicago activist.
So any wonder she's not afraid to smack down Gates. Too bad Bobo, you're not going to stop Hillary from taking her turn in the only spotlight she can find as World's Protector. And she's chafed that she might have to share that spotlight with "lesser luminaries" like Sam Powers and Susie Rice.
Hillary has probably threatened to de-ball Chelsea's beloved Mark.
Would you want Hillary Clinton as your Mother-in-Law? I think not.

Posted by: Just A Thought at March 27, 2011 12:48 PM (HqOUw)

37 I'm pretty certain our main vital interest is to present President Figurehead with nothing more taxing than two crayons and a line drawing of a golf cart.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 12:49 PM (AZGON)

38 I think people would like to support him but he's got to tell us what the hell we're supposed to be supporting first.

Not me, I still want to see him do the perp-walk. Oh, and fuck Libya.

Posted by: Peaches at March 27, 2011 12:53 PM (zxpIo)

39 Hey, wait... Then who is that clown racking up the miles and expenses on Air Force One, taking vacations every two days? And are you telling me we have squatters in the White House? Nah, that would be a mess steward and a maid living it up until we find a President.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 27, 2011 12:53 PM (yLJzo)

40 The thing that sort of bothers me is how so many on the right were
pissed at Obama for not dealing with all of this right off the bat and
now they are debating whether or not Gaddafi needs to be dealt with.

NeoCons are confused by nature.

Posted by: The Gipper at March 27, 2011 12:58 PM (xs5wK)

41 Re Hillary
Oh yeah and let's not forget VP Joe's wife on the View, or Oprah letting it slip that hubby Joe was offered both VP or Sec State.
Not to mention John Fing Kerry poaching and pre-empting Hillary.
I would not want to cross Hillary right now. She might "cut a bitch".

Posted by: Just A Thought at March 27, 2011 12:58 PM (HqOUw)

42 Call all of those al-Qaeda jerkoffs in Libya to a summit and then wipe them out.

I'm sure all our vets since 9/11 are happy that we are fighting to eradicate al-Qaeda in two countries and fighting to hand them oil and Libya at the same time.

Posted by: sifty at March 27, 2011 12:58 PM (/TRW4)

43 I honestly don't care whether or not we bomb the shit out of Libya. It's the total hypocrisy of the left that gets me angry.

The Precedent obambulates all over South America while we go to war and he's "being cautious and thoughtful". I always wondered whether these leftist talking heads knew they had a double-standard or were just stone cold stupid. There's simply no possible way they can't see they hold Precedent to a different standard at this point, so it's pretty clear they're biased and they know it. The "they're just stupid" ship has sailed.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 12:59 PM (mhmc7)

44 Let me be clear: I have bamboozled you all and I will now proceed to run amok.

Posted by: Precedent Step and Fetch at March 27, 2011 01:00 PM (vP1Pd)

45 I'm using our soldiers as mercenaries - paid by U.S. tax payers, of course, because we've stolen the world's wealth.
Posted by: Fair is Fair Barry
There is more truth to that (from the point of view of Barack Obama and his familiars) than some might realize. See, this goes along with Hillary's! comment"We asked our NATO allies to go into Afghanistan with us ten years ago..."
See, we owe the World Collective for some undefined sin, and by golly, come Karl Marx and Saul Alinsky, Barack Obama and Hillary! are going to make sure that someone is going to pay for it so they can sleep comfy at night and go places like Davos once a year and not be pestered by annoying little Euro-fuckers like George Monbiot.
Some days I really hate the Clinton gang and all their annoying little lackeys that still appear on my TV, and some days I really hate the Obama Regime and all their little empty - skulled lackeys that come on TV to apoligize/rationalize all the stupid crap that they say and do. And on Sundays I rest, except today.

Posted by: Reader C.J. Burch writes..... at March 27, 2011 01:01 PM (sJTmU)

46 Clinton = clueless
Gates = Huh?
Obama = MIA (on the golf course, I'll bet)

The only news here is that Slubdog is a "man"? I was always hoping for a hot chick...

Very disappointing.

Posted by: Marcus at March 27, 2011 01:02 PM (L397u)

47 Hillary is always the smartest person in the room, until she opens her mouth and proves she's right on a par with President Prissypants.

Posted by: Fritz at March 27, 2011 01:03 PM (FaFnu)

48 I'm sure all our vets since 9/11 are happy that we are fighting to eradicate al-Qaeda in two countries and fighting to hand them oil and Libya at the same time.
Posted by: sifty
Well they've got Admiral Mullen and Secretary Gates to speak up for them and represent their thoughts in the highest councils of the government.
And that thought makes me throw up in my mouth a little.

Posted by: Reader C.J. Burch writes..... at March 27, 2011 01:03 PM (sJTmU)

49 "Our word for every day since January 20, 2009 has been "incoherence."I'd like a new word, please.
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 11:59 AM (7utQ2)"

You could try "incompetent."

Posted by: rabidfox at March 27, 2011 01:03 PM (1SMSD)

50 The inabilty of 2 senior officials with substantial staff suppport to coordinate an answer to an inevitable question before a major media event bothers me more then us blowing some holes in various Libyans.

Posted by: Jean at March 27, 2011 01:04 PM (6gk77)

51 I was always hoping for a hot chick...
What are the odds that the one hot chick in Me. is our Slublog?
C'mon...those odds are longer than Michelle Obama's penis.

Posted by: garrett at March 27, 2011 01:05 PM (vP1Pd)

52 Oh, and one last point, if you will.
When Hillary's big effort ends up a worse clusterfuck than it is now, and President Present drops all the blame in her lap.............
I would not want to be anywhere near for the blow-up.

Posted by: Just A Thought at March 27, 2011 01:05 PM (HqOUw)

53 You better believe Gates is looking forward to stepping down now.

Posted by: CDR M at March 27, 2011 01:05 PM (5I8G0)

54 ""Where did that woman with the Klingon costume come from? Are we having a Star Trek convention in the West Wing?""

Thats just some extended family, was it Lursa or B'tor?



Oh and this-

""Hey, wait... Then who is that clown racking up the miles and expenses on
Air Force One, taking vacations every two days? And are you telling me
we have squatters in the White House?""


There is some serious brilliance there if anybody caught it. This is soooo on the money, and its theee perfect rallying cry for 2012...Lose the fucking squatters.



Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 01:06 PM (gWHrG)

55 48:

Gates should retire and open a pawn shop or a cigarette store somewhere. He's an embarrassment.

I hope Patton's ghost haunts him.

Posted by: sifty at March 27, 2011 01:06 PM (/TRW4)

56 I had not seen this interview, but if this is what Hillary actually said, I am sorry I ever supported this woman. What a completely incoherent, incompetent statement!
We should return the favor to France? hello! france didn't help us with Iraq!!
We now pretty much a president who couldn't give a damn, and a SOS who is being led by the French. And Sec Gates looks like he's ready to pull out his hair and ready to leave.

Posted by: johnc_recent_EX-dem at March 27, 2011 01:06 PM (ACkhT)

57 Posted by: Jean at March 27, 2011 01:04 PM (6gk77)

Yup. It's amateur hour. It is often hinted at in briefings I attend lately. It's like Laurel and Hardy.

Posted by: CDR M at March 27, 2011 01:07 PM (5I8G0)

58 #52 Just a Thought
My little sugar dumplin' throws a mean ashtray.
I'll be on vacay.

Posted by: Billy Jeff at March 27, 2011 01:07 PM (HqOUw)

59 The picture of the empty suit at the podium reminds me of the cover of the book "The Man Who Never Was", a true story of WWII espionage to confuse the Germans about the true natrue of the invasion of Europe.
So what if Obama is the product of espionage conducted by another country, and there really isn't a real person named Barack Hussein Obama. I mean, has anybody seen his birth certificate?
But that's just me spitballing on a Sunday afternoon.

Posted by: Reader C.J. Burch writes..... at March 27, 2011 01:08 PM (sJTmU)

60 Sticking by my assertion that Obama is the highest placed communist agent ever.

The voices still argue over whether it was the Russians or the Chinese who created and placed him.

Posted by: sifty at March 27, 2011 01:10 PM (/TRW4)

61 CMR M. We need an AOSPHQ on the high side.

Posted by: Jean at March 27, 2011 01:11 PM (C3KwS)

62 I'm still trying to get my little pointed head around the fact that the entire Mideast thinks we're the Great Satan, yet they were screaming for us to intervene in their internal matters when that's why they hate us.
I'm also concerned that we seem to be aiding the Muslim Brotherhood, a group that has mentioned more than once that they wish to overthrow us themselves.
It it just me, or has the entire world gone bonkers all of a sudden?

Posted by: BackwardsBoy at March 27, 2011 01:12 PM (d0Tfm)

63 and I just read his pathetic wife who hates America is now on schedule to give the commencement speech at West Point, yes, just what those young men and women need. Some who has admitted to be ashamed of America her entire life talk about her new found patriotism.

Posted by: johnc_recent_EX-dem at March 27, 2011 01:12 PM (ACkhT)

64 Hopefully Obama will be our Akhenaten.

Posted by: garrett at March 27, 2011 01:13 PM (vP1Pd)

65 61
CMR M. We need an AOSPHQ on the high side.

Posted by: Jean at March 27, 2011 01:11 PM (C3KwS)
LOL. Hope it would run better on the high side than it does on the low side. Can be pretty painful at work.

Posted by: CDR M at March 27, 2011 01:13 PM (5I8G0)

66 I'll admit I was for taking out crazyDaffy's Air Force early one and so was SP. But since our administration refused to be rushed and has access to full INTEL that citizens don't have - maybe they could have figured out that the rebels were Al Queda and stayed out? Especially since the window where if we would have taken out Daffy's ability to hit the rebels from the air they looked likely to win without continued help from us based on momentum had closed 3-4 days before the UN got around to the resolution?

Now we have both the "aren't we helping really bad guys against bad, but no longer much threat Daffy" AND a big commitment of military support for months if not years. Gee thanks Mr cool and logical president. This smart power is just soooo wonderful.

Posted by: Palerider at March 27, 2011 01:16 PM (ql12X)

67 I am taking a screenshot of your empty suit picture. You are racist for pointing out that it's all BLACK except for the suit, and blackness depicts emptiness.

Oh, and buy a Kindle from my Amazon store willya? EA Games is raising their online fees, and even at Costco prices these cases of Cheetos are adding up

Posted by: Charles Luther Johnson at March 27, 2011 01:16 PM (vdfwz)

68 Your betters in the Royal Progressive Elite are willing to overlook your past crimes and forgive you for being contemptible warmongering racist imperialist pig-dogs.

We welcome you into the fold of our personal Social Justice Strike Force and look forward to commanding you to attack and destroy any who oppose our vision of a New Socialist World Order.

And we may need you to pose for pictures with my sissy husband occasionally to butch him up a bit. Seriously, he makes Richard Simmons look like Charles Bronson.

-Excerpts from Queen Obama's speech to West Point, 2011

Posted by: M'Shell at March 27, 2011 01:18 PM (/TRW4)

69 34
Nice work on the "Memoirs of a SSC" blog, kdba. Me been lazy lately.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 12:46 PM

Can't let their 80th birthdays go by without comment, especially since I've read that Shatner is freaked about that milestone

Posted by: kbdabear at March 27, 2011 01:18 PM (vdfwz)

70 Pretty funny the zerohedge freakout of having two carriers in the Persian Gulf area. He's way off on where Enterprise has been but that's OK. He's got a website to run with scary, incorrect info!

