Joe the War Correspondent

Ed looks askance at his calls for "patriotic" coverage.

Eh. So he's not an objective journalist. Who is? Christian Amanapour?

There are a lot of advocacy journalists in the Middle-East. In fact, almost everyone there is. I can't get very incensed that Joe admits his own agenda. Unlike professional journalists (and I use that term advisedly), he has no career to protect by lying about his own biases and agenda.

A brief mention of a PSM essay written by a tool at The Moderate Voice. I only even mention it because both Instapundit and Hot Air link it.

The Moderate Voice, of course, defends the MSM down the line and questions how any, um, "civilian" like Joe could possibly have anything of value to add to reportage.

Here's some value -- he has a high profile, at least among conservatives on the internet, and will work to show that Israelis (especially in Sredot) are suffering in this war at Hamas' hands, something the MSM isn't particularly animated to show themselves. They far prefer Hamas' hard-luck tales.

So, a bit of balance will be provided, even if it comes from someone who forthrightly admits he's not really a balanced reporter.

I will point out that I have had occasionally read The Moderate Voice, and I have, to this day, never seen it take a position that wasn't clearly and safely -- and all too predictably -- liberal.

Just for shits and giggles, I'd like to see The "Moderate" Voice actually criticize liberal policy or belief. Just once. Just to establish they can in fact manage such a Herculean task.

I think I will rename this site "The Moderate Ace of Spades." No change in my politics; but I guess we're all "Moderates," really.

Here's Joe reporting for Pajamas TV (free registration required).

One Thing That's True... is that by offering up his pro-Israel agenda so unabashedly, he diminishes his credibility as an objective source and thus can't help Israel as much as if he lied about it, or at least concealed it.

That's true... but that kind of credibility is gained via a lie. The MSM does this all the time, of course, purporting to be neutral referees when in fact they are determined partisan actors. To the extent they have more credibility for their purported objectivity, they should not. It's a lie.

Posted by: Ace at 12:38 PM

Comments

1 But his name is not Joe!

(Channeling dipshits at my work)

Posted by: runninrebel at January 12, 2009 12:45 PM (0n9wc)

2 I don't know if he'll add anything of value to the reporting or not, but watching the "professional" reporters lose their shit over this has been comedy gold.

Posted by: Brendan at January 12, 2009 12:48 PM (2jQGY)

3 Did they actually use the term "civilian" un-ironically?

Then I'd like for TMV to produce their enlistment papers post haste.

Posted by: Techie at January 12, 2009 12:48 PM (906oR)

His title has changed. He is now

Joe the Moneyman

Posted by: polynikes at January 12, 2009 12:48 PM (m2CN7)

I would take coverage that was not actively on the other side.

Squarely in the middle. Just once.

And now back to Episode Number 3,450 of "Arabs Starting Wars and Whining About The Inevitable Buttkicking."

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at January 12, 2009 12:50 PM (B+qrE)

So I guess you aren't up to speed on the liberal to English dictionary:

Moderate = Leftwing

Center/Left = Far Leftwing

Progressive = Socialist or Communist

It is part of the whole framing thing the Left has invested so much in. And frankly, like alot of other elements of leftwing strategy, something we should be adopting ourselves.

So yes, Ace is a moderate...why not?

And at least we have the advantage of the fact that what passes for "far right" now in media circles would be moderate a decade ago...

Posted by: 18-1 at January 12, 2009 12:51 PM (7BU4a)

Who says war correspondents don’t experience Stockholm syndrome ?

Joe obviously believes most of the media are fully sympathetic to their captors.

Posted by: Neo at January 12, 2009 12:52 PM (Yozw9)

8 The criticism you will see from liberals of "liberalism" is when it is not totally whackjob-insane-communist enough...The "moderate" commie-lib Dems are just the ones that have not yet degenerated completely in their continuing downward spiral into the dregs of humanity... Cognitive dissonance seems to affect very few when faced with contradictions of their fantasies with reality. They are hopelessly insane.

Posted by: J David at January 12, 2009 12:53 PM (WdS39)

9 Kristy-Ann Amanapour to you.

Posted by: Greg Toombs at January 12, 2009 12:54 PM (GAoY7)

10 Joe Wurzelbacher may not have a journalism degree from Columbiastan, but I bet he can tell the difference between an airplane and a helicopter.

Posted by: Gregory of Yardale at January 12, 2009 12:55 PM (PLvLS)

11 Does he have a license to do this?

I could check on that for you, if you like.

