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| How Obama Got His Groove Back: President Declares Honduras Action "Illegal" Coup, Declares Chavez Thug Zelaya Still the Rightful PresidentOdd that Obama's rich, nuanced concerns over perceived "meddling" fly out the window when he has the chance to support a leftist thug. According to Fausta (and most others, apart from Obama and Hugo Chavez), Zelaya was the one attempting to illegally engineer a coup, attempting to re-write the Constitution through ballot initiative despite the fact that the Constitution disallows such maneuvers six months before a scheduled election. Like Chavev, he sought to erase term limits on himself and become, per the bad old Latin American tradition, El Jefe for Life. Who opposed him? Well, the military, for one, which refused to distribute his ballots, because they were illegal. The courts, which ruled the ballots were illegal and the attempt to rewrite the constitution so close to an upcoming election impermissible. His own party, which similarly felt Zelaya was breaking the law, executing a "self-coup." On the other hand, there's Barack Obama and Hugo Chavez. The military acted pursuant to a court order.Honduras's Supreme Court gave the order for the military to detain the president, according to a former Supreme Court official who is in touch with the court. Later, Honduras's Congress formally removed Mr. Zelaya from the presidency and named congressional leader Roberto Micheletti as his successor until the end of Mr. Zelaya's term in January. Mr. Micheletti and others said they were the defenders, not opponents, of democratic rule. "What was done here was a democratic act," Mr. Micheletti, who was sworn in as president Sunday afternoon, said to an ovation. "Our constitution continues to be valid, our democracy continues to live." Mr. Micheletti is a member of Mr. Zelaya's Liberal party. But he had opposed his plans for a referendum that could have led to overturning the constitution's ban on re-election, allowing Mr. Zelaya to potentially stay in power past January, when his term ends. Mr. Zelaya, a frequent critic of the U.S., has been locked in a growing confrontation with his country's Congress, courts, and military over his plans for the referendum -- planned for Sunday -- that would have asked voters whether they want to scrap the constitution, which the president says benefits the country's elites. The Supreme Court had ruled the vote was illegal because it flouted the constitution's own ban on such referendums within six months of elections. The military had refused to take its usual role of distributing ballots. But Mr. Zelaya fired the chief of the army last week and pledged to press ahead.Gee, I wonder what makes Obama suddenly pipe up with such enthusiasm and so few cares about being perceived as "meddling" in this case. Whoops: I see Drew just posted this. Well, I'll leave it up, just for the additional quotes and links. Comments1
Proof positive that Obama is just as horrible as we have every right to believe he is. God help us.
Posted by: JCD at June 29, 2009 03:45 PM (2HLvt) 2
The only country that hussein flexes his muscle (ha) at is Israel.
How did all of this happen. Can we have a coup...would that be o.k. Posted by: free at June 29, 2009 03:46 PM (cFwGO) Posted by: Eleven at June 29, 2009 03:46 PM (7DB+a) Posted by: dreyfus at June 29, 2009 03:46 PM (zplc6) Posted by: The Q at June 29, 2009 03:46 PM (pfStM) 6
Yes Ace double posted this entry. But he got the HTML right on the first try. So there's that.
Posted by: lorien1973 at June 29, 2009 03:47 PM (IhQuA) Posted by: Eleven at June 29, 2009 03:48 PM (7DB+a) 8
This is why conservatives have to stop screaming about "Democracy", which our Founders abhorred, and instead stick to the idea of a Republic, which is what the US is. The will of the people needs to be limited by a constitutional framework in the same way as all other powers of government. The Founders were very adamant about this and it is a real shame that so many today don't seem to understand it. It shouldn't be that difficult to get this across, as the very names of our political parties spell it all out: Democrats want a Democracy. Republicans want a Republic.
If this event in Honduras doesn't bring this all out into the open, I don't know what will. Posted by: progressoverpeace at June 29, 2009 03:49 PM (A46hP) 9
Seriously, though, good roundup, except for Obama coming to the leftist aide and ignoring Iran. My theory: Obama's like Zack Morris, calling timeout on the rest of the world, while he gets the US "up to speed". Posted by: The Q at June 29, 2009 03:49 PM (pfStM) 10
Might be a good idea to keep a close eye on Panama for a while. Hugito's making noises about "comin' up there wit' a few o' my boys"...
Posted by: mojo at June 29, 2009 03:49 PM (g1cNf) 11
Yes, he and Chavez same-same.
Posted by: Vic at June 29, 2009 03:49 PM (5ynkO) 12
Gee, I wonder what makes Obama suddenly pipe up with such enthusiasm and so few cares about being perceived as "meddling" in this case. "When Treason succeeds, none dare call it Treason." (Or in modern Obamunist speak, "We won, so shut up.") Posted by: Curmudgeon at June 29, 2009 03:49 PM (ujg0T) 13
Honduras? Pfff...Nothing "hot dog diplomacy" can't handle.
Posted by: Barack Obama at June 29, 2009 03:50 PM (fDWFP) 14
Apparently now he's a scholar of the Honduran Constitution as well as the American one.
Barack Obama is objectively pro-dictator, anti-democracy. Posted by: Wolfwood at June 29, 2009 03:50 PM (6cwXH) 15
Should I post the same comment as I did in the previous thread?
Posted by: ricky at June 29, 2009 03:51 PM (UkL5l) 16
1. Bush'sFault!
2. Militaries are bad...BAD! 3. Obama was the editor at the Harvard Law Review, so his judgment is infallible. 4. Rathist'th! 'Thuglicanth ! Wingerth! Posted by: Automated Troll Meme Generator at June 29, 2009 03:52 PM (kIjlp) 17
Let's just say it -- Barack Obama is in favor of anti-American tyrants wherever whenever and however they are. I'd love to be proven wrong about this, but I'm not seeing it.
Posted by: Bud Norton at June 29, 2009 03:54 PM (6cOMd) 18
Potentially loose-shit here:
Mr. Zelaya, a frequent critic of the U.S., has been locked in a growing confrontation with his country's Congress, courts, and military over his plans for the referendum -- planned for Sunday -- that would have asked voters whether they want to scrap the constitution, which the president says benefits the country's elites. There's a distinction between the "military not delivering ballots regarding a referendum which would scrap the constitution" and the "military not delivering ballots on which Zelaya's name appears as a candidate" If it's the former scenario, Zelaya calling for a referendum to scrap the constitution, that changes the issue, I think. Hell, can I start drinking now? Posted by: BumperStickerist at June 29, 2009 03:55 PM (ruzrP) 19
Hey, Honduras, fuck you, too! He won!
