1

WAF** is my new motto. Yesirree.

Can I still blame Bush?

 

 

** We're all fucked

 

2 He really IS the mother-fucking Antichrist.

3 Is he carrying a bar of soap?

4 What if.. they're right?  What if Obama really can bring effective change to Wahington, and solve all our problems?  Did you ever consider that?
.
.
.
.
.
WAF.

5 If this works, I can relax.  I've always been sure that there would be a post-American future, I was just never positive when it would start.

The question I'll need to ask myself if this works is whether I need to start learning Gaelic, Spanish, Hindi, or Japanese.

6 That thing in his right hand has golden arches on it.  It's his order of fries.

7 Holy shit.  Does that come in velvet? 

8

I guess they're going after the sizeable heroin addict vote here in Portland. 

9 I think the 'horse' is a unicorn.
WAF!

10 And is it me or is BHO literally farting roses in that drawing?

11
Stock up on the Valu-Rite, folks.  It's gonna be a long 8 years.

Hey, lets all try not to work ourselves into a rabid frenzy like the Left did over Bush for 8 years.  It's bad for your health and we're gonna need you in 2016.

In the meantime... suspended animation.  Yeah, that's the ticket.

12 Is he rising from the ocean? Where's the big clam shell?

13 Is this the cover art for the new Herbie Hancock album?

14 Damn you Joanie!

Serves me right for wasting valuable blog snarking time by getting a little actual work done.

15 at least he doesn't appear to be walking ON the water.

16 My my my, he looks absolutely .....magical!

wooops, there goes my lunch.

17

I hesitate to bring this up, but Michelle Malkin just informed us of the new Republican slogan.

It's ripped off of an antidepressant commercial.

No, really.

18

WAF** is my new motto. Yesirree.

Can you figure out how to add the extra FLE to that as well.  Then you can say WAFFLE

19

This might be the funniest thing I have ever seen.  I'm imagining the artist painting that, making little self critiques... "Oh, needs more roses!  Hm... and a galloping hors- no!  Unicorn!  There!  That's perfect.  This is both tasteful and completely serious." 

20 That's the bridge to nowhere.

And why does he have 3 thumbs?

21
If he's in it will only be for one term.  As  soon as he is elected the stock market will take a serious dive because of his capital gains tax platform. He's such a push over for terrorists, we are bound to be attacked again, either here or overseas. The Israelis aren't going to kiss his ass, either.

22 FLE = Fear Liberal Executive?

23 Now you know what kind of people get suckered into cults.

24

I was thinking "nice new SluShop" and then BAM!

Look on the bright side, no matter who wins, we're fucked.

25 I don't think it's going to work as well with those who actually vote.  The much-demonized 'bitter voter' brigade will be repulsed by the hero-worship. 

26

They almost had my vote until I saw that the unicorn behind him was not, in fact, a unicorn.

close, very close

27 This shit is so stupid. This is going to drive me batshit fucking crazy for almost an entire decade. Good grief.

28 Holy shit; I thought it was a Photoshop at first.

I agree, Ace. If there's any consolation, it'll be seeing his insane supporters be thoroughly disappointed after the honeymoon.

29

Is he carrying a bar of soap?

Pocket Koran.

 

30 Andrew Sullivan dreamscape?

31 Oh, and, WAF!!!

32 Yeah but better the O'man than McCain.

33

I don't think thats a rose petal at the bottom of the painting. 

34 Andrew Sullivan dreamscape?

Actually, even Andy thinks this is ridiculous.

35

Come on everybody, what is the worst that can happen? A plurality of symps and chumps swallow this crap, just like they swallowed "A Man from a place called Hope" in 1992.

Perhaps some 3rd party siphon appears like Perot did (Bob Barr?), just to push the Obamunists over the line.

By 2010, things are so fucked up a massive electoral revolt occurs on the Congress level, just like 1994.

The key question, of course, is how much damage the Obamunists can do in 2009 and 2010.

 

36 Could have had my vote if the "artist" had put in one of those chest thingy like Iron Man.

37 pj momma,

If you squint, it is a unicorn.
Do that and you'll receive the true healing power of the BHO into your soul.
And your wallet.

38 Curmudgeon at May 13, 2008 01:36 PM

The problem is last time we got Clinton, who let Osama slide several times instead of killing him. That didn't work out so dandy.

39 <i>Actually, even Andy thinks this is ridiculous.</i>

Heh heh heh.  Quote from Andi:  "Calm down, guys.   Calm down."

He's probably talking to his testicles.

40

That shit really ran next to an Oregon weekly's endorsement of Obama.

Which Oregon weekly?

41 The Oregon Obama ads are a bit too much, they run like 4 times an hour and get this: they picked the most unpopular governor in our history, a woman that almost got recalled, she even almost caused a Republican to be elected governor which hasn't happened in almost 100 years. She's the one you picked to advertise for you??

42 Isn't that shirt the same style as the one Michael Jackson wore at concerts and in at least one video?

43

President Carter Obama may end up doing OK, if he gets anointed.

44 I like how you look at the link, it says obama420.jpg

So this is from a stoner's perspective?  Afterall, Oregon was the first state to decriminalize marijuana in small amounts.

45

The key question, of course, is how much damage the Obamunists can do in 2009 and 2010.

Unfortunately, Obama is an Illinois Democrat. Illinois Democrats can't wipe themselves, let alone govern anything, even though they have 100% control. Hopefully, they'll just gridlock DC with whiny power grabbing and infighting.

WAF.

46 I realize that it's de rigeur here to slam John McCain, and with good reason. But could you ever, in your wildest imagination, think that a McCainiac could do anything half this asinine? Just wondering ...

47 I hate to break it to you guys, but it matters little how well he performs in office.
The press thinks that they had a hand in damaging Bill Clinton and they won't let that happen again. 

48

If I'm not mistaken, and I just might be, the same article for which the Earth, Wind, & Fire album cover picture of Obama rising from the Willamette River is on the cover, mocks those Evangelicals that voted for GWB due to their religious fervor.

 

49 The amazing thing is there's no way this fuckwad will ever win.

We could have nominated a real conservative, you know someone to the right of Ghengis Khan and beat this assclown. But no, we have to elect Mr. Maverick. 

What a waste.

50

He's probably talking to his testicles.

Wiserbud,

L!

O!

L!

51 Which Oregon weekly?

Willamette Week.

52 I'd consider a vote for Obama IF he came forward and said something like: "Listen, I appreciate those of you that support me and my campaign. But please stop being such huge douches, OK? Please? All the dick sucking drowns out the conversation."

53 What's the white sticky stuff running down the side of his face?

54

Is he carrying a bar of soap?

That's a ticket to paradise.

55 Whoa whoa whoa, adam h. NOT SO FAST!

56

I have no limits.  None.  Zilch.

57 I see a horse. I don't see a unicorn.

I also don't see any, uhh, pants.

WAF.

58

Isn't "ride the white horse" a euphemism for coc*ine use?  I seem to recall a 1980's dance song along those lines (play on words unintended).

If so, the picture may be more apt than you first thought....

59 This work of "art" will be hanging on the wall of the next Portland cuddle party.

60 So this is from a stoner's perspective? Afterall, Oregon was the first state to decriminalize marijuana in small amounts.

Hah! I can beat that. Here in Eugene, the police publicly announced that reports of any property crimes under $700 would not even be accepted, let alone investigated. F'n morons. I might as well put up a sign in my front yard that says "Come and burgle my house."

61

I see Obama chose Bert as his running mate:

http://___371.imageshack.us/___371/5384/32734659dt1.png

I guess Bert *is* Evil.

62 But if I shot some meth head who broke into my house to steal stuff, I'm sure the police would have something to say about that.

63 Have you; or anyone you know ever taken part in one of these surveys that they are forever going on about.  Seriously- is a Random Sample of George Clooney and 32 of his friends really fucking Random?

