1 Hah.  Just got another dog.  Eat it, bitches.

2 This is worthy of a slow clap.

3 Or - he's just lyin' for his buddy.

4

I hope this guides the investigators/command to Special Courtmartialing this mother fucker.

He don't rate an honorable, even AFTER an Advance release, and an LTH even after his full duty.  He's a disgrace.  He rates BCD at MINIMUM!

5 though maybe he was "raped."

6

God damnit ace, I frickin' hate you.  You are killin' my reputation and making people question my bona fides.

Seriously, I expected more out of you. Don't you get it?    Just what kind of writer are you? We're the same, you and me. We're the same, don't you see?

Anyway, maybe we can come to some sort of arangement.  I know you hate TNR.  It's cool.  I know how you feel.  So how about I help you, and you help me?  I'll write you some anonymous stories, from the perspective of a young idealistic writter/staffer who has his soul corrupted by the lies and horrors of working and writting in the Belly of The Beast (ie, TNR).

Sound good?  You get your expose, and then you lay off me, maybe even throw a few props my way, saying maybe old Scotty Thomas ain't so bad.

What do ya say?

7 Is it just me or did the world just move? No, really, we just had an earthquake here.

Back to bed.

8 4.5 near Chatsworth, Gabriel.

9 The "dog becomes a chalk outline"

In the words of Kyle Braflafsky: "Really?"

That is the sort of writing I associate with ...."her half-finished food tray almost falling to the floor."

I'll go out on a limb and say that Foer is getting confirmation from his primary source. I'll go further out on that limb by stating that if I meet any Foer brother, they will need a dentist.

'Cuz I'm so sweet, I cause spontaneous, catastrophic tooth decay. Also, eldest brother Franklin is an execrable parser of words in his attempts to not own up to his own foolishness, and that makes my knuckles itch. While his brothers may not have done anything wrong in this particular instance, they are part of a larger narrative, and as such I must not hesitate to imprint, even if I am forced to re-report and fact-check after my shoddy reasoning is exposed.

It's like going to press.

10 Oh, the heart aches for Ellspeth.

11

 "How you do this (I've seen it done more than once) is, when you approach the dog in question, suddenly lurch the Bradley on the opposite side of the road the dog is on. The rear-end of the vehicle will then swing TOWARD the animal, scaring it into running out into the road. If it works, the dog is running into the center of the road as the driver swings his yoke back around the other way, and the dog becomes a chalk outline."

note:  This becomes more plausible if you add to the story two platoons of US soldiers, hardened by war and dehumanized by the Administration, who surround the dog and drive it towards the waiting tracks of the Bradley. 

Make the changes and resubmit.

12

How many in TNR's roster of star anonymous witnesses who confirmed elements of Beauchamp's story went on record and repeated those confirmations during the Army investigation?

"During that investigation, all the soldiers from his unit refuted all claims that Pvt. Beauchamp made in his blog," Sgt. 1st Class Robert Timmons, a spokesman in Baghdad for the 4th Brigade, 1st Infantry Division, based at Fort Riley, Kan., said in an e-mail interview.

An Army of None.

13

Heard that cackling little goon EJ Dionne on Hugh last night.

Sho' enuf, he took the position that "all the facts arent in yet" and "TNR may still be vindicated" and "TNR spoke with many people who coroborated Beauchamp".

Then he went on to blither and menstruate about how its "legitimate to question politicians about whether their children are serving in Iraq or not"

Translation: Its legitimate to question Republicans, but not Democrats (who support the war in Afghanistan, and, if your Obama, an invasion of Waziristan) who havent "sent their kids to fight"

Then he mentions Sen. Tim Johnson as the "only congressman with kids in the warzone"

Oops. Forgot Duncan Hunter- GOP candidate for Pres- whose son served 2 tours. Im sure that slurring dousche EJ will correct it pronto

14 Elspeth Reeve certainly found herself a prize catch in Scott Beauchamp. On the bright side, she does not have appeared to have changed her name, so when she realizes that she's married a preening, no-talent ass with less than a full dose of human decency, and she decides that she wants a divorce, there will be less paperwork...and that will make Gaia happy.