Posted by: Generalissimo Obama at June 29, 2009 03:56 PM (FcR7P) 20
So Obama supports leftist thugocracies around the world. Didn't we already know that?
Posted by: JohnJ at June 29, 2009 03:58 PM (giXIt) 21
So far it doesn't seem like the Honduran people mind too much. The only mention of protestors put them at a couple hundred. Seems like most of them are fine with what happened, or they just don't give a rat's ass.
Posted by: yinzer at June 29, 2009 03:58 PM (/Mla1) 22
Funny how you Republicans are all of a sudden concerned with elections and constitutions. And since when do you Republicans care about the brown people in Central America? Posted by: Moonbat cocksucker at June 29, 2009 04:02 PM (Y2hJI) 23
Our President is an embarrasment
Posted by: majham at June 29, 2009 04:02 PM (DqvUP) 24
Hondurans are brown??
Ah, shit, man...why didn't you say so?? Posted by: gator at June 29, 2009 04:03 PM (yUiO3) 25
What would Bill Ayers do?
Posted by: wHodat at June 29, 2009 04:03 PM (+sBB4) 26
VIVA LA REVOLUCION!
Posted by: wHodat at June 29, 2009 04:04 PM (+sBB4) 27
Like I said in the last thread. Is there enough booze to last us for the remaining 3 1/2 years or more? Posted by: Ginger at June 29, 2009 04:05 PM (zIFYY) 28
I see a small missile headed this way? Is this a drill?
Posted by: Waikiki tourist at June 29, 2009 04:06 PM (+sBB4) 29
I posted this earlier, but no one really commented on it. I think it is big because we now have the WH admitting Iran HAS nukes, not trying to get them. Am I just being a moron? PS-I can't figure out how to take the underline off this part, so that is why it is underlined. I am a moron. In an apparent mistake, President Obama's senior adviser David Axelrod stated during an interview yesterday there are nuclear weapons in Iran which are a threat to the entire world. "We are also mindful of the fact that the nuclear weapons in Iran and the nuclearization of that whole region is a threat to that country, all countries in the region, and the world. And we have to address that. We can't let that lie," he said. Posted by: momma at June 29, 2009 04:08 PM (penCf) 30
A friend of mine is vacationing in Hawaii. I hope I inherit some of his stuff.
Posted by: gator at June 29, 2009 04:08 PM (yUiO3) 31
#8 err a small correction. Democrats want a Socialist Republic(like France) Republicans want a Republic that will enforce the Constistution and the Bill Of Rights.
Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 04:08 PM (kmgIE) 32
Automated Troll Meme Generator
Very good. A few misspellings would help. Think mold infested basement, stacks of your moms undies in the laundry pile, and a huge spliff next to the computer for inspiration. Posted by: I Am Jack's Raging Bile Duct at June 29, 2009 04:09 PM (8XI4A) 33
When our Military sends odumbass to Palau along with his thugs he'll know that America is not his friend!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:10 PM (wKnF8) 34
BO sure is getting his share of 3am phone calls. Perhaps he should wait until he's fully awake to respond. Posted by: booter at June 29, 2009 04:11 PM (eimUK) 35
Hey, I don't want Congress and the Supreme Court getting any ideas when I dissolve the government and consolidate all power in the newly created offic of Most Glorious Highness and God-King of All the Multiverse!
Posted by: Barack Obama at June 29, 2009 04:11 PM (tcMQZ) 36
I hope somebody in the Pentagon has noticed the Honduran Army's courage to live up to their oath to Preserve,Protect and Defend their constitution.
Posted by: Txn4evr at June 29, 2009 04:11 PM (vxHF3) 37
Ok, when clients start bringing the conversation around to world affairs you know that people are waking up.
Posted by: dreyfus at June 29, 2009 04:12 PM (zplc6) 38
A country adhering to its constitution could be a dangerous precedent for Barry. He's got to show his support for fellow autocrat thugs.
Posted by: TheQuietMan at June 29, 2009 04:12 PM (1Jaio) 39
IMPEACH!!!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:12 PM (wKnF8) 40
You and the GOP are 'rooting against country and I think in this case, even rooting against the world because the world needs to get its act together to stop global warming.' Rep. Waxman WORLD HATERS!!!!111!!!1!!
Posted by: momma at June 29, 2009 04:12 PM (penCf) 41
Cloning is all the rage...
Posted by: maddogg at June 29, 2009 04:13 PM (OlN4e) 42
It's okay, ace. This way the trolls have to work twice as hard.
Besides, all the cool kids stick to ace's thread. Posted by: Methos at June 29, 2009 04:14 PM (wU8X9) 43
Waxman is a worm just look at him, if that isn't a cockholster I'll kiss your butt!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:14 PM (wKnF8) Posted by: gator at June 29, 2009 04:14 PM (yUiO3) 45
Btw hello morons, just shampooed the dawg of death (grunt jr.), he's so happy to be cool with this 36 days of 100+ degrees living on the sun. hahahaha
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:17 PM (wKnF8) 46
Hmmm. I'll just have to name a Constitution Czar to handle this sort of thing.
Posted by: Mildly Retarded Moonbat President at June 29, 2009 04:17 PM (wU8X9) Posted by: I Am Jack's Raging Bile Duct at June 29, 2009 04:17 PM (8XI4A) Posted by: momma at June 29, 2009 04:17 PM (penCf) 49
So let me get this straight, everyone in the Honduran gov't but Mad Mal is following the Honduran constitution, but we are giving support to Mad Mal? Am i getting this right? Damnit, another celeb needs to die to distract us from these pesky issues!!
Posted by: Penfold at June 29, 2009 04:19 PM (lF2Kk) 50
Just to think some mother fuckers had the gall to compare this asshole (obama) to Reagan.