Posted by: CDR M at March 27, 2011 01:19 PM (5I8G0)

71 This is a crisis of absent leadership at the top. Part of me feels a little bad for Gates and Hillary because you just know they're livid that they're being forced to explain this unexplainable position. On the other hand, they're keeping their traps shut about what a colossally incompetent commander we have. Fuck them both after all.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 01:20 PM (mhmc7)

72 The inabilty of 2 senior officials with substantial staff suppport to coordinate an answer to an inevitable question before a major media event bothers me more then us blowing some holes in various Libyans.

That should frighten everyone. This is studied incompetence. The federal government is now like a decapitated stegosaurus. Before the head was lopped away, it barely knew what the tail was doing. Now...

Maybe Barry should rename his sinecure "The Office of the President Extinct."

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 01:20 PM (AZGON)

73 ""Hopefully Obama will be our Akhenaten. ""



You know, I have been saying that since the fuckstick got elected. He IS Akhenaten, the fucker turned the entire country on it's head. I know what you mean though, hopefully his memory and name will be purged from the records.

Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 01:20 PM (gWHrG)

74 "Gingrich: "We'll Be Running for President Within a Month."





The first moron here to admit to voting for that hack needs to be hunted down and beaten with the femur of a dead hobo.

Posted by: jmflynny at March 27, 2011 01:21 PM (piMMO)

75 Hopefully Obama will be our Akhenaten.

Nice one.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 01:21 PM (AZGON)

76 Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 01:20 PM (AZGON)

Thank you for saying Stegosaurus. I thought for a second I was gonna get named again.

Posted by: The Chicken at March 27, 2011 01:23 PM (5I8G0)

77 We need to send someone a bill.

Posted by: toby928™ at March 27, 2011 01:23 PM (GTbGH)

78 Once Hillary Clinton is done with her War, she'll be bringing Barack and I our coffee.
I'm sure we can find something for her racist husband as well.
Never bring a pantsuit to a fight with a fashion Icon.

Posted by: Flotus at March 27, 2011 01:23 PM (HqOUw)

79 Soooo, lemme see. Ummmm, a 130 yard par 3 over the water. I think I'll use, ummmmmm, my bitchin' new R11 driver!

Posted by: President Wormburner McMulligan at March 27, 2011 01:23 PM (QisdI)

80 WSJ Saturday:
" Of course, just because we can't help everywhere does not mean we can't help somewhere. President Barack Obama has steered a reasonable middle course. He was right to delay action in Libya until the Arab League, the UN Security Council, France and Great Britain were fully on board, and even then to restrict our military actions and objectives. He doesn't want the US to own the Libyan problem, which could drag on chaotically for years. President Obama is not feeble, as some have said; he is cunning. "

-Robert Kaplan senior fellow, Center for new American Security
- correspondent the Atlantic.

Cunning, not feeble. Now there's a hard sell. Their emperor has no clothes. Not even a suit.

Posted by: Derak at March 27, 2011 01:24 PM (CjpKH)

81 62, unfortunately we catch the same flak from more than just the Middle East. A lot of countries say that we're so horrible for using our military might, but whenever a UN resolution is passed that calls for the use of force, who do they all call upon to lead the charge?
The world has always been bonkers, friend. The internet just allows us to view it with greater scope and ease.

Posted by: Jack Camwell at March 27, 2011 01:24 PM (y9qON)

82
This is a crisis of absent leadership at the top. Part of me feels a
little bad for Gates and Hillary because you just know they're livid
that they're being forced to explain this unexplainable position. On
the other hand, they're keeping their traps shut about what a colossally
incompetent commander we have. Fuck them both after all.

I agree with the former sentiment and disagree with the latter. Although it might feel great for the moment, how much good would it do for this country to have his own staff selling him out publicly? If anything, they need to be twisting the hell out of his arm behind the scenes. Blackmail even, I don't care, but a public admission of his failure by his own staff would not be a good thing.

Let's hope they can persuade him that it's in his best interest to retire to the cushy ex-POTUS speakers' circuit in 2012.

Posted by: jmflynny at March 27, 2011 01:24 PM (piMMO)

83 Obama will be our Akhenaten.

So he really is a Sun King then.

Posted by: toby928™ at March 27, 2011 01:24 PM (GTbGH)

84 after seeing this interview, I will campaign, donate, fundraise for anyone who is nominated as the repub candidate, I don't care if its gingrich, romney, palin, whoever. I'm really liking Trump as well.
how the hell can the country survive another 4 years of this?

Posted by: johnc_recent_EX-dem at March 27, 2011 01:24 PM (ACkhT)

85 Odipstick is not getting "credit" for many reasons, most chiefly people aren't as easily fooled as he thinks they are, especially by him.

One, Afgan was to go after al quezzies, two, saddam hussien obama was funding terrorism also. Now yes, libya has attacked us prior despite what hillary says, but this is a civil war and a large part of it is to protect europes oil interests. Secondly, you have to be a leader to get credit, not hem and haw for weeks while the advantage was there and then have a bunch of girls talk you into going to the sissy UN.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at March 27, 2011 01:26 PM (Z1jiu)

86 Hopefully Obama won't be our Ar-Pharazôn.

Posted by: sifty at March 27, 2011 01:26 PM (/TRW4)

87 so now that fraud is going to say, this will take months, first it was days, then weeks, now months. Does the community organizer understand military operations cannot be turned on and off like his teleprompter?

Posted by: johnc_recent_EX-dem at March 27, 2011 01:27 PM (ACkhT)

88 ""and I just read his pathetic wife who hates America is now on schedule
to give the commencement speech at West Point, yes, just what those
young men and women need. Some who has admitted to be ashamed of America
her entire life talk about her new found patriotism.""


How the hell does that even happen or even allowed? West point? Seriously? Wouldn't that really be a job for the CIC?

I can see it now, the new T shirts-

I busted my ass at west point, and all I got was the white house gardener.

Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 01:28 PM (gWHrG)

89 I think SIM's rant from the ONT should be posted as a thread.

a lot of people don't want another war. They just don't especially a war where we have no national interest whatsoever. Let France and England fight for their own oil. Bring Americans home.

Posted by: curious at March 27, 2011 01:31 PM (k1rwm)

90 84

after seeing this interview, I will campaign, donate, fundraise for
anyone who is nominated as the repub candidate, I don't care if its
gingrich, romney, palin, whoever. I'm really liking Trump as well.

how the hell can the country survive another 4 years of this?

Posted by: johnc_recent_EX-dem at March 27, 2011 01:24 PM (ACkhT)
"Hell, I'd vote for Elmer Fudd to keep this man out of office!"- Rush Limbaugh 3/25/11Go, Elmer!

Posted by: Derak at March 27, 2011 01:32 PM (CjpKH)

91 I have been shown pictures of your First Lady, and Secretary of State, wearing thong underwear and I understand why you are at war with my people.

Posted by: Colonel Ghadaffi, Your Brother at March 27, 2011 01:33 PM (HqOUw)

92
Pretty funny the zerohedge freakout of having two carriers in the Persian Gulf area. He's way off on where Enterprise has been but that's OK. He's got a website to run with scary, incorrect info!

I think he got that information from elsewhere (Stratfor, which I'm not familiar with, but have heard of). Is that not right-Is the Enterprise still wasting munitions on Libya?

Posted by: Methos at March 27, 2011 01:33 PM (uqJo6)

93 McCain may be the only man on algore's Earth that I would not vote for over Obama.

All others have a chance at my vote.

Posted by: sifty at March 27, 2011 01:33 PM (/TRW4)

94 Biden Opposes Obama On Libya

Be prepared to not see any articles written about dissension in the administration and disagreement over the rush to kinetic action.

Posted by: pitythefool at March 27, 2011 01:34 PM (DMMfG)

95 You know what we could really use right now?....

a "RESET" button.

Posted by: Lemmiwinks at March 27, 2011 01:34 PM (54F2e)

96 Gates: Libya Isn't In Our National Interest, Clinton: Yes it IsOnce again, the bitches are setting me up.

Posted by: President Sissypants at March 27, 2011 01:34 PM (c0A3e)

97 As soon as they get done cutting the crusts off of Barry's veggie on toast sammich, I'm sure he'll start leading these three wars like a boss.

Posted by: sifty at March 27, 2011 01:35 PM (/TRW4)

98 Haven't we reached critical mass on this administration? The media can't possibly keep this up until 2012.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 01:37 PM (mhmc7)

99 Fudd '12

Posted by: Beto at March 27, 2011 01:37 PM (H+LJc)

100 89
I think SIM's rant from the ONT should be posted as a thread.

a
lot of people don't want another war. They just don't especially a war
where we have no national interest whatsoever. Let France and England
fight for their own oil. Bring Americans home.


Posted by: curious at March 27, 2011 01:31 PM (k1rwm)
Trust me, I'm already thinking of posting it on Clarion. That was a very good piece of writing.

Posted by: CDR M at March 27, 2011 01:37 PM (5I8G0)

101 Fudd / Leghorn 2012

Gotta get the Southern Vote.

Posted by: sifty at March 27, 2011 01:37 PM (/TRW4)

102
McCain may be the only man on algore's Earth that I would not vote for over Obama.All others have a chance at my vote.

Srsly?

Posted by: Ron Paul at March 27, 2011 01:39 PM (zxpIo)

103 On the other hand, they're keeping their traps shut about what a colossally incompetent commander we have. Fuck them both after all.
Posted by: Johnny
I like that last sentence most of all.
I remember from the Eighties, Caspar Weinberger and George Schultz were always battling each other through the Sunday Morning talk shows. Never on at the same time, same show, but theyhad a somewhat different view as to what we should have been doing at any particular time. The difference was that they were both intelligent and responsible adults. Gates and Hillary!, not so much.
But I truly wonder how much worse things would be ifGates had not stayed on asSecDef after Obama's election.

Posted by: Reader C.J. Burch writes..... at March 27, 2011 01:40 PM (sJTmU)

104 Fudd / Leghorn Gonzales 2012Gotta get the Southern Immigrant Vote.


Posted by: FIFY, but don't really want credit at March 27, 2011 01:41 PM (uqJo6)

105 All others have a chance at my vote.

Srsly?


Posted by: Ron Paul at March 27, 2011 01:39 PM (zxpIo)
Hell yeah!


Posted by: Jon Huntsman at March 27, 2011 01:42 PM (uqJo6)

106 But I truly wonder how much worse things would be ifGates had not stayed on asSecDef after Obama's election.

No shit. Odds are, Barry would've been beating the bushes for another racist retard like Holder to fill the position.

Posted by: Peaches at March 27, 2011 01:45 PM (zxpIo)

107 But I truly wonder how much worse things would be ifGates had not stayed on asSecDef after Obama's election.
Wasn't Sen. Kerry Horseface in line to be SecDef if Gates hadn't stayed on?Dear Lord, I dread to think how much less coherent our foreign policy would be if that had transpired...

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at March 27, 2011 01:45 PM (c0A3e)

108 I have advised the President that I can be on the ground in Libya, following the glorious victory of our allies, ready with my Transit and Level, to bring them jobs via our visionary plan for high speed rail.

Posted by: Joe Biden, Genius and Polymath at March 27, 2011 01:46 PM (HqOUw)

109 99
Fudd '12


Posted by: Beto at March 27, 2011 01:37 PM

Wabbit in '12 !!