15 Here's something worth thinking about:

Scott T. Beauchamp joins the Army (to get material for his book).  Gets through Basic and is sent to Kuwait.  Evidently along the way makes friends with another guy in the unit.  They see an injured woman and laugh their asses off, and later Scott writes about it.

Now:  Scott's obviously a liberal since he's boffing a New Republic editor.  It seems reasonable that he would make friends with someone of similar political opinions.  So there's the two token liberals in the platoon, yukking it up over someone else's disfiguring injuries before they've ever seen actual combat themselves.

In other words, war and the Army don't dehumanize you.  Being a modern American liberal dehumanizes you. 

It makes you treat war as a source of "material" to write about.  It makes you laugh at people injured in the line of duty.  It makes you lie.  It makes you tell lies about the men who serve with you.  It makes you admit wrongdoing to avoid punishment, but then try to weasel out of them.

War is not the problem.  The military isn't the problem.  Liberals are the problem.
 

16

War can be blamed for many things, but not for the fact that Beauchamp and his buddy are born and bred assholes.

Brilliant.  This says it all.

 

17 Actually, E.J. was also wrong about Tim Johnson's son. Son was in the army and did serve in Afghanistan and Iraq, but is now a civilian. Don't know if he's in reserves, though.

18 There is an article about this on Newsweek/Msnbc. Sorry I don't know how to link.

19

Definitely worth a repeat:

In other words, war and the Army don't dehumanize you.  Being a modern American liberal dehumanizes you. - Trimegistus

20 That proves it!

Well, it looks like the Army has put this to bed.  Good for them, what could they do to save Pvt. Bo from a lynch mob of demented bloggers and get them to shut the fuck up?  Why, interview other solders, who unanimously decided not to sign up for Article 15s (credit to John Cole on that point) and rescue Pvt. Bo from his own dreams of Hemingwayesque glory by isolating him from the rest of the world.

One thing which can't be clear to those who have never served: when the First Sergeant or someone above want to get you, they will get you and life is hell.  They have ways of making you talk (or not talk), or do what they want you to do.   I believe Mr. Wicked Pinto, calling for court martials himself, can confirm this point for the non-veterans from his own personal experience.  

Whether Bo saw dogs being run over by Bradleys and pieces of cranium being played with will remain unknown to all but Pvt. Bo and those with him, of course.   All this rabid ranting makes what point?  What Pvt. Bo wrote about were outrages totally outside the realm of possibility?  Of course, in the last 2 weeks there have been 2 convictions for murder of civilians in Iraq, one out of a rape/murder/family massacre.  Bad shit happens in war, folks.

21

Ace, don't get bogged down in analyzing anything TNR claims.  Five witnesses?  Meaningless.

We already have more than enough evidence to hang Foer and STB, and that's all we needed.  They didn't do their jobs, they lied and they are in the process of being slowly and nationally humiliated.

It's a good show, and now there's enough material for a full John Stossel piece on the "Winter Soldier Syndrome", as Michelle Malkin puts it.

We're in the home stretch and TNR's ownership will have to step in and fire Foer.  There simply is no other solution, now that the national media types are starting to smell blood.

22 And sometimes on the way to war, apparently.

23
All this rabid ranting makes what point?  What Pvt. Bo wrote about were outrages totally outside the realm of possibility?  Of course, in the last 2 weeks there have been 2 convictions for murder of civilians in Iraq, one out of a rape/murder/family massacre.  Bad shit happens in war, folks.

The point made is that these things, said by this man, did not happen as he said they did.  He lied about American soldiers doing terrible things, and he was enabled by dishonest people purporting themselves to be journalists.