Posted by: Ginger at June 29, 2009 04:19 PM (zIFYY) 51
@31 Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 04:08 PM (kmgIE)
I'm just trying to thumbnail the problem in a way that is simple and easy to understand, and that people will remember - which is why the party names need to be used as I detailed. Democrats generally want a federal government with no restraints on its actions, at all. They are actively starting to forward this view, as per The Precedent's own twisted idea that the US Constitution is nothing but a charter detailing what the government cannot do to individuals, but leaving open anything else that it actively wants to do for them. There is no end to this scenario, except to arrive at a Democracy where the will of the people is unrestrained and supreme. No Republic could exist as such. You are correct that Democrats much prefer the tribal, party-oriented, European parliamentary systems (with almost no separations of powers and virtual governments) as they showed with their insane "no-confidence" votes in Congress against Bush. There is absolutely no meaning to a no-confidence vote within our Constitutional framework, as we have a permanent Executive that is not formed through control of the legislature, and the Democrats showed their total misunderstanding of the nature of our system, and their love of the Euro-systems. But for them, the tribal parliamentary systems are just a step towards full-blown Democracy, where the massive numbers of poor and illiterate control all of government and move wealth and resources at their whim. Posted by: progressoverpeace at June 29, 2009 04:20 PM (A46hP) 52
Liberals ARE schtoopid I don't meet many down here in Texas but when I do boy howdy do I fuck with them they are so easy!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:20 PM (wKnF8) Posted by: momma at June 29, 2009 04:21 PM (penCf) 54
Fuck this, above my pay grade. Screw you guys, I am going out for ice cream.
Posted by: Barry O at June 29, 2009 04:22 PM (gue3j) 55
To all of us who've been paying attention, the latent anti-democracy streak most vocal through the greens ('The failure of democracy, et al) is perfectly consistent with Barky's stance. I'd bet a beer or two that O believes the installation of a for-life dictator like this Honduran chap, Chavez, Castro & Ortega leads to the 'right' kind of progress. Stating the obvious, yada yada.
Posted by: Dash Rendar Groober PhD MD FACCP Master of the Breast at June 29, 2009 04:23 PM (aVQo/) 56
Are there any "wise Latinas" on the Honduran Supreme Court? I understand they make the best decisions.
Posted by: TheQuietMan at June 29, 2009 04:24 PM (1Jaio) 57
I don't like to criticize Ace, but I thought his analysis of why Obama would no support the Iranian opposition could have been made much simpler: he supports anything anti-american. I think this goes to show that.
Posted by: Brad at June 29, 2009 04:24 PM (LZs5x) 58
#27 - Posted by: Ginger at June 29, 2009 04:05 PM (zIFYY) And I gave you a reply in the last thread. On two of your posts. But I'll be nice to the thread and not re-post 'em here. That and 'cause I'm basically lazy. Posted by: teej at June 29, 2009 04:25 PM (c459z) 59
I love watching odumbass squirm, he can't handle it because he's incompetent, maybe he'll off himself, that would be a 1st in American History and I wouldn't bat an eye!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:25 PM (wKnF8) 60
All of those Honduran Supreme Court justices were appointed by Bush!
Posted by: Barack Obama at June 29, 2009 04:25 PM (tcMQZ) 61
Its old.
Posted by: toby928: vile and disgusting slinger of personal belittlements at June 29, 2009 04:25 PM (PD1tk) Posted by: evil libertarian at June 29, 2009 04:26 PM (aR1ng) 63
OK, I see Bud make that point earlier.
Posted by: Brad at June 29, 2009 04:27 PM (LZs5x) Posted by: President Barak Obama at June 29, 2009 04:27 PM (ao5cQ) Posted by: Ginger at June 29, 2009 04:27 PM (zIFYY) 66
In the global view, America's a red state. That's all. We've been blue for so long. Canada and Germany, red for years, are now blue. (Red = Left, Blue = Right, by the way. The last thing I want to do is impose America's political color codes on the rest of the world.) Posted by: FireHorse at June 29, 2009 04:28 PM (jMk+v) 67
Will odumbass attend the pedophiles funeral because he's black, got to keep up with those repatriations under another name!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:29 PM (wKnF8) 68
How does President Obama get away with stating that the removal of Zelaya was 'not legal' and no one in the media (WSJ excluded) or political establishment calls him on it? That the removal was 'legal' is objectively and provably true. WTF? Posted by: Robert_Paulson at June 29, 2009 04:30 PM (zjgCD) 69
I wish we could get a military coup going. Sadly, he's got 3 years to destroy our military before he makes his next move . . .
Posted by: CB at June 29, 2009 04:30 PM (9Wv2j) Posted by: somejoe at June 29, 2009 04:30 PM (yP5sH) 71
Saw that. obama has sure made me think like a crazy person. - Actually, with what we know about obama, holder etc., your thinking is very clear.
Posted by: teej at June 29, 2009 04:31 PM (c459z) 72
"Progressives" like Obama ------and Sotomayor, etc. etc. etc.---don't give a damn about rule by law or constitutions. Any standards that transcend their "enlightened" vision of what is good for the little people are disposable, the sooner the better. Obama instantly, automatically defends and supports Zelaya (as opposed to the Iranian protestors) because he is exactly like him. Que vaya al diablo.
Posted by: Wise Latina Woman at June 29, 2009 04:31 PM (ads9P) 73
Coup de Etat and on and on!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:31 PM (wKnF8) Posted by: Ginger at June 29, 2009 04:31 PM (zIFYY) 75
Zelaya pulling his bizzaro-world Scooby Doo villain impersonation: "I wouldn't have gotten away with it if it wasn't for your meddling douchebag president and his bitch of a Secretary of State." Posted by: bunny boy at June 29, 2009 04:33 PM (YsSn7) 76
Looking at the Comments section at the BBC (anyone familiar with it knows that even the comments section leans heavily left-wing) it seems most people SUPPORT the army's action. We'll see if the media follow Obama's spin or call him on it. At Huffpo, they're almost unanimous in their support for Zelaya. No surprise.
Posted by: JDW at June 29, 2009 04:33 PM (uw+0A) 77
Its clear that "The One" just wants to get the universal movement started on eliminating term limits. Then, in 7 years (God help us) he can argue we need to get rid of that pesky constitutional limit on the president's term by arguing we should be more like the "progressive" governments of Hondurus, Cuba, Venezula, North Korea and Iran and just let him get re-elected over, and over, and over.