Posted by: Bugs Bunny at March 27, 2011 01:48 PM (vdfwz)

110 Which, of course, begs the question: Why?
If you don't understand how to use a common figure of speech, you shouldn't call yourselfa professional writer.

Posted by: Cicero at March 27, 2011 01:48 PM (QKKT0)

111 109
99
Fudd '12


Posted by: Beto at March 27, 2011 01:37 PM

Wabbit in '12 !!


Posted by: Bugs Bunny at March 27, 2011 01:48 PM

Duck in '12 !!!!!

Posted by: Daffy Duck at March 27, 2011 01:48 PM (vdfwz)

112 Wait until the "rebels" start slaughtering the other side, then what is Prez Mulligan Omomjeans gonna do? I'll tell ya, send in forces to keep the sides apart ala Bosnia.

I can see it from my house.

Posted by: Guy Fawkes at March 27, 2011 01:51 PM (Z1jiu)

113 Hassan chop 2012!

Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 01:54 PM (gWHrG)

114 Hopefully Obama won't be our Ar-Pharazôn.

Nice.

Posted by: that guy that compliments other's obscure cultural references at March 27, 2011 02:00 PM (GTbGH)

115 I've given up trying to argue with liberal friends about Barry's competency. If they can't see it now, they never will. I honestly believe if the organizer-in-chief declared war on Canada and Mexico simultaneously, his base could play enough mental gymnastics to support it.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 02:04 PM (mhmc7)

116 This war is for the economic interests of France and Britain like Suez in 1956.
Usa has been lied by France like in 1914. Now Usa waste billions in a war for french interest.
Haiti, Algeria, and very important results of french politic since 1919 show they are not interested in human rights, that is ridicule, they are the most amoral country in the world

Cirenaicans oppositers of Gadaffi are also more tendent to integrism than Gadaffi s regimen.
If it is for human rights, against powerty for corruption, for women equal rights these are countries that need an intervention more quickly than Lybia.
Arabia Saudi, Kuwayt, Arabia Saudi, Ecuatorial Guinea, Arabia Saudi, Thailand, Arabia Saudi, Guatemala, Arabia Saudi, Sudan.
Thanks for this space.

Posted by: Anthony at March 27, 2011 02:07 PM (C6hB5)

117 Fudd/Taz 2012
Because it's time for someone less looney...

Posted by: jmflynny at March 27, 2011 02:09 PM (piMMO)

118 I've given up trying to argue with liberal friends about Barry's competency. If they can't see it now, they never will.
"Oh, yes, I can see why you would think he's smart," works pretty well.

Posted by: AmishDude at March 27, 2011 02:11 PM (BvBKY)

119 OT - That Smart Military Network, NPR, ran a news feature this morning about the USS Essex (LHD-2), an amphibious landingassualt ship (mainly a helicopter and hovercraft carrier), and the great work its crew is doing in support of the Japanese during the post-earthquake / tsunamirescue and recovery effort.
The Smart Military Newsroom at NPR also mentioned several times that the Essex "once fought against the Japanese in the Pacific in WWII", apparently confusing the 4th USS Essex (CV-9), with this one, which is the 5th US ship to bear the name.
So, NPR, let me phrase it in a way you can better understand:
"The Essex has always been at peace with Japan!"

Posted by: sherlock at March 27, 2011 02:11 PM (thr9V)

120 I still like my idea of a genetically-engineered goat STD to rot their dicks off.

Posted by: Bugler at March 27, 2011 02:11 PM (VXBR1)

121

Obama/Biden 2012
America: Not quite dead, yet.

Posted by: jmflynny at March 27, 2011 02:16 PM (piMMO)

122 Obama has to sort out the differing layers of totalitarian governments in the Middle East, which ones are more or less allied with the US on important US interests, and quit being harsher on our friends. Anyone who thinks the Middle East revolves around Israel and some Jews living in condos, ooooooooh, "illegally" just got a big wake-up call.
Snoozed, no doubt.
He's too consistently opposed to US allies and deferential to adversaries to ascribe it to mere incompetence any more. The Left has reflexively made excuses for those who wanted to kill Americans for a few generations now.Now we get the Left functionally allied with neo-fascist jihadi groups like al-Qaeda, crazedtheocraticTwelvers in Iran, and neocoms like Chavez or Morales against their common enemy: Middle America. The worst of all possible worlds.
Any good deals on mine shafts?

Posted by: Beagle at March 27, 2011 02:17 PM (sOtz/)

123 Might makes right!
Might for Right!
Might for Might!
Right for Might!
Fight, Fight, Fight!

Posted by: Random Conniptin at March 27, 2011 02:19 PM (xaCZY)

124 OT - That Smart Military Network, NPR, ran a news feature this morning about the USS Essex (LHD-2), an amphibious landingassualt ship (mainly a helicopter and hovercraft carrier), and the great work its crew is doing in support of the Japanese during the post-earthquake / tsunamirescue and recovery effort.
The Smart Military Newsroom at NPR also mentioned several times that the Essex "once fought against the Japanese in the Pacific in WWII", apparently confusing the 4th USS Essex (CV-9), with this one, which is the 5th US ship to bear the name.
Why let historical fact get in the way of a great story hook?
This just in: Old Ironsides just fired a broadside at Tripoli! Film at 11!

Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 27, 2011 02:24 PM (yLJzo)

125 The Clothes have no Emperor...

Posted by: phreshone at March 27, 2011 02:25 PM (T3vCe)

126 And the Enterprise just blasted 'em with her phasers!

Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 27, 2011 02:25 PM (yLJzo)

127 Somehow, when I think that we're helping out the Libyan rebels even after we've found out that they're cozy with AQ and the MB, the phrase "giving aid and comfort to the enemy" springs immediately to mind...

Posted by: BackwardsBoy at March 27, 2011 02:27 PM (d0Tfm)

128 I was expecting a clown show, but instead we got a circus fire...

Posted by: phreshone at March 27, 2011 02:27 PM (T3vCe)

129 In 2008, I more or less believed every criticism of Obama as a radical extremist who cared little for America's greatness. I would not, however, have believed that in 2011 he would order our troops to fight on the same side as al-Qaeda.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around this.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 02:28 PM (mhmc7)

130 125 The Clothes have no Emperor...
Posted by: phreshone at March 27, 2011 02:25 PM (T3vCe)
Thread. Winner.

Posted by: AmishDude at March 27, 2011 02:28 PM (BvBKY)

131 Whoever told"Barry" that Libya was full of Tea Partiers has a lot to answer for.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 27, 2011 02:30 PM (yLJzo)

132 The Clothes have no Emperor...
well done

Posted by: garrett at March 27, 2011 02:33 PM (9yG6U)

133 124
This just in: Old Ironsides just fired a broadside at Tripoli! Film at 11!

That was fast!
At least 6 explosions heard in Tripoli - Reuters

Posted by: lurker at March 27, 2011 02:34 PM (6Z/5E)

134 Hillary's going to know where all the bodies are buried and she's not going to be a good team player in 2012.

It will be interesting to see what move she makes against His Emptiness, regardless of whather or not she runs. I'm sure she and Bill would like nothing better than to get a little cold revenge for some of the shit that went down in 2008.

Posted by: nickless at March 27, 2011 02:35 PM (MMC8r)

135 Johnny, are we sure that they are actual al Qaeda? I have no illusions about them being the good guys, but doesn't Qaddafi have a habit of calling all of his enemies "al Qaeda"?
Also, "the rebels" are bound to be disorganized and with various factions.

Posted by: AmishDude at March 27, 2011 02:36 PM (BvBKY)

136 Johnny, are we sure that they are actual al Qaeda? I have no illusions about them being the good guys, but doesn't Qaddafi have a habit of calling all of his enemies "al Qaeda"?
Also, "the rebels" are bound to be disorganized and with various factions.
Posted by: AmishDude at March 27, 2011 02:36 PM (BvBKY)
Good question. What does the CIA have to say about all this?

AHAHAHAHAHA! I kill me sometimes...

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 02:39 PM (QisdI)

137 Rumsfeld on Libya: (video at link)

Former Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld used the word “confusion”
six times in an interview on ABC News’ ‘This Week’ to describe the
United Nations-backed military effort in Libya.
“The first thing you have to do,” Rumsfeld told ABC News’ Senior
White House Correspondent Jake Tapper, “is recognize…the mission has to
determine the coalition. The coalition ought not determine the mission.”
“If you go into something with confusion and ambiguity about what the
mission is – and we’ve heard four or five different explanations about
why we’re there – and that is the root of the problem. The confusion
that comes from that,” Rumsfeld told Tapper on “This Week.”
“Confusion about what the mission is, confusion about who the rebels
are, confusion about whether or not Gadhafi should be left in power,
confusion about what the command and control should be,” Rumsfeld said.
The former defense secretary, who served in that position under both
Presidents Gerald Ford and George W. Bush, told Tapper he thought the
coalition involved in the Libya mission did not compare favorably to the
coalition President George W. Bush put together to fight the “global
war on terror.”
“The coalition that is in place with respect to Libya is the smallest one in modern history,” Rumsfeld said.
“We had over 90 countries in the global war on terror that President
Bush and Colin Powell put in place. We had dozens of countries involved
in Afghanistan, dozens of countries involved in Iraq. … And still, the
Democrats were alleging that it was President Bush was a unilateralist.
It’s nonsense,” he insisted.

Posted by: momma at March 27, 2011 02:42 PM (penCf)

138 Johnny, are we sure that they are actual al Qaeda? I have no illusions
about them being the good guys, but doesn't Qaddafi have a habit of
calling all of his enemies "al Qaeda"?

No one is sure, but we do know that al-Qaeda has had operations in Libya for some time now and there are on-the-ground reports that the rebels are aligned with al-Qaeda.

It's certainly hard to tell, but I'm sure our President will clear things up in the address tomorrow.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 02:44 PM (mhmc7)

139 The Muslim Brotherhood is behind many of these uprisings in the Middle East, from what I've managed to gather. These things are portrayed as a "spontaneous student protest" but reality paints a much different picture. Even our unions are getting into the act, along with teh Code Pinkos and the antiChrist, George Soros.
Normally, I'm all for us standing up for our interests wherever we need to.
I can't seem to find any in Labya. Personally, I'd much prefer to arm both sides in this conflict and allow them to settle it amongst themselves.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy at March 27, 2011 02:45 PM (d0Tfm)

140 so now that fraud is going to say, this will take months, first it was days, then weeks, now months.
He said he wanted it to be days, so clearly the military is not listening to him and is racist.

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 27, 2011 02:46 PM (XdlcF)

141 Clinton was never qualified to be SOS let alone POTUS. As a NY senator she didn’t do squat except reward her rich Manhattan friends who helped her get re-elected. She was the “wife” of a POTUS and that’s about it.
It’s bad enough having Toonces Overpar as president – having senior admin officials be this incompetent is truly scary.
My heart goes out to our military having these nitwits at the controls.

Posted by: Cheri at March 27, 2011 02:47 PM (BA8k3)

142 Good question. What does the CIA have to say about all this?
AHAHAHAHAHA! I kill me sometimes...
Well, USA Today is a weekday paper, so we won't know until Monday.

Posted by: jmflynny at March 27, 2011 02:47 PM (piMMO)

143 It's in our national interest for someone to be pouring me my coffee.

Posted by: Bill Clinton at March 27, 2011 02:48 PM (AZGON)

144 My heart goes out to our military having these nitwits at the controls.
Posted by: Cheri at March 27, 2011 02:47 PM (BA8k3)
Amen to that.