24 So, icus. What you're saying is that it's fake, but accurate. Gotcha. It doesn't matter if STB was lying his silly ass off, because bad shit happens in war. And we need to know that bad shit happens in war, even when it's not, well, actually happening in this particular case. Unlike the cases you mentioned where there was actual evidence presented and convictions handed down. Because you can't possibly trust the Army to police their own, can you? Because the NCOs will make your life miserable if you don't h...shit. Lost my train of thought.

Really, icus; I'm just trying to get this straight. Don't want to miss the narrative for the bone "yarmulkes."

25 You morons joke about Gaia and we wind up with tornadoes in Brooklyn and earthquakes in California. Thanks.

26 Google News offers rebuttal time

27

icus,

Beauchamp is a proven liar. He lied about which country the disfigured woman incident happen. Do you have any proof that the rest of his platoon, his senior officers, and the Army investigation team are all liars?

I want proof, not innuendo, and no vapid statements like 'Bad shit happens in war, folks'.

28 icus - Let me give you an NCO perspective on your comment, "If you had two brain cells working simultaneously, your hair would catch on fire."

29 A further point is that the 5(?) witnesses and contact info was likely provided to TNR by ST Bo himself.  So TNR (through ST Bo) prescreened its own witnesses for their confirmation.

30 The army spokesman said now that the investigation is over Beauchamp is free to speak to whomever he wants.  What would it mean then if TNR doesn't soon follow-up with a "We've now spoken to STB and he says ..." article?   Wouldn't a failure to report what STB directly told them post-investigation constitute a tacit admission by TNR that the stories were phoney.

31 First, with the possible exception of the mocking of the injured/deformed woman, the allegations were not of "terrible things."  At least not in the context of war. Crude, insensitive, cruel, yes.  I don't see running over a stray dog or playing with some bones as "terrible" in context.

It's hard to see how those things are prosecutable under the UCMJ; I haven't read the CENTCOM, MNFI and MNCI General Order One, maybe there's some grave desecration or cruelty to animals provisions.  Maybe one of the listed offenses under Article 134.

Still, when questioned by NCOs and officers and invited to deny (wink, wink, nudge, kick) doing things which have become a matter of public controversy or take an Article 15, I bet that just about 100% of soldiers would avoid the Article 15 or other hassle. 

Nobody posting comments on this blog has any direct knowledge of the command climate in Bo's unit and how interviews were conducted.

So, big whoop, some soldiers denied officially what they confirmed under a journalist's privilege of confidentiality.  So, what was the big deal about again?  The whole thing is a little sick.

32 A few points/questions:

1. Icus, why should a mere witness to some of these actions not speak up when asked? They aren't atrocities or anything and a witness would not be prosecuted.

2. Does STB's cellphone have photo function? You know that these guys would have taken shots of a dude wearing a skull. Its the new myspace "look at me drunk" culture and I would bet dollars to donuts if this incident happened there'd be a camera shot. Or do soldiers not take their phones with them? Hmmm.

33

Being a modern American liberal dehumanizes you, icus.

34 I don't see running over a stray dog or playing with some bones as "terrible" in context.

If so, then why didn't Beauchamp stand by his statements? Why would his friends who also theoretically observed these events not stand by him?  I sure as hell wouldn't attract anything I knew was true, regardless of what could happen to me.  As it stands now,  he's in a much worse position than  any imaginary punishment you see the Army imposing if he had stuck to his story:  he's still in the crapper, he looks like a fool, he's hurt his wife's career, and more likely than not they will be divorced soon. 

35 I sure as hell wouldn't retract anything I knew was true, regardless of what could happen to me.

36 So, if these incidents aren't a big deal, the soldiers are going to lie in an official investigation, especially if the incidents could later be proven true?  Don't make sense icus...

37

Of course, in the last 2 weeks there have been 2 convictions for murder of civilians in Iraq, one out of a rape/murder/family massacre.  Bad shit happens in war, folks.