Posted by: Malamutt at June 29, 2009 04:34 PM (tdr59) 78
Sounds like somebody needs a robust debate!
Posted by: Angry White Dude at June 29, 2009 04:34 PM (3Am4b) 79
Hey odumbass is making historical changes in America never done before, we might as well have a Coup as well just to keep up with the joneses! What a Country, good times, good times!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:34 PM (wKnF8) 80
Posting the same thing at the same time as Drew
It is well known that Ace doesn't actually read this blog. Makes him the perfect candidate for Congress, where they don't actually read the bills they're asked to vote on. Posted by: I R A Darth Aggie at June 29, 2009 04:37 PM (1hM1d) 81
OK, I'm tired of girding my loins, it is starting to hurt? When can I stop?
Posted by: your pal joe at June 29, 2009 04:38 PM (zplc6) 82
The free world is on its own until 2012. Let's hope there's still some left when the Obamatons are drummed out.
Posted by: red speck at June 29, 2009 04:39 PM (/vfpn) 83
Tea bagging rednecks
Posted by: JG at June 29, 2009 04:40 PM (zplc6) 84
81 OK, I'm tired of girding my loins, it is starting to hurt? When can I stop? ___________________________________________
Have no fear. Sheriff Joe has been given the lead on Iraq by the appearance-in-chief.
Posted by: ICBM at June 29, 2009 04:41 PM (Gnu/s) 85
Bizarre-as-hell exchange from SoS Clinton's press conference today on Honduras QUESTION: Secretary Clinton, isnt the U.S. in an uncomfortable position nonetheless, because youre invoking democratic norms to restore a president who some would argue was taking illegal steps to stay in office? Posted by: Robert_Paulson at June 29, 2009 04:46 PM (zjgCD) 86
You guys better man and woman up, there's some freaky shit coming down the pike!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:47 PM (wKnF8) Posted by: Robert_Paulson at June 29, 2009 04:48 PM (zjgCD) Posted by: I Am Jack's Raging Bile Duct at June 29, 2009 04:50 PM (8XI4A) 89
Our country just looks plain silly right now.
Posted by: Robert_Paulson at June 29, 2009 04:46 PM (zjgCD) Heh. Get used to that . . . Posted by: CB at June 29, 2009 04:50 PM (9Wv2j) 90
If you aren't a Veteran you better run and hug one and feed him well because we are tired of this shit, I talk to my Brothers everyday and we are tired!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:50 PM (wKnF8) 91
OK, I'm tired of girding my loins, it is starting to hurt? When can I stop? You'll know when you're done. Trust me. Posted by: David Carradine at June 29, 2009 04:51 PM (gyNYk) 92
What? Obama has to stand up for the "rule of law".
Note that the "rule of law" is different from rules, laws, or the common definition of the phrase: rule of law. Instead, in the Obama-Lexicon, when a President violates the Constitution of his nation, and ignores the Supreme Court, Constitution, Congress, Military, and Attorney General in an attempt to grab power; than man has the "rule of law" and everyone else should be forced by the U.S. Military to accede to his wishes. Some days I wonder if this fucker can get any stupider. Posted by: Gekkobear at June 29, 2009 04:52 PM (X0NX1) Posted by: Barack Obama at June 29, 2009 04:53 PM (tcMQZ) 94
Petraious for Prez, that has a nice sound to it!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:54 PM (wKnF8) 95
If I read Hillary's statement correctly, it looks like arresting Zelaya is the rule of law. The Obama and Chavez positions are opposed to that.
If only their judges showed more empathy for Latinos... Posted by: t-bird at June 29, 2009 04:57 PM (FcR7P) 96
What Clinton means is that she doesn't have the faintest idea what she is doing. An honest answer to the media would have been: "Look, we didn't know anything about Zelaya except that he is a Chavecito leftist who hates America, so we just instantly sided with him. Now that we are starting to get some information about the situation, we realize we need to develop nuance. We of course will support our fellow leftist, but we now see than we need to work out a better spin. Fortunately, I'm sure we can count on your total ignorance and full ideological support in this effort." Posted by: Wise Latina Woman at June 29, 2009 04:57 PM (ads9P) 97
'Nam Grunt
Shhh. Too soon. He's my favorite 'dark horse' to run in 2012. Especially if we lose Waikiki to the Norks or San Fran to Al Q. Posted by: I Am Jack's Raging Bile Duct at June 29, 2009 05:01 PM (8XI4A) 98
Would we really want San Francisco back?
Posted by: BrianO at June 29, 2009 05:02 PM (7Zs42) 99
97, I Am Jack's Raging Bile Duct at June 29, 2009 05:01 PM (8XI4A)
The norks aren't going to do shit, they are just selling woof tickets, (although SF sounds nice)! Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 05:03 PM (wKnF8) 100
Wow, this seems like a pretty straightforward situation to me, apparently I'm not at the level of Barry and Hillary genius in order to understand the nuances of an elected President of a democracy trying to violate the constitution of the country and being stopped by the folks designated to stop him from doing so. Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at June 29, 2009 05:06 PM (AJ4xq) 101
If you aren't a Veteran you better run and hug one and feed him well
because we are tired of this shit, I talk to my Brothers everyday and
we are tired!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 04:50 PM (wKnF Some of the most huggable people I know are Vets! Starting with my dad and all the way to the great reservists I know. Sending one your way right now, 'Nam Grunt, and a big thanks for your service and your patriotism! Posted by: CB at June 29, 2009 05:07 PM (9Wv2j) 102
23
Our President is an embarrasment
Posted by: majham at June 29, 2009 04:02 PM (DqvUP) That is a massive understatement. Posted by: sandbagger at June 29, 2009 05:07 PM (nw/4W) 103
And O/T regarding the North Koreans, I really think at this point that they actually have to do something, otherwise their threat was empty and the US is proven right to have scoffed at it. Also, isn't it lovely that Russia is having huge war games right now too? Everyone is just feeling so hopey and changy around the world right now, aren't they? Posted by: ParanoidGirlInSeattle at June 29, 2009 05:08 PM (AJ4xq) 104
Maybe Hondouras will attack DC, they are winners God Bless them!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 05:08 PM (wKnF8) 105
Yeah, the Organization of American States readmitted Cuba earlier this month., ending its ban of Cuba that was adopted in 1962. It's great to see our feckless, statist President working in concert with this feckless, statist organization. Birds of a feather...
