Rasmussen: Support For Border Fence Up To <i>68%</i>

Rasmussen: Support For Border Fence Up To 68%

Ten percent here, ten percent there, and pretty soon you're talking about a real mandate.

Support for the building of a fence along the Mexican border has reached a new high, and voters are more confident than ever that illegal immigration can be stopped.
A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 68% of U.S. voters now believe the United States should continue to build a fence on the Mexican border. That�s up nine points from March when the Obama administration halted funding for the fence and the highest level of support ever.
Just 21% oppose the continued building of the border fence.
Support for the fence is strong across all demographic groups. But while 76% of Mainstream voters think the United States should continue to build the fence, 67% of the Political Class are opposed to it.

I always enjoy how twits speak of the symbolism of a thing.

That's why the "Political Class" -- the Gee Aren't I Terribly Enlightened? crowd -- opposes this. They talk about that a lot -- the symbolism of the thing.

How about discussing the reality of it? It's a fence. Its real purpose -- in real-world, real-time reality -- is to halt people from crossing a border. A real border, mind you, although on that point I concede a border is a more abstract concept than, say, a shoe.

It doesn't symbolically represent a division between the countries. It actually is a division between the countries.

And what is wrong with that?

I'm noting this because a few weeks ago I saw a guy at the riots in Toronto who complained that the police barricades were a symbol representing a division between the protesters and the G-20 representatives.

And I thought, "Gee, no, actually it's not a symbol of a division; it really is, in fact, a physical division." Because, see, you're rioting. (And not symbolically in riot, either.) You can tell it's a real-world division because now you can't get to the G-20 conference center and throw rock-metaphors through the window-symbols.

I think there is a type of person -- well-represented in the "Political Class" and in progressive politics -- that has learned, from college, that the Abstract is everything, that Real Smart People are always focused on the Abstract, on metaphors, on symbols.

And they seem to disregard the concrete, the real, almost as a dirty thing, something of concern to the plebians, who cannot of course grasp the subtleties of high representational thinking like they can. You know, with their "symbolic" barricades and all.

They spoke of the Gaza Wall the same way -- that it symbolized the separation of the peoples. When it fact it did rather more than that. It actually separated them. Because one of those peoples was murdering and butchering the other. (And, again, I stress: They did so in a non-metaphoric manner.)

I don't think this is an important point in terms of a slogan or a manifesto or that sort of thing. I don't think you can build a politics around the Concrete. (What would that bumper sticker look like?)

It's just an observation of a type of intellectually-insecure individual who parrots the pattern of thinking of his professors (who once represented intellectual authority to them -- Symbolically, of course) and elevates, always, the Abstract above the Real.

I just tend to distrust this sort of divorced-from-tangible-reality worship of the abstract. Obviously -- duh -- abstract thinking is important. It is, in certain ways, I suppose, a higher form of thinking than thinking of the concrete.

But not when it is shorn of all rootings to the actual world.

This is how evil happens. You can abstract any evil you choose into some esoteric "greater good."

Posted by: Ace at 03:37 PM

Comments

Opposition of Obamacare down 6% since April 1 or thereabouts.

Keep flooding the zone, my man.

Posted by: Truman "Alinsky" North at July 29, 2010 03:38 PM (e8YaH)

2 Support for border fence up to 68%, Obama admin wants to give a pass to everyone, Federal Judge in Arizona gives more rights to illegals than to a US State? Nov 2010--Vote like your life depends on it, because it does.

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 29, 2010 03:40 PM (0GFWk)

3 meh, only 68% support it, which in liberal world means it's still "controversial."

Posted by: joeindc44 at July 29, 2010 03:41 PM (QxSug)

4 Slicing my guts open and having my head hacked off symbolized my support of the Emperor.

Posted by: Three Time Nobel Nominee Yukio Mishima at July 29, 2010 03:41 PM (5aa4z)

5 Oh, this poll is complete crap. Next thing, your gonna tell me a majority of Americans support the idea that a Congressman should pay his taxes!

Posted by: Charlie Rangle at July 29, 2010 03:41 PM (OWjjx)

6 Hell, I already shot my bigoted load. got nuttin'

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 03:41 PM (RkRxq)

7 Obama halted funding for the border fence?

Never heard of it that's one for the cables I guess.

Posted by: The MFM at July 29, 2010 03:41 PM (LhoRf)

It's a fence. It's real purpose...

Sigh.

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller, uber pedant at July 29, 2010 03:41 PM (SCcgT)

9 I always enjoy how twits speak of the symbolism of a thing.

Yes a big F*ing fence. It clearly says, "If you want past, use the F*ing gate!" to the political class, the technical term would be "Port of Entry"

Posted by: MikeTheMoose at July 29, 2010 03:42 PM (0q2P7)

10 In

what

way

does the author's use of

prison

symbolise

the protagonist's struggle?

And how does this relate -

- to our discussion of the uses of irony?

Posted by: English Teacher at July 29, 2010 03:42 PM (yUybe)

11 We symbolized racist oppression.

Posted by: Little Boy and Fat Man at July 29, 2010 03:42 PM (5aa4z)

12 bat chain puller, I already got that, so suck on it!

Posted by: Ace at July 29, 2010 03:43 PM (KUUXH)

13 Seriously, Ace, I have a better grasp on the real world than these people.

Posted by: AmishDude, pure mathematician at July 29, 2010 03:43 PM (T0NGe)

14 I know when to use it's and its, but I just wrote them in a series -- it's/its -- and when I do that I just tend to repeat the last spelling i used.

Posted by: Ace at July 29, 2010 03:44 PM (KUUXH)

15 11

And intolerance, don't forget intolerance.

Posted by: The MFM at July 29, 2010 03:44 PM (LhoRf)

16 so suck on it!

Posted by: Ace at July 29, 2010 03:43 PM (KUUXH)

THIS!

Posted by: Al Gore at July 29, 2010 03:45 PM (T0NGe)

17 The fence says nothing. An electric fence, however, says bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt, which in Spanish means, keep the fuck out.

Posted by: huerfano at July 29, 2010 03:45 PM (NmcJ6)

You can abstract any evil you choose into some esoteric "greater good."

The "greater good" is for you wingers to shut up and watch this shot...FORE!

Posted by: President Golfsalot at July 29, 2010 03:45 PM (OWjjx)

19 meh, only 68% support it, which in liberal world means it's still "controversial."

75% can support a controversial conservative measure.

However, with only 10% support, "common sense" liberal measures enjoy "broad" support.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose at July 29, 2010 03:45 PM (0q2P7)

20 16 so suck on it!

Posted by: Ace at July 29, 2010 03:43 PM (KUUXH)

THIS!

Posted by: Al Gore

Megadittos

Posted by: Mel Gibson at July 29, 2010 03:45 PM (T0NGe)

21 Golf, golf, racist, golf

Posted by: I'm making that golfing joke again at July 29, 2010 03:46 PM (e8YaH)

bat chain puller, I already got that, so suck on it!

Get in line, cause first, he will blow me!

Posted by: Mel Gibson at July 29, 2010 03:46 PM (OWjjx)

23 Build the fence and don't spare the concrete or razor wire. Then put in 100 yards of high density pressure mines, followed by a moat with Nile crocodiles, then arrest any of them that make it across and force them to return the way they came.

Posted by: maddogg at July 29, 2010 03:46 PM (OlN4e)

24 See Ace this is why you will never be a journalist, we have multiple layers of factchecking which you guys in pajamas will never have.

Posted by: The MFM at July 29, 2010 03:46 PM (LhoRf)

25 Yeah, I kinda thought I put all this symbolism shit to rest with my groundbreaking Transgressing the Boundaries: Towards a Transformative Hermeneutics of Quantum Gravity.

http://tinyurl.com/hgm5

Posted by: Alan Sokol at July 29, 2010 03:46 PM (5aa4z)

26 Yes, but what percentage of mongrels support it?

Posted by: President Ogaffe at July 29, 2010 03:46 PM (T0NGe)

27 Border fence is like checking for ID's when voting. Things you would naturally assume are in place, if those in power cared a whit about the integrity of our country.

Posted by: Randy at July 29, 2010 03:47 PM (zQKSr)

28 "And they seem to disregard the concrete, the real, almost as a dirty thing, something of concern to the plebians, who cannot of course grasp the subtleties of high representational thinking like they can. You know, with their "symbolic" barricades and all."

"So heavenly minded that they're no earthly good" ... Oliver Wendall Holmes

Posted by: bill at July 29, 2010 03:47 PM (0C9Hn)

29 Operation Wetback. Look it up. Bring it back (but this time look for a nicer sounding name).

Posted by: Hedgehog at July 29, 2010 03:47 PM (oQIfB)

30 The fence says nothing. An electric fence, however, says bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt, which in Spanish means, keep the fuck out.
Posted by: huerfano at July 29, 2010 03:45 PM (NmcJ6)

True, but I like the sound of the Phalanx CIWS better
errrhrrhrhrhrhrhrhrh. I guess both get the job done. Hey what not do both?

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 29, 2010 03:47 PM (0GFWk)

The fence says nothing. An electric fence, however, says bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt, which in Spanish means, keep the fuck out.

WINNER! If you had huerfano at post number 17, go to the Pay Window and collect your winnings.

Posted by: AOSHQ Bookie at July 29, 2010 03:48 PM (OWjjx)

32 I'm Mel Gibson, and you know what you do first

Posted by: I'm making that BJ joke again at July 29, 2010 03:48 PM (e8YaH)

WAY O/T - Shep Smith just went "oh snap" on air.

This guy has a show why again?