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 02:49 PM (QisdI)

145 Posted by: Bill Clinton at March 27, 2011 02:48 PM (AZGON)

Top You Off?

Posted by: Monica 'the Humidor' Lewinsky at March 27, 2011 02:51 PM (9yG6U)

146 He said he wanted it to be days, so clearly the military is not listening to him and is racist.

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 27, 2011 02:46 PM (XdlcF)

Obama is a maths genius, so he knows as well as Paul Erdos that any quantity of Weeks may be easily expressed as Days by multiplying by seven. We may end up piddling around in "Lybia" for 4500 days or so, but we won't ever express that in weeks (let along months or years).

Posted by: Like a low wattage ham hock at March 27, 2011 02:52 PM (lT0LC)

147 Amen to that.
Make that two. I have a good friend with a son over there right now, and many more friends with kids in all the theaters. I pray that they never get The Call.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy at March 27, 2011 02:53 PM (d0Tfm)

148 It's in our national interest to have a clean, articulate black man play golf. That's just geopolitics; it's a big fucking deal.

Posted by: Joe Biden at March 27, 2011 02:54 PM (AZGON)

149 I'd like to see Dick Cheney on Fox giving a review of Obama's Libya Policy / Actions...complete with telestrator.

Posted by: garrett at March 27, 2011 02:54 PM (9yG6U)

150 Obama's speaking tomorrow night. I'm literally afraid to tune in.

Posted by: Dianna at March 27, 2011 02:55 PM (mKMj1)

151 Obama's speaking tomorrow night. I'm literally afraid to tune in.

No worries. He's delivering it in Austrian, so no one will understand a word.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 02:56 PM (AZGON)

152 Fuck it. I want to see Dick Cheney's 'War Machine' on before 'Red Eye' each and every weeknight.
Make it a total ripoff of George Michael's 'Sports Machine'. Complete with feel good stories, oversized buttons and War Porn!

Posted by: garrett at March 27, 2011 02:57 PM (9yG6U)

153 Obama's speaking tomorrow night. I'm literally afraid to tune in.
Posted by: Dianna at March 27, 2011 02:55 PM (mKMj1)
I wonder how many times he'll contradict himself?

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 02:57 PM (QisdI)

154 OT but better watch this game. VCU has Kansas on their heels. They may Shaka the world just yet.

Go Rams!

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 02:58 PM (BP6Z1)

155 Let him be clear.

Posted by: garrett at March 27, 2011 02:58 PM (9yG6U)

156
The Muslim Brotherhood is behind many of these uprisings in the Middle East, from what I've managed to gather.
The activity in Barhain, combined with comments made by officials in the regime, makes me suspect Iran (right across the water from them). The MB is an established part of radicalism in Africa, and AQ is the Burger King of the MidEast-- franchise opportunities in your area!

Quite possibly it's all of them in concert, just differentiations between various parts of the Ummah.
The only thing I don't buy in most of these countries (other than Iran, which has had a known movement for some time) is 'spontaneous democratic uprisings.'

Posted by: nickless at March 27, 2011 02:59 PM (MMC8r)

157 Posted by: garrett at March 27, 2011 02:57 PM (9yG6U)
That's a pretty sweet idea! He could make the opening sequence the scene from Apocalypse Now when the Air Cav unit comes in and starts blowing the shit out of the Vietnamese village with Ride of the Valkyries blaring.

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 03:00 PM (QisdI)

158 Make no mistake, our kinetic military action in Libya is not a mistake.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 03:01 PM (mhmc7)

159

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"Is that not right-Is the Enterprise still wasting munitions on Libya?"
I’ll admit that I haven’t kept my finger on the pulse of BG
operations in 5th Fleet AOR of late, but I don't think Big 'E' itself has been involved in the Libya think. I could be wrong, of course.

The last I knew, on the day
shit was starting to hit the fan in Libya (Feb. 15), The Big ‘E’ was sent the
wrong way through the Suez. (I read some retired admiral blasting President Prissypants for that, saying the military is subject to determinations made by civilians).

From reading Eagles Nest just a few days ago, I seem to
recall Big E was in the Arabian Sea on anti-pirate duty – in case, you
know, the Somali cut-throats at HQ in Mogadishu decided to launch their attack
aircraft against the U.N. flotilla.

Posted by: fly at March 27, 2011 03:01 PM (uEUIo)

160
Honduran President Porfirio Lobo on Sunday threatened to fire teachers
if they continue a three-week-old strike that has aggravated divisions
caused by a 2009 coup.

Once again President Lobo shows President Barack "I'm Not A Pussy" Obama how to distill it down to the bare essentials and get 'er done.

Posted by: Fish the Impaler at March 27, 2011 03:01 PM (ZHsNw)

161 Sorry, that first paragraph in 156 shoulda been italicized.

Posted by: nickless at March 27, 2011 03:02 PM (MMC8r)

162 I wonder how many times he'll contradict himself?

Tomorrow night, Lord Unicorn: "I have been consistently clear on the coalition's mission in Libya, which is not regime change or nation building; however Colonel Gaddaffi must understand that he must listen to the aspirations of his people and leave in an orderly fashion within days. This does not mean we are arrogantly dictating the destiny of Libya. We will persist in our potentially kinetic military mission which is at once wide and flexible as well as pinpoint and fixed in determination. Our plans are for a noninterventional interdiction which will be strictly limited to days, even if it takes months to achieve. I have been consistent and clear on this matter."

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 03:04 PM (AZGON)

163 Kansas looks like the 11 seed. Holy shit.

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 03:04 PM (BP6Z1)

164 Honduran President Porfirio Lobo on Sunday threatened to fire teachers
if they continue a three-week-old strike that has aggravated divisions
caused by a 2009 coup.

Once again President Lobo shows President
Barack "I'm Not A Pussy" Obama how to distill it down to the bare
essentials and get 'er done.



Posted by: Fish the Impaler at March 27, 2011 03:01 PM (ZHsNw)
--That's awesome. Attention RINOs: Honduras is a banana republic that has seen bona fide unrest and wars. If Lobo can stand up, you can.

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 03:06 PM (BP6Z1)

165 Kansas looks like the 11 seed. Holy shit.
VCU has crazy energy.

Posted by: Delta Smelt at March 27, 2011 03:07 PM (dWPyO)

166 I guess I'm not alone in wondering who'se in charge of intelligence for this crew in Washington today. And if anyone has enough intelligence to understand the intelligence they're getting...

Posted by: BackwardsBoy at March 27, 2011 03:07 PM (d0Tfm)

167 Personally, I'd much prefer to arm both sides in this conflict and allow them to settle it amongst themselves.

A nice slow-motion replay of the almost decade long Iraq-Iran (1980-198 war sound good? Sometime when I'm feeling energetic I'm going to graph the American GDP, oil prices, and a few other variables across that time frame.

I have a feeling that graph would point to one inescapable conclusion which can be summed up in three words: Good times.

Posted by: Downscaled Upscale at March 27, 2011 03:08 PM (IhHdM)

168 I wonder how many times he'll contradict himself?
Why would you ask that?? Quoting him via Roger Simon and Ed Driscoll:

And that’s why building this international coalition has been so important because it means that the United States is not bearing all the cost. It means that we have confidence that we are not going in alone, and it is our military that is being volunteered by others to carry out missions that are important not only to us, but are important internationally.

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 27, 2011 03:08 PM (XdlcF)

169 Once again President Lobo shows President Barack "I'm Not A Pussy" Obama how to distill it down to the bare essentials and get 'er done.
Posted by: Fish the Impaler at March 27, 2011 03:01 PM (ZHsNw)
FIFY. At least there's one vagina in the marital relationship.

Posted by: Canadian Infidel at March 27, 2011 03:09 PM (GKQDR)

170 I don't see how this will improve teh one's poll numbers. he might get daffy but weeks later, his numbers will go to normal because no one can afford gas. Rebels have taken another town right in the middle coast of libya. daffy's forces are packed in the west. What will happen?

Posted by: Flapjackmaka at March 27, 2011 03:09 PM (c5RQr)

171
VCU has crazy energy.

Posted by: Delta Smelt at March 27, 2011 03:07 PM (dWPyO)
--I hope they tap the brakes a little in the 2nd. If they're up 15 then they are in command of the pace.

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 03:09 PM (BP6Z1)

172 @168
That quote alone shows this half-man in a golf cart is above all a finely-honed bullshit artist.

He would piss in your mouth and tell you it was sacramental wine.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 03:10 PM (AZGON)

173 Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 03:04 PM (AZGON)
Bravo, sir! Bravo!

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 03:10 PM (QisdI)

174 On that show that shall not be mentioned it was said that this looks like it is right out of the clinton playbook for how he got elected to his second term. I don't know the particulars but they lined it up quite nicely. Guess everyone believes the American people are just plain stupid.

Posted by: curious at March 27, 2011 03:11 PM (k1rwm)

175 Well, I will give Obama credit for one thing. With the enormous number of secretaries, czars, directors, staffers, and the multitude of other appointments he's made to our even expanding government, you'd think that he'd, by accident at least, have put at least one competent person to work by now.

Alas, he has defied all mathematical probability and managed not to hire anyone with any semblance of intelligence or even the least bit qualified to hold any position above janitor. Unprecedented.

Which reminds me... As I recall, Capt. Adults-R-In-Charge-Fomer-Constitutional-Scholar had dozens of important posts and federal judge positions that remained vacant for over a year since his inauguration. This, despite creating the non-existent "Office of the President Elect", appointing the largest number of czars in history, and all the other meaningless hoopla. Any word of whether any of this got done yet? Strangely, I never heard any updates from the media on this item.

Posted by: Damiano at March 27, 2011 03:11 PM (3nrx7)

176 Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 03:04 PM (AZGON)

--Did you steal my Teleprompter?

Posted by: Barky McFuckpants at March 27, 2011 03:12 PM (BP6Z1)

177 Man, that quote is a real pisser. It makes me want to spit in his face. What a passive-aggressive psychotic.

Read this again:
and it is our military that is being volunteered by others

Does he not know he is the CinC? He is ordering our military to do what they are doing. He is responsible. Yet he must use the passive voice as if he's just the bystander, professorial in his disdain and cynically gimlet eyeball.

I have never hated a politician as much as this flatworm with jugears.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 03:13 PM (AZGON)

178 I won't be able to watch the Fucker-in-Chief tomorrow night. Just can't take his incompetent bullshit anymore.

Posted by: Cheri at March 27, 2011 03:14 PM (BA8k3)

179 As I recall, Capt. Adults-R-In-Charge-Fomer-Constitutional-Scholar had dozens of important posts and federal judge positions that remained vacant for over a year since his inauguration.

You weren't supposed to have a functioning memory and be paying attention.

Posted by: The MBM at March 27, 2011 03:14 PM (AZGON)

180 ""Obama's speaking tomorrow night. I'm literally afraid to tune in.""


I won't waste the electricity, or life off the TV tube on his speech. If I did turn it on it would only be long enough to flick a beer cap at the screen, blow a bong hit in his general direction, then press my ass against the TV.

Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 03:15 PM (gWHrG)

181 Bill Self looks like he'd gonna blow a gasket.

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 03:15 PM (BP6Z1)

182 175
Well, I will give Obama credit for one thing. With the enormous number
of secretaries, czars, directors, staffers, and the multitude of other
appointments he's made to our even expanding government, you'd think
that he'd, by accident at least, have put at least one competent person
to work by now.

Put aside the assumption that Obama wants things to work correctly, and everything he has done so far begins to make sense.