Right. So of course that means what Pvt. Douchecamp said is true, right?

I'd call you mentally deficient, but that doesn't cover it.

 

 

38

Ace gets a new name...

Ace the Eviscerater  

Keep ripping these guys to shreds!

39 I have figured, as you outline in rational fashion, that only one solidier, a pally- pal of Beauchamps, joined in the story telling to support his friend, in misguided brotherhood.

For he to-day that sheds his blood mows the lawn with me, etc.

But still, I'd like to know who the friend is, to make absolutely sure he isn't Pvt. Ellison Ellington, and made of a camouflage sock, though certainly that would be going too far, even for STB.

40 icus: "Bad shit happens in war, folks."

No duh. Let's add laziness to the list of TNR's sins, then, because surely they could find some real horrors to report instead of just publishing whatever shit showed up in their inbox. Shoot "researcher/reporter" is probably a euphemism for "intern," and they probably couldn't believe their luck when Elspeth's boyfriend turned out to be a Hemingway wannabe on his way to Iraq. She was probably they only person in that whole crowd who actually knew a soldier.

Ace:

I think Beauchamp's story about the kid whose tongue was cut off deserves some serious debunking too. It's called "War Bonds" but get this: the browser window it shows up in is titled My horrifying tour of duty in Iraq. Any questions?

41

icus,

Doesn't seem like you've even read "Shock Troops." The incident with the BFVs, as described by STB, would have endangered the lives of everyone in the vehicle as well as everyone in the convoy.

Except that it didn't happen.

42 When did TNR change their opinion on the war? I keep hearing that they initially supported the war but no longer do.

43 The fact that you have to sit there analyzing every word to try to figure out how many so called witnesses they claim to have just shows the level of dishonesty on their part. If they were the least bit confident in anything they'd be clear as a bell about it. They aren't because they are trying to deceive.

I've contended elsewhere they would have no problem simply lying about having any witnesses. What have they got to lose at this point? What's one more lie when they've told so many already and how could anyone prove it anyway?

44 Icus, why should a mere witness to some of these actions not speak up when asked? They aren't atrocities or anything and a witness would not be prosecuted.

Um, maybe because most infantrymen are not experts on the UCMJ and therefore are not sure what can and cannot be prosecuted and might stay on the side of discretion. 

Think about it.  Suppose, just for the sake of argument, that dogs were run over and skulls bandied about.  You are in Pvt. Bo's squad, you've seen it and you're called into an interview about what happened. 

You are probably aware that the shit has hit the fan in some way, Pvt. Bo's in trouble and the CO is pissed, even though you might not have had the chance to read noted Iraq War Experts "Ace of Spades," Michael Goldfarb and Michelle Malkin "proving" he's wrong.   You're on FOB Falcon and it sucks.  It's hot and it stinks like shit all the time and you have to roll out the gate and face IEDs everyday.  You want no part of this controversy, you just want to survive your tour and go home.  You get called into a room with the 1SG, CO and maybe some other officers you don't even recognize with MNCI or MNFI patches on.  And they ask you "You didn't see any dogs getting run over, did you?  And, you didn't see any playing with skulls and bones, either, right?"  Well, WTF are you going to say?  What's the quickest way out of that room?

Does STB's cellphone have photo function? You know that these guys would have taken shots of a dude wearing a skull. Its the new myspace "look at me drunk" culture and I would bet dollars to donuts if this incident happened there'd be a camera shot. Or do soldiers not take their phones with them? Hmmm.

Many if not most combat commands in Iraq have a policy against broad individual ownership of cellphones by soldiers.  This is mostly to prevent premature notification of combat fatalities, guys calling home and telling their wives that Johnny just got killed and then wives telling, etc..  Units impose shutdown of base internet cafes after fatalities, too.  There are phones which are held by platoon leaders for morale calls, etc.  Of course, soldiers do have cameras, but there's only so much shitty stuff you can take pictures of - it's a long tour.  Have you noticed that all kinds of shit happens, even now, that people don't take pictures of?