Posted by: Mallamutt at July 29, 2010 03:49 PM (OWjjx)

bat chain puller, I already got that, so suck on it!

'Tis an honor to be personally smacked down by Ace.

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller at July 29, 2010 03:49 PM (SCcgT)

35 So? It could be 100%, and we still say you peasants don't know what's good for you.

Posted by: The Oligarchy at July 29, 2010 03:49 PM (kcqZS)

36 It's a nuanced approach to life!

Posted by: timothyj at July 29, 2010 03:50 PM (b+pBW)

37 I couldn't sigh on to a high voltage electric fence, wildlife might get killed.

Posted by: maddogg at July 29, 2010 03:50 PM (OlN4e)

38 We should put those caught crossing in prison ... and farm that job out to the guys that run the Mexican prisons for those caught jumping their southern border.

Posted by: bill at July 29, 2010 03:50 PM (0C9Hn)

39 Look, it's all well and good for you to want us to uphold the law and everything, but you have to think of the lawsuits, and how we won't get invited to the garden parties anymore. But mostly how we won't get invited to the garden parties anymore.

Posted by: The Council in that one town in Nebraska at July 29, 2010 03:51 PM (e8YaH)

40 We propose a sonic fence.

Posted by: The Dharma Initiative at July 29, 2010 03:51 PM (T0NGe)

Shep Smith is an android.

Posted by: Dr. Varno at July 29, 2010 03:51 PM (3fiIy)

42 33

I can deep throat a zuchini and I remind my producer of a nicer less spittle flaked version of Keith Olbermann.

Posted by: Shephard Smith at July 29, 2010 03:52 PM (LhoRf)

My big gut is a symbol of me being overweight.

Posted by: Iota Cracker Jones at July 29, 2010 03:52 PM (1DVez)

44 i think we need to epistimologically close the border

Posted by: Ben at July 29, 2010 03:52 PM (wuv1c)

45 Shep Smith is an android.

Well, I'm fairly sure that he dreams of electric sheep.

Posted by: AmishDude at July 29, 2010 03:52 PM (T0NGe)

46 Sure, there's no provision in the Massachusetts Constitution that allows us to keep a lawfully-submitted ballot question off the ballot. But it's just easier for us to keep you from voting on whether to allow gay marriage or not than it would be to explain why we would overturn you when you overwhelmingly support banning it.

Posted by: The Massachusetts General Assembly, 2006 at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (e8YaH)

I got my bigot groove back!

The biggest shame in all of this, imo -

The fact that we can now identify that a political class even exists in this country.

Is it supposed to be like that?

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (RkRxq)

48 So high I can't get over it
So low I can't get under it
So wide I can't get round it

-- OH, ROCK MY SOUL
by Peter Yarrow (of Peter, Paul & Mary fame)

libtards' pantaloons rapidly filling with libturds

Posted by: Tunes for Campers at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (FcKXR)

49 See, even you retarded racist teabaggers understand my putting your face through a plate glass window symbol. Now, the kneepads I wear in my meetings with Lord Obama...not a symbol.

Posted by: Spencer Ackerman at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (VmtE9)

50 There's a whole gob of those 'educated' deep thinkers that would benefit greatly from a nice pop in the face and a few lumps on their heads.

Posted by: Portnoy at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (mT7uC)

51 Who gives a fuck what the poll is anymore? It's obvious the government doesn't give a rat's fuck what 70 percent of the population thinks, so how do these polls even fucking change anything? 70 percent support AZ's law,and it still gets blocked?

Fuck this country and the 30% of commie clusterfuckbags that destroyed it.

Posted by: The Man with the Non Creased Pants at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (gLNLT)

52 The left have no frontal lobes. That's why lobotomies would be kind of useless. But there is all that Donner meat.

Posted by: Corona at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (woZIc)

The fact that we can now identify that a political class even exists in this country.

Is it supposed to be like that?

Yes. In France.

Posted by: AmishDude at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (T0NGe)

54 True, but I like the sound of the Phalanx CIWS better....Hey what not do both?

Nothing says get off my lawn like a 6 barrel auto rotating 20mm Vulcan Cannon. _{(Wow it shoots so fast it sounds like a big diesel running)}

Posted by: MikeTheMoose at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (0q2P7)

55 41

Shep Smith is an android butt pirate.

Posted by: Dr. Varno at July 29, 2010 03:51 PM (3fiIy)

FIFY.

Posted by: conscious, but incoherent - stating the obvious at July 29, 2010 03:54 PM (YVZlY)

56 44 i think we need to epistimologically close the border

Posted by: Ben at July 29, 2010 03:52 PM (wuv1c)

I'm convinced!

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 03:54 PM (RkRxq)

Person 1: Words are symbols of thoughts.

Person 2: No words actually are symbols of thoughts.

Posted by: rdbrewer at July 29, 2010 03:54 PM (1DVez)

Is it supposed to be like that?

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 03:53 PM (RkRxq)

Is it supposed to be like what?

Posted by: Bob Schieffer at July 29, 2010 03:54 PM (fDRif)

Yeah, the old symbolism thing. Reminds me of the economist joke, which ends:

"Well of course it works in real life, the question is, will it work in theory?"

Posted by: Steve Skubinna at July 29, 2010 03:55 PM (QQ9sc)

60 This virtual fence will be much better than a brick-and-mortar fence because you can't climb over a wall that isn't really there.

Posted by: An actual member of DHS at July 29, 2010 03:56 PM (e8YaH)

61 So high I can't get over it
So low I can't get under it
So wide I can't get round it

-- OH, ROCK MY SOUL
by Peter Yarrow, pedophile and John Kerry's bud (of Peter, Paul & Mary fame)

FTFY

Posted by: MikeO at July 29, 2010 03:56 PM (lBmZl)

Is it supposed to be like what?

Posted by: Bob Schieffer at July 29, 2010 03:54 PM (fDRif)

Time for your nap Bob. There's a good boy.

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 03:56 PM (RkRxq)

63 If the East Coast bordered Mexico instead of the Atlantic, we'd have the damn fence.

Posted by: Sgt. Fury at July 29, 2010 03:56 PM (gh1bX)

64 Hell, use my system and you could set up spectator bleachers, you know, kinda like some kind of Japanese game show where when you get fatally injured your out of the competition. Take bets on the chances of a particular "runner" making it across, then the return trip. Now that's entertainment.

Posted by: maddogg at July 29, 2010 03:57 PM (OlN4e)

My favorite economist joke:

An economist walks down the street with his buddy. Buddy says, "Hey! There's a twenty dollar bill lying on the sidewalk!"

Economist replies, "That's impossible. If there were, someone would have already picked it up."

Posted by: Truman North at July 29, 2010 03:57 PM (e8YaH)

66 This is how evil happens. You can abstract any evil you choose into some esoteric "greater good."

Yup, and then these same people feel completely justified afterwords. Commies kill upwards of 100 million people trying to shoe-horn a particular gov't model on people? "Have to break some eggs to make an omlette" or "They meant well".

Add some projection and cognitive dissonance and ta-da, the modern liberal!

Posted by: Kratos (Ghost of Sparta) at July 29, 2010 03:57 PM (9hSKh)

67 This virtual fence will be much better than a brick-and-mortar fence because you can't climb over a wall that isn't really there.

Yeah I'm not following that logic.

Obama could use the same argument for the imaginary fence he's using now.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose at July 29, 2010 03:58 PM (0q2P7)

68 Economist jokes suck.

Posted by: Truman North at July 29, 2010 03:58 PM (e8YaH)

69 If the East Coast bordered Mexico instead of the Atlantic, we'd have the damn fence.
Posted by: Sgt. Fury at July 29, 2010 03:56 PM (gh1bX)

And it would be much cheaper to get my grass cut here in NJ

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (0GFWk)

70 44 i think we need to epistimologically close the border
Posted by: Ben at July 29, 2010 03:52 PM (wuv1c)

Be careful or you'll provoke 'em into comments like You care to posit a counterfactual to that?

Posted by: Libtard, waay smarter than you at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (FcKXR)

71 Geez some people act like the fence is to keep us in like the Berlin Wall. Seems like the people who have the highest disposable income are the ones who don't think there should be a fence. Living in a gated community can separate a person from reality.

Posted by: Downsized Upscale at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (IhHdM)

You can abstract any evil you choose into some esoteric "greater good."

So you've read my new script! What do you think, too wordy?

Posted by: Oliver Stone at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (fDRif)

73 Add some projection and cognitive dissonance

They don't do that anymore, they simply alter their perception of reality to suit their desired philosophy. No fuss no muss, and you're always right in your world.

Posted by: MikeTheMoose at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (0q2P7)

74 Yeah, I kinda thought I put all this symbolism shit to rest with my groundbreaking Transgressing the Boundaries: Towards a Transformative Hermeneutics of Quantum Gravity.

IIRC, the PoMoTards decided the paper was correct even though it was meant as a joke. That's the problem with eliminating reality as a frame of reference.

Posted by: Ian S. at July 29, 2010 04:00 PM (p05LM)

75 Living in a gated community can separate a person from reality.
Posted by: Downsized Upscale at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (IhHdM)

Does that fence around the White House count?

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 29, 2010 04:00 PM (0GFWk)

76 But Intrade has Amnesty up by 20%!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: In before the troll at July 29, 2010 04:00 PM (P9+0W)

Living in a gated community can separate a person from reality.

If you build a gated community, then you don't have to worry about building a fence

Posted by: East Coast Intelligencia at July 29, 2010 04:01 PM (e8YaH)

"It is, in certain ways, I suppose, a higher form of thinking than thinking of the concrete."