64 Would shooting a meth head be considered more than $700 in property damage?  It doesn't even sound to me like you'd have to report it.

65 That picture is very nice when viewed thru McCain Derangement Syndrome colored glasses.

66 We had that exact picture on the side of our Chevy Van.

It got our asses kicked.

A lot.

67

What's the white sticky stuff running down the side of his face?

I think it came from Andi Sullivan.

68

How will this play in Massatoosits?

69

I hate to break it to you guys, but it matters little how well he performs in office.
The press thinks that they had a hand in damaging Bill Clinton and they won't let that happen again. 

Ah, but the press clearly is not what it once was. Which is a large part of why we're all here reading this blog.

Honestly, folks? I think we may actually *need* a "multicultural Jimmy Carter", just so the mushyheads out there, especially the young, can understand how bad things can really get. Too many people, and obviously the young, just do not remember the 1970's.

Maybe we *need* Baghdad and Mosul 2009 to turn into Saigon and Phnom Penh 1975. Maybe even just the specter of that happening would get a Great Islamunist bashing President in 2012, just as we got a great Commiebashing Prez in 1980.

Maybe we need really convoluted economic policies as only Demunist Commiecrats can create. Maybe even just the specter of wage and price "guidelines" would again do the trick for the Congress in 2010.

The key sub-questions, of course, are:

1. How much damage as Commander in Chief could the Obamunist do in 4 years, and

2. How much damage to the judiciary could the Obamunist do in 4 years.

70 If all you see is a horse, then my Hope for Change is being thwarted by distractions.
So stop it.
It's more fun if it's a unicorn.

71 I don't think it's going to work as well with those who actually vote. The much-demonized 'bitter voter' brigade will be repulsed by the hero-worship.
Posted by: Slublog at May 13, 2008 01:30 PM (R8+nJ)

I really hope you are correct.

What could Obama fuck up the worst? The military. Commander in Chief, remember?

72 Another sub-question;

How much heavy drinking can my liver take over 4 years?

73

You guys sound bitter.

That horse is actually a My Little Pony.

 

WAF

74 I guess they're going after the sizeable heroin addict vote here in Portland.

Free the Needles!

75
Funny how Obama is "blacker" in the painting than he actually is. He's half-white, remember?

76 Our country is fucking doomed.

77

Funny how Obama is "blacker" in the painting than he actually is

It's to emphasize his magical half.

78 Our country is fucking doomed.

Nah, we're just in for a rough 2-4 years. America will be fine. Let's try and help the GOP grow a brain in time for the next mid-terms. People should be getting pretty pissed with the Obamassiah by then.

79 Yeah me!  I've got a future in retail!

80 Yay me?

81 I think the painting would look better with that Unicorn thing on Red Eye that Greg Gutfield draws.

82 What if Obama really can bring effective change to Wahington, and solve all our problems?  Did you ever consider that?

Won't happen.  Obama doesn't know how to follow through and seal the deal.  He's all show and no go.  This trait actually reveals itself in his handwriting.

83 Oh, he'll manage some miracles. Losing Iraq, appointing very liberal Supreme Court justices and tilting the courts to the left for the next generation, raising taxes, demolishing the economy.

And the McCainiacs tell us that after all that, he'll be re-elected for a second, possibly a third and fourth term.

Of course, McCainiacs tell us that Obama will ravage our women, cripple our horses, and send our children to re-education camps to be buggered by Barney Frank and Bernie Ward, so I take it with a grain of salt.

84 They almost had my vote until I saw that the unicorn behind him was not, in fact, a unicorn.

I didn't paint the horse as a unicorn because that wouldn't have been in keeping with my strictly realistic style.

85 My Little Pony.  Heh.

86 Sooner or later, perhaps already, ordinary people are going to get really creeped out by this abject worship of the man. That's just disturbing at a very basic level. Watch for more soviet-style hero art of the guy like his campaign posters.

87
Eighty-two percent of Americans now say the United States is seriously on the wrong track ...

The decades-long dumbing down of our education system is in large measure responsible for this attitude. Seriously. Increasingly Americans are as ignorant shepherds dancing on the ruins of a fallen civilization greater than they could ever know much less imagine. Implicit in this metaphor is that we are in or entering a dark age, and I think that's true to some degree. Victor Davis Hanson writes often in this vein and I mostly agree with him. But the seminal work on the subject is "After Virtue" by the philosopher Alasdair MacIntyre, published in 1981 (see the Wikipedia entry on MacIntyre if you want to know more).

Life is generally quite good in the material sense for a large majority of Americans and yet a large majority can't seem to recognize how good they have it and, by extension, what a great country America is. I call this a moral as well as an educational failing. It also represents a failure to become mature adults with all the gravitas that being an adult should entail. The relentlessly pessimistic and adversarial mindset that holds that all that is good about America is more than vitiated by its flaws is a product of childish progressivist/utopian thinking, and it is corrosive to American civilization. I would assert that it is especially prevalent among twenty- and thirty-somethings who are very poorly educated indeed in the foundational moral virtues and intellectual streams of Classical Greek and Roman civilization--and who comprise a large segment of Obama's constituency. Those of you in your twenties and thirties ought to stop excoriating Baby Boomers for their manifest flaws and look to their own house and get it in order. I suggest you start by reading Parmenides, Heraclitus, and Homer, and working your way from there. Or, e.g., read Classical Greek accounts of, say, the Battle of Thermopylae instead of reading stupid graphic novels about the battle or viewing even stupider movies based on those graphic novels. Get my drift?

88

Is that an armadillo in his trousers?

It's quite frightening.

89 can't seem to recognize how good they have it

4/8 years of Obama and a democrat congress will cure that problem.  Nothing hurts like pain.  Pain clarifies and focuses.

90

Why do I think, "Jehovah's Witness" when I look at this picture?

91 ugh...you know, as an Obama supporter, this just makes me freaking cringe, man!

92

I would assert that it is especially prevalent among twenty- and thirty-somethings who are very poorly educated indeed in the foundational moral virtues and intellectual streams of Classical Greek and Roman civilization--and who comprise a large segment of Obama's constituency. Those of you in your twenties and thirties ought to stop excoriating Baby Boomers for their manifest flaws and look to their own house and get it in order.

Unfortunately, the Boomers are no better in this regard. They were the first to disregard the timeless truths about human nature. Generations X and Y can hardly be blamed for not learning what the Boomers *removed* from the curriculum.

93

Hah!

Now dress him up like a barbarian and put him in some Boris Vallejo stuff.

94 I would assert that it is especially prevalent among twenty- and thirty-somethings who are very poorly educated indeed in the foundational moral virtues

Combine this with the incessant manipulation and pandering to the unwashed masses by the power-brokers of the Left, who continuously cultivate this impression of a horrible, depressing, decaying society from which there is no hope for a better world, unless they are given the seat of power, and you have the entire story.

95

Entropy's new motto:

Change that needs a sammich and a BJ.

96

I hope Drew's right when they say he'll never win.

The hardest thing I see now is keeping conservative voters motivated enough to get to the polls by November... the intent on the left is to turn the Dem Convention into a coronation. The narrative is obvious- it's not like they're trying not to telegraph it- but the fact is, we on the right are ambivalent at best about McCain, and when he continues to make unforced errors ("comprehensive" immigration reform, Huckabee for VP?), it makes it that much harder for the people who have to vote him into office to do so,

tmi3rd

97

Steve, nothing implicitly wrong with reading the graphic novels and movies.  It's just wrong if you think that's how it actually went down.

But I'm also a guy who reads Herodotus, Caesar, and random chronicles on the Crusades for fun...

98

I'm more creeped out about V the K's obsessive hatred of McCain than the Obamassiah cult.  

Don't worry, I'm keeping track of my earlier commitment.  Another $10.00 to the McCain kitty though this is a political type thread, so not so much off topic.  Though I'll give McCain the benefit of the $10.00.