45 Don't play his stupid game.  The story is about TNR.

46 Ace....

Sorry to be "nitpickish" here, but who was TNR's "ombudsman"...

And how did said Ombudsman go about selecting these soldiers to corroborate these stories?

Please don't tell me that TNR had Beauchamp himself running around asking for buddies to corroborate/collaborate for him...that would really give TNR a failing grade.

anyone have any info on that?

47

Well, WTF are you going to say?  What's the quickest way out of that room?

What's the quickest way to guarrantee that you won't get called back into that room?  What's the best method to make sure your story gels with everyone else being interviewed and you don't get nailed for lying?

Could it possibly be to tell the truth?

48

icus,

if your theory about soldiers lying because they don't want to get in trouble is true, how do you explain the fact that the Abu Ghraib scandal was uncovered because some soldiers who witnessed it went to their officers, their officers, instead of suppressing it, reported it higher, and a full investigation was conducted? In case you have forgotten, soldiers and the Army uncovered Abu Ghraib, the media just raised shit and patted themselves on the back.

49 STB and TNR had an agenda.  Its as simple as that.  They were called on it and got caught lying.  That the Army had to conduct an investigation of reporting in an American magazine of troop malfeasance when its time could have better been served prosecuting the war is treasonous.  The reporting served no one other then our enemies.  Now that they have been caught in a lie, their supporters want to downplay the significance of this demoralizing and slanderous reporting.  Same ole, same ole.  

50 I don't see running over a stray dog or playing with some bones as "terrible" in context.

Well - that's because you're a buttplug stuck up STB's ass.  Its dark in there.

51

Check out Hewitt's interview with EJ Dionne.  http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/g/01a7d315-b20f-4567-901d-0ef4f07b2e9e

When politicians, soldiers, doctors, lawyers, bureaucrats, cops, or indian chiefs do what he's doing for the TNR journalists call it corruption.  When they do it for one another it is called nothing at all.  Kind of odd, isn't it?  And we shouldn't get too high and mighty on this one friends.  There are some conservatives ( and a conservative publication) doing the exact some thing Dionne is doing.

52 Yeah, it's funny how the "diary" was originally of major significance to moonbats but now  it's "eh, no big deal."

53 Posted by: icus at August 09, 2007 10:16 AM (OTNlI)

Every soldier knows what happens if you lie during an official investigation and every soldier knows that even if he lies, somebody going to tell the truth, so you go in there and tell the truth - that's the quickest and safest way out of the room. If you think it's easy to go in and lie to the US Army, you have no idea what you're talking about.

54 Yeah, everybody tells the truth all the time.  On Abu Ghraib, it was one soldier, Joseph Darby, who exposed what was going on.  He was under guard for six months afterwards.  If there weren't photos that got out, who knows what would have happened?  http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6930197.stm 

MG Taguba, who conducted the investigation and found wrongdoing, was threatened and told to retire.  http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2007/06/25/070625fa_fact_hersh

So you can see there are strong incentives to tell the truth and report abuses in the Army.

It was one soldier who talked about the Mahmoudiyah rape/murder/family massacre, weeks after the event in a counseling session after two unit members were killed, possibly in retaliation. 

Let's not talk about Pat Tillman, the bullshit that was flung there.

Of course, it all depends on how the questions are asked.  Is it "What have you seen, what's been done?" or "You didn't see anything like what Pvt. Bo (who's now maybe confined to quarters and obviously in the shit) wrote about, did you?"

Sheesh, if Ace spent one tenth as much time on Pat Tillman's case, there might be some respect.  But I guess that's not his place, this being a moron statist blog and all.

55

It was one soldier who talked about the Mahmoudiyah rape/murder/family massacre, weeks after the event in a counseling session after two unit members were killed, possibly in retaliation. 