Nooooo....no, no, no! Some ivory tower academic twit considering the finer points of hetronomative symbology is not thinking on a higher plane than an engineer designing a bridge, or for that matter a mechanic figuring out why a car is missing on one cylinder.

He's not fuckin' better than they are! He only thinks he is. Hell Ace, the work you do on this blog represents a far greater intellectual challenge than most professors in the humanities are capable of dealing with.

Posted by: gebrauchshund at July 29, 2010 04:01 PM (ADeN1)

79 It's a fence. It's real purpose...

Sigh.

Posted by: Bat Chain Puller, uber pedant at July 29, 2010 03:41 PM (SCcgT)

Overblown.

Posted by: Rocks at July 29, 2010 04:02 PM (Q1lie)

80 We now have our very own Aristocracy of Pull

Posted by: Ben at July 29, 2010 04:02 PM (wuv1c)

81 Finally, my Friends, you understand what I've been telling you about building the fence. Now please excuse me. I think I see another parade that needs leading.

Posted by: Maverick McMaverick at July 29, 2010 04:02 PM (swuwV)

I'm noting this because a few weeks ago I saw a guy at the riots in Toronto who complained that the police barricades were a symbol representing a division between the protesters and the G-20 representatives.

God..don't ya just wanna tear those wanna be fucktard's head off!

Posted by: dananjcon at July 29, 2010 04:02 PM (pr+up)

83 Fence, schmence. The nautral borders - the Rio Grande and the desert - do a good enough job! Obama told me so!

Posted by: Typical Libtard at July 29, 2010 04:03 PM (zgZzy)

84 And it would be much cheaper to get my grass cut here in NJ

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (0GFWk)

Nothing is more expensive than "cheap labor". California spends over 21 BILLION a year on welfare, education and incarceration of illegal aliens and their children each and every year.

Posted by: Jim in San Diego at July 29, 2010 04:03 PM (oIp16)

85 A government fence? Now they wanna put me outta business too?

Posted by: A Mobster at July 29, 2010 04:03 PM (e8YaH)

86 Okay, so now I know what a fence says (nothing), I know what an electric fence says (bzzzzzzzzt!), and I've got a pretty good idea what a virtual fence says (virtually nothing).

What would a 60' poured-concrete wall with machine gun towers and interlocking fields of fire say?

Posted by: Keith Arnold at July 29, 2010 04:03 PM (jhHL/)

Thats true, and Ace can (and does) tell us to go fuck ourselves. Ya can't do that in the University!

Posted by: maddogg at July 29, 2010 04:03 PM (OlN4e)

88 68 Economist jokes suck.

Posted by: Truman North at July 29, 2010 03:58 PM (e8YaH)

True, but it's not a problem because they're all written by the invisible hand.

Posted by: AmishDude at July 29, 2010 04:04 PM (T0NGe)

89 And it would be much cheaper to get my grass cut here in NJ
Posted by: nevergiveup at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (0GFWk)

Nothing is more expensive than "cheap labor". California spends over 21 BILLION a year on welfare, education and incarceration of illegal aliens and their children each and every year.

Posted by: Jim in San Diego at July 29, 2010 04:03 PM (oIp16)

Yeah I know. I was just dreaming and joking. OK back to reality

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 29, 2010 04:04 PM (0GFWk)

90 Oh, contraire, I fuck myself all the time!

Posted by: A fag hag at July 29, 2010 04:04 PM (e8YaH)

63 If the East Coast bordered Mexico instead of the Atlantic, we'd have the damn fence.

EAST SIIIIIIIDE!

Posted by: New Yawk Rapper at July 29, 2010 04:05 PM (zgZzy)

92 I want a giant border wall that makes the Berlin wall shit itself. Multiple fences some chain link some concrete, spotting towers, concertina, dog runs, snipers, mobile patrol, land mines, etc. As much as feasible, National Guard troops should do their two weeks on the border. And again, this goes for both northern and southern borders. I want the coast guard patrolling the coasts and scanning all incoming freight off shore for WMD. If you're seen crossing the border I want the LE and Military fully authorized to aim center mass on any attempted border crossers. I'd love some fucking robots patrolling 24/7 armed to the teeth, but the tech may not be there yet. Go with what works. And that isn't drones or virtual anything.

How's that for symbolism?

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 04:05 PM (WZFkG)

Lucianne@

France�s President Sarkozy promised a crackdown against delinquency last week. Now he has ordered the dismantling of some 300 illegal camps of travellers and Roma across France, with the immediate deportation of anyone found without papers

omg, they are asking f or papers!

Posted by: willow at July 29, 2010 04:06 PM (SbsTp)

94 ALL of our problems since the mid-nineteenth century have been a product of abstract thinking.

Posted by: Brad at July 29, 2010 04:06 PM (2GsJg)

95 Living in a gated community can separate a person from reality.

Posted by: Downsized Upscale at July 29, 2010 03:59 PM (IhHdM)

I live behind two gates, one with a guard, and the other that requires a key code. This state could meltdown totally and we would not know it until the power went off. I like it.

Posted by: Jim in San Diego at July 29, 2010 04:07 PM (oIp16)

96 Stuffing 50 Big Macs into my slobbering maw each day symbolizes what a big, fat, overeating, over-consuming hypocrite I am.

Also, it symbolizes my impending heart attack.

Posted by: Michael Moore at July 29, 2010 04:07 PM (QoR4a)

97 Isn't it ironic that the people who think we should seal our borders and never let a single job be outsourced overseas have no problem with leaving our borders wide open so that the riff-raff of the third world can flood in?

Posted by: Steve L. at July 29, 2010 04:07 PM (Gkhxf)

98 Ace: "You can tell it's a real-world division because now you can't get to the G-20 conference center and throw rock-metaphors through the window-symbols."

Heh. Ace brings the funny. Too bad it symbolizes his inherent racism, but it's still ha-ha funny.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at July 29, 2010 04:07 PM (swuwV)

And I thought, "Gee, no, actually it's not a symbol of a division; it really is, in fact, a physical division." Because, see, you're rioting. (And not symbolically in riot, either.) You can tell it's a real-world division because now you can't get to the G-20 conference center and throw rock-metaphors through the window-symbols.

You're such a simple man. You just don't understand the nuance.

Posted by: New York Times at July 29, 2010 04:08 PM (1DVez)

100 What would a 60' poured-concrete wall with machine gun towers and interlocking fields of fire say?

Posted by: Keith Arnold at July 29, 2010 04:03 PM (jhHL/)

Go Ahead, Make My Day?

Posted by: conscious, but incoherent - stating the obvious at July 29, 2010 04:09 PM (YVZlY)

101 OK, speaking of Mikey Moore, when that big ole vapor lock comes, who is going to pump fat boy's chest and who is gonna give mouth to mouth?

Posted by: maddogg at July 29, 2010 04:09 PM (OlN4e)

102 You couldn't get 68% of people to agree on anything else. Things like "Do ghosts exist?" and "Should people be happy?" are more evenly split than this. Build a wall as tall as possible. Let illegal aliens work on it and pay them handsomely (only on the southern side)!

Posted by: dfbaskwill at July 29, 2010 04:10 PM (ndlFj)

103 An invisible hand touched her left boob on their first date.

Posted by: Ace's new novel at July 29, 2010 04:10 PM (o7kZZ)

104 Yeah I know. I was just dreaming and joking. OK back to reality

Posted by: nevergiveup at July 29, 2010 04:04 PM (0GFWk)

Oh I know. I was just posting out that little factoid for the benefit of others that don't seem to know why we are all so aflutter out here in the West about that issue.

Posted by: Jim in San Diego at July 29, 2010 04:10 PM (oIp16)

105 Economist jokes suck.

Posted by: Truman North at July 29, 2010 03:58 PM (e8YaH)

A prisoner was walking around the recreation yard, trying to figure how to break out. He walked up to a new prisoner and got to talking to him.

"So what did you do on the outside?", he asked the new guy.

"I was an economist", said the new prisoner.

"Wow. You must be a pretty smart guy. Maybe you can figure out how to break out of this place."

So the economist says, "Easy. Assume you had a pick axe....."

Posted by: Alan Sokol at July 29, 2010 04:10 PM (5aa4z)

106 I'd love some fucking robots patrolling 24/7 armed to the teeth

ED-209 ready and operational! Drop your weapon! You have 10 seconds to comply!

Posted by: MikeTheMoose at July 29, 2010 04:11 PM (0q2P7)

107

OK, speaking of Mikey Moore, when that big ole vapor lock comes, who is going to pump fat boy's chest and who is gonna give mouth to mouth?

I'd pump his chest with a sledgehammer and give him mouth-to-mouth with the tailpipe of my truck.

I mean, if no one else volunteers.

Posted by: ErikW at July 29, 2010 04:11 PM (fDRif)

108 I want the dang fence complete so that in 10 years I can revel in watching an old frumpish, wrinkled up, tatoo'd scrunt like Garafalo screaming "President Christi...tear down this fense!!111!!!11"

Posted by: dananjcon at July 29, 2010 04:11 PM (pr+up)

109

"Metaphor" is a thing bastardized by the left. It's not a bad thing - just bastardized to the point of inciting ill feelings.

OTOH, I can't help but think of the Ultimate Metaphor: God... which incites ill feelings of the left.

Plus ca change, plus c�est la meme chose... but interesting to think about.

Posted by: dum blond at July 29, 2010 04:11 PM (gbCNS)

110

92 I want a giant border wall that makes the Berlin wall shit itself. Multiple fences some chain link some concrete, spotting towers, concertina, dog runs, snipers, mobile patrol, land mines, etc.