Posted by: Helen Jones-Kelly at January 12, 2009 12:56 PM (wWwJR)

12 The shitfit the MSM is having over this, combined with their reaction t o the Palin interview, is gold.

Posted by: eddiebear at January 12, 2009 01:02 PM (wnU1W)

13 Oh, and why is it I am not shocked that another HA columnist is down on Joe? What, nothing to rip Palin about today?

Posted by: eddiebear at January 12, 2009 01:03 PM (wnU1W)

14 I wonder if Joe stays in Israel after The Messiah is inagurated if there will be a "mix up" in his papers to fly back.

Posted by: eddiebear at January 12, 2009 01:11 PM (wnU1W)

15 Ed is an idiot.

Posted by: VP Joseph Biden at January 12, 2009 01:12 PM (NLtVk)

Yeah, the combination of Ed and AP is not a good one. Preston added some needed right-wing balance to that site, it's gone downhill since he left.

If there was any truth in advertising, Hot Air would be called The Moderate Voice.

That guy at TMV is "moderate" in the sense that he does not insist that Bush set up 911. He should call his place The Moderate Moobat.

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 01:13 PM (49Uo4)

17 Good for Joe! The MSM and moonbats wanted to humiliate and banish him, but he has different ideas about his future and none of them include going away quietly, I reckon.

Posted by: IC at January 12, 2009 01:14 PM (jZNCU)

18 Well, at least the Powerline guys support sending Joe over there. Nice to see the defeatists are not unified on this one.

Posted by: eddiebear at January 12, 2009 01:15 PM (wnU1W)

19 Hurray! Someone is finally upfront with his bias. Dude, that's really what I want, just be freaking honest about the slant to reporting.

As far as the cries about being a "professional" journalist, give me a break. Asking people "Were you upset when the bomb blew up your house?" does not require a degree in rocket surgery.

Posted by: alexthechick at January 12, 2009 01:17 PM (SHHaV)

20 He should call his place The Moderate Moobat.

Hee hee, what's a moobat, some kind of nocturnal flying cow?

Posted by: OregonMuse at January 12, 2009 01:17 PM (FO+YO)

Posted by: 18-1 at January 12, 2009 12:51 PM

Giants fan?

Posted by: Darling at January 12, 2009 01:20 PM (TiWmf)

22 Well, yeah, if you can picture a flying cow with rows of eight-inch long razor sharp teeth and a small little extra head that extends out from it's mouth Alien style.

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 01:23 PM (49Uo4)

Found Obama's Offroad Bus for sale on Craigslist

Posted by: Cromagnum at January 12, 2009 01:23 PM (UxAb/)

24
It's a dumb idea to send Joe to Israel.

Joe should be touring America and visiting real folks and reporting back to us what the real mainstream America thinks.

For instance, the MSM, for the last several days, has been telling us about the overwhelming support that Obama has for his stimulus plan as he enters his term. I think it's bullshit. I think people want something done, not the shit Obama is planning, though.

Posted by: Darling at January 12, 2009 01:24 PM (TiWmf)

Back on topic, this "move to the left is so 1790's Parisian style. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

"Committee of Public Safety" anyone?

"Robespierre has a list, and your name is on it" - Fouche

Posted by: Cromagnum at January 12, 2009 01:27 PM (UxAb/)

"Obama Robespierre has a list, and your name is on it" - Biden Fouche

Fixed

Posted by: Cromagnum at January 12, 2009 01:28 PM (UxAb/)

27 So far as I know, the MSM does not mention that Hamas/Fatah/misc. other scum set up headquarters in the basements of hospitals, produce fake footage of "atrocities" caused by Israelis, use ambulances to carry weapons and fighters, fire rockets *daily* without regard to targets, etc., etc.

But we're supposed to think that that the MSM are seasoned, trustworthy professionals who care only about truth? They can FOAD.

Go Joe!

Posted by: qrstuv at January 12, 2009 01:28 PM (iLavX)

28 when I hear the news updates on the radio, the narrative is that rockets materialize out of thin air and drop randomly into Israel..

but the IDF is gearing up for the invasion into Gaza..

Posted by: Dave C at January 12, 2009 01:40 PM (bU9ij)

All reporting should be considered good as long as it presents facts, is not misleading and does not lie by omission. It does not require that you have to give a balanced counterpoint, especially when there is no counterpoint.

Posted by: polynikes at January 12, 2009 01:43 PM (m2CN7)

30 In a choice between Joe and professional journalists Joe wins every time. Of course any creature that doesn't leave a trail of slime where ever it goes would win when compared to a professional journalist...

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 01:43 PM (1g+FW)

31 I forget who said it, may h ave been Insty, but if a community organizer can be president and an former SNL player can be (presumably) a senator, then Joe the Plummer can be a reporter.

