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| Democrats' Dilemma: Vote for ObamaCare and Be Voted Out of Office. Vote Against ObamaCare and Be Voted Out of Office.Long story short: Obama and his political masterminds Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid have constructed, of their own volition, a massive wedge issue in which either the moderates will be offended, and so they'll lose, or their liberal base will be offended, and so they'll lose. There is a price to pay with independents if a strong health care bill is passed. Democrats lead 37-30 with them in general on the generic ballot, but they say they’ll vote 44-37 for the GOP if a bill with a public option makes it through.The lose-lose proposition, I think, helps the bill a little, because Democrats might take the position that If I'm going to be voted out of office anyway, I'm going to need the support of those liberal advocacy groups and George Soros to give me a nice job after I lose this one. Meanwhile, a long-serving Blue Dog is retiring. (I mentioned last week that Charlie Cook had forecast long-serving Blue Dogs in Red States were in more trouble than the youngish, more centrist newcomers that won purplish districts in 2006-2008.) n very much related and important news, a Blue Dog who’s held a red seat for the past 12 years has suddenly decided now might be a good time to retire. Quote: “Moore, who won his last race 56 to 40 percent over Jordan, was in trouble because of his support for many of President Barack Obama’s initiatives, including the stimulus package and health care reform.”It's a vicious cycle for them and a virtuous one for us. As we look stronger, more top-tier name candidates step forward to claim what looks like low-hanging fruit. Meanwhile many of their entrenched incumbents begin to retire -- why bother? why not go out on a win? -- and the forbidding circumstances discourage many Democratic candidates who might otherwise run. I am wondering if at some point a few of these Red State Blue Dogs don't float the idea to the RNC of a Reverse Specter: Let me run as a Republican, and keep the field clear for me, and I'll join your party and vote the way you like. Comments1
Soon young Skywalker will be one of us.
Posted by: eman at November 23, 2009 09:51 PM (Weq7t) 2
A wedge issue impacting the Democrats? Never heard of such a thing.
I know a whole bunch that are problems for the Republicans. Watch World News Tonight any night. We usually hit on 2 or 3 of them. Posted by: Charlie Gibson at November 23, 2009 09:51 PM (FCWQb) 3
The Public will vote out everybody who even sniffed at the Obamacare entree.
Posted by: eman at November 23, 2009 09:52 PM (Weq7t) 4
I think ace shot his *link* all over this thread.
Posted by: In Exile at November 23, 2009 09:52 PM (4YL/l) 5
Let me run as a Republican, and keep the field clear for me, and I'll join your party and vote the way you like.
The Richard Shelby option. Posted by: toby928 at November 23, 2009 09:55 PM (PD1tk) 6
Perhaps the American People, at long last, will wake up and realize they have to pay attention all the time, not just some of the time. Maybe they will see that politics is at least just as important as everything else in their lives.
Lazy, inattentive people get screwed. Posted by: eman at November 23, 2009 09:55 PM (Weq7t) 7
Oh, don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out, Moore. Another one of the mythical "blue dogs" that seems to vote for everything that the LightBringer supports. Kansas WON'T miss you (not even the JoCo squishes)
Posted by: In Exile at November 23, 2009 09:56 PM (4YL/l) 8
Yea, joining the Republicans would be the smart option. But, if every Democrat facing that issue did that the Republicans would soon be welcoming, into their ranks.........Harry Reid.
Posted by: Mallamutt at November 23, 2009 09:56 PM (V9SYy) Posted by: Blazer at November 23, 2009 09:59 PM (+FzLa) 10
I was not politically awake yet back in 1994. Did the Dems see the Reaper coming so far ahead back then? I would guess not, but school me, oh elder morons.
Posted by: sherlock at November 23, 2009 10:00 PM (ktKOD) 11
Wasn't it less than a year ago when pundits were saying no Republican would ever be elected again anywhere in the country?
Two things.... 1-Pundits are idiots 2-A year is an eternity in poltics, don't get cocky. Posted by: DrewM. at November 23, 2009 10:01 PM (FCWQb) 12
Every goddamn incumbent will be re-elected by large margins in Rhode Island and Massachusetts. Let us be a warning to the other, still-functioning states. Posted by: Truman North at November 23, 2009 10:02 PM (XH/G8) 13
This is why they're going to pass a healthcare monstrosity sans public option - and they'll pass it with 60-62 votes in the Senate. The media will claim that the monstrosity they pass is a triumph of moderation.