So of course the resident dipshit compares cases of murder with wearing a skull on your head.

Seriously asshole, why are you bothering?

56 Posted by: icus at August 09, 2007 10:47 AM (OTNlI)

Quoting Seymour Hersh and assuming the Army is dishonest by nature is an excellent way to establish your credibility.

People like you want to believe the worst about our soldiers and the military for whatever reason. That's your right as an American. A right their sacrifices makes possible.

57

Icus,

Your standard of "bad shit happens" could be applied anywhere at any time in human history.

So, I guess you'd be perfectly happy if a reporter named, oh, let's see, "Thomas Scott" reported in the NewYork Times that
"Icus" murdered his whole family with a butcher knife, then teabagged his dead mother, and raped his brother's spleen in a fit of blood lust because, well, bad shit happens in "Icus"'s town. So, it's true.

Is that your standard for the news? Really?

There's not going to be any "Winter Soldiering" this time around, retard. Yeah, bad stuff happens in war as at any other time in any other place. So, if someone reports some, they better have all their p's and q's lined up.

58

Let's not talk about Pat Tillman, the bullshit that was flung there.

Oh right idiot.

And those were privates writing on blogs there too?

Nice analogy.

Why are you leftists always so stupid?

59

icus,

The first person to quote Seymour Hersh loses the debate.

This rule is quite similar to the Godwin's rule. If it is not already a rule, it should be. Seymour Hersh is a master of spinning tall tales that are impossible to prove or disprove. If you trust his word blindly, there is hardly anything for us to discuss.

60 Any chance this mystery witness is Sen. John Kerry?

61

Project much, Icus?

62 So of course the resident dipshit compares cases of murder with wearing a skull on your head.

Yeah I do compare them - I'm the one saying running over stray dogs and playing with bones is no big deal compared to murder and rape. 

I'm afraid a point that subtle is beyond the moron's capability.

As far as "Winter Soldiering," there's already been enough of that on the court martial schedules, right?  Like, convictions and all.  By court martial juries, not the MSM or the Worker's World Party or the Hitlery Black Helicopter Conspiracy. 

So who really gives a fuck about Pvt. Bo and his writing on a blog that some dogs were run over?

Unless it's for some fool to say when the chickenhawks get geared up for the next war: "There were no atrocities in Iraq!  That was all proven false when Ace of Spades counted STB's witnesses and the Army done proved him wrong!  That proves it!"

63 So who really gives a fuck about Pvt. Bo and his writing on a blog that some dogs were run over?

Well, obviously you lefttards did when you believed it advanced your cause. Now, it's "who really gives a fuck"?

64

Icus why do you want us to lose in Iraq? Is it  that you want to be proven right?  

65 Shit, I never heard of Pvt. Bo or any of what he wrote until this blog wrote about it.  I couldn't care less if soldiers run over stray dogs with Bradleys, they deserve a little amusement.  Anyways, Pvt. Bo's famous now.

Seymour Hersh is a master of spinning tall tales that are impossible to prove or disprove.

Hersh has a pretty good record of getting things right over the last few years, for example, he was the first one to report on the timetable and certainty of war in Iraq, when Bush was denying it, in when, May 2002?

Anyways, in the Taguba Abu Ghraib article, Hersh is quoting MG Taguba, who posed for a picture for the article.  Are you saying that Hersh made up quotes of MG Taguba or that Taguba is lying?

66 Liberals assume that everyone lies because all of them do. Lie, I mean. Liberals. All the time. It simply does not occur to them that telling the truth is the default option, the home page, the first thing you do, not something you have to be forced into.

So why am I always surprised when they lie?

67 Icus why do you want us to lose in Iraq? Is it  that you want to be proven right?

Believe me, I want us to win in Iraq.  If you only knew how much.  I just have some basic sympathy for a soldier who probably got some things right, maybe exaggerated some others, but he's in Iraq and these fatass "warbloggers" and harpies are not.

