The Justice Department Blows Another One (chad)

First Ted Stevens now this. That remedial disclosure training that Attorney General Eric Holder ordered better begin soon.

A federal court jury on Friday acquitted the big chemical products company W. R. Grace and three of its former executives on all charges that they had knowingly contaminated the small Montana mining town of Libby with asbestos, then conspired to cover up the deed.
...
Prosecutors tried to convince jurors that the memorandums revealed a cover-up and a conspiracy; the defense argued that they instead showed the internal workings of a company grappling in good will over how to make the mine safer.
...
Marshalling the evidence was not the only problem for prosecutors, though. In late April, Judge Molloy denounced the star prosecution witness, Robert H. Locke, in open court, and raised doubts in front of the jurors about the practices of the prosecutors.
Mr. Locke, a former Grace executive, testified that Grace executives knew that asbestos was sickening people and that they actively worked to hide that knowledge. But after his testimony, evidence turned over by the prosecution showed that Mr. Locke had grossly understated on the witness stand how often he had met with prosecutors.
Judge Molloy told the jurors that the government had committed an “inexcusable dereliction of duty” by not providing evidence of that relationship sooner. He ordered the panel not to consider Mr. Locke’s testimony in considering the fate of one defendant, Robert J. Bettacchi, and to use “great skepticism” in evaluating Mr. Locke’s testimony about the case as a whole.
source

Now I don't agree with the peosecution of W.R. Grace based on that facts as I under them, but damn for the amount of money we spend on the Justice Department is it too much to ask for them to hire competent attorneys?

Posted by: Open Blog at 09:01 PM

Comments

1 "...but damn for the amount of money we spend on the Justice Department is it too much to ask for them to hire competent attorneys?"

Fascists are notoriously incompetent, and lazy.

Posted by: Toad at May 08, 2009 09:16 PM (f0pIy)

2 Oh, and jug eared.

Fascists are notoriously incompetent, lazy and jug eared.

Posted by: Toad at May 08, 2009 09:27 PM (f0pIy)

3 Holder is not about to hire attorneys smarter than him so that rules out all but the guy being released from the insane asylum next week.

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5 Straight out of a top law school you're going to make about 1/4 to a 1/3 as much money going to work for the government as you can get at a big (or even mid-sized) law firm in a big (or even mid-sized) town. You get what you pay for.

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As for the Grace case, I spec their products all the time for waterproofing and fireproofing on my projects. I wasn't aware of this case. Guess I'd better look into it. Thanks for posting this.

Posted by: genghis at May 08, 2009 09:42 PM (1XErj)

7 No wonder they backed off from investigating BushitlerMcCheneBurton. These clowns couldn't find their ipso with two factos.

Posted by: billypaintbrush at May 08, 2009 09:45 PM (wY1G+)

8 But on TV and in the movies, the corporations are always guilty!

You mean, it isn't true?

Posted by: PJ at May 08, 2009 09:48 PM (oUBw8)

9 So we invest more in things that don't work, and less in things that do? Got it.

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Posted by: Not A Spammer Sock Puppet at May 08, 2009 10:01 PM (1/FwS)

Gabe, there's a job opening just for you - and for any other morons here who are attorneys.

I'm not trying to be sarcastic; it's just that - there's the rub.

Posted by: Captain Ahab at May 08, 2009 10:02 PM (ewXBY)

12 ...is it too much to ask for them to hire competent attorneys?

Little over the top, wouldn't you say? The entire progressive movement appears to be not only competent, but exceptional at the whole graft and corruption thing.

Posted by: Kae Gregory at May 08, 2009 10:09 PM (E+9ug)

13 I'm not even supposed to be here today.

Posted by: Dante Hicks at May 08, 2009 10:11 PM (8D00g)

14 A job when I graduate would be nice, but I'd have to work for that ass-clown Holder.

It's too bad the admin. doesn't focus on the whole "law" part so much as "fairness" and "empathy".

Posted by: Jollyroger at May 08, 2009 10:12 PM (Lau5V)

15 Did I perchance hear someone solicit a venerable wig of lace? Pray tell can I purchase one powdered?

Posted by: George Washington at May 08, 2009 10:15 PM (Lau5V)

So here's a question I've longed to ask of one of you attorneys. We all remember Johnny Cochran's plea; "If the glove doesn't fit you got to acquit."