Posted by: runningrn at June 29, 2009 05:10 PM (p9lFf) Posted by: Unclefacts at June 29, 2009 05:10 PM (vZVv7) 107
I always like to include San Francisco in 'doomsday' type scenarios. I feel like my location on the east coast is the epicenter for all the bad shit that goes on. (Pretty much equidistant from Flight 93, NYC, and Washington). If any city should get the Al Q types upset with the decadence of western civilization, it should be San Fran.
Posted by: I Am Jack's Raging Bile Duct at June 29, 2009 05:10 PM (8XI4A) 108
I'm grilling jumbo gulf shrimp wrapped in bacon, w/a nice sirloin on the side, eat your hearts out morons!
Posted by: 'Nam Grunt at June 29, 2009 05:12 PM (wKnF8) Posted by: Kratos (on the back of Gaia, scaling Mt Olympus) at June 29, 2009 05:15 PM (otlXg) 110
I must admit, there is some internal consistency here in the President's statements, if you take a long and very dim view.
In the future, when Obama violates the Constitution and ignores the Supreme Court and fires the head of the military, then he can point back to this and say that he has been consistent all along. And after, when people go to the streets in America and some of them get shot by government operatives for protesting, then he can say that he wasn't particularly perturbed about that when it happened in Iran, so why should he be perturbed about it now? ConsistencyTM. He's all about consistency. Posted by: Darren at June 29, 2009 05:16 PM (PntkJ) 111
Obama is in over his head. Waaaaaay over his head.
Posted by: Wise Latina Woman at June 29, 2009 05:16 PM (ads9P) 112
Note that this is a huge failure of Obama's hyped diplomatic skills:
The official, who spoke on the condition that he not be named, said the U.S. Embassy in Honduras was "consistently and almost constantly engaged in the last several weeks working with partners" and that U.S. officials were "in contact with all Honduran institutions, including the military." Posted by: CM at June 29, 2009 05:17 PM (f14vX) 113
#51 Read you loud and clear. The French already did that in the 1790's . Everyone else tried to destroy them. All the monarch's almost did. Napoleon saved their heads. Those that were still attatched. He became Emperor, and the Franch still have their Napoleonic Code to this day as their basis of law.
Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 05:18 PM (kmgIE) 114
#110
Exactly right. Only he'll probably wait until he's got his "civilian defense force" fully armed and overturns the 2nd Amendment before he tries anything on this level. Posted by: CB at June 29, 2009 05:19 PM (9Wv2j) 115
114 My thoughts exactly. This should open everyone's eyes. Sadly, with our media. It won't It will be too late. Posted by: Ginger at June 29, 2009 05:21 PM (zIFYY) Posted by: Ginger at June 29, 2009 05:22 PM (zIFYY) 117
Obama is in over his head. Waaaaaay over his head.
Posted by: Wise Latina Woman at June 29, 2009 05:16 PM (ads9P) He knows exactly what he is doing. Posted by: sandbagger at June 29, 2009 05:25 PM (nw/4W) 118
#114 We already have one. it's called homeland defense. The president does not have to call in the military. ATFE, FBI, etc, etc.I think they will do his bidding.
Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 05:25 PM (kmgIE) 119
Zelaya's legal term was not over until after the end of the year. Wouldn't the proper thing be to refuse to seat him in the event of an illegal re-election? I would love to be able to say B.O. is out to lunch but all I see right now is a lack of basic reading comprehension.
Posted by: slickdpdx at June 29, 2009 05:25 PM (RIdwM) 120
Gekkobear: "Some days I wonder if this fucker can get any stupider more narcissistically pathological."
Fixed. And no, he remains pegged to the max. The real question is how many will continue to follow this tragedy and not whether the band leader will change tunes. Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at June 29, 2009 05:26 PM (rZ235) 121
119
Zelaya's legal term was not over until after the end of the year.
Wouldn't the proper thing be to refuse to seat him in the event of an
illegal re-election? I would love to be able to say B.O. is out to
lunch but all I see right now is a lack of basic reading comprehension.
Posted by: slickdpdx at June 29, 2009 05:25 PM (RIdwM) Assuming the Honduran president takes an oath to uphold their constitution, I think there's probably a good case to be made for removing him once their Supreme Court rules that he has violated both the constitution and his oath of office. Tell me where that's wrong . . . Posted by: CB at June 29, 2009 05:30 PM (9Wv2j) 122
#27 Ginger, I bought a case of Kentucky Burbon 2 months ago before their big tax increase in the state of Kentucky. At the rate Obama's going, it looks like I should have bought 5.
Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 05:33 PM (kmgIE) 123
Just part of my continuing effort to empower our enemies and to weaken our friends.
Posted by: Obama being spiritually advised by Crazy Jerry Wright at June 29, 2009 05:33 PM (xxgag) 124
Where's Mike Steele?
Posted by: Iblis at June 29, 2009 05:34 PM (9221z) 125
@118
The FBI is real good at facing down unarmed five year olds for deportation and burning down buildings full of women and children in order to save them, but only because they can mass personnel to fixed locations, They just don't have the numbers to impose martial law nationwide. And homeland security? What are they going to do, surround us with fermaldehyde laden trailers? Posted by: Methos at June 29, 2009 05:35 PM (wU8X9) Posted by: Ginger at June 29, 2009 05:36 PM (zIFYY) 127
Recommend everyone read the current Rubin Report, http://rubinreports.blogspot.com/
It is more proof that we have a very serious problem with Obama, reference magical thinking and genuine psychotic episodes. I'm afraid. Posted by: Bob from Virginia at June 29, 2009 05:38 PM (uEMA+) 128
He (Mr. Z) proposed legislation (a referendum) that the S.Ct. there says, very credibly, is no good. I get that. But, if an elected official can be removed simply for proposing legislation the S.Ct. finds unconsitituional, we are looking at a lot of military action in our own country. The valid twist in this story is B.O.s reluctance to "interfere" in Iran but lack of reluctance to interfere in Honduras (if anything, the historical parallels are for doing the non-interference deal in both countries by B.O.s alleged policy of prior American-meddling means hands off now.)