Posted by: JamesT at January 12, 2009 01:43 PM (cTHUy)

32 Look, I have nothing against Joe the Plumber, but this is stupid. I would rather be the party of Joe the Business Executive again. McCain beclowned himself by mentioning this guy dozens of times while he campaigned. As usual, McCain overdid something that worked in moderation. He should sue the Ohio government for snooping into his private life for no reason if he wants his vindication.

Posted by: Dirk at January 12, 2009 01:44 PM (EiJuR)

33 I have to agree with #16. HA went downhill. It's just boring now.

Ace has no competition imo. Ace should have hired Joe, though.

Posted by: Stan at January 12, 2009 01:44 PM (3d8gE)

34 Poor MSM... Ad revenue drying up. Bloggers kicking their asses. Newspapers shuttering their headquarters.

It will only make them feel more worthless if one of the benighted rubes actually proves he is as competent a reporter as the professionals. Go Joe! If you succeed, the giant asteroid moves a little closer....

Posted by: bunny boy at January 12, 2009 01:44 PM (YsSn7)

35 Ed isn't an idiot. He's just hung about with too many journalists. Rots your brain.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 01:45 PM (1g+FW)

36 "Republican" Ed is from a state that has let Al Franken "recount" his way to the Senate. Tells you all you need to know about Ed. Ed's okay with it. He's okay with Obama's "shared sacrifice." He's one of those who want to "give O a chance" and want to "see him succeed."

And they wonder why Repugs can't win an ass-kicking contest against a one-legged man.

Posted by: George Orwell at January 12, 2009 01:46 PM (6uMRO)

37 I have to agree with #16. HA went downhill. It's just boring now.

Totally agree. Happy to know it isn't just my own isolated opinion.

Posted by: George Orwell at January 12, 2009 01:50 PM (6uMRO)

38 Dirk,
The party of Joe the business executive handed itself bail outs until it was no longer credible. It ain't coming back.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 01:55 PM (1g+FW)

39 And HA, as frustrating as it can be sometimes, has been very good on the CNN video fraud. Not every one can say that.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 01:56 PM (1g+FW)

40 Damnn......Joe just walked in off the street and started doing reporter journalist type work. Now does this make Joe the Plumber smarter than hell or journalist dumber than shit................

Posted by: norryrr at January 12, 2009 02:08 PM (IF2pc)

The party of Joe the business executive handed itself bail outs until it was no longer credible.

And did so at the urging of Joe the Business Executive, who then went on to donate huge amounts of money to Obama. Because Joe the Business Executive really wants bailouts for himself. Those Joes are natural Dems, and their influence in the GOP has been whats dragged it leftward.

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 02:09 PM (DLVJj)

Wait a minute, journalists are supposed to see BOTH sides of a conflict and avoid identifying with one side too much? Oh crap. Guess I should have found another line of work.

Posted by: Ernie Pyle at January 12, 2009 02:10 PM (cdAdD)

I would rather be the party of Joe the Business Executive again.

Yes, because of all their fantastically positive moves in mortgage securities. They apparently know best.

Yes, I remain very, very annoyed at the financial genius sector of the economy.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at January 12, 2009 02:26 PM (B+qrE)

44 40..

I'm going with the journalists dumber than shit..

OT..

www.jackbauertorturereport.com/

name says it all (Not related to me or my blog.. thought it was cool)

Posted by: Dave C at January 12, 2009 02:27 PM (bU9ij)

An added note--if anyone feels the urge to use the "it was legal" justification for the idiocy that has financially beclowned us as a nation (looking around for JackStraw)--go ahead and punch yourself in the nuts to save me the time of hunting you down.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at January 12, 2009 02:30 PM (B+qrE)

46 Are we really demonzing business executives now? In the Republican Party? Yes, I know the crooked ones suck and can go worship Pelosi and Obama, but there have to be some good ones. Didn't President Bush run as a CEO-type who would not make naive mistakes like the academic wonks that Clinton hired and the Democrat Party in general reveres? The Left will always win the people who have financial resentments. Joe the Plumber probably didn't even deliver plumbers to McCain.

Posted by: Dirk at January 12, 2009 02:35 PM (EiJuR)

47 38 Dirk,
The party of Joe the business executive handed itself bail outs until it was no longer credible. It ain't coming back.

This is not true. One more time: There are no Republicans on Wall Street. None. Zero. Zilch. Nada. All of the players in the scandal -- whether they ran the private companies or Freddie or Fannie -- were all HUGE donors to Democrats. Look it up on fec.gov. The really big money knows that you get there by getting handouts and special deals from the government. Republicans, like the Tories under Thatcher, are the party of the shopkeeper.