Now who the hell tries on and buys gloves wearing latex gloves?

Posted by: Captain Ahab at May 08, 2009 10:15 PM (ewXBY)

17 Who the hell tries on a glove with their hand fully extended?

A: Someone who doesn't want it to fit

Besides, wet (bloody?) leather shrinks....

Posted by: Jollyroger at May 08, 2009 10:17 PM (Lau5V)

18 Isn't it a shame how 99% of the lawyers give the whole profession a bad name.

Posted by: Captain Ahab at May 08, 2009 10:25 PM (ewXBY)

19 Between this chinless wonder and his boss, a brutha won't be elected as dogcatcher for the next hundred years.

Posted by: baldilocks at May 08, 2009 10:31 PM (b4sAO)

> 'the government had committed an “inexcusable dereliction of duty”

The duece you say!

Posted by: Jones at May 08, 2009 10:34 PM (KOkrW)

21 Don't believe everything you read in the papers . . . I'm just sayin'.

Posted by: TRO at May 08, 2009 10:40 PM (q4WFG)

22 Best known as scavengers of the dead and dying, sharks have well-honed sensors with which they can track the sounds of other injured and struggling beings.

Posted by: Captain Ahab at May 08, 2009 10:46 PM (ewXBY)

23 Hard to be accurate when you're persecuting a case and not really prosecuting it.
Smells like the gubmint is trying to ride people and companies it doesn't like into the dirt rather than just let them be.

This bubbling BS stew was started under Bush so we can't blame this on Bro-Bama the First, King of the Urkel Tribe and crowned prince of the Southside.

Long May His Chiselled Pecs of Lard glimmer in the PMSNBC sunshine. Blessed be the Great and Wise Justice Lord Sir Eric of (Grudge) Holder. May his moustache not smell of his boss's nutsack. All Hail! Hail Yes!

Posted by: entger sandman at May 08, 2009 10:48 PM (zxaA2)

24 Why do you think my nom de plum is Jollyroger

Posted by: Jollyroger at May 08, 2009 10:48 PM (Lau5V)

25 I think the headline for this article should just read "The Justice Department Blows."

It's really more accurate that way

Posted by: Jollyroger at May 08, 2009 10:53 PM (Lau5V)

26 Bureaucrats hire bureaucrats.

Posted by: Ken Hahn at May 08, 2009 10:54 PM (67fux)

27 A job when I graduate would be nice, but I'd have to work for that ass-clown Holder.

I'd take heart in the fact that John Mitchell went to prison. Holder stands a fair chance of doing that too.

Posted by: Purple Avenger at May 08, 2009 10:54 PM (qsxNt)

Bro Holder got royally faced today. Big 'ole Suthun boy Richard Shelby asked "The Grudge" if he knew about rendition during his Clinton years. (Woohoo!)

The Grudge said he'd look into the numbers of folks that were rendited, to which the good senator said, "I didn't ask for the numbers, I asked if you knew."

To complete the tag team, Lamar Alexander then made the veiled threat to The Grudge, saying, "Where will this stop?"

Posted by: rushbabe at May 08, 2009 10:59 PM (LKkE8)

I'd take heart in the fact that John Mitchell went to prison. Holder stands a fair chance of doing that too.

He stands a better than fair chance of having company too.

Posted by: Captain Ahab at May 08, 2009 11:17 PM (ewXBY)

30 29 But what are the odds of these demons sending one of their own to Hell?

Posted by: rushbabe at May 08, 2009 11:20 PM (LKkE8)

31 I don't know if I can delete comments but knock it off with the bro-bama, bro-holder shit. Everyone knows its just a cheap way to skate around Ace's restrictions on race baiting and I am not going to be the open blogger who tolerates it.

Posted by: chad at May 08, 2009 11:22 PM (f9ojf)

32 19- In my heart, I wish that Obama won't turn out to be like David Dinkins, former mayor of NYC who's performence, or lack thereof, assured that New Yorkers would not vote for a black mayor for a generation. In my head, I know better.