Posted by: slickdpdx at June 29, 2009 05:38 PM (RIdwM) 129
128- Yes, if Zelaya had simply stopped after the court declared his referendum unconstitutional, okay. But in defiance of all law he ordered the army to run the referendum anyway, sending them out with ballots to set it up. The court then ordered them to desist and declared Zelaya in contempt.....just as they said they would do if he proceeded in defiance of all law.....and even in defiance of his own party.
Posted by: Wise Latina Woman at June 29, 2009 05:44 PM (ads9P) 130
Reading a bit about this situation, it seems that the Honduran Constitution not only bars a President from serving more than one term, but it even bans a President from supporting measures that advocate he serve more than one term. Clearly, his "survey" was against the law, and their Supreme Court agreed. He decided to proceed anyways, firing the armed forces chief for not playing along. Some Hondurans are saying that public servants were forced to gain "yes" votes under threat of losing their jobs and/or benefits. This wasn't a coup. Their President flagrantly violated their Consitution, and their court acted to remove him for it. Yet the Obamatuer sides with a lawless President who had plans to turn Honduras into another "el Presidente for life" leftist dictatorship. Gee, I wonder why... Posted by: Hollowpoint at June 29, 2009 05:45 PM (rf03a) 131
#126 Ginger You are a girl that I could sit down with and down a good bottle of burbon. The two you mentioned are two of the best.. The others are good stuff also. I would not refuse any other label.
Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 05:45 PM (kmgIE) 132
#128,
My understanding is that the Honduran Constitution explicitly states that if a President advocates for extending his "rule" beyond the constitutionally determined limits, he immediately ceases to have the qualifications to be president and must be exiled from the country. I'll try to find a link. I'll admit it's an unusual provision, but it's apparently there. Posted by: Robert_Paulson at June 29, 2009 05:45 PM (zjgCD) Posted by: The Oort Cloud at June 29, 2009 05:47 PM (MqJKF) 134
#125 Methos, do not underestimate Homeland Defense. They have a lot of Agency's that have a lot of firepower. Even the local Police Force has special squads that now have same pretty impressive equipment and firepower.
Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 05:50 PM (kmgIE) 135
Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 05:50 PM (kmgIE)
Haven't they been conducting all kinds of helicopter (maybe more) drills over some of the larger cities lately? Is that the military or this homeland squad? Posted by: CB at June 29, 2009 05:52 PM (9Wv2j) 136
He (Mr. Z) proposed legislation (a referendum) that the S.Ct. there
says, very credibly, is no good. I get that. But, if an elected
official can be removed simply for proposing legislation the S.Ct.
finds unconsitituional, we are looking at a lot of military action in
our own country.
Not just proposing but actually holding the referendum. Their Court ruled he couldn't do it but he was going rogue and doing it anyway as I understand it. Posted by: laddy at June 29, 2009 05:52 PM (kcuW8) 137
since when is there such a thing as a "legal coupe"? How is it that Mara doesn't see this like everyone else?
Posted by: ?????? at June 29, 2009 05:55 PM (zplc6) 138
9 My theory: Obama's like Zack Morris, calling timeout on the rest of the world, while he gets the US "up to speed".
Posted by: The Q Exactly right. St. Barry of 1600 really doesn't give a flying fuck what goes on in the world as long as it doesn't mess up his domestic agenda. That's why any wrangling or debate over Obama's foreign policy is pointless, except as a classroom intellectual exercise. He's always going to vote present on international issues unless absolutely forced to act. Even when circumstances demand he make a move, it will always be to kick the can down the road, rather than make a hard choice that may endanger his socialist re-engineering of the US. Also, it's a buddy of Chavez. Chavez would never dick over his good pal Obama, right? Posted by: KingShamus at June 29, 2009 05:56 PM (5BgCg) 139
mystry, when the time comes to organize outright resistance to the federal government, I'll be with you in my serious hat. For now, I'm just trying to enjoy my time while it's mine with some humor.
I was just thinking of people I know in the FBI and local police and that they wouldn't take part in an Iran style crackdown, and then I thought about a couple of instances where those agencies have let us down. Still, outside of ACORN, I think Obama's going to be in for a rude awakening when he tries to pull crap everyone knows you can't do and are unwilling to live with. Posted by: Methos at June 29, 2009 06:00 PM (wU8X9) 140
#135 CB The military cannot perform any type of drills over populated areas. The are restricted to strict zones of activity. Say over large areas of national forests, or special blocks of land out west, like in Navada. Many drills you see are special activity by regional units that are practing for things like mass casualitys or massive enviramental spills.
Posted by: mystry at June 29, 2009 06:02 PM (kmgIE) 141
A synopsis of the Honduras Constitution
Title VII, with two chapters, outlines the process of amending the constitution and sets forth the principle of constitutional inviolability. The constitution may be amended by the National Congress after a two-thirds vote of all its members in two consecutive regular annual sessions. However, several constitutional provisions may not be amended. These consist of the amendment process itself, as well as provisions covering the form of government, national territory, and several articles covering the presidency, including term of office and prohibition from reelection. Posted by: Robert_Paulson at June 29, 2009 06:04 PM (zjgCD) 142
Breaking on CNBC Charlie Gasparino reporting taht P PIP coming on Wednesday or Thursday but could only confirm Wilbur Ross and GE capital as two of the nine participants which he thinks also include blackrock and pimpco.
Posted by: Honest Abe at June 29, 2009 06:19 PM (zplc6) 143
Death to all dictators and their supporters.
Posted by: The Great Satan at June 29, 2009 06:20 PM (71Zq0) 144
i really don't have any idea of what I stand for...dis iran freedom fighters one week and then when safe-offer some consoling advice....
next week, i support the leftist and would be dictator attempting to break the law...and denounce his lawful removal. i am a jugeared fuck and I really don't have any idea of what the hell I am doing...they didn't teach a lot of this liberty and freedom shit in Indonesia. BHO Posted by: WeHaveMetTheEnemyTheyAreWhoWeThoughtTheyWere at June 29, 2009 06:25 PM (jlUQR) 145
Hey FROGS!!