And the business executives don't really run the Democrat party. Lawyers do. It's a party of lawyers. They are appointing lawyers to every position. CIA, anyone? Jamie Gorelick (who, despite all of her other faults, knows nothing about finance) was appointed to one of these boards.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 12, 2009 02:36 PM (T0NGe)

The Left will always win the people who have financial resentments.

I've got news for you, "financial resentment" is going to be a mild term for what has begun.

Posted by: Circa (Insert Year Here) at January 12, 2009 02:40 PM (B+qrE)

49 Part of the reason the MSM hates Bush with such ferocity is his success with the War on Terror. 9/11 was a big fat moneymaker for the print and TV media--my Dad actually bought copies of the Chicago Trib and Sun-Times on 9/12, something we hadn't done since the Bears won the Super Bowl (I was stationed in England at the time).

Without a major terrorist attack due to the efforts of Bush, circulations are down. Note that the Tribune announced it was seeking bankruptcy protection, and the very next day the Blago arrest occurred.

But now, when the next major terrorist attack occurs, many of us anti-media types won't go and purchase a paper--they've lost us forever. We'll come here to figure out what's really going on.

Posted by: Big Fat Meanie at January 12, 2009 02:43 PM (n2eCn)

Just saw the PJTV segment with Joe. It was interesting, but I have two critiques. 1) Joe should not keep repeating "the story is not about me"... frankly it is and why? Because the "professional reporters" make it so. Instead he should ask these turds why they are more interested in him than attacked Israeli families. 2) Yes, he is not biased and blatantly states it. But when he does this then admonishes the media for their bias and states his is after the truth, it comes off hypocritical. Is he there to report what is happening in Israel or how the media is (not) covering what is happening in Israel.

BTW, I really like the suggestion of having Joe go across the US asking regular folks their opinions. Joe's already in Israel. Let him finish what he started. But PJTV or another outlet should consider hiring him for somethign like that.

Posted by: thelmdatter at January 12, 2009 02:47 PM (gdv+2)

51 All of the players in the scandal -- whether they ran the private companies or Freddie or Fannie -- were all HUGE donors to Democrats.

And, we're only allowed to talk about Bernie Madoff, according to the MSM, as a symbol of the Evil Influences Due To Free Markets. Let's not talk about Raines, Dodd, Frank, Rubin, etc.

Well, look up Madoff on fec.gov. Let's play "guess which party." Yes, several times more money to Dummycrats, especially in recent year.

Posted by: George Orwell at January 12, 2009 02:49 PM (6uMRO)

The Left will always win the people who have financial resentments.

Americas billionaires have a lot of financial resentment then, because they support the left by a huge margin.

Didn't President Bush run as a CEO-type who would not make naive mistakes like the academic wonks that Clinton hired and the Democrat Party in general reveres?

How did that work out for us?

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 02:51 PM (44ZKk)

Yes, Joe should stay in this country and report on Joe Six-Pack and the real state of the economy. That being said, I don’t see how any truthful reporter could go over to the conflict in Gaza and NOT report that the Hamas terrorists are, you know, terrorists who use children as shields and who started this entire mess.

Going in and attempting to be “fair and balanced” and reporting both sides of the conflict is giving the terrorists too much credit. If they were really going to report Hamas’s side truthfully it would read just like Joe’s reporting. So big Ed is FOS.

Posted by: Vic at January 12, 2009 02:56 PM (f6os6)

54 This whole thing is hilarious:
(1) It's Pajamas Media, FGS! With all due respect to Roger L. Simon and his wise decision to advertise on AoSHQ, it's just a little blogging operation. If Joe were hired by ABC News to be their chief foreign correspondent, I would balk too, but is somebody really arguing that Simon is sullying the long and storied reputation of Pajamas Media by hiring Joe the Plumber to be a reporter?

Besides, haven't we learned that experience means nothing?

(2) Joe the Plumber -- get this -- is allowed to have his own opinion. No, it's true. It's in there in the First Amendment. He can go to Gaza, look around, and tell people what he thinks. He doesn't need some wussy journalism degree or a Master's in International Relations or any other excuse to keep people out of a profession that it doesn't take very much skill or intellect to break in to.

Mark Steyn always laughs at the absurdity of an American journalism degree. In Britain, journalists are people who "have failed at pretty much everything else."

(3) This whole election has been full of way too much elitism and people thinking they're far smarter than they really are. As a mathematician, it offends me deeply that a person like Obama is considered "brilliant" because he went to a big-deal law school. There's no international competition (how many students from China are getting law degrees in the US?), no dissertation, no objective standards and no mathematics.

While a law degree or a journalism degree might indicate a certain level of specialization, it in no way indicates a general level of intelligence.