Posted by: Oschisms at May 08, 2009 11:38 PM (R7JHf)

33 I am not going to be the open blogger who tolerates it.

Posted by: chad at May 08, 2009 11:22 PM (f9ojf)

Even if I'm black too?

Posted by: baldilocks at May 08, 2009 11:53 PM (b4sAO)

34 Sorry I brought it up, but we know it's the truth. Heck, unless it were Thomas Sowell, Clarence Thomas, my step-dad or my fiance, I'd think twice before casting the vote. Our educational system damn near gives us a Leftism IV.

Posted by: baldilocks at May 08, 2009 11:59 PM (b4sAO)

35 performance (cough)

Posted by: Oschisms at May 09, 2009 12:01 AM (R7JHf)

36 Genghis;
A close friend of mine has been dealing with asbestos cases for over eight years and is exquisitely well-informed in them (although he recently got so burned out and disgusted by the flagrant abuse and money-grubbing he insisted to be transferred to another division). The complaints are, of course, 99.999% nothing more than money-makers for ambulance chasing attorneys, as anyone who watches late-night TV will know.
Anyway, the medically agreed upon link between essentially all asbestos exposure and lung cancer requires two key points: existing lung damage (asthma, smoking, etc) and that the type of asbestos be of the rarely used varieties called crocidilite or amosite. Even so, reliable medical studies have put the chances of cancer in cases of chronic exposure in the million to one range. The most common type of asbestos, by far, used in the past (and even now in safe forms) is chrysotile and there is no medically recognized significant link between it and lung cancer (mesothelioma or any other). Massive exposure by miners and other workers to all kinds of asbestos can cause asbestosis. Regulations dealing with this syndrome have been in place since the 70s. Basically, lawyers have used the fact that all these different minerals are called "asbestos" to hoodwink sympathetic juries into awarding judgments, or, more often, collecting settlements from companies weary of fighting endless court cases.
It is all but impossible get past the pages of "We'll get you money!" ads and faked "information" sites on google to find real data, unfortunately. However, here is a simple and rational site by a geologist. http://tinyurl.com/dctt7w
For all modern day purposes, the only real risk of chrysotile asbestos is legal, not physical. (As an amusing side note, Daly City in California has so much naturally occurring chrysotile in the soil the air has over 10x the limit considered safe by the FDA. One wonders how the court cases are argued there.)
All in all, the asbestos panic is just another example of the "lawyer tax" on living in America.

Posted by: Flubber at May 09, 2009 01:32 AM (g0nz7)

@baldilocks,

your post is inmy mind a little different than one referring to the President as bro-bama and king of the urkel tribe.

Posted by: chad at May 09, 2009 02:15 AM (f9ojf)

38 I don't think that it's that they're incompetent, because the ones I know in there are some smart mofo's. I think it's a matter of laziness brought on by a smug feeling of overwhelming superiority. That's how power rots the brain.

Posted by: steez at May 09, 2009 02:36 AM (7KzjQ)

39 I don't think that it's that they're incompetent, because the ones I know in there are some smart mofo's. I think it's a matter of laziness brought on by a smug feeling of overwhelming superiority. That's how power rots the brain.

Posted by: steez at May 09, 2009 02:38 AM (7KzjQ)

40 Between this chinless wonder and his boss, a brutha won't be elected as dogcatcher for the next hundred years.

Posted by: baldilocks at May 08, 2009 10:31 PM (b4sAO)

That was my feeling before the election. You just knew Jug Ears was going to be an epic, epic fail, and a race-baiter. I'll stick with my prediction that race relations are going to be sent into the shitter for a half century because of this clown's incompetence.

As for asbestos, I know nothing of the different compounds called 'asbestos' but I certainly recall cutting asbestos shingles with a circular saw when I was in my teens to side an old outbuilding. Fucking dust was everywhere. Kind of like I recall rolling a ball of mercury around in my hand. Which could explain some things about my cognitive development.

Posted by: Herr Morgenholz at May 09, 2009 06:06 AM (Yb87T)

These two cases could not be more different. The Stevens case pretty much looked like an open and shit guilty case and the feds screwed up on technicalities. Stevens was let off AFTER a jury had found him guilty. In this case, from the eveidence that we can see from the press accounts, there was never any case to begin with. This case appears to be the typical overzelous EPA bureaucrat pushing for a conviction when there was never a problem to begin with. The jury gave a not guilty. Next the justice department and EPA should be made to pay the legal bills and it should come out of the pockets of all the assholes that pushed for this case to be brought, not the tax payers.