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at March 27, 2011 03:16 PM (c0A3e)

183 Does he not know he is the CinC?
I think you are unclear about what that means.

Posted by: The Chicken in Charge at March 27, 2011 03:17 PM (XdlcF)

184 I'd suggest a drinking game for tomorrow night's speech- drink on every "as I've always said" and "let me be clear" but I don't think our current economy could support the production of or purchase of the necessary levels of booze.

Besides that, I don't think Obamacare will have the Unicorn-pulled Ambulances in service until 2014 or so, so we'd have no way to get everyone to the hospital for treatment of the inevitable alcohol poisoning.

Posted by: Damiano at March 27, 2011 03:17 PM (3nrx7)

185 Put aside the assumption that Obama wants things to work correctly, and everything he has done so far begins to make sense.

It is getting embarrassing to maintain any longer that this is just mere incompetence.

But that's okay. People like Medved will continue to tell us Barry loves this country as much as you do.

Posted by: George Orwell at March 27, 2011 03:18 PM (AZGON)

186
You're all looking at this the wrong way.

Clarity is bad for Obama. His intention is to keep people guessing.

He's the dynamic kinetic president.

Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:18 PM (sPHjn)

187 you know, any day now I expect Beck to come on Fox news with "the obama playbook" sent to him by "someone in the White House" who maybe doesn't agree with following the playbook.

Must be awfully difficult to hire at the White House. Someone might appear to be perfect in every way and be a closet conservative.

Posted by: curious at March 27, 2011 03:19 PM (k1rwm)

188 Always worth re-linking

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 03:19 PM (BP6Z1)

189
As I predicted, the stupid Republicans are falling in line behind Obama. This is going to kill us politically in 2012.


Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:19 PM (sPHjn)

190 I'd suggest a drinking game for tomorrow night's speech- drink on every "as I've always said" and "let me be clear" but I don't think our current economy could support the production of or purchase of the necessary levels of booze.
I expect him to start saying "winning!" every other sentence/

Posted by: robtr at March 27, 2011 03:20 PM (MtwBb)

191 OT: Rep. Anthony Weiner bashes Middle America
@RepWeiner: Perhaps the best thing of the week. The Iowa tea posse stops brushing their tooth long enough to boo me. #ilovehowcrazyimakethem

Posted by: Miss'80sBaby at March 27, 2011 03:20 PM (UO6+e)

192 Let's go racing! Boogity-boogity!

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 03:20 PM (mhmc7)

193 If I did turn it on it would only be long enough to flick a beer cap at the screen, blow a bong hit in his general direction, then press my ass against the TV.
Awesome.....what time should we be over?

Posted by: Cheri at March 27, 2011 03:20 PM (BA8k3)

194 Clinton was never qualified to be SOS let alone POTUS
Does anyone doubt though that she's probably the second-most qualified of Obama's cabinet secretaries? Certainly in the top 3.
It is damning with faint praise, but there it is.

Posted by: AmishDude at March 27, 2011 03:20 PM (BvBKY)

195 I won't be able to watch the Fucker-in-Chief tomorrow night. Just can't take his incompetent bullshit anymore.
Posted by: Cheri at March 27, 2011 03:14 PM (BA8k3)
I reached that point a while ago. I can't bear to even listen to his voice. This candy ass piece of shit cannot get the fuck out of the White House soon enough.

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 03:21 PM (QisdI)

196 OMG, logprof, you're right, he will be selling coalitions, not missles!

Posted by: Mama AJ at March 27, 2011 03:21 PM (XdlcF)

197 ""Awesome.....what time should we be over?""



The debauchery starts at sundown. lol

Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 03:21 PM (gWHrG)

198 Appropriately, Toonces the Cat is on a Geico commercial.

Posted by: USS Diversity at March 27, 2011 03:22 PM (gJNMj)

199 Pay attention morans. It is OK for Demorats to wage wars. But not repubs. The evil BOOOOSHH. WW1, WW2, Korea, Nam. And how many of the leftist heros have massacred people? Chairman Mao ring a bell? It too is OK for them to massacre people. It is ignored. So dont buy this bullshit.

Posted by: Hous Bin Pharteen at March 27, 2011 03:22 PM (V+/pV)

200
oh, and Bill Kristol never met a foreign conflict he didn't volunteer others to fight in.


Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:23 PM (sPHjn)

201 If The Vapid One™ was giving a speech in my living room, I wouldn't get out of bed to gohear him.
He's like that Far Side cartoon of the man talking to the dog and all the dog hears is "Blah, blah blah." I'm the dog.
How can you tell the president is lying? His lips are moving...*rimshot*
What? That joke worked back in the Nixon days! Sheesh, you're a tough crowd.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy at March 27, 2011 03:24 PM (d0Tfm)

202 I'm amazed that VCU's leading scored averaged just 15. That shows that either the teams sucks, or it is very good at distributing the ball.

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 03:25 PM (BP6Z1)

203 I think the "empty suit" is doing what his daddy wanted. To send the USA back to a third world country. That is his Hope and Change. Socialist Utopia!

Posted by: Hous Bin Pharteen at March 27, 2011 03:25 PM (V+/pV)

204 I know that he's been busy, but has there been any word on whether or not Sir Golfs-A-Lot has spoken to anyone in his Cabinet yet this year?

I know last year, the White House staff was still busy putting together phone lists and updating his super-duper Blackberry.

Posted by: Damiano at March 27, 2011 03:26 PM (3nrx7)

205 "...but Gaddafi is a mass murdering sob with the blood of hundreds of Americans on his hands. He is not only threatening genocide in his own country, he has a history as a supporter of terrorism with a penchant for wmd. He is a dangerous man and for decades the world has known this."

That describes the Assad's to a T. But we're all happy face with them.

Posted by: richard mcenroe at March 27, 2011 03:27 PM (qvify)

206 Brad Stephens looks like he's heading to a chem lab or a frat party, not coaching a Final Four team.

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 03:27 PM (BP6Z1)

207 If I did turn it on it would only be long enough to flick a beer cap at the screen, blow a bong hit in his general direction, then press my ass against the TV.
I'll bring the Gargle-Blasters!

Posted by: Dodge Prefect, Ford's little brother at March 27, 2011 03:28 PM (d0Tfm)

208
/scratches chin

hmmm, if only we had something to use against Obama...golly gee willickers, Obama is darned good at being president...if only he'd make a mistake we could exploit...

Posted by: GOP presidential hopefuls at March 27, 2011 03:29 PM (sPHjn)

209 ""That describes the Assad's to a T. But we're all happy face with them.""


Only because they agreed to let Bela Pelosi retire there, and its in our national interest not to blow THAT deal.


Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 03:29 PM (gWHrG)

210 O/T: Wow, we have great contributors here. Stewart Varney just said a whole bunch of stuff that our Monty has been saying.

Posted by: curious at March 27, 2011 03:30 PM (k1rwm)

211
you'd think somewhere Ramsay Clark is having a stroke

that's what you'd think

Posted by: GOP presidential hopefuls at March 27, 2011 03:30 PM (sPHjn)

212 @203

I think that you're on to something!

If the U.S. stays on the Obamanomics program much longer, his brother in Kenya will be rich compared to us.

Huh, guess he was looking out for his bro' after all.

Posted by: Damiano at March 27, 2011 03:30 PM (3nrx7)

213 Brad Stephens looks like he's heading to a chem lab or a frat party
He's the anti Calipari. Doesn't give off the slick huckster vibe at all.

Posted by: Delta Smelt at March 27, 2011 03:31 PM (dWPyO)

214 If we're keeping score, I'd say even factoring in Euro 'help' in
Afghanistan, the whole, "thanks for saving us from the Nazis and
keeping the Soviets in check for 40 plus years" account isn't quite even
yet.

Years ago, I got into an argument with a British lefty over Reagan. At one point, I said "Does he get any credit for winning the Cold War?" And he said, "What Cold War?"

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:31 PM (McG46)

215
That describes the Assad's to a T. But we're all happy face with them.

Along with Iran. When are we going to institute an NFZ around Syria and Iran?

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at March 27, 2011 03:31 PM (c0A3e)

216 210 O/T:  Wow, we have great contributors here.  Stewart Varney just said a whole bunch of stuff that our Monty has been saying. 
Posted by: curious at March 27, 2011 03:30 PM (k1rwm)

...

Has anyone seen Stewart Varney on TV and a Monty post show up at the same time?

Hmmmm...

Posted by: Damiano at March 27, 2011 03:32 PM (3nrx7)

217 So let me get this straight. This mission is to spend hundreds of millions of dollars of ordnance over an undefined perios of time, to defend people, we still do know who, except for the identified Islamic terrorists, and put them under the peacekeeping and humanitarian protection of several bankrupt European countries who colonized those same people for over two hundred years and kept them forcibly in line by everything from muskets to poison gas thus ensuring their welcome back.

I don't see how we can fail, do you?

Posted by: richard mcenroe at March 27, 2011 03:32 PM (qvify)

218 ""I'll bring the Gargle-Blasters!""

I want the pan-galactic version, and leave beeblebrox at home.

Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 03:33 PM (gWHrG)

219 205 richard... It is Okay for genocide from Marx people. It is just because he is doing to "freedow fighters" who wish to spread Jihad on the west. They need these fighters in the 'stan. Not fighting Gadaffy in Libya, back home!

Posted by: Hous Bin Pharteen at March 27, 2011 03:33 PM (V+/pV)

220
WTF?

Posted by: the Darfuri at March 27, 2011 03:34 PM (sPHjn)

221 WTF?

Posted by: the Darfuri at March 27, 2011 03:34 PM (sPHjn)
The Libyans are lighter skinned.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:36 PM (McG46)

222 At this point, the tar baby is stuck fast to our stick.
So my question is, what do we do now? We've had special teams all throughout Africa trying to instill goodwill through good works for several years now (See Imperial Grunts by Kaplan). It's been shot to hell by Pres__ent Clueless. What a phenominal waste of both opportunity and effort.
We need a non-Obama exit strategy from this whole Middle East slide into Medievalism, and we need someone other than Beltway types like Kaus to formulate it. It's going to hurt like when they rip the duct tape from your eyes after the ransom was paid. And like the ear before that. You know what I mean. But at least I'm back.
Anyway, what to do now?

Posted by: K~Bob at March 27, 2011 03:37 PM (3xjfw)

223 The Libyans are lighter skinned.
Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:36 PM (McG46)
Those are my peeps!

Posted by: Eric Holder at March 27, 2011 03:37 PM (QisdI)

224
Did you hear this?

Obama plans to finance Operation Reelection with the Defense Department's budget funds.

Of course this isn't feasible and he'll eventually ask Congress for a supplemental. Which of course the Republicans will trip over themselves giving it to him while putting us further into debt for Obama's reelection campaign.


Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:37 PM (sPHjn)

225 drewsie, you just don't support the troops, do you? When it was George Bush throwing money US doesn't have an Iraq, where are you bitching about whether the war was in our "national interest"?

Well, drewsie, you didn't complain then, because you're a fucking dick. The only thing you care about is some abstract victory against... I'm really not sure. I guess you just like stabbing the troops in the back.

Posted by: leonard maltin at March 27, 2011 03:37 PM (JaL+E)

226 Breaking News:
President Obumbles to visit the US. Plans to stay for a couple days to enjoy American golf courses. Photos at eleven.