99

His campaign is getting seriously creepy.

When they chant "O-BA-MA,  O-BA-MA,  O-BA-MA" at his rallies I get badly creeped out.  Reminds me of the zombie-ish guys in The Mummy chanting "E-MO-TEP,  E-MO-TEP,  E-MO-TEP".

100

Well that painting wasn't quite miraculous.  Note that Obama seems to be knee deep in the water; it's either a shallow creek he's crossing, or he can't quite walk on water--close, but not on top of the water.

 

And second, all of the pissing and moaning and woe is me about the economy that is a constant refrain in our main stream media will suddenly go dark the day that the Obamessiah is inaugurated.  The "worst economy  in years" (actually one of the longest peacetime booms in our economic history) will suddenly become  good again, just as soon as Obama is in the White House--and the economy can then go straight into the dumpster and the New York Times will say "it's all good".  

So some miraculous stuff is coming our way, you betcha for sure.

101

"The decades-long dumbing down of our education system is in large measure responsible for this attitude."

I work with people who actually have no fucking CLUE about what the fuck inflation is.

"Wull, gas prices are so much higher now than they were in the 70's!!!"

102

None of it really matters.

If Obama does not get elected and damage the piss out of the country, McCain will.

His energy policy is abject economic ruin for decades. His border policy is cultural death.

Ask not for whom the bell tolls.

103 @98

I am not going to single anyone person out but there does seem to be a lot more McCain bashing here at AoS then any of the other sites I visit regularly.

I actually paused before publishing my original comment because I thought it might start a flame war but then I decided what the hell it's what at least a few people are thinking.

104 Time for reality check.

1. Obama is the creation of the media and rich yuppies. The Apple Computer / "Gossip Girl" types. Apple Computer has 5% of the market, and Gossip Girl does 2.5 million viewers. For all their buzz, they remain niche stuff.

Yeah, the media and marketers go crazy over these people because they're the hyped flavor of the month. But American Idol with women over 50 watching does 22-28 million or so each week. Do the math.

2. Obama can't win in Dem Primaries that matter. Yeah he took Wyoming. All 17 gay boutique designers voted for him. Wyoming will vote for McCain in a landslide. Outside of the Pacific Northwest, and IL, Obama has not won states that matter. He didn't win CA. He didn't win FL, MI, MA, OH, PA, and so on.

Yes he won Southern States where the only Dem voters left are Black. Big deal. Anyone think he has a chance for any Southern state save VA (because of the Alexandria are voting?) He's got zero chance in places he won big, like MS.

3. Obama commits a gaffe a week. He's a walking, talking, Dukakis in a tank. All his problems so far are self-inflicted. When the campaign really heats up between him and McCain, much as I loathe Maverick, Mav's got more political skills to undercut Obama in key gaffes that you know Obama will make. Wright is not going away, neither is Rezko, neither will Michelle Obama shut up, neither will his childhood associates who can testify he lied about being Muslim as a kid, nor any other number of problems.

4. Media influence is waning. Audiences and readers are dropping. They can't pull Obama over the finish line.

5. The more the hip young things embrace Obama, the more non-hip middle aged people who  actually vote and far outnumber the young (Demographics matter, the baby bust means Seniors outnumber young by 2-1) will vote for the other guy. Just as Starbucks hype and embrace by the young and cool makes the Dunkin Donuts crowd love Dunkin more (and Dunkin is profitable while Starbucks is in trouble), so too the hype creates backlash. Obama is a pet rock or mood ring.

6. Obama and his strategy aim to replicate his IL Senate victory, i.e. Blacks + college kids + yuppies. That's not enough to win nationally, he's going to lose by at least 10 percentage points and probably more.

7. Events can drive Obama off the rails -- terrorist attacks make him look weak and appeasing (well, even more so) and his call for higher taxes is a loser (taxes only benefit minority welfare recipients not white voters).

8. Obama is weak on crime and that's a major issue for homeowners. Er, the largest group of voters.

105 ...he can't quite walk on water--close, but not on top of the water.

He's just learning, be patient, by Nov. he'll be 2ft above it.

106 can't seem to recognize how good they have it

My son recently asked me what was so great about Reagan. And I told him it was impossible to appreciate Reagan because he had no way of knowing how bad it was under Carter. I was just a little kid then, but I was precocious, and I do remember. Under Jimmy Carter, the prevailing wisdom was that America was over. Our enemies were taking over in Afghanistan, in Nicaragua, in Grenada, in Angola. Our cities were rotting, our military was in shambles, We were doomed to economic and social decline, and eventual defeat... probably at the hands of the Soviets, and the best we could hope for was to negotiate terms of defeat.  President Carter fully shared in this gloomy scenario.

Reagan turned all that around. But over half the electorate doesn't remember Jimmy Carter. They are about to be reminded. (No matter who "wins.")

107 What can we learn from this photorealistic painting of Obama:

1) Obama melts in sunlight

2) Obama effervesces in water. Just like Alka-seltzer, but better. Obama + water = bubbles, roses, and strawberry Kool-Aid.

3) White horses and/or unicorns love to prance around in strawberry Kool-Aid

4) Obama always carries a large Bill Blass brass belt buckle every where he goes.


Based on the above information - Obama's got my vote!

108 You know, every night I go to bed laughing at the antics of our candidates for president and tell myself "Self, Yuk it up. It can't get any better."

And every day, it just Keeps.Getting. Better.

109 there does seem to be a lot more McCain bashing here at AoS then any of the other sites I visit regularly.

I'm glad there's McCain bashing going on here. Are we supposed to just get on the bandwagon for that douche?
He's toxic.
Frankly, I'm sick of hearing "I'll vote for him, but I won't like it!"
Then don't vote for him, or shut up about "Lesser of two evils" bullshit. That's a cop out to justify letting the Republicans fuck us.
And if you do vote for McCain, you're telling them to continue fucking us.
As much as I loathe the thought of an Obama win, I hate the Republicans trying to piss on my leg and tell me it's raining, just a little more.

110 Well bmac if you think McCain will be worse than Obama, then in your words shut the fuck up and vote for him. 

111 sorry ,you did not use the word fuck in that context.

112 I also didn't say McCain would be worse.

113 Touching the hem of Obama's pirate shirt has cured my scrofula!

114

I also didn't say McCain would be worse.

I'll admit being dense then because you lost me.  

115 Can you figure out how to add the extra FLE to that as well.  Then you can say WAFFLE

FLE - F'ing lunatics EVERYWHERE

WAFFLE!

And I believe he's ejaculating those roses in the first picture.

116 The only good thing about Obama running is Slublog.

117 to V the K (and kinda to Jim Rockford):

See, this is something people don't really seem to realize.  They don't quite understand the youth support for Obama, preferring to gloss over it by calling them college kids + yuppies, or what have you.  But you hit on something very real, V the K.  Ask yourself what we've (yes, I'm a Gen-Y Millennial, and proud of it) grown up under.

We have fondish memories of seemingly "good times" that was our childhood under Clinton.  But we've come of age under Bush II.  And you wonder why we are an ever increasingly Left, progressive demographic (something like low to mid 60% Democrat/Democrat leaning atm)?  Like you said (and forgive my sarcasm a bit here) we never knew the "nightmare" of Carter, only his post-presidential work.  And we certainly didn't know the great godly goodness that Reagen apparently was.  We don't know that kind of conservatism.

The only conservatism we know is...Bush.  The civil-rights restraining, intollerant and "gays will kill the family," "the jury is still out on global warming," Christain-God-first bible thumping type of conservatism.

Am i disgusted by this type of Obama messiah-ism?  of course!  but there is a reason his "shares our values" and other such ratings with the under-35 crowd is thru the roof...

118 Every crap T-shirt shop on the boardwalk is going to have this airbrushed garbage this summer.  Then when he loses in November you can change it to a crucification scene while the left cries about how racist America is.