Flaming pits of fire, bitches!

Posted by: Samuel L. Jackson at July 29, 2010 04:11 PM (zgZzy)

111 An invisible hand touched her left boob on their first date.

Posted by: Ace's new novel at July 29, 2010 04:10 PM (o7kZZ)

HE STEAL SUZY-Q METAPHOR AND FUNYUN SYMBOL!

Posted by: Old Korean Lady, Postmodernist at July 29, 2010 04:12 PM (5aa4z)

112

How�s this for amateur sociology:

I don�t believe this whole �illegal� thing would be nearly as bad as it didn�t attract the political vultures to it.

Most Americans I don�t believe can truly abide with things like free services, tuition assistance and educational benefits not available to citizens, sanctuary cities, non-enforcement of laws because of status, and other advantages that a probably very small minority of Americans are able to ascribe to illegals to the (perceived, at least) disadvantage to citizens.

If politicians were to come up with a fair model under which illegals were to attain a legal status without politicians being able to use it as a f�king tool to get elected every few years, I believe that most Americans would welcome it. (And I don�t mean amnesty � they should go to the back of the line, imo of those who are waiting to get in legally.)

But our politicians play this against us every few years and it is to their advantage evidently to let it languish, or to come up with remedies that piss off one side and play them against the other.

But, as in previous comments I�ve made, I could just as easily be full of shit.

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 04:13 PM (RkRxq)

113

HE STEAL SUZY-Q METAPHOR AND FUNYUN SYMBOL!

Mmm . . . Funyuns!

Posted by: Michael Moore at July 29, 2010 04:13 PM (zgZzy)

114 But if they build the fence, could they at least leave some large holes for Salma Hayek to stick her big tits through?

Posted by: Average mongrel moron at July 29, 2010 04:13 PM (o7kZZ)

115 Crawl to the border, blow me, build a fence....In that order.

Posted by: Det. Riggs at July 29, 2010 04:14 PM (2cfUo)

116 Now if it was a solar powered electric fence - that would already be up.

Posted by: Jean at July 29, 2010 04:14 PM (bXHdf)

117 103 An invisible hand [symbolically] touched her left boob on their first date.

Posted by: Ace's new novel at July 29, 2010 04:10 PM (o7kZZ)

added a word

Posted by: conscious, but incoherent - stating the obvious at July 29, 2010 04:14 PM (YVZlY)

118 I WANT MOTHERFUCKIN SNAKES ON THE MOTHERFUCKIN WALL

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 04:15 PM (WZFkG)

119

Comrade Zero has done what he promised. He brought the country together.

Against the Zero Administration.

Posted by: Cicero at July 29, 2010 04:15 PM (QKKT0)

120 Ace: "I just tend to distrust this sort of divorced-from-tangible-reality worship of the abstract."

Oh, yeah? Well your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries!

Posted by: Maya Angelou at July 29, 2010 04:15 PM (swuwV)

121

114 But if they build the fence, could they at least leave some large holes for Salma Hayek to stick her big tits through?

Hey! No gringos get to touch my enchiladas!

Posted by: Salma Hayek at July 29, 2010 04:15 PM (zgZzy)

122

Oh, yeah? Well your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries!

Did somebody say hamster?

Posted by: Richard Gere at July 29, 2010 04:15 PM (zgZzy)

123

"Wow. You must be a pretty smart guy. Maybe you can figure out how to break out of this place."

So the economist says, "Easy. Assume you had a pick axe....."

The mathematician says, "Define yourself to be outside of the fence."

Posted by: AmishDude at July 29, 2010 04:15 PM (T0NGe)

124 Most Americans I don�t believe can truly abide with things like free services, tuition assistance and educational benefits not available to citizens, sanctuary cities, non-enforcement of laws because of status, and other advantages that a probably very small minority of Americans are able to ascribe to illegals to the (perceived, at least) disadvantage to citizens.

That's because it's a symbol:
__
| |
____| |___
| | | | | |
| | | | | |

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at July 29, 2010 04:16 PM (5aa4z)

125 Damn thing

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at July 29, 2010 04:16 PM (5aa4z)

126 What would a 60' poured-concrete wall with machine gun towers and interlocking fields of fire say? Home, sweet Home

Posted by: Jean at July 29, 2010 04:17 PM (1vx4q)

127 Anyone live in AZ? Do you get a sense mexican-american citizens support border enforcement?

Posted by: rdbrewer at July 29, 2010 04:17 PM (1DVez)

128 Yes, congress passed the secure fence act of 2006, you know the congress was going to guarantee the border was secure before comprehensive immigration reform. And then Obama removed funding for it ... But enough of the miles were built to prove it worked.

So what will this group of AMNESTY seekers do when they become the ones on the bubble for the next group. Slave wages for all.

Isn't it weird how congressional clunkers won't keep their word about anything?

Posted by: bill-tb at July 29, 2010 04:17 PM (y+QfZ)

129 Mark Levin posting Facebook snark in response to some Andi Sullivan "Atlantic" stupidity. "The only choice for fiscal conservatives is to vote Democrat...", that kind of crap.

Might be the night for non-listeners to try to find the Levin show on the dial. Full on Mark Levin vs. Andi Sullivan will be hilarious.

Posted by: Lincolntf at July 29, 2010 04:18 PM (+O8yf)

130

But while 76% of Mainstream voters think the United States should continue to build the fence, 67% of the Political Class are opposed to it.

Uh, but then only 68% want the fence? Either they pretty much ONLY polled the "political class"... or their as math challenged as Tim Geitner.

And the major question, why are we asking the servents, what the Boss's want? Why are they even ASKING the Political class these questions?

Posted by: Romeo13 at July 29, 2010 04:18 PM (H+oXM)

131 Salma Hayek is a naturalized U.S. Citizen. An American, free and clear, so we don't need to leave any holes in the fence. She's already here.

Posted by: maddogg at July 29, 2010 04:18 PM (OlN4e)

132

Posted by: AmishDude at July 29, 2010 04:15 PM (T0NGe)

Sorry to interrupt all your smart witty posts, but with that hash, you really needed to be on last night's pussy-licking thread on the ONT.

Posted by: TexasJew at July 29, 2010 04:18 PM (o7kZZ)

133

60' poured-concrete wall with machine gun towers and interlocking fields of fire.

I beat that in New York, I'll beat that in Nogales.

Posted by: Mexican Snake Pilssken at July 29, 2010 04:18 PM (zgZzy)

134 What would a 60' poured-concrete wall with machine gun towers and interlocking fields of fire say?

More dues!!

Posted by: Border Patrolman's Local 787 at July 29, 2010 04:19 PM (5aa4z)

135 That's because it's a symbol:
__
| |
____| |___
| | | | | |
| | | | | |

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at July 29, 2010 04:16 PM (5aa4z)

Oh.

Pretend I never brought it up.

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 04:19 PM (RkRxq)

136 O/T: So she wants "card check now" per your hotair site? Well, are she and the dems/libs going to personally guarantee the safety of anyone who doesn't check the card pro union. And take full responsibility for anything, anything at all that occurs as a result of said legislation?

Posted by: ???????? at July 29, 2010 04:19 PM (p302b)

137 She's already here.

Posted by: maddogg at July 29, 2010 04:18 PM (OlN4e)

But her chi-chis are in Mexico..

Posted by: TexasJew at July 29, 2010 04:19 PM (o7kZZ)

138 Actually the fence does symbolize something. That Mexico is a bad neighbor. I wonder what the support for a border fence with Canada would be?

Posted by: Locus Ceruleus at July 29, 2010 04:20 PM (tzcjs)

139
The Mandate Without Men^tm

The Republicans might win the House, this November, on a mandate of repeal, security, a spending cuts...

but will they have the courage to prosecute such change?

Posted by: Time at July 29, 2010 04:20 PM (uFokq)

140 I wish they'd build a complete fence here in TX. You hear & see such awful things about violence in the border towns, & it seems a fence would help keep the drug cartels at bay.

Posted by: Miss'80sBaby at July 29, 2010 04:20 PM (HQSQk)

141 131 Salma Hayek is a naturalized U.S. Citizen. An American, free and clear, so we don't need to leave any holes in the fence. She's already here.

Posted by: maddogg at July 29, 2010 04:18 PM (OlN4e)

And I, for one, am better off because of it.

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 04:20 PM (RkRxq)

142 _{en fuego}

Posted by: that guy that whispers en fuego because he's afraid of being deported at July 29, 2010 04:21 PM (8/oOq)

143

Oh.

Pretend I never brought it up.

We need a preview function just to prevent Chronic ASCII Fail.

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at July 29, 2010 04:21 PM (5aa4z)

144 In another news, 68% of Americans are now racist.

Back to you , Katie.

Posted by: MFM at July 29, 2010 04:21 PM (EW49d)

145 I wonder what the support for a border fence with Canada would be?

Posted by: Locus Ceruleus at July 29, 2010 04:20 PM (tzcjs)

I dunno,. but if our country goes down the shitter any more, the Canadians (whose banks are sound) may want to build one.

Posted by: TexasJew at July 29, 2010 04:22 PM (o7kZZ)

146 Sorry to interrupt all your smart witty posts, but with that hash, you really needed to be on last night's pussy-licking thread on the ONT.

In Soviet America, pussy licks you!

Posted by: YakovSmirnoffDude at July 29, 2010 04:22 PM (T0NGe)

147 "138 Actually the fence does symbolize something. That Mexico is a bad neighbor. I wonder what the support for a border fence with Canada would be?