Posted by: chuck in st paul at March 27, 2011 03:39 PM (EhYdw)

227
So what do you guys think? In about 10 days Obama will ask for $5B to fund his Libyan fiasco?


Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:39 PM (sPHjn)

228 Anyway, what to do now?

A. Go all in with the Israelis. Amazing how a developed parliamentary democracy makes a more stable ally, huh? (Note to Paultards: Shut up.)

B. We have to get serious about our energy situation. Monday morming 9AM.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 03:40 PM (7utQ2)

229
Under my new world order scenario, and for equal opportunity at command, countries like Zimbabwe and Zamunda will be given the lead role of directing US Armed Forces, and all members under my leadership will defer to and accept all direct orders from these exceptionally qualified foreign Officer's. There will be no exceptions or waivers to the stated policy.

Barack Hussein Obama
Commanding

Posted by: BH & Michelle Obama, Fashion Plates & Okra Too! at March 27, 2011 03:40 PM (ZHsNw)

230 We need a non-Obama exit strategy from this whole
Middle East slide into Medievalism, and we need someone other than
Beltway types like Kaus to formulate it.

Anyway, what to do now?

Posted by: K~Bob at March 27, 2011 03:37 PM (3xjfw)
What happens when we leave and the Middle East slides into Medievalism and the oil quits flowing? That's right, very bad things.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:41 PM (McG46)

231 this blog is hilarious. For eight years of Bush Cheney, all it was here at AoS 24/7 was military suck cock. And now it's, OMG!!, Obama is an imperial presidency destroying our constitutional rights!!

You're a fucking stupid dick, drewsie.

"Illegal war"!! What a fucking dick.

Posted by: leonard maltin at March 27, 2011 03:41 PM (JaL+E)

232 I Blame The Water

Posted by: richard mcenroe at March 27, 2011 03:42 PM (qvify)

233 Someday this kinetic military action's gonna end.

Posted by: Lt. Col. Bill Kilgore at March 27, 2011 03:42 PM (QKKT0)

234 like Zimbabwe and Zamunda will be given the lead role of directing US Armed Forces
Prince Akeem/ Semi 2012

Posted by: Delta Smelt at March 27, 2011 03:43 PM (dWPyO)

235 When I said the Left is "functionally allied with al Qaeda" I was thinking more along the lines of opposing Gitmo, proposing civilian trials for illegal combatant cutthroat suicide bomber types, defending sharia, and holding hearings against average Americans instead of those who attack us over and over. When it comes to being allied militarily with al Qaeda in Libya today, an offshoot, or what would become al Qaeda, that's bipartisan historically.
Eastern Libya famously now is known for providing suicide bombers and we are allied with a number of jihadis. But what else is new? From Bin Laden (not directly that time) and the Arab fighters in Afghanistan against the Soviets, to Izetbegovic,Bin Laden again, or a differentlocal offshoot of al Qaeda in Iraq 'awakening', we always do this out of necessity (or misperceived necessity).
There is one way of looking at the Muslim world'spoliticalspectrum one could call the PC Lie Officalspeak Version. Orthe Islamophobic RacistBut-More-TrueVersion. So we ally with jihadis (often a Sunni or Shia splitter fighting the other when convenient or Muslim Brotherhood group)and claim they want democratic reform: their version being one man, onevote, one timefor theocratic global-sharia-imposing Islamists... ....And then the executions start. Or aslower creeping version in places like Turkey where the befuddled Americans and European diplo-political class think a possible military coup is the problem. In Egypt they view it asa feature and the army as an important institution.But in soon-to-be-post Kemalist Turkey where the educated, secular military traditionally prevents hyper-Islamization it's a problem. Doh.
McCarthy's op-ed at National Review does a nice job outliningtheproblems we'll see over and over fighting for, with,and against jihadis or 'moderate' creeping Islamists. One big problem being not getting -- or systematically hiding and attacking those who expose --the connection between Islamic scripture, sharia,jihad and terror.
Decoding Libya
Robert Spencer has covered the legal rules for jihad as well. Like a million times. Or read parts of Bin Laden's 1998 fatwa couched like a sharia ruling.
Of course Morons living the AoS lifestyle get it while Clapper is spouting Ikhwan press releases. Sigh...

Posted by: Beagle at March 27, 2011 03:43 PM (sOtz/)

236
can't wait for Gene Shalit to show up


Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:43 PM (sPHjn)

237 drewsie, you just don't support the troops, do you?
When it was George Bush throwing money US doesn't have an Iraq, where
are you bitching about whether the war was in our "national interest"?Well,
drewsie, you didn't complain then, because you're a fucking dick. The
only thing you care about is some abstract victory against... I'm really
not sure. I guess you just like stabbing the troops in the back.

Posted by: leonard maltin at March 27, 2011 03:37 PM (JaL+E)
Oh goody, a troll! The war in Iraq was in our national interest. Bush made the case very clearly over 9 months or so. If that was a rush to war, what the hell to call Obama's approach?

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:44 PM (McG46)

238 archie bunker?

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 03:44 PM (QisdI)

239 You're a fucking stupid dick, drewsie.

Wow! You must have been saving an insult as creative as that for months.

Posted by: jmflynny at March 27, 2011 03:44 PM (piMMO)

240 Ooh, look a new troll.

With the whole, "Well, you guys were for Iraq" argument. Read around, nitwit, the primary gripe in these parts is about the lack of strategic vision now playing on a television near you (State and Defense at perpendicular purposes on national television--really? This is hope and change?).

U.S. troops ALWAYS have my support. Next.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 03:44 PM (7utQ2)

241 Hey Leonard,
NO WAR FOR OIL
NO WAR FOR OIL
NO WAR FOR OIL
HALLIBURTON!!!
CHENEY!!!!!!
%rivvidravidsplurchfmmmmm##$**$@!@!

Posted by: Cicero at March 27, 2011 03:44 PM (QKKT0)

242 This one typically trolls as "some murdered nuns in el salvador."

Posted by: blue star at March 27, 2011 03:45 PM (4OCrT)

243
a.k.a. eggmcmuffin

Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:45 PM (sPHjn)

244 Prince Akeem/ Semi 2012
Posted by: Delta Smelt at March 27, 2011 03:43 PM (dWPyO)
BWAHAHA!
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese,pickles, onion ona bun.

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 03:46 PM (QisdI)

245 It seems even the free press is illegal now. Only far left reporters are allowed. What constitution? I dont thing Karl Marx wrote one. From the Drudge Report http://tinyurl.com/5twuz28

Posted by: Hous Bin Pharteen at March 27, 2011 03:46 PM (V+/pV)

246 This one typically trolls as "some murdered nuns in el salvador."

Oh. Well, pardon me. I didn't realize we were in the presence of such class and grace.

Posted by: jmflynny at March 27, 2011 03:46 PM (piMMO)

247 this blog is hilarious. For eight years of Bush
Cheney, all it was here at AoS 24/7 was military suck cock. And now
it's, OMG!!, Obama is an imperial presidency destroying our
constitutional rights!!You're a fucking stupid dick, drewsie."Illegal war"!! What a fucking dick.

Posted by: leonard maltin at March 27, 2011 03:41 PM (JaL+E)
Oh goody! A rabid, profane, insane-with-hate troll! See, your stereotypes are getting in the way of your perceptions. Republicans aren't war-mongers, they just believe that sometimes, war is necessary.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:46 PM (McG46)

248 onion ona bun.

You forgot me!

Posted by: Sesame Seed buns at March 27, 2011 03:47 PM (piMMO)

249 I've got something to say as well. No really, I do. But I'm having a hard time getting the words out.

Posted by: Roger Ebert at March 27, 2011 03:47 PM (zUAke)

250
ergie used to pick good, obscure names

leonard maltin...hahahaha

who's next, that Lipton weirdo on the gay Bravo channel?

Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:47 PM (sPHjn)

251 Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese,pickles, onion ona bun
Mmmmm, the Big Mic!

Posted by: Delta Smelt at March 27, 2011 03:47 PM (dWPyO)

252 Leonard Maltin – it is truly admirable that you can type while sucking on this failure of a Presidents limp little winky in your mouth

Posted by: Cheri at March 27, 2011 03:48 PM (BA8k3)

253 a.k.a. eggmcmuffin

I wish I could get those for dinner.

Posted by: Whatever! at March 27, 2011 03:48 PM (piMMO)

254 You forgot me!
Posted by: Sesame Seed buns at March 27, 2011 03:47 PM (piMMO)

You want to get me sued!?

Posted by: Mr. McDowell at March 27, 2011 03:48 PM (UiiAv)

255 Republicans aren't war-mongers, they just believe that sometimes, war is necessary.

And requires a clear, unambiguous statement of what the war is about. We're kinda missing that at the moment.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 03:48 PM (7utQ2)

256 I didn't think erg was this...perturbed.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:48 PM (McG46)

257 ...our buns don't have the seeds.

Posted by: Mr. McDowell at March 27, 2011 03:48 PM (UiiAv)

258 I didn't think erg was this...perturbed disturbed.

FIFY and, yes. Yes he is.

Posted by: Whatever! at March 27, 2011 03:49 PM (piMMO)

259 Posted by: leonard maltin at March 27, 2011 03:41 PM (JaL+E)

--'sup ergie?

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 03:50 PM (BP6Z1)

260 Posted by: leonard maltin at March 27, 2011 03:37 PM (JaL+E)


Posted by: some murdered nuns in el salvador at March 09, 2011 04:17 PM (JaL+E)

same dude

Posted by: laceyunderalls at March 27, 2011 03:50 PM (zUAke)

261 Also, leonard, at least some of us support the adventure in Libya, and all of us support the troops. That doesn't mean we can't call out the sheer hypocrisy of Obama. According to Obama and Biden, Obama should be impeached. What say you?

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:50 PM (McG46)

262
Fuck the Big Mac, "Don't Squeeze the Charmin."

Posted by: Nr Whipple at March 27, 2011 03:50 PM (ZHsNw)

263
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese,pickles, onion ona bun

Mmmmm, the Big Mic!



Posted by: Delta Smelt at March 27, 2011 03:47 PM (dWPyO)
I'm getting moist.

Posted by: Meghan McCheese at March 27, 2011 03:51 PM (BP6Z1)

264 Oh. Well, pardon me. I didn't realize we were in the presence of such class and grace.

Well, it is a lefty...

Posted by: blue star at March 27, 2011 03:52 PM (4OCrT)

265 erg wept

Posted by: happy jack at March 27, 2011 03:52 PM (GTbGH)

266
The Republicans of 1942 were hesitant of getting into the war.

Today's Republicans will support the invasion of Canada if the president decided to do so. They need to cut the shit with automatic approval of the president's military whimsy.

Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:52 PM (sPHjn)

267 Posted by: leonard maltin at March 27, 2011 03:41 PM (JaL+E)

Taste it, eggamoobymuffin! Taste the difference between how Bush legally consulted Congress, legally informed the nation, legally made the case in front of the UN, legally built a coalition, and how your limpdick feckless crapweasel Obama, after four weeks of picking his nose, sort of haplessly joined in on some French-led mission without bothering to explain himself to Congress or the American people. Taste the difference and choke on it, you ignorant, galactically-stupid fuck.

Posted by: Waterhouse at March 27, 2011 03:52 PM (D9etI)

268 Seems like ever since Axelrod left, nobody is making sure the trolls stay on their meds.

Posted by: Peaches at March 27, 2011 03:52 PM (zxpIo)

269
The Big Mac doesn't cut it boys, "Where's the Beef.?"

Posted by: Clara Peller at March 27, 2011 03:52 PM (ZHsNw)

270 VCU melting before our eyes, by the way.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 03:53 PM (7utQ2)

271 I can't wait to miss big speech about Libya. It will be hilarious watching the Morning Joe crew declare it a magnificent triumph for the ages.