How about you guys whip up another one of them statues? We'll tow it down to Honduras and put it in a harbor somewhere. Apparently in Honduras, when a would be dictator attempts to break the law, they take action and arrest them! Illegal coups, the great oxymoron, uttered by the great mouthpiece. Honduras is the new symbol of freedom for the world. Come to think about it, maybe BHO will just donate it to Honduras, really no use for it here anymore. Posted by: WeHaveMetTheEnemyTheyAreWhoWeThoughtTheyWere at June 29, 2009 06:32 PM (jlUQR) 146
Where's Mike Steele?
Stuffing envelopes for the RNC claiming to be against Obastard's Leftist AgendaTM and begging for donations to support good, conservative candidates like Mary Bono Mack, Mark Kirk, and the other members of the Crap 'N Tax Eight. After all, supporting Arlen Spector all those years worked out so well for the GOP. Posted by: Reiver at June 29, 2009 06:36 PM (k/zpx) 147
Zelaya's crimes: raise minimum wage; raise salaries for teachers; Nationalize utilities and telephone company; give president two 4 year terms like USA
MY GOD!!! WHAT AN EVIL MAN!!!! You repugnacans are a joke! Posted by: LiberalsWillTakeOver at June 29, 2009 06:37 PM (ICrye) 148
119
Zelaya's legal term was not over until after the end of the year.
Wouldn't the proper thing be to refuse to seat him in the event of an
illegal re-election? I would love to be able to say B.O. is out to
lunch but all I see right now is a lack of basic reading comprehension.
Posted by: slickdpdx at June 29, 2009 05:25 PM (RIdwM) He also kept firing the head of the military, even after congress had reinstated him. He was obviously out of control. Wait...this sounds familiar.... Posted by: Tami at June 29, 2009 06:39 PM (VuLos) 149
Does Obama actually speak Honduran? Posted by: andycanuck at June 29, 2009 06:44 PM (8PGHt) 150
147 Zelaya's crimes: raise minimum wage; raise salaries for teachers; Nationalize utilities and telephone company; give president two 4 year terms like USA Like typical liberal anal cysts you conveniently avoid the reason the Honduran Supreme court ordered Zelaya's arrest. Tell us dumbfuck, why was he arrested? Don't bother, that requires reading. Now do us a favor faggot, shut that gaping tartar encrusted penis receptacle you call a mouth. Posted by: The Great Satan at June 29, 2009 06:46 PM (71Zq0) 151
@ #142 Breaking on CNBC Charlie Gasparino reporting taht P PIP coming on Wednesday or Thursday but could only confirm Wilbur Ross and GE capital as two of the nine participants which he thinks also include blackrock and pimpco. Could you plz translate that into Engrish? Posted by: Tinian at June 29, 2009 06:52 PM (7+pP9) 152
Liberal Ambition, his crime was blantantly violating the terms of his country's constitution. See 141. And raising the minimum wage deprives people of jobs, so sure, low grade evil. Propping up the teachers, well if they're anything like ours, yeah evil. Nationalize anything, yup evil.
He shouldn't have been flown to Chaves, he should have faced a firing squad. Those are nice and irreversible, see. Fortunately, the USA is not Honduras. Posted by: Methos at June 29, 2009 06:53 PM (wU8X9) 153
147: And what of his attempt to circumvent the constitution to consolidate power by unlawful means? BTW, nice hash! Fits so well!! (ICrye) Posted by: bunny boy at June 29, 2009 06:53 PM (YsSn7) 154
Could you plz translate that into Engrish?
Posted by: Tinian at June 29, 2009 06:52 PM (7+pP9) Oh thank God! I thought I was the only one that didn't know what the hell that meant. Posted by: Tami at June 29, 2009 06:53 PM (VuLos) 155
"Now do us a favor faggot, shut that gaping tartar encrusted penis receptacle you call a mouth. "
That hash is funny. Posted by: blackrockmarauder at June 29, 2009 06:54 PM (GvgvT) 156
No. 147: If that is not satire, you are a massive fool. Try reading the article if you can.
Posted by: BattleofthePyramids at June 29, 2009 06:56 PM (vD0EH) 157
I think he is talking about those Public Private Investment Partnerships that were supposed to have the federal government giving tons of money and guarantees to private firms to buy toxic assets in partnership with the feds. I thought that the feds couldn't get any private companies to participate, after having sent union thugs down to threaten the AIG folks and generally working to intimidate anyone out of actually making money, but I may be mistaken. I think this another trillion or two to be wasted ... Posted by: progressoverpeace at June 29, 2009 06:58 PM (A46hP) 158
TEGUCIGALPA, Honduras Police and soldiers clashed with thousands of
protesters outside Honduras' national palace Monday, leaving at least
15 people injured, as world leaders from Barack Obama to Hugo Chavez demanded the return of a president ousted in a military coup.
How long did it take Barry to make his timid little statement about Iran? It didn't take him any time to stand shoulder to shoulder with his comrades over this. Posted by: TheQuietMan at June 29, 2009 07:02 PM (u4tXM) Posted by: WeHaveMetTheEnemyTheyAreWhoWeThoughtTheyWere at June 29, 2009 07:15 PM (jlUQR) 160
#158.......demanded the return of a president ousted in a military coup. Hussein is just irritaded that the Honduran govt and SC would have the audacity to object to their wannabe dictator usurping power, after all Hussein is under the impression that all govts and Supreme Courts rollover for any wannabe tyrant like the slackjawed sycophants did for him here. Outsource our govt to Honduras. Posted by: The Great Satan at June 29, 2009 07:24 PM (71Zq0) 161
Zelaya's crimes: raise minimum wage; raise salaries for teachers; Nationalize utilities and telephone company...
.. I for one am glad to see that there is one country where socialism is a crime. Posted by: Druid at June 29, 2009 07:25 PM (nFeDb) 162
More wisdom from Liberalswilltakeover, aka 'walter':
Where did you guys come up with this idea that its OK for Jews to kill Palestinians for land, but its not OK for Palestinians to fight back. This double standard is at the root of this conflct. I would say we're in the presence of a serious geopolitical thinker of the caliber of Joe Biden! Posted by: Sort-of-Mad Max at June 29, 2009 07:27 PM (aC0uO) 163
"Where did you guys come up with this idea that its OK for Jews to kill Palestinians for land, but its not OK for Palestinians to fight back."