Posted by: stickety at November 23, 2009 10:04 PM (Jg5C9) 14
Ace, oh master, how pray tell, did you slip this thread in under the ONT which just appeared and then, bam, this thread, which was posted later, shows up earlier. You one crafty SOB. Posted by: Kemp at November 23, 2009 10:04 PM (2+9Yx) 15
Specter? (ptiou!)
Posted by: Xoxotl at November 23, 2009 10:08 PM (j88uA) 16
HA HA HA! The Democrats are doodies.
Posted by: arhooley at November 23, 2009 10:09 PM (GKXA7) 17
Obama and his political masterminds Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid have constructed, of their own volition, a massive wedge issue in which either the moderates will be offended, and so they'll lose, or their liberal base will be offended, and so they'll lose.
I hate to break it to you, but The Precedent and his administration knew this and didn't care. He is a political suicide bomber and he has no problem taking all of his allies with him - they're just useful idiots, anyway. They've always been expendable. The Precedent only cares about exacting revenge on America and the West. He just wants to make us hurt as he burns his way through our government. He just wants to foment chaos. Theat's why he let Congress write up whatever they wanted. He knew they'd be nuts (and he even encouraged them to go for it, I'm sure) and he knew that the left would get themselves into this sort of a position if allowed. He nurtured their ability to totally go insane when he actually managed to bully the country into accepting the passage of a Porkulus monstrosity without allowing anyone to read it ... right out in the open! And then, when he took off for a vacation, not to even bother signing that bill until Tuesday ... in Denver, yet! Man, you knew it was all over. The Precedent is all about chaos and pain for us. That's all he cares about. That's why he's been intentionally dithering on Afghanistan. He laughs about this stuff. Now, the useful idiots have been put on death ground ... though everyone saw this coming with the Town Halls. With a normal executive, this legislation would have been killed, already - as had happened with Shamnesty. 9/12 has just been totally ignored. I mean, they have really just pretended that nothing happened. If they pass this stuff ... Posted by: progressoverpeace at November 23, 2009 10:10 PM (A46hP) 18
I was not politically awake yet back in 1994. Did the Dems see the Reaper coming so far ahead back then? I would guess not, but school me, oh elder morons.
Posted by: sherlock Yes, The MSM was forced to showcase it because it was their only way to try and stop the "temper tantrum". I remember Billy BJ whining about the upcoming disaster for the Dems, and the Dems rephrasing Contract with America into Contract on America. Good times, briefly. Posted by: eman at November 23, 2009 10:17 PM (Weq7t) 19
Isn't the unspent TARP money a wild card, though? It's all going to be spent buying Democrat votes.
Posted by: Bugler at November 23, 2009 10:21 PM (YCVBL) 20
I'll join your party and vote the way you like, maybe sometimes, cross my fingers - oh and by the way do I get to keep my seniority. Only if you jump between now and Obamacare reconciliation.
Posted by: Jean at November 23, 2009 10:26 PM (xCBQ4) 21
Hearing it put this way, I'm wondering how much resentment these Congresscritters are going to have toward their "leadership" having put them in a position in which no matter what they do, they lose. Hey boss! Thanks!
Posted by: mr.frakypants at November 23, 2009 10:26 PM (pffBj) 22
I was not politically awake yet back in 1994. Did the Dems see the Reaper coming so far ahead back then? I would guess not, but school me, oh elder morons. The Dems. knew it was coming, but they never envisioned 1) how broad it was going to be or 2) just how many so called "safe" Democrats were going to get their ass handed to them. The Democrats had not lost control of the House for 40 years before 1994 - they figured they were going to walk away still retaining a majority, though a very slim one. They never saw losing the House until about a week before the election when all of a sudden it hit them that they had really underestimated how bad it was going to be. They also never thought they would lose the Speaker of the House (Tom Foley) or a Chicago Democrat (Rostenkowski) but both went down and down hard ( by 10 points). The highlight of that night, at least for me, was watching the old Crossfire Shown on CNN before the polls were closing. Phil Graham, who was the Republican Senate Campaign Chair at the time, went on the air with all the exit numbers, looked at the CNN Liberal and said "I can't tell you what the numbers say, I can't tell you who is going to lose, but I can tell you this...you ain't gonna be real happy when tonight is over!". Posted by: Mallamutt at November 23, 2009 10:27 PM (V9SYy) 23
Isn't the unspent TARP money a wild card, though? It's all going to be spent buying Democrat votes. Nope. That is what the Republicans thought in 2006 - earmarks were gonna save them, they were gonna just buy the voters with a whole bunch of projects, etc. Voters just decided that they were spending like drunk sailors. Debt is the underlying time bomb issue in 2010. And the Democrats can't effectively blame even Bush. Sorry - due to the stimulus, you guys now own that one as well. Posted by: Mallamutt at November 23, 2009 10:29 PM (V9SYy) 24
I remember Billy BJ whining about the upcoming disaster for the Dems, and the Dems rephrasing Contract with America into Contract on America.