S. Joseph Wurzelbacher is a bright guy and frankly I'd rather see somebody pay his freight to go to Harvard Law school. I'll bet quite a lot of money he'd graduate. In the interim, he may have some frank words about idiotic concepts that have been stuck in the law and many legal "scholars" take for granted.

(4) Yes, journalists are generally idiots and they are deathly afraid that a common-sense amateur like Joe will show them up. Moreover, he'll break through the bias that all of these journalists have. He doesn't owe anything to anybody.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 12, 2009 02:58 PM (T0NGe)

"Who is? Christian Amanapour?"

It's Christiane, dumbass, Persian feminine first person feniculare.

Jesus, do I have to correct your sloppy second syntax every fucking post?

Posted by: Spartan Fan at January 12, 2009 03:02 PM (7365r)

56 1) Joe should not keep repeating "the story is not about me"... frankly it is and why? Because the "professional reporters" make it so. Instead he should ask these turds why they are more interested in him than attacked Israeli families. 2) Yes, he is not biased and blatantly states it. But when he does this then admonishes the media for their bias and states his is after the truth, it comes off hypocritical.

You are giving Joe far more scrutiny than the MSM journalists ever get. And he doesn't ask the turds anything. That's the point, they're too good to talk to him.

I don't know where you see the hypocrisy, but the problem with the media isn't the bias, it's the uniformity of the bias. If ABC were conservative and CBS were liberal and the NBC reporter had a libertarian view, it wouldn't be so bad, but they all have the same worldview and, frighteningly, conform to it instantaneously.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 12, 2009 03:08 PM (T0NGe)

eF John McCain.

Sorry, just love saying that.

Posted by: Gas Guzzler at January 12, 2009 03:10 PM (IRsCk)

58 #54

+1

Posted by: George Orwell at January 12, 2009 03:14 PM (6uMRO)

59 MSM reporting is a pathetic sham and has been for many years. Joe the plumber as a reporter is a pathetic sham in the making. I'm allowed to think both of those things, and I do. What is this - a race to the bottom?

Posted by: -Ed. at January 12, 2009 03:22 PM (w9ovf)

60 Well, Ed, I'm glad you've given Joe all the chances the MSM has been given. That was real fair of you.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 03:37 PM (1g+FW)

61 Balanced, too.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 03:37 PM (1g+FW)

62 Summon the meteors

Posted by: MSM at January 12, 2009 03:38 PM (PD1tk)

63 Dirk, Amish,

I suppose George Bush and Hank Paullson and all the rest weren't Republicans either. Nor the editorial staff at the NRO and The Standard both of whom went Squeaky Fromme in favor of the bail out, nor Karl Rove nor Mitch McConnnel...They aren't Republicans either. I said it before arguing this again is a waste of time and counter productive, but pretending the Wall Street Bail out was purely a Democratic deal is flat out dishonest. Pretending it has done any thing other than ensure the Barrack Obama would come to power is more dishonest still. Let it go.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 03:43 PM (1g+FW)

64 Amish,

You're dead on about Joe though. the complaints about him so far have come from terrified elitists, and will continue to.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 03:46 PM (1g+FW)

The Obvious

The bail out would not have passed in a Republican House or Senate........

Posted by: norryrr at January 12, 2009 03:49 PM (IF2pc)

Can Joe the Plumber be as good a reporter-journalist as

Dan Rather,Jason Blair,Katie Couric the whole MSNBC

news crew.All of CNN.The New York Times???

Not Yes but HELL YES.......If he reports facts with balance

and fairness he is better than these people. Without a

degree in journalism. No formal training. Double HELL YES

Posted by: norryrr at January 12, 2009 03:50 PM (IF2pc)

67 norryrr,

Not at first maybe, but check how many Republicans switched their votes after their wall street economic advisors and right-wing journalist friends went to work on them. Fellas, the Republican party isn't out of power because it was misrepresented, though lord knows it often is, it is out of power because the people that normally vote for it can see exactly what it has become. Fixing that is going to stop the right-wing journalist, wall street economic advisor gravy train, but if you want to get back into power it will have to be fixed.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 04:00 PM (1g+FW)

68 If you don't...proceed apace.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 04:01 PM (1g+FW)

HA sucks ass. Sod off swampy.

Posted by: Eleven at January 12, 2009 04:02 PM (7DB+a)

I suppose George Bush and Hank Paullson and all the rest weren't Republicans either.

There's a name for this sort of "change-the-subject" type logical error, though I can't think of it off-hand. (And technically, Paulson is a Democrat.) The debate was not about the bailout, but about the conditions that led to the bailout. Who were the bad actors responsible? Not many were Republicans.

But I think the distinction that needs to be made is between Republicans and conservatives. Too many people use the terms interchangably. A liberal Republican is still a liberal. So.