You & every lefty shill for jihad has that the wrong way around. Posted by: Yehudit at June 29, 2009 07:59 PM (ic15z) 164
Can the Honduran Supreme Court constitutionally give orders to the military? Because ours sure can't (thank God). Of course, such a referendum here would be laughable on its face. I dunno, maybe it would have been better for the referendum vote to proceed without out the participation of the military or any other legitimate branch of government. The Court would then declare the vote null and void and Congress could move to impeach. Come January, if he's still around, Zelaya's done and then if he won't go, the military can come in and remove him. Sure shows Bambi's true colors, though, doesn't it. Posted by: SukieTawdry at June 29, 2009 08:12 PM (7WUCp) 165
This is supposed to be a non-beer night for me, but after what I just read, I may get hammered. Probably shouldn't though, 'cause it would be a mad drunk.
Seriously, in one corner we have; Infidel Castrato, Hugego Blockhead, and... Black Jack Shellac Obama. In the other corner we have; the constitution, military, and republican government of Honduras acting according to the rule of law to stop a wanna-be Dick 'Tater. The president of the United States is on the side of Banana Republic dictators. What. the. unholy. living. fuk?! Posted by: Hucbald at June 29, 2009 08:45 PM (O9yAg) 166
Barry Obama never met a leftest group or nation he didn't like.
Posted by: GarandFan at June 29, 2009 08:53 PM (C3okI) 167
Presidente Zero loves dictators and despots. Now he should go back to eating his waffles.
Posted by: Thomas Jackson at June 29, 2009 09:09 PM (B8gqF) 168
Obama is testing his Marxist theories that you can be elected President of a democratic country, spin a bunch of Hope & Change bullshit while playing basketball and being cool and then wake up one morning and say "I am now the dictator of America". No more congess or Supreme court to embarass your skinny black ass. And it might work for a few hours until the military rolls in and ships your ass off to GITMO. So DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT MR. ZERO - he have your number and it is 3.5 years. That's it - after that you are outta here. You can team up with Carter and Gore and go explore each others body odor.
Posted by: izoneguy at June 29, 2009 09:37 PM (hpOMe) 169
runescape goldrunescape moneyrs goldrs moneyrunescape accountsrs accountsruneScape powerlevelinghiphop说唱 Obama is testing his Marxist theories that you can be elected President of a democratic country, spin a bunch of Hope & Change bullshit while playing basketball and being cool and then wake up one morning and say "I am now the dictator of America". No more congess or Supreme court to embarass your skinny black ass. And it might work for a few hours until the military rolls in and ships your ass off to GITMO. So DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT MR. ZERO - he have your number and it is 3.5 years. That's it - after that you are outta here. You can team up with Carter and Gore and go explore each others body odor. Posted by: runescape gold at June 29, 2009 10:29 PM (Jtn5d) 170
#132
RE: Honduran Constitution Their constitution was ratified in 1982 after they got rid of their last dictator. It has a number of anti-strongman measures built in. Amongst others, here is Article #239 of their constitution: ARTICULO 239.- El ciudadano que haya desempeado la titularidad del Poder Ejecutivo no podr ser Presidente o Designado. El que quebrante esta disposicin o proponga su reforma, as como aquellos que lo apoyen directa o indirectamente, cesarn de inmediato en el desempeo de sus respectivos cargos, y quedarn inhabilitados por diez aos para el ejercicio de toda funcin pblica. . TRANSLATION Article 239.- The citizen that has been the head of the Executive Branch cannot be President or Vice-President (again). Whoever violates this law or proposes its reform, as well as those that support such violation directly or indirectly, will immediately cease in their functions and will be unable to hold any public office for a period of 10 years. In addition they have Article 42, which removes Honduran citizenship from those who try to extend the term of office of the president. They take the anti-dictator thing downright seriously. And note # 42. They take the idea of the president being a citizen a lot more seriously than we do. But of course, Buraq Hussein Obama never met a Constitution he did not have contempt for, nor a dictator that he did not love. Subotai Bahadur Posted by: Subotai Bahadur at June 30, 2009 12:42 AM (lLBRA) 171
Yes, Virginia, America actually elected an anti-American President.
Posted by: SamIam at June 30, 2009 01:32 AM (uwn4a) 172
I want everyone to repeat after me:
"The voters of my country elected a communist empty suit as President." It's the truth. And once you realize that it's true and get used to it, your blood pressure goes down a bit. Try it. Posted by: AM at June 30, 2009 02:00 AM (d61S+) Posted by: ErikW at June 30, 2009 02:37 AM (hKtiw) Posted by: lF at June 30, 2009 06:03 AM (LthjN) Posted by: FireHorse at June 30, 2009 08:49 AM (jMk+v) 176
unbelievable.
no, he would never meddle, not at all, not ever! this man is such a liar it is really unbelievable. obama is nothing but a authoritarian thug. i think he believes in dictatorship. i do. he supports the mullahs, says nothing to support the people of iran, and he supports this moron that was trying to install himself as a dictator thug. no, obama LIKES that stuff. he wants to rule over others, and of course, it is all for thier own good. he knows what's best, fair, and just. god help us. it's almost as if the iron curtain is falling again over parts of the world, and our own president wants the US to be behind that curtain. Posted by: annak at June 30, 2009 09:46 AM (M4IOE) Posted by: Snake Plizzken at June 30, 2009 10:29 AM (H1evQ) 178
This can all be explained rather simply, Obama is a COMMUNIST. Mommie was a Commie, daddy was a Commie, good friend Bill Ayers is a Commie. Hell, he even admits in one of his books that in coollege he used to follow around his Commie professors like a lap dog. But don't believe me, instead believe the main stream media as they tell you that Obama is a great guy, just like you and me in fact. And all that talk of him being what he is, a Commie, is just hate talk to distract you from voting for a black man for President. Posted by: Hughie at June 30, 2009 11:02 AM (iGqcN) 179
#170 Subotai Bahadur: Thank you very much! That puts a different complexion on things. Mario Vargas Llosa, not a lefty, had this to say today: http://tinyurl.com/mngjwu Posted by: slickdpdx at June 30, 2009 11:10 AM (RIdwM) 180
How does it feel to be on the side of murderers again, guys? O yeah, I forgot, you have no conscience, no morals.
Sickening. Posted by: walter at June 30, 2009 11:50 AM (wr1hN) Posted by: toby928 at June 30, 2009 01:52 PM (PD1tk) 182
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