Posted by: Vic at May 09, 2009 07:13 AM (f6os6)

42 "damn for the amount of money we spend on the Justice Department is it too much to ask for them to hire competent attorneys?"

You ain't $een nothin' yet.

Obama slashes federal funding to deal with the illegal alien burdens on American taxpayers (20% reimbursement of costs too pricey, let the individual states carry the entire burden to enforce federal law & mandates in each jurisdiction).

Federal Prosecutions will be all focused on American citizens under the Patriot Act. Federal hands off illegal aliens, including those criminally convicted and "serving" time.

Posted by: maverick muse at May 09, 2009 07:40 AM (F1b/5)

43 Tom DeLay was indicted by the crook Ronny Earle on a technicality that was not law at the time of the event. And though repeatedly acquitted by Grand Juries, Earle finally got his way by stifling evidence and limiting the information provided to the last Grand Jury. And though DeLay insisted on having his day in court, to be provided a speedy court trial, Earle left the case off the calendar and out of court, retired, and got his devotee elected in his stead.

Whether one likes DeLay or Earle, it's another example of prosecutorial misconduct yet to be addressed.

Posted by: maverick muse at May 09, 2009 07:51 AM (F1b/5)

44 I am curious, since few, if any, of you actually know the facts surrounding this case why do you just assume it should not have been brought at all? And that the government was trying to kill big business or some other such evil thing in doing so? Past the normal penchant for just not trusting the Justice Department or the government, that is.

Perhaps the defense of something like15 extraordinarily high-paid attorneys along with a judge who was not at all supportive of the case in the first place simply beat the (in this case) much smaller prosecution team in presenting their two cases, and the jury honestly just found there was not enough evidence to convict on conspiracy and obstruction. It happens.

BTW, there are two good films on the Libby situation that are available on DVD. I would check them out before you make a decision that there was no real issue concerning the health of mine workers and their families.

Posted by: TRO at May 09, 2009 08:08 AM (q4WFG)

TRO\

If you'll go back and read the comments you'll see that I said "based on the press accounts".

Bwsides that, I know what kind of overzealous assholes populate the EPA.

Posted by: Vic at May 09, 2009 09:05 AM (f6os6)

46 I wish that Obama won't turn out to be like David Dinkins

Dinkins will look like an untra competent saint before this is all over. Obama will wind up being on the Kwame Killpatrick end of the spectrum rather than the Dinkins end.

Posted by: Purple Avenger at May 09, 2009 09:14 AM (qsxNt)

47 If the facts and law as presented in the NY Times article are valid how did the Dept. of Justice hope to bring suit given the timelines and circumstances indicated? These DOJ lawyers need to be taken out and hung for gross stupidity.

Posted by: Thomas Jackson at May 09, 2009 12:03 PM (0Qynq)

48 "Bwsides that, I know what kind of overzealous assholes populate the EPA."

Yeah cause all 17,000 of them (too many I agree) are just that way. And all DOD employees are war mongers and so forth and so on. Only the truly evil ever go into public service. It's science,.

Posted by: TRO at May 09, 2009 01:26 PM (q4WFG)

@TRO

since those DVD's are put out by the plaintiffs I doubt they can be considered unbiased.

Posted by: chad at May 09, 2009 01:48 PM (f9ojf)

50 #43 And, by Texas law, the accusation forced Delay to step down from his office and the tie-up keeps him from re-entering elective politics in his state. This was the singular goal in the first place. And now we now from where these sorts of tactics arise.

Posted by: baldilocks at May 09, 2009 01:52 PM (b4sAO)

51 ... for the amount of money we spend on the Justice Department is it too much to ask for them to hire competent attorneys?

I agree that it would be nice, but seriously who in Government could recognize competence when they saw it? Has there been any competence in Government anywhere at any time? Do they have any way to recognize such a thing? Clearly you're asking a blind man to find a red ball. He has no idea what red looks like, how can this possibly be done?

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