Republicans, like the Tories under Thatcher, are the party of the shopkeeper

is better expressed as "conservatives are the party of shopkeepers".

pretending the Wall Street Bail out was purely a Democratic deal is flat out dishonest

I don't see anybody here pretending that. I see the opposite - people pointing out that the GOP politicians pandered to these business interests as badly as the the Dems did. What we're saying is that those business people themselves were and are largely left/Democratic in their politics. And I don't see how anyone can disagree with that.

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 04:03 PM (hz80G)

If you don't...proceed apace

Hmm. What's this "you" stuff? Are you a Dem?

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 04:05 PM (hz80G)

72 - ... occasionally read The Moderate Voice, and I have, to this day, never seen it take a position that wasn't clearly and safely -- and all too predictably -- liberal.

"Donklephant" anoint themselves as 'centrist' as well. What a laugh.

Posted by: goy at January 12, 2009 04:06 PM (BCIGN)

73 Disgusted in dependent who has voted Republican in the last four elections.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 04:10 PM (1g+FW)

74 Whoops, independent.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 04:10 PM (1g+FW)

75 flenser,
I don't disagree that the interests pandered to were Democratic, but ti's sillier still to pretend that the people doing the pandering haven't been Republicans.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 04:12 PM (1g+FW)

76 What I'm saying is this. If the Republican party straightens itself out things get better. If it continues along the line it has taken...pandering to Democrat interests then after the fact pretending it hasn't things won't.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 04:15 PM (1g+FW)

JTP should have to go through the same 'gauntlet' the Moderate Voice and a zillion other MSM gatekeepers put me through when the San Francisco Chronicle sent me to Iran!

Posted by: Sean Penn at January 12, 2009 04:16 PM (ocHBO)

78 Joe Wurzelbacher has years of experience cranking pipes, so to be successful in his new fangled job of reporting, he should transfer his pipe cranking success into a few liberal crank cranking successes.

Posted by: Fish at January 12, 2009 04:18 PM (CG+cG)

79 Once Joe the Plumber was in his cabin in Colorado. A bear tried to get in the window, so Joe started pulling his teeth out one at a time. He only got five of them before the bear took off running. He let his son glue the teeth to his Thanksgiving macaroni diorama, and that's why there's a big damn turkey.

Posted by: Cincinnatus at January 12, 2009 04:22 PM (U663l)

80 63 Dirk, Amish,

I suppose George Bush and Hank Paullson and all the rest weren't Republicans either.

Paulson was not. Robert Novak wrote a story on October 1, 2007 about "Hank Paulson's DNA".

And I am not talking about the bailout -- which every "smart person" said was the only thing we can do. (So much for smart people, eh?) The problem with the bailout is mostly that it couldn't be restricted to the financial markets. Economists always live in a world where there pronouncements of the wise course of action will be carried out by a benign dictator and that there are no political consequences.

I am talking about the corruption. When I say there are "no" Republicans on Wall Street, I'm being facetious, but not by much. The people who made this crisis a crisis aren't the ones who tried to fix it but the ones who caused it. All Democrats. Every one. Republicans aren't gods who are to be held responsible for every failure because of their lack of omniscience.

Posted by: AmishDude at January 12, 2009 04:28 PM (T0NGe)

81 there=their

Posted by: AmishDude at January 12, 2009 04:30 PM (T0NGe)

I don't disagree that the interests pandered to were Democratic, but ti's sillier still to pretend that the people doing the pandering haven't been Republicans.

Well, I agree with the first part of that. But the second part is what is called "lying by omission". Some Republicans did pander, along with all the Democrats. But the opposition to the bailout came from the right. So it's not really not fair to say that "the people doing the pandering" were "Republicans", thereby indicting a lot of good people in the GOP and letting a lot of corporate whores in the Democratic Party off the hook completely.

I'm not seeing why a Republican-leaning independent would want to do something like that.

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 04:40 PM (hz80G)

Personally I love the fact that a regular guy is reporting on the Hamas attacks on Israel. Who else is going to do it? The MSM is so clearly biased against Israel that they have absolutely no creditability with me and many of the people I know. So far Joe the Plumber has given two reports and I challenge anyone to show me anything like that from the MSM.

Posted by: Gripegut at January 12, 2009 04:44 PM (+AouQ)

84 Flenser,

You're right I'm a Moby. You've found me out. Proceed apace. Change nothing inside your party. Matter of fact, do much more of the same. I think that will work wonders for you. Orin Hatch, I hear, is supporting Eric Holder. That's a good start.

Posted by: The Obvious at January 12, 2009 04:45 PM (1g+FW)

I guess we can all agree that no Republican should ever pander to corrupt left-wing busnessmen, or even (perish the thought) corrupt right-wing businessmen, if any right-wing businessmen can be found.