Posted by: CoolCzech at March 27, 2011 03:53 PM (kUaEF)

272 I'm getting moist.
Posted by: Meghan McCheese at March 27, 2011 03:51 PM (BP6Z1)

I'll get the flour!

Posted by: Chubby Chasing Moron at March 27, 2011 03:53 PM (UiiAv)

273 leonard maltin (JaL+E):



"Let me just be honest, I hate America. I really hate the American military.

Who do I love? No one. Why? No one loves me." Link: http://tinyurl.com/4zj9wuc



------------------------------



So, there ya go.

Posted by: Johnny at March 27, 2011 03:54 PM (mhmc7)

274
Viet Cong is unionized?

Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:54 PM (sPHjn)

275 Damn it, I screwed that up. Let me try it again:
I
can't wait to miss Obama's big speech about Libya. It will be hilarious watching the Morning Joe crew declare it a magnificent triumph for the ages.

Posted by: CoolCzech at March 27, 2011 03:54 PM (kUaEF)

276 """this blog is hilarious. For eight years of Bush Cheney, all it was here
at AoS 24/7 was military suck cock. And now it's, OMG!!, Obama is an
imperial presidency destroying our constitutional rights!!""



Hey jerkoff, bush went to congress and got approval, begged at the UN for months, then got a huge coalition together. Saddam was firing at our planes for years, the UN sanctions only helped starved innocent Iraqis and it needed to end. Saddam was out of control, unpredictable, and had a record of using chemical weapons on his own people and others.

On the other hand, your sugar daddy,"Emperor feckless the no cock", commits our troops to a european war for oil, skips out of town when the firing starts, doesn't get congress's approval, and has no fucking clue WHO we are actually helping. Typical bullshit liberal moral equivalence, no wonder all you idiots can accomplish is stupid drum circles.

Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 03:54 PM (gWHrG)

277 VCU melting before our eyes, by the way.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 03:53 PM (7utQ2)
Butler baybee! Lacey, surely you're rooting for the Bulldogs.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:55 PM (McG46)

278 204 I know that he's been busy, but has there been any word on whether or not Sir Golfs-A-Lot has spoken to anyone in his Cabinet yet this year? I know last year, the White House staff was still busy putting together phone lists and updating his super-duper Blackberry.
Posted by: Damiano at March 27, 2011 03:26 PM (3nrx7)
---------- ------------ ----------- ----------- -------------- ---------
You don't understand the way it works. Cabinet positions are filled by requirement of congress and the Constitution. So I just put a bunch of knuckleheads in there the way Presidents do with all those Diplomatic assignments. It's all about the payoff, baby!
The real action is in Czars. I have my Czars tell the "Secretariat" what to do. They also fill in for me in any capacity I damned well please. The good thing is, I filled the "Czariat" and the Secretariat with a bunch of Harvard type, know-nothings like me; so when I ask for a report on "ending world poverty," and a cream cheese and arugulabagel, it's all the same to them.
Hell, I have like, three Czars or something, just hiding all my personal records, so when I do something stupid like post here, they'll come along, screwup the comment systemfor a while, and when Pixy getscomments back up, myimpetuous drivelwill be wiped clean. You won't know if you read this or dremt it. I suggest you invest in tinfoil hats..

Posted by: Your pal, Barak at March 27, 2011 03:55 PM (3xjfw)

279
Well, it's Sunday with nothing to do, I'm going to write the review of President Dreamy Cock's television appearance.

Posted by: Mika Brizitski, Daddy's Little Girl at March 27, 2011 03:55 PM (ZHsNw)

280 272
I'm getting moist.

Posted by: Meghan McCheese at March 27, 2011 03:51 PM (BP6Z1)

Good; now is the time to add one packet of yeast.

Posted by: CoolCzech at March 27, 2011 03:55 PM (kUaEF)

281
Monday night is Obama's 'Reagan moment.'

Excellent politics, Obama. Very well done.




Posted by: Sunday Soothsayer at March 27, 2011 03:56 PM (sPHjn)

282 Taste the difference and choke on it, you ignorant, galactically-stupid fuck.

To fully grok the Erg you have to understand that he doesn't actually believe any of the stuff he regurges. He used to pretend he was a commie, but he's not that either. He's a poseur. A weepy emo poseur. When he's here, its because things are not good in ergy land.

Posted by: toby928™ at March 27, 2011 03:56 PM (GTbGH)

283 They need to cut the shit with automatic approval of the president's military whimsy.

I think it is a conservative trait to recognize that we have enemies in the world and that American power is a necessary component of international stability. We give the President the benefit of the doubt. We're grown-ups that way.

Which is precisely why the word "whimsy" is so spot-on at the moment.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 03:56 PM (7utQ2)

284 Let me just be honest, I hate America. I really hate the American military. Who do I love? No one. Why? No one loves me."
Sounds like a cry for help. Anyone want to help save this poor soul?
Nah, me either.

Posted by: ErikW at March 27, 2011 03:57 PM (QisdI)

285 "266
The Republicans of 1942 were hesitant of getting into the war.

Today's Republicans will support the invasion of Canada if the president decided to do so. They need to cut the shit with automatic approval of the president's military whimsy. "

The declaration of war against Japan passed 388-1.

Posted by: richard mcenroe at March 27, 2011 03:57 PM (qvify)

286 "this blog is hilarious. For eight years of Bush Cheney, all it was here at AoS 24/7 was military suck cock. And now it's, OMG!!, Obama is an imperial presidency destroying our constitutional rights!!""

Bush put his plans to a vote in Congress.

Did Obama?


Posted by: CoolCzech at March 27, 2011 03:57 PM (kUaEF)

287

Well, it's Sunday with nothing to do, I'm going to write the review of President Dreamy Cock's television appearance.


Posted by: Mika Brizitski, Daddy's Little Girl at March 27, 2011 03:55 PM (ZHsNw)
Posted by: Shepard Smith, Fox News Nancy Boy at March 27, 2011

Posted by: Bill O'Reilly, Mr. Right at March 27, 2011 03:58 PM (ZHsNw)

288 Hey leonard, I'm getting the feeling this was a hit-and-run, but could you comment on the fact that Obama has already played more golf than Bush did in 8 years? And how about Obama playing soccer while putting the troops in harm's way? Where are the anti-war rallies?

And you want to try to bust our asses for inconsistency? You have no shame, I'll give you that.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 03:58 PM (McG46)

289 The declaration of war against Japan passed 388-1.
Posted by: richard mcenroe at March 27, 2011 03:57 PM (qvify)

Really?

Obama was in Congress back in 1941?

Posted by: CoolCzech at March 27, 2011 03:58 PM (kUaEF)

290 The Big Mac doesn't cut it boys, "Where's the Beef.?"

Under the pickle, of course!

Posted by: Whatever! at March 27, 2011 03:59 PM (piMMO)

291 Butler Bulldogs. That's right.

Just glad the NCAA didn't see to it that Duke made it the FF this year Duke was pummeled a few nights ago.

Thoroughly enjoyable. More than deserved after the cakewalk they received last year.

Posted by: laceyunderalls at March 27, 2011 04:00 PM (zUAke)

292 135
Johnny, are we sure that they are actual al Qaeda? I have no illusions about them being the good guys, but doesn't Qaddafi have a habit of calling all of his enemies "al Qaeda"?
Also, "the rebels" are bound to be disorganized and with various factions.
Posted by: AmishDude at March 27, 2011 02:36 PM (BvBKY)
BBC reports that one of the 'Commanders' of the Rebels, fought against the US in Afganistan, spent a couple years in prison there, was repatriated to Libya, then released by the Libyan Government.
Now he has on call US Air support...
Wow... just F'n wow...

Posted by: Romeo13 at March 27, 2011 04:00 PM (NtXW4)

293
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese,pickles, onion ona bun

Mmmmm, the Big Mic!



Posted by: Delta Smelt at March 27, 2011 03:47 PM (dWPyO)
I'm getting moist.


Posted by: Meghan McCheese at March 27, 2011 03:51 PM (BP6Z1)
Hey Mooghan,
They gave you your own word in the dictionary this year!Muffin top!

Posted by: momma at March 27, 2011 04:00 PM (penCf)

294 The declaration of war against Japan passed 388-1.

Who was the lone nay vote retaliating against the fucks who blew up our sailors?

For some, no reason is ever good enough.

Posted by: Whatever! at March 27, 2011 04:01 PM (piMMO)

295 The declaration of war against Japan passed 388-1.


Posted by: richard mcenroe at March 27, 2011 03:57 PM (qvify)

I think he means that before Japan attacked us, Republicans were against going to war. With someone who um...hadn't attacked us.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:01 PM (McG46)

296 260 Lacy Posted by: some murdered nuns in el salvador. I did not know Daily Kos was hangin round here. WTF?

Posted by: Hous Bin Pharteen at March 27, 2011 04:03 PM (V+/pV)

297 Damn, it's exhausting just watching this game.

Hold tight, Rams!

Posted by: logprof at March 27, 2011 04:03 PM (BP6Z1)

298 Who was the lone nay vote retaliating against the fucks who blew up our sailors?

Damnit! Typos everywhere.

Posted by: Whatever! at March 27, 2011 04:03 PM (piMMO)

299 ''Obama was in Congress back in 1941?''


Either that ,or that martian they got in ohio, Kucinich.

Posted by: Berserker at March 27, 2011 04:03 PM (gWHrG)

300 B. We have to get serious about our energy situation. Monday morming 9AM.
Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 03:40 PM (7utQ2)
I keep sayin' and typin: The very minute the US posts up a new Drill Here, Drill Now, and Build Some Brand-New, High-Tech Refineries policy, then that announcement will cause massive sphincter constriction throughout the Middle East; and the money flow to Al Qaeda will be imperiled:right.fzcking.now.
But No0Oo0Oo. WE have to run the world with both arms tied back.

Posted by: K~Bob at March 27, 2011 04:04 PM (3xjfw)

301 The declaration of war against Japan passed 388-1.


Posted by: richard mcenroe at March 27, 2011 03:57 PM (qvify)

I
think he means that before Japan attacked us, Republicans were against
going to war. With someone who um...hadn't attacked us.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:01 PM (McG46)
But I agree with what I guess is the larger point, that FDR tricked us into war in the way lefties like to pretend that Bush did.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:04 PM (McG46)

302 This article says it was 420-1:

"California Democrat
Barbara Lee defended her lonely stand by saying that authorizing
military force to stop terrorism wouldn't work, and "I felt let's not
do anything that could escalate this madness out of control."

Posted by: Peaches at March 27, 2011 04:05 PM (zxpIo)

303 Jeanette Rankin, Republican from Montana was the dissenting vote in the House on the DOW against Japan. She also voted against the DOW for World War I. So unlike some (just take a look around the Hill and White House right now), at least she was consistent.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 04:05 PM (7utQ2)

304 298
Who was the lone nay vote retaliating against the fucks who blew up our sailors?

Some principled anti-war type whose spawn did the same thing decades later.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:06 PM (McG46)

305 Whoops that was a huge fuckup on my part. That was the lone vote against Bush. The one in 1942 was Jeanette Rankin, a well-to-do Republican from Montana. It didn't work out well for her, according to the article.