119

My son recently asked me what was so great about Reagan. And I told him it was impossible to appreciate Reagan because he had no way of knowing how bad it was under Carter.

Here's what I want:

1. Elect a semi-reasonable conservative who will put in 2-3 solidly conservative SCOTUS picks if for no reason than to pander to his base. with that problem solved, it will now be not so bad to:

2. elect a crappy liberal who makes Jimmy Carter look like Dick Cheney.

3. after 4 years of mind-dumbing imbecility, the electorate will be ready for another Reagan.

but not before

120 *crucifixion (my spelling + spell check = teh suck) 

121

Like you said (and forgive my sarcasm a bit here) we never knew the "nightmare" of Carter, only his post-presidential work. 

If you think that's a mark in Carter's favor, you're a lunatic.

In other words, the ur-Obama supporter.

122 Swear to God (the non-Obama one) that's a unicorn and not a horsey. 

123

The only conservatism we know is...Bush.  The civil-rights restraining, intollerant and "gays will kill the family," "the jury is still out on global warming," Christain-God-first bible thumping type of conservatism.

I think this is what someone was talking about regard to intellectual laziness.

124

The civil-rights restraining, intollerant and "gays will kill the family," "the jury is still out on global warming," Christain-God-first bible thumping type of conservatism.

Yes, folks, AarynLaperle sums it up. I think we *need* someone to act on everything Aaryn was taught in school. Nothing like reality to knock the brainwashing out.

That Aaryn believes the global warming fraud is sad. As for civil rights, this is the Administration that defined the 2nd amendment as an *individual* right, not a bogus communist collective right, and you can't get more libertarian than THAT. I know, I know, your profs taught you that the ChimpyBushHitler's jackboots are coming to get you....and they also taught you that marriage didn't have to be one man and one woman, never mind 5000 years of history. Ever wonder why the Muslims are so savage and that cult in Colorado City was so messed up? Disposing of the one man and one woman model has a lot to do with it....

Seriously, folks, perhaps we really DO need someone as Prez who actually acts on the pseudointellectual academic garbage that Aaryn soaked up like a sponge.

125 "The civil-rights restraining, intollerant and "gays will kill the family," "the jury is still out on global warming," Christain-God-first bible thumping type of conservatism."

In other words, you blindly, happily believe everything you see and hear on MSNBCNNPBSetc... 

Excellent.  Thanks for canceling out my vote.

126

"I'll admit being dense then because you lost me."

Seriously.  I'm voting for McCain because I don't want Obama, and if anybody's sick of hearing that, they should probably take a break from the blog, cause this is going to go on until November. 

Look, I suspect the people refusing to vote for McCain are misprioritizing and being dangerously short-sighted about how bad an Obama presidency will be, though I hope I'm wrong about that.  That said, I wouldn't dream of suggesting that they shut up about it.  This is important stuff, and it needs to be talked about.

So I'll tell you what, let's knock off the "shut the fuck up" stuff.  That's what's really obnoxious.

127

The Republic will survive Obama, it survived Carter and Clinton.

Don't pay to much attention to the Reuters poll though, it is "1,122 adults ".  Not even registered voters.  Let alone likely voters.

 

128 A white horse?  That's so . . . racist, isn't it?

129 AarynLaperle, since you appear to be an honest dissenter and not one of our bomb-and-run douchebag trolls, can you answer one question for me, honestly?

Can you name one leading candidate for President in all of American history who had less qualifications to be President than Obama?

130 I think we need to raise the voting age. 30 sounds about right.

And the 19th Amendment? That hasn't worked real well either, it's time to repeal it.

131 I think we need to raise the voting age. 30 sounds about right.

And only property owners....

132 So I'll tell you what, let's knock off the "shut the fuck up" stuff.  That's what's really obnoxious.

Hey, I never said "shut the fuck up" I said just shut up about voting for McCain and not liking it. That gets everyone nowhere fast, and we kinda know it by now.
If anybody wants to vote for McCain, do what you gotta do, but saying you don't like it is pointless. If you really don't like it, don't vote for him so that the Republicans are forced into moving in a more conservative direction.

133 lmao, this is funny.  and fun.

First off, wiserbud, i hate MSNBC.  And most of the stuff on CNN too (i'm sorry, Lou Dobbs annoys me to no end).  But thats the same way i feel about FOX, and other demogogery.  And i'll give FOX one thing, at least they don't hide their bias.  Personally, i think thats an improvement for journalism.

Secondly, Curmudgeon, my "profs" as you call them taught me nothing of the kind.  its observation.  And i'm not saying anything of hte kind of "they're coming to get me."  Its just kinda hard to support someone who treats some of its citizens (read: homosexuals, what have you) as something less than the rest of society. (and before you say that every democrat on the ballot answers the same question by talking about civil unions, i say i need no reminding that my party is full to the brim with panderers and mediocrity).

also, 5000 years?  How so?  You can get at most 2000 years before prevailing socio-religious morals began to look down upon homosexual love.  Before that, it was an accepted thing.

Oh, and the 2nd Amendment - whatever you have to say about gun-ownership-rights - is the clunkiest thing written this side of a two year old attempting to write "the love song of J. Alfred Proofrock."

134
Generations X and Y can hardly be blamed for not learning what the Boomers *removed* from the curriculum.

So ...  it the fault of Boomers that Gens X and Y are dumb. Perfect. Thanks for making my point for me.

In any case, it isn't all Boomers, or even a majority of Boomers, who are responsible for your dumbed-down education. It's the fault of Boomer academics and intellectuals, a very small albeit influential (and loathsome) segment of the population. In the Midwest, at least, most people in my age group--i.e., Boomers--are level-headed, hard-working, commonsensical, and patriotic. Yes, I know that's hard to believe--but it's true. Your parents aren't the idiots you seem to think they are.

I will admit that I was engaging in hyperbole in my comments about dumb post-Boomers. I was making a point. In this blog I've read too many posts hammering Boomers, and I've grown tired of it. Comments in that vein are gross generalizations, ignorant, ill-informed, and for the most part lacking basis in fact. They do not reflect the reality of things as they are and as I know them. However, I should like to point out that those who lambaste Boomers sound exactly, I mean EXACTLY, like many Boomers did when talking about their parents' generation--and just as self-righteous, arrogant, and ignorant. I find this amusing. The more things change, the more they stay the some. Wait til you reach your forties and fifties and your kids start excoriating you as the fools you appear to be in their eyes. It'll happen, I assure you. You read it here first.

135 Yes, folks, AarynLaperle sums it up.

Doesn't matter, her generation and her age people aren't likely to actually vote when it comes down to it. They're the Obama Girl generation, too busy to vote in the end.

136

The only conservatism we know is...Bush.  The civil-rights restraining, intollerant and "gays will kill the family," "the jury is still out on global warming," Christain-God-first bible thumping type of conservatism.

Isn't it amazing? Steve makes an impassionioned plea that something has to be done about the ignorance and intellectual shallowness that is endemic in our youth, and then, a mere handful of posts later, along comes a young person who PROVES HIS VERY POINT.  Now, is that uncanny or what?

137 Can you name one leading candidate for President in all of American history who had less qualifications to be President than Obama?

Sure, Stinky Esposit.  Polk comes to mind.  4 Years on a national legislative arena, 2 as gov of Tennessee.  Give me a bit more time and i can come up with more.

138

AarynLaperle at May 13, 2008 04:34 PM (2WUAd

Seriously quit while your behind.

139

And only property owners....

Or somehow linked to the taxes you pay. The top 50% of income earners paid 97% of total individual income taxes in 2005 (IRS data linked at Rush's website).

This situation is tailor-made for demagogues like Obama and Hillary, who promise ever more goodies to the non taxpayers in exchage for their votes. Remember Hillary's Santa Claus ad?

WAF

140 Polk was Speaker of the House, which granted it wasn't then what it is now but he was still a legislative leader and you know, a constitutional officer of the United States. 