And in a perfect world, no Democrat would either. Though I'm not holding my breath waiting for the "reality based community" to realise that that's happening.

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 04:45 PM (hz80G)

You're right I'm a Moby. You've found me out.

That's called "deflection".

If you'd like to explain why you're so eager to let the left off the hook here and blame everything on the right, I'm all ears. Or eyes.

Otherwise, yeah, you're just one more annoying concern troll.

Posted by: flenser at January 12, 2009 04:50 PM (hz80G)

87 If you'd like to explain why you're so eager to let the left off the hook here and blame everything on the right, I'm all ears.

It's a roundabout way of admitting the Republicans are the "only adults in the room".

Posted by: Cincinnatus at January 12, 2009 05:23 PM (U663l)

88 Okay, Let's not be coy here. Let's just call it as we see it and man up about the whole DC/Beltway school of realpolitik...
1. The Republicans were essentially conservative, or as conservative as you can be after the raft of compromises one makes to get enough backing to run for national office in this country. That was around 1994. An age or two ago.
2. The Demoncrats are, have been, and always will be the Party of the Handout, the Bailout and the overweening self-important socialist tool. They pride themselves on being about the 'working man' or the 'common man' yet showcase leftist blowhards of the most demeaning sort: Kennedy (all of 'em), Kerry, dean, Pelosi, Reid, ad nauseum. Nothing common in that bunch.
3. If Joe the Plumbing Salesman(truth in naming his vocation) wants to buy his own plumbing business or report from Gaza and has an outlet, let him. CBN and numerous other outlets carry on every day reporting from one side or the other of a conflict. Fact, not bullshit, just fact. Joe could be reporting for CBN or Trinity Broadcasting and not a word would be said other than to demean his choice of faith. Once properly marginalized into the religious reportage arena, the MSM would feel sufficiently smug about its own superiority to classify Joe with Pat Robertson or maybe as a 'buckaroo' journalist like Geraldo.
4. The MSM cannot, does not, will not ever admit to you, me or itself that it takes sides in a conflict. Self-delusional types like Dan Blather, Tom Brokejaw
and Anderson Pooper love to look back at the fine reporting of the WWII era and compare themselves to that high standard.
But, does anyone really think Edward R. Murrow or one of the fine American war correspondents during the war would be on the Nazi side of say, the Battle of the Bulge, covering 'legitimate German complaints of disproportionate response' on the part of the Allies to the 'just trying to make a war out of it', last-chance-offensive of the overwhelmed and half starved German Doughboys?
Where was their 'Objectivity"?
Didn't the Nazis have the right to have their side of Genocide and Burning of Human Beings told? Well, of course they did. That's why they had Axis Annie and other 'propagandists' like Goebbels.
So, by the definition set forth way back when, the current crop of "I am neutral and I have no national affiliation" journalists are actually propagandists of the Left and Socialism, and nothing more. Hamas couldn't have any better mouthpiece than Christiane Amanpour, now could they?
This one is actually easy to figure out. Nothing hard to it at all.

Posted by: Enter sandman at January 12, 2009 05:45 PM (zxaA2)

89 That said, the repubs have not been core value conservative since 2000 or so, and possibly as early as the sad assed run of Dole 1 in 1996, and pathetically unmorred from its conservative roots for McDole/ Dole 2 in 2008. Demoncrat lite is all I call the party and hope folks get their collective heads out of their butts before it's too late to organize for 2010.
Roman Empire Collapse, part Deux, anyone?

Posted by: Enter sandman at January 12, 2009 05:57 PM (zxaA2)

90 Let's face it: Joe The Plumber has held a real job and is overqualified to be a reporter. Anybody can regurgitate the party line. Imagine going somewhere and doing the ONLY story, doing ORIGINAL work, asking questions nobody else has asked (like he did when he was a 'mere' citizen).

Were he a liberal, he'd be a giant, having had so much experience. Then the conversation would nervously turn to our next President, Secretary of State, and junior senator from New York...

Posted by: t-bird at January 12, 2009 05:59 PM (FcR7P)

91 This moron gives village idiots a bad name. He is about as stupid as there is, something like the right-wing trash that posts here.

Posted by: Killer at January 12, 2009 07:18 PM (ocqsb)

92 Please don't forget to flush and wash your hands on your way out, "Killer."

(hey, to make "Killer" more palitable, can we call him "Sea Pussy," instead? Probably close to the truth, after all... And less offensive than "cocksucker")

Posted by: CoolCzech at January 12, 2009 07:34 PM (iafWn)

93 I would rather have my news from the first 100 names on the phone book than from the faculty of the Harvard School of Journalism, to steal a line...