Posted by: eman at November 23, 2009 10:17 PM (Weq7t) That was one of the only clever things they've ever done. Posted by: progressoverpeace at November 23, 2009 10:30 PM (A46hP) 25
they're going to pass a healthcare monstrosity sans public option - and they'll pass it with 60-62 votes in the Senate
-------------------- Mebbe not, stickety. I watch MSNBC for sport, and those Bernie Sanders types are dead determined on voting No on anything without the public option. Posted by: arhooley at November 23, 2009 10:31 PM (GKXA7) 26
Mebbe not, stickety. I watch MSNBC for sport, and those Bernie Sanders
types are dead determined on voting No on anything without the public
option.
It's going to have a government option. Posted by: chemjeff at November 23, 2009 10:45 PM (F+U5/) 27
I still think the bill will pass, but the damage to the Democrats will be pretty dramatic. The emphasis on the bribe to Landreau of LA surely serves as Exhibit A of the corruption Team Obama was supposed to be against.
There's just no way to hide the uncomfortable truth of a government gone awry when a) the public, and an increasingly antagonistic one at that, is already primed to the runaway spending, b) said public sees money we don't have doled out by the truckload by people who have no credibility or competence, and c) Charlie Gibson et al.'s audience remains in the toilet while Palin, Limbaugh, and Beck suck up the oxygen. Bad is inevitable but the cost will have reverberations. Chrissy's leg tingle will become a searing rash. Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at November 23, 2009 10:45 PM (3nPNg) 28
The Precedent is all about chaos and pain for us.
In his first book, I Hate You, Mommy, one of the reasons he gives for hating her is her politico-sexual fetishizing/exoticising of black guys. (Way down in the shitty abyss that is Barry, that's why he became a black guy; it was a decision.) With his election, a win delivered to him by swooning idiot SWFs, America showed the same fault. If so. Posted by: oblig.mund Freud at November 23, 2009 10:46 PM (aK/MY) 29
I'm conflicted.
Posted by: Sen. George Voinovich D-OH at November 23, 2009 10:54 PM (wUD8j) 30
The bill will have a public option with some sort of weasel worded option, that really isn't an option at all.
Posted by: Jean at November 23, 2009 11:05 PM (xCBQ4) 31
Posted by: oblig.mund Freud at November 23, 2009 10:46 PM (aK/MY)
Well put. And you add in a five-year cameo, during his formative years, in "The Year of Living Dangerously", and it looks pretty ugly. Posted by: progressoverpeace at November 23, 2009 11:16 PM (A46hP) 32
There is a third option for the Dems, but they won't take it.
Good cop. That is, load it up with the socialist wet dream version of Obamacare, make the Republicans and Lieberman filibuster it and blame it on bad cop Republicans. The Left will buy it. But Obama's ego couldn't handle the failure. Posted by: AmishDude at November 23, 2009 11:23 PM (T0NGe) 33
Mallamutt, don't forget that both Foley and Rosty were involved in financial scandals - Foley over phony sales of his book, and Rosty over pocketing postage-stamp money from the House post office. I can't see Pelosi getting mixed up in that penny-ante stuff: she thinks far, far bigger than that. Posted by: Brown Line at November 23, 2009 11:24 PM (kUeTU) 34
We haven't had a president with this many daddy issues since...Bill Clinton.
Posted by: AmishDude at November 23, 2009 11:24 PM (T0NGe) Posted by: Rep. Reparations at November 23, 2009 11:26 PM (gSxol) 36
Wasn't it less than a year ago when pundits were saying no Republican would ever be elected again anywhere in the country?