Posted by: Locus Ceruleus at July 29, 2010 04:20 PM (tzcjs)"

Don't think they would care. As long as someone else is paying for it, they would probably think it's fine.

Posted by: ???????? at July 29, 2010 04:22 PM (p302b)

148 29 Operation Wetback.

operation wetfoot

Posted by: newrouter at July 29, 2010 04:22 PM (bEZJ+)

149

Ace, glad to see you've finally figured out how it all works, in re the higher abilities of the enlightened.

Of course, your conclusions are probably all wrong, as you would be aware (and the enlightened already KNOW) if you had the least capacity to COMPREHEND anything at all, let alone understand it, or get it...

Posted by: Barbarausa at July 29, 2010 04:23 PM (gRgC6)

150 Good Fences = Good Neighbors

I thought I'd already explained this to you frickin' retards?

Posted by: Zombie Robert Frost at July 29, 2010 04:23 PM (P9+0W)

151 Operation Swat Bumblebee Man is in full effect.

Posted by: Janeto Napolitano at July 29, 2010 04:23 PM (zgZzy)

152 144 In another news, 68% of Americans are now racist.

Back to you , Katie.

Posted by: MFM at July 29, 2010 04:21 PM (EW49d)

Katie, dammit, are you drunk again?

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 04:24 PM (RkRxq)

153 Sgt Fury @63 makes a damn good point. The oh so open minded liberals of the north east coast have no problems with the border being open because they are not dealing with it.

It's like a unfunded mandate.

Posted by: Locus Ceruleus at July 29, 2010 04:24 PM (tzcjs)

154 I live on the East Coast and I want a border wall so large that you can see it from space!

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 29, 2010 04:26 PM (zgZzy)

155
We simply making good neighbors.

Posted by: Robert Frost at July 29, 2010 04:26 PM (e1eKc)

156 Katie, dammit, are you drunk again?

WHO WANTS TO FUCK?!?!?

*giggle

*bleargh......

Posted by: Katie Couric at a sorority party at July 29, 2010 04:27 PM (EW49d)

157 I don't give a rat's ass if the support goes up to 108%. What you teabagging cons fail to realize time and again is that this is all about ME. So, to borrow an endearment from my VP...bite me.

Posted by: Barack Hussein Toonces Obama at July 29, 2010 04:27 PM (554T5)

158 On my next job I think I'll tell the client that I'm going to use symbolic fasteners instead of nails , screw , and bolts .When their house is reduced to matchsticks in the next stiff breeze they can consider it a statement on the patriarchal influence of western engineering and design concepts .

Posted by: awkward davies at July 29, 2010 04:27 PM (RNW0d)

159 "Not of woods only and the shade of trees.
He will not go behind his father's saying,
And he likes having thought of it so well
He says again, 'Good fences make good neighbors.'"

Posted by: ???????? at July 29, 2010 04:27 PM (p302b)

160 maddogg: "Thats true, and Ace can (and does) tell us to go fuck ourselves. Ya can't do that in the University!"

So not true. And I have the semester transcripts to prove it. The Humanities and Plant Systematics were the worst.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at July 29, 2010 04:27 PM (swuwV)

161 No Walls around Jericho!

Posted by: Judge Ruth at July 29, 2010 04:27 PM (6oDXl)

162

It's a vicious cycle:

More illegals, less cracka babies, less cracka babies, less work for black panthers.

Ya just can't win!

Posted by: Hussein the Plumber at July 29, 2010 04:28 PM (RkRxq)

163

157 I don't give a rat's ass if the support goes up to 108%. What you teabagging cons fail to realize time and again is that this is all about ME. So, to borrow an endearment from my VP...bite me.

Don't forget Mr. President . . . you won!

Posted by: Bobby Gibbsy at July 29, 2010 04:28 PM (zgZzy)

164 Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 29, 2010 04:26 PM (zgZzy)

like that dam in China? I heard that is very cool to see.

Posted by: ???????? at July 29, 2010 04:28 PM (p302b)

165

Hah!

Beat you all to the obvious Robert Frost joke! Mine is an evil laugh!

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at July 29, 2010 04:29 PM (P9+0W)

166 We got fooled in 1986 when they said there would be border security, so, this time, border security comes first, then a pathway to amnesty.

Posted by: Neo at July 29, 2010 04:30 PM (tE8FB)

167 "Isn't it ironic that the people who think we should seal our borders and never let a single job be outsourced overseas have no problem with leaving our borders wide open so that the riff-raff of the third world can flood in?
Posted by: Steve L."

What?

You make absolutely no sense, here.

Posted by: Dianna at July 29, 2010 04:30 PM (qrFCz)

168 Has there been any polling on the use of a mine field, mixed high-density, Sprengmine 44's, Shumine 42's, Pot mines, A200's, the little wooden bastards that the mine detectors don't pick up?

I'm betting it would get a controversial 39%

Posted by: toby928 at July 29, 2010 04:31 PM (8/oOq)

169 Don't forget Mr. President . . . you won!

Oh...yes. Thanks, Bibbsy...er...Gibbsy. Got distracted. Tough putt for quad bogey coming up here.

Posted by: Barack Hussein Toonces Obama at July 29, 2010 04:31 PM (554T5)

170 166 We got fooled in 1986 when they said there would be border security, so, this time, border security comes first, then a pathway to amnesty.

Posted by: Neo at July 29, 2010 04:30 PM (tE8FB)

Then mandatory chimichangas on all school menus.

Posted by: TexasJew at July 29, 2010 04:31 PM (o7kZZ)

171 That's it! We'll call it "insourcing" and nobody can be against the oposite of "outsourcing"!!

Posted by: Corporate Obama shill at July 29, 2010 04:31 PM (e8YaH)

172 Steve L. -

Come to think of it, that was positively Alanis Morissette level of "irony" disguised as utter incoherence.

I hope you were joking.

Posted by: Dianna at July 29, 2010 04:31 PM (qrFCz)

173

I heard that is very cool to see.

Ours will be cooler because of the rings of fire.

Posted by: Wyatt Earp at July 29, 2010 04:31 PM (zgZzy)

174 And I thought, "Gee, no, actually it's not a symbol of a division; it really is, in fact, a physical division." Because, see, you're rioting. (And not symbolically in riot, either.) You can tell it's a real-world division because now you can't get to the G-20 conference center and throw rock-metaphors through the window-symbols.

Hey ... this is good stuff !!

Posted by: Neo at July 29, 2010 04:32 PM (tE8FB)

175 The privacy fence in my backyard is both practical and metaphoric of my desire to block out my damn next-door neighbors. Why else are they offended by it? More importantly, why should I care?

Posted by: dum blond at July 29, 2010 04:32 PM (gbCNS)

176 11 Busloads of Californians in Arizona protesting. If we can schedule implementing another immigration law on November 4th (election day) maybe enough Californians will go to protest in Arizona (arrested and unable to vote) and we can rid this State of the current idiots representing us. One can only hope.

Posted by: Tom at July 29, 2010 04:34 PM (ASjv/)

177 175 The privacy fence in my backyard is both practical and metaphoric of my desire to block out my damn next-door neighbors. Why else are they offended by it?

Posted by: dum blond at July 29, 2010 04:32 PM (gbCNS)

Because it's blocking their view of you sunbathing nude.

Posted by: TexasJew at July 29, 2010 04:35 PM (o7kZZ)

178 ErikW: "I'd pump his chest with a sledgehammer and give him mouth-to-mouth with the tailpipe of my truck."

Rhetorically, of course.

Posted by: Spencer Ackerman (J-lister) at July 29, 2010 04:36 PM (swuwV)

179

175 The privacy fence in my backyard is both practical and metaphoric of my desire to block out my damn next-door neighbors. Why else are they offended by it? More importantly, why should I care?

We're offended because we can't get a good look at your boobies now!!!

Posted by: Dum Blond's Neighbors at July 29, 2010 04:36 PM (zgZzy)

180 After the fence gets built, then what?

A couple of weeks of remorse and self-loathing in Newseek and Time, and some ugly political cartoons with themes pandering to white guilt. Then the issue will be put on the back burner as journalists lose interest and chase the next shiny thing.

I can live with that.

Posted by: fapo at July 29, 2010 04:37 PM (e1eKc)

181 Don't wait until 11/4 to vote. It's scheduled on 11/2 this year.

Posted by: Corporate Obama shill at July 29, 2010 04:37 PM (e8YaH)

182 Operation Wetback. Look it up. Bring it back (but this time look for a nicer sounding name).

Posted by: Hedgehog

Sounds like it's time for a naming contest!

early entries:

Operation 'reunion'

Operation 'round trip'

Operation 'how did I wind up back here?'

Operation 'signing a lease was pointless'

Operation 'refused by addressee'

Operation ' Oh no you don't'

Posted by: Blue Hen at July 29, 2010 04:38 PM (R2fpr)

183 Operation Go Home and clean up the mess there

Posted by: Naan at July 29, 2010 04:42 PM (GARYj)

184 I don't really understand the opposition to this amongst the political class, specifically the Dims. They can see the current numbers are against it, they can see it energizes the Rightwing base, and god-forbid a terrorist(s) walks across that border and does something horrible while they are screwing around - the party responsible for that mess would get slaughtered. So they are willing to take a current drumming and run the risk of political catastrophe -- all for the relatively dubious proposition of a future voting base? The calculus is really off here, something is biasing it.