Posted by: CoolCzech at January 12, 2009 07:37 PM (iafWn)

94 12 The shitfit the MSM is having over this, combined with their reaction t o the Palin interview, is gold.

The DemSM is going apeshit with Joe Derangement Syndrome over this, and they can't shut up about him. Voila! Pajamas Media gets massive free publicity..

Simon, you magnificent bastard!

Posted by: kbdabear at January 12, 2009 07:48 PM (miw86)

95 Now, now, we have to understand the pain of "real" journalists..

Joe didn't attend the right j-schools and then have old frat buddies land him an interview, he didn't attend the "right" parties in order to get peer acceptance. Joe didn't bring the editors their pipe and slippers and hump their legs to get the choice assignments. Joe doesn't have his handy rolodex of "subject experts" who go to the same parties or went to the same schools as the editors. Most of all, Joe doesn't know which Associate Piss and Al-Reuters articles to cut and paste from, and he doesn't know which opinion columnists have their fingers on the pulse of fellow elitists at the weekend dinner parties.

And worst of all, he probably drinks domestic beer!

Posted by: kbdabear at January 12, 2009 07:55 PM (miw86)

96 I don't see a problem with Joe reporting from Israel. Why not? The clowns we usually hear from aren't really worth listening to in the first place. I generally change the channel when I see the usual suspects anyway. Give him a chance. His performance is not going to make or break the future of the new media.

Posted by: ErikW at January 12, 2009 08:02 PM (hKtiw)

97 Let him report from Israel to get even more publicity for both himself and Pajamas Media (leans right.) I saw the headline on Yahoo news that he was in Israel. If they had sent him around the US it might not have had enough shock value.

Once he's done there, send him back to the USA.

A great PR idea, though I have not seen his reporting enough to see if its decent or not. Hope he keeps humility level high as that covers for any gaffes.

Posted by: Harun at January 12, 2009 09:16 PM (Td7/S)

98 "Newspapers will come back and thrive. Online news is not going to replace it, people want the feel of a newspaper with their morning coffee, they want local news and world news written by professionals, and they need a vibrant media as government watchdogs" - The Mainstream Media

"Ipods are a fad. People still want to hold a record album in their hands and admire the cover art. They want to have the rich feeling of having music filling the room, performed and written by professional musicians chosen by big music companies who will decide who the best acts are" - the ROAA

"No one will buy chintzy little Jap cars" - The Big 3

Posted by: kbdabear at January 12, 2009 09:26 PM (miw86)

"A great PR idea, though I have not seen his reporting enough to see if its decent or not. Hope he keeps humility level high as that covers for any gaffes."

Glad you're optimistic about his success, douchebag.

Posted by: ErikW at January 12, 2009 09:59 PM (hKtiw)

100 "Repent, Joetheplumber!", said the Moderate-Voice Man.

Credentials for Joe:

1) He walks upright. Check.

2) He can string two words together to form coherent sentences. Check.

3) He's unabashedly pro-Israel. Umm, check, I guess.

4) He admits his bias up front. FAIL!!!!!*^%*%$^#%^%@()#&%#*

Actually, #3 would disqualify him as a "journalist" in this day and age. #4 is right out.

As for Captain Ed, I usually like his stuff, bit this "but he's not a journalist" bullshit is simply tiring. Let's be clear: a former manager for a fucking call center isn't a journalist either, except by the simple fact that he happens to write what he sees. I see no reason that a plumber cannot report facts at least as faithfully as a fucking call center manager.

Oh, I'm sorry. Was that rude of me to mention that Ed wasn't always a member of the self-anointed class? Does it make it Ed seem like a pretentious jackass? Good. Then I've done my job.

Posted by: physics geek at January 12, 2009 11:51 PM (JotYN)

101 And worst of all, he probably drinks domestic beer!

Posted by: kbdabear at January 12, 2009 07:55 PM (miw86)

Awww jeeeez...I liked him until you said that!!!

Posted by: norryrr5 at January 13, 2009 09:10 AM (IF2pc)

102 The problem with the MSM is not bias, but fundamental dishonesty. Everyone has a point of view. The mark of a responsible and ethical journalist is that he or she is honest about their own biases and prejudices and works to guard against them. This is not an impossible task, as some apologists would have us believe. Scientists do it every single day.

The problem with the MSM is that they have simply stopped doing this. Instead of striving to be fair and objective in their reporting, they've become the embodiment of yellow journalism. By refusing to tell the whole truth and failing to present arguments that they do not agree with in an honest way, if at all, they have become little more than ministers of propaganda for their favorite ideology. As anyone who understands the nature of propaganda knows, propaganda lies, even when it tells the truth.

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