As for being Governor of TN, at least he had some legislative experience.

You'd be better off trying Lincoln but that's not really true either.

141 you're = your

142 Umm...the white horsey?  If I'm not mistaken, when the big Mo made his "night ride" to Jerusalem he was taken by a winged horse, name if Barack (sp?).  Perhaps the artist knows their history.

143 its observation.

Quite non-biased observation, I see. 

Please to be providing any evidence that your rights have been violated or infringed upon.  And I mean evidence, not simply "Look at the Patriot Act!"  Real, actual, viable, actual evidence that what you are describing actually exists as a matter of policy and is not just your opinion of what is happening.

And no, not believing in Gay Marriage is not a violation of someone's rights.  It is a difference of opinion.  And when you're team is in power, maybe you get to set the agenda.  But until then.....

But please, stop with the over-the-top hyperbole and "Keith Olbermann-type" lunacy. 

144
OregonMuse:

Precisely. And thanks for your comment. If the only conservatism that person knows is the Bush brand, whose fault is that? Maybe he should start reading and learning about conservatism. Burke would be a good place to start, for the modern era. His works can be found in my libraries.

145 4 Years on a national legislative arena, 2 as gov of Tennessee.

As compared to four years in the senate and eight in a state legislature for Obama? Not much of a campaign slogan:

Obama: More Qualified than Polk.

146

In any case, it isn't all Boomers, or even a majority of Boomers, who are responsible for your dumbed-down education. It's the fault of Boomer academics and intellectuals, a very small albeit influential (and loathsome) segment of the population. In the Midwest, at least, most people in my age group--i.e., Boomers--are level-headed, hard-working, commonsensical, and patriotic. Yes, I know that's hard to believe--but it's true. Your parents aren't the idiots you seem to think they are.

Steve (Ed Snate): my parents were actually of the Silent Generation rather than the Boomers. I live in The Land Of Fruits And Nuts, and unfortunately, the Boomers that predominate here are actually those pseudoacademics and pseudointellectuals.

I KNOW there are great Boomers, two mentors in my life on a personal level, both Vietnam vets for what that is worth. To say nothing of various patriot/conservative writers and talkers and bloggers like yourself. So please don't think I lump you all together.

 

147
Oops, correction: "His works can be found in most libraries." Okay, in my library too.

148 Correction to my 144:

"As for being Governor of TN, at least he had some legislative  executive  experience."

149

Its more like:

Obama: More Qualified than Polk. Not Really But Close

150

Sure, Stinky Esposit.  Polk comes to mind.  4 Years on a national legislative arena, 2 as gov of Tennessee.  Give me a bit more time and i can come up with more.

Polk?  Polk is your answer?  You put right there in your comment how Polk is more qualified than Obama, which is that POLK HAD FREAKIN' EXECUTIVE EXPERIENCE.

Look, AarynLaperle, I'm going to let you in on something:  you're an idiot.  Seriously.  Please, don't consider my telling you that ad hominem, consider it a public service.

151
Curmudgeon:

No worries, my friend, I know what you meant. But I appreciate and thank you for your clarification. Again: I was just trying to stir the pot a little. (As if it needs stirring!).

152 Years on a national legislative arena, 2 as gov of Tennessee. Give me a bit more time and i can come up with more.

That already demonstrates him to be more qualified and more experienced than Senator Obama. And Polk was a lousy president.

153 Personally, I think Woodrow Wilson is the least qualified person to serve as president and he still has more executive experience than Obama.

154  the clunkiest thing written this side of a two year old attempting to write "the love song of J. Alfred Proofrock." 

I think you topped it with that last sentence.

155 New Obama logo that had to be done.

156 Wait, 2 years of executive experience is LESS than Obama's time as a state legislator?  Obama may be able to claim more years as a politician for his 8 years as a minor senator in Illinois, but that's hardly equivalent as relevant experience to executive office (plus Polk's legislative leadership experience).

(Keep in mind that I am not inclined to credit Obama with any time whatsoever as a US Senator, since he was elected to the Senate at the same time as being promoted as a Presidential candidate.)

157 Oh, and the 2nd Amendment - whatever you have to say about gun-ownership-rights - is the clunkiest thing written this side of a two year old attempting to write "the love song of J. Alfred Proofrock."

That's "Prufrock," brainiac. 

158 And Polk was a lousy president.

Those sir are fighting words.

Polk was a unilateral neo-con imperialist loooong before unilateral neo-con imperialism was cool.

159

Hey, I never said "shut the fuck up" I said just shut up about voting for McCain and not liking it. That gets everyone nowhere fast, and we kinda know it by now.  If anybody wants to vote for McCain, do what you gotta do, but saying you don't like it is pointless. If you really don't like it, don't vote for him so that the Republicans are forced into moving in a more conservative direction.

Nope, no sale.  I really don't like voting for McCain, but I don't believe that sitting out the election (and consequently helping elect Barak Obama) is going to force the GOP anywhere, except maybe toward pandering further for the leftys and/or "moderates" who didn't choose to sit things out.

You think it's okay to tell commenters that they should shut up about this scenario, and I think that's really wrong.  It's not pointless.  I've explained the point above.

Write what you want, but don't tell anyone else to shut up when they do the same thing.

160 polynike:  naw, i'm actually having fun.  I rarely get to discuss stuff like this.  And a have nothing to do at work atm.

For someone else up there...um, i'm a dude.  Erin is the female version of the name.

As for Polk...eh, someone asked.  I answered. -shrug-

And (not directed at Steve, but some others) you seem to be saying that my education was wanting and my intelligence is sub-par because i made a rather sweeping statement as opposed to writing a paragraphs-long critique of the rights and wrongs of the Bush administration.  I'm sorry...but i have read Homer...and Burke...and Luo Guanzhong, and Plato, and Euripides and so on and so on.  My apologies for that not being clear from a handful of posts.  But i managed to bring up a T.S. Eliot poem in the middle of a political discussion.  Oh, wait, that probably makes me elitist or a snob?

Directed at Steve: oh, no, i agree with you.  There does need to be reform in the educational system.  But blame for it can be spread around...but blame isn't what we need.

lol, this is fun.  I like you people.  And i don't mean that in any sort of pejorative or condecending way.

161 AAryn.... Thanks for playing.
 Please elaborate on your second amendment opinion.
I'm a bitter gun clinger (not the religious kind, alas) and happen to believe that the second amendment is fundamental to our freedom as Americans.
The" shall not be infringed "part , seems to me to be fairly concise and self explanatory.

162 Slublog: eh, i can't spell.  Its one of my many failings =P

163 Polk was the first President to really understand how to control our Southern borders.  Heh.

164 AarynLaperle, the problem is that you are still young (I'm probably up on you by a decade at most); we all start off as liberals and then we grow up.

I remember the Rodney King riots and telling my dad: should just convict those officers (in the name of racial justice or something).

I remember being anti-capitalist then I realized just how terrible the alternatives were.

I lived overseas for five years, from 98-'03. Came back for college. Some kid asks me if I believed in global warming. When I was in middle-school there was this awesome magazine called Omni, which had all sorts of crazy zero-energy, UFO stuff in it. And I remember global warming being every third issue. In that five year time frame I had left the country, some idiots took the UFO conspiracy rags into respectability.

I cannot believe that anyone believes (and science is not a religion, there is no belief in it, and if there is, you need to back the bus up and get off) that the climate of the world is directly caused by human activity. Flies smack in the face of, I don't know, the ice age, for instance.

But, you're young. When you're buttoning your children in parkas in May, you'll have the hindsight to reexamine your beliefs.

Global Warming itself is the greatest refutation of the Left this generation will have. It is the communism of our age, to lay on the ash heap of history.

165

The only conservatism we know is...Bush.  The civil-rights restraining, intollerant and "gays will kill the family," "the jury is still out on global warming," Christain-God-first bible thumping type of conservatism.