Posted by: Jean at July 29, 2010 04:42 PM (xMgdu)

185 How about...

Operation "Adios"

Operation "Return to Sender"

Operation "Dry Back"

Operation "Slowpoke Rodriguez"

Operation "Not Welcome"

Operation "We Finally Grew Some Balls"

Operation "We invented Taco Bell so we don't need you anymore."

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 04:45 PM (WZFkG)

186 Posted by: Jean at July 29, 2010 04:42 PM (xMgdu)

The left is doing the same thing it did under the Clinton years. Ignore the danger and let the incoming Republican President deal with the consequences (and blame).

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 04:47 PM (WZFkG)

187

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 04:45 PM (WZFkG)

I like:

Operation "Sovereignty"

That would really makes the lefts' heads explode. Although, that won't change them, as they don't use their heads, anyway. But, it does slow them down a bit.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 29, 2010 04:49 PM (Qp4DT)

188 Under my program of jailing the employers they wouldn't need to spend money on the fence.

Posted by: Vic at July 29, 2010 04:50 PM (/jbAw)

189 Good fences make good neighbors.
Robert Frost

Posted by: Rat Patrol at July 29, 2010 04:50 PM (dQdrY)

190 Under my program of jailing flaying the employers they wouldn't need to spend money on the fence.

FTFY

Posted by: toby928 at July 29, 2010 04:51 PM (8/oOq)

191

168 Has there been any polling on the use of a mine field, mixed high-density, Sprengmine 44's, Shumine 42's, Pot mines, A200's, the little wooden bastards that the mine detectors don't pick up?

+69

Posted by: dudeinsantacruz at July 29, 2010 04:51 PM (SfDpg)

192

Anyone knowingly employing an illegal should be tried, and executed. Their assets siezed. And their family sold into slavery.

Some people think I'm a bit extreme. Fuck 'em.

Posted by: Rat Patrol at July 29, 2010 04:52 PM (dQdrY)

193 Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 29, 2010 04:49 PM (Qp4DT)

Let's take it one step further...

Operation "America, Fuck Yeah!"

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 04:52 PM (WZFkG)

194 Operation "America, Fuck Yeah!"

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 04:52 PM (WZFkG)

Works for me.

Posted by: progressoverpeace at July 29, 2010 04:53 PM (Qp4DT)

195

There are 2 problems here. One is Mexico, who just dumps its' poor on the U.S any way they can. And we don't hold that government accountable.

The other is the U.S. It would seem, by the actions and the laws that have NOT been passed by this country, that there is a very large group of interests who want illegals in this country.

It's a tough fight.

Posted by: HH at July 29, 2010 04:56 PM (6oDXl)

196 "The other is the U.S. It would seem, by the actions and the laws that have NOT been passed by this country, that there is a very large group of interests who want illegals in this country."

Pete Stark informed a group of constituents that the "restaurant lobby" (?! WTF?) didn't want enforcement.

Posted by: Dianna at July 29, 2010 05:01 PM (qrFCz)

197

Concrete and fence posts were outlawed per Obamacare page 3,001 paragraph 86. Ya know 'it had to be passed for us to see what was in it'

Posted by: Journolist at July 29, 2010 05:04 PM (8EEyy)

198 Ace,
Excellent post. Let me add two more things to your analysis.

1. It is also a cultural issue. Support for the border fence is culturally identified with the gun-totin' Minuteman rubes. The good people of the Political Class can't be seen to be associated with them even in the slightest.

2. The political class inherently don't believe in American exceptionalism. Therefore they think America is always perilously close to full-blown Nazi Fascism. In fact, you could say they believe in American Anti-Exceptionalism: we're always on the verge of disaster because we're a nation full of idiots and retards (according to them), unlike the educated Europhiles represented by the political class. So building a wall, because it could, very hypothetically, lead to concentration camps and atrocities against brown people, and because the Political Class has no faith in Americans to restrain themselves from going down that path, they will resist even the vaguest of vague hints of going there.

Posted by: chemjeff at July 29, 2010 05:06 PM (Pm5H8)

199 While discussing this issue with two deputy sheriffs recently, I was interested (and amused) by one deputy's theory and suspicion that the Democrats are deliberately bringing in hordes of dumb people from south of the border to deliberately dilute this country's population of intelligent people with dummies who will support the Democratic Party's communist agenda. The way he put it was funnier than that, but you know, he might be onto something there. Ya gotta love our deputy sheriffs here. They have to put up with shit that boggles the mind, and yet they still have their sense of humor.

Posted by: Rangel/Greene 2012 at July 29, 2010 05:09 PM (sYrWB)

200 Democrats are deliberately bringing in hordes of dumb people from south of the border to deliberately dilute this country's population of intelligent people with dummies who will support the Democratic Party's communist agenda.

In other words, Idocracy......I will be suing the deputy for copyright infringement as soon as you tell me his name.

Posted by: Mike Judge at July 29, 2010 05:16 PM (UK9cE)

201 Or, Idiocracy. I forgot how to spell after that last bong hit. Sorry.

Posted by: Mike Judge at July 29, 2010 05:17 PM (UK9cE)

202 One is Mexico, who just dumps its' poor on the U.S any way they can. And we don't hold that government accountable.

When Mexican-national illegally-resident rapists, murderers, drug smugglers, coyotes, and pedophiles get deported, we should air-drop them into this yard.

I'm not sure if it would be more effective to give them parachutes so they can start casing the place, or to just let 'em fall.

Posted by: HeatherRadish at July 29, 2010 05:20 PM (jV+np)

203 hasn't most of the fence already been built and been determined not to be an effective way of stopping illegal border crossing ? It is essentially complete from the Pacific to NM which is where most of the illegals used to and still do cross
I mean does anyone think that the stupid thing works ?
Morons

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 05:25 PM (I+7Zv)

204 Uh-oh.

Think Barry can squeeze a visit to AZ in between all his vacations?

Posted by: HeatherRadish at July 29, 2010 05:25 PM (jV+np)

205 Ace foogle border fence and you can see that it is mostly already up and failed

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 05:27 PM (I+7Zv)

206
204 Erm...yeah. This will be interesting.

_{Pack the Kevlar, Sarah...}

Posted by: DarkLordOfTheIntarWebs at July 29, 2010 05:28 PM (IkEhE)

207 "Operation Gated Community"

Gated communities should not be only for the top 1% of Americans. Let's put a gate around all 57 States.

Posted by: Z as in Jersey at July 29, 2010 05:28 PM (kZT4X)

208 Democrats are deliberately bringing in hordes of dumb people from south

They have been dumbing down the schools for 40 years for the same reason, and look who's running the country (into the ground).

Posted by: real joe at July 29, 2010 05:31 PM (IpIBJ)

209 They say a border fence won't stop illegal immigration. Fair enough, but it will slow the illegals down long enough to get a bead on them.

Posted by: Jan Brewer at July 29, 2010 05:36 PM (pELFl)

210

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 05:27 PM (I+7Zv)

You should "foogle" spell check.

Posted by: Mallamutt at July 29, 2010 05:37 PM (OWjjx)

211 Build the fence with the leftovers they were going to put in Yucca Mountain.

Posted by: Unclefacts, AoSHQ Pro Debate Squad, And Summoner Of Meteors. at July 29, 2010 05:39 PM (eCAn3)

212 203 hasn't most of the fence already been built and been determined not to be an effective way of stopping illegal border crossing ? It is essentially complete from the Pacific to NM which is where most of the illegals used to and still do cross
I mean does anyone think that the stupid thing works ?
Morons

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 05:25 PM (I+7Zv)

Bet you think Lindsey Graham is just fuckin' dreamy don't ya.

Posted by: Unclefacts, AoSHQ Pro Debate Squad, And Summoner Of Meteors. at July 29, 2010 05:40 PM (eCAn3)

213 Unclefacts: Bet you think Lindsey Graham is just fuckin' dreamy don't ya.

Yeah. So what's it to you?

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 05:46 PM (pELFl)

214

hasn't most of the fence already been built and been determined not to be an effective way of stopping illegal border crossing ?

No.

It is essentially complete from the Pacific to NM which is where most of the illegals used to and still do cross.

No.

I mean does anyone think that the stupid thing works ?

Well, if it were built, then we could discuss it.

Posted by: HH at July 29, 2010 05:46 PM (6oDXl)

215

To put it nicely, Denny, you don't have a clue. I've been reading your ditzy comments - screwy assumptions, even screwier conjectures and wild 'n irresponsible accusations which aren't supported by the facts. I'm sure that you don't mean to be, but you're so ditzy that you're funny._.So please, keep 'em coming,

_{(Pssst, Ace? Is that you?)}

Posted by: Greene/Rangel 2012 at July 29, 2010 05:47 PM (sYrWB)

216 Someday we'll get a full-assed troll.

Posted by: HeatherRadish at July 29, 2010 05:48 PM (jV+np)

217 Build the fence with the leftovers they were going to put in Yucca Mountain.

LOL, those elements have to decay for a minimum of 5 years before they can be shipped. However it would be tough to stack them unshielded onto a fence.

The last time I saw someone try to measure one it was by lowering a high level film badge next to one in the SFP under 12 ft of water. They estimated 10⁶ Rem/hr.

That is what we called instant molecular death.

Posted by: Vic at July 29, 2010 05:49 PM (/jbAw)

218

But....but....the Dems keep saying if the wall is 30ft. high

the hordes at the gate will make 31ft. ladders! I guess

we just have to give up......now, land mines might just

do the trick.