68 Chickenhawk neocon Halliburton ABU GHRAIB!!!  Refute that, if you can.

69 Chickenhawk neocon Halliburton ABU GHRAIB!!!  Refute that, if you can.

Posted by: Isuc at August 09, 2007 11:23 AM (72/aa)

I love it when Ace loses it.  Mission accomplished.

70 The fact that Beauchamp is still only a PV2 after 2 years in, means to me he has spent most of his military career cleaning toilets and writing fiction.

71 a soldier who probably got some things right

Such as there being a country called Iraq.  Can't fault him on that one.

72

So who really gives a fuck about Pvt. Bo and his writing on a blog that some dogs were run over?

You mean other than you, who is here desperately trying to make a case that it happened because of Abu Ghraib?

Yeah I do compare them - I'm the one saying running over stray dogs and playing with bones is no big deal compared to murder and rape. 

Actually clown, you're the one saying that because murder and rape happen, someone put a child's skull on their head.

You don't read your own silly opinions, do you?

73

Believe me, I want us to win in Iraq

Mind you, from the author of:

but he's in Iraq and these fatass "warbloggers" and harpies are not.

Yes, you're too stupid to see what a moron this makes you.

Funny that you're not there though, isn't it?

for a soldier who probably got some things right, maybe exaggerated some others

The question is, why do you believe in lies?

Oh, you're a liberal. That's why.

74 "bad shit happens in war, folks. . .

Well, you know, it's like this every day in Puerto Rico.

75 I couldn't care less if soldiers run over stray dogs with Bradleys, they deserve a little amusement.

Ah, the Michael Vick defense!  I hear he might be doing some time over that one.

76

for example, he was the first one to report on the timetable and certainty of war in Iraq, when Bush was denying it, in when, May 2002?

I'd love to see a link on this.

Love it.

77

Believe me, I want us to win in Iraq.  If you only knew how much.

So all of your postings are like a contrarian logic puzzle or something? Come on man, admit it.  You'll feel better.

78

Tell me Senator Obama, would you send your kids to die in the Waziristan quagmire that you propose to undertake if elected President?

Tell me Senatory Clinton, given that you support the "real war on terror" against the Taliban in Afghanistan- why isnt Chelsea lugging gear around Kandhahar?

How about you, Biden? Hairplugs too tight? WHy arent your kids shooting Al Qaeda in Kabul? You'll send other peoples kids there but not yours?

CHICKENHAWKS

79 And once again Icus proves how stupid he is just in case anyone here was unconvinced.

80 Sorry to be "nitpickish" here, but who was TNR's "ombudsman"...

He was chanting "Om" and smoking bud, man. 

Why do you babykillers hate America?

81

To use Icus's standard, we should be reporting this regardless of whether Beauchamp lied.

TNR has a history of journalism scandals (Stephen Glass) that are much worse. Beauchamp may be innocent, but who cares? The point is that bad things happen in journalism.

82

>>He was chanting "Om" and smoking bud, man. 

You mean he was chanting 'Om', drinking Bud, and was smoking a man's pole?

83 Anyways, in the Taguba Abu Ghraib article, Hersh is quoting MG Taguba, who posed for a picture for the article.  Are you saying that Hersh made up quotes of MG Taguba or that Taguba is lying?

That is the single wildest troll I've seen in ages.  I've read it five times now and I still don't understand the point.  It's like a strawman made of pieces of children's skulls.

Icus, you magnificent bastard!

84

TNR has a history of journalism scandals (Stephen Glass) that are much worse. Beauchamp may be innocent, but who cares? The point is that bad things happen in journalism.

Ouch, thats crystaline.

85 Icus...

Forget everything else Beauchamp has said and concentrate on one specific thing...