I knew the dems would over reach. I wasn't really expecting them to go full Hale Bopp Heaven's Gate suicide cult though. Posted by: Purple Avenger at November 24, 2009 12:04 AM (L5cJG) 37
There is something wrong here - seriously wrong. This many Democrats cannot actually be letting themselves be put against a wall for Obama. There has to be something more. Limbaugh calls them suicide bombers but I believe it's the hundreds of billions in unspent TARP money that will be used come July and September to pay off districts and move voters for Democrats.
Posted by: Def Leppard at November 24, 2009 12:07 AM (hIOnV) 38
After all, wasn't the 300 million payoff to Landrieu from TARP funds?
Posted by: Def Leppard at November 24, 2009 12:07 AM (hIOnV) 39
Poster #12 is right - the hard blue states will vote their guys back in - Mass, RI, CT, ME, the northwest corner and San Fran liberals. Don't get cocky here. Obama and Rahm will manufacture crisis after crisis to keep the public so busy they'll never see what hit them.
We can hardly keep up with it here - just this weekend was Healthcare, more ACORN news and the hacked emails! I haven't even heard what Obama has been up to in a few days. Posted by: Def Leppard at November 24, 2009 12:11 AM (hIOnV) 40
Any Democrat who will switch parties and take the pledge (with a signed resignation in the drawer if they violate it) for at least 8/10 - I'll take 'em for now and reorganize the congress. What the hell! Maybe we could stop Obambi now!
Posted by: CatoRenasci at November 24, 2009 12:12 AM (EBXTK) 41
I believe it's the hundreds of billions in unspent TARP money that will
be used come July and September to pay off districts and move voters
for Democrats.
Polling shows the vast majority of public (like in the 70% range) want any unspent funds to remain unspent. TARP and the Spendulus are radioactive with the public right now. Posted by: Purple Avenger at November 24, 2009 12:12 AM (L5cJG) 42
Don't be fooled again; vote Conservative.
Posted by: Conservative or Bust at November 24, 2009 12:32 AM (gSxol) 43
President Obama, how does adding healthcare for 30 million people save money?
President Obama, will you buy us dinner and a movie? BECAUSE WE LIKE DINNER AND A MOVIE WHEN YOU ARE DOING SEX TO US!! Posted by: Def Leppard at November 24, 2009 12:35 AM (hIOnV) 44
I guess the question is this: will they have a signed contract in hand for a mid-six-figure job with some Soros-funded NGO come 2011 when they take the dive for Obama, Pelosi, and Reid?
Some of these folks are clearly going to be bought. They're going to know that by voting however Rahm and Nancy tell them to they're going to have a nice sinecure set up when the voters beat a tattoo on their ass next year. There might be a few Blue Dogs that can be redyed, though. Posted by: mrkwong at November 24, 2009 12:35 AM (G8Eo0) 45
There's a whole lot of T-shirts and bumper stickers in that SNL skit...
Posted by: mrkwong at November 24, 2009 12:36 AM (G8Eo0) 46
That was the best skit I've seen since they did Colonel Angus.
Posted by: Def Leppard at November 24, 2009 12:38 AM (hIOnV) 47
@41 - for the first time ever, the Dems seem intent on ignoring every poll that's out there in order to fulfill the will of their lord and master in the White House. I've never seen anything like this. And while a year is a long time away, there's a real chance people may throw out the Dems en masse. Yet the Dem Reps seem to be unaware of this realization.
Posted by: Def Leppard at November 24, 2009 12:42 AM (hIOnV) 48
"I am wondering if at some point a few of these Red State Blue Dogs don't float the idea to the RNC of a Reverse Specter: Let me run as a Republican, and keep the field clear for me, and I'll join your party and vote the way you like."