Posted by: grizzlybare at July 29, 2010 05:49 PM (PtLfz)

219 ====== IF WE BUILD IT, THEY WILL STOP COMING =============

Posted by: SantaRosaStan, increasingly discouraged at July 29, 2010 05:50 PM (JrRME)

220 You can go here and see where the fence is and where it's not. Mostly where its not. Left side of web page.
American Border Patrol

Posted by: sig at July 29, 2010 05:50 PM (2i+Vz)

221 Mines. 1 mile deep, 1000 miles wide. Let's play illegal immigrant roulette.

Posted by: tangonine at July 29, 2010 05:57 PM (C8Pcc)

222 That is what we called instant molecular death.

Posted by: Vic at July 29, 2010 05:49 PM (/jbAw)

I'm not seeing a downside here Vic

Posted by: Unclefacts, AoSHQ Pro Debate Squad, And Summoner Of Meteors. at July 29, 2010 05:58 PM (eCAn3)

223 We're doing this wrong. Instead of focusing on drugs and human trafficking, we should claim illegals are crossing the border carrying (gasp) UNTAXED TOBACCO! Our a$$hat governor, Jim "cigarettes at $60 a carton" Doyle would be leading the charge, in a .50cal equpped Hummer, leaving a trail of bodies in his wake.

Posted by: bigred at July 29, 2010 05:58 PM (uh7Ap)

224 OT - more Soetoro follies over at The Thinker

B.O., Adult Child of an Alcoholic
tinyurl.com/35tmm7q

Posted by: Blackford Oakes at July 29, 2010 06:03 PM (w9BEi)

225 Unclefacts--we don't want to kill the builders...(of course, I'm assuming we're awarding the bid to firms that don't pick up their workers out by the Home Depot every morning...maybe a bad assumption)

bigred--lol, so true.

Posted by: HeatherRadish at July 29, 2010 06:04 PM (jV+np)

226 225 Unclefacts--we don't want to kill the builders...(of course, I'm assuming we're awarding the bid to firms that don't pick up their workers out by the Home Depot every morning...maybe a bad assumption)

bigred--lol, so true.

Posted by: HeatherRadish at July 29, 2010 06:04 PM (jV+np)

Heather you've forgotten the first rule of any nefarious plot: Leave No Witnesses.

Posted by: Unclefacts, AoSHQ Pro Debate Squad, And Summoner Of Meteors. at July 29, 2010 06:06 PM (eCAn3)

227 Peek-a-boo, Denny! Are you still there? Olie, olie, olsen free! Come out, come out, wherever you are?

Posted by: Hi Denny!!! at July 29, 2010 06:09 PM (sYrWB)

228 I don't really support a border fence, because illegals could easily climb it or cut thru it.

Mine the frontier - with cluster bombs.

Posted by: CoolCzech at July 29, 2010 06:09 PM (tJjm/)

229 203 hasn't most of the fence already been built and been determined not to be an effective way of stopping illegal border crossing ? It is essentially complete from the Pacific to NM which is where most of the illegals used to and still do cross
I mean does anyone think that the stupid thing works ?
Morons

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 05:25 PM (I+7Zv)

Dickless twat.

Come down here and try to climb over the full-size 18' version (which has only been implemented in sections, due to the traitors in Congress and that bizarre fecal pellet in the White House). It is sheer vertical metal and has motion detectors.

Posted by: TexasJew at July 29, 2010 06:16 PM (o7kZZ)

230

Mine the frontier - with cluster bombs.

Ummm, No.

Now the drug boys, that's a whole different story.

Ambush...

Posted by: HH at July 29, 2010 06:21 PM (6oDXl)

231 "...and that bizarre fecal pellet in the White House)."

Oh, Dear! Is THAT where I left it?

Posted by: The Yeti at July 29, 2010 06:24 PM (tJjm/)

232 For those of you who are Abstract Nihilists, Proponents of Neo-Chomskyian Deep Structure, and quasi-Haiku aficionados:

A fence

may not absolutely prevent your neighbor's dog from shitting on your lawn,

but it sure helps.

^{_{(and a paintball marker with electric feed hopper, fully loaded, can get the little doggie's attitude right, and real fast)}}

Posted by: Arbalest at July 29, 2010 06:35 PM (gma26)

233 well tell me how much it has helped so far since we have it up from the Pacific to the NM border. Of course once your neighbors dog is in, it then makes it harder for him to leave. Enforcing the law on hiring would do a hell of a lot more than a fence. And also 50% of all illegals that are now in the country came on legal visas. The fence would only stop them from LEAVING

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 06:45 PM (I+7Zv)

234 #233 denny crane

1. As shown above, the fence "from the Pacific to the NM border" is incomplete. Actually, it has many holes in it, and does not exist in other places. I think you know this, you just want to evade the truth.

2. "And also 50% of all illegals that are now in the country came on legal visas."
No. Obviously untrue. You know this, as well

3. "Of course once your neighbors dog is in, it then makes it harder for him to leave."
If you've ever had a "doggie problem", then you know that if you deal with it quickly, the doggie leaves even faster. They're good at remembering how they got in.

Posted by: Arbalest at July 29, 2010 06:51 PM (gma26)

235

I'll bet the UN wouldn't approve if we did build the fence like that all along the border.. Probably something like obscuring some historic view, or mopery with intent to creep.

Posted by: Reader C.J. Burch says... at July 29, 2010 06:53 PM (sJTmU)

236 Senator Ted Kennedy (D-Cirrhosis) glibly thundered before the Senate one day, "Show me a fifty foot fence and I'll show you a fifty-one foot ladder." If I lived in DC I woulda unveiled a prototype section of fence and said, "OK, it's your turn, Ted. It's not even close to fifty feet tall. This'll be easy. Show us the ladder. And then use it to climb over the wall, fatass."

Posted by: Wm T Sherman at July 29, 2010 07:04 PM (w41GQ)

237

@27: "Border fence is like checking for ID's when voting."

Racist?

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at July 29, 2010 07:10 PM (ySNz/)

238 Ace, I've gotten to the point where I've moved on from just a fence. I'd even settle for LAND MINES.

Posted by: GarandFan at July 29, 2010 07:15 PM (XaWFq)

239

@54: "Nothing says get off my lawn like a 6 barrel auto rotating 20mm Vulcan Cannon."

I prefer the retro look. Either the quad-40mm mount, or the German Flakvierling.

Posted by: Fa Cube Itches at July 29, 2010 07:15 PM (ySNz/)

240 What bothers me more than the "bad symbolism" of concrete measures are the bold statements of the abstract:

"You can't deport 12 million people. That would be impossible!"

Really? How many could we deport? How many should we deport? None, you say? Eisenhower deported nearly 100,000 in less than a year, while causing the self-deportation of over a million.

Posted by: Cooter at July 29, 2010 07:16 PM (k2Bjx)

241 I think I found a place for all those unused land mines.

Posted by: War Monger at July 29, 2010 07:20 PM (uXuLF)

242 None, you say? Eisenhower deported nearly 100,000 in less than a year, while causing the self-deportation of over a million.
Posted by: Cooter at July 29, 2010 07:16 PM (k2Bjx)

I'm still sucking my thumb over that, booh, hoo!!!

Posted by: Anderson Cooper at July 29, 2010 07:23 PM (tJjm/)

243 @236:

Show me a 12 foot deep puddle of water, and I'll drive my girlfriend into it!

Posted by: Zombie Ted Kennedy at July 29, 2010 07:24 PM (tJjm/)

244

@192: "Anyone knowingly employing an illegal should be tried, and executed. Their assets siezed. And their family sold into slavery."

Naw, naw. We're cool with that.

Posted by: The Romans at July 29, 2010 07:26 PM (ySNz/)

245 Well said, Ace. Really. The type of person you speak of is the classic revolutionary who brings down the old order and all of its restraints and then becomes the first victims of the power players like Stalin, who actually do deal in reality. Trotsky will tell you all about it

Posted by: Call me Lennie at July 29, 2010 07:28 PM (mClC0)

246 233 well tell me how much it has helped so far since we have it up from the Pacific to the NM border. Of course once your neighbors dog is in, it then makes it harder for him to leave. Enforcing the law on hiring would do a hell of a lot more than a fence. And also 50% of all illegals that are now in the country came on legal visas. The fence would only stop them from LEAVING

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 06:45 PM (I+7Zv)

must be a bitch having to live with stupidity of this magnitude.

Posted by: Unclefacts, AoSHQ Pro Debate Squad, And Summoner Of Meteors. at July 29, 2010 07:31 PM (eCAn3)

247

Trotsky would tell you all about it if only Stalin had not located him down in Mexico with that little Mexican artist and her husband, whatshername again?

Reality beats abstract every time they meet up.

Posted by: Boots at July 29, 2010 07:32 PM (06JTY)

248 �This memorandum offers administrative relief options to . . . reduce the threat of removal for certain individuals present in the United States without authorization,� it reads.

Also: �In the absence of Comprehensive Immigration Reform, USCIS can extend benefits and/or protections to many individuals and groups by issuing new guidance and regulations, exercising discretion with regard to parole-in-place, deferred action and the issuance of Notices to Appear (NTA), and adopting significant process improvements.�

Posted by: Neo at July 29, 2010 07:32 PM (tE8FB)

249 And also 50% of all illegals that are now in the country came on legal visas. The fence would only stop them from LEAVING

The U.S. doesn't check your ID as you leave.

Not to mention you don't have to cross the Mexican border on foot to return to Ireland, Poland, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Thailand, etc--you can take a plane, maybe not directly there, but certainly with minimal unnecessary stops.

Posted by: HeatherRadish at July 29, 2010 07:39 PM (jV+np)

250

Denny - #233 @ 6:45PM

Whoa, you got us there!!! Can't agrue with that logic.