Well, when your beliefs are formed out of both ignorance and a cartoonish caricature of your ideological enemies, it's pretty easy to line up behind a vapid, clueless, corrupt buffoon like Hopey McChangerton.

Universal suffrage is the worst of this nation's many self-inflicted wounds.  I just wish the juvenile blithering idiots that benefitted from it at the expense of the functional and productive would stop rubbing it in at every opportunity.

It's not polite to brag, Aaryn.

166 But i managed to bring up a T.S. Eliot poem in the middle of a political discussion. Oh, wait, that probably makes me elitist or a snob?

No, but you managed to mispell 'Prufrock', which kind of destroyed the effect you were trying to achieve.

167 Quickly before i have to leave:

Aubry: the "shall not be infringed" bit isn't the clunky part...

Executive vs. Legislative experience: correct me if i'm wrong, but isn't the current election - however many years of experience they have - between 2 people who only have legislative experience?

Anyways, been fun.  Have fun ripping me apart some more.  I don't mind.

168 AAryn....Young man , I believe you are a conservative in the making. Come back soon.  Oh, and , buy a gun at your first opportunity.

169

 Its just kinda hard to support someone who treats some of its citizens (read: homosexuals, what have you) as something less than the rest of society. (and before you say that every democrat on the ballot answers the same question by talking about civil unions, i say i need no reminding that my party is full to the brim with panderers and mediocrity).

That you insist on the bogus concept that a homosexual relationship is *exactly* the same as a marriage says a lot.

also, 5000 years?  How so?  You can get at most 2000 years before prevailing socio-religious morals began to look down upon homosexual love.  Before that, it was an accepted thing.

Oh my, someone really has no history. How about the whole Old Testament? Meanwhile, let us look at those cultures where it *was* an accepted thing: slavery, infanticide, ritual abuse? You think you would really like living in Caligula's time?

Oh, and the 2nd Amendment - whatever you have to say about gun-ownership-rights - is the clunkiest thing written this side of a two year old attempting to write "the love song of J. Alfred Proofrock."

Ok, toots, I'll give you something even clunkier: When the criminal robs and rapes and beats you, and you can't defend yourself, and he gets let go because he's a misbegotten ethnic acting out of frustration at his "oppression", don't say you were not warned. You voted for what you got. At least Reginald Denny and the Korean store owners didn't get raped. (you may not remember that)

(I know, boo hoo hoo, upon reading this the multi-culti brainwashing may now be kicking into your bimbified mind, and you are crying "Waaah! Racist!" Never mind who the "hate crime" victims REALLY are, more often than not. Then again, you may not remember the crocodile tears the "progressives" cried over Willie Horton, either).

170 #164: totally agreed.  It's not a coincidence that the first major conference on global warming happened about 6 months after the collapse of the Soviet Union.

171

He's killing us with kindness and retardedness but mostly retardedness.

 

172
Curmudgeon:

By way of providing historical context, let me say that when I was in college from 1968-76, the humanities department were dominated by Marxists. (Remember the Donald Sutherland character in "Animal House"? Perfect). These were pre-Boomers, academics who had come of age in the late 30s, 40s, and 50s: Red Diaper Babies, "progressives, out-and-out Communist, and their fellow travelers. We, their Boomer students, hated them. Most of us did, anyway. The ones who didn't adopted their views and went on to become academics themselves.

Just want to show you all that the left-wing rot didn't start with Boomers. We were subjected to it by our elders.

173

Aubry: the "shall not be infringed" bit isn't the clunky part...

No, it's just the inconvenient part.  You know, the one that invalidates any confusion over basic, unambiguous words that the Left routinely professes when that antiquated old document gets in the way of its naked pursuit of unrestrained power over the proles.  An armed citizenry, after all, isn't one that will put up with "progressive" policies being forced upon it.  Can't have that.

But, remember, Bush is the one trampling all over civil rights, despite Aaryn's curious inability to name any.

174 Executive vs. Legislative experience: correct me if i'm wrong, but isn't the current election - however many years of experience they have - between 2 people who only have legislative experience?

Yes. Which is one of the reasons we are facing such miserable prospects with this election cycle.

But, if Obama's thin resume is adequate, shouldn't McCain's (or even Hillary's, shit, even John Edwards') measurably longer one make him, clearly, the more experienced choice?  Or are we simply admitting that experience really doesn't matter?

175 correct me if i'm wrong, but isn't the current election - however many years of experience they have - between 2 people who only have legislative experience?

McCain was a fighter pilot. That trumps 'community organizing' and banging the ex-CinC, evidently two other areas of executive experience, because that is also an impressive leadership credential. Leading people into combat is more impressive than glad-handing donors in San Fran.

And if legislative experience is the issue, McCain has more than the two Dem nominee-selects together.

It might be different if Obamamessiah had a governorship, but even on legislative experience he is incredibly lightweight. (One term, less?)

176

Oh, come off the 'gen x/gen y/ baby boomer' bullshit.

Nobody, and I mean nobody, hates hippies more then I do. Except maybe Eric Cartman. But what about the fuckin 'greatest generation'? Those bastards operatively invented socialism for fucks sake. They were morons too.

The sad, sad truth is, you're all fuckin stupid and you disgust me. How the hell any of you managed to crawl out of the tree and stop flinging your poo at each other long enough to hobble together some rudementary language skills is beyond me. Hell is other people.

also, 5000 years?  How so?  You can get at most 2000 years before prevailing socio-religious morals began to look down upon homosexual love.  Before that, it was an accepted thing.

Never was it marriage. Never.

Even 3,000 years ago in Greece, it was perfectly acceptable in some places for men to have romantic relations with other men. However - they were still expected to have a wife and produce an heir with their wife. Marriage has always been about familiar organization and child production and has always been male/female.

Besides - what the bloody fuck does that mean? Lots of things were acceptable 2000-5000 years ago... slavery.. polygamy.. pedophilia.. genocide.. I'm really not sure where the hell you're going with this.

Oh, the ancient greeks didn't have a problem with it? Oh, well then. Nor, in the case of Dionysus/Bacchus, did they have a problem with human sacrifice...

Which is not to say that homosexuality is equatable to murder, merely that if you have a point in saying it was acceptable 5000 years ago, I can't fathom what it might be.

177 I'm sorry...but i have read Homer...and Burke...and Luo Guanzhong, and Plato, and Euripides and so on and so on.  My apologies for that not being clear from a handful of posts.  But i managed to bring up a T.S. Eliot poem in the middle of a political discussion.  Oh, wait, that probably makes me elitist or a snob?

No, it makes you a pretentious douche.  Maybe you think your little show-and-tell routine about who you've read is impressive.  It's not.  I learned how to read when I was four.  And you've got a real razor wit, too.  James K. Polk?  Did you look that up?  You should have looked up a guy named Abraham Lincoln.

178 McCain commanded a flying squadron. That's executive experience.

179 banging the ex-CinC

Vercingetorix,

First, screw you for the mental image.

Second, what's the over/under on the last time they had sex? 5,10 or 15 years?

(Yes, with each other)

180 Actually if you read the other state amendments at the time the 2nd amendment is pretty standard wording. It reads oddly now, but only because our education has suffered so very much. Once you study it and think about it, particularly in historical context, it makes perfect sense, very clear.

181
... long enough to hobble together some rudementary language skills is beyond me.

That would be "cobble" together, not "hobble." And you misspelled "rudimentary."

Language skills indeed. Pot calls the kettle black.

182

OK, I'm no McCainiac by any stretch, but let me chime in a little for him on "executive experience" here.

When the Vietnamese are beating your ass mercilessly and repeatedly and you turn down offers of release unless all your fellow prisoners are also released, that's called "leadership." It is executive experience forged by fire.

Contrast that with the pandering for votes exhibited by the 2 Dem candidates who just blow whichever way the polling winds send them (I guess I could have stopped at "blow"), and I'll take McCain's executive experience over either of theirs any day.