Posted by: Peaches at March 27, 2011 04:07 PM (zxpIo)

306 The very minute the US posts up a new Drill Here, Drill Now, and Build Some Brand-New, High-Tech Refineries policy, then that announcement will cause massive sphincter constriction throughout the Middle East; and the money flow to Al Qaeda will be imperiled:right.fzcking.now.

What? You don't have to do that. We'll pump more oil. Besides, it's bad for the environment.

Posted by: The Saudis at March 27, 2011 04:08 PM (McG46)

307 But I agree with what I guess is the larger point, that FDR tricked us
into war in the way lefties like to pretend that Bush did.

FUBAR, please. That is such bullshit.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 04:08 PM (7utQ2)

308 FUBAR, please. That is such bullshit.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 04:08 PM (7utQ2)Care to elaborate? Maybe start with Lend-Lease.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:11 PM (McG46)

309 I kept us out of war!

Posted by: woodrow wilson at March 27, 2011 04:11 PM (GTbGH)

310
We don't want war, we wanted surrender.

Posted by: Julius & Ethel Rosenberg at March 27, 2011 04:12 PM (ZHsNw)

311 Care to elaborate? Maybe start with Lend-Lease.

OK, let's start there--how did Lend-Lease trick us into a war with....Japan?

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 04:13 PM (7utQ2)

312 Speakin' of drilling:
I wonder how long Israel is going to take to begin drilling off their coast? Six years for the Environmental Study, maybe? Another ten for the Middle East Balance of Power Impact studies, ya think?
Barak Obama is not just farbot. He's megra farbot.

Posted by: K~Bob at March 27, 2011 04:14 PM (3xjfw)

313 Care to elaborate? Maybe start with Lend-Lease.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:11 PM (McG46)

See, no.

You made the positive assertion that "FDR tricked us". You need to provide evidence for that assertion.

The contrary statement (bullshit) is what we refer to as the "null hypothesis". It requires no evidence beyond your lack of evidence.

Posted by: Like a low wattage ham hock at March 27, 2011 04:16 PM (lT0LC)

314 OK, let's start there--how did Lend-Lease trick us into a war with....Japan?

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 04:13 PM (7utQ2)
Lend-Lease was for Germany. If you don't know about Lend-Lease, how can you assert anything about our conduct leading up to the war? And asking questions isn't elaborating. But as for Japan specifically, how about cutting off their oil supplies? Ignoring signs of imminent attack?

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:16 PM (McG46)

315 And are you seriously disputing the fact that FDR decided to go to war loooong before the country or the Congress felt that way?

Didn't know there was any disagreement on the issue.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:19 PM (McG46)

316 The best part of being the best Precedent on the links. The ball washers.

Posted by: The Precedent at March 27, 2011 04:20 PM (IhHdM)

317 OK, you people solve this. I have to get back to work. I had to rebuild my computer this week, and it still ain't right. I put in a new MOBO, CPU, SATA drive, and 4 Gigglobytes of RAM. Works fine, just don't have all my software installed yet. The sekrit box of Microsoft laser-etched CDs is still at Boogie North, and I'm at the Boogie Southern Compound, building my end-of-the world stockpile.
But first, a little work, and some music. Then some cheese.

Posted by: K~Bob at March 27, 2011 04:21 PM (3xjfw)

318 Lend-Lease was for Germany. If you don't know about Lend-Lease, how can you assert anything about our conduct leading up to the war? And asking questions isn't elaborating. But as for Japan specifically, how about cutting off their oil supplies? Ignoring signs of imminent attack?

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:16 PM (McG46)

Uh, no. Lend-lease was for England. England was fighting against Japan.

Posted by: Like a low wattage ham hock at March 27, 2011 04:24 PM (lT0LC)

319 This could've been a great opportunity to kill Mc'Daffy as payback for Lockerbie. And to destroy the Libyan military, leaving it up to the various tribes, clans and factions to sort things out. Which would've been some sweet payback to the UK for letting the Lockerbie bomber go free as well as to the frogs -- for messing with us over invading Iraq.

That's how you play political hardball.

France will someday have another Chirac. If we left them to suffer without Libyan oil -- even with a friend like Sarkozy in charge -- the next Chirac would think twice about messing with us. Same with the limeys. Especially if you leave the resultant mess for them to clean up.

But instead of using the 10 day window of opportunity we had, Obama intentionally dithered.

I wonder if Obama waited for our intel community to assure him that al Qaeda and the MBH had taken the lead roles in the Libyan opposition before he decided to support the rebels.

No matter who wins, the next chapter in this book will be mighty expensive. And one thing is for sure -- America will pay 95%+ of that bill.

Posted by: Ed Anger at March 27, 2011 04:33 PM (7+pP9)

320 At least Gates is consistent.

You can tell he has been against this intervention from the get-go and he remains true to his position.

Maybe it is his way to get kicked off the ship of state before it hits the rocks.

And, btw, he is exactly right, there are no compelling national interests for the U.S. to be Libya at this moment.

Posted by: theMachiavellian at March 27, 2011 04:35 PM (GlSHt)

321
Uh, no. Lend-lease was for England. England was fighting against Japan.

Posted by: Like a low wattage ham hock at March 27, 2011 04:24 PM (lT0LC)
Thanks buddy. Lend-Lease was a piece of clever legislation in much the same way as ObamaCare's tax-vs-penalty dodge. Did you like that? And what was Germany supposed to do about it? Ignore it?You might agree with what FDR did, but leave the whitewashing to the libs, hoss.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:37 PM (McG46)

322 FUBAR--if you want to get in a discussion with me about World War II, you better bring your library.

Lend-Lease was intially a way to get access to British bases that would allow a better profile for hemispheric defense in the reformulation of the color plans. You brought Lend-Lease up in regard to "tricking" everyone into war, remember? I'm also detecting a vibe that you think we should have lived in blissful ignorance of the German threat, and if that is the case, go over there and have some coffee with your buddy Pat Buchanan.

The intelligence regarding the Japanese attack is well known, but it was assumed that the target would be the Philippines in keeping with existing war plans. B-17s had been sent to the Philippines earlier in 1941 as a deterrent to Japanese action. But, here is my question in return--what exactly, given the woefully inadequate state of the U.S. military in late 1941, would the steps have been that would have indicated that Roosevelt was not "tricking us"? Complete redeployment of the fleet to the Philippines? That would have been a complete strategic disaster as opposed to a partial one. Given military doctrine at the time, who could have foreseen a carrier attack on Hawaii?

As for the oil embargo: Was it in the national interest of the United States to continue to provide critical war resources to an ally of Nazi Germany to run amok in Asia? I say no.

If you will notice, the entire premise of your argument is that Roosevelt was nigh-on psychic: He had the ability to predict the oil and steel embargoes would force a Japanese attack and thereby involve the United States in the European war. That's pretty thin gruel. If anything, the United States totally miscalculated the Japanese reaction--the Japanese reaction was borderline suicidal; this is where the whole conspiracy theory falls apart.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 04:44 PM (7utQ2)

323 Mr. Maltin, please report for induction tomorrow morning.
And yes, with the repeal of DADT, you now qualify.

Posted by: Leonard Maltin's draft board at March 27, 2011 04:46 PM (yLJzo)

324
Uh, no. Lend-lease was for England. England was fighting against Japan.

Posted by: Like a low wattage ham hock at March 27, 2011 04:24 PM (lT0LC)
Nope -- Lend-lease was for the war between Germany and the Brits. The Brits became involved in war against Japan after the sinking of The Repulse and The Prince of Wales the day after Pearl Harbor.

Posted by: Ed Anger at March 27, 2011 04:54 PM (7+pP9)

325 Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 04:44 PM (7utQ2)

If you're such a super WW2 scholar, then you should know exactly what I'm talking about, because I'm not such a super WW2 scholar, and I've seen these views in more than one place. Or did you think I made them up in my own crazy head?

Tell me. Why the elaborate arrangements over Lend-Lease? Because there was an earlier law passed by Congress forbidding exactly what FDR wanted to do, which was sell supplies to England. But you must know this.

So, instead of calling bullshit, period, how about elaborate on the weaknesses you see in the arguments that FDR acted so provocatively toward Germany and Japan that he might as well have declared war himself? And that he acted (you can only characterize it as) dishonestly with Lend-Lease?

Hell, I don't even have too much of a problem with any of it, because we'd've been at war sooner or later anyway. And especially considering what I actually said, which is that if Bush lied us into war, FDR surely did, then I still don't see what is such bullshit.

Posted by: FUBAR at March 27, 2011 04:55 PM (McG46)

326 I busted my ass at west point, and all I got was the white house gardener.
And not very well hung, I might add.

Posted by: SomewhereSouthWest at March 27, 2011 05:04 PM (CyPWX)

327 And especially considering what I actually said, which is that if Bush
lied us into war, FDR surely did, then I still don't see what is such
bullshit.

If FDR "lied" us into war with clear, demonstrable, extant threats to the U.S. and legal congressional support, then Bush lied as well. See how that works? The historical record shows that Roosevelt acted within the bounds that were set for him. If one recognized the existential threat that the Axis represented--especially in the timeframe between the fall of France and Pearl Harbor, and ALSO recognized an electorate wildly distrustful of international intervention after World War I, what were the possible (not fanciful) policy options that were open?

As we are fond of saying around here, "Presidentin' is hard."

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 05:14 PM (7utQ2)

328 The historical record shows that Roosevelt acted within the bounds that were set for him.
No. It shows nothing of the kind. Roosevelt ordered the US Navy to protect convoys half the trip to Britain. Under international law, that was an overt act of war - aiding a belligerent nation in time of war - and in direct contravention of the Neutrality Act.
I'm not criticizing Roosevelt, or disputing the wisdom of his actions. But they were most certainly illegal under both American and international law. U-boats would have entirely within their legal rights to torpedo US Navy warships, as happened to the USS Reuben James.
Again, not criticizing FDR, nor defending Nazis. Just setting the record straight. Roosevelt's action in contravention of US law is quite like that of Reagan and supporting the contras, in a number of respects.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 27, 2011 05:50 PM (yLJzo)

329 Roosevelt ordered the US Navy to protect convoys half the trip to
Britain. Under international law, that was an overt act of war - aiding a
belligerent nation in time of war - and in direct contravention of the
Neutrality Act.

Roosevelt did that after Hitler authorized attacks on U.S. merchant ships after Lend-Lease was enacted. As we have recently discussed here at AOSHQ, "international law" does not trump congressional action. There is way too much seven-decade-later quarterbacking of FDR for my taste.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at March 27, 2011 06:09 PM (7utQ2)

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Posted by: Druid at March 27, 2011 06:44 PM (RnujI)

331 Roosevelt did that after Hitler authorized attacks on U.S. merchant ships after Lend-Lease was enacted.
Doesn't matter. Aiding a belligerent nation - by shipping war materiel and protecting such shipments - is an act of war. Period. Not criticizing FDR, but a fact is a fact.
And I couldn't care less about your taste.

Posted by: Jay Guevara at March 27, 2011 09:28 PM (yLJzo)

332 And re seven decade later quarterbacking, I have defended FDR for interning the nisei. (That was FDR, off his own bat, by Executive Order - pace liberals, who like to say the "US Government" interned the nisei).
Different times, different concerns, different policies.
But let's not get descend into liberalism. Germany was, for once,entirely within its rights in attacking American warships that were protecting convoys of war materiel going to Britain. There are no two ways about it.
Turn it around: if Iran were shipping war materiel to a country we were fighting, would we agonize over whether to attack those shipments? I would hope not.

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