Posted by: Denny vs. Arbalest - The Battle Of The Loonies at July 29, 2010 07:42 PM (sYrWB)

251 233 well tell me how much it has helped so far since we have it up from the Pacific to the NM border. Of course once your neighbors dog is in, it then makes it harder for him to leave. Enforcing the law on hiring would do a hell of a lot more than a fence. And also 50% of all illegals that are now in the country came on legal visas. The fence would only stop them from LEAVING

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 06:45 PM (I+7Zv)

I just walked in FROM the Mexican border about 5 minuets ago, and I must say, from first hand experience, that you are profoundly retarded.

There ARE NO CONTROLS on going into Mexico from the USA. You have two very bored Infanter�a de Marina (Mexican Marines) standing in front of a card table waving EVERYONE through with no documentation what-so-ever. This is at the San Ysidro border crossing. Disneyland has better security than Mexico does at the US border.

Next time, know of what you are speaking before you talk nonsense.

Posted by: Jim in San Diego at July 29, 2010 07:48 PM (oIp16)

252

Of course, once your neighbors dog is in

Dude, are you comparing Mexicans to dogs?

You are a bad, bad liberal.

Posted by: Who Knows at July 29, 2010 07:50 PM (aE/nJ)

253 Amnesty without any vote

http://tinyurl.com/22lhu46

We're all orphans in Zombieland

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 08:04 PM (WZFkG)

254 Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
Sometimes a door is just a door.
Sometimes a fence is just a fence.

Posted by: Steve S at July 29, 2010 08:11 PM (IfigT)

255 What we know:

- Dems won't vote for anything not including immediate amnesty (a very firm position I suspect).
- Public is opposed to immediate (gr)amnesty.
- Public is (now?) in support of a fence while the political class (whom is despised) is not.

SO: How to use to advantage? Any ideas?

Seems possible it could be used as a "wedge issue" for Nov. 2010, coupled with the AZ suit. I am imagining the Repubs actually BRINGING A PLAN TO THE PUBLIC. One the libs won't accept which is easier than pie - push it hard - be viewed in favor of a real "immigration reform" - take the word back _ (hint: it can even be more left then it would/will be - added bonus: the far right would be against and this would make media's job harder - it won't happen in next 2 years anyway (if get House - otherwise screwed regardless)).

a little far-fetched I know, but I wonder if GOP could use the center-position(s), for the Fall, while these nutballs are leaning so far left, and the public is moving away - the field is wide open in that sense.

If they say, "look, we are all for immigration reform, AND HERE IS OUR PLAN, it is the Dems who are trying to rigg the system (for votes). We simply feel that the path-to-citizenship should be a path and not a jump". This would also counter the party-of-NO theme, not that it's all bad, but it's bad to be pegged to one, and countering themes is a tactic to keep media off-balance. The left is, among other things, the party-of-Obstinant.

PS: silly ques: Can AZ pass a new law tommorrow and keep the DOJ and WH busy filing suits until Nov?

Posted by: hey it's bold at July 29, 2010 08:14 PM (vQoSF)

256 I think we should ask our "political class" if they have fence around THEIR property. If so, how can they be against that which they use for themselves?

Posted by: Rich at July 29, 2010 08:44 PM (JzDsB)

257 Symbolism, like accusations of racism, is the squid ink of the left. Since there is no real world reason to support any idea that progressives come up with, they have to promote imagination and fantasy. If that doesn't work there's always character assassination. The left has no factual or realistic arguments so they distract.

Posted by: Ken Hahn at July 29, 2010 08:48 PM (WRkLQ)

258 hate to re-post but here is some fodder/brain-dump in case even one sentence is useful:

-- begin post --
1) Have to be able to prevent gross flow of physical bodies across border, FIRST*. Choose your tech-of-choice. Initially it will need super-charged resources/patrols, which would be unnecessary once the solution has settled, (ideally - the guest-worker program and complying employers would do the trick (oh, but there is entitlements... k neglect for now), and a simple fence properly placed would remove the tail.

Next, a solution could have 2 things:

- guest-worker program

I don't know what there is now but this would not be your standard work-visa, with requirements A. We need this program because we don't want to cut-off the cheap labor supply, is that right? and the citizenship part should be necessarily a longer part, part of the,

- path-way to citizenship (for the future guest-workers + "special case" for those who broke the law)

There already is a normal one, and we are doing a "special case" for our valued resident neighbors, right? so this could be an auxillary path which could not be as strict as say the work/student/visa process, as we are primarly trying to avoid "uprooting" people.

2) First things first. Guest worker program. Once this is announced their will be an extreme increase in "migrants" (but does it matter?). background check etc. maybe fingerprints whatever...

* this is why there must be block first. It doesn't matter what the details of the amnesty process are: we will not be able to validate any work history as that would require self-incrimination by the employer (unless you want to grant them amnesty to, but again, the announcement, paperwork...) and we aren't looking at tax records (sorry if they also committed identity theft but they don't get that money back) or received handouts. Point is we will be having a blue-light special from the announcement untill the "special case" forms stop being handed out (eventually just an initial guest-worker program form). There may be another way to distinguish between those who have legitamate roots here and those who don't, but it escapes me.

Maybe they could be given the choice of paying into FICA/etc. or not. Those who do not want to become citizens would get to keep their money (oooh.. jealous - though mexico may grab it). If they choose to pay then those years should count if they eventually become citizens.

3) once we have all the guest workers including the millions of "special cases", we then stop handing out the forms and place those into the "pathway-to-citizenship" file in the immigration department, which will be at THE END OF LINE in the other immigration forms. They can still work with the guest-worker thing until interview or whatever - however, in the evalution, they will be allowed special (one time?) requirements that will take into account their whatever status. If they fail their guest-worker thing is cancelled and we send I nice letter asking them to leave.

No citizenship shall be awarded from this legislation for 1 full federal election cycle + 1 day. They will be guest-workers with application to pathway-to-citizenship until then.

After all the "special cases" are handled, their could still be a separate set of requirements for people applying for citizenship from the guest-worker program (after whatever years), but this would be uniform and not prejudicing any race or nationality or "US residency" prior 201X. In the end, there would be the final guest-worker forms at the embassies/border (fee paid at counter - but no job needed, or guaranteed), which would be quick, plus, a fence to boot (to deter the greediest employers, as the wages will necessarily rise for this new class).

At that point, as far as babies, if they are born here and go to school here, well, let's make them Americans.

-- end post --
pls, forgive my impudence.

Posted by: h.i.b. at July 29, 2010 08:49 PM (vQoSF)

259 "let's make them Americans."

supposed to be: "let's make them Americans."

Posted by: hib at July 29, 2010 08:51 PM (vQoSF)

260 Oh yeah... shoot, also, and very importantly:

"or nationality"

should be striked out: "~~or nationality~~"

duh.

Posted by: hib at July 29, 2010 09:02 PM (vQoSF)

261 203 I mean does anyone think that the stupid thing works ?
Morons

Posted by: denny crane at July 29, 2010 05:25 PM (I+7Zv)

Shorter denny crane: "FENCES: HOW DO THEY WORK?"

Gee, I have most of a telephone here, but for some inexplicable reason, it don't work. It is a mystery to us all.

Also, do you just forget where you're posting? "Morons" isn't an insult here, it's just the name of the group.

Do you stand outside the fence at dairy farms and shout "herd!" at them? I could so see that. Well, until the guys in the "rescue" van arrive.

Posted by: Merovign, Strong on His Mountain at July 29, 2010 09:09 PM (bxiXv)

262 Guest worker won't solve shit. People are fleeing Mexico because it's a dangerous, corrupt shit hole. The jobs are free government cheese is a bonus.

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 09:16 PM (WZFkG)

263 *the jobs OR free govt cheese

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 09:17 PM (WZFkG)

264 ...and, another concern that I had was that it would probably be a bit harder to pass a FAIR Tax after such votes materialize... it's a strategy call I guess and I wouldn't know, but my hunch now is the FAIR Tax will be a big, long, lift regardless; and BO is there for 2 mo yrs and you gotta make the best of what you got. *pulls foot out of mouth*

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Posted by: whitenice at July 29, 2010 09:21 PM (4Q4zy)

266 Ace, this abstract/concrete thing is a good insight. It helped some puzzling things fall into place about lib behavior I've observed. Example: I was once at a dinner, nice calm atmosphere, when a tangential reference to politics led one of the attending libs to raise his voice and say "I think that Bush is a WAR CRIMINAL who should be EXECUTED!" His face turned red as he said this, and his usually kind demeanor turned savage and uncontrolled. For him, Bush was an abstraction, and the people around him, enjoying their dinners, well, they were just mundane concrete examples, no point in worrying about them.

Posted by: Splunge at July 29, 2010 09:28 PM (9uwvY)

267 *the jobs OR free govt cheese

Posted by: ChicagoJedi at July 29, 2010 09:17 PM (WZFkG)

yes, but we will have to wait untill 2013 for any entitlement reform no? So ques is how to get a fence before then... frankly, I don't think BO would allow a fence even with blanket amnesty..... so, then, the question is whats the best way to play the issue until he is gone. plus, the political (lobby) reality is that at minimum the solution will have to include ability to obtain special visa whatever outside the US; whatever that is called doesn't matter.

Posted by: og at July 29, 2010 09:37 PM (vQoSF)

Posted by: ed hardy at July 29, 2010 10:07 PM (vlSI8)

269 ALL of our problems since the mid-nineteenth century French Revolution have been a product of abstract thinking.

Posted by: Brad at July 29, 2010 04:06 PM (2GsJg)

FTFY

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