183
Totally agree. The phrasing clearly indicates that owning firearms is a precondition to having an organized militia. In other words: you may or not choose to have an organized militia; but the right keep and bear arms precedes that choice.

You don't need to be a constitutional lawyer to suss this. The language is clear and comprehensible, accessible to every man and woman with half a brain--as the Founders intended.

184 Even 3,000 years ago in Greece, it was perfectly acceptable in some places for men to have romantic relations with other men.

Even then, Greek tolerance for homosexuality is way overstated. People accept the poet's glib phrase ('Alexander was conquered only by Hephaestion's loins,' or some such drivel) as fact, when homosexuality was about as common as today (not common at all, in other words). Reminds me of Aristophanes's slander of Pericles in the Archians (not looking up the spelling, call my lawyer), that Pericles started the Peloponnesian war because the Megarans stole three whores from his wife's whore house; that Michael Moore hit job tarnished Pericles for two centuries. Poets use poetic license.

Another example is the Theban Sacred Band, 150 couples bound by love; most people take that as erotic love. But it was best friends, fathers and sons, brothers, not sex, that bound them.

Sparta's festival, gymnopedia, the feast of "naked boys" is another scurrilous example; but it was Vienna choir practice, not a NAMBLA swap meet (or meat). Yadda yadda yadda.

185 DrewM,

Second, what's the over/under on the last time they had sex? 5,10 or 15 years?

How old is Chelsea again?

186 eww..... looks like he was victim of a bukkake party

187

Aaryn does reflect the opinion of the millennials I know.

I am just old enough to recall Carter - or, rather, the Carter years. I remember clearly that as of November 1980 I didn't even know his name (it came up in a mock election and I had no idea who these names were). However  I also remember dealing with the inflationary mess that was the 1980 economy everywhere I went.

If all we had to go on was the Clinton and Bush presidencies, with maybe some vague awareness of Bush Sr, and we were brought up by the public school system - perhaps ignored by divorced or separated (or leftist) working parents - then yeah, Bush ends up looking like a 19th century imperialist anachronism - like Gladstone. And being Intolerant is not nice. In fact it's the worst sin of all, to the Millennials.

It sure doesn't help that so many of those who are trying to explain about Western civilisation, moral values and such have been caught posting rave reviews about tripe like Expelled. Aaryn is misinformed about a great deal, and doesn't have the "benefit" of a memory of the Carter years. He is however right to observe that conservatism is on the retreat, and that those conservatives who are left are increasingly composed of anti-scientific resentful demagogues. It's something of a vicious cycle...

188
Even then, Greek tolerance for homosexuality is way overstated.

Very true. Then as now, homosexuals constitute only about 3 percent of the population, if that. Nature simply won't permit more: to do so would endanger the propagation hence the survival of the species. Just so, Nature ingrains about 97 percent of the population with a disgust for same-sex relations.

To claim otherwise, however, places gay advocates in a neat little bind. It means that nurture not nature plays a larger role in the making of homosexuals. If that's the case, then we heterosexuals are quite justified in not wanting our children to associate with homosexual adults and excluding homosexuals from professions (e.g., school teachers, scout masters) that would put them contact with children.

Also, Alexander the Great was not gay. Those who believe he was because of his relationship with Hephaestion don't know and/or don't understand the nature of male friendship and relationship in Classical  Greece--or in 21st century America, for that matter. Chalk this ignorance up to another failure in their education.

Interestingly, an amusingly, the Romans loved to mock the Greeks as fags and sissy boys. Which tells us something about Roman attitudes toward homosexuality, and, assuredly, the prevalence thereof in their society.

189
Not to beat a dead horse, but ... anyone who believes that Achilles and Patrocles were lovers also betrays ignorance concerning ancient Greek (in this case, Mycenaean/Ahhiyawan) attitudes concerning male friendship and male bonding among warriors. The movie "Troy" was so afraid of this topic that the screenwriters made Patrocles a nephew or cousin (I forget which) of Achilles. Just one of the many ways that "Troy" utterly and totally sucked.

190 These were pre-Boomers, academics who had come of age in the late 30s, 40s, and 50s: Red Diaper Babies, "progressives, out-and-out Communist, and their fellow travelers. We, their Boomer students, hated them. Most of us did, anyway. The ones who didn't adopted their views and went on to become academics themselves.

I've wondered if this virus of left-wing thought wasn't dormant in the body politic since at least the Great Depression, but it hadn't enough influence to fully express itself, especially during WWII. But less than a handful of years after the war, you could see the one-world-government war-is-not-the-answer anti-liberty tropes appearing everywhere, even in obscure places like science fiction. Man, the human race itself, was always the primitive, or always destroying itself... the Other was always the superior intellect. Consider the old flick "The Day The Earth Stood Still." When you step back and look at it, it's pure wish fulfillment for a fascist overlord to descend from heaven and set mankind aright. Do as we say, for the good of all, or we will destroy you. All of mankind's problems were dismissed as petty squabbles, the only thing that mattered was To End War. Thinking about how this could work, for even five minutes, turns the exercise into gibberish. Would aliens step in to put an end to slavery in some random minor nation? Not according to the movie's logic. But would one be allowed to fight it? Guess not, that sounds like war.

Now that I think of it, a nice slushop would be Obama as Klaatu, resplendent in spacesuit, with strong man Gort at his side... ready to dictate terms to Earth. He's gonna need Gort if anyone outside of the West is going to listen.

191

 Those who believe he was because of his relationship with Hephaestion don't know and/or don't understand the nature of male friendship and relationship in Classical  Greece--or in 21st century America, for that matter

I have no idea what the hell your talking about but are you sure you're not gay?

This isn't like one of those "there's nothing gay about it, he's just lending a hand" things is it?

Interestingly, an amusingly, the Romans loved to mock the Greeks as fags and sissy boys.

Everyone loved to mock the Greeks as fags and sissy boys. At least, until Rome fell, and then they mocked the Italians instead.

Because Greeks and Italians are all gay. They are.

No seriously. Bunch of girly homos. The whole lot.

192 Which tells us something about Roman attitudes toward homosexuality, and, assuredly, the prevalence thereof in their society.

If you go to Europe, men kiss you on the cheeks. If you go to Asia, you see men holding hands. If you go to China, even in the army after a long march, men will strip down and massage out the tension of one another. Different worlds, different cultures, none of them 'gay' to speak of. The past is a different country too; I think these advocates are just woefully ignorant of the world as it is now, much less as it was in the past.

I also had a friend who fell into cold water in sub-zero temperatures (all of us Marines), so he had to strip down naked and huddle with another naked guy; if he didn't, he would have died. Think about how hard life was without technology and you'd see an incredible bond between regular people forced to come together for their very survival. Again, a different country.

193
Prof. Challenger:

Excellent post. Excellent observations.

Check out the 1936 movie "Things to Come," based on the H.G. Wells story "The Shape of Things to Come," written in response to the carnage of the First World War. Premise: in a dystopian future wracked by endless global war a multinational air force imposes peace by threatening to bomb the combatant nations into oblivion.

BTW, the actor who played Klaatu--Michael Rennie--was gay. Make of that what you will.

194
I have no idea what the hell your talking about ...

No shit.

195

Because Greeks and Italians are all gay. They are.

No seriously. Bunch of girly homos. The whole lot.

I retract my points and second this motion.

196 Steve;

Oh yes, I have even read most of Wells's "The Shape of Things to Come," which is a long, breathy tale of an alternate future which would make any socialist or fascist have a sticky wardrobe incident in his boxer briefs.

I loved pulp like "The Outer Limits," the original series, as a kid, and on reviewing such things, it's amazing how so much speculative fiction is littered, festooned with weepy left-wing tropes and vanities. The military is always bad, science is constantly perverted, can't we just get along with the aliens,...