He claimed he mocked the woman because the war had made him a monster.  Except, um, he now says that happened before he wasn't within a couple of hundred miles of the war. 

So...why do you believe anything else he wrote or give him any benefit of the doubt?

BTW-As I wrote about this incident and the rest, if they had been couched as 'me and my buddy blah, blah, blah...' I wouldn't have doubted him. Out of a pool some 150,000 plus people (that's a good sized city's worth) you will have your quota of jackasses. But to believe that lots of people saw this and did nothing about it at the time nor will confirm it now (with their name on it), strains all credibility.

86

Icus,

Wow, are you really this stupid?

You don't understand the difference between "Winter Soldering" ie. making up shit against our soldiers to further your career and real courtmartials against real assholes who committed real offenses? Really?

And yeesh, the chickenhawk meme?

Well, okay, let's run down your probable chicken offenses:

You claim you want us to win in Iraq: why aren't you there serving right now? If you're too old, why aren't you volunteering as a private contractor? CHICKENHAWK!!!!11!

Of course, you don't really want us to win. Why else would you constantly smear the troops and try, in your pitiful way to destroy morale on the home front? Why don't you buy air time on a radio station or newspaper ads to be more effective in your goal? CHICKENPROPAGANDIST!!!!!!111!!!

And since you don't really want us to win, that must mean you want the Al Queda to win: why haven't you strapped on a suicide bomb? CHICKENJIHADI!!!!!!!1111!!!!!!!!

As are most "progressives", you're a socialist. Yet, you work at a job instead of working underground to bring about the glorious revolution. CHICKENREVOLUTIONARY!!!!!!
Not to mention: why haven't you migrated to some socialist/communist paradise like Cuba: CHICKENIMMIGRANT!!!!!11!!

You probably drive a car or use public tranportation instead of walking or riding a bike. You wear manufactured clothing and live in a house and use electricity. Do you eat meat? CHICKENGREENY111111!!!!!

You're probably yanking the crank all day with your Cheetos-stained fingers to internet porn instead of meeting real women, CHICKENHETEROSEXUAL!!!!!!!111!!!!!

Or more likely, CHICKENTEHGHEY!!!!!!!1!!!!

Because this stuff happens in the town where you live, it must be true. According to Icus' Law.

87 has a history of journalism scandals (Stephen Glass) that are much worse.

This is much worst than Glass.  Glass wasn't fabricating propaganda for the enemy, he was just "making shit up" like BS tossed around at a bar.

88 Drew at August 09, 2007 11:49 AM (hlYel)

To these people just being in the military makes you a monster. The rest is just details...

89

Interesting new info from the person TNR purported to consult about the Bradley dog targeting episode:

http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/236527.php

90

Posted by: rinseandspit at August 09, 2007 11:50 AM (5ksba)

 

Well said, sir.  Well said.

91 "

Three soldiers with whom TNR has spoken have said they repeatedly saw the same facially disfigured woman. One was the soldier specifically mentioned in the Diarist. He told us: "We were really poking fun at her; it was just me and Scott, the day that I made that comment. We were pretty loud. She was sitting at the table behind me. We were at the end of the table. I believe that there were a few people a few feet to the right."

 

 

One thing I haven't seen commented on (maybe I missed it).  In the above quote, the supposed witness (witless?) says that HE made the comment.  If I remember correctly, didn't Beauchump claim that it was he (Scottieboy) who made the comment.  Wish these guys could at least get their lies straight.  Wonder which one of them "really" made the comment....?  Makes one kinda lean towards the fabulist side of the fable, doesn't it?

 

92

Furthermore:

Regarding "Skull verification."

Like the cemetery gambit, TNR reports they checked with an expert and found that indeed a skull could have "plugs of hair still attached".  But nobody disputed that.  The questions were whether an adult could fit inside a child's skull, and whether it could fit under a helmet, TNR either did not ask about that or more likely, is hiding the answer they got.

 

 

 

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