Phil Gramm did it the right way: when he decided to switch parties from Democrat to Republican, he resigned his seat and ran in the GOP primary. He believed that the voters in his district had the right to choose whether to stick with him or to stick with the Democrat party. Posted by: stuiec at November 24, 2009 12:52 AM (Ate22) 49
Obama's pathetic loser resume and track record was obvious. Obama is a fuck up. AT BEST. Obama's CHOICES are less than FUCK UP'S. SEBELIUS, DASCHLE, GEITHNER, HOLDER, etc etc etc. Obama has never had any semblence of judgement. EVER. Obama's CHOICES have always been FUCKED UP FREAKS. THAT IS THE MOTHER FUCKING TRUTH. So Sorry for any OFFENSE, BUT, Obama is a god damned CLOWN. ANY HALF WIT COULD HAVE SEEN THAT. If you are a LIBTARD RETARD, you MAY stilll believe. BUT, Obama is a complete and utter CLOWN.
Posted by: gus at November 24, 2009 12:53 AM (MaqIC) 50
But clowns aren't dangerous...
Posted by: ParisParamus at November 24, 2009 01:14 AM (I2aaX) 51
Wow, talk about a win win situation
Posted by: lou at November 24, 2009 01:50 AM (UbWbu) Posted by: Berserker at November 24, 2009 01:51 AM (gWHrG) 53
what the hell is wrong with olbermann? Damn, he has some serious issues, yet he keeps gaining an audience!! Maybe its the football thing!! We should kick him to the curb like the nfl did Rush!!! But no, think about the fantasy football!! Tee Hee
Posted by: lou at November 24, 2009 01:54 AM (UbWbu) 54
Why not let the kids play Football?
Posted by: lou at November 24, 2009 01:58 AM (UbWbu) 55
We all know how the dems operate....self interest first and last. So I ask, why are they so sure they will not pay a price for their vote? Is it that they have been assured that if they lose their election, they will be rewarded with lucrative jobs? Or that there will be NO possibility that they will lose their jobs?
Posted by: J at November 24, 2009 08:25 AM (T3/qP) 56
I would have thought the dual whammies of crap and tax AND Obamacare would have put paid to the myth of "moderate blue dog Democraps". There is no such thing as a "moderate" Democrap.
This is an invention of the liberal press. They called the bitch from Arkansas a "moderate" when she has a lifetime ACU rating of 18. They call Lieberman a moderate with a rating of 17. I would think that moderate would mean that you vote at least something close to 50-50. Look, anyone who could vote for crap and tax and nationalizing health care is a communist there is no other way around it. Posted by: Vic at November 24, 2009 08:46 AM (CDUiN) 57
NO WAY we want 'blue dogs' in the party....A blue dog is a cur dog.
The RINO problem has been grinding us ever since 'no new taxes' was uttered. Get these political posers out of the party....all of them. They're turds in the punch bowl. Posted by: torabora at November 24, 2009 09:05 AM (UNDmA) 58
Let me remind all you good people how Hitlery supporters just simply HOWLED when The Obamunist took the nomination away from her through some less-than-honest maneuvering in the primaries.
Remember that? Michigan? Florida? Caucuses (Cauci?) in Iowa, etc?
Now, sit back and think about it -- How many dims SWORE they would NOT vote for The Obamunst? Think about it.
And then think about what happened. Every one of them DID vote for The Obamunist. Nary a peep. They jumped on the Hopey-Change bandwagon faster than College kids with zero interest in sports celebrating a national champioship. Herd mentality.
Point being, dims understand their constituency far better than we do. They understand that libtards don't vote FOR anything, they vote AGAINST things.
Like Freedom, Capitalism, Americanism, etc. That's what they're about. The dim politicians can vote however they want. It won't make a damned bit of difference to the average dim. Even though they might be a little pissed at their dim rep, they'll NEVER, not in a million years, vote for a Republican. Never.
They might stay home but even then, they'll find it hard to forego the free bus ride and free lunch on the way to the polls. And, of course, the jailbirds will take any chance to get out of their cells, even if it's just for a short ride to the polling booth.
The ONLY way to get rid of dims is for Conservatives to actually get off their complacent asses and (gasp!) vote.
Instead of sitting home and pouting like premenstrual little girls when they don't get a 'perfect' candidate, they need to -- Vote. Even when the best we can come up with is a John McCain or a Scuzzafuzza, sometimes you gotta understand -- You're not necessarily voting FOR him or her, as the case may be, you're voting to keep a low-life, scum-sucking dim out of office.