About one in three of these stories has some creaky left-wing message. And I marvel that this stuff was so vibrant when the struggle of WWII was still in vivid memory.

197 You think it's okay to tell commenters that they should shut up about this scenario, and I think that's really wrong.

Fair enough, I'll concede that Kensington.

But if you vote for McCain and don't like it, get used to voting for people you don't like. I guess that's my point.
The Republicans will be more than happy to "lesser of two evils" us right into socialism, as long as we go along with it. Grudgingly or not.

198 Okay, I'm not wading through 197 comments.  Hopefully, I'm the first to bring this up?  You know what the Obamessiah reminds me of?  Jasmine in the Buffy spin-off "Angel". 

199 have been caught posting rave reviews about tripe like Expelled.

I'd avoid commenting one way or another on this until seeing it. Let's just say I'm disinclined to take the word of people who are certain that we're causing global warming so much that the seas will rise 20 feet in the next 100 years and cause famines.

200

Steve, great snark. No seriously - what the hell is so obviously 'male friendship' being confused with homosexuality in the case of Alexander?

OK... cut and paste. This next one got long.

But damned if I'll type this shit and not subject you to it as well.

201

If you go to Europe, men kiss you on the cheeks. If you go to Asia, you see men holding hands. If you go to China, even in the army after a long march, men will strip down and massage out the tension of one another.

Yah, that's all gay. Gay, gay, gay.

Seriously those dudes are all gay.

past is a different country too;

Nah, it's not.

 It's just simply, I think, the phenomenon of straight flight.

In a world where homosexuality is normalized, most males are psychologically compelled to differentiate themselves from anyone who might even be gay, because they don't even want to be suspected of it, NTTAWWT etc. etc.

That's the problem. All male relationships become suspect. It becomes harder for men to be intimate with one another, because, come on, that sounds gay doesn't it? That's totally fuckin gay.

The problem is linked to that whole business about the 'war on boys' and feminisms degredation of classical masculinity. I think the impulse to not be gay is part of the classical 'manly' psychology. The traditional male role was created for a heteronormative society. For the classical man to exist in a polyamorous society he'd have to isolate and detatch himself from it in some way.

It comes down to honor. It's been said that a woman is simply born. You are born a girl, you sprout some tits, bam you're woman. But a man isn't something you're born, you have to prove it. This is perhaps the direct result of our evolution - remember most of us have more female ancenstors then male ancestors. We have more men then are needed to reproduce. Most of us are expendable. And "man" and "woman" are what if not reproductive designations?

Now how one goes about proving they are sufficiently manly to be one of those 20-50% of men who actually get to be MEN in a reproductive context, differs from individual to individual let alone sub-culture. If art is gay or merely sophisticated. If puttin a cap in someone's ass is manly or just thuggery. It winds up being quite relative, in terms of what people ultimately end up ascribing to. Some cultures channel these impulses more productively then others, but there is a wide variance on what's out there. However only 1 standard can be said to be empirical, and only that 1 standard winds up being universally shared by all : The ability to bang and impregnate the wimmenfolk. Historically, frankly, it doesn't even much matter if you're buggering all sorts of dudes up the ass. Historically, I'm not sure if that's even "gay". It's a hobby. So long as you crank out the heirs. Get married to that super-wealthy-powerful king's daughter and inherit all his land. The one true mark of manliness is nailing women. That is, after all, what the whole business is about right? Proving your in the top 20% and therefor not one of the expendable extraneous ones? The ultimate measure of success is...success.

Hence within the normal framework, homosexuality will always be derogatory. That's why 11 year olds use 'homo' as an insult on the playground. Not the negatively connotated "fag". "Homosexual" is a nice clinical, almost medical term. Full of latin. And unwieldy to boot. It was suppose to be free of any negative stigma. But sure as shit you find, when you make these PC newspeak words, that views are not negative because the context on words are, cotext on words become negative because views are. There's simply nothing less manly, nothing less worthy of being the man in a reproductive arrangement (as opposed to being the man who never gets to use his man-ness, and therefor essentially an a-sexual genderless unich), nothing less verile, then not wanting to bang women. "You're gay", it's basically saying: You're expendable. You're of no use. You didn't make the cut. Deemed unworthy by natural selection. Go away and die and leave no genetic legacy.

To eliminate what many would decry as 'homophobia' would require the elimination of the male archetype that has been created by evolution. And in so doing, you would also eliminate the part that has led to most of the great advances of society on the freakin' whole, because both are linked to the same competitive element. To live in a society where homosexuality has been normalized without eliminating this, is to live in a society where you now have a bunch of men competing with another to prove how not gay they are. So these other cultures, I think, like that old cliche for how you explain why the flying fuck you're wearing a pink shirt, can be said to really actually be just that much more secure in their masculinity then ours is. We're riddled with insecurity, which will increase as homosexuality is increasingly normalized, and will essentially begin suffering from a sexual napoleon complex. When you go to Europe, do the yobs kiss each other on the cheek? Or have they pretty much resorted to shivving old ladies as a manly greeting? Europe, even amongst the native population, is quickly turning A Clockword Orange for a variety of reasons.

Wow. That got long. But there you go - my view (AKA the correct one, which most of you monkeys can't begin to appreciate).

202 Wow. That got long

Did Ace start paying commenters by the word, cause I can go longer if there's money in it.

203 Hey, Entropy, why don't you suck my cock, okay already?

204 I had no idea galloping white stallions were fans of Obama.  Nor that roses explode in front of him wherever he walks.

Color me impressed.  Obama now has my vote.

But don't worry McCain:  If you capture the unicorn vote, you might just woe me back over.

205

he had to strip down naked and huddle with another naked guy

I'm 99.9% sure that makes actually makes him gay.

A straight guy would have frozen to death if there weren't any bitches around.

206 Would you vote for a man with roses coming out of his johnson?

207 As someone who was born in '82, I can tell you firsthand that anyone who describes himself as a "proud" member of Gen Y can be safely ignored.  They are the most narcissistic people I have ever had the misfortune to encounter.

208 I do believe Entropy doth protest too much.

209 Wow, the IlludiumQ36ExplosiveSpaceModulator went to sleep reading Entropy's post.

210 "But if you vote for McCain and don't like it, get used to voting for people you don't like. I guess that's my point."

Fair enough, bmac; it's probably a realistic possibility.

Still, I'm really going to like voting against Obama, perhaps even more than I loved voting against Bill Clinton in '96.

211

212 Shut up and let me eat my waffles.

213 @198 (Stephen) - you hit the nail on the freakin head.

214 "Can you name one leading candidate for President in all of American history who had less qualifications to be President than Obama?"

Easy. William Jennings Bryan. Nominated for president by the Democrats in 1896, 1900, and 1908; beaten by McKinley (twice) and Taft. Served two terms in the House before that, 1890 and 1892. Supposedly a mesmerizing orator, with his famous "Cross of Gold" speech; nominated after he gave the inaugural speech at the 1896 Democratic convention. Later served as counsel for the prosecution in the Scopes Monkey trial. A ranting, bellowing populist, a literal rabble-rouser who was utterly unfit to be president by policy, intelligence, character, or experience. The parallels to the Obamessiah are eerie.

215 http://obamamessiah.blogspot.com/

216 I can't wade thru all the comments either. Whoever painted that picture wants to suck Obama's cock.

217

And here I thought women were expendable because there was a good chance they would die during childbirth (and still do frequently in Third World countries) or just get worn out from having child after child.

Well, I read all the comments and I haven't laughed so hard in a long time.  That poster is a strange combination of Elvis and My Little Pony for sure.

I figure that Barack will be shot and then Hillary will get in on a wave of "I will preserve Barack's legacy".  I can't think what else she is counting on.

 

 

218 That picture is so faggy it makes me  queasy, the same kind of queasy I know I'd get if I was in a restroom and the guy in the next stall started  tapping his foot.

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