A bad Republican is still better than any dim. Posted by: Uncle Rick at November 24, 2009 09:21 AM (El8pC) 59
Even when the best we can come up with is a John McCain or a Scuzzafuzza, sometimes you gotta understand
Bullshit; if you keep voting for asshat RINOs and DIABLOs that is ALL the current leadership will feed you. Make them fix the primary rules and make them follow their own rules in the primaries. Posted by: Vic at November 24, 2009 09:32 AM (CDUiN) 60
Bullshit; if you keep voting for asshat RINOs and DIABLOs that is ALL the current leadership will feed you.
UR: How's that strategy working out for you? Posted by: Uncle Rick at November 24, 2009 09:35 AM (El8pC) 61
UR: How's that strategy working out for you?
Tell me, what would be the difference with McCain? In any case, I did go down and vote for Palin after which the assholes in McCain's camp savaged her. I swore I would never do that again. I am done with voting for the lesser of the evils. From now on it will be either somebody I support or third party. If the Repubs don't fix the rules and get back on message they are dead to me. Posted by: Vic at November 24, 2009 09:44 AM (CDUiN) 62
Tell me, what would be the difference with McCain? In any case, I did go down and vote for Palin after which the assholes in McCain's camp savaged her. UR: Obviously, you are an individual with principles. For which, I respect you.
But you MUST understand something. This isn't about principles. This is about the very existence, the continuance, of our way of life. It is war without the bullets.
The dims are doing what no other power on Earth has ever been able to do -- They are destroying our country. They are doing it at the ballot box, not on the battlefield.
Sometimes, in war, it is necessary to set aside one's principles and do things you wouldn't normally do. Ace has a quote at the top of his page by Mencken.
Think about it. Posted by: Uncle Rick at November 24, 2009 09:54 AM (El8pC) 63
We all know how the dems operate....self interest first and last. So I ask, why are they so sure they will not pay a price for their vote? Is it that they have been assured that if they lose their election, they will be rewarded with lucrative jobs? Or that there will be NO possibility that they will lose their jobs? I think it is something even worse than the "suicide bomber" meme that everyone on the right is currently talking about. The Democrat Party has been taken over in the last 40 years, especially in the last 15 or so, by certifiably insane people. These are people who believe as true a set of "principles" that are objectively false. Everything they try has been proven to fail time and again, to be utterly counterintuitive, to fly in the face of human nature and science, yet they continue to believe, and act on their beliefs. They worship death, at least of the weak and unborn, and their policies cause nothing but misery everywhere they are applied. Rather than suicide bombers, who are religious fanatics who kill people they don't know because they believe they'll receive some otherworldly reward, I think the Dems are much more like the insane guy who hides his insanity fairly well for years (there are always warning signs: "He was quiet and withdrawn." "He seemed to have a lot of fun only when kicking the dog."), but then one day he comes home from work and butchers his entire family before taking his own life. There is no "non-insane" rationale for pushing Cap and Trade at the same time ObamaCare is shoved down our throats, while at the same time devaluing our currency while at the same time borrowing immense amounts of money we don't have, while at the same time weakening ourselves on the international stage. Any sane person who looks at the situation knows this, but the Dems, led by Obama, just keep pushing. They're going to murder their own family (our country), then suffer death by their own hands in the next election. The only answer to what is going on is that they are utterly, irreversibly, completely insane.
Posted by: Sharkman at November 24, 2009 11:14 AM (Zj8fM) 64
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Posted by: sdsd at November 24, 2009 12:19 PM (7cvUu) 65
Seppuku!!!
Posted by: Barry Gaigin Obama at November 24, 2009 12:22 PM (wAQA5) 66
Vic: Ben Nelson is at 48. Which is a little below Snowe. Anyway, the change the party theme. In the House, I only see about five tops changing to Republicans. I would agree that the Blue Dog myth is a creation of the MSM. Most are either liberal or center-left. Only a few are moderate or center-right. Most of the change in party will be in the south (NC, TN, and AR, maybe Edwards in Texas). I would bet on more retirements than in party changes.
Posted by: MarkN at November 24, 2009 02:01 PM (ZMeaC) Posted by: obama is a traitor at November 24, 2009 02:04 PM (Qt4Y7) Posted by: John Wayne Gacy at November 24, 2009 07:35 PM (vupGF) 69
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Posted by: frbkil at November 25, 2009 05:34 AM (AaiSV) 72
The best option for both parties parties is to let Leiberman filibuster it. The dems can claim to have voted for it, the republicans against it.
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